Guild Wars 2

We have long since come to accept that WvW won’t yield us the same loot that PvE’ing does, so when anet implemented wxp it was, for many, some kind of band-aid to rectify said loot imbalance.

For many players wxp became both a small and steady source of income, and also a proof of progression and experience, and thus, a source of pride.

I think it’s fair to draw a line here to sPvP’s glory system, which is similar in many ways.

So, when custom arenas were introduced to sPvP and people started abusing them for farming glory, anet were relatively quick to respond how that’s not how they meant them to be you utilized, and put on a limit on how much glory could be earned per match. This stopped low-skilled players from attaining ranks in a few weeks, that veteran players have played for since launch.

In WvW, EoTM was implemented, and I’m pretty sure that players aren’t playing in EoTM like anet meant them too. Avoiding all fights, never defending and running 3 synchronized karma-gold-wxp-all-in-one-trains clockwise around the map.

Now, I don’t really care about the karma and the gold, but I must admit I’m a little upset that these players earn a lot more wxp while PvE-ing, than I do while WvW’ing.

This is why, just like with the glory-change, wxp-gain for capping objectives should be limited in EoTM. Wxp for player kills should remain the same to encourage battles and defending.

Any opinions?

Until you can get champion bags from defending, you’re not going to see an end to the train.

And unless I can get my 10 WvW tourny achievements by defending, you’re not going to see a change.

Rewards are way to high in EOTM compared to the real wvw, Wxp/Karma/Badges etc.

It all favors karma train all over the place.

Karma is easy to get, I’m not sure why it is so plentiful, so let’s drop karma rewards in WvW, and the badges rewards are on par with the cost of buying those nifty toys in EotM.

and let’s try to increase the RI and award badges exp/wxp/karma for defending.

or a bigger penalty for losing your corner.

OR remove access to EotM from every server that has at least 1 wvw map not queue’d heheh

The badges of Honor in EoTM should be nerfed as well, as well as the Empyreal Fragment rewards. the badge costs of the WvW skins should be increased.

Im ok with Loot and Karma being great in EoTM, this is healthy PvPvE as seen in other games, but the rewards structure as/is gives no reason to go to regular WvW.

I am never an advocate for nerfs and will not support a “Reduce Wxp” agenda.
Instead, you should be asking for a buff of Wxp in the main maps.

Another thing to consider, Wxp is such an insignificant rank in itself, after a player achieves rank 500~ you can easily max Applied Fortitude & Strength.
This leaves you with enough points to max a couple other Siege Masteries depending on your class and play style. Anything beyond that is over kill and does not matter much.

Eotm allows newer players to learn Wvw tactics and catch up to the WvW vet players. Think of it like a Summer school for the new.
Also just because the rewards suck in regular WvW does not mean we shld nerf Eotm, I can clearly argue that rewards in dungeons are way too high so please nerf.
That would not be a valid argument, instead you should ask for rewards based on effort.

Roaming mostly flipping camps is more wxp than Eotm. Why? because of the guards giving wxp. So just doing random stuff in normal wvw is better for leveling and is fun compared to the Eotm karma train. The end of the week karma train in normal wvw is more rewarding than the Eotm karma train. Why do Eotm? Without those achievement I would never go their. Not enough roaming/havoc group stuff to do when compared to a borderland.

I think of Eotm as a training ground for newer wvw commanders. No one will complain much if you fail. You can get a newer wvw guild to organize better or a new commander to understand zerging is not just running and auto attacking.

I don’t see EOTM as training for anything to do with WvW. If you want to train get in WvW. If you want to command, follow a good commander who will help you and command yourself off-peak.

So, for that reason I say take away ALL wXP from EOTM.

I don’t know why people are so upset about the PvE’ers getting wxp from EotM and getting their ‘wxp titles’… These people will likely never be in the actual WvW to show them anyway…

Also, I would pretty much laugh if I ever stomp a platinum/diamond or whatever other higher rank because the dude was just a scrub who never actually learned to fight.

Jong.5937:

I don’t see EOTM as training for anything to do with WvW. If you want to train get in WvW. If you want to command, follow a good commander who will help you and command yourself off-peak.

So, for that reason I say take away ALL wXP from EOTM.

I agree somewhat. EotM shouldn’t ever be viewed as actual WvW. It’s more of a playground for the PvE crowd who wants to say they do WvW. HoD apparently spends quite a large amount of time in EotM. But I’m repeating myself.

Id rather see the whole awards for WvW boosted to be in line with EotM:-

ie, The reward for the time and effort to cap Stone Mist or any borderlands keep is way way too low in comparison to EotM.

Whole different skill set for WvW over EotM (and im not talking traits), and it shows.

I’m a 3 weeks old WvW player. I play WvW because I like it and because of the titles. Now that the PvE trains has been nerfed and the train that was in EotM has become bigger it’s really easy to earn WxP there. Way easier then for the people that are actually playing WvW.

I never enjoyed the train cuz it required hardly anything to do it. Now people who are mindlesly running around in circle are earning more WxP then me, someone that solos camps , scouts or trebs which hardly gives me any WxP while these people earn WxP for little to no effort and to make it worse they aren’t even trying to earn WxP. And even if I run with the commander I still don’t earn as much WxP as the people in EotM.

Now the titles that I love so much have the same worth as mystic forge or legendary weapons, you know those things people can just buy with money or gold instead of actually earning them.

For all I care you give those EotM people 1 gold per bag just don’t let them earn any WxP so those titles will still mean anything to me. You already made mystic forge and legendary weapons mean nothing to me don’t do this with the WvW titles.

I know my post is selfish but what made me go to WvW is because I had no more goals in PvE. Yes I still enjoy PvE but because there is no goal for me there I hardly play it. WvW is enjoyable as well and if those titles are going to mean nothing (to me) then eventually the time I spend playing WvW (hours) is going to be as short as PvE (20-30 min).

There’s no sense of community in EoTM .. that’s why no one cares about winning or losing there and that’s why it’s become merely a karma train.

Same thing is happening with megaservers in PvE, of course. Anet doesn’t learn.

EOTM may get nerfed, but I suspect by the rewards and map design that it was intended as a profitable train map.

Megaservers “fixed” pve, but Anet realizes such a fix won’t work in WvW (I would offer free transfers but hey) I think their solution to fixing WvW is the same as the solution to pretty much everything else in the game, which is making it into a karma/loot train.

Personally I would rather have my server merged, than be herded with carrots into wvw train maps. Since it doesn’t even feel much different to champ trains in QD or Orr.

It’s a really weird thing when you regularly see single enemy players run past each other and avoid combat simply because they want to rejoin the train. Very different mindset to players in there and ones in real WvW.

Remove all rewards and auto turrets from EOTM. Also combine all the land masses into one. I stopped using that map a long time ago because of these problems.

Seigfried.5938:

Remove all rewards and auto turrets from EOTM. Also combine all the land masses into one. I stopped using that map a long time ago because of these problems.

Wide open maps lead to trains getting split up easily. The map consisting of 95% rope bridges ensures the train stays together. The map was unfortunately designed 100% intentionally.

Don’t pay EOTM attention. This map slows even more the development of the real WvW down.

Iluth.6875:

Seigfried.5938:

Remove all rewards and auto turrets from EOTM. Also combine all the land masses into one. I stopped using that map a long time ago because of these problems.

Wide open maps lead to trains getting split up easily. The map consisting of 95% rope bridges ensures the train stays together. The map was unfortunately designed 100% intentionally.

It goes to show Eotm is truly a joke. Sad really, so many of us were looking forward to it and had high expectations.

Most people complain about abyssmal rewards in most parts of the game, and you want EotM rewards nerfed. Why?

Lévis.5489:

Most people complain about abyssmal rewards in most parts of the game, and you want EotM rewards nerfed. Why?

We should be rewarded for our fights against other players, not zerging a harmless door or a champion.

If they nerf EotM, we’ll just have to spend that much longer in there instead of regular WvW.

btw… the only thing that stops going choo choo in WvW are small minded players. Regular WvW maps have a faster circuit which yields the greatest rewards.

Jeknar.6184:

I don’t know why people are so upset about the PvE’ers getting wxp from EotM and getting their ‘wxp titles’… These people will likely never be in the actual WvW to show them anyway…

Also, I would pretty much laugh if I ever stomp a platinum/diamond or whatever other higher rank because the dude was just a scrub who never actually learned to fight.

Seen plenty of ‘higher ranked’ players being stomped as soon as they come out from their 80 strong zerg or get out from behind their 20 AC from which they got their ranks.

It is sad that being brain dead in eotm rewards more and easier wexp and rewards than actually playing in wvw.

Titles mean nothing and don’t reflect true player skill so don’t get too hung up on them. I’m personally happy EotM exists. It keeps the karma trains more or less out of wvw.

Those that want to wvw will continue to do so, and those that want a break or just want to k train will go to EotM. I’ve never been upset someone can run in EotM and get more wxp than I get in wvw. I just prefer wvw. Now, back to killing people.

I am not upset about the wxp they gain either. As wxp does nothing else than better wwww capacicty, if they are higher wxp rank they will be more usefull having more rank if they one day decide to play in WWW. So no problem here.
The gain in bonus in badge of honor could be either removed or added in regular Www too. But it’s not a big deal.

What bother me more is the fact that it’s really easy to do the season meta just staying in EOTM. I mean it’s great that for server that are really active in WWW players don’t have to wait in line to enter and do their meta. But that it is exploited so that players will have the title and reward while they didn’t contribute at all in their server ranking is kind of weird and unfair.

Don’t hate on my Karma/Loot/Exp/WExp/Badges train on EOTM. It’s one of the best reasons for me to get my commander tag.

ChoooChooooooo~~~~

(Also, try to tone down on the complaints. I swear that over the past 10 or so years, the amount of complainers online and in game conventions have multiplied in numbers. Or maybe they’re simply the most vocal group of people because the rest of us are enjoying the game instead of crying about “broken mechanics” or something that doesn’t cater to our wants/needs/etc)

@OP

dont make wvw a borefest and sit in towers forever with more siege than players + everything upgraded

than you gain more wxp, karma, gold, loot ……..

i rly dont understand this complaining

The entire reward system of EotM needs to be overhauled. Entering an overflow should get you a set of achievements to do for that overflow, and rewards get mailed when the match finishes based on how well that overflow did and based on your overall participation. And to counter potential blowouts. the outnumbered mechanics needs to be hugely buffed.

Ulion.5476:

Roaming mostly flipping camps is more wxp than Eotm. Why? because of the guards giving wxp. So just doing random stuff in normal wvw is better for leveling and is fun compared to the Eotm karma train. The end of the week karma train in normal wvw is more rewarding than the Eotm karma train. Why do Eotm? Without those achievement I would never go their. Not enough roaming/havoc group stuff to do when compared to a borderland.

I don’t know if you’ve done EotM trains before but they are far better than the regular map trains. I’ve seen myself gain many more levels in an hour of EotM than I did at the end of the week on the regular maps where everyone does the karma train.

Flipping camps is most definitely not better WXP. There are only six on a map and the travel time between each is rather long. The WXP from guards is laughable at best. In EotM you can doing a loop and be completing one of the objectives every couple of minutes. There’s also no downtime as people don’t actively defend these objectives which isn’t the case in the regular WvW maps.

I suggest you spend an hour in EotM in a karma train and then another hour in one on the regular WvW maps. You’ll see that there’s quite a difference.

If loot was reduced then no one would play eotm. Keep it the way it is. It’s much more fun than old WvW anyway.

However, since there are no points, that loot is the only reason to play it.

Rezz.8019:

If loot was reduced then no one would play eotm. Keep it the way it is. It’s much more profitable than old WvW anyway.

However, since there are no points, that loot is the only reason to play it.

FTFY

EotM is a great map, it WAS played the way it was intended, but people want easy rewards. honestly how fast can you spend your karma? I have never had a Karma issue because everything rewards it, so I don’t understand why people seem to declare that the need the karma train in EotM.

lately I’ve been noticing that people who like to defend do exist, and they are growing in EotM, simply because the other colors are like sheep to the slaughter when they go up against something that is defended, and the bags OMG the bags of loot.

so keep Ktraining or whatever you want to call it, I appreciate the bags you give when you come knocking on my doors

how about a penalty for dying hmmmm? put some of that precious karma on the line when you want to PvD.

ZilentNight.5089:

I am never an advocate for nerfs and will not support a “Reduce Wxp” agenda.
Instead, you should be asking for a buff of Wxp in the main maps.

Another thing to consider, Wxp is such an insignificant rank in itself, after a player achieves rank 500~ you can easily max Applied Fortitude & Strength.
This leaves you with enough points to max a couple other Siege Masteries depending on your class and play style. Anything beyond that is over kill and does not matter much.

Eotm allows newer players to learn Wvw tactics and catch up to the WvW vet players. Think of it like a Summer school for the new.
Also just because the rewards suck in regular WvW does not mean we shld nerf Eotm, I can clearly argue that rewards in dungeons are way too high so please nerf.
That would not be a valid argument, instead you should ask for rewards based on effort.

THIS!

EotM is fun, so is WvW, WvW, is just not as rewarding. Instead of slapping yet another nerf on WvW as a whole, fix the problem.

The main fight needs more. More WxP, more ACHIEVABLE achievement, more balance, more… well, a lot.

Edge, its a fun distraction and I see no major flaws with it, if it compared and scaled correctly to the rest of WvW.

FiX WvW, don’t nerf it!

It is WvW’s reward system (WXP too) that should be modified.

No point in fixing EotM exp drop, cause a lot of players will just return to PvE (not WvW) in case of nerfing.

I am surprised by a lot of these comments. I wish I could get more people to participate in EotM I often find that it is a small splinter group of us versus a huge zerg of enemies when we run in it. I do agree that defense should be made more appealing as right now my only motivation to defend is to ruin Overgrowth’s day. That being said I often find that myself and a select few other commanders run odd paths and cut off other zergs leaving them stuck with RI wait times etc. Personally I lead everyone into Zerg vs Zerg fights when I know we have a shot of winning. It is something that is satisfying on a primal level when we destroy the other Zerg and they are left dead and angry. In response to nerfing rewards in EotM I think this would end EotM it would just become Cursed Shore pre-megaserver. I do however think that buffing the rewards up from WvW would not be a bad idea. Maybe leave them the same for basic unupgraded sites but figure out a way to offer bigger rewards for taking down a fully bunkered keep. I think this could be applied to EotM as well by maybe creating an event for fortifying your keeps and towers. That way you have a defensible position that is manageable to defend and also attractive to defend. That way if WvW’rs want to go to EotM it is more similar to what they are used to and it also trains people that participate to be better at WvW. Any thoughts pro or con? (Sorry about the wall of text.)