Guild Wars 2

During our ascent through the tiers with Kaineng, War Machine has endeavored to be as honorable and respectful as is possible in a competitive PvP format.

The majority of our opponents and allies (individuals, guilds and servers) have also acted in this grain, and we can have no complaint about their conduct. However, at the same time as we have strong honorable opponents on one hand, there have also been some questionable tactics implemented by less respectful, weaker opponents who, having seen our strength, and unquestionably superior team-play, seek to damage our guild, and our server through underhand methods.

These methods include but are not limited to, comprehensive slander on both the official, and sometimes unofficial forums, unfounded and unproven accusations that we are multiboxing, botting, exploiting and generally taking part in dishonorable conduct.

I wish to state that all of these accusations are false, under no circumstances would anyone in War Machine ever exploit in any of the aforementioned ways and anyone proven to be doing so would be removed from our community.

Several members of our guild have received automatic bans for botting Immediately before reset on the 25’th of January. These bans are currently being appealed, but it is highly disruptive to our guild’s functionality and our preparation for reset.

This behavior cannot be allowed to pass unnoticed, War Machine is being systematically targeted by a group of people who are willing to violate the code of conduct in order to sabotage another server’s community.

Thank you for any help in this matter.

I seriously doubt posting on this forum is the appropriate place to express this. However, with that said….

Even if 1000 people reported someone for botting, unless there was at least a SMALL warning bell someone at ANet saw or the system detected, I doubt a ban would go out….even an automatic one.

Not saying for 100% sure anyone did anything wrong, but flip side if there was 100% for sure no one did anything that seemed off, there would be no ban regardless of reporting.

No game company wants to ban people unjustly, and no one out there uses a system that just gives auto bans based on reports. If they did, it would be a disaster for them. Is there bugs in any system? Of course. Do people get hit with a ban when they shouldnt? Of course. But saying just because people are “abuse reporting” someone that they can get banned is stretching it a little bit.

And a guild like yours is systemically destroying months of matches by having no server loyalty and transferring down every time you can’t hack it.

Tandy.4781:

No game company wants to ban people unjustly, and no one out there uses a system that just gives auto bans based on reports. If they did, it would be a disaster for them. Is there bugs in any system? Of course. Do people get hit with a ban when they shouldnt? Of course. But saying just because people are “abuse reporting” someone that they can get banned is stretching it a little bit.

ANET uses such a system…dunno if it’s manual or what, but after a certain number of reports…auto-ban. What’s worse, though, is the Gold Ban…know far too many people auto-banned for trading Gold…when they earned it legitimately farming.

I have never played against WM but I can tell you that I have been reporting A LOT of people lately for botting since there is no option to report players for hacking.

The max run speed in this game is capped at 33% out of combat which my elementalist is at all the time. If a player can noticeably out run me that player has to be hacking and I report everybody.

Peetee.9406:

I have never played against WM but I can tell you that I have been reporting A LOT of people lately for botting since there is no option to report players for hacking.

The max run speed in this game is capped at 33% out of combat which my elementalist is at all the time. If a player can noticeably out run me that player has to be hacking and I report everybody.

Unless they’re a warrior or using leopard/bear form….. I have yet to see speed hacking in this game. Use of unintended items… sure all day. The occasional flying mesmer i’ve spotted, but not speed hacking.

On topic, I don’t know how they do botting bans. The gold transfer stuff is automatic, horribly implemented, and easily skirted around. I’d like to think they need proof before throwing out the ban, but who knows… maybe they didn’t. Either way this isn’t the place to bring it up.

If it looks like a duck …

Peetee.9406:

I have never played against WM but I can tell you that I have been reporting A LOT of people lately for botting since there is no option to report players for hacking.

The max run speed in this game is capped at 33% out of combat which my elementalist is at all the time. If a player can noticeably out run me that player has to be hacking and I report everybody.

I think there’s several legitimate ways to exceed 33% runspeed, one of which is the superior rune of speed, the final bonus increases move speed by an extra 7% when using swiftness.

I don’t know why I bothered posting at all though, this thread will likely be closed or deleted.

Peetee.9406:

I have never played against WM but I can tell you that I have been reporting A LOT of people lately for botting since there is no option to report players for hacking.

The max run speed in this game is capped at 33% out of combat which my elementalist is at all the time. If a player can noticeably out run me that player has to be hacking and I report everybody.

The problem is that this particular case is being caused by a few individuals making very broad statements and following them up with reporting…over…and over…and over…and over again. If you asked people whether they HONESTLY thought WM was Botting, only people who’d say “Yes” are bum-hurt individuals upset they lost a fight. WM has skill and discipline. They don’t need to cheat to be great at what they do.

Shroom.9026:

Several members of our guild have received automatic bans for botting Immediately before reset on the 25’th of January.

No surprised in the least. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, its most likely a WM

Noone is banned for a report, or even 100 reports. Anet investigates every claim, and other than them using the system in place to fight such a ban, posting here is really pointless. Let the system work.

Peetee.9406:

he max run speed in this game is capped at 33% out of combat which my elementalist is at all the time. If a player can noticeably out run me that player has to be hacking and I report everybody.

Ya, that’s not true. Good job reporting a bunch of innocent people though.

Actually, people are banned for reports or even following other bots in a DE. Those get unbanned in a few hours after an appeal though. however, I honestly think this blanket ban is better it serves a purpose to deter people from botting.

I’m not so sure, I’ve heard plenty of people randomly banned for something they didn’t do then ANet sending an apology PM or email or whatever about the situation and lifting it asap.

Cat Amiss.9463:

I’m not so sure, I’ve heard plenty of people randomly banned for something they didn’t do then ANet sending an apology PM or email or whatever about the situation and lifting it asap.

Doesn’t that mean the system worked?

Well if WM needs to cheat in tier 5 they got serious problems.

How would anyone ever know how many reports are sent in on a person? Sounds like made up crap to me.

Sounds like they botted to me. Guilty, court adjourned

Without being able to provide relevant facts to show your guild members were innocent, I do not think you make a good case that people are abusing the report button.

It’s not like a court of law and trial by peers.

I hope that any innocent people are quickly unbanned.

I also hope that 1-2 admitted past exploits by individuals are not being used as a reason to single out a guild or guild members.

Please treat each case on it’s own merits when you feel you are seeing bots/exploits etc you may be mistaken.

Sunspots.9861:

Noone is banned for a report, or even 100 reports. Anet investigates every claim, and other than them using the system in place to fight such a ban, posting here is really pointless. Let the system work.

I think Anet says they do not have an “Auto-ban” feature, and that an actual person has to click the ban button, buuht enough reports and it will happen. I’ve had a guild member banned from ganking too many people in WvW right outside one of the other teams spawn/invulnerable location. It took Anet a week to undo his ban an say it was “in error” <.<.

No compensation, no reason =/. The report feature is easily abused.

There is no cheating, and what is being stated above is in fact true.

Catisa.6507:

And a guild like yours is systemically destroying months of matches by having no server loyalty and transferring down every time you can’t hack it.

^^ This has no place here. Nor impact to anything, nor is true. Have a look below at the tiers in millennium, upon departure. 1 week per tier going up to equal ground is expected. In that week, the server as a whole, has made it aware and all servers a talking point in that week. The only thing our server could do, in order to limit it to 1 week at a time, was to win by margin enough to bump up brackets and not stick around multiple weeks. In that time, we have addressed and acknowledged it to many.

The issue, and request … is the 10 banned or suspended accounts that are wrongly so. Jaix is addressing this, with arenanet. As you can tell, it’s written and reviewed by a professional, in a first and formal letter and request to ArenaNet. The rest of us have no matter in this, unless you are one of the people reporting without evidence. I would hope not.

If you have evidence to the matter 1 way or the other, it’s the only thing useful.

Jaix, I hope Anet rectifies this, or alternatively provides just cause and evidence to your members.

~X

Some ppl said we are large number of bot, but honestly, we didn’t even care, till yesterday’s disaster.

We are neither bluffer nor boaster. We all think victories are come and go. That’s why we normally didn’t post about our battle. Yes, we taking videos almost every battle just for discussion about how can we’ll improve us and what is need for that.

But now, feel like we need to show you “little” evidence we never use any illegal program or something and how we coordinate. Show 2 movie about yesterday’s our activity. We think that’s why we automatically banned.

Can you still say “wm is just a bot” after see this? I’m really curious.

Ishuria.6372:

Can you still say “wm is just a bot” after see this? I’m really curious.

Anet did. We are just agreeing.

airstu.2579:

Ishuria.6372:

Can you still say “wm is just a bot” after see this? I’m really curious.

Anet did. We are just agreeing.

If you agree when someone said or did wrong, it’s equal to said same thing.
Don’t you even know this simple thing?

I just hope this doesn’t become common tactics. I can see in T1 where people tries to get commanders banned.

If Anet made a mistake, they will fix it. Until then guilty as charged, its how Anet deals with botters. Their game, their rules, their call. I support bot bannings and unless the posted video covers every second of play the 10 have ever done in game, its worth as much as was paid to post it.

I’m more amused has to how the discussion has gone from “Several members of our guild” to “The issue, and request … is the 10 banned or suspended accounts”. More to come?

Will WM ditch Kaineng because they don’t like the tactics their enemy use? Thought that was one of the reason they left SBI.

Sad to hear this. People do stupid things out of ignorance and jealosy.
As far as I know, WM is very organised guild and atleast keeps high focus on the tight movement. That ticks the “randoms” head to think foul when they can’t break it with unorganised fighting.

airstu.2579:

If Anet made a mistake, they will fix it. Until then guilty as charged, its how Anet deals with botters. Their game, their rules, their call. I support bot bannings and unless the posted video covers every second of play the 10 have ever done in game, its worth as much as was paid to post it.

I’m more amused has to how the discussion has gone from “Several members of our guild” to “The issue, and request … is the 10 banned or suspended accounts”. More to come?

We barely complain about Anet’s policy. The problem is, all banned ppl are same squad with General Jang at the same time, even include General – our commander.
Can you imagine one of your commander keep encourage and schold you while he using a illegal program like mass bot?

Anyone who knows even a little about what WM was in GW1 and in in GW2 knows they are playing fair. Always did.

In fact this is the direct result of what happened on our SBI just before WM moved.

The only way Agg managed to fight against WM was by flooding their commanders with insulting whispers. Full pages, where they were called all sorts of censored names.

Agg were really surprised (and proud) that this actually worked in getting them angry and making them leave the map (shortly after the server too – not just because of this incident but still..) See, the US PVP players are used to ignoring this kind of behavior – seems WM are not – I remember how surprisingly mad they were when a hacker stole our orb – was there on the map and they literally went crazy -they could not believe it to be possible.

So they are weak to trolling and harassing. Their current foes discovered this weakness and are trying to exploit it – mass reporting for botting seem a legit strategy for some.

And Anet has a clear policy about “ban first, ask later” whenever it touches their income and “bot reports” do that. They use automated banning systems – banned Dulfy, they banned many WvW guild and community leaders.

So WM is weak to trolling – they should try to correct this weakness if they intend to continue playing.

Request action: Report Abuse of Report function. jks.

My experience of WM on SoS was a good one. No complaints or exploits there, except maybe having too many committed wvw members.

SO how does the commander of WM get banned for botting. Is there like a software for leading?

If u saw awesome enemy, report them. and then they can’t come to u.
So u can win.
For example, Now elite member of WM include wm leader “Jang” can’t play
coz malcious reports from WvW enemies. sigh~~~.
Troll>Keyboardwarrior>noob>big zerg

Mike, I find it hard to believe a commander leading a zerg would be accused of botting.

Several famous WvW guild leaders in T1 (I know of Coronbale and Jedbacca) have been banned for gold selling. They took gold from the guild bank and sent it to guild members to buy commander tags. An automated system banned them. They were reinstated days after they contested the decision.

As someone who tagged along with Jang during his SBI days, sometimes I wished he was a bot – so much scolding of his followers, and angry caps typing

Well, having fought some against WM it looked to me like they just moved very well together and were very organized and disciplined. I didn’t think they were botting.

WAR MACHINE is very famous guild from guildwars1. they are bot? are you kidding.

MikeFerguson.8921:

I want to clear something up here, we do not auto-ban people without investigating the account first. Our CS staff reviews reports that come in and if they find questionable activity, they take whatever action they deem appropriate.

Maybe it is time to re-evaluate your investigation process, then. The amount of false-flag reports that have resulted in a ban are disconcerting, to say the least

Ninein.4782:

SO how does the commander of WM get banned for botting. Is there like a software for leading?

Get enough people to make a ‘convincing’ report.

MikeFerguson.8921:

I want to clear something up here, we do not auto-ban people without investigating the account first. Our CS staff reviews reports that come in and if they find questionable activity, they take whatever action they deem appropriate.

You may receive an automated response if you appeal actions taken against your account, but any action we take is reviewed and enacted by human beings.

It is true that we have reinstated folks that were banned erroneously for questionable activity, but we don’t take action against an account unless a very solid reason presents itself upon review.

Please note that I’m not commenting specifically on the actions take against those accounts mentioned in the OP and I have no information on why any action was taken in the cases mentioned. I just want everyone to understand that we don’t ban people just because they get a lot of reports against them, our CS folks have to find and confirm actual infractions before we take any action.

Thank you very much for the reply, but please understand the system is beeing abused with regard to WvWvW and people ARE getting wrongfully banned without reason or compensation. More and more people are learning they can get away with abusing the report feature and more incidents like this are just going to happen.

Ninein.4782:

SO how does the commander of WM get banned for botting. Is there like a software for leading?

Ninein, IF, If there’s software can moving and leading us like our commanders,
we eager to face and fight against who use it! lol

Mike, your CS folks would ban people if they transferred gold to guild mates to buy commander titles. If your CS is truly thorough and diligent, we would not have such issues arising.

Shroom.9026:

During our ascent through the tiers with Kaineng, War Machine has endeavored to be as honorable and respectful as is possible in a competitive PvP format.

The majority of our opponents and allies (individuals, guilds and servers) have also acted in this grain, and we can have no complaint about their conduct. However, at the same time as we have strong honorable opponents on one hand, there have also been some questionable tactics implemented by less respectful, weaker opponents who, having seen our strength, and unquestionably superior team-play, seek to damage our guild, and our server through underhand methods.

These methods include but are not limited to, comprehensive slander on both the official, and sometimes unofficial forums, unfounded and unproven accusations that we are multiboxing, botting, exploiting and generally taking part in dishonorable conduct.

I wish to state that all of these accusations are false, under no circumstances would anyone in War Machine ever exploit in any of the aforementioned ways and anyone proven to be doing so would be removed from our community.

Several members of our guild have received automatic bans for botting Immediately before reset on the 25’th of January. These bans are currently being appealed, but it is highly disruptive to our guild’s functionality and our preparation for reset.

This behavior cannot be allowed to pass unnoticed, War Machine is being systematically targeted by a group of people who are willing to violate the code of conduct in order to sabotage another server’s community.

Thank you for any help in this matter.

There’s a commander in WM who post under the name of General. Have you guys kicked him from the guild yet? He exploited into bay keep before you guys xfered.

Never worked personally with any of you but played against you plenty.

As someone who respects your guilds wvw ability, I sincerely hope this issue is worked out quickly and you are all able to return to wvw as quickly as possible. On the other hand, I hope that if there are members of your community who are hacking, you’ll be able to find them quickly and solve this problem.

Best regards,

~Kell

Ever thought that they are all actually bots? Geez.

If I were a botter I’d sure as hell try and defend myself on these forums

I have enjoyed playing with WM on Kain, don’t let them get you down, you guys are alot of fun to play with.

[WM] using bots? That sounds ridiculous to me. Why would any botter use the same account to bot and play WvW? Makes no sense. And if people really were banned from false reporting then that is totally f’d up and should be investigated.

I suppose that it might be possible to inadvertently share an IP address with some people that botted and get banned via the IP (like a college dorm where many people share the same IP address). But I would think that a lot would have to be done to ban an entire IP instead of just individual accounts.

If false accusations were made and people really got banned then it is extremely disappointing and I feel sorry for those that now have to wait out the appeal process.

I’ve played with WM a lot over the past few weeks and I’ve never seen anything bot-like from any of them. The other day a WM commander was leading a PUG zerg around, we wiped a group at a camp and the commander lead us to the north camp saying in map chat “there’s a 53.24% chance they’ll attack the north camp next”, when someone asked how he figured that out he replied “I’m a bot, don’t you read the forums? lol” So clearly if they are bots then they’ve become self-aware and we should all be afraid.

I see complaints about how they move around very coordinated, but if you’ve played with their leaders you’d know even with pugs they focus on keeping everyone in a tight grouping.