Guild Wars 2

Those are some balanced piercing auto attacks

WvW is the imbalance in pvp on steroids. And it will continue to be that way until they split balance and do some serious damage reductions for that kind of nonsense.

I experienced this on my glass ele during the time when it went through walls… not fun.

Any minute now someone will come in here and tell you that a Cruel Repercussion proc is not a realistic representation of revenant damage, and that when you disregard the trait, the remaining 5.5k, 1500 range, piercing auto attack is actually completely balanced.

Anet devs will read that post and silently nod in agreement.

vana.5467:

Any minute now someone will come in here and tell you that a Cruel Repercussion proc is not a realistic representation of revenant damage, and that when you disregard the trait, the remaining 5.5k, 1500 range, piercing auto attack is actually completely balanced.

Anet devs will read that post and silently nod in agreement.

No more imbalanced than my ele throwing 3-4K fireballs that hit in an AoE or the lava font, necro life blasts that regularly could do that much, while piercing and with 100% critchance and amazing autoproc of chilblains which can literally one shot anything glass.

For comparison hammer bolt is 0.95 coefficient listed on the wiki, puncture shot 0.9, long range shot at max is 0.9, fireball 0.85. Could do with a slight shave down to 0.9 but it’s not going to do that much to its damage either way. It’s the modifiers you should be complaining about.

I do think cruel repercussions shouldn’t be a thing though. Rev already has enough modifiers to not ever need something like that.

Edit: To show the problem, Rev has two 7% damage bonuses as minors, an executioner as a major for 20% and elder focus which is anything from 6% to 14% maybe more. Added onto that is assassins prescience and then slap cruel repercussions on to multiply all that by 50%…Yeah.

51% damage boost essentially without cruel repercussion and then it becomes 126% with cruel repercussions as the stack multiplicative.

Full zerker without mods a crit from hammer bolt will be about 2760 damage, with mods that goes up to 4160 (1.51 modifier without CR) and then add CR it becomes 6250 and that’s with no might.

Add in 25 might and we get about 3570 crit no mods, 5400 with mods and 8000 with CR but this is assuming executioner is active.

This can get higher with sigils and runes though, problem I see is they can easily duo stack might to 25, have nearly 100% crit chance and CR is just a rediculous modifier with the ability to easily survive via glint heal and shiro.

apharma.3741:

It’s the modifiers you should be complaining about.

I do. All the time.
My post was not intended to call out Hammer Bolt as a core issue, though I do think the range is silly.

Hammer being a ranged weapon leaves me scratching my head… Just as a little side to the specifics.

vana.5467:

apharma.3741:

It’s the modifiers you should be complaining about.

I do. All the time.
My post was not intended to call out Hammer Bolt as a core issue, though I do think the range is silly.

Range is 1200 (looking at it right now on tooltip) same as everything else, if it is hitting from much further away then that’s a bug.

I edited some numbers mostly rough and taken from my own zerker rev in full ascended. The might generating with CR is where the numbers really get high imo, 4K auto for no might in full zerk and all mods isn’t that bad and it’s more like 3.5k without executioner.

Get some toughness.

apharma.3741:

vana.5467:

apharma.3741:

It’s the modifiers you should be complaining about.

I do. All the time.
My post was not intended to call out Hammer Bolt as a core issue, though I do think the range is silly.

Range is 1200 (looking at it right now on tooltip) same as everything else, if it is hitting from much further away then that’s a bug.

I edited some numbers mostly rough and taken from my own zerker rev in full ascended. The might generating with CR is where the numbers really get high imo, 4K auto for no might in full zerk and all mods isn’t that bad and it’s more like 3.5k without executioner.

Range has been broken for as long as I can remember in this game. You can still hit things even when you have that red bar under your skills. Try it out by auto-attacking a cannon.

apharma.3741:

Range is 1200 (looking at it right now on tooltip) same as everything else, if it is hitting from much further away then that’s a bug.

It does. This isn’t a revenant specific issue though. Ranger longbow has almost 2000 range, ele staff 1500 etc.
Hammer Bolt has slightly more range than most other projectiles listed as 1200, but it tends to connect more reliably. That, in combination with the super high damage, makes the discrepancy especially obvious/obnoxious with revenants.

LetoII.3782:

Hammer being a ranged weapon leaves me scratching my head… Just as a little side to the specifics.

No different than the necro axe and the mesmer greatsword being ranged.

I blame all the food and buffs you can get more than anything.

Mind telling us what you were running OP?

It’s not surprising that someone with minimal toughness could get him for that much if the Rev was running full DPS, like most do these days. Especially if he has full buffs.

For reference, Hammer Bolt has a 0.95 modifier. Fireball, Ele’s Fire Auto on Staff has a 0.85. That’s only a little over 11% more damage, which isn’t a great deal at that scale, especially when Ele has access to far more damage modifiers.

Whoever tells you Revenants aren’t OP in WvW is just trying to be a special snowflake by stating the opposite of the truth in an attempt to try to sound like a good player (“yeah, that’s not a problem for me, hue hue hue”) or an attempt to somehow make themselves feel better or superior. There’s no rocket science. Revenant hammer is OP in WvW.

And no… elementalists with a staff do not come even close. A glass ele with a staff dies from a breeze. A glass power Revenant is a nearly a bunker. One is balanced, the other is not.

apharma.3741:

vana.5467:

apharma.3741:

It’s the modifiers you should be complaining about.

I do. All the time.
My post was not intended to call out Hammer Bolt as a core issue, though I do think the range is silly.

Range is 1200 (looking at it right now on tooltip) same as everything else, if it is hitting from much further away then that’s a bug.

I edited some numbers mostly rough and taken from my own zerker rev in full ascended. The might generating with CR is where the numbers really get high imo, 4K auto for no might in full zerk and all mods isn’t that bad and it’s more like 3.5k without executioner.

Every single ranged attack in the game functions this way except for firearms and ranger shortbow based on how physics projectiles are handled. This includes mesmer GS’s auto as well. Fun fact, if you jump, you can get further distances. ANet has also publicly come out (I can’t remember where, somewhere on the ranger forums) and made claims that this is working as intended and there are no plans to make changes.

mexay.3902:

Mind telling us what you were running OP?

It’s not surprising that someone with minimal toughness could get him for that much if the Rev was running full DPS, like most do these days. Especially if he has full buffs.

For reference, Hammer Bolt has a 0.95 modifier. Fireball, Ele’s Fire Auto on Staff has a 0.85. That’s only a little over 11% more damage, which isn’t a great deal at that scale, especially when Ele has access to far more damage modifiers.

Ele has less, otherwise there would be a 11k ele fireball build..

Btw hammer 2 is much more balanced at a 14k crit total in Spvp… can provide video proof.

C’mon now, it’s not easy to spam that #2.

Boreal.9826:

C’mon now, it’s not easy to spam that #2.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6W6xslm2mJM

Thanks for proving my point for me, whether that was an intentional ironic joke or not.

apharma.3741:

No more imbalanced than my ele throwing 3-4K fireballs that hit in an AoE or the lava font, necro life blasts that regularly could do that much, while piercing and with 100% critchance and amazing autoproc of chilblains which can literally one shot anything glass.

Thing is the ele has to go full glass in light armor and low HP to make that happen. The necro also in light armor has no escape. The problem with the Rev is that it wears heavy armor, has good HP, great utility, decent escape, strong sustain AND hits like a truck from 1200 often with an AoE attack. They also have one of the best skirmish bunker condi builds running in the game right now.

In general ranged DPS should always have a big survivability trade off. A player wants to hit from far away especially with an AoE, they shouldn’t also be hard to kill up close. The staff ele is a near perfect balance. To dish it out they are vulnerable up close.

Kekkei Genkai Kage.5930:

Get some toughness.

Get some toughness???
Are you serious, i’m a Guardian with 3066 armor and Rev hit me for 18k., sorry but can you please tell me how much toughness exactly i need?
/i have screenshot somewhere, im just too lazy to find it./

Avit.3165:

Kekkei Genkai Kage.5930:

Get some toughness.

Get some toughness???
Are you serious, i’m a Guardian with 3066 armor and Rev hit me for 18k., sorry but can you please tell me how much toughness exactly i need?
/i have screenshot somewhere, im just too lazy to find it./

How can heavy class have only 3066 armor? Even light classes have over 2900.

Junkpile.7439:

Avit.3165:

Kekkei Genkai Kage.5930:

Get some toughness.

Get some toughness???
Are you serious, i’m a Guardian with 3066 armor and Rev hit me for 18k., sorry but can you please tell me how much toughness exactly i need?
/i have screenshot somewhere, im just too lazy to find it./

How can heavy class have only 3066 armor? Even light classes have over 2900.

… no?

Base on light is 1920, medium 2064, 2211 on heavy.

Due to the massive numbers Revenants push out, optimal blob setup is pushing an emphasis towards full Nomad’s gear including the backline. Death by a million cuts, so to speak, because one good CoR from the enemy and you lose your fight when five people hit the floor.

LetoII.3782:

Hammer being a ranged weapon leaves me scratching my head… Just as a little side to the specifics.

I should rename my revenant “Thor”. Hope its not taken.

Zefrost.3425:

Those are some balanced piercing auto attacks

We used to complain about 8k Backstab from Thieves when the game was released. Now Heavy classes do 8k auto attacks from 1200 range (or 14-17k bursts every 3 seconds if they press 2 and get lucky).

I understand the concept of inflation but I didn’t think MMO skill damage was also subject to it.

I want CoR to cascade up walls to hit players and Siege please…

Xillllix.3485:

Zefrost.3425:

Those are some balanced piercing auto attacks

We used to complain about 8k Backstab from Thieves when the game was released. Now Heavy classes do 8k auto attacks from 1200 range (or 14-17k bursts every 3 seconds if they press 2 and get lucky).

I understand the concept of inflation but I didn’t think MMO skill damage was also subject to it.

If you were complaining about 8k backstabs you weren’t complaining about the right damage or skills.

Hasted RF was worse than it is now and dealt more damage, pets could solo groups of players, and backstabs could reach 30k easily if the thief was built properly.

Thing is, ANet tried to balance their game and for the most part did a decent job at it. WvW pre-HoT had tons of viable builds for all different purposes – moreso than sPvP – but the expansion has brought in absolutely absurd power creep (Revenant, DH, Scrapper) and horrible guild upgrades which trivialize content and make fighting unfun and very limiting now.

Some groups are coordinating CoR from several Revs which is really devastating. Getting hit by just one is bad enough, imagine 2 or more of them hitting you at the same time… pretty much insta down for even the tankiest of classes.

This makes it challenging to push as traditional melee, to say the least. But we still try, using veils and dodges, and never pushing in a straight line. Then you gotta worry about them scattering and just teeing off on you from range. So it’s a must for commanders to keep moving. Having your DPS focus on taking out Revs as priority targets helps.

It’s hard for me to believe that this ridiculousness was intentional. It’s yet another example of a mechanic’s impact to WvW not being thought through. The nerfs will come. Problem is, there are so many other broken aspects of WvW… who knows when that will happen. And they still need a shiny new class to entice more ppl to purchase HoT. RIP WvW.

Boreal.9826:

It’s hard for me to believe that this ridiculousness was intentional.

Look at all the other things affecting WvW. Its not ridiculous at all. Obviously they planned for WvW upgrades to be behind a 5000+ gold paywall, just as they planned the oasis event on desert to completely ruin gameplay. Any other thought would be highly illogical. They dont just put in a class with random numbers on its skill. The amount of damage that CoR does in WvW is planned.

Boreal.9826:

Some groups are coordinating CoR from several Revs which is really devastating. Getting hit by just one is bad enough, imagine 2 or more of them hitting you at the same time… pretty much insta down for even the tankiest of classes.

This makes it challenging to push as traditional melee, to say the least. But we still try, using veils and dodges, and never pushing in a straight line. Then you gotta worry about them scattering and just teeing off on you from range. So it’s a must for commanders to keep moving. Having your DPS focus on taking out Revs as priority targets helps.

It’s hard for me to believe that this ridiculousness was intentional. It’s yet another example of a mechanic’s impact to WvW not being thought through. The nerfs will come. Problem is, there are so many other broken aspects of WvW… who knows when that will happen. And they still need a shiny new class to entice more ppl to purchase HoT. RIP WvW.

I’m sorry, but you’re being unbelievably naive here. The damage numbers from hammer isn’t anything new. Revs were dropping CoRs into zergs during the pre-HoT betas, and I distinctly remember the Dev in charge of Revenants stating at the end of the Betas close to launch that “Revs were in a good spot”.

Hexalot.8194:

Boreal.9826:

Some groups are coordinating CoR from several Revs which is really devastating. Getting hit by just one is bad enough, imagine 2 or more of them hitting you at the same time… pretty much insta down for even the tankiest of classes.

This makes it challenging to push as traditional melee, to say the least. But we still try, using veils and dodges, and never pushing in a straight line. Then you gotta worry about them scattering and just teeing off on you from range. So it’s a must for commanders to keep moving. Having your DPS focus on taking out Revs as priority targets helps.

It’s hard for me to believe that this ridiculousness was intentional. It’s yet another example of a mechanic’s impact to WvW not being thought through. The nerfs will come. Problem is, there are so many other broken aspects of WvW… who knows when that will happen. And they still need a shiny new class to entice more ppl to purchase HoT. RIP WvW.

I’m sorry, but you’re being unbelievably naive here. The damage numbers from hammer isn’t anything new. Revs were dropping CoRs into zergs during the pre-HoT betas, and I distinctly remember the Dev in charge of Revenants stating at the end of the betas close to launch that “Revs were in a good spot”.

Thanks, good to know that the devs are so in tune with WvW.

Xillllix.3485:

Zefrost.3425:

Those are some balanced piercing auto attacks

We used to complain about 8k Backstab from Thieves when the game was released. Now Heavy classes do 8k auto attacks from 1200 range (or 14-17k bursts every 3 seconds if they press 2 and get lucky).

I understand the concept of inflation but I didn’t think MMO skill damage was also subject to it.

Note… Some commanders, not myself that is, prefer to run lots of Revs using Hammer 2. They don’t care about Herald and the protection boon stuff… They even tell people on TeamSpeak to spam Hammer #2 skill CoR over and over… It downs a lot of people and makes the game seriously boring and broken even if you’re one on the team that doing that.

What people said about toughness, yes, 3.3k armor is good even having health point pool of 28k good. You’ll still get 50% health taken if they land the hit. One way though to counter the Hammer 2 train though is to run more retaliation boon build. So that way, they crit you for say around 18k… they crit themselves for the same amount. Love how retaliation reflects all incoming damage back to source, while still having you take the damage. Then it becomes all about who has the larger health pool… Welcome to the world of tanky high health builds…

KayCee.4653:

Xillllix.3485:

Zefrost.3425:

Those are some balanced piercing auto attacks

We used to complain about 8k Backstab from Thieves when the game was released. Now Heavy classes do 8k auto attacks from 1200 range (or 14-17k bursts every 3 seconds if they press 2 and get lucky).

I understand the concept of inflation but I didn’t think MMO skill damage was also subject to it.

Note… Some commanders, not myself that is, prefer to run lots of Revs using Hammer 2. They don’t care about Herald and the protection boon stuff… They even tell people on TeamSpeak to spam Hammer #2 skill CoR over and over… It downs a lot of people and makes the game seriously boring and broken even if you’re one on the team that doing that.

What people said about toughness, yes, 3.3k armor is good even having health point pool of 28k good. You’ll still get 50% health taken if they land the hit. One way though to counter the Hammer 2 train though is to run more retaliation boon build. So that way, they crit you for say around 18k… they crit themselves for the same amount. Love how retaliation reflects all incoming damage back to source, while still having you take the damage. Then it becomes all about who has the larger health pool… Welcome to the world of tanky high health builds…

In PVP and WvW, Retaliation damage returned is reduced by a third. Have high toughness/armor, and you get an even further reduction. Just saying.

KayCee.4653:

Xillllix.3485:

Zefrost.3425:

Those are some balanced piercing auto attacks

We used to complain about 8k Backstab from Thieves when the game was released. Now Heavy classes do 8k auto attacks from 1200 range (or 14-17k bursts every 3 seconds if they press 2 and get lucky).

I understand the concept of inflation but I didn’t think MMO skill damage was also subject to it.

Note… Some commanders, not myself that is, prefer to run lots of Revs using Hammer 2. They don’t care about Herald and the protection boon stuff… They even tell people on TeamSpeak to spam Hammer #2 skill CoR over and over… It downs a lot of people and makes the game seriously boring and broken even if you’re one on the team that doing that.

What people said about toughness, yes, 3.3k armor is good even having health point pool of 28k good. You’ll still get 50% health taken if they land the hit. One way though to counter the Hammer 2 train though is to run more retaliation boon build. So that way, they crit you for say around 18k… they crit themselves for the same amount. Love how retaliation reflects all incoming damage back to source, while still having you take the damage. Then it becomes all about who has the larger health pool… Welcome to the world of tanky high health builds…

The only drawback about Retal is that it works only against White damage. It has no affect against Condi’s which is sad. Hence my Guard is now mostly used for crafting to make gold.

yeah but Rev number 2 hammer skill does no fire damage. Therefore condi, why worry about that if you’re just QQ’ing about Revs.

Straegen.2938:

apharma.3741:

No more imbalanced than my ele throwing 3-4K fireballs that hit in an AoE or the lava font, necro life blasts that regularly could do that much, while piercing and with 100% critchance and amazing autoproc of chilblains which can literally one shot anything glass.

Thing is the ele has to go full glass in light armor and low HP to make that happen. The necro also in light armor has no escape. The problem with the Rev is that it wears heavy armor, has good HP, great utility, decent escape, strong sustain AND hits like a truck from 1200 often with an AoE attack. They also have one of the best skirmish bunker condi builds running in the game right now.

In general ranged DPS should always have a big survivability trade off. A player wants to hit from far away especially with an AoE, they shouldn’t also be hard to kill up close. The staff ele is a near perfect balance. To dish it out they are vulnerable up close.

Yeah I run staff ele in WvW and that’s not just it, the ele essentially has to run fire and air to get damage modifiers equal to (not run the numbers yet) a revenant. Though if you discount cruel repercussions an eles fireball should do about the same amount of damage.

Thing is, as you say, eles don’t get 40% crit chance from fury, staff self stacking might is poor without the Pyromancer’s Puissance trait and as you said, they’re very very squishy, more so with only having water, arcana or tempest as 3rd slot.

Still that screenshot and some of these claims of being hit for 18k with 3k toughness I find hard to believe without there being a cruel repercussions trait massively boosting it.

apharma.3741:

Thing is, as you say, eles don’t get 40% crit chance from fury,

Fury is 20%

LetoII.3782:

apharma.3741:

Thing is, as you say, eles don’t get 40% crit chance from fury,

Fury is 20%

Not when you spec into the trait as a revenant.

Junkpile.7439:

Avit.3165:

Kekkei Genkai Kage.5930:

Get some toughness.

Get some toughness???
Are you serious, i’m a Guardian with 3066 armor and Rev hit me for 18k., sorry but can you please tell me how much toughness exactly i need?
/i have screenshot somewhere, im just too lazy to find it./

How can heavy class have only 3066 armor? Even light classes have over 2900.

Since when do heavy classes have 3066 armor wearing zerk or anything without toughness and light classes have over 2900 armor?

KayCee.4653:

Xillllix.3485:

Zefrost.3425:

Those are some balanced piercing auto attacks

We used to complain about 8k Backstab from Thieves when the game was released. Now Heavy classes do 8k auto attacks from 1200 range (or 14-17k bursts every 3 seconds if they press 2 and get lucky).

I understand the concept of inflation but I didn’t think MMO skill damage was also subject to it.

Note… Some commanders, not myself that is, prefer to run lots of Revs using Hammer 2. They don’t care about Herald and the protection boon stuff… They even tell people on TeamSpeak to spam Hammer #2 skill CoR over and over… It downs a lot of people and makes the game seriously boring and broken even if you’re one on the team that doing that.

What people said about toughness, yes, 3.3k armor is good even having health point pool of 28k good. You’ll still get 50% health taken if they land the hit. One way though to counter the Hammer 2 train though is to run more retaliation boon build. So that way, they crit you for say around 18k… they crit themselves for the same amount. Love how retaliation reflects all incoming damage back to source, while still having you take the damage. Then it becomes all about who has the larger health pool… Welcome to the world of tanky high health builds…

Retal doesn’t reflect. The damage done is 200 + (0.075 * Power) damage from the person that applied retaliation ; in WvW it is reduced by 33% damage.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Retaliation

It’s a fact that this game is imbalanced in wvw, it’s likely that things will even out by the next patch, but these patches are often take too long, they made nerfs to certain professions in-between, but left other things still broken.

And Thieves rerolling to Revs aswell? Pfft, those guys who rerolled, weren’t even that good in the first place.

LetoII.3782:

apharma.3741:

Thing is, as you say, eles don’t get 40% crit chance from fury,

Fury is 20%

Revs have a GM trait that doubles the effect of fury. Means they end up sitting at about 93% crit chance in full berserkers.

apharma.3741:

Straegen.2938:

apharma.3741:

No more imbalanced than my ele throwing 3-4K fireballs that hit in an AoE or the lava font, necro life blasts that regularly could do that much, while piercing and with 100% critchance and amazing autoproc of chilblains which can literally one shot anything glass.

Thing is the ele has to go full glass in light armor and low HP to make that happen. The necro also in light armor has no escape. The problem with the Rev is that it wears heavy armor, has good HP, great utility, decent escape, strong sustain AND hits like a truck from 1200 often with an AoE attack. They also have one of the best skirmish bunker condi builds running in the game right now.

In general ranged DPS should always have a big survivability trade off. A player wants to hit from far away especially with an AoE, they shouldn’t also be hard to kill up close. The staff ele is a near perfect balance. To dish it out they are vulnerable up close.

Yeah I run staff ele in WvW and that’s not just it, the ele essentially has to run fire and air to get damage modifiers equal to (not run the numbers yet) a revenant. Though if you discount cruel repercussions an eles fireball should do about the same amount of damage.

Thing is, as you say, eles don’t get 40% crit chance from fury, staff self stacking might is poor without the Pyromancer’s Puissance trait and as you said, they’re very very squishy, more so with only having water, arcana or tempest as 3rd slot.

Still that screenshot and some of these claims of being hit for 18k with 3k toughness I find hard to believe without there being a cruel repercussions trait massively boosting it.

I can get you a screenshot of a cruel repercussions proc critting a melee train t1 warrior for 21k….

Sadrien.3470:

apharma.3741:

Straegen.2938:

apharma.3741:

No more imbalanced than my ele throwing 3-4K fireballs that hit in an AoE or the lava font, necro life blasts that regularly could do that much, while piercing and with 100% critchance and amazing autoproc of chilblains which can literally one shot anything glass.

Thing is the ele has to go full glass in light armor and low HP to make that happen. The necro also in light armor has no escape. The problem with the Rev is that it wears heavy armor, has good HP, great utility, decent escape, strong sustain AND hits like a truck from 1200 often with an AoE attack. They also have one of the best skirmish bunker condi builds running in the game right now.

In general ranged DPS should always have a big survivability trade off. A player wants to hit from far away especially with an AoE, they shouldn’t also be hard to kill up close. The staff ele is a near perfect balance. To dish it out they are vulnerable up close.

Yeah I run staff ele in WvW and that’s not just it, the ele essentially has to run fire and air to get damage modifiers equal to (not run the numbers yet) a revenant. Though if you discount cruel repercussions an eles fireball should do about the same amount of damage.

Thing is, as you say, eles don’t get 40% crit chance from fury, staff self stacking might is poor without the Pyromancer’s Puissance trait and as you said, they’re very very squishy, more so with only having water, arcana or tempest as 3rd slot.

Still that screenshot and some of these claims of being hit for 18k with 3k toughness I find hard to believe without there being a cruel repercussions trait massively boosting it.

I can get you a screenshot of a cruel repercussions proc critting a melee train t1 warrior for 21k….

Yeah I was saying I’d have a hard time believing 18K hit on a 3k armour target without CR especially hammer bolt which was what the OP screenshot. I’m more than aware just how much and how stupidly high it boosts damage.

Here’s some numbers accounting for max might, fury, hitting for max weapon damage, all 11 boons for max elder focus, bloodlust and force sigil, no food/oils buffs though so could go up by a few hundred.

Hammer bolt with CR
3556*1111*0.95/3000 = 1251.1
1251.1*2.3 = 2877.4
multipliers
2877.4*1.07*1.07*1.2*1.05*1.24*1.5 = 7721
With max vuln = 9651

CoR final hit with CR
3556*1111*2.25/3000 = 2963
2963*2.3 = 6815
multipliers
6815*1.07*1.07*1.2*1.05*1.24*1.5 = 18286
Vuln is a 1.25 modifier so would make it 22857

Hammer bolt without CR
5147
With max vuln
6434

CoR final hit without CR
12191
With max vuln
15238

What this shows is CoR really should have a higher CD or lower coefficient (or get a rework considering a hill can nullify it) and that cruel repercussions is absolutely insane for boosting damage and really should be a different trait that doesn’t boost damage, revs really don’t need it ontop of high coefficients.

apharma.3741:

Sadrien.3470:

apharma.3741:

Straegen.2938:

apharma.3741:

No more imbalanced than my ele throwing 3-4K fireballs that hit in an AoE or the lava font, necro life blasts that regularly could do that much, while piercing and with 100% critchance and amazing autoproc of chilblains which can literally one shot anything glass.

Thing is the ele has to go full glass in light armor and low HP to make that happen. The necro also in light armor has no escape. The problem with the Rev is that it wears heavy armor, has good HP, great utility, decent escape, strong sustain AND hits like a truck from 1200 often with an AoE attack. They also have one of the best skirmish bunker condi builds running in the game right now.

In general ranged DPS should always have a big survivability trade off. A player wants to hit from far away especially with an AoE, they shouldn’t also be hard to kill up close. The staff ele is a near perfect balance. To dish it out they are vulnerable up close.

Yeah I run staff ele in WvW and that’s not just it, the ele essentially has to run fire and air to get damage modifiers equal to (not run the numbers yet) a revenant. Though if you discount cruel repercussions an eles fireball should do about the same amount of damage.

Thing is, as you say, eles don’t get 40% crit chance from fury, staff self stacking might is poor without the Pyromancer’s Puissance trait and as you said, they’re very very squishy, more so with only having water, arcana or tempest as 3rd slot.

Still that screenshot and some of these claims of being hit for 18k with 3k toughness I find hard to believe without there being a cruel repercussions trait massively boosting it.

I can get you a screenshot of a cruel repercussions proc critting a melee train t1 warrior for 21k….

Yeah I was saying I’d have a hard time believing 18K hit on a 3k armour target without CR especially hammer bolt which was what the OP screenshot. I’m more than aware just how much and how stupidly high it boosts damage.

Here’s some numbers accounting for max might, fury, hitting for max weapon damage, all 11 boons for max elder focus, bloodlust and force sigil, no food/oils buffs though so could go up by a few hundred.

Hammer bolt with CR
3556*1111*0.95/3000 = 1251.1
1251.1*2.3 = 2877.4
multipliers
2877.4*1.07*1.07*1.2*1.05*1.24*1.5 = 7721
With max vuln = 9651

CoR final hit with CR
3556*1111*2.25/3000 = 2963
2963*2.3 = 6815
multipliers
6815*1.07*1.07*1.2*1.05*1.24*1.5 = 18286
Vuln is a 1.25 modifier so would make it 22857

Hammer bolt without CR
5147
With max vuln
6434

CoR final hit without CR
12191
With max vuln
15238

What this shows is CoR really should have a higher CD or lower coefficient (or get a rework considering a hill can nullify it) and that cruel repercussions is absolutely insane for boosting damage and really should be a different trait that doesn’t boost damage, revs really don’t need it ontop of high coefficients.

With that sort of math, it makes it seem that ANet delibrately did this to CoR to make it near a one shot killer. Got a feeling that the balance they claim would be coming in January will resultin this changing drastically due to people running it for only the CoR.

That’ s why i didn t buy hot.
I don’ t want to spend my money untill there is a real balance. Hope it comes soon.