Guild Wars 2

First this will be opinion on seasoned 3 year wvw player and comander.I am not speaking for my guild or server.I have spoken with a lot of people from our community my guild what ever but I will never claim I speak for them.
So basicly Anet your main issue is you don’t understand your wvw game mode and the last 3 years you are simply killing it.

The main issues start from the point system and the pvd it promote,with the mindless karma trains you make useful on the maps and with the seasons you promoted with the pve achievements in them.Basicly you killed your top wvw communities several times in NA and Eu with this bulkitten. Not to mention how you never rewarded properly wvw players but it is like minor issue we just like to fight and we do it for fun anyway.

Right now wvw has several basic issues :
1- new maps honestly vertical maps and confusing narrow ways? Really you bring maguma/eotm style bulkitten to the wvw.WE love to fight no fun to fight when you have to seek the enemy for ages and in 30 mins you fight like 2 times only. This issue is simple to fix return the old maps remodel them based on EB map and we will be happy.

2. – For god sake remove auto upgrades,you remove tactical and strategy decision making you just promote sieing and stay inside with this. Why would people want to fight if they get upgrades without doing nothing just protecting narrow points with 10000 Ac and balistas and trebs. This kill the fun. No last minute saves,desperate run for supplies closing the gate or wall to gain this precious seconds for the TP to open and your people to come or your allies to run in helping you.Now defender just need to build thousands of siege and stay under them and that is.

3- remove this pve event in the middle really wtf? it lags the whole map,the meta destroys doors which is useless they can be repaired in like seconds with the masteries.

4. – Get people in your developers or at least consult actual players/guilds in the top guilds and tiers same as you do in pve and spvp. Honestly the curtain of information you impose on wvw is like crazy and nothing happens and then you bring that guy on your stream that laugh like crazy killing a npc veteran on wvw really?and it was with zerker warrior!?! You cant balanced all the specs the profession but at least give us something playable and we will adapt to changes with each patch you drop on us.

5. – And for the love of god look back to gw2 and how you handled pvp there,remove or atleast try to remove some of the grind you expose on us right now.For example some of the new runes. Let say I or my guild or my community decides to use rune of leadership for our guardians or whatever.. 1 rune is 100 crystalline ingots for full set this is like 600 crystalline wtf.On DS run you get like 20-30 with luck and this is if you succeed the meta,so you want of us to dedicate like 60-100 hours just to farm 6 runes and they are so just depending on meta.Not to mention all the other receipts for commander/wanderer sets and weapons we have to buy and they cost like 50 ingots each.And they have like exotic/asc versions…and not to mention the grind to get your guild upgrades so you can claim and ect….

I can point several more problems but these are the main right now.And it is pity with no other mmorpg right now in the next year or so you can kill it make us happy but you destroy your community alone…

Aliendreamer player/commander from Seaferer’s rest Eu out.

I think what you’re asking for is large-scale, team-based PvP. It’d be great if that need was met, but that is not what they are trying to accomplish with WvW. Perhaps that’s why you’ve been perennially dissatisfied?

Sviel.7493:

I think what you’re asking for is large-scale, team-based PvP. It’d be great if that need was met, but that is not what they are trying to accomplish with WvW. Perhaps that’s why you’ve been perennially dissatisfied?

There in lies the problem. What most people ACTUALLY play for…and what ANET…. THINKS they play for….are very different. Because of this….they royally screw everything up.

I don’t know if we can talk about how big of a chunk wants what, but I do know that the solution to this problem isn’t to change WvW to accommodate these demands. Even in the old state, it was very imperfect for large-team PvP. It would make more sense to increase the size of the guild hall arena and let that fill the need. If that causes a huge drop-off in WvW players, that’s too bad, but at least the remaining crowd will have more focused wants and, therefore, be easier to please.

Sviel.7493:

It would make more sense to increase the size of the guild hall arena and let that fill the need. If that causes a huge drop-off in WvW players, that’s too bad, but at least the remaining crowd will have more focused wants and, therefore, be easier to please.

So… cut small guilds and loners completely out of the picture?

Just dig out old backups of the maps all the way back to quaggan lake and revert to that state. It’ll be significantly better than what we have now.

Then don’t touch WvW anymore and just let it die it’s slow inevitable death: because you obviously don’t have even the slightest clue how the game mode is being played and what people enjoy about it, so all you’re going to do is make it worse.

Swift.1930:

Sviel.7493:

It would make more sense to increase the size of the guild hall arena and let that fill the need. If that causes a huge drop-off in WvW players, that’s too bad, but at least the remaining crowd will have more focused wants and, therefore, be easier to please.

So… cut small guilds and loners completely out of the picture?

I don’t think small guilds and loners were all that interesting in large-scale team-based pvp anyway?

Also, getting the arena set up is one of the cheaper parts of the guild hall assuming you’re not trying to fill it with gimmicks.

I agree. WvW has never been perfect, but it was a lot of fun. Instead of listening to the players and make changes for the better Anet killed WvW. Although 80% of negative comments on the changes (yes someone did vote counting), there is no reaction from Anet. I played WvW every day for 3 years. Now, I do not play at all. It is sad.

To be honest, it seems more like people played for 15 minutes then spent hours upon hours complaining. Most are saying the same things like ‘too much pve’ or ‘too big’ or ‘too hard to find enemies’ without substantiating their claims. It’s a very whiny echo chamber—it’s hard for me to take it seriously so I can’t imagine Anet is all that worried.

Sviel.7493:

To be honest, it seems more like people played for 15 minutes then spent hours upon hours complaining. Most are saying the same things like ‘too much pve’ or ‘too big’ or ‘too hard to find enemies’ without substantiating their claims. It’s a very whiny echo chamber—it’s hard for me to take it seriously so I can’t imagine Anet is all that worried.

Bubi.5237:

I did.
We had guildraids there. Enemy had 3-4 guilds there. We had Q on the map. Enemy probably did, too. We were attacking keeps. We were defending keeps.
As of now, it’s not so fun as old BLs.

The WP-system makes defending not important, the Upgrade/Dolly-system makes draining supply a lot harder/more time consuming.
The “complex terrain” makes fights more static as a lot of groups are just waiting for the other one to push into your choke instead of you pushing into their choke.
The “complex keeps” makes scouting alone almost impossible, you just can’t check every gate/cataspot/trebspot before a blob can take down a paper gate/wall if it’s not trebs.
Cannons/Oils are still unusable deathtraps against competent enemies, a lot of mortars are… dunno, not so usable as on old BLs (There you could use a lot of mortars to defend keeps, even if S defended N gate. Now I just can’t find a lot of use for mortars, only as “free” counter-trebs.)
“Fun to fight bosses” and “mechanics” (like wind turrets) makes fights more annoying than tactical, you simply can’t see f.e. the wind turrets inside a particle-boom GW2 have during combat.

It just feels like (and my guild agreed) a HoT pve-map which was dropped mid-development and was made into a wvw map.
And the enormous secret-quaggan-kitten room just salt into my wound, as it clearly was made with a lot of love, it’s awesome. Too bad I can’t say the same for the rest of the borderland from a WvW viewpoint.

If you have to eat horsekitten, you will know it’s not delicious after the first bite, you don’t have to eat half of it to say it’s bad…
But millions (of flies) are loving it, so it must be good!

Sviel.7493:

I don’t know if we can talk about how big of a chunk wants what, but I do know that the solution to this problem isn’t to change WvW to accommodate these demands. Even in the old state, it was very imperfect for large-team PvP. It would make more sense to increase the size of the guild hall arena and let that fill the need. If that causes a huge drop-off in WvW players, that’s too bad, but at least the remaining crowd will have more focused wants and, therefore, be easier to please.

It’s called WvW, not GvG. TYVM

@Bubi

Am I right to assume that you mean that defending isn’t important because WPs come at tier 1? If so, I contend that you don’t value reinforced/fortified walls as much as you should. Also, having an objective flipped means losing any siege that’s inside of it. Even if you manage to retake it quickly, it’s still a big set-back. In addition, it will likely be drained of supply if it’s switching hands.

The upgrade system does make draining supply harder in some ways because you can’t expect upgrades to run it dry. On the other hand, Yaks aren’t always out in the open so you can assassinate them more easily now—enemies won’t see you coming a mile off. That said, if you deal significant damage to a structure, it will still run out of supply very quickly. Thus, I don’t think this is a negative change.

I can’t say anything about fights on your server, but on mine people are wise enough to re-position if they’re faced with a choke. There’s always another path to take to the objective or a way to get behind an enemy. If you can’t force through them, keep moving until you have more favorable conditions. Once you actually get close to an objective the chokes tend to disappear anyway.

If the enemy has siege built on your gate before you see them, you’ve already been outwitted. A good scout will keep sentries flipped for early warning and can check a perimeter in a minute or less. If an enemy wants to take my keep, they usually have to run through cannon fire to get to the gate.

Cannons/Oil do suffer from the inverted wall problem. That is, it is safer to be at the bottom of a wall than at the top. A shield generator can mitigate this pretty well, though. I run a pretty defensive build in order to be able to stay on a Cannon/Oil long enough to do something—it’s effective enough that no one breaks my gates without killing the siege first. Still, I think you’re right in saying that more needs to be done to make built-in siege usable.

Mortars do seem a bit oddly placed. I’ve been able to figure out how to use all that I’ve actually sat on, though.

With the exception of Parched Outpost (merciless, boring stunlock), I really like the new lords. You can’t just blob them and win with no problems. In firekeep you have to make sure you can survive a knockback/fear. In airkeep you have to avoid fighting the boss in the center of his platform. This also means that if you’re defending with a smaller force, you have an obvious weak point to exploit. Just like the walls/gates, killing the lord now requires an actual strategy beyond overwhelming force.

But, if you don’t like it, oh well. Some of your complaints are things I agree with, some not…

Sviel.7493:

@Bubi

Am I right to assume that you mean that defending isn’t important because WPs come at tier 1? If so, I contend that you don’t value reinforced/fortified walls as much as you should. Also, having an objective flipped means losing any siege that’s inside of it. Even if you manage to retake it quickly, it’s still a big set-back. In addition, it will likely be drained of supply if it’s switching hands.

The upgrade system does make draining supply harder in some ways because you can’t expect upgrades to run it dry. On the other hand, Yaks aren’t always out in the open so you can assassinate them more easily now—enemies won’t see you coming a mile off. That said, if you deal significant damage to a structure, it will still run out of supply very quickly. Thus, I don’t think this is a negative change.

I can’t say anything about fights on your server, but on mine people are wise enough to re-position if they’re faced with a choke. There’s always another path to take to the objective or a way to get behind an enemy. If you can’t force through them, keep moving until you have more favorable conditions. Once you actually get close to an objective the chokes tend to disappear anyway.

If the enemy has siege built on your gate before you see them, you’ve already been outwitted. A good scout will keep sentries flipped for early warning and can check a perimeter in a minute or less. If an enemy wants to take my keep, they usually have to run through cannon fire to get to the gate.

Cannons/Oil do suffer from the inverted wall problem. That is, it is safer to be at the bottom of a wall than at the top. A shield generator can mitigate this pretty well, though. I run a pretty defensive build in order to be able to stay on a Cannon/Oil long enough to do something—it’s effective enough that no one breaks my gates without killing the siege first. Still, I think you’re right in saying that more needs to be done to make built-in siege usable.

Mortars do seem a bit oddly placed. I’ve been able to figure out how to use all that I’ve actually sat on, though.

With the exception of Parched Outpost (merciless, boring stunlock), I really like the new lords. You can’t just blob them and win with no problems. In firekeep you have to make sure you can survive a knockback/fear. In airkeep you have to avoid fighting the boss in the center of his platform. This also means that if you’re defending with a smaller force, you have an obvious weak point to exploit. Just like the walls/gates, killing the lord now requires an actual strategy beyond overwhelming force.

But, if you don’t like it, oh well. Some of your complaints are things I agree with, some not…

I like offensive-upgrading, too. I like to get enemy garrison and try to get it to wp/t3 and then farm them inside as they’ll try to take it back. The only objective you can be sure to attract enemy blobs to fight. Now I have no motivation for it as no WP even if I defend it for 4 hours.

WP at t0 makes my motivation to defend/upgrade offensive-bl hills/bay close to zero. On old BL, I could babysit it for half a day, trying to get WP in it for prime time, so our guildraids can defend it as enemy blobs will try to flip it, as it has WP. Now no point flipping it as wp will remain, no point upgrading as you’ll have WP for primetime if you just blob it down 1min before guildraid starting.
Yes, T2-3 is nice to have, but as it’s automatic, I just hate it. I want to choose what to upgrade, I want to start it when it’s the time for it. I don’t want to see a War-simulation playing itself. I liked the feeling of success when you upgraded it to t3, now it’s just boring.
Dollies were easily killed before, now it’s hard only if someone defends it… It’s rare, reaaaaaaly rare that someone defends it when no guild mission…

The problem is not that we can’t take another route to the objective. The problem is that we want to fight them! We don’t want to play a boring wait-and-wait game with them to see who’ll push into the others choke first. And 99% of the time they’ll not push, they’ll wait and be happy that we didn’t take their precious objective… boorrriiinnnnggggggg.

When you scout enemy garrison, you can’t really have every Sentry on your side and not flipped by 3 guys in minutes when you got it… You’ll not see the enemy closing on your keep. And even on hills/bay, most ppl are clever enough to avoid sentries anyway, or just send 1-2 guy to kill all of them before the zerg goes there… I mean if they really want to cap the keep and not just bait out enemies to fight.

Dunno about Shield Generator, I can’t use it, so dunno. (Even if someone built one, ppl without HoT can’t interact with it.) Tho if you’re alone, it’s a lil’ bit hard to use SG and then cannon/oil

I don’t have much problem with the lords. They’re boring pve-npcs, but whatever, I just semi-afk while 111 them. We’re killing the lord after we wiped the enemy anyway.
What I care about is the additional mechanisms in the keep/lordroom. I freakin’ hate the wind turrets, in a blobfight you can’t even see them activating… It would be a bit better if they made those orange-triangles on the ground so you can see them activating, but this way… The lava is just another cliff, fall down into it and you’ll be dead… As if we didn’t have enough cliffs already…

It’s an over-engineered wvw map or a good pve map, that’s my problem. We’re even playing against a server which cares about PPT, so they’re defending/scouting, but it’s still not fun to play on. I’m not playing on EBG, never liked it… So I’m just playing less wvw/gw2 now.