Guild Wars 2

Hi guys,

Here is the footage of the Scourge zerg we made on Jade Sea during PoF last demo.
Scourge needs to be change or else, it’ll completly destroy the WvW mechanics.
A lot of strong barriers for a lot of people, a lot of cleansing, a lot of strong conditions, a lot of debuff make this class too strong. It litteraly doesn’t need Guardians, or any other class in order to survive by itself.

Here is the link : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6HwjGaRHPg

To explain a little bit more, we were 40 scourges (and probably 25 at the end of the event) We won every fights, we stayed inside a T3 Garrison under sieges, 4 AC, and probably around 20 people trying to kill us on the walls, we didn’t die. We manage to put barrier on golems (which is kind of a joke cause we reached around130k barrier on them (around half of its HP) and we made the last golem survive for 45min with only 5% health inside garrison (and even managed to get out of garrison without loosing it, everything under the exact same amount of ACs, cause they were really good at defending).

With a scourge zerg, you basically take no damage, cause you always have self barrier, and barriers from friends. You can always have full barrier, and by playing a Trailblazer Scourge you have a lot of HP, so you have a strong barrier (around 14k) all the time.

Don’t kill the scourge please, I think it’s a great class that will really change the actual metagame, which is great imo. But do not let it as it is right now.

Credits go to Deter on Jade Sea for the video.
Probably gonna share that on Reddit so devs might see that and be aware of the problem. (Cause yep, it’s a problem)

See ya !

My head explode. Jade sea manage win a fight, but enemy is desolation. I don’t know what to think!!!

How rude ! Jade Sea is not the best server, but it’s not the question, I’m heartbroken.
Can we talk about the scourge now ? :p

i mean.. u r fight a bunch of other players who are testing new specs…

yes i believe scourge is by far the best pof spec for wvw… and i think it will kill base necro and reaper because it does more dmg than both plus brings a lot of utility. but this is a problem with necro/reaper itself… that the only viable way to play it is to run condi shouts with reaper runes and abuse th very balance trait that is deathly chills.
either way, i do not believe scourge is op, but we will have to wait and see when pof arrives.

also u have no stability and no condi removal with that scourge zerg..
any decent fighting group would just cc you and bomb you while u cant even cast ur barriers.

Arrow carts don’t kill anyone but full glass with no heals anyway. Even now, zergs show up and just stand under them taking basically no damage. How is this “revelation” of yours any different?

Also, it’s not continuous video. Editing can do amazing things. This video has been edited in an attempt to make scourge look strong, all of the deaths/enemy pushes have been removed.

Your group has no stability. A good group will push right through and wipe you. The barrier is nice, but even attempting to abuse a single mechanic, turns the raid in to a one trick pony that can be countered easily by the current meta/good groups.

In all fairness, get 40 condi reapers together and the same thing will happen. 40 burn DH and similar will happen. 40 condi thieves and similar will happen. (in all reality, 40 any 1 class will drop anything)

Vova.2640:

also u have no stability and no condi removal with that scourge zerg..
any decent fighting group would just cc you and bomb you while u cant even cast ur barriers.

They’ll just have to start using Well of power.

no condi removal with that scourge zerg..
cant even cast ur barriers.

a) they can trait to remove condi on barrier as well as clear/convert 2 conditions every 4~5s for them and 5~20 people. b) The two best barrier skills are instant.

In which scenario being able to litteraly one shot every zerg / staying alive by pressing 5 buttons with 20 people pewpewing + 4 ac on you while taking 0 damage, and being able to have perma barrier is a normal thing for you ?

In which scenario being able to play with only scourge cause kitten stab, kitten condi clean, kitten anything encourage people to play other classes ?

Scourge doesn’t have to be a substitute to every other classes.

I love scourge, but if you’re a real wvw player, you’re not supposed to be able to stand against 20 people + 4 ac in a keep, since ac are really really really strong (hit 50 people, scourge has light armor, things like that)

Plus we stand in a mortar aoe, and we didn’t even have the time to get burned, since the burning was instantly remove.

Is it really what you want in wvw guys ? a zerg full of scourge spamming F1 F2 F3 F5 and the healing skill ? (cause it’s litteraly what we’ve done for 2hours, and some of us managed to play without weapons, and OFC it worked)

Stop being too protective cause you play necro, idk…

Id like to see 20 guards vs 20 scourge or 20 druids vs 20 scourge or etc… you get the idea. Until then lets wait to see what happens on live. Once you know how to fight a scourge they are super squishy, very easy to kill, people will figure it out within a couple of months and then all the scourge will be crying for buffs.

If you really want to continue this conversation, upload the full video unedited, without gaps in the video.

People are not very openminded, that’s sad. How can I put words on that :

Many scourges, invulnerables, barrier, lot lot lot.
Condition, none, cleansing, lot. Ennemies, die, no stab, debuff, lot
Cripple, torment, burning, lot lot lot.
Can’t run, dying. Can’t clean, much condi. Wow
Cooldown F1,lol. Targets 10.

Do you guys understand ? Or is it still too hard ?

And don’t even try to talk about a 20v20 against guards or whatever.
It’s not about little pvp where you can just counter a single scourge, it’s about large scale battles, it’s totally different since you can counter one scourge, but you can’t avoid 20 F1 which are 300 radius and 900 range, which can be spam 3 times in a row if you try to move, with a little 10 sec cooldown, you’ll have perma cripple, with no stab, you’ll die from 25 stacks of torments and the same amount of burning (cause traits), without having the time to pierce a 14k+ barrier which is growing every second because of other scourges.

I don’t know, but you might be true, we’ll wait the release and wait until Anet devs nerf it by themselves.

https://i.gyazo.com/149101d6b0c8113ddd51c2ba18115ae4.png

When you see that what you can do it’s not cheated ? Open your eyes guys REALLY !

When last time you see Turtle worked in WvW zerg ? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVgxqj_-ihU&feature=youtu.be
Just look and say me it’s not cheated XD

Anet killed guardian turtle very fast, and was not that efective compared with the scourge turtling….

But somehow i feel ANet will accept scourrge turtling…

(but my opnion is completelly biased on lack of trust on ANet dev’s)

Sand Swell was disabled during the PoF stress test this afternoon…wonder if that means changes are incoming for that skill?

You guys are playing on eu, so ofc players are going to die fast.

Scourge is over tuned.

Personally, I think everyone is over hyping barriers just a little bit.

To me, the real issue with Scourge is that desert shroud makes it so that walking next to players will corrupt their boons.

And boons don’t get corrupted like they usually do. No no.

Every boon corrupted by that will be changed to a damaging condition.

To me, Scourges are an exemplary example of the problems facing WvW.

Too much stability spam, too much boon corruption.

These 2 things are constantly pulling on each other, creeping in power, and the devs are just ramping it up even further.

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

In all fairness, get 40 condi reapers together and the same thing will happen. 40 burn DH and similar will happen. 40 condi thieves and similar will happen. (in all reality, 40 any 1 class will drop anything)

I kinda want to see Ali Baba & the 40 condi thieves XD

Its impossible to tell the effect of that.

A long time ago we ran an engineer raid and destroyed the enemy 50+ man zerg multiple times just by dumping supply drop in one place. It was hilarious to see. Everyone laughed so hard. One second they where alive and steaming toward us, the next rooted and dead in a 5 fps sea of turrets.

So the conclusion is vanilla engineer is OP in WvW and need to be nerfed to the ground?

No.

It just shows people have no kittening idea how to fight new things. After a couple of hours they knew what was up and had turned the tables, winning every fight instead. I have no doubt the new elites need to be nerfed some way or another but how about we wait for release?

Scourge is pretty strong and definitely a part of any group comp, I’m just not entirely sure that it’s all that much better then current deathly chill reaper since if you want to go full damage on scourge you have to take dhummfire and sand savant or demonic lore, and if you do that you have 0 stability whereas deathly chill reaper even with dhummfire manages to have stab natively in its kit making it much safer for zergs.

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

To me, the real issue with Scourge is that desert shroud makes it so that walking next to players will corrupt their boons.

And boons don’t get corrupted like they usually do. No no.

Every boon corrupted by that will be changed to a damaging condition.

Desert shroud skill F5 does not corrupt boons.

alright, i’m going to lean on this topic a bit.

you think scourge is “OP” with 50 in a squad and fighting groups with no composition, no skilled(or experienced fightmander) leadership, or tactics? you honestly think the devs are going to fall for this kitten?

Listen up care-bears; Scourge was developed with team strategy in mind. WvW is an attrition based environment. meaning when one side runs out of resources they are going to die. Scourge fits that perfectly. if you have no way to keep up LF generation, you’re a lame mentally handicap broken legged duck. if a halfway decent squad pushed into you, you would die. that second video posted shows that perfectly. they got kitteny and paid the price on south fire keep.

here’s a tip for anyone wanting to counter scourge, do what you do vs reapers, peck at it from long range until it runs out of resources(attrition) and then finish it off… not that kittening hard.

I seriously hope you guys get some training. go watch a fight video. do something to contribute to the betterment of quality in wvw fights. if i see another burn guard im going to flip a table.

i’m out of insults/helpful advice.

seriously go get good

thanks

Mac.7249:

Listen up care-bears…

I hate to break it to you, but you are a “carebear”, if you weren’t you’d playing EVE Online or something, rather then the most “carebear” MMORPG out there and talking about WvW which as a PvP mode is about as skilled, hardcore and “PvP” as My Little Pony, still thanks for the laugh.

As for the OP, the devs don’t need to see anything, whether scourge is broken OP or not doesn’t really matter, as you seem to have missed it, there is no class balance in WvW and never has been, because they virtually ignore WvW when it comes to balance, it is unlikely that is going to change 5 years into the game.

The devs would have rigorously tested the elite specs well before the trial weekend.

They know scourge (and pretty much all of the new elites in one way or other) are op. They have designed it like this. It was exactly the same for HoT as well. We might get balances once anet meets quota, but until then threads like this are pointless from the player’s perspective.

Just accept that for the sake of money, everything behind a paywall will be stronger than anything you can get for free. It’s crap, but it also means GW2 will exist for a few more years. GW2 is pretty tame compared to other games though when it comes to selling expansions through powercreep.

TL;DR. Dev’s know scourge is op, because they made it op.

Imagine a full squad of a guild called Deadeye Muggers [MUG], filled with just deadeyes who all target spike same enemy one by one. Death’s Mark being 1500 range with all the Steal traits including Mug. It refreshes cool down on kill so they can just F1 over and over again with coordination. Not even need to use rifle skills.

It is so funny to see Jade Sea complaining when winning fights considering how often you’d see that.
oh wait it is against Desolation…yeah figures.

It is fun watching a whole blob ganking one person
It is fun watching an organized group fighting one that isnt
It is fun watching you spam staff marks and barely anything else
Lets press all the skilllzzz and Zzz Zzz see what happens
like what are you doing? what is it that you are “fighting”? what you are doing in this vid can be done better by any other competent group.

Lets see a ragdoll Scourge running in headstrong with a no mobility spec, no stunbreaks, no stability, shroud bar is always healthy and not stressed or needing to fill the bar considering that Scourge has very weak life force generation. mhm yea…you basically steamrolled the enemy in clips you selected and edited all of them together for a glorious Montage. we dont see that often do we?
color me impressed….not.

what? You are basically a naked ragdoll walking around with 40 other ragdoll copies. You did not get pulled, corrupted, CC’ed, stressed for cooldowns, starved for lifeforce. condition’ed for life or seriously damaged even in your montage. the enemy was clearly competent, organized and a perfect candidate to base your conclusions on. how about a real sample hm? one with a bit more competition and a better realistic composition. 40 of anything is OP in one area or others.

basically your footage is not proving much

However, Barrier should not be allowed to work on siege pieces like golems like that. the only thing you were able to show case. good job, reward yourselves with a pat on the back for much effort.

Sigmoid.7082:

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

To me, the real issue with Scourge is that desert shroud makes it so that walking next to players will corrupt their boons.

And boons don’t get corrupted like they usually do. No no.

Every boon corrupted by that will be changed to a damaging condition.

Desert shroud skill F5 does not corrupt boons.

Oh, you’re right.

My bad, it was trail of anguish that did that.

Oslaf Beinir.5842:

However, Barrier should not be allowed to work on siege pieces like golems like that. the only thing you were able to show case. good job, reward yourselves with a pat on the back for much effort.

Thanks buddy, I appreciate your blindness.

So now, when it comes to the video and actual footage, you can look @ 4:10, you’ll see a 50+ zerg of desolation. Yeah you’re right, all those red names are not actually pve monsters, it’s real players. Remember, we have no guard (no stab), no revenant, no healer, no boonshare or whatever.

Let me explain so your little mass of flesh that serves you as “brain” can understand what happened :

Deso gathered, tried to empower/ We didn’t cause we always were at 25 stacks of power. (no need guards lel)
Deso tried to move, we were already in front of them (cause no empower, yolo)
We had little cc on us, but since the cc got nerfed, not everyone was stunned, so the barrier was still up. (no need stab, it’s too 2012)
All the conditions are instantly removed (no need stab, clean or power, then guardians / revenants / mesmers are pretty much useless isn’t it ?)
They tried to split in every direction, half of their zerg already died cause conditions (it’s about perma 10 torments 10 burning on every single person), and even in all the aoe, noone took damages. (14k barrier mate… Wait, no damage means no need healer, bye tempest auramancer <3)
The second half manage to go to our “backline”, we followed them, and they died.
We cleaned the lasts and boom, that’s done. (Crazy damage awesome cleansing and perfect debuffs, does it means… yes ! We don’t need any other classes in WvW, that’s sweet)

Let me correct what someone said earlier as well :

Not a single class can survive like that without the help of other classes.
And don’t get me wrong, it’s not about how well you can survive, it’s HOW LONG you can survive. By having access to perma barrier, scourge is definitly on top of everything else.

Now if you excuse me, I’m not looking for necros trying to defend their new elite spec, but for real gw2 players who care about balance (which is, for exemple, a task which comes with the first test of a new class / new spec)

Cause it’s not only about wvw, it’s also a problem you’ll find in pvp, and in pve (but the bosses won’t complain, thankfully, no moar conpleining plz, thoz guyz want to kil da scurge QQ its a konspiraci:(:( (yes i’m totally making fun of you guys, sorry <3))

An all Scourge zerg is easy to kill. Plink at it from range (Scourges can’t do anything notable outside of 900 range) and run them out of life force, then dive in for the kill. Their damage and defense is super tied to life force, so it should be a pretty easy sweep.

unfortunately devs still don´t give a kitten on wvw they´re fixing pve and gemstore stuff that´s it

primatos.5413:

unfortunately devs still don´t give a kitten on wvw they´re fixing pve and gemstore stuff that´s it

they actually dont care much… classes are mostly designed for pve only, what result on wvw is on automode and if carries the players the better, more noobage will play the gimmicks and stay playing the game…

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

An all Scourge zerg is easy to kill. Plink at it from range (Scourges can’t do anything notable outside of 900 range) and run them out of life force, then dive in for the kill. Their damage and defense is super tied to life force, so it should be a pretty easy sweep.

Well, I never had problem with life force, cause staff marks unblockable and spam 1, F1 doesn’t require a lot of life force, so basically spamming 1 one or 2 times on the ennemy zerg results in me have 20% life force, plenty of…

Wanna cross a scourge zerg ? well have fun, they’ll all put F1 under their feets, will have 14k barrier stack 25 might, you won’t be able to do damage, nor applying conditions, you’ll lose stab instantly and melt cause conditions, but nice try
Does anyone want to play the game “imagine a way to defeat 40 scourges” ? Or will we be able to see how ridiculous it actually is before everyone is bored of this little game ?

Hana.8143:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

An all Scourge zerg is easy to kill. Plink at it from range (Scourges can’t do anything notable outside of 900 range) and run them out of life force, then dive in for the kill. Their damage and defense is super tied to life force, so it should be a pretty easy sweep.

Well, I never had problem with life force, cause staff marks unblockable and spam 1, F1 doesn’t require a lot of life force, so basically spamming 1 one or 2 times on the ennemy zerg results in me have 20% life force, plenty of…

Wanna cross a scourge zerg ? well have fun, they’ll all put F1 under their feets, will have 14k barrier stack 25 might, you won’t be able to do damage, nor applying conditions, you’ll lose stab instantly and melt cause conditions, but nice try
Does anyone want to play the game “imagine a way to defeat 40 scourges” ? Or will we be able to see how ridiculous it actually is before everyone is bored of this little game ?

Oh I know how to beat 40 scourges.

Surround them with catapults. No stab + constant knockback =’s no barrier stacking.

Now all we need is a mesmer with the ability to clone catapults….

If Scourge ship as is that will be the end of class out side of necor. I am not sure why Anet is letting this one dev. make such broken classes.

Scourge may brake wvw to the point of not being playable unless you are a scourge.

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Oh I know how to beat 40 scourges.

Surround them with catapults. No stab + constant knockback =’s no barrier stacking.

Now all we need is a mesmer with the ability to clone catapults….

That not comply true scourge has the ability to “steal” boons all be it a weaker version but in wvw it means perm boon effects. I would say scourge out of all the necro set up has the best stab up time due to its corruption boons effects getting a copy of the boon you corruption.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Feed_from_Corruption

If scoruge is not nerfed hard having boons in wvw will be more of a problems then nothing having them. Things like swiftness stab might and resicstese will cause more harm then good. I am not sure if you can even make groups with no boons at all outside of being nothing but scorges and tempest (super speed not a boon!) or other super speed classes.

There is no disavaged to playing as a scourge barror is better then death shord because you can heal your self during it if you need to and you can use all of your DS skills with out putting it up. Scourge is pure power creep of the necro class.

Necros/reapers kill people with boons now…it just changes how it’s done.
I see guards, eles and warriors all the time running around fighting 1vs4, 1vs5 and winning. Not really because amazing skill, but because they can perma-boon and the classes they fight don’t/can’t remove them. I jump in on reaper, they near-insta down and get spiked.

I get that the OP is mad that ele isn’t the best at everything anymore, but scourge really isn’t as broken as they are trying to make out (for the record, I don’t like it and won’t be switching from reaper).

Where is the OP’s uproar at the video showing a thief hitting another player for over 100k damage?

Ubi.4136:

Necros/reapers kill people with boons now…it just changes how it’s done.
I see guards, eles and warriors all the time running around fighting 1vs4, 1vs5 and winning. Not really because amazing skill, but because they can perma-boon and the classes they fight don’t/can’t remove them. I jump in on reaper, they near-insta down and get spiked.

I get that the OP is mad that ele isn’t the best at everything anymore, but scourge really isn’t as broken as they are trying to make out (for the record, I don’t like it and won’t be switching from reaper).

Where is the OP’s uproar at the video showing a thief hitting another player for over 100k damage?

There was an uproar when they added in war doing more dmg when ppl have boons +2% per boon. Boons are not made to be disadvages like this. At this point having a condi on you is better then having a boon on you with the effects of scourge. Its realty THAT bad.

I’m not talking about people getting upset over past changes.
If the OP is so worried about balance with PoF, why is this thread ONLY about scourge? There is a video of a deadeye hitting another player (not NPC) for over 100k damage. There are multiple videos showing a deadeye hitting for 30k-45k damage against other players. Most players have 20k health.

Where is the uproar?

I would argue that boonsharing/boon uptime is as broken as scourge might be given certain circumstances. (which may be why they created it)

Jski.6180:

If Scourge ship as is that will be the end of class out side of necor. I am not sure why Anet is letting this one dev. make such broken classes.

Scourge may brake wvw to the point of not being playable unless you are a scourge.

A message from the Skills and Balance Team:
There have been a number of changes and bug fixes to some of the specializations since the first time you were able to play them during the WvW/PvP Preview Weekend. However, we still are vetting and testing many of the changes, and as a result the stress test today will have the same versions that were featured during the preview weekend. You’ll be able to see the updated elite specialization changes on September 22nd!
See you in Tyria!

Ubi.4136:

Necros/reapers kill people with boons now…it just changes how it’s done.
I see guards, eles and warriors all the time running around fighting 1vs4, 1vs5 and winning. Not really because amazing skill, but because they can perma-boon and the classes they fight don’t/can’t remove them. I jump in on reaper, they near-insta down and get spiked.

I get that the OP is mad that ele isn’t the best at everything anymore, but scourge really isn’t as broken as they are trying to make out (for the record, I don’t like it and won’t be switching from reaper).

Where is the OP’s uproar at the video showing a thief hitting another player for over 100k damage?

100k damage (and I know it’s true) is something that will not stay untouched cause Anet can’t let a guy one shot litteraly everything. It’s like the mesmer in 2013 (or 2014 ?), when he had that trait, and took fall damages, and did 20k every sec with the aoe that pop under its feet.

In gw2, you can 1v3 1v4, but if you face people who are not new at fighting other people, you definitly won’t be able to stand long, it’s even more true when it comes with condi necro.

I’m mad at the ele, but it’s not an ele thread. So why bothering talking about this class ?

If you don’t see the scourge as a strong class, it’s cause you haven’t face a zerg full of scourges, but I don’t mind, I know, at some point, a lot of people will complain about having uneffective skills against scourges (qq i dont do damage, qq i cant kill scourges, qq i cant use my skills cause i die too fast), I know the metagame will change and use more and more scourges cause it really works, and I know at some points, the devs will change it, here again, I’m not doing that so you guys can be angry at me or whatever, I’m posting that so we can show our feedback to the devs so they won’t let it as it is right now so people won’t have to complain in the future.

Who am I to decide if it’s broken or need a nerf ? Well, that’s also why I’m doing this post, trying to convice (because we tried it) that the scourge is a threat to gw2 as it is right now. It’s feedback, from real experience, not cause i’m a scourge hater, I really love the scourge and it’s fun, that’s why I want the devs to nerf it, not to kill it, but I’m also realistic you see.

When it comes to an event like that, I know it happenedwith almost everything, mesmer zerg, ranger zerg, thing like that, but they’ll always need something else.

Like, guardians can rotate stab so they’ll never be cc, can clean everything, can heal a lot aswell, but they take damages, they’re not in god-mode like scourges. Also they can (rip staff) put range pressure nor they can debuff the enemy. Actually, the vanilla guard is just a mass of love and armor. But it lacks of things the revenant can do, the tempest healer can do, the necro/reaper can do, the mesmer can do.
And if the idea of playing an entire zerg full of something is not a thing atmn it’s cause it’s not that op, and has counter.

NOW let’s talk about the real thing :
What can counter a prema barrier ? Nothing
What can counter a 25seconds aoe that debuff every 5 sec (F2) with 300 radius ? Nothing
What can counter a perma condi clean ?
What can counter a perma 10stacks torment / 10 stacks burning / cripple ? condi clear ? yes, you got it, a full scourge zerg.

Wow mate, I can’t wait to see the next metagame. After the boring monoball… It’s gonna be full scourges vs full scourges, the one with one extra scourge win the battle, so good.

But the best thing is probably that you try that the next beta or at the release. Maybe you’ll come back with a new opinion, and stop trying to argue without arguments (cause all you guys say is “it’s not as strong as it looks like”)

Also I’m not qqing for other elite specs cause they’re not killing other classes, you see ?
100k deadeye is a bug, it’ll have power, but it’s something the devs wanted no ?
The problem with the scourge, it’s that giving everything to everyone, everytime, and removing everything from any opponent is not something they wanted to add. So…

You guys defending scourge are in total denial. I tried it and it was obvious to a toddler this class will ruin WvW.

There are many of you saying, yeah, but put it against 40 of this or that. Sure, that might work for a bit, but the scourge has barrier, boon corruption, healing, and massive damage output. No other class has this much survivablity/boon corruption/damage.
Other classes, might have 2, but not 3. That’s what makes it so OP. Just the massive boon corruption with almost every single skill makes this totally op. Basically, whoever attacks first wins.

I mean, hey, if you don’t want team work, build diversity, If you want to play one class and press a few buttons, then WvW will be for you if this doesn’t get changed.

DONT stand in the shades, take Scourge down easy from range and most of all STOP CRYING. When ppl actually learns the New Elites very few of them will be as strong as same ppl are crying about now, for instance do OP know that standing in the shade is actually more dmg then standing near the Scourge itself ? seriously doubt any non-Necro have even bothered at this point to learn howto fight it, they just go onto Forums and CRY cause for first time in 5y they cant ROLL OVER a Necro.

The dmg of Scourge is high – yes but the defence of Scourge is by far the weakest of any Necro variant, use that instead. And Scourge lacks what ALL Necs do any real way to deal with range. If u wanna go hand to hand in Melee vs a Scourge, bait out the Shade/s and l2p instead of sounding like a wimpy kid.

Hana.8143:

It’s like the mesmer in 2013 (or 2014 ?), when he had that trait, and took fall damages, and did 20k every sec with the aoe that pop under its feet.

I’m sorry, what?

Chaos storm has never done 20k damage a second.

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Hana.8143:

It’s like the mesmer in 2013 (or 2014 ?), when he had that trait, and took fall damages, and did 20k every sec with the aoe that pop under its feet.

I’m sorry, what?

Chaos storm has never done 20k damage a second.

Why would you use an absolute if you don’t know?

Hackuuna.4085:

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Hana.8143:

It’s like the mesmer in 2013 (or 2014 ?), when he had that trait, and took fall damages, and did 20k every sec with the aoe that pop under its feet.

I’m sorry, what?

Chaos storm has never done 20k damage a second.

Why would you use an absolute if you don’t know?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBguZgFv8XA

Wow, how do they even screw that up.

And you’re right, I shouldn’t have said “never”.

Hana.8143:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

An all Scourge zerg is easy to kill. Plink at it from range (Scourges can’t do anything notable outside of 900 range) and run them out of life force, then dive in for the kill. Their damage and defense is super tied to life force, so it should be a pretty easy sweep.

Well, I never had problem with life force, cause staff marks unblockable and spam 1, F1 doesn’t require a lot of life force, so basically spamming 1 one or 2 times on the ennemy zerg results in me have 20% life force, plenty of…

Wanna cross a scourge zerg ? well have fun, they’ll all put F1 under their feets, will have 14k barrier stack 25 might, you won’t be able to do damage, nor applying conditions, you’ll lose stab instantly and melt cause conditions, but nice try
Does anyone want to play the game “imagine a way to defeat 40 scourges” ? Or will we be able to see how ridiculous it actually is before everyone is bored of this little game ?

If they’re stacking all that might and barrier, they’re blowing through their life force pretty fast. Let them. Then kill them when they’re out and the barrier runs out.

Staff marks only provide 3% life force no matter how many people they hit, so that’s really not a great way to rapidly build it up again, and staff does incredibly low damage. Staff auto works well in zergs, I agree. But it’s also a projectile. What zerg doesn’t run projectile reflects?

Considering Staff is their only option for above 900 range, I don’t see this as too bad. Long range pressure until they’re starved because nothing is dying, then charge in for a quick wipe.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Hana.8143:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

An all Scourge zerg is easy to kill. Plink at it from range (Scourges can’t do anything notable outside of 900 range) and run them out of life force, then dive in for the kill. Their damage and defense is super tied to life force, so it should be a pretty easy sweep.

Well, I never had problem with life force, cause staff marks unblockable and spam 1, F1 doesn’t require a lot of life force, so basically spamming 1 one or 2 times on the ennemy zerg results in me have 20% life force, plenty of…

Wanna cross a scourge zerg ? well have fun, they’ll all put F1 under their feets, will have 14k barrier stack 25 might, you won’t be able to do damage, nor applying conditions, you’ll lose stab instantly and melt cause conditions, but nice try
Does anyone want to play the game “imagine a way to defeat 40 scourges” ? Or will we be able to see how ridiculous it actually is before everyone is bored of this little game ?

If they’re stacking all that might and barrier, they’re blowing through their life force pretty fast. Let them. Then kill them when they’re out and the barrier runs out.

Staff marks only provide 3% life force no matter how many people they hit, so that’s really not a great way to rapidly build it up again, and staff does incredibly low damage. Staff auto works well in zergs, I agree. But it’s also a projectile. What zerg doesn’t run projectile reflects?

Considering Staff is their only option for above 900 range, I don’t see this as too bad. Long range pressure until they’re starved because nothing is dying, then charge in for a quick wipe.

Thing you don’t understand is : They don’t slack and spend all the life force like dumbs, they actually use skills so the life force never goes down to 0. Use a staff, take soul mark and you will never be @ 0life force. Even if it’s 3%. F1 is not expensive in terms of life force cost. The power stacks are not something you want to have before the combat, it’s just a little plus from skills. You’re @ 25 power instantly so why bothering stacking before the fight ? Just jump in and you’ll see it instantly.

And by waiting, you’ll just end up caught by a F1, or rather wasting your time being chased by scourges who don’t use any skills cause smart people are smart. We manage to stay 45min inside a T3 garrison by only hitting a door with staff 1, and spamming F1 F3 F5 and healing skill to max out the barrier. Without EVER being @ 0 life force. Also if you don’t get it now, i’ll tell you something, 2hours of raid, never ever had problem with life force.

Reflect is great, but in a large scale fight, you can’t reflet 100% of the projectiles. You’ll just end up giving life force, even if you don’t want to. And even 5 scourges with tiny little bit of life force can’t put 5 aoe, which means 10*5 people with 3k barrier. Just like that.

Also, when you tell me you want to pirate ship, scourge are not about pirateship, if you try to pewpew @1200, they’ll just rush towards you, and use the super nice little F1 that will cripple every single person, which mean you’ll have to think of something else if you want to run away, cause perma cripple mate. perma cripple no matter how many time you clean it.

Did I say the F1 is a 25sec duration aoe that hits 10 people ? Probably not.
10 allies, 10 enemies. 10sec cd, 25sec duration. Sounds legit to me… or not ?

You can’t win a pirateship war cause scourge are just going to cross your bus like it was nothing (NO DAMAGE LOL) and people will start to die.

Oh yes, God forbid the necromancer will actually be competent for a change

Don’t get me wrong, it’s an amazing class, i’m not asking anet to remove barrier or whatever. They need to think about the number of targets, cause, by giving them 10 targets on a 25sec duration aoe, it’s just too strong, 3 targets with a 5sec aoe is still broken when you see how strong it is. There is even more to change, but the mechanic is by far the best of the new specs.

Lahmia.2193:

A message from the Skills and Balance Team:
There have been a number of changes and bug fixes to some of the specializations since the first time you were able to play them during the WvW/PvP Preview Weekend. However, we still are vetting and testing many of the changes, and as a result the stress test today will have the same versions that were featured during the preview weekend. You’ll be able to see the updated elite specialization changes on September 22nd!
See you in Tyria!

So, this conversation is kind of pointless.

But, 40 deadeyes vs 40 scourges (with no changes to either) who wins?
With equal skill, it’s not gonna be the scourges.

Are the Scourges putting out 3k Barriers? Then they’re pure Healing Power. They’re not killing you.

See, there’s this thing called “Power damage.” You might have heard of it? Dragonhunters, Deadeyes, Revenants, Rangers, and Eles are very competent at dishing it out at 1200 range or more. At 1200 range, you know how much damage Scourges can deal? A few hundred DPS. Maybe 1k. If nobody is dying, their life force drains when they try to keep themselves alive. You’re not focused on conditions, so their condition flips and transfers are pretty worthless.

You know what all of those listed classes also have? Mobility greater than Scourges. You control the combat against an all-Scourge zerg. They have the portal, but it’s nowhere near enough to let them control the combat location.

Yes, you go Pirate Ship against an all-Scourge zerg. If you do, you basically auto-win.