Guild Wars 2

Hi WvWers,

Today in EotM I finished my reward track, and almost simultaneously got the 250 badges I wanted for a discount on an ascended amulet. This has left me in in a reflective mood. I wonder should I go back and do it again? Should I try proper WvW? And it left me wondering what Anet should do to make WvW more attractive to PvEers.

So, a few thoughts:

Don’t try to force us. If you do, we will teach you the meaning of “beware of unintended consequences” by e.g. mostly-afking and repairing a wall every few minutes while we watch sitcoms in another window and the queue fro EB goes over 50.

Don’t try to bribe us. If WvW ever becomes genuinely lucrative, then the minds that brought you Tarir multiloot with disguised IP addresses will apply themselves to farming WvW. Believe me, you WvW guys are better off with it as the worst paying game mode than with that.

It needs to pay OK, like the Cursed Shore or whatever. If I can say “it’s not quite as good money as the Silverwastes, but you don’t have to do chest farms” then we’re cooking.

But the first thing WvW needs is to look fun. I think what you need is real marketing. Not by devs, by advertising professionals. Show us videos of cool fights, with voice overs by real commentators saying “now the neat thing about this is…” And make it assuming no prior knowledge of WvW, and put a link on the load screen which clearly flags it as intended for people with no WvW experience.

And once it looks like it could eventually be fun, it needs for people a way to get involved starting from “I know very little except that I’m a bit confused”.

Most of all, what I’d need is a place to start. There maybe good places to start, but I don’t know about them. Instead people jabber on assuming I already know what “push” or “max participation” mean.

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

One thing I will say for WvW, BTW… The only obnoxious WvWer I’ve encountered was in guild chat in my PvE farming guild. WvWers seem pretty chill, so much better than the dungeon commnity. Stay cool guys, maybe I’ll see you around some time.

Don’t force me to pve before I have a costume brawl with the raid boss

Starting out by threatening to destroy other people’s gameplay is against the T’s and C’s.

It’s basically like me saying ‘hey guys new to pve, if you force me to do things I don’t want to do… I’ll bring my guild and ruin the AB meta all week to ensure failure’

Of course that is not acceptable behaviour in either circumstance.

Moving past that childish attitude and on to your question: WvW video’s … there are plenty of WvW videos out from commanders, players, guilds … the whole nine yards.

But you are right… this game is not new anymore. There is a lot of these “how to’s” and basic write ups available, likely out dated, but available. Some of these just need to be brought to the forefront and promoted by communities. I feel this area is lacking, because it takes a tonne of work and effort. We used to have one guild position that was pretty much dedicated to it, and they burnt out.

Morte.5916:

Most of all, what I’d need is a place to start. There maybe good places to start, but I don’t know about them. Instead people jabber on assuming I already know what “push” or “max participation” mean.

^^ …. new players who don’t have the know how, or have an interest but not sure where to go for some guidance, information, current builds, map layouts, general stuff. Many servers actually have their own server forum with some of this information.

For the record, coming in with a poor attitude, regardless of game mode, will get you 0 help. Just based on the way you decided to craft your OP, I am still not convinced you actually give a rat about WvW. But I wanted to highlight the only viable point you made I believe is true regardless of server (given the current age of the game)

The place to start is be willing to change off of PvE classes and builds, get on voice coms to hear what is actually happening in the game, join a guild that has builds on their website and learn to play the game and not just score for the other team instead. Every time you die in WVW you are scoring for the other team. The best place to start is to actually try to become a part of the WvW community. This is not Single player and Not PvE, and that should be understood from the go.

So look at it this way, you just walked out onto the court in the middle of a basketball game grabbed the ball and started scoring for the other team and wonder why people are yelling at you.

lil devils x.6071:

The best place to start is to actually try to become a part of the WvW community. This is not Single player and Not PvE, and that should be understood from the go.

So look at it this way, you just walked out onto the court in the middle of a basketball game grabbed the ball and started scoring for the other team and wonder why people are yelling at you.

Hell has frozen over. I actually completely agree with you on this.

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Most players run all ascended gear for WVW, and need more than one set to switch out to be able to run different party comps. I don’t know any nubs running condi builds anyhow.. running rabid gets you gkicked lol

LvL 76 gear = score for other team.

I don’t know, but I think the OP would have done better to just read the sticky post at the very top of the forum page…. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/The-Basics-of-WvW-guide-and-more, rather than coming on here and threatening the devs in the 3rd paragraph.

My guess is that the OP has never read the book “How to Win Friends and Influence People” by Dale Carnegie.

Sure but devils, consider the OP … this is not a battle hardened individual … yet. It’s a new player coming to WvW, and he most def is not looking to zerg bust, but maybe get with a team and learn the ropes from.

So likely you are looking at a character, and can assume he will need a full set to accomplish (havoc team play).

They will not have armor sets readily available, nor any knowledge of any builds.

He needs to get involved with a WvW guild to learn and acquire a taste for that kind of thing.

Not sure the OP’s attitude would be tolerated much by anyone, but I’m sure there are havoc guild on your home server (or pairing) that can assist.

As of right now, you basically have to be connected with a few options, check them out and figure who you want to go learn the ropes from.

EDIT: added some clarity

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Most players run all ascended gear for WVW, and need more than one set to switch out to be able to run different party comps. I don’t know any nubs running condi builds anyhow.. running rabid gets you gkicked lol

LvL 76 gear = score for other team.

Lol. I still run mostly exotics. And I can still beat you

Wow guys, someone takes the time to point out how to make WvW enticing to other areas of the player base while warning about possible pit falls and all they get is this?

OP, the gear doesn’t cost that much if you craft it, chances are you will have the mats already and a lot of guild members will craft it if you’re not able to yourself. You can run all exotics and you’ll be fine, ascended armour really isn’t worth it unless your head has been up your back side so long you’ve forgotten what daylight is.

I do also agree with the OP that there could be a much better tutorial of what you do in WvW, the difference between normal and superior siege, what supply is (I have known people who don’t even know that) and how to use it. Then a brief basic on tactics, what you can do to help and you’d be golden.

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Most players run all ascended gear for WVW, and need more than one set to switch out to be able to run different party comps. I don’t know any nubs running condi builds anyhow.. running rabid gets you gkicked lol

LvL 76 gear = score for other team.

A competent player in full exotics can easily take over a scrub that think having full ascended stuff will save him… Happens plenty of time when I’m playing on my alt account which only have ascended rings and amulet.

Ascended equipments give advantage? Sure they do. But it’s not like it’s impossible to win a fight without those… One would argue that at best you only need a ascended weapon (because the base damage increase the damage of your skills) to be par with an full ascended player, and ascended weapons aren’t really expensive since you only need to craft 2-4 of them.

apharma.3741:

Wow guys, someone takes the time to point out how to make WvW enticing to other areas of the player base while warning about possible pit falls and all they get is this?

OP, the gear doesn’t cost that much if you craft it, chances are you will have the mats already and a lot of guild members will craft it if you’re not able to yourself. You can run all exotics and you’ll be fine, ascended armour really isn’t worth it unless your head has been up your back side so long you’ve forgotten what daylight is.

I do also agree with the OP that there could be a much better tutorial of what you do in WvW, the difference between normal and superior siege, what supply is (I have known people who don’t even know that) and how to use it. Then a brief basic on tactics, what you can do to help and you’d be golden.

I think I love you just a little bit for this.

Jeknar.6184:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Most players run all ascended gear for WVW, and need more than one set to switch out to be able to run different party comps. I don’t know any nubs running condi builds anyhow.. running rabid gets you gkicked lol

LvL 76 gear = score for other team.

A competent player in full exotics can easily take over a scrub that think having full ascended stuff will save him… Happens plenty of time when I’m playing on my alt account which only have ascended rings and amulet.

Ascended equipments give advantage? Sure they do. But it’s not like it’s impossible to win a fight without those… One would argue that at best you only need a ascended weapon (because the base damage increase the damage of your skills) to be par with an full ascended player, and ascended weapons aren’t really expensive since you only need to craft 2-4 of them.

You should never expect to be 1v1 anyone, you should be expecting to 1 v 5 at all times. Unless you want to be roadkill and feed them bags, or just blob it up, you should be ready to fight outnumbered against zergs in full ascended gear at all times. Due to how long this game has been out the zergs are no longer as green as they used to be…

But then again I am accustomed to the enemy zergs to be running proper builds and comps and buffing on another coming at us with a dragon banner so if you want to be able to fight that outnumbered you need to have your gear and comp together to do so.

Jayne.9251:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Most players run all ascended gear for WVW, and need more than one set to switch out to be able to run different party comps. I don’t know any nubs running condi builds anyhow.. running rabid gets you gkicked lol

LvL 76 gear = score for other team.

Lol. I still run mostly exotics. And I can still beat you

You might be able to with a stick outside of WvW, however, in WvW you are welcome to try. XD

Morte.5916:

Hi WvWers,
Today in EotM I finished my reward track, and almost simultaneously got the 250 badges I wanted for a discount on an ascended amulet. This has left me in in a reflective mood. I wonder should I go back and do it again? Should I try proper WvW? And it left me wondering what Anet should do to make WvW more attractive to PvEers.

If you had fun, sure why not?

So, a few thoughts:

Don’t try to force us. If you do, we will teach you the meaning of “beware of unintended consequences” by e.g. mostly-afking and repairing a wall every few minutes while we watch sitcoms in another window and the queue fro EB goes over 50.

Nobody is forcing you to? unless this is another gift of battle complaint. But no need for the threat. Of course I have to mention how much more wvw players are “forced” to do pve to get the things they want to function in wvw, but another argument for somewhere else.

Don’t try to bribe us. If WvW ever becomes genuinely lucrative, then the minds that brought you Tarir multiloot with disguised IP addresses will apply themselves to farming WvW. Believe me, you WvW guys are better off with it as the worst paying game mode than with that.

It needs to pay OK, like the Cursed Shore or whatever. If I can say “it’s not quite as good money as the Silverwastes, but you don’t have to do chest farms” then we’re cooking.

Fine by me, the reward tracks are perfect and that’s about as far they should go for rewarding play, we don’t need it to be as rewarding like the tarir meta. We just need enough gold to be able to maintain our gear, oils food, etc and a lil something something for a rainy day, like a transfer.

But the first thing WvW needs is to look fun. I think what you need is real marketing. Not by devs, by advertising professionals. Show us videos of cool fights, with voice overs by real commentators saying “now the neat thing about this is…” And make it assuming no prior knowledge of WvW, and put a link on the load screen which clearly flags it as intended for people with no WvW experience.

And once it looks like it could eventually be fun, it needs for people a way to get involved starting from “I know very little except that I’m a bit confused”.

True that, the marketing department seemed to ignore wvw for almost it’s entire time, meanwhile the notices we get about spvp and it’s tournaments, courtesy of the marketing department. Tons of wvw videos on youtube though.

Most of all, what I’d need is a place to start. There maybe good places to start, but I don’t know about them. Instead people jabber on assuming I already know what “push” or “max participation” mean.

I believe there’s suppose to be a tutorial npc in citadel, right at the portals. Terms like “push” are used by commanders, that will come with experience of running with them.

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

What? As mentioned already the wvw gear is cheaper than normal gear on the trading post since it cost badges too. You go rabid gear if you want to play a condition spec. But that’s up to you, havoc groups doesn’t require you to get that, unless a specific group you’re running with wants it for group synergy.

Anyways you can run normal exotics, build ascended trinkets/rings first which you can get in numerous ways. Gearing for wvw specifically really isn’t any different than gearing for raids. There’s tons of roles to play in wvw, gear towards what you want to play.

One thing I will say for WvW, BTW… The only obnoxious WvWer I’ve encountered was in guild chat in my PvE farming guild. WvWers seem pretty chill, so much better than the dungeon commnity. Stay cool guys, maybe I’ll see you around some time.

Thanks, don’t mind us clowns in here.

lil devils x.6071:

Jayne.9251:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Most players run all ascended gear for WVW, and need more than one set to switch out to be able to run different party comps. I don’t know any nubs running condi builds anyhow.. running rabid gets you gkicked lol

LvL 76 gear = score for other team.

Lol. I still run mostly exotics. And I can still beat you

You might be able to with a stick outside of WvW, however, in WvW you are welcome to try. XD

Sure, let’s meet up. What server are you on?

Jeknar.6184:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

cut quotes to pertinent information.

none found … searching …

…

A competent player in full exotics can easily take over a scrub that think having full ascended stuff will save him
…

…

Ascended equipments give advantage? Sure they do. But it’s not like it’s impossible to win a fight without those… One would argue that at best you only need a ascended weapon (because the base damage increase the damage of your skills) to be par with an full ascended player

Yup, I can’t remember but wasn’t it only like 4-5% difference in overall stats? The weapon provides the cap on dmg, suffering a bit in stats isn’t going to hurt experienced players. Heck, most players I bet have at some point levelled alts that were still under levelled in WvW to get the last 5-10 levels. I remember a pretty popular commander making his charr alt, and commanding underlevelled and still doing very well. The difference there is a lot more noticeable then missing some ascended armor.

My alt account is still time gated for laurels (so poor on laurels, looking at 2 in the wallet) and most my accessories are exotic still.

If you have ascended available, great … if not … it’s not to hard to gear out in exo’s and work from there if you are new.

joneirikb.7506:

No idea what server you’re on, but if you happen to be on Kaineng reach out to either of the guilds I’m in (SIN and Owls) they’re great for taking in new WvW’ers and showing them the ropes, and generally focus on roaming/havocing.

If you’re on Kaineng, SIN and Owls are really good wvw guilds that we have on the server. Lots of fun and lots of help.

Jayne.9251:

apharma.3741:

Wow guys, someone takes the time to point out how to make WvW enticing to other areas of the player base while warning about possible pit falls and all they get is this?

OP, the gear doesn’t cost that much if you craft it, chances are you will have the mats already and a lot of guild members will craft it if you’re not able to yourself. You can run all exotics and you’ll be fine, ascended armour really isn’t worth it unless your head has been up your back side so long you’ve forgotten what daylight is.

I do also agree with the OP that there could be a much better tutorial of what you do in WvW, the difference between normal and superior siege, what supply is (I have known people who don’t even know that) and how to use it. Then a brief basic on tactics, what you can do to help and you’d be golden.

I think I love you just a little bit for this.

I’m still not duelling you.

apharma.3741:

Jayne.9251:

apharma.3741:

Wow guys, someone takes the time to point out how to make WvW enticing to other areas of the player base while warning about possible pit falls and all they get is this?

OP, the gear doesn’t cost that much if you craft it, chances are you will have the mats already and a lot of guild members will craft it if you’re not able to yourself. You can run all exotics and you’ll be fine, ascended armour really isn’t worth it unless your head has been up your back side so long you’ve forgotten what daylight is.

I do also agree with the OP that there could be a much better tutorial of what you do in WvW, the difference between normal and superior siege, what supply is (I have known people who don’t even know that) and how to use it. Then a brief basic on tactics, what you can do to help and you’d be golden.

I think I love you just a little bit for this.

I’m still not duelling you.

:(

I don’t see what could be wrong from the OP’s questions and the “don’t” list. When you have no idea about what could bring you to something, you may have some ideas about what wouldn’t.

Anyway, I won’t endorse ppl saying “try not to make your server fail”, because if you’re new, you’re here to learn, and if so, you’re expected and allowed to sometimes fail. Especially in PvP fights that are mostly far more difficult than PvE ones.

So, to me, the first thing to learn is where you are. Explore the area around home. Learn how to travel fast, learn where you can leap off cliffs without dying. In the meantime, try to make yourself useful : take camps, take sentries, kill enemy yaks. In organized servers, you can do both by spending some time scouting towers or keeps : you’ll learn a keep layout, and see from where enemies usually attack.

Find youself a group of friends to play with. Try various things, from small group to blob, and find what you like, from k-train to tactics.

Concerning PvP part… Expect the vast majority of your opponent to run the current metas that change like every 3 months. There’re plenty of meta builds around so you may try and find one that you like, and that works too. In PvP lobby, you can try for free various stats combinaisons. It’s not as tweakable as WvW, hence it won’t be exactly the same, yet it can be enough to give you a taste of a build, and see whether you’d like to explore it any further.

Yet, don’t expect much strategy from a WvW fight. Sadly, the motto has been “the faster the better” from ages. You won’t have any tactic. Just a bunch of skills cast at you, and the opponent fleeing as fast as he can if it didn’t kill you the first time. You can also have the stunlock, or things like these, because tons of WvWers like it easy, and kindly ask you to keep your hands under your seat while they kill you ^^.

Anyway, just try and have fun ! There’re many things to do in WvW.

Hexinx.1872:

Starting out by threatening to destroy other people’s gameplay is against the T’s and C’s.

I promise you it’s not a threat. It’s a prediction and warning.

I mean, come on. Do you think I’m in charge of the PvEers and I can tell them to do this? How can I “threaten” anybody?

I am, rather, warning people (mostly Anet) about the potential unintended consequences of having lots of people in WvW who don’t want to be there. These are especially bothersome for WvW because it has player caps, it doesn’t just spawn extra instances when the numbers grow like PvE/PvP.

Dawdler.8521:

Morte.5916:

There are also practical barriers. Say I like the sound of havoc groups (I do). To try that will I need a set of e.g. rabid gear? If so, that’s on the order of 100g just to try something out. Free level 76 exotic gear, that’s only usable in WvW and disintegrates after 30 hours, would be more like it.

… what? Wtf do you use, armor made of gold? A full set including weapons and sigils/runes is like 20 gold (or 10 days of doing nothing but daily). Ascended trinkets is dirt cheap. And thats not even counting the options for WvW bought gear, which is more like 7 gold + badges.

Wow, you are right. I was thinking in terms of berserker gear prices, my bad. Sorry.

lil devils x.6071:

Every time you die in WVW you are scoring for the other team.

Why do you think I stick to EotM?

Xenesis.6389:

Nobody is forcing you to?

Well, no, they’re more sort of “prodding”. Like they’re prodding when they put fractals (which most PvEers don’t do) in the PvE dailies. Or when they put the exotic berserker aquabreather (mostly useful to dungeon/fractal people) in sPvP. Or when they expect WvWers to map complete PvE. And they seem to mostly succeed in annoying everybody.

edit: Anet shouldn’t pester people into WvW against their will and hope some of them stick. They should rather make WvW interesting enough that people want to try it. Then they should make the barrier to entry as low as possible, so that people actually try it rather than saying “I’d like to try it, but the problem is…”.

Of course I have to mention how much more wvw players are “forced” to do pve to get the things they want to function in wvw

Absolutely, I agree entirely. Personally I think there should for example be a set of “Vicarious Exploration” reward tracks, one per region, to get a gift of exploration for the set.

Folks, I didn’t actually ask for help or advice in the OP but, well, thanks for all the help and advice. It is good of you.

ThomasC.1056:

Anyway, I won’t endorse ppl saying “try not to make your server fail”, because if you’re new, you’re here to learn, and if so, you’re expected and allowed to sometimes fail. Especially in PvP fights that are mostly far more difficult than PvE ones.

Funny thing is there’s still a lot of players who have been around for 3 years still making stupid mistakes, stuff that even common sense should tell you not to do, but it somehow doesn’t click with them.

But yeah wvw is a learning experience, it’s stuff you have to actually experience and learn from, stuff like siege placements, counter siege placements, scout and commander calls, learning your class and what you can and cannot do, learn the flow of battle and positioning, reading enemy movement on the map, supply management, do’s and don’t, like don’t repair a wall that’s being trebbed until the treb is down or you’re wasting supply, and so much more.

Stuff like that you can’t teach with an npc, some of it you can with a wvw guild, but some of it you just need to experience it to get it, roaming, havoc, zerging, all have their own tricks to learn, the more you play the more you pick up over time.

Morte.5916:

Well, no, they’re more sort of “prodding”. Like they’re prodding when they put fractals (which most PvEers don’t do) in the PvE dailies. Or when they put the exotic berserker aquabreather (mostly useful to dungeon/fractal people) in sPvP. Or when they expect WvWers to map complete PvE. And they seem to mostly succeed in annoying everybody.

edit: Anet shouldn’t pester people into WvW against their will and hope some of them stick. They should rather make WvW interesting enough that people want to try it. Then they should make the barrier to entry as low as possible, so that people actually try it rather than saying “I’d like to try it, but the problem is…”.

I’m fine with them putting stuff in dailies, when dailies first started out it was very limited, and we clammered for more variety in dailies for every section, pve wvw spvp, to the point it’s at now.

The hard hooks which “force” people into other sections of the game I don’t agree with as well, but well there should be something to entice players to give them a look at least.

One of the problems with wvw is the limited recruitment because of the megaservers, and the loss of callouts in LA for reinforcements. Tournaments use to bring in new players, some of which stayed in wvw, my guild was a testament to that, but there’s problems with those and they no longer want to run them.

Maybe if they ran more special events as promotions it would help, course the last one they did, golem week, turned into a disaster. But even running the wvw buff more regularly like they do with spvp may help pique some player interest from time to time.

As for a low barrier of entry, I tend to look at wvw somewhat like an endgame area like raids, and normally the entry to raids takes practice through dungeons. For wvw I look at eotm as that bridge, mind you it was opened as a place to temporarily play while waiting in queue, but it became a good spot to level so many players did that rather than grinding in pve.

In eotm you can learn wvw basics in there, even if it’s just following a zerg around taking stuff, there’s other stuff to learn if you pick up on them, keeping an eye out and reading enemy movement on the map, learning the flow of battle and positioning, which are very important to keep yourself alive.

Sorry about the long post, just thought it was some good quotes for discussion.

WvW is basically the same as pve. You’ll go out not knowing what’s out there and you’ll learn the maps and terms along the way. Most of the terminology is the same if you raid and what is not the same is self explanatory. I use whatever gear my build needs, don’t get in the mindset that there’s a metabuild you have to use out there, change things up as needed and just see what works. Sounds like you’re overthinking it, just go out and do stuff and don’t beat yourself up for losing a fight, just ponder your build every time.

If your server has a teamspeak it helps to jump on there when you know there’s a few different squads working on something big, few days of that and you’ll get the hang of the work flow. There’s no way to advertise WvW without false advertisement, not that it would be a scam, just that you’ll end up doing stuff and landing in fights you just can’t expect.

It seems like a genuine attempt to help understand, and provide understanding, to me, and it looks like it was a waste of time now. PvE players are not going to get past the first few responses before saying “nope, this is not for me”.

So metabattle.com has some basic NA wvw builds which are somewhat viable, theyre surprisingly similar to what EU runs, scrubbier tho. Maybe it’s better if you are an ele, find a open guild raid and ask ele from that guild what gear is he running.

Regarding getting ascended gear:
Gear Importance-Level Cost
weapon Highest medium * * *
Amulet High low * * *
Chest High High * *
Leg Medium High * *
Other Armor Low High *
Rings Medium Low * * * (get with pristine fractal relics if you have)
accessories Medium Medium * * (get with gcommendations if you have)
backpiece Low High * (get with fractal relics or PvP league tickets if you have)

• * * * =most important and quite cheap, get asap
• * * = Important and cheap, should take few days to get though
• *= get when you can, dont really need it, better focus on gearing another class

Morte.5916:

lil devils x.6071:

Every time you die in WVW you are scoring for the other team.

Why do you think I stick to EotM?

I don’t think you should be forced to go to WvW at all. It is a game, you should enjoy the time you spend on it. You should be able to access everything you need to play from the game mode you enjoy most. PvE should not have to go to PvP or WvW to get what you need, WvW should not have to PvE to get what we need either. That was what made GW1 stand out from the rest. You could come straight in and PvP without having to ever step foot in PvE and it was great for that. Them removing one of the best features of their games is a terrible move on their part. PvP, WvW, PvE should all be self sustaining to access what is used in the game mode. Playing the game should not feel like " work" or “chores” to be able to get to what you enjoy doing. It should be fun the entire time you are playing.

Often I think people forget that games should be fun for those playing it. For some people, having players attack them and think they suck isn’t fun, just as for some people, killing an NPC isn’t fun. Some like the competitive nature of a mass PvP game mode, some do not.

Anet originally came in with the mindset that it was okay to like different things and not force the other upon players who liked different play styles when they made GW1. The problem they are making now is they are trying to do exactly what made players not want to play the other games that tried to force them to grind to do what they enjoy, all that is going to do is send those players off again searching for a game that doesn’t do that. Changing that just makes players start looking for a game to take their place.

As for learning, if new players become active in the community, join the server website, teamspeak, they find plenty of people more than willing to help them learn. The worst mistake I think a new player coming in to WvW could do is not join the community there as soon as a possible. The players trying to play the game without listening to voice coms are not even playing the same game as the rest of the players as it is drastically different. Non voice com players do not hear any of the commands within the fight, regardless of what position someone plays, they can benefit from listening to what is happening on their server.

People may think it " harsh" to tell them that they need to get good gear and learn to fight outnumbered, but the reality is there are few “even” fights in wvw, and you should expect to be outnumbered and new players are going to have much more fun learning how to fight and live than they are going to have dying over and over and over again because no one showed them how not to and told them to get cheap gear. Players do not come to a massively multiplayer PvP game mode to avoid most of the players in it, they come to fight them and need to learn how to do that .