Guild Wars 2

So, WvW is getting removed from World Completion. And there are already a couple threads on this for general discussion. The announcement did however give me a more specific idea on how to handle world completion outside PvE.

On the surface, this is a good move. Waiting for the colours to rotate to get that random vista or POI was silly, and it brought players into WvW who had no interest in helping the team, instead taking up map spots at all times.

However, the idea here is WORLD completion. Why can purely PvE players get access to the Legendary crafting requirements but pure WvW, pure PvP or mostly Dungeon runner players can’t? In fact, how can anyone claim World Completion by only ever seeing 1/4 areas of the game? Either make things separate so everyone can get everything in each area of the game or don’t and make it a game-wide goal.

Now, Dungeons, PvP and WvW aren’t exactly conducive to “map completing” with POIs and vistas. What I would suggest instead is adding a token achievements for each of these 3 areas and make them a required part of World Completion.

How onerous these would be and the actual numbers would be ANet’s call. But taking a small % of the world completion score and tying it to an achievement in each of these 3 other game areas is the idea. Something like:

-5 keep/tower captures, 5 defences, 50 player kills (EotM does not count)
-Win 5 sPvP matches (hotjoins or Q)
-Complete 50% of all dungeon paths.

Now, those numbers are pretty low, just as an example. The idea is to gain the benefit of having people who want world completion to have at least seen and tried all areas of the game, maybe even unexpectedly finding something they liked other than PvE. As well, when the map completers jump into a dungeon, WvW or PvP the idea is to have them come and actually play the game mode, rather than running around for little squares on the map.

At the same time, the idea is to make these goals very achievable so they aren’t the huge drag that WvW map completion could be, which would actually drive people away.

It’s a pretty random musing I know, but figure I may as well post it anyway.

At this point i just hope they don’t also remove the completion rewards for the individual maps. Like if you get full completion you still get the exp and the other stuff from completing each borderland and the EBG.
Also i’d be tons more happy if they were announcing “We’re adding map completion rewards to Silverwastes, Dry Top and Southsun”.
I see how adding new maps and stuff kinda borked the World completion thing. But like Helequin said you could award the gift of explorer upon completing a certain number of achievements within a pool. Or just have more world explorer achievements. It just feels kinda cheap that the game that was supposed to reward exploring is doing so less and less. At least in the most strict sense of it.

The best idea i saw on this was just split the rewards

Give WvW 1 gift of exploration, and PvE 1 gift as well.

TexZero.7910:

The best idea i saw on this was just split the rewards

Give WvW 1 gift of exploration, and PvE 1 gift as well.

PVE is always babied and WvW has had and will always have mediocre rewards – don’t expect that to change.

I pretty much agree with everyone.

@Tex – yeah that’s the other way to approach this problem. Give each game mode its own way to achieve things, get Legendaries, all of it without going to any of the others. I’m okay with either approach, making end game stuff encompass all modes or letting each mode get there individually, as long as ANet picks one and actually acknowledges different player game preferences.

@Blockhead: I’m well aware. My two least favourite things in the entire game are crafting and mindlessly filling in heart quests after hitting 80. That effectively locks me out of ever having cohesive ascended weapons/armour or a legendary, no matter how well I master Dungeons, PvP or WvW (other than just grinding gold and buying a legendary).

It all seems silly considering the “design ethos” ANet plastered all over around the first ascended releases, where there would be multiple routes to things, especially BiS gear. Instead, everything seems to be crafting based.

See I don’t agree with “master of dungeons” because right now to make a legendary you’re forced to go into dungeons as it is.

Actually making a legendary you have to do everything except sPvP, and soon to be WvW. (And no, EOTM isn’t wvw…)

Someone proposed Legendary’s specifically for WvW, and honestly I think that is the best Idea I have seen, however make it so ALL items for them are gained solely from WvW plz.

You can choose not to do dungeons if you go through Spvp… But yea, this change effectively removes WvW from making a legendary.

TexZero.7910:

The best idea i saw on this was just split the rewards

Give WvW 1 gift of exploration, and PvE 1 gift as well.

That would be kinda imbalanced, i mean as annoying as it gets to get full completion (specially if your guild isn’t very wvw oriented), the WvW maps are just 3 (with completion atm), and with the proper conditions can be done quickly… You just need to get inside the keeps and whatnot. Last character i did completion with i got my last POI (i needed bay on a borderland) with 2 other guys. We capped bay as a trio just before reset. Basically the maps were empty so we got it done quickly and easily.
But some other rewards would be cool for full WvW map completion (maybe even gifts of exploration if its including the new borderlands that are coming and EoTM).

Dasenthal.6520:

You can choose not to do dungeons if you go through Spvp… But yea, this change effectively removes WvW from making a legendary.

Gift of battle? Still required afaik.

Dasenthal.6520:

You can choose not to do dungeons if you go through Spvp… But yea, this change effectively removes WvW from making a legendary.

They still need a gift of battle, which for people who detest WvW is apparently a real chore.

sPvP gets screwed more than anything. Even if you’re a pure sPvP player, you have to do the other two formats for sure. At least if you’re a pure PvE or WvW player, you only have to do one of the other ones.

They always kept the WvW map completion in there to encourage people to play all formats (though sPvP was never made a requirement), but the fact that they’re finally shying away from this will hopefully open the doors to legendary requirements being achievable from any one of the game formats. This would help people play the game how they want without barring them from being able to achieve a legendary weapon.

The primary issue in doing that is making sure that each format takes approximately equal effort. As such, a WvW player should need to put in about as much time, money, and effort to get a legendary exclusively in WvW as someone in PvE would. At least, that would be the case if they wanted to be fair.

I think it would also add to the system if playing all the formats would make it easier to get a legendary than someone playing only one format, though it would still be possible in either case.

I think it’s a good direction to go in, but there’s a ton of details that would have to be figured out. It’s surely not a change that can just be slapped in.

Yamsandjams.3267:

They still need a gift of battle, which for people who detest WvW is apparently a real chore.

Badges can be gained through achievement chests so they only have to join WvW to buy the gift.

Turamarth.3248:

Yamsandjams.3267:

They still need a gift of battle, which for people who detest WvW is apparently a real chore.

Badges can be gained through achievement chests so they only have to join WvW to buy the gift.

Achievement chests and EoTM. Neither of which require or even encourage the same playstyle as WvW.

Yamsandjams.3267:

Dasenthal.6520:

You can choose not to do dungeons if you go through Spvp… But yea, this change effectively removes WvW from making a legendary.

They still need a gift of battle, which for people who detest WvW is apparently a real chore.

sPvP gets screwed more than anything. Even if you’re a pure sPvP player, you have to do the other two formats for sure. At least if you’re a pure PvE or WvW player, you only have to do one of the other ones.

They always kept the WvW map completion in there to encourage people to play all formats (though sPvP was never made a requirement), but the fact that they’re finally shying away from this will hopefully open the doors to legendary requirements being achievable from any one of the game formats. This would help people play the game how they want without barring them from being able to achieve a legendary weapon.

The primary issue in doing that is making sure that each format takes approximately equal effort. As such, a WvW player should need to put in about as much time, money, and effort to get a legendary exclusively in WvW as someone in PvE would. At least, that would be the case if they wanted to be fair.

I think it would also add to the system if playing all the formats would make it easier to get a legendary than someone playing only one format, though it would still be possible in either case.

I think it’s a good direction to go in, but there’s a ton of details that would have to be figured out. It’s surely not a change that can just be slapped in.

I have a problem with this (mostly bolded part). If you require the same effort WvW players will need less gold, if you require the same amount of gold WvW players will be giving a lot more effort. (The point being that WvW is still vastly unrewarded compared to PvE, most notably SW)

Turamarth.3248:

Yamsandjams.3267:

They still need a gift of battle, which for people who detest WvW is apparently a real chore.

Badges can be gained through achievement chests so they only have to join WvW to buy the gift.

Even if they get all badges through achievement chests they still need lvl 14 in WvW. Which needs them to play either EoTM (like it or not its part of wvw and some pvp will happen, although its little more than a big champ train with some pvp in the middle) or Regular WvW.

Honestly i don’t get the fuss about Legendaries not being available exclusively through WvW or PvP. Why should it? First they’re not exclusive to PvE either. Next if anything legendaries are PvE content. And are you gonna tell me you don’t run Fractals, and don’t craft ascended items to get best gear possible for WvW?

ReaverKane.7598:

Even if they get all badges through achievement chests they still need lvl 14 in WvW. Which needs them to play either EoTM (like it or not its part of wvw and some pvp will happen, although its little more than a big champ train with some pvp in the middle) or Regular WvW.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Taste_of_Liquid_World_Experience
Can be bought from the laurel vendor in WvW for 50 badges and 2 laurels.

Those of us who’ve done the WvW maps should at least get a title for having done it.

“Gone where no noob has gone before”
“Forlorn Hope”
“Gauntlet Runner”

And so on.

If I can add my two cents I’ve done WvW map completion 5 times.
Now that is getting cast out because some players were very vocal about it and thought they shouldn’t have to go to the trouble.

Law of the least effort I guess, I mean screw me and everyone that did map completion and had to get all the WvW maps.

Maybe its time for me to start whining I don’t like gold grind so anet has to make precursors available at 1 gold on some vendor, because reasons and reasons and reasons and whats so legendary about gold grind? It shouldn’t be a thing, it just shouldn’t, nag nag nag nag.

Oh and when they finally get the precursors at 1 gold, I wouldn’t bother with a legendary anyway because they all look ridiculous.
I got 17 stacks of uni dyes sitting on my guild bank, that alone sold right now would be enough to flat out buy a legendary from the market without a sweat.