Guild Wars 2

Through research of viable roaming builds for my favorite classes (mesmer/ele and more recently ranger), I’ve discovered the prevailing sentiment that HoT basically nerfed solo roaming through a combination of widespread sustain and defense/CC buffs.

My question to this forum is thus: How do we rank roamers by profession, damage type, and build? Is it still a viable playtype (fun notwithstanding, I’ll continue to do it regardless), or does it need significant changes?

From what I can tell, the profession tier list so far goes:

1. Thief
2. Everything else
3. D/D Ele

How do you guys like to keep roaming alive, and what builds or classes do you recommend roaming with?

I recommend roaming with a pure power Reaper. Full glass.
We have the least variety of defensive mechanism. Basically just Shroud.
When you meet the enemy, you have to fight or die. No escape.
It’s fun. It’s exhilarating. It’s thrilling.
It pushes your skills to the max because its kill or be killed.
You don’t have the option to run and avoid.
Power Reaper > every other class/build in terms of fun, exhilaration, thrill.

You can see some of my roaming videos in my signature.
I recommend the first link. Still my favorite.

There is a viable roaming build for every class but you can only really do it enjoyably ATM in the borderlands. EB is just full to the brim with gank groups and zergs. I would rank the top ones Mesmer->Thief->Druid/Scrapper->Warrior, the rest are kind of meh (unless you do it in a party, in which case ele/rev/dh are pretty OP).

Think I will just go for the meta build on the roaming parts, as for example thief→d/p the pistol is for improving survive-ability etc.

I don´t know, after Alpine BL is changed the roaming seems to be rather limited, EB is usually on a que for quiet a while, the border lands as I wrote is limited, filled with up and downs which makes the map bigger since it got different levels to be on, and not as easely accepted since it is filled with walls blocking off certain areas and need a small blob to gain access through places, which again seem to make it unlikely to see roamers on prime.

Roaming is no longer 1v1 in our tier. There are a few people who will CC you then burst you down but those people aren’t fun to fight because if they miss, they usually drop instantly due to the glassy gear. Right now there are small groups of people that run around and are usually anywhere from 3-10 people in size. You’ll get the mesmer from a distance who will interupt you, the thief that will burst you, and the reaper who will drop conditions so you can’t move once you stun-break. Its a solid roaming comp and if the zerg comes, you can just mass invis and run to the sides then go back to picking off the pugs who are trying to get get back with the zerg.

Most common setups I see are what I mentioned. Lots of thieves, chronomancers, and reapers. Nothing new really.

zengara.8301:

Think I will just go for the meta build on the roaming parts, as for example thief->d/p the pistol is for improving survive-ability etc.

I don´t know, after Alpine BL is changed the roaming seems to be rather limited, EB is usually on a que for quiet a while, the border lands as I wrote is limited, filled with up and downs which makes the map bigger since it got different levels to be on, and not as easely accepted since it is filled with walls blocking off certain areas and need a small blob to gain access through places, which again seem to make it unlikely to see roamers on prime.

Are you referring to the barricades? If so, anet removed all of them and smoothed out the terrain to make it easier and more open to navigate.

I feel like all the people ranking thief as number 1 for solo roaming don’t actually solo roam on a thief. There is so much passive “save your kitten ” traits in the game now that a thief can’t really burst people down very fast. Also the loss of guard stacks really hurt thieves, I have literally 1 shot a few. They do well in small groups, but you have to be kitten ed good to be effective solo
I much prefer solo roaming on druid or scrapper. I find them much stronger in 1vX and they still have plenty of tools for escaping.
Condi mes is strong but only if players commit to the fight. If they choose to ignore you it is unlikely you will kill them before they reach safety.

roamzero.9486:

There is a viable roaming build for every class but you can only really do it enjoyably ATM in the borderlands. EB is just full to the brim with gank groups and zergs. I would rank the top ones Mesmer->Thief->Druid/Scrapper->Warrior, the rest are kind of meh (unless you do it in a party, in which case ele/rev/dh are pretty OP).

I’ve noticed especially in T2, where pretty much any single player is bait for a nearby gank squad. Doesn’t help when EB has a 50 person queue and the other BL’s are empty.

Puck.9612:

I feel like all the people ranking thief as number 1 for solo roaming don’t actually solo roam on a thief. There is so much passive "save your kitten traits in the game now that a thief can’t really burst people down very fast. Also the loss of guard stacks really hurt thieves, I have literally 1 shot a few. They do well in small groups, but you have to be kitten ed good to be effective solo
I much prefer solo roaming on druid or scrapper. I find them much stronger in 1vX and they still have plenty of tools for escaping.
Condi mes is strong but only if players commit to the fight. If they choose to ignore you it is unlikely you will kill them before they reach safety.

Condi Mes is undeniably strong, but I really just feel like its boring to play. It doesn’t have the visceral impact of Power Mes or really any other mes build. I’d rather play stealth mantras then condi mes.

Also, do you think LB/GS ranger has any place right now? The Druid build doesn’t really appeal to me, though I see it’s power.

Grayclay.4579:

Also, do you think LB/GS ranger has any place right now? The Druid build doesn’t really appeal to me, though I see it’s power.

The cheesy staff/greatsword avoidance style has completely pushed away the normal ranger when it comes to roaming. Played well they are near impossible to kill and completely impossible to catch by anything other than a thief. Best case scenario is that you can slug it out for 5+ minutes with another sustain build, but he can withdraw at any moment so its pretty pointless unless its a fight to the death.

Personally, I’m enjoying roaming on my druid in DBL these days. Only went to EB once since HoT dropped and hated it.

Puck.9612:

I feel like all the people ranking thief as number 1 for solo roaming don’t actually solo roam on a thief. There is so much passive "save your kitten traits in the game now that a thief can’t really burst people down very fast. Also the loss of guard stacks really hurt thieves, I have literally 1 shot a few. They do well in small groups, but you have to be kitten ed good to be effective solo
I much prefer solo roaming on druid or scrapper. I find them much stronger in 1vX and they still have plenty of tools for escaping.
Condi mes is strong but only if players commit to the fight. If they choose to ignore you it is unlikely you will kill them before they reach safety.

I agree with Puck. Thief is always brought up in these threads as great for roaming but nowadays it’s not ideal imo.

Druid is OK though I find it drops off once it’s 1v2+. Scrapper is a great option, have had great success with it currently. ATM I’m solo roaming with lb sw/t condition warrior and it’s been working out well so far.

Honestly every class has a viable roaming build. For solo roaming I would say scrapper=mesmer > warrior = druid = revenant > necro = thief > guardian > ele

Scrapper is definitely the best. Mesmer is the best duelist where both parties commit. Even then, chrono’s mobility is quite good. I’d probably have to agree that druid comes next, though I think it shines the most in groups of 2 or 3, and then falls flat beyond that point.
Next I’d honestly put D/D ele. Assuming you run remotely durable. There are some builds which are literally unkillable without a 2v1, though opposing sustain might be enough to perpetuate the fight; depends on composition.

I think core warrior and guardian are bottom-of-the-barrel. Too many passive defenses for them to land their essential burst, not enough range/punishing effects, and simply low control compared to most elites.

I’d argue thief stands somewhat in the middle of the list. It’s good, but it really only should be winning deliberate/committed fights to the top-tier dueling professions if it’s either completely kitted out to beat them, or simply there’s a huge skill disparity.

Grayclay.4579:

roamzero.9486:

There is a viable roaming build for every class but you can only really do it enjoyably ATM in the borderlands. EB is just full to the brim with gank groups and zergs. I would rank the top ones Mesmer->Thief->Druid/Scrapper->Warrior, the rest are kind of meh (unless you do it in a party, in which case ele/rev/dh are pretty OP).

I’ve noticed especially in T2, where pretty much any single player is bait for a nearby gank squad. Doesn’t help when EB has a 50 person queue and the other BL’s are empty.

Puck.9612:

I feel like all the people ranking thief as number 1 for solo roaming don’t actually solo roam on a thief. There is so much passive "save your kitten traits in the game now that a thief can’t really burst people down very fast. Also the loss of guard stacks really hurt thieves, I have literally 1 shot a few. They do well in small groups, but you have to be kitten ed good to be effective solo
I much prefer solo roaming on druid or scrapper. I find them much stronger in 1vX and they still have plenty of tools for escaping.
Condi mes is strong but only if players commit to the fight. If they choose to ignore you it is unlikely you will kill them before they reach safety.

Condi Mes is undeniably strong, but I really just feel like its boring to play. It doesn’t have the visceral impact of Power Mes or really any other mes build. I’d rather play stealth mantras then condi mes.

Also, do you think LB/GS ranger has any place right now? The Druid build doesn’t really appeal to me, though I see it’s power.

Not really. I mean, it will work but there is so much projectile hate that it’s almost impossible to land a rapid fire vs any competent players and maul is so mediocre unless you build around buffing it. You’d be better off swapping either weapon for staff or going full melee.

I’m leaning towards trying out staff with sword/axe now that they made some changes to those weapons. Should be pretty mobile and off hand axe does some decent damage. At the moment I’ve been running a hybrid crit bleed build with shortbow/staff. It does great in 1v1’s, 1v2’s, or small group fights but retal is a nightmare.

Puck.9612:

words

The only thing that prevents me from swapping to shortbow/axe+torch is the equipment swap cost. I played it a bit in sPvP and it felt not only powerful but quite mobile.

DeceiverX.8361:

Scrapper is definitely the best. Mesmer is the best duelist where both parties commit. Even then, chrono’s mobility is quite good. I’d probably have to agree that druid comes next, though I think it shines the most in groups of 2 or 3, and then falls flat beyond that point.
Next I’d honestly put D/D ele. Assuming you run remotely durable. There are some builds which are literally unkillable without a 2v1, though opposing sustain might be enough to perpetuate the fight; depends on composition.

I think core warrior and guardian are bottom-of-the-barrel. Too many passive defenses for them to land their essential burst, not enough range/punishing effects, and simply low control compared to most elites.

I’d argue thief stands somewhat in the middle of the list. It’s good, but it really only should be winning deliberate/committed fights to the top-tier dueling professions if it’s either completely kitted out to beat them, or simply there’s a huge skill disparity.

Interesting that you say that, considering the amount of hate D/D ele gets on here. I think its more-so the lack of kill power, because even in sPvP, D/x ele is durable af. Are you talking Power Scrapper? I like ele/mes better thematically, but I’ve seen so many scrappers get away with so much stuff….

Also, interesting that you say core warrior is the worst, considering the poster above you said it’s tied for 2nd best. Was watching a montage earlier with a zerk GS/Rifle doing 13k crits.

Scrapper is still the best by a long shot just because the damage and sustain is insane. Thieves kill incredibly quick now – you can easily kill a squishy light target with a basilisk >steal>quickness AA chain. But it’s far better to do this as a group of Thieves because a single Thief just can’t survive focus fire.

Then you have condi PU which can persist, but not really kill unless an objective is involved. Also GS Warrior is making a comeback, but it lacks the stealth to disengage from a sudden zerg appearance.

Grayclay.4579:

Also, interesting that you say core warrior is the worst, considering the poster above you said it’s tied for 2nd best. Was watching a montage earlier with a zerk GS/Rifle doing 13k crits.

The problem with such as build is that you sacrifice everything to be a one hit wonder, much like how most thieves build. Missing that shot (or even better, getting it reflected into your face) means you are probably doomed. It also means that small groups will probably roflstomp you. I have always seen this type of build as a party flanker, someone that pops a shot in to surprise someone that’s already engaged (again, much like how thieves perform the best).

Grayclay.4579:

I’ve noticed especially in T2, where pretty much any single player is bait for a nearby gank squad. Doesn’t help when EB has a 50 person queue and the other BL’s are empty.

Yes to this! I have to remind my guildies constantly “if you see one dude, there’s likely 30 nearby”. If I go into a map alone, I usually don’t get much past NN before I’m looking for a tag to join or the safety of a keep or objective.

Not sure if Alpine will make that better or worse, but I’m looking forward to finding out.

Simonoly.4352:

Scrapper is still the best by a long shot just because the damage and sustain is insane. Thieves kill incredibly quick now – you can easily kill a squishy light target with a basilisk >steal>quickness AA chain. But it’s far better to do this as a group of Thieves because a single Thief just can’t survive focus fire.

Then you have condi PU which can persist, but not really kill unless an objective is involved. Also GS Warrior is making a comeback, but it lacks the stealth to disengage from a sudden zerg appearance.

What kind of Scrapper build or Warrior build do you suggest?

Also, I’ve always wondered, what is PU? Power Uxxxxx?

Grayclay.4579:

snip.

I should have clarified my comments with classes. I am assuming the best roaming build for each class in a solo setting. For some reason I mix and match the HoT and core names. I believe that for solo roaming berserk is better than core warrior and that makes it tied for second.

Additionally Mesmer is only strong when the opponent has decided to commit to the fight. The long standing strategy of I’m just going to walk away still applies to all but the best condition mesmers out there roaming.

Also my ranking does not factor in the “oh kitten zerg Inc” factor very much. For me it more comes down to ability to take on outnumbered fights instead of the escapability aspect hence why I’ve placed thief lower.

Grayclay.4579:

Also, I’ve always wondered, what is PU? Power Uxxxxx?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Prismatic_Understanding

Helly.2597:

Grayclay.4579:

snip.

I should have clarified my comments with classes. I am assuming the best roaming build for each class in a solo setting. For some reason I mix and match the HoT and core names. I believe that for solo roaming berserk is better than core warrior and that makes it tied for second.

Additionally Mesmer is only strong when the opponent has decided to commit to the fight. The long standing strategy of I’m just going to walk away still applies to all but the best condition mesmers out there roaming.

Also my ranking does not factor in the “oh kitten zerg Inc” factor very much. For me it more comes down to ability to take on outnumbered fights instead of the escapability aspect hence why I’ve placed thief lower.

Gotcha, that makes much more sense. I like the stealth element that mesmer can bring, I think it’s still around despite Power being nerfed because (other than condi OP) it has so much utility that applies to so many settings.

Also, what does Kitten mean in this context?

mcarswell.3768:

Grayclay.4579:

Also, I’ve always wondered, what is PU? Power Uxxxxx?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Prismatic_Understanding

This changes so much.

Helly.2597:

Grayclay.4579:

snip.

I should have clarified my comments with classes. I am assuming the best roaming build for each class in a solo setting. For some reason I mix and match the HoT and core names. I believe that for solo roaming berserk is better than core warrior and that makes it tied for second.

Additionally Mesmer is only strong when the opponent has decided to commit to the fight. The long standing strategy of I’m just going to walk away still applies to all but the best condition mesmers out there roaming.

Also my ranking does not factor in the “oh kitten zerg Inc” factor very much. For me it more comes down to ability to take on outnumbered fights instead of the escapability aspect hence why I’ve placed thief lower.

The “oh kitten zerg inc” is an important part of roaming builds. I could without a doubt build to have more sustain and last longer in a 1v1 or small group fight but I’d have to sacrifice my escape ability and end up being a free bag for any passing zerg. There is a reason roaming builds and dueling builds aren’t always the same thing.

Puck.9612:

It’s still definitely a factor for me. But I just don’t value it to a huge extent. It’s fairly well expressed within my ranking anyways. Necromancer can’t get away that easily which really drops it down. Scrapper, Mesmer, warrior, rev and druid all have mechanisms for escape within their builds which contributes to them being good roamers.

Did the warrior buffs in this patch make them more viable, or have they always been decent roamers?

I love the engi/scrapper for roaming.
You can get good mobility, sustain, burst, stealth… and all the complexity and versatility of the engi class.

And what is best. When a zerg comes, you just need to change a few utilities to tag along and then go off on your own…

Engi is just so adaptable, makes a great roamer.

I miss the old days of DD ele roaming. I still love the fluidity of ele gameplay, but tempest just kills it too much now, and the core ele is just under-performing now in face of all Especs power creep.

Grayclay.4579:

Did the warrior buffs in this patch make them more viable, or have they always been decent roamers?

I’m bias cause I’ve been roaming on mine recently. But they’re viable for solo roaming at least. Probably fall off at larger numbers unless you go group support though. Check out the warrior forum, a bunch of videos have been put up in the last week. Shameless plug for my own of course.

I mostly use Ele D/D for roaming.

Celestial Arcane Power build for 2-3 man roaming with aura heals.
Shaman/Apoth Perplexity for ultimate troll solo roaming.
Knights/Valk S/D fresh air Aura Share for 4-7 man roaming.

All run tempest.

Grayclay.4579:

DeceiverX.8361:

Scrapper is definitely the best. Mesmer is the best duelist where both parties commit. Even then, chrono’s mobility is quite good. I’d probably have to agree that druid comes next, though I think it shines the most in groups of 2 or 3, and then falls flat beyond that point.
Next I’d honestly put D/D ele. Assuming you run remotely durable. There are some builds which are literally unkillable without a 2v1, though opposing sustain might be enough to perpetuate the fight; depends on composition.

I think core warrior and guardian are bottom-of-the-barrel. Too many passive defenses for them to land their essential burst, not enough range/punishing effects, and simply low control compared to most elites.

I’d argue thief stands somewhat in the middle of the list. It’s good, but it really only should be winning deliberate/committed fights to the top-tier dueling professions if it’s either completely kitted out to beat them, or simply there’s a huge skill disparity.

Interesting that you say that, considering the amount of hate D/D ele gets on here. I think its more-so the lack of kill power, because even in sPvP, D/x ele is durable af. Are you talking Power Scrapper? I like ele/mes better thematically, but I’ve seen so many scrappers get away with so much stuff….

Also, interesting that you say core warrior is the worst, considering the poster above you said it’s tied for 2nd best. Was watching a montage earlier with a zerk GS/Rifle doing 13k crits.

The ele (speaking tempest ofc) is so durable that it can sustain through an opponent quite often. I’ve found instances of beefy elementalists whittling down groups of 3 and 4 players playing aggressive builds just enough to slowly down and kill them. Stacking tons of might can compensate nicely for a lack of power, and Air/Fire skills do absolutely crazy amounts of damage.

Scrapper is good no matter what build. Power, condi, nomad’s… it doesn’t matter. It has raw numbers and enough just straight-overpowered defenses with huge damage coefficients to go toe-to-toe with literally anything and win if played within a reasonable skill bracket. I’ve killed a bunch, but I can genuinely tell you the ones I have killed have been both bad players and on the build-side squishier scrappers.

I say core warrior being bottom-picks because even the core Warrior can’t get away with things like Killshot nukes against even remotely competent players unless they run a build like full stances just for the single attack and typically get lucky, and even then they’ve burned everything after going into a fight weak to potentially whiff a very predictable skill. I typically find myself only dying to warriors when I make pretty big missteps or get jumped in an outnumbered situation, where even then most of the problems extend from the other player and not the warrior. The Berserker on the other hand is a very powerful spec which I’d put towards the middle depending on matchup and build. Taunt and chain CC with no windup animation on Gun Flame, and Decapitate ignoring dodges (albeit a bug) make for some difficult encounters. That said, builds like tempest and scrapper with projectile hate and tons of defenses will kill them without issue.

Edit:
Condi Berserker is also absolutely ridiculous, but again, this is berserker-specific.

Warrior is quite strong roaming as you can prop up its still relatively weak sustain with runes and sigils that aren’t available in spvp. At my level of play (higher than average) I feel little to no fear fighting another power spec of any class 1v1, and I’m dangerous to some condi specs despite having next to no condi clear. However guildies who have tried my build have had much less success so how much Warrior is infact viable and how much is me having mained it for better than a year now I don’t know.

So yes warrior is viable for roaming, even good at it. But you need to be proficient at warrior and be using the right build.

My build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJAQNAR8enMdAdhglkCmhAEliltAD5vFACdvX2O7oVJGU6aBA-T1BEABap8LR1fi7iA0muBy3fYLlgA8EAIFgZCjA-w

My twitch page has quite a few highlights of that build in action, both pre and post adrenal health buff.

As an aside, there’s a ton of flexibility in WvW as a whole, though, where almost anything and everything can work.

I run signet D/D thief with massive success, and that’s widely considered as the least-usable build in the game in sPvP. The stat allocation and diversity lets most things work.

My rankings are for the most part subjective and based on criteria such as consistency, hard counters, mathematical advantages, and lastly, difficulty for any individual player. Everyone has different styles and difficulty becomes very subjective, so I try to keep that one primarily on the build-level.

Overall, WvW balance is by miles better than sPvP, so it often boils down to what you’d rather play rather than what’s “good” in accordance to some optimization based on the confines of certain stat distributions and scaling in accordance to a very strict type of game mode (capture, hold, and don’t die).

There’s definitely cheese and blatantly overpowered things in WvW, but the overall scope of diversity is quite large relative to the rest of the game.

DeceiverX.8361:

As an aside, there’s a ton of flexibility in WvW as a whole, though, where almost anything and everything can work.

I run signet D/D thief with massive success, and that’s widely considered as the least-usable build in the game in sPvP. The stat allocation and diversity lets most things work.

My rankings are for the most part subjective and based on criteria such as consistency, hard counters, mathematical advantages, and lastly, difficulty for any individual player. Everyone has different styles and difficulty becomes very subjective, so I try to keep that one primarily on the build-level.

Overall, WvW balance is by miles better than sPvP, so it often boils down to what you’d rather play rather than what’s “good” in accordance to some optimization based on the confines of certain stat distributions and scaling in accordance to a very strict type of game mode (capture, hold, and don’t die).

There’s definitely cheese and blatantly overpowered things in WvW, but the overall scope of diversity is quite large relative to the rest of the game.

I’ll have to agree with this general sentiment. I boosted a Ranger with the recent update, and used my celebration stuff + tomes to get a warrior to 80, so the only classes left to level are a Thief and Guardian. I can hop on any of the other 7 classes, and with subpar equipment and no real guidance behind my build, find and beat people while I roam. I think a lot of discussion going on the forums is implying “duel” esque situations, whereas roaming is basically like ganking in EvE Online. Your opponents are all variety of builds, skill levels, and even experience levels, and with that much diversity it’s pretty easy to find a fight you can win.

The only struggle I have is that my tiny wallet balance prevents me from enjoying the majority of Condi builds without dipping down to rare equipment.

If I had to rate professions myself just based on my own experience, it’d be:

1. Chronomancer
2. Scrapper
3. Ranger
3. Tempest
5. Warrior
6. Thief
7. Rest

Diversity does not really equal balance, due to the choice of gear, runes and food/oil, rather than being stuck with a limited selection of Runes/Amulets you get in sPvP.
When it comes to small scale or dueling, power creep and OP builds/setups are apparent.

Thief is good at resetting fights and ganking, alot like their role in PvP really, but in WvW you can be easily one-shot as a squishy class.

And vice versa. A glass thief can one-shot a glass reaper, and a glass reaper can one-shot a glass thief. And in many instances, having the fine-grain control over builds helps classes deviate away from needing to be fully glassy while retaining damage. I’ve personally one-shotted a few thieves on my ele – something preposterous in sPvP.

If you want to play glassy, you better be ready to avoid taking damage. The only major imbalance I’m aware of in WvW is Dire+Perplexity, which honestly never should have existed to begin with.

CrimsonNeonite.1048:

WvW is not really balanced due to the choice of gear, runes and food/oil, rather than being stuck with a limited selection of Runes/Amulets you get in sPvP.
When it comes to small scale or dueling, power creep and OP builds/comps are apparent.

Thief is good at resetting fights and ganking, alot like their role in PvP really, but in WvW you can be easily one-shot as a squishy class.

I get that sPvP is balanced in that everyone has the same starting stats, but given the relatively stricter constraints around the actual play, i.e. small arenas 5v5, limited stat distribution, I’d say that its going to inherently have a more skewed distribution of power than WvW, where you have more diversity and a larger playing field.

That’s why last season you saw chill shout necros and trap guards in every single match. Of course, there is a different set of variables driving what is powerful in each game type, but the natural open-endedness of WvW is always going to promote diversity because a much larger variety of situations occur, meaning that a much larger proportion of the large amount of skills each class has can be useful.

For actual roaming Druid is > anything. Druid is over tuned to the point of it really needing a nerf. Something needs to give as it’s either far too much mobility, or cleansing, or healing, or CC. I think what needs to be nerfed is having “Solar Beam” being non reflectable and only a few blocks working against it. I don’t like having AA’s without counter play.