Guild Wars 2

All I see projectile spam. what happen to the head bashing, blood quirting close range combat.

I don’t think I’m playing the same game. Most of the QQ on this board is due to D/D Eles and Thieves (and I’m pretty sure they aren’t crying about Shortbow).

Sudden idea:
Remove AE limits for melee only.

If 15 people are standing in a tight clump, ranged AE can only hit 5 of them, like now, but let melee AE hit all targets with no limits.

That might really revitalize the melee in this game.

Xirin.8593:

I don’t think I’m playing the same game. Most of the QQ on this board is due to D/D Eles and Thieves (and I’m pretty sure they aren’t crying about Shortbow).

That’s for their hit-and-run ability, especially in smaller fights. For major zerg on zerg fighting, which is most of the battles in most of the tiers, melee is a good way to go, “Hey, what happened? I just suddenly died.” The blob tends to punish anyone who runs out in front. Melee does still work in organized fighting when you can get 15+ melees to all charge at once but for pugs it’s all about ranged.

Slamz.5376:

Xirin.8593:

I don’t think I’m playing the same game. Most of the QQ on this board is due to D/D Eles and Thieves (and I’m pretty sure they aren’t crying about Shortbow).

That’s for their hit-and-run ability, especially in smaller fights. For major zerg on zerg fighting, which is most of the battles in most of the tiers, melee is a good way to go, “Hey, what happened? I just suddenly died.” The blob tends to punish anyone who runs out in front. Melee does still work in organized fighting when you can get 15+ melees to all charge at once but for pugs it’s all about ranged.

OP should have been more specific. This sounds like the open-field zerg-dancing push/fall-back. Still, I see plenty of zergs physically clashing into each other. Maybe this is a match-up specific issue?

All I ever see are guards and wars

Hammer warriors are one of the most deadly things you can face in a zerg fight
Imagine 10 hammer warriors charge into your zerg (with their zerg behind)
They will all launch a 2 second stun that will hit up to 50 people (5 per warrior), they will use an AOE knockback that will break your zergball up, they have access to a single target 2 second knockdown – all the while putting out decent damage.

Keep in mind that melee weapons do roughly 5x the damage as their ranged counterparts. So any time you can get in melee combat you will kill the other side faster.

If you are the ONLY melee person in a zergfight, yeah its going to suck.

Slamz.5376:

Sudden idea:
Remove AE limits for melee only.

If 15 people are standing in a tight clump, ranged AE can only hit 5 of them, like now, but let melee AE hit all targets with no limits.

That might really revitalize the melee in this game.

People would just run entire zergs of melee then.

You live in a tier with a weak meta, melee is very strong.

^ good zergs use a lot of melee currently already.

I really don’t see anything wrong with melee in a zerg situation. The only time melee doesn’t work is when you cant run into the enemy. And that’s all fine.

SundayTrash.9562:

All I see projectile spam. what happen to the head bashing, blood squirting close range combat.

Run straight at the enemy. You’ll find what you’re looking for.

I don’t know what World are you playing in. But in euro tier #1 the melee train has been the meta. Several hammer warriors in the front line. And really those type of warriors are okay. They are powerful.

Nerfing the ranged AoE would bring even more power to the melee train and soon we would see nothing else. You want a mono culture instead of diversity?

SundayTrash.9562:

All I see projectile spam. what happen to the head bashing, blood quirting close range combat.

Sory did you not see thr 50 plus zergball rushing through you comprising of 75% guardians and warriors mashing their ‘1’ melee skill?

Yes and its so unfair that Anet didnt give every class a ranged weapon or two!

Oh wait they did.

I want necro’s dagger buffed to deal AoE attack by default.

1) Roll Hammer Warrior
2) Run headfirst into zerg
3) ??
4) Profit

Slamz.5376:

Sudden idea:
Remove AE limits for melee only.

If 15 people are standing in a tight clump, ranged AE can only hit 5 of them, like now, but let melee AE hit all targets with no limits.

That might really revitalize the melee in this game.

1. Form a party of 8 zerker warriors
2. Get a friendly thief to give you stealth
3. Pop endure pain, whirlwind through a 40 man zerg
4. ???
5. GG

Paradoxine.8192:

Slamz.5376:

Sudden idea:
Remove AE limits for melee only.

If 15 people are standing in a tight clump, ranged AE can only hit 5 of them, like now, but let melee AE hit all targets with no limits.

That might really revitalize the melee in this game.

1. Form a party of 8 zerker warriors
2. Get a friendly thief to give you stealth
3. Pop endure pain, whirlwind through a 40 man zerg
4. ???
5. GG

Isn’t whirlwind an evade? Why would you waste endure pain on that?

Caliban.3176:

Paradoxine.8192:

Slamz.5376:

Sudden idea:
Remove AE limits for melee only.

If 15 people are standing in a tight clump, ranged AE can only hit 5 of them, like now, but let melee AE hit all targets with no limits.

That might really revitalize the melee in this game.

1. Form a party of 8 zerker warriors
2. Get a friendly thief to give you stealth
3. Pop endure pain, whirlwind through a 40 man zerg
4. ???
5. GG

Isn’t whirlwind an evade? Why would you waste endure pain on that?

Endure pain lasts 4 seconds. Whirlwind IIRC (I basically never play warrior, though I do have an 80) will last a couple seconds max. A 40 man zerg can do an awful lot of dps and It’s in your interest to maximise your survivability especially given you have zerker gear. If we want to be pedantic then yes, pop endure pain after whirlwind then 100B or spam 1, but It was an example, come on.

SundayTrash.9562:

All I see projectile spam. what happen to the head bashing, blood quirting close range combat.

Have you tried a guardian? Melee types can be insanely effective when you’re playing with a coordinated group. Wade in with a quick disruptive strike and GTFO gather your wits and cooldowns and go right back in.

Granted melee is very dangerous (and I die a lot doing it) but the thrill when you split a zergball or run down that key player holding everyone together can’t be beat.

Also:

You live in a tier with a weak meta, melee is very strong.

Pretty much this.

If you’re seeing only battles made of 2 zergs trowing each other projectiles and nothing else, you’re in a bad/unskilled/boring tier (or group, facing a similar bad group, at least).

When game gets serious, it’s all about who manage to drop the meele inc bomb first and better.

… Or who knows how to strafe from red circles then bomb drop

Those with tunnel vision always lose. Because they are bad.

If you are sick of projectile spam move to a higher tier server, as in T1NA the most common fights are between guilds who run heavy trains. There are a few guilds who do use ranged very effectively (i.e. TW ele-nec cluster kitten), but guilds such as MERC, KnT, FoO, Choo and WM run CC trains that are melee based

Also I have to note that running a zerk warrior frontliner is dumb, as you’re just going to rally the other side when you melt to AoE. Sure you’re getting good burst, but you can’t dps when you’re dead. Leave full zerk for CoF please

Tarkus.4109:

If you are sick of projectile spam move to a higher tier server, as in T1NA the most common fights are between guilds who run heavy trains. There are a few guilds who do use ranged very effectively (i.e. TW ele-nec cluster kitten), but guilds such as MERC, KnT, FoO, Choo and WM run CC trains that are melee based

I can confirm this. In NA Tier 1 its common when running into enemy zerg your going to run into one of two things, either a bunch of warriors and guardians busting stright through to your backline or a bunch of Necros dropping marks on you.

I play a mostly tanky D/D thief, and I’m pretty useless in a mass battle at killing a unique target because if I openly charge in I just get chain stunned and gang kittened with AoE. I can often help my team mates, though … I stealth toward the tightest mass of enemy, Daggerstorm in a u-shape heading back toward my group, and then use Blinding Powder and Hide in Shadows to slink off to heal. If I wait until most of the enemy are already engaged one way or another and if I trait for heal-while-stealthed, there’s usually enough confusion (not referring to the ability) in play to make it work repeatedly. Sometimes I can even peel off a Death Blossom or two before bailing. Worst case I kitten off a bunch of the enemy and draw WAY more DPS than it takes to kill me, thus reducing the overall damage to my group.

And yes, I’m fairly decent strafing with a shortbow, but being tanky I don’t contribute as much that way.

frostshade.3617:

All I ever see are guards and wars

Sure you do.

sostronk.8167:

I can confirm this. In NA Tier 1 its common when running into enemy zerg your going to run into one of two things, either a bunch of warriors and guardians busting stright through to your backline or a bunch of Necros dropping marks on you.

Oh so they purposely limit themselves in NA T1 by doing either or?

Because in EU T3 a bunch of guardians and warriors will slam right into you while dozens of wells are dropped at their feet. And for effect there is usually half a dozen feedback bubbles up on the same location. Sometimes you cant really tell, it may be that a supernova got randomly created at the same location by pure chance. GW2 and RNG you know.

sostronk.8167:

Tarkus.4109:

If you are sick of projectile spam move to a higher tier server, as in T1NA the most common fights are between guilds who run heavy trains. There are a few guilds who do use ranged very effectively (i.e. TW ele-nec cluster kitten), but guilds such as MERC, KnT, FoO, Choo and WM run CC trains that are melee based

I can confirm this. In NA Tier 1 its common when running into enemy zerg your going to run into one of two things, either a bunch of warriors and guardians busting stright through to your backline or a bunch of Necros dropping marks on you.

My next toon is gonna be a PVT Warrior hammer just because i can.

Urrid.4593:

SundayTrash.9562:

All I see projectile spam. what happen to the head bashing, blood quirting close range combat.

Have you tried a guardian? Melee types can be insanely effective when you’re playing with a coordinated group. Wade in with a quick disruptive strike and GTFO gather your wits and cooldowns and go right back in.

Granted melee is very dangerous (and I die a lot doing it) but the thrill when you split a zergball or run down that key player holding everyone together can’t be beat.

Also:

TY, came for this, was thinking I was gonna leave dissapointed

I disagree and I am against all suggestions made in this thread .

I was in OP’s shoe when I was pugging with commanders. Then, my guild turned into a serious WvW guild. Now, I use more melee builds than ever before.

There is a huge difference between the two. PuGs and guilds. PuGs are just militia men. Militia wants to play it safe. You can’t get anymore safe than playing with range. WvW guilds are the elite soldiers. It is hard to play melee alone. However, if you have someone next to you meleeing with you, you will survive longer. WvW guilds knows that going melee is much more damaging than staying in range.

Join a serious WvW guild. Join the top WvW guild in your server and you will see WvW in a different light.

In the SoR/JQ/BG fights, melee is everywhere. It’s high damage and quick execution make it the preferred medium to killing things. There are several places where it shows up:

*I use a staff necromancer, and while I don’t generally melee myself, I do use Spectral Grasp a lot. Whether chasing someone down, pulling someone off a wall, or in a zerg vs. zerg fight, I like to pop Spectral Grasp to yank one enemy into melee range. Then the meleers (guardians and thieves mostly) focus on that stunned + chilled enemy, killing him almost instantly. Also, if in an organized group going for a push, I’ll lay down Spectral Wall to give an entire zerg protection. Then the meleers jump ahead and lay waste.

*In more organized zergs, there will be several “Push” guardians. What they’ll do is rush forward with stability, then stagger their walls of reflection. This allows their team to rush forward behind the safety of the wall, and in response the other zerg has to run back. While doing this, the guardians melee to death anything that crosses the wall. Little note: here is when I like to use Spectral Grasp. Doing this over and over again, these 3 or 4 guardians can push back an enemy zerg quite far, even when grossly outnumbered.

*If there are several mesmers in the group, the use of Veil + Mass Invisibility can be outright deadly. MI has a 10 target limit instead of 5, and Veil is a wall so it has a limitless target limit. What several mesmers will do is lay down 2 or 3 veils and use MI while someone uses swiftness. Then, when the entire zerg has stealth for 12 seconds or so, they wall run into the middle of an enemy group and just raise hell.

*Portal. Often times a mesmer will squeak their way past a defensive wall, then set up a portal. Immediately afterward, 20 or so melee classes will rush in using all of their burst skills. It can melt enemy zerges in seconds. The mesmers will often run in and use Blurred Frenzy and spam clones, exploding them for mass confusion.

*Ambush thieves will often join a zerg, and their primary job is to find any troublesome class (skirting mesmer, pushing guardian, the guy manning siege), and then hit them with everything they’ve got. They use something like Mug to close the distance and hit hard, follow up with backstab + heartseeker, ending with a stealth stomp. Sometimes even downing the enemy player is enough, since it creates an opening for teammates. These ambush thieves are worse in WvW than they are in sPVP, since they can come from anywhere and have the ridiculous DPS of zerker gear.

And those are the main ways I see melee being used. There are, of course, zerg balls and melee trains and all that, too.

Paradoxine.8192:

Caliban.3176:

Paradoxine.8192:

Slamz.5376:

Sudden idea:
Remove AE limits for melee only.

If 15 people are standing in a tight clump, ranged AE can only hit 5 of them, like now, but let melee AE hit all targets with no limits.

That might really revitalize the melee in this game.

1. Form a party of 8 zerker warriors
2. Get a friendly thief to give you stealth
3. Pop endure pain, whirlwind through a 40 man zerg
4. ???
5. GG

Isn’t whirlwind an evade? Why would you waste endure pain on that?

Endure pain lasts 4 seconds. Whirlwind IIRC (I basically never play warrior, though I do have an 80) will last a couple seconds max. A 40 man zerg can do an awful lot of dps and It’s in your interest to maximise your survivability especially given you have zerker gear. If we want to be pedantic then yes, pop endure pain after whirlwind then 100B or spam 1, but It was an example, come on.

Well OP doesn’t really know how the game works right now. He is doing the linefighting thing still. I wouldn’t want him to try something new and then do it wrong.

(So yes, I was just being pedantic)

RamataKahn.4283:

frostshade.3617:

All I ever see are guards and wars

Sure you do.

Well I am a guardian so I run straight in to give the ezerg a big ole hug so yes I get too meet all you sexy wars and guardians mashing your 1 keys as I dive roll in circles around you never dieing