Guild Wars 2

Nighthawk.6453:

I guess, games you mentioned doesn’t have half-non-target system, siege weapons, lots of mobs and NPC and that quality of tons of visual effects?

You clearly haven’t seen EVE or some of the other games out there. 1000+ man battles are perfectly possible, but require a very well made engine and network code.

The numbers in GW2 are not impressive. 50 vs 50 is the usual max, and at 20v20 you already start getting rendering issues, at 30v30 you start noticing lag, at a 3 way battle of roughly the same numbers, you won’t be doing anything besides auto attacking and spamming tab to look for invisible targets.

The game is hardly in a playable state with all this.

But thanks for keeping us updated on your progress, ArenaNet.

Cant take a pvp game serious when you cant see your enemies until your dead. Why the F#$% would they roll a game out with this flaw?

This is getting to the point where im considering dropping WvWvW until something is done about it… Its a vital part of the make up of WvWvW and for such a large issue to have come up and still be in launch… I don’t care what you say but its shocking.

Please fix rendering/visibility/culling of enemies on screen during altercations like this!!

Kindeller.3072:

This is getting to the point where im considering dropping WvWvW until something is done about it… Its a vital part of the make up of WvWvW and for such a large issue to have come up and still be in launch… I don’t care what you say but its shocking.

Please fix rendering/visibility/culling of enemies on screen during altercations like this!!

Lolz I actually came here to post for this very reason.

I had for a time not been too bothered by the rendering issue.

However some guilds with regards to the rendering issues use mesmer portals to devastating effect. They have become very good at exploiting it.

To the extent that by the time everything loads half your team has wiped. You simply can’t operate under those conditions when your part of the generic zerg. It simply makes you want to hide in your keep, knowing that if you venture out an invader is liable to pop outta know where.

Players exploiting a bug need to be dealt with separately from the bug itself.

To many organised teams know, that if they zerg through a portal together, they will have a certain period of invisibility to use as an advantage.

Is the exploit? or tactics/strategy?

Romerio.8763:

Players exploiting a bug need to be dealt with separately from the bug itself.

To many organised teams know, that if they zerg through a portal together, they will have a certain period of invisibility to use as an advantage.

Is the exploit? or tactics/strategy?

For now its a legitimate strategy, for Anet this can hardly be ‘working as intended’.

I’m actually starting to learn towards they need to look at mesmer portals if they cant solve the rendering issue. I actually didn’t want to single mesmer’s out but seeing what guilds can do with the rendering/portal combo. I just got sick of the repair cost alone….

In DAOC we used to joke that we knew we were going to be attacked by the Albs (I was Mid/Guin) when everything locked up for a second and lagged to hell. It was a sure sign we were about to get into it lol.

Didn’t bother me then, probably wouldn’t bother me now.

I’d rather lag for a second as the game renders and then see everyone with enough time to make decisions.

my 2 cents

Just rendered this (sorry for the poor quality i used l33t Movie maker skillz and no idea how to upload 720p videos, even though that was the resolution of the video at rendering in MM o.O)

It shows the issue in Lions arch.. players disappearing and reappearing aswell as a clip of me getting molested in the rear by an invisible zerg that only appears towards the end… note the red tags are all dead for the majority of the video its only when i die it renders the rest of the alive enemies that where killing me :/

Edit: turns out it was just processing 720p options ignore i do have leet youtubes skillz :p

Haha, MajorKong, I laughed quite hard at that screen shot. I just chalked it up to my slow computer, but I’m glad to see there’s something that can be done about the invisible character issue.

Nighthawk.6453:

I guess, games you mentioned doesn’t have half-non-target system, siege weapons, lots of mobs and NPC and that quality of tons of visual effects?

You gotta be kidding me. EvE’s PvP information blows GW2’s out of the water. And it handles ten times the players with ease.

“This is what will kill WvWvW. We can’t fight an enemy we can’t see.”

Art of War?

I jumped down against what I perceived to be only three or four enemies… but when I started spinning around with my great sword… I hit about six invisible enemies. As soon as I saw them, they saw me and wrecked me.

This absolutely absurd design/programming decision to just plain not render enemies on your screen in a PvP game makes ArenaNet look like complete fools. All of the tens of millions spend on this game are going down the toilet unless this is fixed in a matter of days, along with the massed hacks, botting, sound bugs, crash bugs, etc.

One of the fools/programmers themselves coming into this thread and acting like they haven’t a clue how to fix this game-breaker and that it’s not even a big deal are losing ArenaNet all of the goodwill they had generated in an otherwise pretty darn fun game.

“We must always balance our time on the forums with our time spent working on the game. If we go silent for a while it’s generally because we’re busy working hard so that the next time we post we can have something substantial to tell you.”

It looks like you spending more time on farming/grinding “issues” than on real problems. “Culling” existed from day one, and yet nothing done.

Honestly, the invisible “culling” or whatever it’s called, player loading issue, is also a major problem for me in ANY main city areas as well as WvW. Obviously in WvW it’s a bigger deal as you can end up without any knowledge of forces approaching, but it’s still even annoying just running around LA and not seeing people pop up.. at all :P

I sincerely hope ANet can solve this issue – because if it takes a LONG time to fix it, I honestly can’t see people sticking around long-term (At least in terms of WvW).

it does suck when the enemy clearly sees me and is hitting me but i can’t see it instead i am forced to hit or shoot in the air and hope that i hit something

Either you’re all quite new EVE players or you’ve forgotten about the many many years of hell when it came to trying to play in large fleet battles. General performance was bad enough (10 minute loading times if jumping into a busy system… if you even loaded at all), crash to desktops, server crashes, etc. You then had the Age of the Desync, where the server thought you were one place and the client another, and there was no way to get back in sync without relogging.

And of course, the players absuing things to make them worse. Everyone dropping 5 drones to cause the enemy take much longer to load, dropping canisters everywhere, etc.

WvW may have an issue loading enough players, but EVE was far FAR worse for many years of its life. Can’t comment on it today as I no longer play it. And the big difference is that in EVE you lose everything on you (ship, weapons, etc) while in WvW you just get a repair bill.

It’s still annoying as hell though.

gotten a bit worse last few days dunno whats been up if you guys are tinkering with the system or somethin. just lettin you know

Arson.4189:

gotten a bit worse last few days dunno whats been up if you guys are tinkering with the system or somethin. just lettin you know

Yep. Last two updates have made it awful. The very last update tonight has made WvW unplayable.

Yeah, it was pretty crappy tonight in SM after the patch. Invisible invaders everywhere! Makes it very hard to defend the place.

It was odd, though. Usually I only see this in SM when we’ve got invaders inside, or in an area with a very large zerg, but tonight I was in Lion’s Arch and also noticed the player culling, only there weren’t very many people there. Strange.

The player culling is getting so incredibly bad, that now once all the enemies disappear, they stay disappeared. Even my allies disappear and running away from the battle and back in doesn’t fix it. You have to log off and then back into the queue.

This is epic fail.

On DEs with higher bots participation, I learn to drop AOE or cast in the air where bots are hitting before I see any enemy model.

I want to see enemy clearer than the bots around.

After the Oct/07 patch, invisibility/render culling issue is much worse.

It’s usually triggered after two huge armies clash. All enemies are rendered invisible, teammates are invisible and most NPCs are rendered invisible(e.g Supply camp guards). Dying and respawning does not fix the problem.

Relogging or restarting will fix it till the next big zerg clash.

There are 3 invaders in this screenshot. Maybe 2, I fired an overcharged shot but god only knows if they were even hit, combat log didn’t even catch it.
This is after half an hour of a siege with 20 on defense, I would think more than enough time to have loaded everyone, or whatever may be the problem.

Thenoob.1480:

There are 3 invaders in this screenshot. Maybe 2, I fired an overcharged shot but god only knows if they were even hit, combat log didn’t even catch it.
This is after half an hour of a siege with 20 on defense, I would think more than enough time to have loaded everyone, or whatever may be the problem.

If you didn’t see damage, you didn’t hit them, the culling is visual, it still registers everything server side.

Well last night I logged off quite frustrated at the state of WvWvW after dying 4 times in a row to invisible enemies. Between that and thieves taking like 2 seconds to render when they leave stealth my opinion of your world pvp model has been tarnished.

Its not even about dying (this is expected in large scale battles), but I think 5 pages in I don’t need to explain. I hope you fix it without breaking the game.

They haven’t fixed it, according to everyone else’ post as of the 7 Oct. update its gotten worse <.<

Zintair.1987:

In DAOC we used to joke that we knew we were going to be attacked by the Albs (I was Mid/Guin) when everything locked up for a second and lagged to hell. It was a sure sign we were about to get into it lol.

Didn’t bother me then, probably wouldn’t bother me now.

I’d rather lag for a second as the game renders and then see everyone with enough time to make decisions.

my 2 cents

The same thing would happen in Darkfall. All of a sudden the whole server would start to lag and we knew that someone was about to be attacked.

The rendering problem in WvWvW is making it unplayable. I haven’t logged on for about a week now and I just keep randomly checking the forums hoping that they fix the problem.

Since patch I’ve actually noticed that this has gotten worse.

Typically it’d only happen when fighting large groups, but more recently if there is even a zerg in the vicinity, targets directly near me don’t render… even while dealing damage back and forth to each other.

Anyone else notice this?

came back after this update and it is definitely worse.
I lost my weapon models, on all weapon sets. Switched to warhorn for the group speed, back to longbow and it didn’t show up. the skills were there and I’d make the attack animation but the weapon itself was gone. switched to main weapon and it too was gone. was like that for 10 mins or so but wasnt a big deal. but then i noticed i could only see about half my team at times. Still couldnt see the enemies of course.
So it was me, weaponless, fighting with three visible people in my group vs the enemy group of invisible players.
This is just getting worse and worse and will probably be the reason i end up quitting this game. Almost all the other people i joined with already have.
Get it together Anet.

I wonder how long I can sit here and still not see my own allies.

Having the same issue in WvW — only started after the patch today. Players would eventually become invisible. Can’t tell if it was over time, but when 30+ players started consolidating at 1 place I was starting to notice I was targeting nothing but able to still attack (with the damage numbers popping up). I had to stop playing since this is quite game breaking when I can’t see the enemy who is close enough for me to attack.

Using an ATI 6990M.

Same here

Image of what is happening: http://postimage.org/image/h9f1p4tht/
(Me targeting a Sentry Veteran)

Only happened after the recent Patch on 7/OCT/2012

Various chat on the Map and Team Channel on Sea Farers rest about it with people logging out

Added a pic I took 10 minutes ago, annoyingly enough the fact we couldn’t even see what was coming towards us had us losing stonemist castle about 5 mins after this was taken.. doesn’t really matter though.. the real problem is how poor a gaming experience this ‘feature’ is … it’s not fun to play.

erm.. silly question here but um..

erm.. silly question here but um..why not just make them all look the same? you really dont need unique armor sets in wvw to see other ppl? looking cool is important to alot of ppl I know.. but honestly does your enemy need to look sexy in a crowd of 200 ppl?
better yet, make them all Asura and we’ll be even more motivated to kill those little arrogant kittens

invisable players seems to be getting worse ive ive been attacked and slowly killed by invisable players now over 10-20 seconds i can see the invisable projecties “arrows” flying though the air hitting me

not just the instant invisable zerg killed in 1-2 seconds then i can see them type

Krohlm Spinebreaker.2708:

why not just make them all look the same?

This question we keep asking developers for weeks. All races * All professions * 2 genders = not a lot of default models.

No response.

The flood of people that are about to quit because of this is rather large.

please fix soon .

Sunduck.2450:

Krohlm Spinebreaker.2708:

why not just make them all look the same?

This question we keep asking developers for weeks. All races * All professions * 2 genders = not a lot of default models.

No response.

ANet, let the players decide, give us an option that will reduce the amount of loaded stuff to a minimum.

Race, profession, sex and weapon is enough for me.

I prefer to see 10 bad-looking characters than the one that looks good …

For a game based on world vs. world pvp, current performance is unacceptable. Battles where you can actually see less than 10 players at a time are not epic in the slightest bit.

People are patiently waiting for the problems to be corrected, but the ADD generation’s patience for this sort of thing grows shorter by the week. I’m not all that interested in Planteside 2, but that’s what people in my 1000+ member guild are starting to talk about, but I really hope it doesn’t come to that.

Suggestion: Can Anet at least create circles on the ground representing enemy players even though their character and actions are not rendered? It would hopefully load faster and allow us to fight and invisible army.

I’ve already had a bunch of people I play with quit and go back to our old game because of the performance issues here.
And Daylos is right, this is unacceptable. I got this game for WvW, I love WvW because its a new type of pvp.
I could handle the lack of rendering on invis army zergs because I could hang back for 5-10 seconds till they loaded. I was annoyed with the mesmers portaling in entire armies to take advantage of the rendering issue, but that could have been an easy fix.
But this new problem is just getting out of hand. I cant see enemies no matter how long i wait, I cant see allies, I cant see my weapons, and I cant load npc’s. Add in the fact that it is now a larger problem in the PvE environment and Anets problem more then just doubled.
And unless this problem is fixed fast, and i mean at least before next weeks match-ups, Anet is going to see a MASSIVE decline in player activity.
I mean, why bother playing a whole new week of WvW when i wont be able to see anyone other then myself on those first inital pushes to take orbs or camps/towers.

I think it is worth mentioning that also NPC models fail to load.
I experienced this after player models started to fail loading. After 5 sec allied models failed to load.
I teleported back to base and I saw that the merchants were not there, but if I clicked on the spot the usually are I was able to sell and buy.

This issue is server wide, not just WvWvW.
It’s ridiculous seeing models of players load only within like 300 range

(Total overkill self made gaming rig here, with cpu/gpu/memory load below 25% at any time. So please fix this on your end Anet as you did screw it up there this time)

If needed, I’ll make a video or two. But I just want to say (and I’m sure it’s been stated) that this is throughout the game. I thought, “what area is really barren as a good test location?” and came with Fields of Ruin in the Ebonhawke area. So I ran around the outer circle of the Stronghold of Ebonhawke to see what would happen.

The first round I saw maybe 4 players in the area. 2 of those players didn’t appear until I was right up on them. Also an NPC worker didn’t appear until I was right on them.

The second round I didn’t notice anything.

The third round, another new player appeared right when I was upon her.

Now .. this area is extremely low populated and low assets (I would assume). And since my system doesn’t matter I can only assume that this is a server-side issue.

My system is very top-of-the-line as is my 50MB symmetric bandwidth.

What I really find interesting in my observations and in so many of the videos made is that the PETS always render and quickly. A good example is to run into the Trading Post of Lion’s Arch and notice how the pets show up for all of the players who don’t show up until seconds/minutes later. Then leave the TP, go down the stairs, and observe the lizard pet that appears on the right building where the 3 NPCs will eventually appear. I can literally go back and forth over and over and reproduce the same results. Why are the 3 NPCs not even rendering until later? (Even when no other players are around?)

Dear ArenaNet, I don’t care if you want to render stick figures in place of enemies, that is fine. Invisible enemies is NOT fine.

I just get to the WvW today, first time after the patch and I was very disappointed. I have heard people were saying that rendering has become much worse after the last patch, but today I have witnessed it by myself. Before the patch I had this problem also in the big fights, but it took about 10 seconds for enemies to render. Today I have stood into invisible battle for about 15 minutes and no one has rendered, even allies. It is really something horrible. With every patch Anet is fixing something minor and breaking something major. Why? I’m not going to go to the WvW until this is fixed, which will probably take another week. Thanks Anet for the great week you gave us.

@Macovan

Didn’t you know it’s the new game mode? check this thread

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Introducing-Guild-War-2-Invisible-10-8-update

*trollface*

Sunduck.2450:

Krohlm Spinebreaker.2708:

why not just make them all look the same?

This question we keep asking developers for weeks. All races * All professions * 2 genders = not a lot of default models.

No response.

This is not a fix and would cause me to leave GW2. All the other games have nice graphics and customisation without the ability of loosing great gameplay. The Invisible WvWvW thing will go. Its been working fine for me up until the 7th Oct. And Im sure it will go away again. If you kids were able to wait 48hours for a coder to get his head around it im sure we will get it the way we all want it.

Graphics and customisation is half the experiance in GW2. If you want garbage to look at, with some good game play hop over to Runescape and be gone with you