So, we see thread after thread about people that can’t counter what a thief throws out. This is compounded by the fact that it’s much harder to tell if a thief is for example speed hacking.
Given the amount of information that is handled client side and not server side a stealth speed hack is not impossible and it can easily be put down to stealth into Infiltrator’s Arrow or Shadow Return.
If for example a Guardian speed hacks, it’s obvious, they magically speed up and disappear from the fight. If a thief disappears, well, its because they used one of their skills.
This doesn’t include ways that hackers can use fly or teleport hacking all while hidden under stealth that can be rationalised with ‘skill’.
Its a real problem that really does happen , there are sites selling these abilities.
Sounds like your problem including your example has more to do with speed hacking, what does this have to do with thieves? Because you think they are hacking then it must be happening?
There are a lot of things that a Thief can use as a gap closer or distance maker, you can heartseeker in stealth for example to create a great amount of distance between you and the group you want to evade without actually breaking stealth (as long as you don’t hit anything), shadowstep carries a fair distance as a teleport/return move.
Without any kind of actual proof and just you words, this just comes over as just another complaint without substance.
What has it got to do with Thiefs?
The thief and it’s mechanics for example opens the class up to being exploited by 3rd party software and makes them impossible to detect and report by players.
Why? well because many hacks incorporate functions that exist in thief mechanics for example speed increase & teleporting which to an untrained eye could be seen as stealthing which in any other class would be easy to spot and report but a thief using the hacks well even if you did realise something wasn’t right you wouldn’t have sufficient time to keep the target to issue a report.
Sounds like your problem including your example has more to do with speed hacking, what does this have to do with thieves? Because you think they are hacking then it must be happening?
OP is saying you wouldn’t be able to tell if a thief is speed hacking or not. Yes, they have a lot of mobility skills. It’s also just as easy to stack stealth and speed away without being seen though.
Thanks Renny. In addition a thief’s stealth helps to camouflage any hacks.
This game has far less incidences of hacking then most and in all my hours of WvW, I have only experienced it twice, it was a necro and a ranger. Are there people hacking out there, sure, but who cares it has so little meaningful impact it is not worth dwelling on.
This is a valid point. And yes, the Thief is a profession that is more sensitive to hacking because the underlying design of the profession makes it harder to spot, and thus harder to get banned.
Observe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTTzzg7UBqo
Speed hacking, both Thieves. And they both made sure to use it as much as possible while in Stealth. So its harder to tell if they hacked or if its just Thieves being Thieves.
This is a valid point. And yes, the Thief is a profession that is more sensitive to hacking because the underlying design of the profession makes it harder to spot, and thus harder to get banned.
Observe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTTzzg7UBqoSpeed hacking, both Thieves. And they both made sure to use it as much as possible while in Stealth. So its harder to tell if they hacked or if its just Thieves being Thieves.
I saw a zoom, speed and flying hacker video on youtube with the guys account info clearly visible in the video. I emailed him ingame and his account hasn’t been banned. This was months ago. He was using the hack in WvW.
^ “This video contains content from The Orchard Music, SME, Warner Chappell, Sony ATV Publishing and INgrooves, one or more of whom have blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.”
Anyway what they really need is to add hacking as an in-game report option. Of course that would mean admitting that there’s hacks in their game.
This game has far less incidences of hacking then most and in all my hours of WvW, I have only experienced it twice, it was a necro and a ranger. Are there people hacking out there, sure, but who cares it has so little meaningful impact it is not worth dwelling on.
That’s assumption, the majority of hackers aren’t stupid and would use script not easily seen by ArenaNet.
Orbs were removed by ArenaNet because they couldn’t stop the flyhacking that was occurring.
By assuming hacking in small and meaningless is the same as giving up and encouraging more to to it.
This is a valid point. And yes, the Thief is a profession that is more sensitive to hacking because the underlying design of the profession makes it harder to spot, and thus harder to get banned.
Observe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTTzzg7UBqoSpeed hacking, both Thieves. And they both made sure to use it as much as possible while in Stealth. So its harder to tell if they hacked or if its just Thieves being Thieves.
That’s a great vid for 2 reasons:
1) Great use of d/d bunker ele.
2) Highlights my point PERFECTLY. Everything that human thief does could be described as great ability, up until the 22.55 min mark where this ‘skill’ is revealed. I am curious however, what server were these thief’s from?
That’s a great vid for 2 reasons:
1) Great use of d/d bunker ele.
2) Highlights my point PERFECTLY. Everything that human thief does could be described as great ability, up until the 22.55 min mark where this ‘skill’ is revealed. I am curious however, what server were these thief’s from?
Its from one of the Ele’s in the guild im in, great player. He makes vids from time to time.
When i saw the point being made in the OP this is what i thought off. Illustrates it perfectly.
As it is quite difficult to tell exactly when the Thief is hacking and when not because he usually does it while in stealth, and since Thieves are pretty mobile anyway, it leaves plenty of doubt and deniability. No other profession could cover such hacking up so well.
Ow and the server they were from was maybe mentioned in the video. ahem
I know that is not a real solution: But in the case of stealthed players hacking it is up to the allies (players from the same server) of this player to report. It won’t really change as long as players go around with a mindset: “as long as it benefits me, it’s okay”.
The same with bots and stuff. If players wouldn’t buy gold from other “sources”, as long those bots will find a way.
Not everything is up to the developer imho. Not everything can be covered by the developer. I am not saying by that, that ANet doesn’t have the responsibility to fix such issues. What I’m saying is that some matters can be to a great part dealt by the community itself.
I think the 2nd guy in the video may not have been cheeting.
If he was hacking, he would have done a very very bad job. (of course, if he needs hacks, he must be very bad^^). But the only time it seemed “obvios” may have been a huge lag. Other than that a thief can be that mobile…
I think the 2nd guy in the video may not have been cheeting.
If he was hacking, he would have done a very very bad job. (of course, if he needs hacks, he must be very bad^^). But the only time it seemed “obvios” may have been a huge lag. Other than that a thief can be that mobile…
I think its quite clear at the 22.55 min mark that the 2nd thief speed hacks. He covers a huge amount of distance in a short period of time. Remembering as well that at this stage the d/d bunker ele has an ally with him who doesn’t do a ‘slideshow’ at all. Up until that point I would have agreed with you.
I think the 2nd guy in the video may not have been cheeting.
If he was hacking, he would have done a very very bad job. (of course, if he needs hacks, he must be very bad^^). But the only time it seemed “obvios” may have been a huge lag. Other than that a thief can be that mobile…
I think its quite clear at the 22.55 min mark that the 2nd thief speed hacks. He covers a huge amount of distance in a short period of time. Remembering as well that at this stage the d/d bunker ele has an ally with him who doesn’t do a ‘slideshow’ at all. Up until that point I would have agreed with you.
Okay, I should have watched the whole vieo^^ But u’re right. In this moment the hack is obvious.
I would really like to see the vid.
I can tell you right now though that I can cover huge amount of space when running without any hacks of sorts.
You can see the video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTTzzg7UBqo (was originally posted by Terrahero.9358
at 22:55 u can see the thief using a hack, there is no doubt about that, because he is not in stealth at this moment…
You can see the video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTTzzg7UBqo (was originally posted by Terrahero.9358
at 22:55 u can see the thief using a hack, there is no doubt about that, because he is not in stealth at this moment…
No, you cannot see the video there, at least not if you live in the United States.
“This video contains content from The Orchard Music, SME, Warner Chappell, Sony ATV Publishing and INgrooves, one or more of whom have blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.” (was originally posted by Zephyrus.9680)
I don’t think I’ve seen the speed hack yet, but I do recall an ability that lets thieves move at +50%! in stealth. Haven’t tried this out but that’s above what swiftness provides.
I don’t think I’ve seen the speed hack yet, but I do recall an ability that lets thieves move at +50%! in stealth. Haven’t tried this out but that’s above what swiftness provides.
It’s bugged and only increases to 33% if out of combat and the 50% increase is over in combat speed (currently). However, stealth then shadowstep + HS spam can easily cover that amount of ground that quickly.
Do rangers have a skill that stealths them.. ive seen it a few times while fighting a ranger and he disappears??
The video is viewable. Can people not see from their mobiles? I did notice a comment that the utube poster couldn’t enable it due to copyright issues. You need to see from your computer.
(edited by SoPP.7034)
To the OP: Do you have a proposal? Do you want thieves removed? There’s no conclusion here.
To the OP: Do you have a proposal? Do you want thieves removed? There’s no conclusion here.
No conclusion? That’s short-sighted. If the communities informed and aware then it places ArenaNet in a position to be more proactive about it. An uploaded utube vid that used fraps is our best detection and report mechanism? Seriously?
As it stands for report mechnisms in game the d/d bunker ele in the vid could right click the thief (when hes not stealthed) and report for….. i dunno… botting?
This video contains content from The Orchard Music, SME, Warner Chappell, Sony ATV Publishing and INgrooves, one or more of whom have blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.
Please stop posting links that are broken or videos that contains © music that will automatically flag it…are you new to the “internets”?
Ups. It’s been discussed already, please read before posting.
It’s not a broken link, if you don’t have a work around for the internets then you can’t watch it.
The point is that if nobody in the US can watch the video…how do you expect Anet to watch it and see the problem being discussed?
Because ArenaNet is based only in the US? There are no free work arounds?
Result:
Unfortunately, this video is not available in Germany because it may contain music for which GEMA has not granted the respective music rights.
Folks, you are not doing your recordings any favour by adding proprietary music. I know I can use some proxy, but that usually involves severe quality degradation of what I can view (bad resolution , sub-par player software, bad performance; often all of that).
Do rangers have a skill that stealths them.. ive seen it a few times while fighting a ranger and he disappears??
Rangers have access to stealth in 3 ways.
1) Camoflague, a trait that kicks in at a certain level of health.
2) Pet skills, pigs steal. The Siamoth can get moa feathers for stealth.
3) Superior Runes of Infiltration. Any class can use this which kicks in cloak at a certain health point
Do rangers have a skill that stealths them.. ive seen it a few times while fighting a ranger and he disappears??
Rangers have access to stealth in 3 ways.
1) Camoflague, a trait that kicks in at a certain level of health.
2) Pet skills, pigs steal. The Siamoth can get moa feathers for stealth.
3) Superior Runes of Infiltration. Any class can use this which kicks in cloak at a certain health point
There is some trait that makes them stealth if they are CCed (I know Daze..maybe any stun??) as well. I know this from fighting them on my S/D thief.
It should be obvious that thieves, particularly solo and small group roamers are the most likely to be using cheats. That doesn’t mean it’s more likely for thieves to cheat, it means cheaters are more likely to use the thief class.
I use to be an anti-cheat admin for FPS games in defunct CAL league and also for TWL, so cheating is something that I am particularly sensitive to. The current cheats, which anyone can easily see a description of with google searching on public forums, can do distance hacks (see players and tags at long range, through terrain), give unlimited endurance, toggle higher FoV, toggle speed, plus all the teleport and climb exploits most everyone has seen.
Here’s one thing that tipped me off to cheaters I was (unknowingly) playing with. With the endurance hack, some cheaters will use the power of inertia trait + orrian meat stew food for 2 stacks of might on every dodge. If you see anyone constantly generating more than 6 stacks of might from dodging, they are cheating.
This seems to be one that players using the exploit don’t even try to hide since no one monitors boons in combat and doubts can be rebutted with"I’m using orrian meat stew!". Add in a slight speed hack that is tough to spot, and a cheater has increased their survivability and ability to do damage immensely with hardly anyone noticing. Adding in the uncatchable trait (caltrops on dodge) amps up survivability even more.
As for legit thieves, main hand sword thieves with shadowstep can close a huge distance in less than a second, 2700 to be exact with shadowstep —> infiltrator’s strike —> steal, then return from infiltrator’s and / or shadowstep in stealth. Being an initiative skill, infiltrator’s strike / shadow return is also repeatable with no cooldown, range 600.
To the OP: Do you have a proposal? Do you want thieves removed? There’s no conclusion here.
No conclusion? That’s short-sighted. If the communities informed and aware then it places ArenaNet in a position to be more proactive about it. An uploaded utube vid that used fraps is our best detection and report mechanism? Seriously?
As it stands for report mechnisms in game the d/d bunker ele in the vid could right click the thief (when hes not stealthed) and report for….. i dunno… botting?
yeh I still can’t believe there isn’t an easy report function in game
with the way culling is right now and the abundance os stealth it is very hard to catch many hackers.. and they are quite prevalent i see them often enough in wvw, and those are just the ones I do notice
I was witness to a Thief today who was speed hacking and the tell for this is the constant stuttering run, if you pay close attention they don’t run as smoothly as everyone else.
Ive seen enough Thief’s in my time to realise they weren’t running away in a legit manner. The problem as has been stated there is no easy reporting system for them and the drop down box should have exploit listed. I had to report whoever it was for botting but that’s not correct but there is no other method for easily reporting these people.
It isn’t just Thief’s so having a thread picking out one class isn’t right, there are other classes making use of this and a few other exploits and its a shame as its a small minority trying to spoil the fun for everyone else. If they cant play fair then they shouldnt play at all.
Do rangers have a skill that stealths them.. ive seen it a few times while fighting a ranger and he disappears??
Rangers have access to stealth in 3 ways.
1) Camouflage, a trait that kicks in at a certain level of health.
2) Pet skills, pigs steal. The Siamoth can get moa feathers for stealth.
3) Superior Runes of Infiltration. Any class can use this which kicks in cloak at a certain health pointThere is some trait that makes them stealth if they are CCed (I know Daze..maybe any stun??) as well. I know this from fighting them on my S/D thief.
You are correct. Camouflage is applied by Hide in Plain Sight, wilderness 9. Apply Camouflage when you are dazed, knocked down, launched, pushed back, or stunned. It’s not on a health amount. Seems I also misspelled it.
As for legit thieves, main hand sword thieves with shadowstep can close a huge distance in less than a second, 2700 to be exact with shadowstep —> infiltrator’s strike --> steal, then return from infiltrator’s and / or shadowstep in stealth. Being an initiative skill, infiltrator’s strike / shadow return is also repeatable with no cooldown, range 600.
Don’t forget Infiltrator’s signet, I recently learned to love that skill as a gap closer (doesn’t require enemy to be in the range, it’ll just shadowstep to it maximum range in the direction of the target)
I think this is why it’s easier to cheat if you’re a thief. You’re already so slippery that some people can just name out the 50 ways you h ave to cover vast differences and just say you never cheated. But I’ve seen one thief I know had to be cheating, because he wasn’t just covering distance very fast he was teleporting distances very fast. As in +2000 distance or more in less than a second and popping back and forth. I’m not aware of thieves having a teleport with range greater than a longbow can shoot.
I think this is why it’s easier to cheat if you’re a thief. You’re already so slippery that some people can just name out the 50 ways you h ave to cover vast differences and just say you never cheated. But I’ve seen one thief I know had to be cheating, because he wasn’t just covering distance very fast he was teleporting distances very fast. As in +2000 distance or more in less than a second and popping back and forth. I’m not aware of thieves having a teleport with range greater than a longbow can shoot.
Shadowstep + infiltrator’s signet/strike/arrow followed by shadow return (from shadowstep)
gives about 2100 distance, using infiltrator’s signet it’ll be in less than a second because there is no delay.
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