Guild Wars 2

I totally expect this to get trolled.

But seriously something needs to be done about thieves perma stealth troll spec in wvw for the other classes that aren’t as good roamers unless your in a zerg there is simply no reason to run about as within 2 minutes you will come across a thief that cant play any other class effectively so has gone for the perma stealth glitch to help their lack of skill and gameplay.

I am 100% sure that when this game was released it didn’t want to be like wow and other mmo`s with no anticipated classes having stealth for any given period of time.

And I am trusting in Anet to fix it………

Majority of wvw players zerg but what do the other roamers think?

Yes I know there are signs of where the thief is via the skill they are using to stealth but its still over the top and OP.

Keep on trusting and believing in that fix for it has only been 10 months and 24 days (give or take a day) since lunch and they have only slapped the Thieves hand a couple of times.

As of which, where not even really that big of a deal. They complain about them but it wasn’t as bad as they claim. Warriors, however, got punched in the face as a knee jerk reaction to people not knowing how to dodge a single skill…. 30% burst damage down to 3% for over 9 months… Now we get burst skill recharge reduction…. (great 10 second skill is now 8 seconds, yay?)

The stealth issues should have been addressed in alpha and beta. Not a year down the road.

I swear I’ve seen this thread before.

I roam a lot, and I like it when I see a Thief. Usually an enemy Thief means an easy kill, or at least an easy win with them fleeing from me… especially so when they are these “perma stealth” builds.

I won’t go further into depth because this topic has been address approximately 9000 times already, with the same conclusion each time: L2P

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

90% players is so bad in PvP,PvE, 8% players are good players who learned to play against all classes, just only 2% of the players are pros.

You’re in category 90%.

Evilek.5690:

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

90% players is so bad in PvP,PvE, 8% players are good players who learned to play against all classes, just only 2% of the players are pros.

You’re in category 90%.

Agreed.

Demandrer.7068:

I totally expect this to get trolled.

But seriously something needs to be done about thieves perma stealth troll spec in wvw for the other classes that aren’t as good roamers unless your in a zerg there is simply no reason to run about as within 2 minutes you will come across a thief that cant play any other class effectively so has gone for the perma stealth glitch to help their lack of skill and gameplay.

I am 100% sure that when this game was released it didn’t want to be like wow and other mmo`s with no anticipated classes having stealth for any given period of time.

And I am trusting in Anet to fix it………

Majority of wvw players zerg but what do the other roamers think?

Yes I know there are signs of where the thief is via the skill they are using to stealth but its still over the top and OP.

Roll a thief, come in WvW, die tons of times because you are bad, stop posting kitten.
ty
bb

Demandrer.7068:

Majority of wvw players zerg but what do the other roamers think?

I do solo roaming as an engineer 90% of the time. I sometimes roam using other professions e.g. warrior, necromancer, ranger, thief.

The most common professions I run against:
warrior, guardian, thief, mesmer and elementalist
The other professions seem to be rare as solo players and in fact most of the warriors and guardians just seem to be lost from their own zerg, running full PVT or bunker build.

Underwater ranger is the most common solo profession. Above water thieves are the most common true solo roamers by far.

I get to fight quite a lot of thieves during my roaming. Solo thief is generally not a problem. Stealth + shadow steps + heart seeker spam are hugely annoying, but I also have a level 80 thief, so I know how thief skills and most traits work, so I can AoE nuke and CC them. Usually enough to scare the thief away, if not to kill him. Sometimes my AoE kills two enemy thieves in one blow and then I have a big laugh.

However thieves run in small groups and that is very deadly e.g. yesterday a certain 5-man Visunah team was constantly abusing stealth. They had a near perma daze sword/pistol thief, glass cannon ranger, guardian etc. It was truly annoying team constantly camping solo roamers from our side and their burst got me once, but I got to collect loot bags from their corpses when they run against 5 random guys from us.

The thief groups have extreme burst, stealth and mobility, which forces most players to either:
- run in a group
- run as a profession, which can reset fight at ease e.g. a thief or a mesmer
- run a full bunker and wish to survive until you are able meet up with your zerg or get behind your own walls, but you will be unable to kill any decent solo roamer as your damage will lack
- run a full glass cannon, hoping your dodges will be perfect and you are able to burst down the enemy 1st

I play balanced hybrid builds, which have group utility (which is wasted in my solo roaming). I use the same build in pve and as a PuG commander. This is not optimal, but really playing all 8 professions, I cannot master all the possible builds within each profession, so I just choose something I like to play.

Are thieves ruining WvWvW? I would say the biggest problems right now are the flawed scoring system, which favors coverage and numbers over anything, and overpowered WXP traits + abundant siege. Many player are afraid of getting insta gibbed from stealth, so thief play actually promotes running in bigger groups, but that is just one small factor and of course not the only reason for zerging.

Stealth is a broken game mechanism. There is no hard counter to stealth, besides those clunky traps, with are really not a solution for any sort of solo roamer. I have also done WvWvW as a thief and I feel that they have a bit too efficient ways to reset a fight and thus can run more glassy builds than most other players would dare to. I run into zerker thieves all the time, but I very rarely run into zerker guardians. Note that both professions have same base health. People are rightfully angry of losing badges and WXP when a thief vanishes. Those are the key reason why threads like these keep coming up.

I have been for months thinking really hard how to solve the stealth issue, without breaking the thief profession or redesigning all professions. Here is a copy & paste of my solution, which I posted to the spvp/tpvp forums:

First 2 seconds of stealth the character remains fully invisible to its enemies. Then its transparency value begins to change (gradually becoming a bit visible). After staying 3-4 seconds in stealth it becomes semi-transparent, just like the stealthed person is rendered to its allies. You could not still target that semi-transparent stealthed opponent, but it would remove the guess work where the stealthed opponents are.

Pros:
+ no changes needed for skills or professions
+ minimal programming work
+ all stealth related traits (most thieves really rely on them) would still work exactly like before

Cons:
- landing a backstab from rear/sides after long period of stealth would be more difficult
- AoE easier to land against stealthed opponents

I also think damage over time (DoT) effects, including bleeding, should be rendered on stealthed opponents, so that enemy can see them. If you got multiple stacks of bleed, that should leave some particle animation even if you’re stealthed. I would also remove stealth traps from the game (thieves need stealth for condition removal etc).

Evilek.5690:

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

90% players is so bad in PvP,PvE, 8% players are good players who learned to play against all classes, just only 2% of the players are pros.

You’re in category 90%.

Hah. Funny that you used those specific values. My buddy and I have a term we throw around a lot when talking about GW2 players: the 90%ers.

tldr; high-five for accurate post.

Xirin.8593:

Evilek.5690:

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

90% players is so bad in PvP,PvE, 8% players are good players who learned to play against all classes, just only 2% of the players are pros.

You’re in category 90%.

Hah. Funny that you used those specific values. My buddy and I have a term we throw around a lot when talking about GW2 players: the 90%ers.

tldr; high-five for accurate post.

I used to get owned on my Ele in WvW by thieves, so i made a thief to learn how to combat them.

…now i just get owned on my Thief, haha.

Scrambles.2604:

Xirin.8593:

Evilek.5690:

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

90% players is so bad in PvP,PvE, 8% players are good players who learned to play against all classes, just only 2% of the players are pros.

You’re in category 90%.

Hah. Funny that you used those specific values. My buddy and I have a term we throw around a lot when talking about GW2 players: the 90%ers.

tldr; high-five for accurate post.

I used to get owned on my Ele in WvW by thieves, so i made a thief to learn how to combat them.

…now i just get owned on my Thief, haha.

so you are confirming that it’s not the class, but the player…

Scrambles.2604:

Xirin.8593:

Evilek.5690:

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

90% players is so bad in PvP,PvE, 8% players are good players who learned to play against all classes, just only 2% of the players are pros.

You’re in category 90%.

Hah. Funny that you used those specific values. My buddy and I have a term we throw around a lot when talking about GW2 players: the 90%ers.

tldr; high-five for accurate post.

I used to get owned on my Ele in WvW by thieves, so i made a thief to learn how to combat them.

…now i just get owned on my Thief, haha.

I wish more people in the game and on these forums had your sense of humor.

Daendur.2357:

Roll a thief

Done that.

Daendur.2357:

come in WvW

After hitting 80 and getting decked in full exotics, first thing i did.

Daendur.2357:

die tons of times because you are bad

No doubt i was bad, and im still a scrub thief. But the whole “die tons of times” never really happend… Infact, roaming and fighting is rediculously easy as a Thief. I see a zerg rolling in my direction, i dont even have to flee.

Stealth, and just wait for them to run by or tag along and see where they are going. Killing off stragglers.

Daendur.2357:

stop posting kitten.
ty
bb

Sorry, but its true. The Thief profession is carried by unbalanced mechanics. Last week i single handedly defeated and killed 3 enemy Thieves in WvW. All of them lv80, me, a rookie.
And thats just the thing isnt it? all these “I kill Thieves so hard!”. Ofcourse you do! Most Thieves are flat out aweful at the game, and never learned to play beyond the most rudimenteray skillset. just pressing 2 or 3 buttons, because this nets them a positive result in most cases.

So as soon as they run into someone that isnt so easily defeated because he’s tough, or skilled, or both. They crack up because they never really had to master a follow-up for when cheesing or instagibbing doesnt work.

Daendur.2357:

Scrambles.2604:

Xirin.8593:

Evilek.5690:

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

90% players is so bad in PvP,PvE, 8% players are good players who learned to play against all classes, just only 2% of the players are pros.

You’re in category 90%.

Hah. Funny that you used those specific values. My buddy and I have a term we throw around a lot when talking about GW2 players: the 90%ers.

tldr; high-five for accurate post.

I used to get owned on my Ele in WvW by thieves, so i made a thief to learn how to combat them.

…now i just get owned on my Thief, haha.

so you are confirming that it’s not the class, but the player…

either i’m the worst thief ever, or killing thieves in stealth isn’t as hard as everyone makes it out to be.

However, my Ele is much better against thieves now, so there’s that.

WvW is not about 1v1 or small man, it’s the whole world vs another world to accomplish set objectives. For that the thief is completely useless. It’s hilarious to hear **** complaining about the worst class in the game trying to get them nerfed from worst to even worse.

A Condi Necro kills every Thief with absolutely np at all,.. Stelth dosent = imune to dmg u know.

Have absolutely Zero problems with any Thief

Necro vs thief roamer- only viable as a conditionmancer. Any other builds- total fail.
Agree- thieves on WvWvW are “pain in the *”
note: they were first class in spvp to be nerfed. Without reason – You say.
Unless You havnt been hit by 9999 dmg from a thief.

Demandrer.7068:

Brilliant thank you for assisting my thread nice to know 9000 or people alsofeels it stupid!

It is what it is. Go find the recent (last couple of weeks) forum thread where players identify the best class to play for WvW in general and check out where thief ranks. Hint: it’s near the bottom.

Terrahero.9358:

No doubt i was bad, and im still a scrub thief. But the whole “die tons of times” never really happend… Infact, roaming and fighting is rediculously easy as a Thief. I see a zerg rolling in my direction, i dont even have to flee.

Stealth, and just wait for them to run by or tag along and see where they are going. Killing off stragglers.

Actually, you can do this with any class if the zerg isn’t full of noobies who will chase after a single guy. If the zerg is a threat (and you aren’t outmanned) then they are not going to waste their time chasing a single guy, no matter which class you are. At most you’ll get a couple militia breaking ranks, or a couple ranged attacks fired at you as they run past.

Actually, if the zerg did chase after a single player, that single player is being a huge asset to their team in typing that group up, no matter which class they are playing as. Example, the other week I baiting a low discipline zerg of about 20 people or more away from a camp for a couple minutes until the point tally. Granted this was on my no-stealth evasion Thief, but I’ve done the same or similar on my Mesmer, even Necro and Guardian(!).

If you as a roamer somehow have the attention of a zerg, then abuse it.

Everyone should drop a stealth trap when confronted with a thief, 1 of 2 things will always happen, they run away or die.

I hate thieves. you can easily macro the skills to fit 90% of any situation in WvW

BUT I’m TELLING YOU Stealth traps are freaking hilarious tools to use when a thief is around you, try it

The problem is that for a stealth specced Thief stealth is everything.
It’s a iniator, a burst setup, damage avoidance, distraction/target loss for enemies, an escape mechanism, condition removal, mobility, “CD reduction”(initiative regen/gain) and even healing. This, paired with lack of counter options and almost unlimited access without CD due to to initiative mechanic makes it borderline broken. It’s just never wrong to stealth. It works against any other build/class in almost any situation.
On every other class you feel the punishment for using a skill at the wrong time because you can only utilize its effect in certain situations and have a CD attached to it. This is less true for stealth. Traited stealth is such multi-functional, “wrong” use is very unlikely.

No, Thiefs are not OP in general, they have many fields they lack in and would probably be UP if nerfed. However, stealth, as it is abused by certain Thief builds, is just a unsatisfactory mechanic which is not fun to fight against and certainly a balance nightmare, especially with all those traits and functions (stealth attack) attached to it. It supports passive, one-sided gameplay instead of counterplay, observing your enemy, looking for weak spots etc.

Imo stealth should just be that – stealth. It works well enough as that. It shouldn’t be condition removal, healing, speed boost, initiative regen boost and burst setup along with its defensive/distractive nature. If these functions get seperated from stealth, they could be moved to other skills/traits, making non-stealth builds more viable and interesting. It should be a tactical choice to go into stealth, rather than popping it everytime something doesn’t go according to the plan.

As many others have already pointed out, the fundamental problem is not really that thieves are OP, but rather that their game mechanics are simply poorly designed. Or if you like, another way to put it is that thieves are OP in terms of doing one and only one thing in particular, while they are effectively UP in other areas. Thieves are playing the hand that was dealt them, and that hand holds but one card, namely stealth. Everything they do is tied to it, and thus stealth effectively becomes a blessing and a curse at the same time. It makes the thief a stellar class for roaming/ganking, but try running one in almost any other context and the deficiencies begin to show themselves.

At the same time, it is also equally true that the ganking style of play is ultimately only really satisfying for one of the players involved. Thieves undeniably have the ability to put a single target in an unrecoverable position very fast from out of nowhere, and while the tradeoffs the thief class makes to accomplish this are substantial, dying as the result of a fight you never effectively had a chance to participate in is just no fun. Fixing this, however, will require a substantially more sophisticated approach than simply nerfing the class outright.

To put it briefly, stealth needs an overhaul. It’s a matter of, among other things, redesigning several key thief skills and traits to disconnect the stealth effect from most (if not all) of the buffs/passive benefits it provides, and then rebalancing the class accordingly. It’s a fairly large undertaking though, so don’t expect it to happen anytime soon – though I certainly wish it would. In fact, I think it should be one of a.net’s top priorities, but I suppose that’s a matter of opinion.

Previous two posts sum up what the real problem is.

The problem here seems to stem from the fact that everyone here thinks they should be able to win a 1v1 against every other class with any class regardless of skill and that is just silly.

Thieves are designed to be gankers, every single thief trait/skill is designed around getting in quickly and secretly, unloading a ton of burst damage and then getting out before anyone else notices you were there. They are not meant to be killed 1 v 1, they are designed to be annoying.

The problem is that under skilled players can’t stand the fact that they are not on a level playing field against another equally skilled player even though that is the classes design. If you want to kill thieves, find some party members or play a thief/mesmer the only classes that can kill an equally skilled opponent on a thief.

Thief was my first character, I played one the first 3-4 months after launch so I know what they were like when they were op. (When I could build up minutes of stealth CnDing your wall and then come one backstab down squishy classes with the signet build) But I have since moved on to play a mix of guardian (zerg), warrior (roamer, i just laugh at thieves and run by them because idc about kills as they serve 0 purpose in WvW) and occasionally whatever class I’m leveling. Thieves rarely bother me and only when two show up do I die, including when played level 25ish characters, most just aren’t that scary because they are predictable and once you mess them up a couple times they realize your not an easy gank and go elsewhere.

TLDR: Don;t expect to kill them 1 v 1 that is their specialty, find friends to roam with or build a move survival build so they don’t bother you and actually do something that helps your server.

Another thread where players that have professions made for group combat complains about losing to a duelist profession…

Anyone with a “brain” should know that Arena net support and promote Tyranny “The One Man Army” theory in support to their Favorite Class; Thief.

Why Tyranny?

By the countless deleted/infracted/closed and pending threads concerning Thief stealth causing choatic irony in wvw.

Promoting Tyranny

Nearing to 1 year- by the countless nerf-rewardings this class have gotten, is absurd.

Remember how they “nerfed Perma-stealth”?

Well it is still here, i never believed them, because again.. thief is the only nerf-rewarding class and Favorite class.

So why would they stripp their Idol thief from Supremacy status for the sake of any one; classes, community, wvw,spvp and pve?

As long Arena net remain, so be theif stealth and Favoritism.

The only way to remove stealth is to replace Arena net.. and that will Never happen.

Our only Savior and Hope is carry on to other Mmo’s team who don’t believe in Favoritism, “the one man army” theory , Tyranny and Nerf-Rewarding class and most especially, Punishing the “less advantage class” in Favor of the “Advantage” class.

Than and only than they will realized and learn that Favoritism and Tyranny of Stealth Mechanic is a Fail system.

Burnfall.9573:

Anyone with a “brain” should know that Arena net support and promote Tyranny “The One Man Army” theory in support to their Favorite Class; Thief.

Why Tyranny?

By the countless deleted/infracted/closed and pending threads concerning Thief stealth causing choatic irony in wvw.

Promoting Tyranny

Nearing to 1 year- by the countless nerf-rewardings this class have gotten, is absurd.

Remember how they “nerfed Perma-stealth”?

Well it is still here, i never believed them, because again.. thief is the only nerf-rewarding class and Favorite class.

So why would they stripp their Idol thief from Supremacy status for the sake of any one; classes, community, wvw,spvp and pve?

As long Arena net remain, so be theif stealth and Favoritism.

The only way to remove stealth is to replace Arena net.. and that will Never happen.

Our only Savior and Hope is carry on to other Mmo’s team who doesn’t believe in Favoritism, “the one man army” theory , Tyranny and Nerf-Rewarding class and most especially, Punishing the “less advantage class” in Favor of the “Advantage” class.

So, they completely, let me say that again, completely!! ignore the thief community and its requests?!

They have nerfed us time after time, giving us so called buffs that we never wanted and just ended up destroying good weapon sets. They have given us many unjustified nerfs on things no one ever have complained about.

But yes. Anet want to have a strong duelist profession – and that’s exactly what the thief is and what it does best. Being a mobile blast finisher isn’t fun, but that’s all we can do in a zerg. And don’t even get me started on PvE….

Geiir.7603:

Burnfall.9573:

Anyone with a “brain” should know that Arena net support and promote Tyranny “The One Man Army” theory in support to their Favorite Class; Thief.

Why Tyranny?

By the countless deleted/infracted/closed and pending threads concerning Thief stealth causing choatic irony in wvw.

Promoting Tyranny

Nearing to 1 year- by the countless nerf-rewardings this class have gotten, is absurd.

Remember how they “nerfed Perma-stealth”?

Well it is still here, i never believed them, because again.. thief is the only nerf-rewarding class and Favorite class.

So why would they stripp their Idol thief from Supremacy status for the sake of any one; classes, community, wvw,spvp and pve?

As long Arena net remain, so be theif stealth and Favoritism.

The only way to remove stealth is to replace Arena net.. and that will Never happen.

Our only Savior and Hope is carry on to other Mmo’s team who doesn’t believe in Favoritism, “the one man army” theory , Tyranny and Nerf-Rewarding class and most especially, Punishing the “less advantage class” in Favor of the “Advantage” class.

So, they completely, let me say that again, completely!! ignore the thief community and its requests?!

They have nerfed us time after time, giving us so called buffs that we never wanted and just ended up destroying good weapon sets. They have given us many unjustified nerfs on things no one ever have complained about.

But yes. Anet want to have a strong duelist profession – and that’s exactly what the thief is and what it does best. Being a mobile blast finisher isn’t fun, but that’s all we can do in a zerg. And don’t even get me started on PvE….

Here is your answer, why they completely ignore Thief community?

They believe Thief class is Perfect

That’s the Consequence of being Favorite.. and them playing Favoritism.

Not only that is Devastating and Abusive to thief in the long term, any problems or concern this class have will be intentially ignore or "swept under the rug’ because it’s only a Delusion.

Believe me as a Ranger class, i know that thief have many fixes and problems within thier class that need serious attention.

Unfortunately,

Not to Arena net

Which is Sad

Yes I know there are signs of where the thief is via the skill they are using to stealth but its still over the top and OP.

[/quote]

I died blobbing at bay, our zerg was trying to cap it.
I did not get a res from me fellow blobbers so i have to spawn Carrison and run back Bay.

omg omg i have a Thief on me back, wot I do , wot i do…. oh well i keep running and running. "maybe i make it…Ohhh i might make it to me blob…..darn i died…..WATAFAK theese faking thiefs are OP i am gonna QQ on forums.

PS., faka U totall noobs, l2p

Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread. Just ignore him.

For anyone who played EverQuest 1, he is the Battleblade of GW2.

Xirin.8593:

Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread. Just ignore him.

For anyone who played EverQuest 1, he is the Battleblade of GW2.

I hold you Accountable for Lying and Deception.

I Encouage you to post my threads/post of “:]Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread” in the post, so everyone in the community can see.

Otherwise,

I’ll take that as a Joke.

Angewaire.6319:

Necro vs thief roamer- only viable as a conditionmancer. Any other builds- total fail.
Agree- thieves on WvWvW are “pain in the *”
note: they were first class in spvp to be nerfed. Without reason – You say.
Unless You havnt been hit by 9999 dmg from a thief.

Sorry, I had to log in just to reply to this, I have to disagree, I play a Hybrid Necro, Pwr/Cond and seriously have no problem with thieves. I don’t even have to carry a staff. It’s so simple, once they start in on you just drop some wells. Thieves are squishy, and if the well bombs don’t kill them, the remaining conditions will while they are trying to get away. Remember they can only cleanse one cond every three seconds if spec’d for it, if memory serves correctly. Plus, hit a Thief with Fear and he doesn’t haven’t a stun break, well it’s pretty much good night. I also have a Lvl 80 Thief that I have done a lot of WvW with. I don’t like the gimmicky play style which is why I stick with my Necro. But as most of the other posters have said, Thieves generally are bad players. Spamming a few buttons and hoping you drop. I will however say Thieves for getting around the world and map completion, nothing beats it. Mine doesn’t even leave LA anymore, just stays there and does my cooking for me. I used to love my thief, but now that WvW is what appeals to me more he had to retire. Cheers.

Burnfall.9573:

Xirin.8593:

Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread. Just ignore him.

For anyone who played EverQuest 1, he is the Battleblade of GW2.

I hold you Accountable for Lying and Deception.

I Encouage you to post my threads/post of “:]Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread” in the post, so everyone in the community can see.

Otherwise,

I’ll take that as a Joke.

Oh there is a joke here alright. Your post history for example.

Rastos.3812:

Angewaire.6319:

Necro vs thief roamer- only viable as a conditionmancer. Any other builds- total fail.
Agree- thieves on WvWvW are “pain in the *”
note: they were first class in spvp to be nerfed. Without reason – You say.
Unless You havnt been hit by 9999 dmg from a thief.

Sorry, I had to log in just to reply to this, I have to disagree, I play a Hybrid Necro, Pwr/Cond and seriously have no problem with thieves. I don’t even have to carry a staff. It’s so simple, once they start in on you just drop some wells. Thieves are squishy, and if the well bombs don’t kill them, the remaining conditions will while they are trying to get away. Remember they can only cleanse one cond every three seconds if spec’d for it, if memory serves correctly. Plus, hit a Thief with Fear and he doesn’t haven’t a stun break, well it’s pretty much good night. I also have a Lvl 80 Thief that I have done a lot of WvW with. I don’t like the gimmicky play style which is why I stick with my Necro. But as most of the other posters have said, Thieves generally are bad players. Spamming a few buttons and hoping you drop. I will however say Thieves for getting around the world and map completion, nothing beats it. Mine doesn’t even leave LA anymore, just stays there and does my cooking for me. I used to love my thief, but now that WvW is what appeals to me more he had to retire. Cheers.

Pretty much this. I don’t play my necro in WvW, only sPvP, but when I see a thief I know I can light them up with some burning/bleeds and it’s pretty much game over. They will either run or die. Yes, their condi cleanse is in stealth (1 condi/3s).

LilMcGinley.3890:

Rastos.3812:

Angewaire.6319:

Necro vs thief roamer- only viable as a conditionmancer. Any other builds- total fail.
Agree- thieves on WvWvW are “pain in the *”
note: they were first class in spvp to be nerfed. Without reason – You say.
Unless You havnt been hit by 9999 dmg from a thief.

Sorry, I had to log in just to reply to this, I have to disagree, I play a Hybrid Necro, Pwr/Cond and seriously have no problem with thieves. I don’t even have to carry a staff. It’s so simple, once they start in on you just drop some wells. Thieves are squishy, and if the well bombs don’t kill them, the remaining conditions will while they are trying to get away. Remember they can only cleanse one cond every three seconds if spec’d for it, if memory serves correctly. Plus, hit a Thief with Fear and he doesn’t haven’t a stun break, well it’s pretty much good night. I also have a Lvl 80 Thief that I have done a lot of WvW with. I don’t like the gimmicky play style which is why I stick with my Necro. But as most of the other posters have said, Thieves generally are bad players. Spamming a few buttons and hoping you drop. I will however say Thieves for getting around the world and map completion, nothing beats it. Mine doesn’t even leave LA anymore, just stays there and does my cooking for me. I used to love my thief, but now that WvW is what appeals to me more he had to retire. Cheers.

Pretty much this. I don’t play my necro in WvW, only sPvP, but when I see a thief I know I can light them up with some burning/bleeds and it’s pretty much game over. They will either run or die. Yes, their condi cleanse is in stealth (1 condi/3s).

That isn’t completely true. HiS can clear like three conditions straight up, and then you get I think two more over it’s duration from the trait. If they aren’t carrying HiS as their heal though then you are correct.

Renxian.6982:

LilMcGinley.3890:

Rastos.3812:

Angewaire.6319:

Necro vs thief roamer- only viable as a conditionmancer. Any other builds- total fail.
Agree- thieves on WvWvW are “pain in the *”
note: they were first class in spvp to be nerfed. Without reason – You say.
Unless You havnt been hit by 9999 dmg from a thief.

Sorry, I had to log in just to reply to this, I have to disagree, I play a Hybrid Necro, Pwr/Cond and seriously have no problem with thieves. I don’t even have to carry a staff. It’s so simple, once they start in on you just drop some wells. Thieves are squishy, and if the well bombs don’t kill them, the remaining conditions will while they are trying to get away. Remember they can only cleanse one cond every three seconds if spec’d for it, if memory serves correctly. Plus, hit a Thief with Fear and he doesn’t haven’t a stun break, well it’s pretty much good night. I also have a Lvl 80 Thief that I have done a lot of WvW with. I don’t like the gimmicky play style which is why I stick with my Necro. But as most of the other posters have said, Thieves generally are bad players. Spamming a few buttons and hoping you drop. I will however say Thieves for getting around the world and map completion, nothing beats it. Mine doesn’t even leave LA anymore, just stays there and does my cooking for me. I used to love my thief, but now that WvW is what appeals to me more he had to retire. Cheers.

Pretty much this. I don’t play my necro in WvW, only sPvP, but when I see a thief I know I can light them up with some burning/bleeds and it’s pretty much game over. They will either run or die. Yes, their condi cleanse is in stealth (1 condi/3s).

That isn’t completely true. HiS can clear like three conditions straight up, and then you get I think two more over it’s duration from the trait. If they aren’t carrying HiS as their heal though then you are correct.

A necro can throw more than 5 conditions on a target really fast, not to mention HiS only clears “Cures burning, poison, and bleeding”.. all others are still ticking away. HiS would give you those 3 + 1 for being invis for 3s. Signet of Spite is 6, 2 of which auto cleared and 1 thru the 3s duration, leaving Cripple, Blindness, Chill, Weakness for them to deal with. If I was a thief and got hit with that, I’d prolly just run away.

But yeah, there are other ways to condi cleanse as a thief, such as Shadow Step and Roll for Init, can also trait in Acrob and Shadow for additional but it is a class that lacks reliable, consistent condition removal.

Renxian.6982:

Burnfall.9573:

Xirin.8593:

Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread. Just ignore him.

For anyone who played EverQuest 1, he is the Battleblade of GW2.

I hold you Accountable for Lying and Deception.

I Encouage you to post my threads/post of “:]Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread” in the post, so everyone in the community can see.

Otherwise,

I’ll take that as a Joke.

Oh there is a joke here alright. Your post history for example.

Than post my post History so everyone can see “Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread”

Go on…

Everyone waiting…..

Burnfall posts stuff like this in every Thief thread!!!

LilMcGinley.3890:

Renxian.6982:

LilMcGinley.3890:

Rastos.3812:

Angewaire.6319:

Necro vs thief roamer- only viable as a conditionmancer. Any other builds- total fail.
Agree- thieves on WvWvW are “pain in the *”
note: they were first class in spvp to be nerfed. Without reason – You say.
Unless You havnt been hit by 9999 dmg from a thief.

Sorry, I had to log in just to reply to this, I have to disagree, I play a Hybrid Necro, Pwr/Cond and seriously have no problem with thieves. I don’t even have to carry a staff. It’s so simple, once they start in on you just drop some wells. Thieves are squishy, and if the well bombs don’t kill them, the remaining conditions will while they are trying to get away. Remember they can only cleanse one cond every three seconds if spec’d for it, if memory serves correctly. Plus, hit a Thief with Fear and he doesn’t haven’t a stun break, well it’s pretty much good night. I also have a Lvl 80 Thief that I have done a lot of WvW with. I don’t like the gimmicky play style which is why I stick with my Necro. But as most of the other posters have said, Thieves generally are bad players. Spamming a few buttons and hoping you drop. I will however say Thieves for getting around the world and map completion, nothing beats it. Mine doesn’t even leave LA anymore, just stays there and does my cooking for me. I used to love my thief, but now that WvW is what appeals to me more he had to retire. Cheers.

Pretty much this. I don’t play my necro in WvW, only sPvP, but when I see a thief I know I can light them up with some burning/bleeds and it’s pretty much game over. They will either run or die. Yes, their condi cleanse is in stealth (1 condi/3s).

That isn’t completely true. HiS can clear like three conditions straight up, and then you get I think two more over it’s duration from the trait. If they aren’t carrying HiS as their heal though then you are correct.

A necro can throw more than 5 conditions on a target really fast, not to mention HiS only clears “Cures burning, poison, and bleeding”.. all others are still ticking away. HiS would give you those 3 + 1 for being invis for 3s. Signet of Spite is 6, 2 of which auto cleared and 1 thru the 3s duration, leaving Cripple, Blindness, Chill, Weakness for them to deal with. If I was a thief and got hit with that, I’d prolly just run away.

But yeah, there are other ways to condi cleanse as a thief, such as Shadow Step and Roll for Init, can also trait in Acrob and Shadow for additional but it is a class that lacks reliable, consistent condition removal.

No. It’s 3+1 on initial stealth and 1 three seconds after that from my experience. That’s why Shadow Refuge is so good for condition wiping. I have yet to run into a class that can load enough conditions to kill me straight up assuming I am not stunned or in some way prevented from using skills.

That said, we absolutely need to blow utilities to counter heavy condition loading from classes like engineer and necro. Also as said before, best defense against a thief, as you demonstrated, is making the fight too difficult or dangerous to be bothered. From my personal perspective, I will generally ignore ANY character that can repeatedly re-apply chill to me. Chill is absolutely the most obnoxious condition in the game because it screws you in about 5 different ways.

Renxian.6982:

LilMcGinley.3890:

Renxian.6982:

LilMcGinley.3890:

Rastos.3812:

Angewaire.6319:

Necro vs thief roamer- only viable as a conditionmancer. Any other builds- total fail.
Agree- thieves on WvWvW are “pain in the *”
note: they were first class in spvp to be nerfed. Without reason – You say.
Unless You havnt been hit by 9999 dmg from a thief.

Sorry, I had to log in just to reply to this, I have to disagree, I play a Hybrid Necro, Pwr/Cond and seriously have no problem with thieves. I don’t even have to carry a staff. It’s so simple, once they start in on you just drop some wells. Thieves are squishy, and if the well bombs don’t kill them, the remaining conditions will while they are trying to get away. Remember they can only cleanse one cond every three seconds if spec’d for it, if memory serves correctly. Plus, hit a Thief with Fear and he doesn’t haven’t a stun break, well it’s pretty much good night. I also have a Lvl 80 Thief that I have done a lot of WvW with. I don’t like the gimmicky play style which is why I stick with my Necro. But as most of the other posters have said, Thieves generally are bad players. Spamming a few buttons and hoping you drop. I will however say Thieves for getting around the world and map completion, nothing beats it. Mine doesn’t even leave LA anymore, just stays there and does my cooking for me. I used to love my thief, but now that WvW is what appeals to me more he had to retire. Cheers.

Pretty much this. I don’t play my necro in WvW, only sPvP, but when I see a thief I know I can light them up with some burning/bleeds and it’s pretty much game over. They will either run or die. Yes, their condi cleanse is in stealth (1 condi/3s).

That isn’t completely true. HiS can clear like three conditions straight up, and then you get I think two more over it’s duration from the trait. If they aren’t carrying HiS as their heal though then you are correct.

A necro can throw more than 5 conditions on a target really fast, not to mention HiS only clears “Cures burning, poison, and bleeding”.. all others are still ticking away. HiS would give you those 3 + 1 for being invis for 3s. Signet of Spite is 6, 2 of which auto cleared and 1 thru the 3s duration, leaving Cripple, Blindness, Chill, Weakness for them to deal with. If I was a thief and got hit with that, I’d prolly just run away.

But yeah, there are other ways to condi cleanse as a thief, such as Shadow Step and Roll for Init, can also trait in Acrob and Shadow for additional but it is a class that lacks reliable, consistent condition removal.

No. It’s 3+1 on initial stealth and 1 three seconds after that from my experience. That’s why Shadow Refuge is so good for condition wiping. I have yet to run into a class that can load enough conditions to kill me straight up assuming I am not stunned or in some way prevented from using skills.

That said, we absolutely need to blow utilities to counter heavy condition loading from classes like engineer and necro. Also as said before, best defense against a thief, as you demonstrated, is making the fight too difficult or dangerous to be bothered. From my personal perspective, I will generally ignore ANY character that can repeatedly re-apply chill to me. Chill is absolutely the most obnoxious condition in the game because it screws you in about 5 different ways.

Ah, thanks for pointing that out. I’ve played ~800 hours on my thief but never really used HiS, Signet of Malice OP

Necro would be using some form of fear, they only have like 3442 ways to apply it. Fear + Signet of Spite = Game over. In sPvP I usually open with staff 3, stakitten , signet of malice then DS 3, fear while on those conditions are on you. Drop staff 2 at my feet for what is probably an incoming steal/backstab combo for more bleed then go to town with scepter. DFire procs a couple times during that, 700 dmg each, in sPvP.

Necro shouldn’t lose to a thief if you are smart about your rotation and watching what they do.

This again. Things we know about thief posts:

• This topic will get posted over and over because people feel the need to be special and create a thread rather than reply to an existing one with the exact same topic
• The vast majority of fights that end well for the thief are against less skilled players or players using a group friendly build
• The thief has seen a nerf with almost every significant patch since release. They share this with the ele and to some degree mesmer
• D/P thieves are the most annoying solo class in the game but a close second is anything bunker
• Thieves do not comprise the most DPS that belongs to AoE classes
• Thieves do not have the most kills… hello zerg guardian
• Thieves are designed for roaming and are mediocre at best in most other roles
• Many forum warriors think their class/build should excel in all facets of game play and completely gloss over builds/classes that do not do well in other aspects of WvW
• Most classes have some form of solo/skirmish build that gives them a relatively fair fight against equally skilled thief players

Daendur.2357:

Roll a thief, come in WvW, die tons of times because you are bad, stop posting kitten.
ty
bb

Rolled a thief, went in wvw, died incredibly few times.

I’m pretty bad at combat overall, and on my other characters had been between ok to not so great

But bringing in my thief, I discovered that I could harass small groups until they had no choice but to respond, then effortlessly escape when they did try to respond.

Someone of my (low) skill level should not be able to accomplish this. Sorry, but the “Roll a thief” argument is bogus, thanks for playing.

Burnfall.9573:

Geiir.7603:

Burnfall.9573:

Anyone with a “brain” should know that Arena net support and promote Tyranny “The One Man Army” theory in support to their Favorite Class; Thief.

Why Tyranny?

By the countless deleted/infracted/closed and pending threads concerning Thief stealth causing choatic irony in wvw.

Promoting Tyranny

Nearing to 1 year- by the countless nerf-rewardings this class have gotten, is absurd.

Remember how they “nerfed Perma-stealth”?

Well it is still here, i never believed them, because again.. thief is the only nerf-rewarding class and Favorite class.

So why would they stripp their Idol thief from Supremacy status for the sake of any one; classes, community, wvw,spvp and pve?

As long Arena net remain, so be theif stealth and Favoritism.

The only way to remove stealth is to replace Arena net.. and that will Never happen.

Our only Savior and Hope is carry on to other Mmo’s team who doesn’t believe in Favoritism, “the one man army” theory , Tyranny and Nerf-Rewarding class and most especially, Punishing the “less advantage class” in Favor of the “Advantage” class.

So, they completely, let me say that again, completely!! ignore the thief community and its requests?!

They have nerfed us time after time, giving us so called buffs that we never wanted and just ended up destroying good weapon sets. They have given us many unjustified nerfs on things no one ever have complained about.

But yes. Anet want to have a strong duelist profession – and that’s exactly what the thief is and what it does best. Being a mobile blast finisher isn’t fun, but that’s all we can do in a zerg. And don’t even get me started on PvE….

Here is your answer, why they completely ignore Thief community?

They believe Thief class is Perfect

That’s the Consequence of being Favorite.. and them playing Favoritism.

Not only that is Devastating and Abusive to thief in the long term, any problems or concern this class have will be intentially ignore or "swept under the rug’ because it’s only a Delusion.

Believe me as a Ranger class, i know that thief have many fixes and problems within thier class that need serious attention.

Unfortunately,

Not to Arena net

Which is Sad

If they really believed the Thief was perfect, then why have I yet to see a developer play one? I have never seen any livestream of the Thief.

We have a ton of bugs (shadow step mechanics for example) that we have posted several times, yet they fail to fix these. The thief community always ask for more viable builds and more options except for the standard high burst thief, but we never get anything…

Demandrer.7068:

Roll a thief, come in WvW, die tons of times because you are bad, stop posting kitten.
ty
bb

don’t you mean
roll a thief come in WvW, kill tons of people, because its so easy, start posting L2P.
ty
bb

Due to the inflammatory tone of this thread and the non constructive discussion, this thread is locked.