Guild Wars 2

As the title says, I’m getting downed in most scenarios before I even get the chance to do anything. I’ve been 1 shotted in a meteor shower, demolished by necros, rekt by warriors, couldn’t get a word in edge-wise against engi’s, the list goes on. I don’t believe that I should be going down this fast with 1300 toughness and 1500 vitality. This wasn’t an issue pre-patch. Anet has literally made thieves unviable in most situations for WvW. IT’S SO FRUSTRATING.

You’re doing it wrong.

mako.2431:

You’re doing it wrong.

Roughly the same build, same exact armor set, same weapons, same playstyle. I’m not the only thief who’s having problems. This most recent patch has negatively affected the thief class, you can’t deny that. Especially in WvW.

As a thief I love burst, but this patch is too much burst from nearly all classes. Roaming on my thief has turned into a “kill opponent instantly or die instantly” in many situations. It’s the reason why many thieves (in my experience this last week, around 60%-70%) of thieves are now condi p/d in wvw.

I feel like I still do relatively well compared to pre-patch using my d/p build, but a lot of fights just arent as fun anymore. I am now consistently one shotting other thieves, and they can one shot me even though I’m wearing valkyrie armor set. Mesmers can pretty much one shot me in a combo, engi’s obviously have that ridiculous grenade crap, and condis are so insane if I don’t clear them in under 3 seconds I’m pretty much dead.

I much preferred BS’ing for 6k consistently and having more survivability and longer fights than having this new 8-12k backstabs but also getting one shot in return if I stay out of stealth for over 1 second. It was just more fun for me that way.

Ever since this last “patch” anet has succeeded in making this game even more unbalanced and just no more fun to play. I was hanging on by a thread as it was but this has pushed me over the edge. Anet has not been good to WvWers and Roamers in general but now with the out of control condis and stun META…. enough is enough. My main class (thief) is useless. Between the 17 stacks of torment and 12 stacks of confusion/ poison/bleed and burn that a single warrior can do or the engi’s 6 seconds of reveal on a small cooldown plus reveal in stealth EVEN IF WE DONT HIT THEM then 1 hit with grenades…. I am over it. I tried switching back to any one of my 10 other toons but nothing is worth it. Nothing has the condi clear to even come close to dealing with wvw cheese. Maybe a full party of guards but even then its doubtful. I am done with Anet pushing us in one single direction…. condi condi condi…. from the gear you get as you level to the crazy buff of an already out of control part of the game. People like me who have played one class as a main from the beginning of the game are being rolled by newbies with a cheese builds. I refuse to give this game anymore of my time when they are doing NOTHING to support my play style or give us power builds a chance. Why should we be forced into playing in a way or class that we do not like?! I thought before the patch was bad but GG anet… you definitely proved me wrong.

Kyley.9436:

People like me who have played one class as a main from the beginning of the game are being rolled by newbies with a cheese builds. I refuse to give this game anymore of my time when they are doing NOTHING to support my play style or give us power builds a chance. Why should we be forced into playing in a way or class that we do not like?! I thought before the patch was bad but GG anet… you definitely proved me wrong.

You sorta answered your own question. I hate passive condi play as much as anyone, but most new players will give up if there’s not some sort of button smash build that will give them a chance against players that have mastered one build / one class for the last two, almost three years now. I’m not saying the new player should actually win fights, but they need something that is easier to play so they at least feel they have a chance.

Anet has always kept such builds in the fold. Ten years later, there’s still ppl playing blood spike in GW1 GvG’s when all it requires is face roll from left to right on keyboard. Like it or not, the e-z mode build thing is part of the MMO genre so new players don’t quit straight away, like they do in games such as Quake when they are murdered over and over, with no chance whatsoever because of the massive skill gap, and steep learning curve.

zen.6091:

Kyley.9436:

People like me who have played one class as a main from the beginning of the game are being rolled by newbies with a cheese builds. I refuse to give this game anymore of my time when they are doing NOTHING to support my play style or give us power builds a chance. Why should we be forced into playing in a way or class that we do not like?! I thought before the patch was bad but GG anet… you definitely proved me wrong.

You sorta answered your own question. I hate passive condi play as much as anyone, but most new players will give up if there’s not some sort of button smash build that will give them a chance against players that have mastered one build / one class for the last two, almost three years now. I’m not saying the new player should actually win fights, but they need something that is easier to play so they at least feel they have a chance.

Anet has always kept such builds in the fold. Ten years later, there’s still ppl playing blood spike in GW1 GvG’s when all it requires is face roll from left to right on keyboard. Like it or not, the e-z mode build thing is part of the MMO genre so new players don’t quit straight away, like they do in games such as Quake when they are murdered over and over, with no chance whatsoever because of the massive skill gap, and steep learning curve.

That’s really painting new players with a very broad brush. I am that new player and in my opinion the classes are so borked they need to roll it back.

Aside from that Thieves have enjoyed a very long run being the 1v1 FOTM according to the forum post here. I mean its almost like I woke up and was playing WoW again. Did they hire the thief fanboy from over there or something?

Play Mesmer.

Its the new far improved thief.

Juba.8406:

Play Mesmer.

Its the new far improved thief.

LOL

Juba.8406:

Play Mesmer.

Its the new far improved thief.

It is funny, i actually did. And i love it.

All this time ive disliked the stealth mechanic on thieves, and hated the way anet basically wants to balance thieves around it. Almost forcing you to take it, or making you feel crippled if you dont. But i fought on with my no stealth thief.

Until this last patch. Now he just melt. Even in all soldiers and runed health. He is just a walking bag that brings nothing to the table. So i went out looking and started leveling my level 20 mesmer. He is now 80.

And what a difference. Anet can make a class with stealth and not have the class completely balanced around it. Every bit of my survival is not balanced around siting in stealth and running away? Oh my! i have plenty of condition removal! I can heal outside of stealth! I can stay in stealth! I have excellent group utility! Oh my! I can not stealth and wont have to feel like im crippling myself. It is a brave new world out there! Phear the new Mesmer overlords!

I think Sic’um needs a serious tweak now

Well I’ve been dishing out 10K heartseekers, 11K unloads, 7K Cluster bombs and 9K+ backstabs on my full glass Thief without any particularly notable might and/or vulnerability stacking. Need to try sword next

There’s very little point building for sustain at present because of the damage increase. Better to go full kitten and burst people down as quickly as you can.

Used D/P before patch and now. My thief is still playable. Anet will adjust condi/direct dmg/HP pool to restore balance. I have no worries so far.

Sovereign.4217:

As the title says, I’m getting downed in most scenarios before I even get the chance to do anything. I’ve been 1 shotted in a meteor shower, demolished by necros, rekt by warriors, couldn’t get a word in edge-wise against engi’s, the list goes on. I don’t believe that I should be going down this fast with 1300 toughness and 1500 vitality. This wasn’t an issue pre-patch. Anet has literally made thieves unviable in most situations for WvW. IT’S SO FRUSTRATING.

I read this as ‘I now feel like every other glass class and even some medium/tanky builds used to feel when attacked by a mainly invisible cheese mechanic exploiting thief’.

No more facepalm inst gibs without having some chance of dieing..diddums. If it was any other class complaining about the crazy amounts of damage around i’d have some sympathy.

Basically they adjusted most classes to do what thiefs could do previously (but without access to the cheese mechanic stealth)..don’t you like it when you’re on a level playing field?

The balance team utterly failed to take into account group mechanics, wvw, etc and the absence of even a rudimentary test server is shininh through loud and clear now.

Not sure how they will fix the broken damage now- restricting builds to just 3 trait lines and moving the stats is proving to be another of those ideas that sounded good to the devs in theory but in practice has turned pvp into a joke.

As a test, I jumped on to my super tanky engineer, tried to get somewhere near my old traits (some useful ones are gone, as they were in another trait line). previously, I could have played tag with 2-3 thiefs or mesmers or pretty much 2-3 of anything, as my very high armor and HP together with heals, etc outdid their damage. now, it’s ‘boom, dead’.

Wonder if there is any point in wearing any toughness at all now, having 2.3k toughness or 1.1k toughness seems to make zero difference now on ranged classes- although my tanky guard lasted well compared to my ranged classes with LESS armor…

Baldrick.8967:

Basically they adjusted most classes to do what thiefs could do previously (but without access to the cheese mechanic stealth)..don’t you like it when you’re on a level playing field?

Which is precisely why this is just plain wrong. Everyone does the damage a thief can. But every other class has more passive and active defences compared to what a thief gets.

So something that was once balanced around doing more damage but being squishy, now deals the same damage, but is still way more squishy than anything out there..

mako.2431:

You’re doing it wrong.

^^
This.

I got owned by thieves plenty still, but I can beat them now too, it really boils down to the toon and build I am runing at the time and CDs I have up when jumped by a thief, being a thief is no longer a 80-90% win guarantee anymore, but it isnt like you are saying, you just have to adjust your play and be a bit more selective with your targets.

sounds like you need to adjust you play and build or pick another class. the patch has changed things, time to adapt. i’ve been building new gear and builds for all of the classes i play.

Sovereign.4217:

mako.2431:

You’re doing it wrong.

Roughly the same build, same exact armor set, same weapons, same playstyle. I’m not the only thief who’s having problems. This most recent patch has negatively affected the thief class, you can’t deny that. Especially in WvW.

Just play differently. You can’t expect everything to work the exact same way like before. Otherwise what would we need a patch for?

Nade exploit is stupid

Only playing d/d+sb since i dislike the gameplay of d/p and s/d. Compared to those builds it always felt weak as it is lacking most of the defensive options a thief has and is easier to counter.
I can confirm that after the patch it got more difficult to play, part of it is the increased cd of Withdraw. I either oneshot the enemy or have to disengage (atleast shortbow movement is really strong now). Longer fights are pretty much not possible for my build.

Anyways i prefer now to play my medi-guardian, it was strong before and feels alot stronger now.

I just picked up my condi thief after the new patch, tonight. Took it for a spin. Pretty much a venom share thief now thanks to that trait but hey, that’s fine with me.

Things melt fast. Like. Insanely fast.

That uhh.. improvisation trait is really RNG but when it DOES land on venoms oh man the torment is reallll.

Sovereign.4217:

mako.2431:

You’re doing it wrong.

Roughly the same build, same exact armor set, same weapons, same playstyle. I’m not the only thief who’s having problems. This most recent patch has negatively affected the thief class, you can’t deny that. Especially in WvW.

LOL

sorry, but with all the changes that came with this patch, did you expect the “same build, same exact armor set, same weapons, same playstyle” to work? Everything has changed, those who adapt will grow stronger. In the end, there are probably many imbalances, but don’t even expect to understand what you are doing wrong, without trying something different.

Even if thieves are the worst profession now in wvw, I’m sure there is tons you can do to adapt until a balance pass is done. Things will fluctuate for a while, but gradually, they will get better.

I also haven’t changed my gear since patch, due to being broke. I also know that some balance patch will drastically change the status quo sometime in the next 1-5 months. Sure I get wrecked, but I’ve been trying many different builds and have been having varying success in wvw. (on my ele who is wearing 90% zerker)

Sovereign.4217:

mako.2431:

You’re doing it wrong.

Roughly the same build, same exact armor set, same weapons, same playstyle. I’m not the only thief who’s having problems. This most recent patch has negatively affected the thief class, you can’t deny that. Especially in WvW.

I deny that, thieves are fine.

Your issue may be that you’re missing the toughness or vitality from your previous build and haven’t noticed. The update removed stats from traits so any defensive stats you received from them will need to be compensated for in your armour since that’s where the extra stat points were distributed.

For example, if you had previously gone fully into Acrobatics then you are now missing 300 vitality (3k health) which would make you die much quicker.

I’ve noticed as long as I twitch a lot, bounce around, dodge and use attunements and water like they are going out of fashion, it’s fine on a staff ele- not very relaxing, but small scale you survive as long as you react real fast to major incoming damage.

I don’t think it’s really correct to say that people are missing toughness/vitality in their builds. I currently and always have run a build with full dire on the trinket/accessory side, and I am much much squishier than before.

The issue isn’t that we lost defense, it’s that all classes (including thief?) gained offense. With the spec patch the game is now really close to something like an FPS where 1-2 shots with a gun will kill you. Whoever gets seen first dies.

I’m actually considering simply dropping all defensive stats for more burst potential, because whoever bursts first will win.

The nerf to thieves’ defenses along with the insane power creep is what you are feeling.

Good Luck

It’s literally a shoot out now in WvW… And thief doesn’t have the sustain to survive in this new super burst land…and thief doesn’t even have as much burst as my ele, warrior, mesmer, guardian, ranger, or engineer…

Thieves are fine but extremely boring now. I gave up my main thief because of that. It is either kill at first jump or die trying. More of a coin toss than pvp for me.

But yesterday I have seen a quite clever and tanky thief with a good sustain and heavy damage. So I guess some people are really adapting to some changes. I advise yoy to find a character that you are good with then thief, if you are really bothered with the changes like I did.

Tank up more, you’re too zerky.