Guild Wars 2

I know people have said for a long time this is a dead game mode, almost memeing it at times. But right now, it seriously is on a lifeline.

Servers have been linked and even in T1 where im at right now, things are pretty empty most nights. There are incredibly empty for T1, a tier that from my experience has always had nonstop activity.

It makes me incredibly sad to see this in WvW. Its always been my main gamemode in this game but Anet is going to have to make a decision very soon to do something very very drastic, I mean big changes to the game mode to fix it, or just call it quits and say we can’t carry on it with it anymore.

I can’t help but say this is completely their fault. They’ve done so little for this gamemode of such massive potential in 4 years.

Anet has put a lot of work into the wvw. Unfortunately they are forever constantly overlooking the problems in the game

The server linking was a big change, and so were skirmishes, but those only happened recently. They are good changes and Tyler has done a good job so far, I like the direction he’s taking it.

However, this should have been done a long time ago by people capable like Tyler. Even though the changes are a step in the right direction, this is very little progress for 4 years.

There are only 4 tiers in wvw right now and all of them are quite empty relative to what they used to be.

The main reason they eventually linked them is because the bottom half of wvw was a ghost town. T1 right now, even with server linking has the same activity level of t4 or t5 did 2 years ago from my memory.

The core problems have never been fixed. Score, population, and rewards. Its a mode that has been flawed from its inception because there has never been any incentive to win a match, because population dictates match. That also means you cant reward winners of the match.

If that could be fixed it would also be good.

If they want to save this mode they need to do something drastic and announce big PR for it as well. No covering stuff up. Whether it be completely redoing the mode or something, its the only chance theyd have at bringing back players.

I sort of doubt theyd do it though, because there may not be as much profit incentive even if a large amount of previous wvw players came back.

The 211 scoring system has been a huge step in the wrong direction.

The main reason they eventually linked them is because the bottom half of wvw was a ghost town. T1 right now, even with server linking has the same activity level of t4 or t5 did 2 years ago from my memory.

Might be time zone related, but anyways, I think they did have a solution for this, which was then rejected by the community (EOTM). The more I look back and think about it, I think they meant EOTM to be how they originally envisioned WvW, and it would solve “most” of those logistic problems (population and coverage), and they could theoretically shift the teams around in the same way they do linking now.

Naturally that didn’t sit well with most of the dedicated WvW players, as most of those want WvW to be a competitive game mode.

The more I look at WvW, I really can’t say it is designed to be competitive at all. All the mechanics and ways things are set up screams casual. I keep wondering what would have happened if ANet actually had included the EOTM setup from the start instead of WvW as is, and how people would react to it, and what the player base would look like (In terms of Casual vs Competitive etc).

/rant

World linking created more problems than it fixed. It made server jumping significantly easier thus resulting with the most inaccurate glicko system that anet ever had to deal with

Hexalot.8194:

Yes population is down everywhere, but you could at least acknowledge in your rant that this is extremely normal this time of year with the Christmas season and all that.

It was Christmas season 2 years ago, and WvW was way, way more active, you are making excuses, just like those that made them in the summer that people were going out enjoying the weather and would be back when the weather gets colder in autumn/winter, it didn’t happen, the game mode is moribund.

IMHO, its the free to play model in WvW. Real easy to get a free account, troll the server your playing against, then log back into your reg account, and watch the fun.

Many a time it sure seemed odd that seige trolls run out a objective, only to have it hit by the enemy a short time later.

There is no easy fix. Servers will always be stacked, multiple accounts just mean people can log into the account of the server that is wining at the time, and steam rolling and karma farming.

IMHO, if it could be done, your i/p should be attached to the server your on, so no server hoping. your where you are, and no free accounts on other servers. Thats my 2 cents.

Anet has put a lot of work into wvw. Especially when it came to kill thee gamemode

I dont see the problem, yes before 2 years the blobs were greater, but why you need big blobs to play wvw?

i would like to see that anet decrease capacity of maps, so each server can bring a maximum of 40 players to the maps. that would stop this newbie blobbers and stop skillaggs in big fights. the players would have to transfer back to smaller server because of qeues, if they want play wvw.

anet DID a lot for wvw in last year, and I hope they will someday understand that they have to increase transfercosts to bigger servers AND their partners to stop the bandwagonners and create a better population balance. than everything would be fine.

SkylightMoon.2098:

The server linking was a big change, and so were skirmishes, but those only happened recently. They are good changes and Tyler has done a good job so far, I like the direction he’s taking it.

However, this should have been done a long time ago by people capable like Tyler.

I agree Tyler is and has put a LOT of effort in and I appreciate him, even if I don’t always agree with his vision for the game mode. I also agree that work restarted on WvW too late.
However, I very much doubt the WvW and PvP teams’ had much to do with Living Story devouring the vast majority of resources put into the game postlaunch by Anet… Less hair involved in that decision I’m thinking https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LhvuomaJaY

zinkz.7045:

Hexalot.8194:

Yes population is down everywhere, but you could at least acknowledge in your rant that this is extremely normal this time of year with the Christmas season and all that.

It was Christmas season 2 years ago, and WvW was way, way more active, you are making excuses, just like those that made them in the summer that people were going out enjoying the weather and would be back when the weather gets colder in autumn/winter, it didn’t happen, the game mode is moribund.

Yeah because it was two freaking years ago. In the current generation MMOs thats basicly cash grabs which survive 3 months before loosing 80% of player, GW2 still stands out as a healthy populated game. But it doesnt change the fact it get older by the day and thus people quit naturally.

That and it’s kittening christmas eve.

1 most of WvW players are pvers
2 wvw players are like 1% of entire gw2 population
3 no incentive to play wvw since it offer no special reward
4 casual players have no chance against guild grp and majority of players are casual players
5 the game mode is totally wrong since ppl need to switch to certain class like rev and guard and certain build just to be able to compete and rest of classes are useless for WvW.

It sound like this guy is from Blackgate and realized the game is dying because BG is no longer winning.
Please open BG so we can fix this.

Dawdler.8521:

zinkz.7045:

Hexalot.8194:

Yes population is down everywhere, but you could at least acknowledge in your rant that this is extremely normal this time of year with the Christmas season and all that.

It was Christmas season 2 years ago, and WvW was way, way more active, you are making excuses, just like those that made them in the summer that people were going out enjoying the weather and would be back when the weather gets colder in autumn/winter, it didn’t happen, the game mode is moribund.

Yeah because it was two freaking years ago. In the current generation MMOs thats basicly cash grabs which survive 3 months before loosing 80% of player, GW2 still stands out as a healthy populated game. But it doesnt change the fact it get older by the day and thus people quit naturally.

That and it’s kittening christmas eve.

You missed the point, I compared to two years ago, because WvW was active year round, people going on about the season are spouting as much BS as those made the same excuse in summer, WvW has reached the state it has because there are so few playing it, simple as that, the season has nothing to do with it.

And yes it is Christmas eve, but it should be obvious people are talking about more than just today.

T1 is empty, please open BG!

It doesn’t take alot to fix WvW, and ANet could have done it with the development time they have invested on trying to invent miraculous solutions. The same situation with PvP, they have tryed to reinvent the wheel to, in the end, use a existing system that works. The developer EGO speaks to high and obvious solutions are ignored. I think soon they will realize that.

The only thing they have done in wvw has been add more siege, add more gear grind, add more maps with more PvE. All their dev time has been spent on tournaments and matchups and the stupid score nobody cares about

All they had to do to improve wvw was assign a couple people to balance it and make it more enjoyable TO ACTUALLY PVP IN and the population would have flourished. But nope, they put all their money behind the ESPORTZZZ garbage and the most kitten excuse to sell stuff in the cash shop, err i mean “expansion”

Everyone I knew who played GW2 played only for WvW and they have all quit and moved on.

zinkz.7045:

Dawdler.8521:

zinkz.7045:

Hexalot.8194:

Yes population is down everywhere, but you could at least acknowledge in your rant that this is extremely normal this time of year with the Christmas season and all that.

It was Christmas season 2 years ago, and WvW was way, way more active, you are making excuses, just like those that made them in the summer that people were going out enjoying the weather and would be back when the weather gets colder in autumn/winter, it didn’t happen, the game mode is moribund.

Yeah because it was two freaking years ago. In the current generation MMOs thats basicly cash grabs which survive 3 months before loosing 80% of player, GW2 still stands out as a healthy populated game. But it doesnt change the fact it get older by the day and thus people quit naturally.

That and it’s kittening christmas eve.

You missed the point, I compared to two years ago, because WvW was active year round, people going on about the season are spouting as much BS as those made the same excuse in summer, WvW has reached the state it has because there are so few playing it, simple as that, the season has nothing to do with it.

And yes it is Christmas eve, but it should be obvious people are talking about more than just today.

I agree. Around this year 2k14 in WvW there were queues popping on t5 and below servers.

Spurnshadow.3678:

The 211 scoring system has been a huge step in the wrong direction.

no, 2 1 1 scoring is a great idea, it stops servers fighting for second place while the “top” server runs away in points because they are being ignored.

CrimeMaker.8612:

SkyShroud.2865:

Erm?

People come and go, game will decline regardless you like it or not, this is the reality. When game decline, merger naturally occur, that’s the cycle of game. Though anet could have delay the decline by doing more productive things. Also, claiming that T1 is empty, which timezone are you referring to or are you simply exaggerating things like all other T1 people always do?

T1 is only active over the weekend. After Monday its pretty empty for T1 all around.

Pretty empty referring to what? 50-men squad? 10-men squad?

SkyShroud.2865:

CrimeMaker.8612:

SkyShroud.2865:

Erm?

People come and go, game will decline regardless you like it or not, this is the reality. When game decline, merger naturally occur, that’s the cycle of game. Though anet could have delay the decline by doing more productive things. Also, claiming that T1 is empty, which timezone are you referring to or are you simply exaggerating things like all other T1 people always do?

T1 is only active over the weekend. After Monday its pretty empty for T1 all around.

Pretty empty referring to what? 50-men squad? 10-men squad?

10 men

Everyone is loosing interest in WvW. I guess Anet is getting what they want. They want people to loose interest in WvW even if you love it and fairweather to spvp or spve

CrimeMaker.8612:

SkyShroud.2865:

CrimeMaker.8612:

SkyShroud.2865:

Erm?

People come and go, game will decline regardless you like it or not, this is the reality. When game decline, merger naturally occur, that’s the cycle of game. Though anet could have delay the decline by doing more productive things. Also, claiming that T1 is empty, which timezone are you referring to or are you simply exaggerating things like all other T1 people always do?

T1 is only active over the weekend. After Monday its pretty empty for T1 all around.

Pretty empty referring to what? 50-men squad? 10-men squad?

10 men

10-men all around is really interesting, I guess it means that even T4 can beat T1 now.

There weren’t queues on all borderlands, and EBG, on christmas eve?!
GAMEMODE DEAD CONFIRMED NO ONE PLAYS.
/melodramatic

CrimeMaker.8612:

Everyone is loosing interest in WvW. I guess Anet is getting what they want. They want people to loose interest in WvW even if you love it and fairweather to spvp or spve

The other parts of the game are no better, Anet still thinks its a matter of rewarding.

People leave game when they notice how this game is ment to be played, builds stats etc, crafting.

There are still a lot more players in pve and at this point i think spvp might just have more players…

I doubt more reward will fix the current issues with WvW atm. Rewards would help but wvw needs something bigger to pull players into it now. When wvw was very popular t1 had 3 server with every map queued during peak hours and Eotm was necessity. With the changes to wvw, its better than it was before HoT but the population is not their due to the other game modes. Raiding is doing very well, Fractals have always been popular (hardcore mode looks very interesting), LS3 maps for casual content and the new pvp updates. That’s a lot to competition, so casual players decide to do something else instead of wvw.

SkylightMoon.2098:

The server linking was a big change, and so were skirmishes, but those only happened recently. They are good changes and Tyler has done a good job so far, I like the direction he’s taking it.

However, this should have been done a long time ago by people capable like Tyler. Even though the changes are a step in the right direction, this is very little progress for 4 years.

FYI he hasn’t been on the team for over 3 months, another dev shipped off to living story…

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/4zrrpn/what_happend_to_tyler_bearce_uanettylerb/

Hexalot.8194:

SkylightMoon.2098:

I know people have said for a long time this is a dead game mode, almost memeing it at times. But right now, it seriously is on a lifeline.

Servers have been linked and even in T1 where im at right now, things are pretty empty most nights. There are incredibly empty for T1, a tier that from my experience has always had nonstop activity.

It makes me incredibly sad to see this in WvW. Its always been my main gamemode in this game but Anet is going to have to make a decision very soon to do something very very drastic, I mean big changes to the game mode to fix it, or just call it quits and say we can’t carry on it with it anymore.

I can’t help but say this is completely their fault. They’ve done so little for this gamemode of such massive potential in 4 years.

Eh… stop being so melodramatic. Yes population is down everywhere, but you could at least acknowledge in your rant that this is extremely normal this time of year with the Christmas season and all that. People have just got better things to do than chase your kitten around the border lands all day.

Would have also been nice of OP to acknowledge T1’s buying habits over the past four years.

Mulling.8421:

It doesn’t take alot to fix WvW

The population imbalance problem apparently does take a lot. Not many RvR games have found a successful 24/7 “even numbers” formula. It would have to be treated more like a structured PvP environment first to solve the issue.

Spurnshadow.3678:

The 211 scoring system has been a huge step in the wrong direction.

Oh please, there are much bigger problems with wvw than a scoring change.

Rewards need to be fixed, especially when spvp gets purchasable ascended before wvw.
Population needs to be fixed, some how in some way other than links.
It needs a revival whether by overhauling the system which they have already scrapped in favor of links, or by actively advertising and running events and promotions to get pve/spvp players into wvw more often.
Separate class balance for wvw needs to be done.

They spent this year tweaking scoring, skirmish mode, points for captures, ppk, it’s time to address the big problem with population both the imbalance between servers and getting new players.

Diku.4620:

You wouldn’t blame water for causing a flood. You’d blame the plumber.
You wouldn’t blame electricity for starting a fire. You’d blame the electrician.

Funny. I’d blame nature for starting a fire and causing a flood.

Pre – Hot 70% more players playing WvW. If nothing happens to WvW soon a lot of players are gonna quit even if there is nothing else out there to play.

Also remember, not just holidays, but relink time…

CrimeMaker.8612:

Pre – Hot 70% more players playing WvW.

Thats an oddly specific number given the fact Anet never show us any metrics.

None of this accords with my experience. I play on two servers, YB and EB, mainly in EU prime but also pretty often in OCX and SEA (EU morning and afternoon). In fact, the only time zone I never see at all is NA prime.

I play most days and have done since launch. I can remember several periods when there were fewer people around, when zergs were smaller or non-existent and when activity was significantly lower. Equally, I can remember busier periods.

I would say the last six months or so have been average in terms of action in WvW at the times I play. Weekends are very busy. If I log in on Sunday morning EU time I can and do find myself in a full zerg within minutes and end up losing six hours. I actually avoid WvW on weekends because it’s too hectic and I get sucked in and spend more time there than I planned.

Weekday mornings (OCX) on YB is always busy. One Aussie-led guild always runs open raids then and musters 30+, while there are generally a couple of other smaller groups around. SEA can be quiet midweek but by the time I get home from work, early EU prime, a couple of other regular Commanders usually have zergs of 30+ running. And of course if DK is on you can double those numbers.

EBay depends who we’re linked with these days but I never found any shortage of action with HoD or SoS. I forget who we had before that. Zerg sizes there are definitely smaller but still there’s no shortage of people out doing stuff.

I think people have a rose-tinted memory of how busy WvW used to be, or else they were in T1/T2 when there were 9 tiers and base everything on that. YB was in T3-5 in the first two years and numbers now seem fairly similar to that. We rarely had queues outside of EBG back then except at weekends as far as I remember it.

Numbers are down across the board, though, as you would expect in a four year old MMO that hasn’t had a new expansion for over a year. PVE is quieter. What else would you expect? WvW was never anywhere even close to being as popular as PvE in the first place and the removal of almost anything that interests PvE players has made that even more the case. Doesn’t mean there aren’t enough people playing WvW to keep things buzzing. How many people does it need, anyway?

I was also thinking of buying a 2nd account so I could bandwagon around looking for a place to play when I log in. Decided that isn’t an acceptable solution, game is just too neglected. Gunna put the money twords an NES classic instead. Nintendo will save the game industry.

Yep, it is. And concentration on population is kittened up so much.
I’m on AG, server has “died” several times over the past 4+ years and coming back always but this is the worst state I’ve seen.

Can you even imagine how much worse it would be if Anet lied to us and didn’t prioritize WvW /s ?

I remembered the days I used to play Daoc till next day without sleeping but with GW2 oh no its bed time cya bye even tho EB keep is under attack lol.

SkyShroud.2865:

CrimeMaker.8612:

SkyShroud.2865:

CrimeMaker.8612:

SkyShroud.2865:

Erm?

People come and go, game will decline regardless you like it or not, this is the reality. When game decline, merger naturally occur, that’s the cycle of game. Though anet could have delay the decline by doing more productive things. Also, claiming that T1 is empty, which timezone are you referring to or are you simply exaggerating things like all other T1 people always do?

T1 is only active over the weekend. After Monday its pretty empty for T1 all around.

Pretty empty referring to what? 50-men squad? 10-men squad?

10 men

10-men all around is really interesting, I guess it means that even T4 can beat T1 now.

“CD Tri-link have a higher population than Blackgate”

this thread is complete nonsense, its XMAS! 3 hours everybody on, 24 hours everybody off 3 hours everybody back it was random before the server linking its random now.
happy xmas wvw even the salty ones.

Blame a Christian holiday for a poorly designed server system. Other times it must be rosh hashana or the summer solstice. That darn easter bunny is killing WvW.

ommmmmmmmmm nom nom nom salty humbug

Jim Hunter.6821:

T1 is empty, please open BG!

You make a good point, but I think the really important subject this holiday is; when will Anet open BG for transfers?

zinkz.7045:

Dawdler.8521:

zinkz.7045:

Hexalot.8194:

Yes population is down everywhere, but you could at least acknowledge in your rant that this is extremely normal this time of year with the Christmas season and all that.

It was Christmas season 2 years ago, and WvW was way, way more active, you are making excuses, just like those that made them in the summer that people were going out enjoying the weather and would be back when the weather gets colder in autumn/winter, it didn’t happen, the game mode is moribund.

Yeah because it was two freaking years ago. In the current generation MMOs thats basicly cash grabs which survive 3 months before loosing 80% of player, GW2 still stands out as a healthy populated game. But it doesnt change the fact it get older by the day and thus people quit naturally.

That and it’s kittening christmas eve.

You missed the point, I compared to two years ago, because WvW was active year round, people going on about the season are spouting as much BS as those made the same excuse in summer, WvW has reached the state it has because there are so few playing it, simple as that, the season has nothing to do with it.

And yes it is Christmas eve, but it should be obvious people are talking about more than just today.

More kitten nonsense. This game has always experienced population drops leading up to, and during festive seasons. This has been happening since year one. And of course overall player participation has dropped since 2014. That’s the natural progression for most MMOs.

Oh and merry Christmas to everyone !

Even the trolls…

Chaba.5410:

The population imbalance problem apparently does take a lot. Not many RvR games have found a successful 24/7 “even numbers” formula. It would have to be treated more like a structured PvP environment first to solve the issue.

It’s impossible to balance a population that goes out of its way to unbalance itself, unless you outright force people to move.

Or you could bring WvW into the loving arms of the megaserver, which has a proven track record for fixing population issues, but isn’t very popular.

Oh please. This has nothing to do with the holidays. Thats a hilarious joke. I came back to the game over a month ago and every week I’ve been surprised to see how T1 now feels like mid tier WvW 1 or 2 years ago.

WvW is hemorrhaging players. Its not a symptom of the game as a whole either. The PVE and PVP population are certainly not like they are at the launch of the game, but they are certainly stable. WvW is not.

Those of you who play in WvW and deny that Anet has neglected this gamemode as if its an unwanted child are only further harming it by not speaking up.

Seriously, no one who has consistently played WvW could actually say claim “No no, its just cuz muh holidays”. Its clearly more than that, so stop bsing about it.

tym.3791:

IMHO, its the free to play model in WvW. Real easy to get a free account, troll the server your playing against, then log back into your reg account, and watch the fun.

Many a time it sure seemed odd that seige trolls run out a objective, only to have it hit by the enemy a short time later.

There is no easy fix. Servers will always be stacked, multiple accounts just mean people can log into the account of the server that is wining at the time, and steam rolling and karma farming.

Free account does not seem to be the problem because players are having fun.

Players are more likely to stay engaged and not quitting when they are having fun.

Free accounts could be an effective counter for siege hump a strategy that annoys many players.

Siege building depends on supplies. Without supplies, sieges could not be built.

One way to destroy supply is to waste them while in the disguise on an opposing server.

• Rewards:

Short term fix, that will make people interested there and then, and die off in weeks/months when most have gotten what they want. And a random small tickle of other people that will come, grind it out and leave, all the while complaining that it is impossible to do solo.

• Scoring:

Scoring only exist as a motivation for people to play and beat the enemy. As long as other underlying issues causes people to not care about fighting, points serve no purpose. As long as one side can beat both others due to population/coverage and a combat system that doesn’t allow you to fight back against the superior numbers, no amount of points is going to make people want to play.

• Population:

Chaba.5410:

Mulling.8421:

It doesn’t take alot to fix WvW

The population imbalance problem apparently does take a lot. Not many RvR games have found a successful 24/7 “even numbers” formula. It would have to be treated more like a structured PvP environment first to solve the issue.

+1 Spot on. There is simply no way we will ever get a balanced Population/Coverage with the WvW structure. They will need to change that entire mechanic, into something that creates even teams if they want to create a Competitive and Fair environment. (Which begs the question, is that what ANet wants ?)