Guild Wars 2

Hello everyone…. First of all i am a commander who is commanding since release… so you know where i am standing. I dont know if you remember the fun times in TS where you “facerubbed” T3s down because you were better than your enemy blob inside a structure.

Nah anyone else remembers? You remember that you were able to take a gate down even if there was a treb and acs just because your melee could rotate their skills and the eles were doing a good job?

Well, we all know since “Hardened Gates” all this is gone. We all know that the WvW-Part of the Guild Hall needs a meaning, we all know that this things are well and actually claiming something means something now. But why do we have less and less possibilities to attack a structure? Just remember:

- Ac dmg nerf back then
- Ac FOV nerf so you cant take trebs on inner gate with an AC down anymore
- Hardened Gates
- Hardened Siege

I know Anet wanted to finally do something so defenders/scouts have a reason to defend and give servers an upper hand if they actually care to defend.

But please think about it:

- No possibility to take down inner treb, if you dont want to build a treb somewhere to take the inner (!) treb down so you actually can build rams.
- The above mentioned nerfs and buffs
-> Inner cannon can easyly destroy rams
-> Inner treb will take down rams quickly and shoot cows so no chance to rebuild in a real fighting situation
-> Smart commanders and blobs can defend VERY easy now without any chance to take down a structure
-> It basically removes gate sieging and moves all sieging to walls with catas/trebs.

It was possible to defend before and now it feels like impossible. Instead of Anet giving equal chances or leaving equal chances to both sides its much more pro defender.

So my proposal:
Removing wont work, i know. Anet doesnt want to do that but:

Nerf Hardened gates in a way that it REDUCES the dmg on the gate by 40-50%? So at least facerubbing WILL be possible still.
Nerf Hardened Siege to dmg reduction by 30-40%.

So hardened gates will make gates HARDER but not indestructible!

Give attackers again some fun back and actually the possibility to destroy gates. As a commander who is commanding since release, all people i know are asking for those buffs to be in the way i supposed.

Thanks for reading and i hope to see some Dev giving his opinion about it.

Hardened gate is how the gate should work since the begining….
And hardened siege bah… Canon and oil are a death trap for the user if you have enough caster with you…
But yes, the HoT stuff make the keep on ABL far harder to take…. Hills good defended is close to impossible to take now ! It was hard before, now it’s close to impossible…

As scout I like that, but shield gen are really over powered and should never be added.

i basically agree with Sich.

The gate is the best defended and protected area in the castle. hardened gates is the reflection of that i don’t think its working bad or against its design.

Atm the wall/catapult alternatives are a valid alternative for going trough the gates.

As for the shield gen make the interaction range larger so if you have active skill on one the other gets blocked skill-use, that way the gates and walls aren’t 24/7 protected.

Don’t make it invulnerable to catapult or trebuchet attack if it gets hit without its skills active.

Yeah, it was always cheesy to be able to nuke down the gate of a fortified keep by bashing any number of staves and swords and daggers against it! " We don’t care that you’ve taken the time to properly build defences to your keep and even have the people to man them – we’re The Blob and we’re coming in!"

Personally, I think it might be OK if certain long cooldown utility skills (e.g ele) were able to do damage, but not 1-5.

Humm…before asking for a nerf to adress a tactical issue, perhaps should we adpat our play style first?

Breaking canons, and so on is still quick if you have the number in your zerg with you, and/or you can always use balistas for that.

A good organisation is also to ask to roaming groups to prepare the zerg assaut destroying canons and so on with balista. Two players are sufficient to build and use a balista.

And for the doors…well…if they are correctly defended, why not to choose to Attack a less defended wall section with catapults?….

Honnestly I do not see the issue with Hardened Gates and Hardened Siege.

They just make you, as a commander, in an obligation to better organize your assault…perhaps by setting up a real siege making a “ninja operation” less easy.

To conquer a correctly defended keep you need to weaken it first…cutting supply, perhaps conquering its support points first (towers), and finlay organizing a network of siege machine (treb protected by shield generators, balistas, and perharps carts…)…

And it ’s a good thing for the interest of the game.

Hardened gates one is a good one. Imo it should not be an upgrade but standard when a structure hits t3.

I think that Hardened Gates is necessary when u have outnumbered buff, so pls dont give easy life to the blobs against outnumbered enemies.

Ermmm?

Isn’t hardened gate as intended, prevent people to pvd literally?
So you saying to promote pvding?

SkyShroud.2865:

Ermmm?

Isn’t hardened gate as intended, prevent people to pvd literally?
So you saying to promote pvding?

Sounds like it. These are the exact counter measures provided against ktrains.

Anvil.9230:

Humm…before asking for a nerf to adress a tactical issue, perhaps should we adpat our play style first?

Breaking canons, and so on is still quick if you have the number in your zerg with you, and/or you can always use balistas for that.

A good organisation is also to ask to roaming groups to prepare the zerg assaut destroying canons and so on with balista. Two players are sufficient to build and use a balista.

And for the doors…well…if they are correctly defended, why not to choose to Attack a less defended wall section with catapults?….

Honnestly I do not see the issue with Hardened Gates and Hardened Siege.

They just make you, as a commander, in an obligation to better organize your assault…perhaps by setting up a real siege making a “ninja operation” less easy.

To conquer a correctly defended keep you need to weaken it first…cutting supply, perhaps conquering its support points first (towers), and finlay organizing a network of siege machine (treb protected by shield generators, balistas, and perharps carts…)…

And it ’s a good thing for the interest of the game.

This +1.

I love the hardened gates. Not a fan of the shield generators so much, but they can be used by both sides.

Looks like the OP just wants to steamroll karma train t3 keeps with his blob without having to use any tactics at all. Ballistas are a wonderful thing, learn to use them, speed build a treb, attack from 3 points at the same time (co ordinate over ts), and above all, have a havoc squad taking down siege, draining supply, preventing dollies reaching it, cap camps so defenders can’t resupply, etc. Hills can take a long time to take if defended and t3, but it’s really great fun doing it whilst outnumbered 2 or 3 to 1 (the Kodash mega blob!) and needs some determination.

It’s not EoTM, if you want to mindlessly karma train, go there. ABL requires a bit more thought and tactics against people who want to defend.

I still find it amusing that we have so many players who turn and run at the first sign of bigger numbers, or who stand on walls waving at the catapults taking down garri wall as they are afraid of getting their pixels hurt, rather than engaging their brain and porting up, go around, attack from behind suiciding on the siege several times until it’s down.

WvW might actually require brains to win soon, not face rubbing doors.

tony.9425:

Hello everyone…. First of all i am a commander who is commanding since release… so you know where i am standing. I dont know if you remember the fun times in TS where you “facerubbed” T3s down because you were better than your enemy blob inside a structure.
….
Give attackers again some fun back and actually the possibility to destroy gates. As a commander who is commanding since release, all people i know are asking for those buffs to be in the way i supposed.

Thanks for reading and i hope to see some Dev giving his opinion about it.

Really the only credible or logical statements I found were these. You have been commanding since release…that’s great? You gotta have some actual solid arguments to make claims and posts like this though. From my perspective it was a: I want this and I want that and there’s no real logical explanation for this reversion/change other than my personal needs and nostalgia factors demand it, kind of post.

You know how people want umbrella’s when its raining out? It’s like you are asking that they provide people only half an umbrella, because you find it funny and amusing when people don’t have a full umbrella….and people didn’t used to have umbrella’s back in ur dayyyyyy. I mean changing things out of the sake of majority of votes is apparently something anet considers now, but having these things also completely devoid of all sense of logic? That’s gonna ruin the gamemode.

I never understood the player base’s needs to cleave gates. As some1 else mentioned its more surprising that fortified gates aren’t pvd immune by default. I mean if it means so much to you that you have the opportunity to rofl pvd’ing gates….just find something that doesn’t have the upgrades on it and have at it. Everyone needs to make a little sacrifice here and there to make wvsw great again. Yours apparently is pretty hefty, and I’m sure everyone not on board will gladly offer you their sympathies….?

Dhemize.8649:

SkyShroud.2865:

Ermmm?

Isn’t hardened gate as intended, prevent people to pvd literally?
So you saying to promote pvding?

Sounds like it. These are the exact counter measures provided against ktrains.

Still not a hard counter, Ktrain will just spawn more rams into it, and towers/clastles are easy to take due everything has a very easy spot to stress up the defenses that they will loose it.

Hardened gates do in fact divert the ktrain which is why I like them. A handul of us have held a keep against a zerg simply by laying supply traps and providing a modicum of defense at the gate in question. They run over that supply traps a few times with that nearest supply source now empty, they move on to something easier very often to another map.

Prior to hardened gates, were they to run over a supply trap they would just Pvd the door.

babazhook.6805 well it looks that counters awfully bad players then XD, were lucky that wvw is full of them.

To hills and how hard it is to take. I like that now even from the perspective of the side taking it. Some of the battles are epic in scale and the sense of accomplishment when it finally falls is very real.

It a long process of wearing the enemy down, making sure no supply gets their way, hitting from different directions using everything from trebs in North east camps to rams at the door, retreating as one licks ones wounds and going at it again. It feinting at or taking other objectives in the hope that the enemy drawn away to defend. It using misdirection such as hitting South gate with rams and a zerg even as trebs are quickly thrown up in NEC to attack the northern wall.

It getting to the Lords room after finally breaking through only to have the enemy Zerg arrive just as you enter with epic fights on the bridge.

Hills fights are more fun than SMC fights in my opinion and part of that is it easier to defend and a harder nut to crack.

Since the patch has nerfed those scribe buff, please nerf the scribing cost according as well.

I like how hard it is to flip upgraded keeps now since it is leading to more fights.

The correct tactic is to stop the keeps from upgrading in the first place.