Guild Wars 2

I think it is about time, that not only was Down state FIXED for all classes IE – so that they are ALL useful and not just Ele, Thief actually get GOOD downstate skills but i think Stealth stomping should be removed as well, I would go as far to say that Stability stomping should be removed, unless ALL classes are given Ele/Thief style downskills that make it so that Stealth and Stability kills aren’t simply to easy.

Ele – Moveable Invul
Thief – Stealth
Warrior – Knockdown
Mesmer – Stealth (requires target)
Ranger – Stun
Guardian AoE Knockdown
Engineer – Pull down(?)
Necro – Fear

Even the Downstate 2 skills are unbalanced but Downstate 3 is just as bad.

Would giving EVERY class the Warrior Downstate 3 with obviously different name and such added to it be any better? Because while might say “oh but its unique don’t want everyone to be the same” That doesn’t stop it from being VERY unbalanced

So i would take EVERY one having the same downstate, of course with different names than have it the way it currently is where you are simply dead in seconds unless you are on a specific class.

1) Deal Damage (unique name for each class)
2) AoE stun/knockback (unique name for each class)
3) Vengeance unique name for each class)
4) Bandage

What do people think about this idea? They could have it so maybe they give conditions different for some classes or something, Or make the damage higher but with no conditions to spread it out, The AoE Stun/Knockback could vary as well – Necro could get AoE fear or something for example

Vengeance wise, Think all classes COULD have it, some trickier to pull off such as Thief a Ranger for example could be ressed by its pet or something…

The downed mechanism is not a way to rally everytime (especially when in like a 1v1) it is basically a way to give you a small chance to get back in the fight. Although I admit that that some downed abilities are better than others, not naming any class in particular (cough Elementalist), some could use a small buff or nerf but giving every class the (almost) exact same downed skills does not really make sense to me. So much for class uniqueness!
And you want to see stability or stealth stomping removed from the game? Better learn to live with it because I do not see Anet remove that

PS:
Stealth stomping with blind on stealth as a thief is so satisfying :P

Peixe.1804:

The downed mechanism is not a way to rally everytime (especially when in like a 1v1) it is basically a way to give you a small chance to get back in the fight. Although I admit that that some downed abilities are better than others, not naming any class in particular (cough Elementalist), some could use a small buff or nerf but giving every class the (almost) exact same downed skills does not really make sense to me. So much for class uniqueness!
And you want to see stability or stealth stomping removed from the game? Better learn to live with it because I do not see Anet remove that

PS:
Stealth stomping with blind on stealth as a thief is so satisfying :P

I know its not a rally every time sort of thing, but the simple fact is it is VERY unbalanced, it is meant to give you a chance to delay getting killed – Except that is simply not the case for most classes Once you are down you are dead in seconds with that in mind – they may as well just remove downstate altogether but of course they won’t due to all the finishers they sell on the GemStore, the ONLY part of the game they care about.

Screw uniqueness, either we all have great downstate (ele, Thief, Warrior – with #3) or we all have crappy ones such as Engineer and it is about time that Stealth stomping is removed it simply offers NO defense, you simply can’t defend against a skill that you cant hit with, unless of course you are a Thief or Ele in which case you can wait a second or so jump into Mist form and escape the attempt or just teleport somewhere else isnt that how ALL of them are meant to be designed so that you can’t win very well if the fight sucked but you can delay them and possibly get them down – How do you delay something that you cant interrupt/stun/fear away?

Same goes for Stability stomping, either every class gets easy access to stability or none should seeing as how most of the downstate #2 skills are simply useless against Stability – except for yet against Thief and Ele…

Stealth stomping is fine, your team mates can counter it if they have half a brain.

No, not every class should get easy access to stability.

I agree they need to fix the large downed state imbalance though… T1 ele T2 thief, mes T3 ranger, guard T4 war, necro, eng. It’s a year and a half into the game and it’s just 3 skills (4th is universal). No one really cares about the aa that much so just make 2/3 on par with each other. What the kitten, 2 skills… balance them.

You can have them be unique and still balanced. Say for example… eng gets a #2 that blows himself away in a direction. Still different than the rest, still a high chance of being able to stop that first stomp from multiple players.

Ok, but only work if remove stability/invulnerability and others while stomping enemys.

Justice for all.

Aberrant.6749:

Stealth stomping is fine, your team mates can counter it if they have half a brain.

Assuming all fights are group fights, i have had many a time where i have nearly had a Thief downed but thanks to them going Stealth i have died. If he couldn’t have gone stealth he would have been downed as well – then it would have become another story.

If it’s 1v1 and you’re downed and he’s not it’s gg at that point anyways. Even if you do get them downed it’s not like you’ll finish him off before he finishes you off since you’ll probably have quite a bit less downed hp (save possibly war).

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

they may as well just remove downstate altogether but of course they won’t due to all the finishers they sell on the GemStore, the ONLY part of the game they care about.

the downstate is one of the main mechanics that makes GW2 unique as a MMO.

Aberrant.6749:

If it’s 1v1 and you’re downed and he’s not it’s gg at that point anyways. Even if you do get them downed it’s not like you’ll finish him off before he finishes you off since you’ll probably have quite a bit less downed hp (save possibly war).

The problem is the fact that the downstate skills are meant to give you a fighting chance to rally, sure you have been downed but i have been downed plenty of times with the other person a few hits away from being down, they then go stealth for an easy unpreventable stomp – that ISN’T how it should be considering certain classes can and easily do counter stealth stomp – EVERY class should have this, not just the select few.

Peixe.1804:

the downstate is one of the main mechanics that makes GW2 unique as a MMO.

Yeah and its insanely unbalanced, but that is Anet all over…

Discordia.7293:

Ok, but only work if remove stability/invulnerability and others while stomping enemys.

Justice for all.

Totally agree, NONE of it should work for stomping. you should NOT get a guaranteed stomp against 6/8 classes down to your class having certain mechanics the others don’t have.

Bananaling.9673:

Stealth stomp is the only way a thief can stomp anyone. Play it and see if u can stomp any one with out it in a group fight. At least the rest can tank thru it. L2p so u don’t lose 1v1 warrior

Downstates have ONE interrupt/stun/fear – How exactly can a thief not do that 1 Vs1? Why does a class need stealth at all to stomp someone, unless of course you need stealth to actually down someone at all…

Bananaling.9673:

Stealth stomp is the only way a thief can stomp anyone. Play it and see if u can stomp any one with out it in a group fight. At least the rest can tank thru it. L2p so u don’t lose 1v1 warrior

totally agree with this, the stealth stomp also is pretty much our only way to ever get a stomp in a 2v1 or 3v1 situation. Well shadowstep could work too I guess.

Guess it is gonna come down to repeating arguments from now on. It is a part of the game. Live with it or leave it

Like I said play it before u complain. I can stomp with stability fine on my guardian and warrior. U can get feared knock down in stealth. Like I said don’t get downed in the first place. Unless it’s a group or Zerg fight or even spvp no one will complain

Peixe.1804:

totally agree with this, the stealth stomp also is pretty much our only way to ever get a stomp in a 2v1 or 3v1 situation. Well shadowstep could work too I guess.

Why should you though? Look at other classes, hell i know that EVERY TIME my first “Finish” attempt will fail – simply due to my total lack of Stability. Why should a class/or classes have such a way they can finish people when said downed people have NO way to counter it…

You know you can always adept, maybe change your traits a bit or something else. Guess you won’t but it is something that you can do if you wanna get that stomp the first time.

Peixe.1804:

You know you can always adept, maybe change your traits a bit or something else. Guess you won’t but it is something that you can do if you wanna get that stomp the first time.

Yeah because wasting 30 trait points for Stability inside DS when you can’t stomp in deathshroud will help me SO much. Or maybe a 50second cool down 1second stability will help? Nope that won’t either.

It has nothing to do with my build, more to do with how unbalanced the game is. Then again it would not be Anet if Downstated wasnt just as unbalanced as the rest of the game, so i guess they are going to say its “working as intended”

Simply put: Stealth, Stability, Invul NONE of these should work on “Finisher”

Simply Put Part 2: ALL classes should either get Thie/Ele standard downstate or everyone should get Engineer standard downstate

Stability stomps are worse. Nothing teammates can do against those except damage them down.

At least with stealth stomps the thief gives up a precious utility or burns a bunch of initiative. They are also still vulnerable to any kind of control or damage. Thieves also lack the ability to tolerate focused fire so dropping AoE on a downed ally often gets free kills.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/if-there-was-no-downstate-a-hypothetical/first

LOL One thread wanting to get rid of downed state another to make it harder to Stomp.

Arnon.1563:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/if-there-was-no-downstate-a-hypothetical/first

LOL One thread wanting to get rid of downed state another to make it harder to Stomp.

Thats pretty much it – Some classes have it TO easy to stomp certain other classes. Its not balanced at all, it should either be ALL hard to get a stomp off or every class should get a skill that means they can stomp without risk, some classes have it while others don’t

Then you have just how unbalanced the downstates are for the person on the ground. Some classes get Stealth and moveable Invul – Others get something that is EASILY countered by certain classes with either Stealth or Stability, again easy for some downed classes, hard for others. No balance.

mrmadhaze.8706:

ArmaQQonAsh get an hobby pls, this stealth crusade start to be really childish

Don;‘t like my posts or Threads? Don’t read them. Is it SO hard for you to see a post and think “Oh, i know that guy he hates XYZ better not read it or i’ll kitten and moan again” Is it REALLY that hard? Well, maybe for you…

I can’t imagine Anet making much money off downed finishers to begin with. It just seems like it’d be the most useless thing for sale. The flags don’t stay out long, and I sure don’t have the time to admire a flag in the middle of a battle. I don’t think the person you killed really cares either.

Just get rid of the finishers and refund the gems to whom ever bought them and removed downed state completely from WvW.

People can’t complain about what’s balanced or imbalanced about it if it didn’t exist.

Lets have a look see here….
Warrior: Stability stomp
Guardian: Stability stomp
Engineer: Elixir S stomp
Thief: Stealth, shadowstep stomp
Ranger: Stability stomp
Elementalist: Mist Form stomp
Mesmer: Invuln, stealth stomp
Necro: lolgoodjoke

I really don’t think these stomps should be removed, (if anything, buff necros), just thief’s and elementalist’s #2 be changed a bit. In most 1v1 situations however, you’re pretty much done if you’re downed and your enemy isn’t, so when you use your downed skills, you are delaying the inevitable 99% of the time. That 1% chance being a teammate is coming or your enemy is at like 1% health. This is coming from a thief so it probably sounds biased, but its just my opinion.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Aberrant.6749:

If it’s 1v1 and you’re downed and he’s not it’s gg at that point anyways. Even if you do get them downed it’s not like you’ll finish him off before he finishes you off since you’ll probably have quite a bit less downed hp (save possibly war).

The problem is the fact that the downstate skills are meant to give you a fighting chance to rally, sure you have been downed but i have been downed plenty of times with the other person a few hits away from being down, they then go stealth for an easy unpreventable stomp – that ISN’T how it should be considering certain classes can and easily do counter stealth stomp – EVERY class should have this, not just the select few.

I disagree that they are supposed to give you a fighting chance 1v1. They are meant to delay the stomp so an ally can help you. Some downed states fail at that pretty kittenLY in PvE would I agree that they are there to help you rally by yourself.

Well lets look at this with some current classes. Guardian can stop a stealth stomp. However, mesmer can not (they need a target in order to use deception). Does that mean mesmer downed needs a buff? No… because mesmer has a downed state that’s overall stronger than a guardian’s downed state in most situations. That’s pretty well balanced imo.

The ones I have a problem with are war/eng/necro. The difference between an aoe and single target projectile cc on the #2 skill is just too vast (ok necro’s isn’t a projectile, but it’s still bad).

@SeNoZinD I agree invuln stomping is far more powerful than stealth stomping… and I don’t think they should be removed either.

The Down system has always been god awful, just encourages zerging and terrible gameplay.

If anything stomping needs to be made faster and easier. Downed-States that have no counters (Ele and….to an extent Mesmers) need a nerf.

Stomping is already down-right suicidal in some situations. There’s a reason barely anyone stomps in WvW. It’s just too dangerous and annoying.

That’s why the only time people stomp is in 1v1 situations and if you lost fair and square then suck it up. You don’t have the right to delay each finisher twice before dying.

Against a lot of classes, Its better to not even bother stomping, like a thief for example, you might as well just damage them to death, will take about as much time as it does to stomp them.

SeNoZinD.9874:

Necro: lolgoodjoke

Nah, blind stomp is pretty effective. Stealth only beats it (and all other stomps) vs. mesmer.

Not sure why people complain about stealth stomp when thieves have blind fields anyways.

Terravos.4059:

The Down system has always been god awful, just encourages zerging and terrible gameplay.

That’s not really the fault of the downed state itself, but the rally/res systems we have in place atm.

Interesting, I, personally, really enjoy the function of the downed state, as well as the stomp mechanic. I think it adds a level of strategy, and challenge to combat in both 1v1’s, small group, and zerging. You need to change how you approach a stomp in all of those situations based off your current surroundings, allies you may or may not have with you, as well as the class you’re trying to stomp. Sometimes your best bet is to go straight for the stomp yourself, sometimes you need to let someone else do it. Sometimes you should simply move on to another target (say you just downed an ele by a tower or keep door, don’t waste your time), other times you have your necro team mate put a fear down to drive enemy rezzers off so you can get the stomp off. Then maybe your in a zerg group, and if you try to stomp 12 red circles will pop up on you half way through and wipe you before you get the stomp off. Maybe then you should send your mesmer in to use distortion for the stomp while surviving the AoE’s, maybe that key kill rallies a few team mates who turn the tide. Well, you get the idea, its a mechanic that can reward strategy and tactics, it also can punish a lack of thought if you’re not careful. Some classes are better for it, while other classes strength lies elsewhere. Personally I try to focus on making sure I maximize my advantages through strategy and tactics rather than worry about getting things changed to suit what I want, or get rid of what I dont like, but then again, I’m no game designer and maybe things are bad and need changing.