Like in PvP, players were able to rally off the deaths of guards and lords. Now, players cannot, but for some reason in WvW, it still exists. And this is a bad mechanic when fighting small team fights in the lord’s room of a tower or keep. All a player has to do is kill a random NPC and they rally. Like…really?
It turns a fight completely around in favor of the person who, by all rights, is dead. This needs to change for the better as guard rallies can tilt a fight the wrong way.
But the scouts for ex are the main reason i die while fighting near a keep/camp. They help alot so it wouldnt be fair to count them off. Blindind and stuns from guards have saved way more people than rallying from one.
Or you can call it quick thinking on there part for finishing off a guard who was already low on health.
If you can’t pop stab and pin him, then unload an AoE or also use your quick thinking and have your chill/snare/cripple immob ready knowing he will pop back up any second at 25% health or so and burn him down again. Mechanic is there for a reason. WvW is not sPvP
Wouldnt mind if they disabled this. Also the random 1500 range knockdown from archer that flings you off a wall.
Wvw is becoming more and more brainless and this would add to it: so go for it. I don’t think anyone cares anymore anyway.
Only one person can rally from said NPC since the rally changes, right? I don’t think it’s a big deal either way, honestly. Though I see your point, in my many, many hours of WvW, it has rarely been a real issue.
As someone else here has said, NPC’s helping you by blinding or stunning someone happens a lot more often. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve gotten a free stealth from the pistol NPC’s by using Ranger GS #3 Swoop to leap through their invisible Smoke Field.
Or the number of times I’ve died getting caught by bolas while being chased and trying to avoid the players’ skills -.-
I’m fine with 1 rally, I rage quit when I’m fighting 1vX in a camp neither of us own and the other player gets rallied several times because I can’t get a stomp off with his buddy wailing on me or killing off a guard to get him up.
But that’s really just a problem with how forgiving the stupid rally system is. You really should only get the downed state every few minutes, anything more than that and you are being hard carried by that idiotic game mechanic.
I’m fine with 1 rally, I rage quit when I’m fighting 1vX in a camp neither of us own and the other player gets rallied several times because I can’t get a stomp off with his buddy wailing on me or killing off a guard to get him up.
But that’s really just a problem with how forgiving the stupid rally system is. You really should only get the downed state every few minutes, anything more than that and you are being hard carried by that idiotic game mechanic.
I think starting health penalties in downed state should just be more severe each time you down. You don’t lose enough when chain-rallying at the moment. The third down while in the same instance of combat and you should be slain outright, no 4/5/6 tries.
You alreaday get a penalty, the grey, yellow, red button next to your healthbar. I think you can rally 4 times, after that it’s insta dead. It has been hampered with down state enough to make it rather hard to rally in zergs – I don’t really think we need more although it can be annoying but that’s a thing you have to deal with:
Enemy in your camp, guards low = heal them
Enemy in a camp not owned by you 2: gamble.
I am not talking camps here, I am talking team scale fights in a tower lord’s room. Not solo roaming either, this is with a 5v5 fight to keep a tower and when we focus one person they rally off a guard because they got lucky. They by all rights are dead! And they got lucky to res off a guard and are invulnerable for that short period so that my team’s cooldowns are up.
It’s a silly mechanic to have people res off a guard that does nothing but cripple/poison/blind or stun/immobilize/weaken. Guards are trash mobs and should be not used for a rally bot.
If you are bothered about guards rallying people don’t let your enemies get to the guards in the first place or let them clear out the guards before you enter the fray. You choose to fight alongside the guards so you will have to deal with the possible rally, just as your enemies have to deal with all the npc skills.
I am not talking camps here, I am talking team scale fights in a tower lord’s room. Not solo roaming either, this is with a 5v5 fight to keep a tower and when we focus one person they rally off a guard because they got lucky. They by all rights are dead! And they got lucky to res off a guard and are invulnerable for that short period so that my team’s cooldowns are up.
It’s a silly mechanic to have people res off a guard that does nothing but cripple/poison/blind or stun/immobilize/weaken. Guards are trash mobs and should be not used for a rally bot.
So, there’s usually 5 npcs in a camp and 5 npcs in a tower – yeah sorry I spoke of camps – it’s totally different.
And btw: if npcs are bothering you in a 5 vs 5 then you’re doing something very wrong.
And actually that was what I initially meant.
I don’t care about rallying off of guards. I want people to stop rallying off of siege. :/
Edit: typo
(edited by Famine.7915)
^ yeah, what cleaver clogs thought of that 1. lets allow to people rally of siege weapons
If a guy has the right intelligence and reflexes to rally from a guard while fighting you, I think he deserves to do so. It is not wise to dumb down the game that much. It is already going down the drain. So, in my personal opinion, some tricks should remain at least.
Trimming downed state will probably go further than removing rally off of guards. Is rediculous how hard downed state carries too many players. It’s no wonder people can put the old adage safety in numbers to shame.
Like in PvP, players were able to rally off the deaths of guards and lords. Now, players cannot, but for some reason in WvW, it still exists. And this is a bad mechanic when fighting small team fights in the lord’s room of a tower or keep. All a player has to do is kill a random NPC and they rally. Like…really?
It turns a fight completely around in favor of the person who, by all rights, is dead. This needs to change for the better as guard rallies can tilt a fight the wrong way.
I agree, its ironic that its HELPS to fight with NPCs attacking you!!! Personally I’d remove the downed state entirely from WvW. Its just a pain in the kitten which favours larger groups over smaller one. 2v1 is hard enough as it is, without the massive advantage the down state adds.
I have to agree, that rallying off guards needs to be removed. It’s annoying enough seeing people getting insta rezzed constantly during fights, but letting people rally off of guards is to much and needs to be removed.
I can see both sides.
Both like the mechanic for being something unique to GW2 and saving me a whole lot of times.
But also specifically in 2vs1, even if you down one of the others, you might not be able to finish them off, as the other player keeps harassing you if you try to finish him.
On the whole I liked the changes they did a while back, to allow only 1 rally at a time, instead of the whole pack, that fixed the worst problems with Rally. Guess I’m willing to let the rest work as is for now.
You already cannot rally off ambient creatures in WvW. Only from enemy teams’ NPCs.
Killing a guard when downed without any preparation is not that easy. The downed person probably intentionally took the guards to low health before you and your friends downed him.
I do that often while solo capturing supply camps when I know there are many enemy roamers nearby. The rally is my ticket to escape when things go south.
If this a case when you cannon down someone killing gate guards and he rallies and escapes, you have no symphaty from me. Man up, leave the cannon and go out finish him.
Yes, a rally can turn the fight around. You need to incorporate the possibility to your tactics. It is well mindless skill spam at the same target does not always work.
Is rediculous how hard downed state carries too many players.
Couldn’t agree more.
Can’t tell you how many kitten times I’ve been winning an outnumbered fight and lost because I couldn’t get a stomp off in time. Drives me insane when I’m doing well in a 1vX but I end up losing because I can’t safe stomp or because one of them rallies.
I enjoy outnumbered fights but the downed state thing can be a huge hindrance at times.
Is rediculous how hard downed state carries too many players.
Couldn’t agree more.
Can’t tell you how many kitten times I’ve been winning an outnumbered fight and lost because I couldn’t get a stomp off in time. Drives me insane when I’m doing well in a 1vX but I end up losing because I can’t safe stomp or because one of them rallies.
I enjoy outnumbered fights but the downed state thing can be a huge hindrance at times.
I don’t think you can really count it doing a 1vX when you were surrounded by allied blind/stun spamming NPCs or in the case of the OP also a Champion tower lord.
People won’t rally off guards if you are not fighting by the guards… Simple as that. If you people are seeking the NPCs help, you’ll have to deal with the mechanics.
Is rediculous how hard downed state carries too many players.
Couldn’t agree more.
Can’t tell you how many kitten times I’ve been winning an outnumbered fight and lost because I couldn’t get a stomp off in time. Drives me insane when I’m doing well in a 1vX but I end up losing because I can’t safe stomp or because one of them rallies.
I enjoy outnumbered fights but the downed state thing can be a huge hindrance at times.
I don’t think you can really count it doing a 1vX when you were surrounded by allied blind/stun spamming NPCs or in the case of the OP also a Champion tower lord.
People won’t rally off guards if you are not fighting by the guards… Simple as that. If you people are seeking the NPCs help, you’ll have to deal with the mechanics.
They trim quoted me, they are not talking about kill guard rally.
Well then it’s worse. Downed state is a part of this game that won’t be removed. No point in complaining about that.
Well then it’s worse. Downed state is a part of this game that won’t be removed. No point in complaining about that.
Said trimming downed state. They already are looking at trimming it in spvp I think.
Trimming it as what? Not rally off anything? Not let people ress you? Any other change to the current downed state pretty much break the whole reason it is there.
Trimming it as what? Not rally off anything? Not let people ress you? Any other change to the current downed state pretty much break the whole reason it is there.
Trimming as in I’m not sure but it should get some trim in pvp formats. Maybe in the hp, no joke some players are more tanky lying on the ground than standing, or the laughable 4 times downed in 1min = death(finally).
The whole reason it exists is that casual everyday players are not getting uu-tea-eff wrekt by no-chance-to-recover-one-shots.
Often times in a roaming situation, you are either late to the draw and find players already attacking the guards/lord or right in time to watch the wall/door go down in which case, many players push the lord’s room anyway.
Good case today was me fighting 1v2 against a guard and reaper in desert borderlands’ NEC. I down the guard and fighting the reaper when an NPC dies and the guard rallies. Now I am low health, fighting off this guard who has full health and his reaper. That should never be the case. I should not have to be worried about dealing with a guardian back at full health who was just in downed state.
I managed to finally kill them both but only after being downed myself. Case in point should never happen in a situation like that.
NO THANKS. This is not a thing. We don’t want dev time wasted on this nonsense.
this sounds more like a L2P complaint more then anything else.
Good case today was me fighting 1v2 against a guard and reaper in desert borderlands’ NEC. I down the guard and fighting the reaper when an NPC dies and the guard rallies. Now I am low health, fighting off this guard who has full health and his reaper. That should never be the case. I should not have to be worried about dealing with a guardian back at full health who was just in downed state.
You did a 1v2 with NPCs helping you… If there was no guards he wouldn’t rally. You could have waited they had killed all guards prior engaging if you didn’t wanted to deal with that. Again, you chose to fight under NPCs so you carry the burden of it.
Good case today was me fighting 1v2 against a guard and reaper in desert borderlands’ NEC. I down the guard and fighting the reaper when an NPC dies and the guard rallies. Now I am low health, fighting off this guard who has full health and his reaper. That should never be the case. I should not have to be worried about dealing with a guardian back at full health who was just in downed state.
You did a “1v2” with NPCs helping you… If there was no guards he wouldn’t rally. You could have waited they had killed all guards prior engaging if you didn’t wanted to deal with that. Again, you chose to fight under NPCs so you carry the burden of it.
Wouldn’t mind turning down state off…except then there would be no stomps. Stomping people is one of the few fun things left in the game and lets pug scrubs like me cash in an extra point of ppk when we have bloodlust. Maybe down state nerf then.
I wouldn’t mind if all the random animals wandering around became the 1 hit kill variety. Getting blind sided by a boar during a fight is funny if you still manage to win.
Good case today was me fighting 1v2 against a guard and reaper in desert borderlands’ NEC. I down the guard and fighting the reaper when an NPC dies and the guard rallies. Now I am low health, fighting off this guard who has full health and his reaper. That should never be the case. I should not have to be worried about dealing with a guardian back at full health who was just in downed state.
You did a “1v2” with NPCs helping you… If there was no guards he wouldn’t rally. You could have waited they had killed all guards prior engaging if you didn’t wanted to deal with that. Again, you chose to fight under NPCs so you carry the burden of it.
I went into a fight to defend my camp. NPCs do not help anything once they burn their main skills. Auto weakness/cripple. A rabbit could do more than an NPC. Engaging when an enemy is in combat and using their skills would be more preferable to waiting until they were out of combat.
Again, my issue is nothing about l2p and timing issues. It’s about unfair shifts in fights when a player is able to rally off NPC cannon fodder. Since the consensus of these replies all agree NPCs are nothing more than that.
Just because you think it’s advantageous fight them while they are in combat doesn’t change the fact that you KNEW they could rally off NPCs and still CHOSE to engage them anyway. The camp don’t insta flip once all NPCs are dead, you could have waited last NPC die and jump in to fight while they problably still had some skills on CD and fought without any issue.
If you are going to fight along with NPCs then you carry the burden of it.
Just because you think it’s advantageous fight them while they are in combat doesn’t change the fact that you KNEW they could rally off NPCs and still CHOSE to engage them anyway. The camp don’t insta flip once all NPCs are dead, you could have waited last NPC die and jump in to fight while they problably still had some skills on CD and fought without any issue.
If you are going to fight along with NPCs then you carry the burden of it.
You seem to think I disagree with you about carrying the burden of choice. And in order not to get this thread closed, I will not argue with you anymore.
There exists in WvW a concept of PvP over PvE (unless you are in EotM or it’s ktrain day). If that is the case, then let PvP supersede the PvE elements in situations where it could turn a fight on its head. Fighting regardless of location or pretense means a player(s) verseus player(s) situation and that is what I am focusing on.
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