Guild Wars 2

Is this considered a legitimate strategy by Anet? Seems like it goes against the intentions set forth by the game. I’m sure this has been discussed before. Just curious if there is a dev response to this issue.

The issue (if it is) is broader – no friendly fire. You dont question AoEs affecting only enemies so why question siege doig the same?

I remember they commented on it before and basically said while they don’t like it they can’t really fix it either right now. It would require a substantial rewrite to the game engine. Maybe someday they’ll add occlusion, but for now we’re stuck without it.

Better not fix it…would be much harder to hold structures when outnumbered without that.

The easy fix would be : no catapult can be build inside wall.
I don’t think doing an exception for just 1 weapon siege would really be that hard and they don’t need to rewrite engine for that.

Catapults are not really anti personnel weapons, so to see them able to be used that way in the game is annoying. In history, catapults were fairly difficult/slow to load and make ready to fire. They then fired a large chunk of something (rock/person/diseased cow) at a wall or over a wall if attempting to spread disease. Sure they could be used to fire at a large group of people charging across an open field, but that would not be something that could be done over and over.

Hopefully it gets fixed, but isn’t the highest of priorities.

Thorvald.5432:

The easy fix would be : no catapult can be build inside wall.
I don’t think doing an exception for just 1 weapon siege would really be that hard and they don’t need to rewrite engine for that.

Problem with this is that also limits tactics, such as putting a cata on a supply depot roof to defend outside the wall. Many catas behind a gate can fire over a wall and affect a fight going on outside. This exclusion would limit more strategies and would be a bit too much of a blanket approach to the problem that the AoE shouldn’t bounce beyond the gate. when a ram hits a gate you are standing behind, it doesn’t knock you back. It’s simple physics, but a game engine needing to be coded differently is more difficult than it sounds.

I think they are already plenty of other weapon siege that could fit that role instead of catapult.
Right now catapult behind doors are way too OP. You can stop a raid of 10-15 players with 1 AFK auto click on a catapult.

Boiling oil should be the weapon siege which was meant for that role but are right now to easely destroyed.

If your having cata troubles on a door cause of a ram then build a cata to counteract it. I’v done it many times to where you set up a seige line and break it down that way.

Or you could simpley set up a cat or 2 and shoot over the wall and try to hit the cata to destroy it. Done this many times aswell.

There is a solution to most defenses, just have to find the weak spot…which comes with trial and error.

Not trying to flame the topic or anything but if thats the case then cannons and, especially, oil need to be way harder to destroy. Not to mention it will cost your own personal money.

Also, in my opinion, the defender should ALWAYS have the advantage. No matter what. When seigeing a tower/keep/castle it should always be harder for the attacker. But if you can just run up to the gate, drop a couple rams while your superior numbers AoE the walls and take the tower/keep/castle then it’s kinda pointless to defend it if you can’t really fight back from the walls.

Ualtar.5047:

In history, catapults were

In history? You are kidding, right? If we are to make it more realistic, we’d have to get rid of all this ancient siege. Who really needs it if we have, wait, what?!.. GUN POWDER.
Look at in-game rifle models. Some are like modern sniper rifles. It looks like fire arms discipline should be quite developed in gw universe. Why then not just blow that door up with explosive or some bigger artillery piece? Where is all this bada-boom goodness? Looks awfully inconsistent.

It’s all MMO abstractions, eclecticism and trying to make game experience more fun. I wouldn’t expect it to be 100% close to real life or history.

Thorvald.5432:

Right now catapult behind doors are way too OP. You can stop a raid of 10-15 players with 1 AFK auto click on a catapult.

Really? How about building your own cata instead of ram?

i like it , it helps when you are outmanned, and if we are going to try and talk historical accuracy – we will have to reconcile people being born from trees and talking cats first lol

LOL ricky. Just get a mesmer near the door and problem solved with the inside siege.

So the Anet response was that they don’t like it but can’t change it without significant changes to game code?

Basically, it’s “I want to be able to destroy all siege inside the castle, outside of LoS, kill people trying to repair the door, but it’s totally unfair that the cata inside can damage what is outside a keep or tower”.
As a defending party,, what is A-nets stance on ridiculous AoE destroying all siege inside a defensible position with zero line of sight, making it next to impossible if the zerg outside the keep or tower has enough mesmers/ele’s to destroy any and all defensive siege. That worries me far more than catapult splash damage, which is easily countered.

This “bug” of being able to hit enemies through gates helps the attackers just as much as the defenders. Get enough people hitting a gate and it’s practically impossible to repair from the inside. Especially if you’re using catapults of your own.

There’s no band-aid for this issue. Either A-net overhauls the game code or they don’t, but it’s really a minor thing in the grand scheme of WvW right now. And the current mechanics are relatively balanced for both parties (especially when people just stack on gates with stability anyway).

i have to agree with what Dovgan said there. Granted in historical fights they never built a cat right in front of the door…. wait a minute they have done that, granted they never fired it at the door to take care of invaders, but the moment the door caves in guess what the first thing the invaders saw when that happened ____ you guessed it a huge ball of iron flying into their faces… well ok maybe not iron per say but you get the general idea point is the cat may not be for that situation for anti door breaking it’s still a viable tactic to build a cat right behind the gate

Seeing as D is a joke in this game , any zerg can take any D , I miss the days of Dark age of Camelot where a few in the tower could hold out! , this could be a down fall of the game , numbers of the zerg mean everything

Dogvan: I did not mention any of the things you listed. I am talking about a particular aspect of the game. Lets keep this on-topic please.

You did not mention them, but that is exactly what it boils down to. When every other piece of siege equipment is painfully vulnerable to attack, player have to default to what works as a reasonable defensive strategy. It is easily counter able if you set catapults.

Making every piece of defensible siege equipment almost non viable is exactly what the issue is, and is why people tend to migrate towards the cata behind the door. If the walls/door acted like walls and doors, this would entirely be a non issue. Personally I am more a fan of a well placed balista or arrow cart.

As far as the initial post, A-Net has already commented on exactly what you asked.

So Anet has already commented on catapults, abilities, and (insert here) going through doors and walls? I am trying to determine the developer’s intention. I don’t care about the rationale behind why people are doing X or Y.

It doesn’t make sense, catapult damage should not splash through walls.

Ualtar.5047:

Catapults are not really anti personnel weapons, so to see them able to be used that way in the game is annoying. In history, catapults were fairly difficult/slow to load and make ready to fire. They then fired a large chunk of something (rock/person/diseased cow) at a wall or over a wall if attempting to spread disease. Sure they could be used to fire at a large group of people charging across an open field, but that would not be something that could be done over and over.

Hopefully it gets fixed, but isn’t the highest of priorities.

Real life history is not a factor to judge by.
In this game catapults are great anti-personnel weapon. A bit rock hitting people on the head for several thousand is automatic anti-personnel and you can change to gravel as well -

If they fix enemy AOE through the door from the outside – catapult AOE from the inside would also be fixed.

Mirage.2597:

Seeing as D is a joke in this game , any zerg can take any D , I miss the days of Dark age of Camelot where a few in the tower could hold out! , this could be a down fall of the game , numbers of the zerg mean everything

A few could hold out …. but rarely, if the zerg was incompetent and all stood in front of the door afk hitting it.

@shug, thats what I do now …in fact I hardly use sieges because my mesmer does more damage faster lol – but I still like the siege …strangely enough because II was impressed with how effective it was from keeping us from stomping them lol it really didn’t bother me and just made the game more challenging.

Eh, if you want catapults to not do splash dmg to the walls from the inside, then I assume trebs and cats from the outside shouldnt be able to splash through to the inside too right? Cause I mean thats they only fair thing to do here if you want to take out the defense of the position. Trebs can splash walls that they dont even hit and still take them down, arrow carts can be used instead of cats too from the inside on the door and still hit enemies outside. Lets please not risk a horrible change to one aspect of the game that adds a lil defense that can be countered. The current catapult abilities are fine. To remove the cat ability or change it, you would 1) need to extend the walls so aoes cannont take out siege up there, 2) make the camera more mobile while on set siege so you can actually see all the places in range of your siege instead of just guessing, 3) stop splash damage from the outside(yes splash should work both ways punish one side u should punish the other) from causing the guys inside not to be able to repair + skills by players to do so. As it is, there is just too much involved in messing with just the catapult, its really the only viable defensive tool to use if the other issues arent addressed at the same time. So dont complain about it, learn to counter it, and work with how the game is for now, I’m sure we have all seen how bad hasty nerfs to any one thing can be to games.