Guild Wars 2

DevonCarver.5370:

I’m going to lock this post for 2 reasons. 1) This topic has been discussed ad infinitum and we have given our reasons for the system as it currently exists.

Where exactly, have you given this, Devon?

If I missed this I apologist for it in advance. I simply can’t find it. But I am very keen on the exact reasons behind this, simply as I am trying to understand it… as I am sure others are as well.

I am sure you are as frustrated with this recurring subject as we are with what seems to be a completely illogical decision. Please help us understand.

The goal is to make the WXP spending differentiate characters. I think they could achieve the same goal without the current punitive system by giving all of a player’s characters the full amount of WXP to spend on abilities and perhaps reduce the overall amount of WXP so that no one character can have it all and players are encouraged to allocate different builds to different characters, especially since WXP can’t be readily reallocated.

The customer is always wrong apparently.

Wxp should primarily go to the character you farmed it on. Professions each play differently, if you want to benefit one you should need to level it the same way you level regular xp. Given how easy it is to get wxp I don’t even understand the point of these arguments, it’s like people won’t be happy until GW2 finally becomes so casual that it fully transitions to an amusement park.

Omne.4603:

Wxp should primarily go to the character you farmed it on. Professions each play differently, if you want to benefit one you should need to level it the same way you level regular xp. Given how easy it is to get wxp I don’t even understand the point of these arguments, it’s like people won’t be happy until GW2 finally becomes so casual that it fully transitions to an amusement park.

I find the issue mainly lies with the defense against guards line being so insanely good, making it a must-have for any character, while costing a big chunk of points. I don’t find the wxp levels very fast when playing solo or in a small group, where they actually matter most.

It makes me not want to play my alts as my main has the important trait lines (and thus on a competitive level with the enemies I encounter) and is now just gathering more levels that aren’t useful to him at all.

My computer can’t handle zerging as a solution to farm wxp fast and I do enjoy WvW very much in the way I play it, just the wxp thing I’d rather see gone than implemented in the way it currently is. At the moment I’m just slowly gathering up the flasks and stuff of wxp until i have enough for 130 levels and dump those on my alt.

MAGpie.7962:

I simply can’t find it. But I am very keen on the exact reasons behind this, simply as I am trying to understand it… as I am sure others are as well.

I am sure you are as frustrated with this recurring subject as we are with what seems to be a completely illogical decision. Please help us understand.

Yepp, if they stated the reasons and it has been discussed so often… why isnt there a faq about it yet ? It would really help preventing those pointless threads.

As far as i know there were no reasons given, the closest comment i have found is this https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Got-a-reply-to-account-bound-WvW-level/page/2#post2641483 but it doesnt explain why.

After all we are just the customers and provide feedback so both of us can be happy, but being consumer-unfriendly and not open about decisions that impact us greatly in a negative way isnt going to help either side.

The “reason” is that it’s supposed to be a form of character progression.

That’s fine if you only have one character, but many people have several characters. On top of that, I’m pretty sure 90% of WvW players don’t give a kitten about “character progression”. That roleplay stuff is what PvE is for.

You can’t compare WXP to regular XP/Levels. Regular levelling can be completed in less than a week; within a few days your character can be on an equal footing with everyone else in terms of traits/stats/abilities. This is not true of WXP.

If WXP should be character bound for the sake of “character progression”, then so should karma, gold, laurels, badges, and any crafted items (including ascended/legendary). After all, why should you be able to get a legendary/ascended item on a character if you didn’t put the effort in on that character?? HurrDurr.

I suspect the real reason is that it’ll take a fair amount of developer time to change the system. After all, it took nearly a year to get the Wallet implemented. And PvErs are valued customers. WvW doesn’t stand a chance.

Ragnar.4257:

The “reason” is that it’s supposed to be a form of character progression.

It states that you can see the current system as character progression … the problem is it doesnt explain why it is implemented as a character progression instead of an account progression, although the latter makes much more sense.

If there exists a reasonable explanation why they cant make it account bound, they should make it clear and state that reason so all can accept their decision and be happy. As of now you can only imagine that they are greedy and want to sell more wxp boosters, since wxp grinding is already a massive timesink on one character and having the same amount of wxp/ranks on your alt characters doesnt change the flow of the game in wvw (because you already have those advantages on another character which you could use instead).

Might as well get in before thread lock…

I had the same reaction to the “we have given our reasons” statement. All remember seeing them say is “character progression” with no discussion of how that is supposed to be better for everyone than some type of account progression. So the reasoning is pretty much ‘because we said so’.

At least “2) There will be more information about changes to the Wxp system in the next few weeks” is a bit more promising.

Gumby.1708:

Ragnar.4257:

The “reason” is that it’s supposed to be a form of character progression.

It states that you can see the current system as character progression … the problem is it doesnt explain why it is implemented as a character progression instead of an account progression, although the latter makes much more sense.

If there exists a reasonable explanation why they cant make it account bound, they should make it clear and state that reason so all can accept their decision and be happy. As of now you can only imagine that they are greedy and want to sell more wxp boosters, since wxp grinding is already a massive timesink on one character and having the same amount of wxp/ranks on your alt characters doesnt change the flow of the game in wvw (because you already have those advantages on another character which you could use instead).

….

eithinan.9841:

….

wow, such sophisticated commentary. Where did you earn this mastery of expression ?

How about you say what you mean? Most of us dont speak “dot-ish”.

ps: you can quote parts of comments by deleting the unnecessary stuff you dont need, instead of quoting a whole page and mark a fraction of it.

I would love to state my opinion on this but the bold text got me in trouble before.

It’s weekend. Will give the benefit of the doubt.

I think what most players find confusing about the current WXP system is that, as the name states (World vs World experience), it has nothing to do with classes or characters. One spends his/her time in WvWvW following commanders, scouting, zerging, using sieges etc. and becomes more experienced in these stuff. Do you use a treb, catapult, ac, ballista, cannon, ram, oil differently on each class? I don’t think so.

Every ability you can use in WvW is completely unrelated to classes/characters, they are about about your experience and the time you’ve invested in playing this part of the game. That is basically why it should be acccount and not character bound.

I’ve always wanted to know why its not account bound and had not found a straight answer from any developer yet. It’s good to hear they will gives us some more info about it in the future because as it is right now it doesn’t make any sense.

This thread should be locked because you are making a duplicate of a thread they locked and gave reasons for locking. Just wait until this new info comes out instead of risking an infraction for breaking the code of conduct

I think what people are saying is they don’t think the current system is justified and want it changed to account bound, like almost everything else in the game is. No amount of new info is going to change this simple fact.

Takes too long to level WxP much like earning WvW achievements. The scale compared to character leveling is at least 100 to 1 (as in it takes 100 times longer to cap in WvW as it does to cap a player). Even if we are talking just capping masteries not entire WvW levels it is still a good 20 to 1.

They dug in on this issue and unfortunately have no interest in reverting it… yet. Most players hate it and it has pretty much killed Alt Play by a significant portion of the players in WvW (at least the ones I am in contact with).

Heta.8629:

This thread should be locked because you are making a duplicate of a thread they locked and gave reasons for locking. Just wait until this new info comes out instead of risking an infraction for breaking the code of conduct

Usually when I read a locked thread like the OP’s previous one, and its locked with reasons like “its been discussed before” and “we’ve already responded to this question” ,there is a link where you can backtrack what they ve said. I ve totally missed it this time. I hope if they close this one there will be a link.

Valheru Baal.9456:

Heta.8629:

This thread should be locked because you are making a duplicate of a thread they locked and gave reasons for locking. Just wait until this new info comes out instead of risking an infraction for breaking the code of conduct

Usually when I read a locked thread like the OP’s previous one, and its locked with reasons like “its been discussed before” and “we’ve already responded to this question” ,there is a link where you can backtrack what they ve said. I ve totally missed it this time. I hope if they close this one there will be a link.

Exactly what I am hoping for. Not looking to stir the pot just looking for a answer to try and rationalize it for myself, that so far I have not seen or have missed.

I remember the “we dont want you to grind” thing

Heta.8629:

This thread should be locked because you are making a duplicate of a thread they locked and gave reasons for locking. Just wait until this new info comes out instead of risking an infraction for breaking the code of conduct

civil disobedience noun (Concise Encyclopedia)
Refusal to obey government demands or commands and nonresistance to consequent arrest and punishment. It is used especially as a nonviolent and usually collective means of forcing government concessions and has been a major tactic of nationalist movements in Africa and India, of the U.S. civil rights movement, and of labour and antiwar movements in many countries. Civil disobedience is a symbolic or ritualistic violation of the law, rather than a rejection of the system as a whole. The civil disobedient, finding legitimate avenues of change blocked or nonexistent, sees himself as obligated by a higher, extralegal principle to break some specific law. By submitting to punishment, the civil disobedient hopes to set a moral example that will provoke the majority or the government into effecting meaningful political, social, or economic change. The philosophical roots of civil disobedience lie deep in Western thought. Cicero, Thomas Aquinas, and John Locke, among others, appealed to systems of natural law that take precedence over the laws created by communities or states (positive law). More modern advocates and practitioners of civil disobedience include Henry David Thoreau, Mohandas K. Gandhi, and Martin Luther King, Jr.

TL:DR I am willing to risk punishment to peacefully state my beliefs.

Player progression > pixel progression. The player should always feel like they are useful. That is my statement on the issue.

Since I have 11 alts, I know I will be at a disadvantage in WvW for a very long time, years in fact. Sooner or later (sooner) it’s going to become too annoying to bother. Already WvW is becoming smaller and limited because it is a “Full Mastery” only for this and that mentality.

MAGpie.7962:

DevonCarver.5370:

I’m going to lock this post for 2 reasons. 1) This topic has been discussed ad infinitum and we have given our reasons for the system as it currently exists.

Where exactly, have you given this, Devon?

If I missed this I apologist for it in advance. I simply can’t find it. But I am very keen on the exact reasons behind this, simply as I am trying to understand it… as I am sure others are as well.

I am sure you are as frustrated with this recurring subject as we are with what seems to be a completely illogical decision. Please help us understand.

You expect the devs to actually have reasoning behind their decisions? Dude…

Master of Timespace.2548:

MAGpie.7962:

DevonCarver.5370:

I’m going to lock this post for 2 reasons. 1) This topic has been discussed ad infinitum and we have given our reasons for the system as it currently exists.

Where exactly, have you given this, Devon?

If I missed this I apologist for it in advance. I simply can’t find it. But I am very keen on the exact reasons behind this, simply as I am trying to understand it… as I am sure others are as well.

I am sure you are as frustrated with this recurring subject as we are with what seems to be a completely illogical decision. Please help us understand.

You expect the devs to actually have reasoning behind their decisions? Dude…

It is my continued and sincere hope… yes.

Alright.. soo:

“Your personal fractal difficulty and reward level is being made account-wide! Starting with the Fractured release, you can attempt high level fractals on a new character without needing to level up all over again.”

Source: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-the-fractals-of-the-mists/#mistlock

Now… really, why is this still character based?

I am sorry if this may offend, but I am starting to feel that someone is being dubious about this whole issue.

MAGpie.7962:

Alright.. soo:

“Your personal fractal difficulty and reward level is being made account-wide! Starting with the Fractured release, you can attempt high level fractals on a new character without needing to level up all over again.”

Source: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-the-fractals-of-the-mists/#mistlock

Now… really, why is this still character based?

Yep, this is ridiculous, if they can do it for fractals they can do it for WXP. Fractals are PvE where there is much more reason for there to be character progression.

morrolan.9608:

MAGpie.7962:

Alright.. soo:

“Your personal fractal difficulty and reward level is being made account-wide! Starting with the Fractured release, you can attempt high level fractals on a new character without needing to level up all over again.”

Source: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-the-fractals-of-the-mists/#mistlock

Now… really, why is this still character based?

Yep, this is ridiculous, if they can do it for fractals they can do it for WXP. Fractals are PvE where there is much more reason for there to be character progression.

Judging from the Fractal update…. It seems we have to wait until WvW reaches a higher level of inactivity so they can “update” it with something people wanted a long time ago to reinvigorate the interest.

I would really like to get an answer to this. Devon?

Hey I just got my 3rd character to max defense against guards. Gratz to me. 345 wxp ranks all dedicated to the same trait line. That is awesome character progression there…

A character without 230 wxp feels naked these days (as hardcore vizunah square enemies all have the vitality/power/condition buff).

Having 6x rank 100 character, I do NOT feel different on any of the chars. I feel the SAME frustration, i farmed 600 ranks, and 4 of these don’t even have a full guard leech yet.

I consider myself pretty hardcore, so that means a non hardcore player, wouldn’t even be able to (ever) reach guard leech/fortify on multiple chars.

What happens AFTER 230 wxp ranks per char = differentiating. But since that’s incredible hardcore, very hard to get, and only able to be farmed on vizunah square-alike servers, basically 90% of servers (and all their people) will never ‘differentiate’ their characters. Think about that stubborn Anet devs.

When ArenaNet said that there would be liquid WxP, I thought that we might get them with each rank up chest (one 250 WxP one), with perhaps a chance to get a 2500 potion instead. But that did not happen. I also get very few of them during normal game play, around one of the smallest variant every two hours. I have never seen a 5k one (or better) so far during the whole season 1 fights.

If I could boost an alternative character with the regular liquid WxP potions, I would be happier to do WvW on another character than my main. But currently, it feels like a wasted investment.

I think the reasoning is that seeing since it will take forever for one character to level up enough WXP levels to the point that character provides even a small advantage to WvW, that WvW players will get so bored they may just go to sPvP instead.

But seriously, having it character bound means that playing on several characters gives you a clear disadvantage in WvW. As said above, getting 2 character to max defense against the guards is not progression, its just more grinding; grinding more wxp so you get your new character to the same level as another character.

Have you even seen the WXP wiki page, the rank goes to 9,945 Diamond Legend!!
WXP was introduced back in March, so it’s been 8 months. In that time I’ve probably got about 450 WXP levels across all my characters, I know some who have got to 600 who play mainly one character. So based on that I’m getting it will take 132.6 months to get to max WXP rank, that’s 11 years on one character!

11 years?! I’d expect GW3 to be out by then! Come on Anet you have got to get serious and just like the WvW achievements (original ones not the Season ones), set realistic time frames on them!
I and I know a lot of other people are not going to spend 11 years playing on one single character! WXP ranks must be account bound!

MAGpie.7962:

I would really like to get an answer to this. Devon?

You’ve been waiting for 8 days for something you can find yourself by looking at his post history?

That’s exactly it… I have done that and I have not found the answer… and as far as I know, no-one else has either. It may not be Devon who posted it for example. Makes the search significantly more interesting.

Okay, so I can go with a character without any agony resistance, without proper gear, hell he doesn’t even have to be lvl 80 into the same level fractals as with a character that has full agony resistance and I actually know how to play.

For WvW-ranks, I have to spend all day farming WXP to get to the vitality/power/conddmg-buff with each of my characters indiviually… I play WvW since release. First on FoW now on FSP. I am not a hardcore player. I like to roam, I use a play mesmer, so my tagging of targets is not the best. Ergo: I have not made on my main all the neccessery ranks to get all the power/vitality/conddmg buffs.

WvW rank should represent skill and character progression, but it only feels like a pain. And still, I am defeating bronce legends, who have full buffs+food with my newest rank 7 character without using any food buffs… I am lost…

WXP doesn’t work in enjoyable way as it is. That is probably why we want to discuss about it forever.

It is very unfair system for players who play several characters and do not enjoy doing activities which maximize your WXP gain.

It wouldn’t be so bad if it didn’t give you so good bonuses (like imbastacks) and it would be a tad bit easier to level up for alts. Currently some bonuses are way too good to justify the current system.