Q:
What class can go invisible, with no apparent cooldown?
A:
It is a Pistol/Dagger thief using just 2 skills. #1 and #5 using condition damage.
Where they messed up is that they didnt give Thieves a perma out of combat stealth. Instead they allowed them to stealth while in combat multiple times making them harder to deal with.
Most Thieves you find will have a dagger offhand simply to stealth with CnD.
Revered – [REVD]
Maizen Blue – Thief
Maizen Blue – Thief
Thiefs are broken yo.
Could be an Engineer. One trait that they can get is turn invisible whenever they are immobilized.
Tarnished Coast
Orisletum [TFH] – 80 Necromancer
Oriscalamitas [TFH] – 80 Engineer
Orisletum [TFH] – 80 Necromancer
Oriscalamitas [TFH] – 80 Engineer
prob a theif and they have multiple inviz skills that they can alternate to stay inviz from 20-30 seconds, they sacrifice a lot to do so, but hey if u wanna hit and run its one of the best ways to do it….
they also have an AOE inviz that is also very helpful for getting teams out of a pinch my guild uses them often to escape, res, and ambush
Could be an Engineer. One trait that they can get is turn invisible whenever they are immobilized.
Either this.
Or the 5th thief dagger skill allows you to go invisible if you hit something, combined with the +1 second stealth trait, stealthing steal trait, initiative on stealth trait, stealthing heal, blinding powder, auto-blinding powder below 25%hp trait, and the shadow refuge.
Edit : And the Blast finisher + Smoke field makes you invisible.
(edited by AXLORD.2045)
If this was on Fergusson’s crossing against a Kaineng Charr at the Red tower, I was there too. Not sure the class (hard to tell when they’re always invisible). For over a minute 7-8 of us were trying to kill this guy. He would be invis, reappear for < 1 second to hit (he did not hit very hard at all), then disappear for another 5-10 sec. He was trying to take down a catapult we were building, but the invisibility seemed a little off. We even tried AoE, but we were aiming blind and never seemed to hit him much with it.
I’ve faced many thieves who have gotten the best of me at times, but I’ve never seen this before. Pretty much a constant stealth the whole minute, only reappearing for a half second to hit once/twice, then disappearing again.
As a mesmer, we finally beat him after dropping null field. It seemed to pull him out of stealth long enough for us to target/attack.
I don’t know if this was a hack, exploit, or simply game mechanics combined with rendering. It wasn’t too game breaking as it was just 1 guy who didn’t do much damage, but it was definitely frustrating.
This is like asking “what is that class that makes copies of itself over and over, then when you down them, they go invisible and make more copies then get back up? Exploit?”
No it’s the entire point of the profession!
It was a Thief with P/D build. The entire build is about slow condition damage and being in stealth as much as possible. You are just exaggerating how short they were out of stealth after attacking. To counter this, put pets on passive and attack from range, don’t let him get near you. Though with a catapult sitting there.. he can stealth by attacking that so.. just that situation.
(edited by Stiv.1820)
Wait Stiv you’ve seen the duplicating player hack as well!? I hope you reported.
Yesterday in WvW some guy with a big sword came and like…. rushed really fast to me, way faster than normal running speed. And immediately after that he swung his blade at me hella fast like… hundreds of times and there was nothing I could do I was dead. Does anyone know what class can do that? Is it exploits?
I could have looked at my combat log and seen what the abilities were, but it’s hidden behind my chat window so I can’t read it…. virus?
There are a million reasons cloak and dagger will miss which completely nullifies this so called “exploit”, unless he was using it on the catapult to insure it didn’t miss you should try dodging it or blinding him while he’s out of stealth.
This is like asking “what is that class that makes copies of itself over and over, then when you down them, they go invisible and make more copies then get back up? Exploit?”
No it’s the entire point of the profession!
It was a Thief with P/D build. The entire build is about slow condition damage and being in stealth as much as possible. You are just exaggerating how short they were out of stealth after attacking. To counter this, put pets on passive and attack from range, don’t let him get near you. Though with a catapult sitting there.. he can stealth by attacking that so.. just that situation.
I think what the OP and I were saying is that we are just looking for more information on if there is a build/profession that is capable of this. If so, then fine. Not going to argue with it, cause so far I have not found it to be overpowering. In fact, I have no problem with thieves at all in their current state.
What I was describing was something different I was witnessing last night. No, I am not exaggerating the timing on this. Again, it could very well just be the player rendering delay that caused him to only appear for less than a second. It just seemed to be inconsistent from what I have witnessed from many thief builds so far (not positive it was even a thief, cause I did not get to see him much).
I was not clear in how I presented my previous post (and I probably poorly represented my stance by even mentioning hacking/exploiting), but I am not calling anyone out for hacking or exploiting. I’m just trying to ask if the scenario I described is possible with the current game mechanics. If it is, great, question answered.
Your post and the 3 posts prior to yours had some very constructive feedback that could account for much of this and it also explains why, even though he was constantly invisible, he wasn’t hitting very hard (likely sacrificing a lot for this capability). As you said, he probably was proc’ing his stealth from the catapult. Just seemed a little quick to stealth and long durations is all.
@Monsoon: There very well could be a hack out there but there are Rune sets that allow any classes to stealth, probably other things as well. Couple other classes have invisible/stealth effects aside from thieves as well. You can also log out instantly and I read it’s becoming more of a problem, especially when downed.
@Aeden haha yea exactly. People aren’t taking the time to learn about other classes. You can’t PvP effectively against what you don’t understand and there is a ton of stuff each class can do!
@OP and others, Cloak and Dagger has a fairly long animation, it can be actively dodged. Any thief that attacks from stealth gets a “revealed” debuff that prevents them from sheathing fora few seconds. After that drops they will be coming toward you to hit you with C&D to get back into stealth. Snare them, kite them. Don’t put pets near them. They just need to attack anything to get back in stealth. If you deprive them of this you will force them to use a cooldown to stealth. Once you get them to blow those it’s just a matter of snare/kiting.
One tip, don’t “pre-roll” when a Pistol thief stealths (not true for Dagger though). If you dodge their opener, it’s initiative free and won’t unstealth them if it does zero dmg. Let the first couple hit then roll, or eat it and save endo for later.
Each class can do so much and be built in so many different ways it’s going to take a long time to learn the counters for every setup that you have to identify on the fly as they are fighting you!
@Koega: if the thief didn’t attack you or the catapult from stealth they won’t have any cooldown on stealth and can chain. You can do C&D, then chain as many stealth abilities as you fit on your bar with no cooldown at all, you just can’t attack from stealth. You can attack after you unstealth and re-stealth instantly, maybe that’s what he was dong? Like Cloak and Dagger, unstealth, cloak and dagger unstelath on and on. If he was just doing that over and over on the catapult then it fits exactly what you describe.
(edited by Stiv.1820)
Thieves are broken.
Anytime you have a race that can engage multiple enemies at once and still get away, is broken.
@Koega: if the thief didn’t attack you or the catapult from stealth they won’t have any cooldown on stealth and can chain. You can do C&D, then chain as many stealth abilities as you fit on your bar with no cooldown at all, you just can’t attack from stealth. You can attack after you unstealth and re-stealth instantly, maybe that’s what he was dong? Like Cloak and Dagger, unstealth, cloak and dagger unstelath on and on. If he was just doing that over and over on the catapult then it fits exactly what you describe.
The problem with that in WvW is it prevents a point from flipping, with no way to break the stealther. That is what is broken to me.
@Koega: if the thief didn’t attack you or the catapult from stealth they won’t have any cooldown on stealth and can chain. You can do C&D, then chain as many stealth abilities as you fit on your bar with no cooldown at all, you just can’t attack from stealth. You can attack after you unstealth and re-stealth instantly, maybe that’s what he was dong? Like Cloak and Dagger, unstealth, cloak and dagger unstelath on and on. If he was just doing that over and over on the catapult then it fits exactly what you describe.
The problem with that in WvW is it prevents a point from flipping, with no way to break the stealther. That is what is broken to me.
They still need to attack someone or something. If it’s you, you can try time their stealth running out and roll or start dropping AoE’s. Even just auto attacking around will still hit them. It’s annoying but hardly that functional in the grand scheme of things.
Easy fix is majority or (whatever % you want) of whatever team is in the ring gets the color/cap.
(edited by Stiv.1820)
It may have been an item. Yes any class can stay continuously invisible for 10 seconds with no cooldowns on re-invis using a particular item.
Edit: I was thinking the Ash Legion Spy Kit, so I just bought a few and tested in WvW and they do not work thereare so could not have been liberal use of them.
(edited by DirtyDeeds.6075)
@stiv
No. They don’t need to hit you. They can’t be hit with AOE. They only appear targetable for a half second or less.
It was most likely an item. It’s not supposed to work in WvW but it still has some functionality. Report them for exploiting and Anet will investigate, and hopefully get it fixed.
Atsug Em – [RvR] – lvl 80 Engineer – IoJ
Tryggon Gathol – [RvR] – lvl 80 Warrior – IoJ
Sechnal – [RvR] – lvl 80 Ranger – IoJ
Tryggon Gathol – [RvR] – lvl 80 Warrior – IoJ
Sechnal – [RvR] – lvl 80 Ranger – IoJ
I don’t know of any item or ability that makes you not be able to get hit with AoE or any attack in your direction while in stealth?
I can fire my ranged pistol #1 shot with no target at an area where I think someone is stealthed, and I can tell if it hits or not. I do it all the time vs other thieves. Does anything in this game even require a player target to be used?
Was the person moving around while invisible?
I know there’s a consumable that makes you stealthed for 10 seconds as long as you dont move. It may be functioning in WvWvW.
Hard to determine if they are moving or not. In one case the person kept coming out of stealth in the same spot for that < one second. In another case you could see the “destealth” animation appear in different location. 15-20 people spamming AOE throughout the circle had no effect.
If the 10sec stealth consumable can be munched on with no CD then I guess anyone can stay stealthed forever. The rings for say, a supply camp are pretty huge so it would be easy to avoid AoE in that.
My belief is that it’s not a consumable. I believe it is a specific thief build spec, chaining stealth, WAI. The problem is no class has stealth breakers that I know of. In WvW this has the potential to be game breaking.
You are just exaggerating how short they were out of stealth after attacking.
Nope,
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]
See, I can count.
My belief is that it’s not a consumable. I believe it is a specific thief build spec, chaining stealth, WAI. The problem is no class has stealth breakers that I know of. In WvW this has the potential to be game breaking.
It’s not if they aren’t attacking anything at all…
Shadow refuge or Smoke Scoke screen with Exploding arrow spam is the longest possible stealth and both show the area they are in. The latter all you need to do is stand near the screen and they will reveal when they hit you.
You are just exaggerating how short they were out of stealth after attacking.
Nope,
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]
Visible, [one one thousand, two one thousand]
Steathed [one one thousand, two one thousand, three one thousand]See, I can count.
My experience has the visible time < a second.
Of course my experience, they aren’t attacking either.
My belief is that it’s not a consumable. I believe it is a specific thief build spec, chaining stealth, WAI. The problem is no class has stealth breakers that I know of. In WvW this has the potential to be game breaking.
It’s not if they aren’t attacking anything at all…
It is if you can’t flip the point.
He was attacking and if I remember correctly, he was trying to get behind me which I am guessing is a thief move?
Yea if they aren’t attacking, there is nothing stopping them from re-entering stealth right away. If they are attacking at all from stealth they have to wait 3 seconds to re-enter stealth. You can time it so you hit right when your debuff drops to make it exactly 3 seconds, maybe latency makes it seem like 2.