Guild Wars 2

What builds/skills do you find OP and in what context?

My short list:

DH – Rotational defense combined with passive defense is too strong
Necro – Deathly Chill is crushing it in skirmish. Epi is still an issue.
Thief – Ever-vade builds, Ghost Thief
Warrior – The passive Signet heal needs an adjustment downwards
Mesmer – Condi Chrono for a variety of reasons needs to meet a nerf bat

Straegen.2938:

What builds/skills do you find OP and in what context?

My short list:

DH – Rotational defense combined with passive defense is too strong
Necro – Deathly Chill is crushing it in skirmish. Epi is still an issue.
Thief – Ever-vade builds, Ghost Thief
Warrior – The passive Signet heal needs an adjustment downwards
Mesmer – Condi Chrono for a variety of reasons needs to meet a nerf bat

You’re funny, warrior signet heal is fine. You might be thinking of adrenal health stacks off primal burst

Jacion.6302:

Straegen.2938:

What builds/skills do you find OP and in what context?

My short list:

DH – Rotational defense combined with passive defense is too strong
Necro – Deathly Chill is crushing it in skirmish. Epi is still an issue.
Thief – Ever-vade builds, Ghost Thief
Warrior – The passive Signet heal needs an adjustment downwards
Mesmer – Condi Chrono for a variety of reasons needs to meet a nerf bat

You’re funny, warrior signet heal is fine. You might be thinking of adrenal health stacks off primal burst

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

Bare minimum would be to revert the PvE change they made to confusion. Remove the passive tic so you only take damage if you activate a skill.

Shortbow longbow viper rampager condi power hybrid ranger is op.

Jim Hunter.6821:

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

Bare minimum would be to revert the PvE change they made to confusion. Remove the passive tic so you only take damage if you activate a skill.

I agree that confusion should be changed, not because condi chrono is overperforming, but because its silly to use PvE condi rules when we have separate balance between the game modes.

But I’m still interested to hear what OP thinks needs to be changed, since he is the one that brought it up

Straegen.2938:

What builds/skills do you find OP and in what context?

My short list:

DH – Rotational defense combined with passive defense is too strong
Necro – Deathly Chill is crushing it in skirmish. Epi is still an issue.
Thief – Ever-vade builds, Ghost Thief
Warrior – The passive Signet heal needs an adjustment downwards
Mesmer – Condi Chrono for a variety of reasons needs to meet a nerf bat

Oh come on,healsig is no issue.I find warris with double endure pain stacking it to 9 sec more annoying than having to even worry about healsig.

Straegen.2938:

What builds/skills do you find OP and in what context?

My short list:

DH – Rotational defense combined with passive defense is too strong
Necro – Deathly Chill is crushing it in skirmish. Epi is still an issue.
Thief – Ever-vade builds, Ghost Thief
Warrior – The passive Signet heal needs an adjustment downwards
Mesmer – Condi Chrono for a variety of reasons needs to meet a nerf bat

DH needs its defense cause its crap without it, try roaming with plain guardian, you will see the difference.
Necro spinal shivers and necro chill are deadly.
Ghost thief need to go-> while putting their traps you can decloak thief with attacks (5 sec duration) -> problem solved.
Warrior adrenal hp recovery needs to go down to 400hp/sec (1000+hp/sec is too much -> you nerfed scrapper, nerf warrior too)
Mesmer need some condi shaving

I would mention:
druid needs pet hp and dmg nerfed ( if you have tanky gear pet should also have tanky gear with no dmg)

overall condi dmg needs big shaving.

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

The reason I didn’t list a specific change is that it isn’t one thing that makes that build so strong. Any changes need to be done in small increments until the build gets brought into line. Changing Confusion back would be a good start in my book. That also makes other condi builds a bit more tolerable.

Jacion.6302:

You’re funny, warrior signet heal is fine. You might be thinking of adrenal health stacks off primal burst

Adrenal Health should use the sPvP version. Over 20s Healing Signet heals for almost 8k passively and has one of the better activation abilities. I would move that number closer to 7k over 20s.

Ragnarox.9601:

DH needs its defense cause its crap without it, try roaming with plain guardian, you will see the difference.

Its rotational blocks/invulns can be up about 80% of the time during a fight. The impressive part is they don’t have to give up much DPS to get that. The DH builds are already difficult to melee much less having to wait for a tiny window to open so a player can do damage. It is the strongest low skill floor build IMO. Guardians can be kited. That isn’t an option with most DH builds. Their Virtues are simply stupid good.

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

The reason I didn’t list a specific change is that it isn’t one thing that makes that build so strong. Any changes need to be done in small increments until the build gets brought into line. Changing Confusion back would be a good start in my book. That also makes other condi builds a bit more tolerable.

Jacion.6302:

You’re funny, warrior signet heal is fine. You might be thinking of adrenal health stacks off primal burst

Adrenal Health should use the sPvP version. Over 20s Healing Signet heals for almost 8k passively and has one of the better activation abilities. I would move that number closer to 7k over 20s.

These are just my opinions and observations. Certainly not gospel.

Straegen.2938:

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

The reason I didn’t list a specific change is that it isn’t one thing that makes that build so strong. Any changes need to be done in small increments until the build gets brought into line. Changing Confusion back would be a good start in my book. That also makes other condi builds a bit more tolerable.

This is still dancing around the issue though. What do you think the problems with condi chrono are? Does it have too much sustain for how much condi pressure it can put out? Does it have too much access to stealth? Is it the conditions that are overperforming, or is the application too large? What do you actually have a problem with this build?

Choppy.4183:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

I agree with this and he gets to the heart of the issue with berserker Vs core warrior where adrenal healing is completely fine.

Additionally I’d increase the cool down on headbutt, 20s for a stunbreak, 3s stun, full adrenaline and decent damage (seen it hit for 4k+) is far too good, make it 30s.

apharma.3741:

Choppy.4183:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

I agree with this and he gets to the heart of the issue with berserker Vs core warrior where adrenal healing is completely fine.

Additionally I’d increase the cool down on headbutt, 20s for a stunbreak, 3s stun, full adrenaline and decent damage (seen it hit for 4k+) is far too good, make it 30s.

Anet’s justification for that is the self stun. Its sort of like necro corruptions; incredibly low cooldowns but they inflict yourself with something negative (though it can be easily got rid of – warrior stun breaks and necro condi transfer).

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

I have faced off several times with the Condi Chrono and never had a issue with them. I wonder if people just don’t have or not using the skills to clear conditions??

Never really had a big prob with thief’s either.

Don’t TOUCH the warrior anet for god sake !!!! warrior is just fine ty

apharma.3741:

Choppy.4183:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

I agree with this and he gets to the heart of the issue with berserker Vs core warrior where adrenal healing is completely fine.

Additionally I’d increase the cool down on headbutt, 20s for a stunbreak, 3s stun, full adrenaline and decent damage (seen it hit for 4k+) is far too good, make it 30s.

Nah they both need to be adjusted. With zero healing power a berserker is ticking for about 900hp a second just from adrenal health and healing signet, that’s a kitten ton of sustain without even considering things like regen that is pretty much permanent in any group or traits like “dead or alive” and “rousing resilience”. On top of that Berserkers are extremely mobile, have several very short cooldown stun breaks can build to be pretty much immune to conditions and can rotate blocks with immunities.

They game is in a really crappy place right now because builds don’t need to sacrifice anything anymore. Having to add a little healing power won’t break their builds, it just means they will have to make a choice if they want to continue to play it safe and have that ridiculous sustain or play a little riskier but continue to land those 10k+ hits.

A lot of these points are viewed in too much of a 1v1 fashion, in a skirmish it’s easy to take out a Warrior if you focus it down. DH’s def rotation is pointless since it gets burned down quickly, Chrono is taken out easily as well if you don’t lose track of it.

Nerfing Warrior’s healing would only make it pointless to play in WvW. If you’re roaming and you see a Warrior it’s already easy to deal with since Adrenal Health only activates when they land a burst and it’s already easy to avoid with the roaming classes. If you can avoid their burst and they’re running heal signet most likely they won’t be able to keep up with the burst damage since heal signet is only a 3k heal and a 400 heal over time, so unless you’re giving them time to heal it really isn’t an issue, just know when to avoid their burst and kite out berserker mode.

As for DH, like everyone said nerfing their def will make them really squishy, it’s just an issue of knowing when to avoid the fight and when to engage them. Just because you can’t run at them and kill them with a simple dps rotation doesn’t mean they’re broken, some fights require patience.

If you look at things from a group perspective a lot of those classes can be dealt with if everyone knows what to do.

Seems like a lot of the issues are just a simple matter of knowing how to play against said classes. The only thing I would agree with is a Ghost Thief but then again I don’t have much experience fighting one. As for a necro it’s honestly depends on who you assign condi clense to. I do agree that epidemic is a bit of an issue, but in most engagements there’s not much threat if your team knows how to deal with it.

Jim Hunter.6821:

apharma.3741:

Choppy.4183:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

I agree with this and he gets to the heart of the issue with berserker Vs core warrior where adrenal healing is completely fine.

Additionally I’d increase the cool down on headbutt, 20s for a stunbreak, 3s stun, full adrenaline and decent damage (seen it hit for 4k+) is far too good, make it 30s.

Nah they both need to be adjusted. With zero healing power a berserker is ticking for about 900hp a second just from adrenal health and healing signet, that’s a kitten ton of sustain without even considering things like regen that is pretty much permanent in any group or traits like “dead or alive” and “rousing resilience”. On top of that Berserkers are extremely mobile, have several very short cooldown stun breaks can build to be pretty much immune to conditions and can rotate blocks with immunities.

They game is in a really crappy place right now because builds don’t need to sacrifice anything anymore. Having to add a little healing power won’t break their builds, it just means they will have to make a choice if they want to continue to play it safe and have that ridiculous sustain or play a little riskier but continue to land those 10k+ hits.

Play core warrior and you realise it’s a berserker issue. Core warrior has trade offs to what it does, if it wants to build adrenaline as fast as a berserker it needs to take arms and will do a lot less damage. If they want quickness to hit burst skills faster they need heightened focus which means no adrenaline refund so harder to maintain AH.

That’s without mentioning core warrior skills are much better telegraphed and not absurdly over powered like berserker burst skills. Seriously go compare the primal bursts to regular bursts for all of them, the burst is way easier to land on everything but bow and/or does a lot more (daze, blind and 2x 4 condi stacks?!). When you couple this with a trait line that gives damage increases as minor, skills that build full adrenaline nearly, burst skills that only require a weapon swap to get enough adrenaline, high stability and reduced cool downs on burst.

Make no mistake it is 100% a problem with berserker trait line, go duel a baseline warrior and you’ll barely notice the adrenal healing.

tym.3791:

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

I have faced off several times with the Condi Chrono and never had a issue with them. I wonder if people just don’t have or not using the skills to clear conditions??

Never really had a big prob with thief’s either.

Knowing what to look for and what to dodge versus a condi chrono does make the fight a lot easier, however as a chrono main I do still think its slightly overtuned. People in general don’t like fighting versus heavy confusion and torment access, because they punish you for using the game mechancis themselves, and condi chrono can load you up like crazy with both of them. Its just extremely annoying to fight a build that can punish you for both moving and using skills. I do think nerfing confusion in general would help a lot with the annoyance of this build, but I do not agree with completely removing the passive tick damage from it and torment, just reducing them in WvW.

apharma.3741:

Jim Hunter.6821:

apharma.3741:

Choppy.4183:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

I agree with this and he gets to the heart of the issue with berserker Vs core warrior where adrenal healing is completely fine.

Additionally I’d increase the cool down on headbutt, 20s for a stunbreak, 3s stun, full adrenaline and decent damage (seen it hit for 4k+) is far too good, make it 30s.

Nah they both need to be adjusted. With zero healing power a berserker is ticking for about 900hp a second just from adrenal health and healing signet, that’s a kitten ton of sustain without even considering things like regen that is pretty much permanent in any group or traits like “dead or alive” and “rousing resilience”. On top of that Berserkers are extremely mobile, have several very short cooldown stun breaks can build to be pretty much immune to conditions and can rotate blocks with immunities.

They game is in a really crappy place right now because builds don’t need to sacrifice anything anymore. Having to add a little healing power won’t break their builds, it just means they will have to make a choice if they want to continue to play it safe and have that ridiculous sustain or play a little riskier but continue to land those 10k+ hits.

Play core warrior and you realise it’s a berserker issue. Core warrior has trade offs to what it does, if it wants to build adrenaline as fast as a berserker it needs to take arms and will do a lot less damage. If they want quickness to hit burst skills faster they need heightened focus which means no adrenaline refund so harder to maintain AH.

That’s without mentioning core warrior skills are much better telegraphed and not absurdly over powered like berserker burst skills. Seriously go compare the primal bursts to regular bursts for all of them, the burst is way easier to land on everything but bow and/or does a lot more (daze, blind and 2x 4 condi stacks?!). When you couple this with a trait line that gives damage increases as minor, skills that build full adrenaline nearly, burst skills that only require a weapon swap to get enough adrenaline, high stability and reduced cool downs on burst.

Make no mistake it is 100% a problem with berserker trait line, go duel a baseline warrior and you’ll barely notice the adrenal healing.

I don’t disagree but unfortunately we can’t just balance around the base professions. Hot is without a doubt the worst thing that happened to this game and berserker is a prime example of why. The specializations were supposed to open up new build options but in almost every case they are so much stronger that they are mandatory.

Berserker didn’t even offer something new and interesting, it’s basically just the same play style except everything hits way kittening harder, is easier to land, and has shorter cooldowns. The problem is there’s no real way to adjust that without just nerfing the kitten out of it and if they do that you are basically just left with the core warrior again.

Jim Hunter.6821:

I don’t disagree but unfortunately we can’t just balance around the base professions. Hot is without a doubt the worst thing that happened to this game and berserker is a prime example of why. The specializations were supposed to open up new build options but in almost every case they are so much stronger that they are mandatory.

Berserker didn’t even offer something new and interesting, it’s basically just the same play style except everything hits way kittening harder, is easier to land, and has shorter cooldowns. The problem is there’s no real way to adjust that without just nerfing the kitten out of it and if they do that you are basically just left with the core warrior again.

Agreed 100%. It is definitely a berserker issue. I’d argue it’s the combination of the invuln + stab stances + Eternal Champion as well as AH regen (triggered by AD + burst skills).

• You can’t CC them (long-lasting, high-uptime stability, resistance)
• You can’t out-damage them (double invuln stance, block, 1k hp/s regen)
• You must dodge/block most of their skills (high damage, long cc)

Core Warrior doesn’t have this problem because it works harder for its burst skills and it sacrifices either sustain, immunity, or damage. Zerker gets it all for free basically.

Jim Hunter.6821:

apharma.3741:

Jim Hunter.6821:

apharma.3741:

Choppy.4183:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

I agree with this and he gets to the heart of the issue with berserker Vs core warrior where adrenal healing is completely fine.

Additionally I’d increase the cool down on headbutt, 20s for a stunbreak, 3s stun, full adrenaline and decent damage (seen it hit for 4k+) is far too good, make it 30s.

Nah they both need to be adjusted. With zero healing power a berserker is ticking for about 900hp a second just from adrenal health and healing signet, that’s a kitten ton of sustain without even considering things like regen that is pretty much permanent in any group or traits like “dead or alive” and “rousing resilience”. On top of that Berserkers are extremely mobile, have several very short cooldown stun breaks can build to be pretty much immune to conditions and can rotate blocks with immunities.

They game is in a really crappy place right now because builds don’t need to sacrifice anything anymore. Having to add a little healing power won’t break their builds, it just means they will have to make a choice if they want to continue to play it safe and have that ridiculous sustain or play a little riskier but continue to land those 10k+ hits.

Play core warrior and you realise it’s a berserker issue. Core warrior has trade offs to what it does, if it wants to build adrenaline as fast as a berserker it needs to take arms and will do a lot less damage. If they want quickness to hit burst skills faster they need heightened focus which means no adrenaline refund so harder to maintain AH.

That’s without mentioning core warrior skills are much better telegraphed and not absurdly over powered like berserker burst skills. Seriously go compare the primal bursts to regular bursts for all of them, the burst is way easier to land on everything but bow and/or does a lot more (daze, blind and 2x 4 condi stacks?!). When you couple this with a trait line that gives damage increases as minor, skills that build full adrenaline nearly, burst skills that only require a weapon swap to get enough adrenaline, high stability and reduced cool downs on burst.

Make no mistake it is 100% a problem with berserker trait line, go duel a baseline warrior and you’ll barely notice the adrenal healing.

I don’t disagree but unfortunately we can’t just balance around the base professions. Hot is without a doubt the worst thing that happened to this game and berserker is a prime example of why. The specializations were supposed to open up new build options but in almost every case they are so much stronger that they are mandatory.

Berserker didn’t even offer something new and interesting, it’s basically just the same play style except everything hits way kittening harder, is easier to land, and has shorter cooldowns. The problem is there’s no real way to adjust that without just nerfing the kitten out of it and if they do that you are basically just left with the core warrior again.

Agreed, HoT broke this game IMO. Expansions are suppose to bring people to the game not drive them away. What is scary…they are basically ignoring gw2 and diving right into another expansion. It’s starting to look like they are just another game studio that goes the cash cow route.

Druid:
Stealth time, Pet Damage, Pet utility, reduce daze time from stunbreaker, MOBILITY!!!!

Dragonhunter:
minor trap damage nerf, minor mobility nerf, or no trap nerf but major mobility shave, have a look on aegis pops and blinds output too

Thief:
bound damage nerf,(take out ferocity modifier from its critical damage), ghost thief nerf(removing of trapper runes such a strong mechnanic aint belongs to any class, add damage to tripwire(the knockdown trap)), make PI proc only on not first weapon slot skills, fix no line of sight, no valid pathes in wvw

Overall trap changes make traps objects, when u place a trap your skill becomes destroy xy trap, only after a trap is destroyed or triggered can a trap go on cooldown

Revenant:
Hammer nerf with power scales(not nerf mara/mixed revs but nerf 15k+ coalescences), remove reveal its g**

Necromancer:
Deathly CHill: applies 2 stacks of bleeding when u chill a foe for 4 seconds icd: 2 seconds
Epidemic: dont have idea for this one
Increase its stability in reaper 3 not the amount but get stability for 9 sec with a 1 stack pulsating every 3 seconds, brakes stuns evry 3 seconds too.
Power reaper needs some dmdage shave but dunno which skills

Enginner:
Shave sustain to direct dmdage, shave reflection uptime, give back stealth to thieves and mesmers, nerf shock shield by 15%

Mesmer:
Superspeed for clones is lel they rune to you buggy as hell and seems like they gonna hit you no matter what, revert buffs to mindwrack really 4.5k from power mesmer -.-, devs go play in high tier go roam and enjoy the fights against condi mesmers…….

Warrior:
Headbutt 30% damage nerf such a strong utility does not needs such high damage, Arching Divider range to 325, Adrenal Health 10%nerf, fix Headbutt interrupted

Elementalist:
Increase smoothing mist passive higher with healingpower, increase its condi clear cabailities to allies give it clear onyl conditions on allies skils on warhorn or whatever, fix glitches can use skills simoltenaously atm, casting water 4 and earth 4 at the same time for example

Menyus.4610:

Revenant:
Hammer nerf with power scales(not nerf mara/mixed revs but nerf 15k+ coalescences), remove reveal its g**

So, as long as Revents dont pick full glasscannon, theyre ok for you? Good to know. Maybe you should try to fight them once, glasscannon is able to be oneshot with war and thief.

Aury.1367:

Menyus.4610:

Revenant:
Hammer nerf with power scales(not nerf mara/mixed revs but nerf 15k+ coalescences), remove reveal its g**

So, as long as Revents dont pick full glasscannon, theyre ok for you? Good to know. Maybe you should try to fight them once, glasscannon is able to be oneshot with war and thief.

Your sentence made no sense

Menyus.4610:

Thief:
I could get behind having PI not proc if you interrupt an autoattack. I don’t think that the engine can easily determine if a skill was an auto attack or not

Necromancer:
Epidemic is fine. It only seems broken because resistance allows you to reach these ridiculous condi stacks

Enginner:
I’m all for less stealth, but what do you propose to give scrappers if you take away the stealth?

Mesmer:
First, what buffs to mindwrack do you want reverted? Secondly, while superspeed on illusions that are shattered is annoying to fight against, shatters become almost impossible to land from range without it. I think its about time that clones got a passive 25% boost to movement speed when they are shattered to help them land, and Time Catches Up could either be reduced to 50% speed increase + another small effect or changed entirely.

Warrior:
Arc divider could deal with a small range decrease, but really primal burst skills need to be treated as T1 adrenaline skills. This would stop the ridiculous healing that berserkers can maintain 100% uptime on from constantly have 3 stacks of adrenal health. I also think that berserk mode can be traited way too heavily. It can be traited as a 15 sec stunbreak and 2 condi clear on top of their already high access to resistance and stunbreaks. Or it can be traited for reduced CD, which will give you 100% uptime on fury and 60% uptime on swiftness + quickness if you have 100% boon duration due to their minor grandmaster trait. And you can then trait for either more stab and might, or you can add yet another damage modifier on berserk mode. Its just ridiculous how heavily berserk mode can be traited. Buff it slightly and then change some of these traits so they affect something else instead.

Replies in bold

+warrior healing is balance to the condi upgrade, warriors favour toughness over almost any class, so got hit the hardest. Pre the adrenal health upgrade they class was almost empty in WVW now its averagely represented. The argument about berserker skills being op is true, but that goes for almost any hots.
The thief warrior trolling & cries for nerf have been going on since the start.
1v1 you have to fancy the thief, what seems to annoy people was they get used to a 95% chance of win, then salt when it gets to 75%. Seems fair.

I know thieves who still prefer fighting warriors as the stances are shorter than boons and the cd so long they kite and kill them, this takes longer than they like given the healing , but the win is always there.
Switch to zerg/skirmish and it’s the other way round. Seems Fair.

-the nonsense about ‘skill caps’ which profession is better, is subjective drivel.

Menyus.4610:

Druid:

Dragonhunter:
minor trap damage nerf, minor mobility nerf, or no trap nerf but major mobility shave, have a look on aegis pops and blinds output too

Mobility??? Nerf Traveler runes!!!!

The most OP class is downed state.

Lahmia.2193:

apharma.3741:

Choppy.4183:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Warriors (especially adrenal health) needs the druid treatment. Nerf the kitten out of the base heal and make it scale decently with healing power. Also bring the range on arc divider down to at least 300, it’s ridiculous how easy it is for them to land it on random nearby npc’s to proc cleansing ire/adrenal health.

A big nerf to the base heal is the wrong fix. Adjusting the range of Arc Divider, along with reducing how many adrenal stacks a primal burst counts for is a much more precise solution to the problem.

Nerfing the base will kill most warrior builds, bringing it back to where the class was before the Adrenal Health buff (very little sustain). But doing those other two things would make Berserkers have to work harder to maintain the AH healing, nerf the melee threat range of Berserker greatsword, and keep the current non-OP builds viable.

As for double EP, all the blocks, etc., those can be handled through smart play, which includes staying out of melee range unless your build allows you to play in that space with blinds, chills, evades, etc. Cutting the range on AD to 300 (as you suggested) reduces the melee warrior threat range, and makes kiting classes in particular great for wearing them down.

I agree with this and he gets to the heart of the issue with berserker Vs core warrior where adrenal healing is completely fine.

Additionally I’d increase the cool down on headbutt, 20s for a stunbreak, 3s stun, full adrenaline and decent damage (seen it hit for 4k+) is far too good, make it 30s.

Anet’s justification for that is the self stun. Its sort of like necro corruptions; incredibly low cooldowns but they inflict yourself with something negative (though it can be easily got rid of – warrior stun breaks and necro condi transfer).

Self stun that charges your adrenaline fully so to instantly burst while you are stunned? Reduce the adrenaline gain by half so the zerker has to work for that primal burst and keep the healing sig the way it is. (BTW i dont play zerker or warrior)

Zerker, Teef, Condi Chrono. Last time i did any roaming a couple months back it was pretty much dominated by these 3 classes.

Vault spam thief, PI thief(standard D/P), perma dodge death blossom condi thief. The usual power zerker and of course, condi chrono.

You would run across other classes occasionally, but mostly it was someone running between keeps to refresh siege, or running sups. Or they were catching up with a tag. Or were part of a small group of 6 or so ppl that you managed to catch solo.

Lahmia.2193:

Anet’s justification for that is the self stun. Its sort of like necro corruptions; incredibly low cooldowns but they inflict yourself with something negative (though it can be easily got rid of – warrior stun breaks and necro condi transfer).

In fact, if you combine it with the Rousing Resilience and Smash Brawler traits, you can shed that self stun instantly for an extra 2.5k heal (on top of the one (and +1k toughness) you got for using Headbutt in the first place), and then immediately lace in with a full Berserker burst rotation. Even crazier, you don’t need to waste a low cd stunbreak utility like Outrage to do it.

apharma’s right, a longer CD on Headbutt seems appropriate as well, provided it’s part of an overall “stop the insanity” balance overhaul across classes.

Jim Hunter.6821:

I don’t disagree but unfortunately we can’t just balance around the base professions.

You can in this case though. It’s relatively simple to leave core warrior more or less intact while peeling back some of the cheese built into Berserker. And you can do it without ruining Berserker as well.

Burn guard
DH-trap ones seem a little ridiculous
Chilling death necro
Anything thief, autopilot mode
Warrior, regeneration is insane.
Mesmer-think we all know condi ones are king

Ranger IMO is the most broke. The class has access to everything-stealth, immobilize spam with optimum range kiting, condi, pet damage, traps, healing bunker, and a celestial god mode.

Not sure how Ranger is broke.. I come across plenty of roamers of all classes that seem to have a good number of counters for my Ranger/Druid. I don’t run condi though, I run a Marauder build. Lots of everything except condi. The EASIEST people I come across for me to take down is other rangers, though there are some that just seem to be built for survival more than anything and manage to run away.

To me, Thief is the one class that’s truly ridiculous. What they can to stealthed makes no sense to me and the amount of dps they can put out in a few seconds in stealth is worse. If I can hit them with a reveal shot at the right time then hit the right combination of skills they will fall, but that’s a stretch for me since my reaction time isn’t what it used to be. Most good rangers should be able to deal with thiefs though if they don’t get hit from behind of course..

The other classes, imo, are not that much different. Simply different skills and counters and if you see two people that know their classes super well having a duel it’s fun to watch. It’s more about “knowing” your class than it is about the imbalance, imo. (except for thief!)

The thread has devolved ito a “what gives ME personally the most issues because I can not kill them on my toon” rather then what is OP and not.

The prime example of this is mentioning classes best at roaming while ignoring the fact that those same classes melt in a group fight.

WvW is not about 1v1 duels. Nor is PvE nor is PvP. You can not balance classes premised on a 1v1 fight unless the same done across the board , which is a design measure which IMHO makes the game worse overall (If all classes just as good at every facet of the game then a class based system not needed)

There also an inability to differentiate between a class that has a wide variety of damage mitigation measures over ones that have fewer. If Warrior has access to blocks, passives that kick in when health low, high armor, high health, invuln mode , high ongoing healing and boon access and the like all kicking in at different times while thief has stealth and more dodges, the latter is going to use those fewer measures on a more frequent basis because they HAVE to. It has nothing to do with being OP.

A DESIGN decision was made to give certain classes lighter armors and far less health wherin this woul dbe made up for via other means to mitigate that damage. The fact remains that as a damage mitigation measure having more armor and more health base is in fact the easiest way to mitigate damage that is possible, yet people pretend those advantages do not exist because they get no feedback on the screen as to why that damage mitigated.

There a reason when making a push a commander calls for Heavies to stack on him or for Necroes to lay down marks and AOE or eles water fields and guardians to remain tight in the group. There a reason those rangers and thieves are deemed liabilities unless they stay at the periphery and it not because the latter two classes are OP.

Balthazzarr.1349:

Not sure how Ranger is broke.. I come across plenty of roamers of all classes that seem to have a good number of counters for my Ranger/Druid. I don’t run condi though, I run a Marauder build. Lots of everything except condi. The EASIEST people I come across for me to take down is other rangers, though there are some that just seem to be built for survival more than anything and manage to run away.

To me, Thief is the one class that’s truly ridiculous. What they can to stealthed makes no sense to me and the amount of dps they can put out in a few seconds in stealth is worse. If I can hit them with a reveal shot at the right time then hit the right combination of skills they will fall, but that’s a stretch for me since my reaction time isn’t what it used to be. Most good rangers should be able to deal with thiefs though if they don’t get hit from behind of course..

The other classes, imo, are not that much different. Simply different skills and counters and if you see two people that know their classes super well having a duel it’s fun to watch. It’s more about “knowing” your class than it is about the imbalance, imo. (except for thief!)

Druid is actually pretty strong against most classes in WvW because of its sustain and mobility. But the biggest problem is that it is somewhat countered by thief and we all know thief is the most prominent roamer in WvW.

I can’t point to anything specific, but any profession would be op if a dev shows a personal attachment to it, while often contributing to balance updates.

Thief

I would try and address stealth stacking and Ghost thief. While on its own it not OP as numbers grow it gets out of hand and should be addrressed. Contrary to those same suggestions that this about trappers runes or traps, this not the case. It is stealth stacking that leads to this.

I do not see issues with “evade forever” as this only a bad thief playing and can be countered .

Condition Chrono. Yes I can have issues with these but it does not follow that they are OP. I can not make this judgment based upon my own troubles with them simply because I personally do not play the class enough to understand it.

Warrior. I think they ok although I would shave Resistance off signet by one second and give a higher cooldown to headbutt (Ie 25 seconds)

Necro. Epidemic should have a lower radius. I have not played with the higher access to bleeds enough to be able to conclude this as being OP. When I was facing them when this added I melted on many of my players just because of what I had been "used to’ when playing against them. I feel I have to play on my necro more to see how it can be countered before i can claim it as being OP.

DH. The pull on this build is still insane and in particular its seeming ability to pull people off walls out of line of sight. if player A on a castle wall can not see or target player B on the ground below because he not in LOS then that player on the ground should not be able to pull that player on the wall. I would look at The Cooldown on the various block scales as well albeit any adjustments would be slight.

As to the other classes, while I play against them a lot, I do not play them enough as an individual to make any judgement as to what is OP on the same. I inseretd my observation on Chrono for that reason.

I really do not think one can make an objective opinion as to what OP in a build unless one understands the class and build in particular by playing it.

I do play thief, warrior, Necro and DH more then those others.

I rarely play Revenant as example so think it would be worng of me to claim they OP. I just feel basing game design decisions on th voices of people running to the baords to complain after having lost to a given build in a 1v1 is the wrong way to go.

Rev is in a weird spot currently. Its design is extremely OP, and instead of redesigning it to be better, the Devs have just repeatedly handed out extremely hard nerfs to Rev to counter this. So you end up with a class that is OP by design, UP in practice.

OriOri.8724:

Rev is in a weird spot currently. Its design is extremely OP, and instead of redesigning it to be better, the Devs have just repeatedly handed out extremely hard nerfs to Rev to counter this. So you end up with a class that is OP by design, UP in practice.

That’s pretty much the case with all the specializations. They were poorly designed power creeps and anet is unwilling to redesign anything, they just want to tweak numbers.

For the people calling druids op, that is a direct result of anet just tweaking numbers instead of changing a poor design. The nerfs have made any build other than bunker druid unviable. There have been multiple threads full of suggestions on how to fix problems with core rangers so that glassier builds might reemerge but so far they have been ignored and we are stuck with the 1 boring play style.

babazhook.6805:

The thread has devolved ito a “what gives ME personally the most issues because I can not kill them on my toon” rather then what is OP and not.

The prime example of this is mentioning classes best at roaming while ignoring the fact that those same classes melt in a group fight.

WvW is not about 1v1 duels. Nor is PvE nor is PvP. You can not balance classes premised on a 1v1 fight unless the same done across the board , which is a design measure which IMHO makes the game worse overall (If all classes just as good at every facet of the game then a class based system not needed)

There also an inability to differentiate between a class that has a wide variety of damage mitigation measures over ones that have fewer. If Warrior has access to blocks, passives that kick in when health low, high armor, high health, invuln mode , high ongoing healing and boon access and the like all kicking in at different times while thief has stealth and more dodges, the latter is going to use those fewer measures on a more frequent basis because they HAVE to. It has nothing to do with being OP.

A DESIGN decision was made to give certain classes lighter armors and far less health wherin this woul dbe made up for via other means to mitigate that damage. The fact remains that as a damage mitigation measure having more armor and more health base is in fact the easiest way to mitigate damage that is possible, yet people pretend those advantages do not exist because they get no feedback on the screen as to why that damage mitigated.

There a reason when making a push a commander calls for Heavies to stack on him or for Necroes to lay down marks and AOE or eles water fields and guardians to remain tight in the group. There a reason those rangers and thieves are deemed liabilities unless they stay at the periphery and it not because the latter two classes are OP.

This reminds me of what my cousin used to say. Any time I showed him something that did large amounts of damage or did something useful, he would claim it to be overpowered.

Jim Hunter.6821:

OriOri.8724:

Rev is in a weird spot currently. Its design is extremely OP, and instead of redesigning it to be better, the Devs have just repeatedly handed out extremely hard nerfs to Rev to counter this. So you end up with a class that is OP by design, UP in practice.

That’s pretty much the case with all the specializations. They were poorly designed power creeps and anet is unwilling to redesign anything, they just want to tweak numbers.

For the people calling druids op, that is a direct result of anet just tweaking numbers instead of changing a poor design. The nerfs have made any build other than bunker druid unviable. There have been multiple threads full of suggestions on how to fix problems with core rangers so that glassier builds might reemerge but so far they have been ignored and we are stuck with the 1 boring play style.

Yes anet nerfed precision based bleed ranger builds and buffed no skill bunker Condi builds for mesmer, thief and reaper (over buffed) in same update. It’s crazy.

Blasting Light Fields! That sh8ts OP as F…

Not a class thing. I find myself OP.

Anet’s nerf-buff ratio is op. Instead of truly balancing, they just nerf or buff without thinking. And due to the patch frequency being far from ok, it takes too much time for them to see-fix the issue.

All the complaining about professions in this topic might be true. But there are so few options for people to play that people are forced to play those builds. There are some exceptions, true, but most of the time you lack other options if you want to play a certain class.

Jim Hunter.6821:

OriOri.8724:

Rev is in a weird spot currently. Its design is extremely OP, and instead of redesigning it to be better, the Devs have just repeatedly handed out extremely hard nerfs to Rev to counter this. So you end up with a class that is OP by design, UP in practice.

That’s pretty much the case with all the specializations. They were poorly designed power creeps and anet is unwilling to redesign anything, they just want to tweak numbers.

For the people calling druids op, that is a direct result of anet just tweaking numbers instead of changing a poor design. The nerfs have made any build other than bunker druid unviable. There have been multiple threads full of suggestions on how to fix problems with core rangers so that glassier builds might reemerge but so far they have been ignored and we are stuck with the 1 boring play style.

It is a problem with all elite specs, but I think Rev has it the worst because the entire class suffered this instead of just 1 of 6 traitlines. Not only would a redesign allow Anet to more easily balance Rev well, it would allow give them the chance to implement many QoL changes to the rev class (like no energy cost on weapon skills. I don’t understand this at all)

OriOri.8724:

tym.3791:

OriOri.8724:

While I agree that condi chrono is overtuned, I’m curious as to what you think should be changed about it considering you didn’t list anything specific.

I have faced off several times with the Condi Chrono and never had a issue with them. I wonder if people just don’t have or not using the skills to clear conditions??

Never really had a big prob with thief’s either.

Knowing what to look for and what to dodge versus a condi chrono does make the fight a lot easier, however as a chrono main I do still think its slightly overtuned. People in general don’t like fighting versus heavy confusion and torment access, because they punish you for using the game mechancis themselves, and condi chrono can load you up like crazy with both of them. Its just extremely annoying to fight a build that can punish you for both moving and using skills. I do think nerfing confusion in general would help a lot with the annoyance of this build, but I do not agree with completely removing the passive tick damage from it and torment, just reducing them in WvW.

It all comes down to F5 Continuum Split.

Balance can’t exist to Mesmer (as a whole) because individual abilities based on long cooldowns can be used multiple times. Opponent playing correctly and avoiding that critical attack is nullified. Chrono leaving any situation (because of Mimic combo) is also difficult to justify.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s close to being OK with all the other HoT spec creep but CS feels cheesy at times since it can be activated mid-cast with anything else (no opponent counterplay) and covers a ton of my own bad plays (i.e. missing opponent with Gravity Well or opponent dodging Moa Morph). I don’t necessarily think CS should go but it needs some of the damage received/cooldowns used after reversion (perhaps a small timeout window for those abilities used during).

In WvW, I abuse Decoy, Null Field and F5 in initial zerg clashes and then get to do it all over again later. Solo, triple Blink with Mimic and F5 seems wrong (also Decoy for stun break/stealth during) is such a powerful get out of jail free card.

I don’t know many chronos that run mimic on their bar in WvW. I might just not know competent chronos though, its entirely possible.

As to CS. I always defend it because our elites are so kitten lackluster without it. I mean moa is nice, but a 6 second transform on a 3 minute CD, on top of it being very hard to land it just bullkitten. If our elites were properly adjusted (not least of all unnerfing Moa back to 10 second duration), then I think overall mesmer would be more balanced if CS didn’t affect our elite skills, but still affected everything else. It still allows for some pretty good plays on the chrono’s part but removes double elites. And if you also combined that by changing SoIllusions active effect to only clear 50% of the shatters CD instead of take them all off CD instantly it would remove a huge source of possible skill spam from chrono.