Guild Wars 2

Please Read the entire post before you condemn it solely based on it’s first few sentences.

A bit of off the wall thinking. But what if they removed the scoreboard & point system all together from player view? Keeping it for internal use to match up servers, but players would be unable to see any scoreboard.

Both Planetside and DAOC used this 3 faction pvp siege system, and in both games it worked very very well. People were happy with it for years, even if they played on an under populated realm.

The key is that there was no scoreboard in either game. You never knew just how badly you were getting crushed on an overall basis. The game was less about points & score, and more about logging in and having fun with friends in an open PvP environment. It really didn’t matter what happened the day, or hour, before. As it was always about the time your logged on and having fun. Some of the most epic memories I have of either of those games was coming back from a massive push from the opposing factions, and retaking our bases/keeps.

This would do several things.

• It would alleviate the population drop when people see their realm is falling behind on the WvW scoreboard.

• It would alleviate the NEED to have round the clock guilds to feel like you can compete. Because it’s more about what any player can do with the play time they personally have, rather than what kind of stagger of WvW guilds you can pull off.

• It would make the game more generally enjoyable, as people feel less pressured to run around playing PvDoor for points. And encourage actual PvP.

• It Would encourage tighter knit guild communities having fun, coordinating, and interacting. Rather than massive zerg guilds required to win the matchups on some scoreboard.

I understand that there are players that crave the need to see what their team is doing in a numeric way. They crave these scoreboards as part of that competitive spirit. But that is what TPvP is for. Scoreboards like this don’t have a place in the WvW type environment. And the problems we are seeing in WvW compared to DAOC & PS1 are pretty obvious.

Bring on the flames.

Actually you have a point but nonetheless , when a server hopper log in to w3 and see a color dominating, they will just switch to the winning side.
Hope the server hopping to winning side will be stopped when the server transfer finally has a better restriction..

nice idea, I’d like to see it given a try.

I think the ‘server hoppers’ / fair-weather epidemic is an urban legend. Yes, I’m sure that some players will do this occasionally, but I don’t think its as bad as people are assuming. The main problem I have seen come from whole guilds moving servers.

Personally, I’d rather see Guild Wars occur. Server wars is a nice idea, bit it relies too much on players balancing the servers to become competitive. Guild vs Guild vs Guild would be awesome. I played a lot of Runes of Magic where they have Siege Wars (basically capture-the-flag style – sort of) which is Guild vs Guild and only and hour long (faaarrr too short). Those were great fun tho. And didn’t suffer from the server transfer issues or fair-weather players. The guild got organised, got in there and went for it.

If you remove the numeric portion of the WvW, that still leaves the “looking at map and seeing everything one color” portion. Unless you mean to remove that too…which I would have no idea how since..yeah. I am not trying to throw-down your idea but its just something I thought about when reading your post.

Overall I do agree though on the fact that I believed WvW was going to be my end-game for a long long long long time but with all the problems it poses, I just don’t know anymore. I honesty don’t know how long the game will last at this rate, at least in terms of WvW. There’s just no incentive to even play for a long time. Sure we can play it, but we’ll get bored of it pretty quick.

I like this idea.

“One color map” isn’t that scary as it looks. It might be just night capping, who knows. You can always try and take your land back.
But when you see a score “200k v 100k v 30k” there’s really no hope for comeback or even a point of trying. Majority will just wait for next match or transfer somewhere else.

Yep score has to go, it was clearly not thought through. It serves no purpose other than to make people log out.. it certainly does not say anything about the skill of the winning team, rather about night-capping capabilities.

RayneOfChaos.9856:

If you remove the numeric portion of the WvW, that still leaves the “looking at map and seeing everything one color” portion.

That isn’t as big of a deal, as there is an ebb and flow to the battlefield. Today when I logged into Planetside 2. (uses the same 3 faction PvP system as WvW) One faction had us pushed back to our spawnpoint. Our faction rallied together, and pushed the other faction back. Retaking all of our territory and more.

Thus when people logged on after our major offensive was finished. They would see that we owned 75% of the map. Where as 3 hours earlier we had only owned about 15% of the map.

This type of ebb and flow will naturally balance out the problem of server hoppers and people looking to always jump on the winning side. Just the nature of the system.

Personally I have no problem with having or not having a scoreboard, if people are getting that worried or depressed over a score, just remove it. I think though this is only part of the problem. In this weeks server match-ups my server is up by a long long way (more of a consequence of ET self immolating than anything else ,IoJ player here btw). Today I logged in to EB just to check things out, to my suprise CD came out in force (some nice battles btw CD /salute). We were struggling to get 20-25 players together to fight off the CD zerg of 50 or so. But the weird thing, EB had a queue (bout 1 minute but still). Map chat was full of, how do i get this poi? kitten there are cd at the jump puzzle, someone come help! Frustrating to say the least, on a full map only 25 players were there for WvW. The rest just wanted map completion or jump puzzle badges for their legendary.

I don’t think it would be a far stretch to assume a lot of these people jumped servers to achieve this, several admiting this in map chat, when we were trying to rally some sort of force together. The point I am labouriously coming to is this, map completion and jump puzzls have no real place in WvW removing this as well as the score would help with the server jumping that is going on.

On a side note,some of these players were also advertising to sell siege blueprints for cut price. If people don’t want to WvW they shouldn’t be forced to, nor should players who want to wvw not be able to because a queue exists while people PvE in a PvP zone while a battle is raging.

People in DAoC knew whether they were ‘winning’ or ‘loosing’ despite the lack of score.
But because there was no cumulative bonus or running score, it did not matter as much to people if they were on the loosing side (aka the side without relics or keeps), because there was no ranking, no transfer to the winning faction (delete/reroll) etc.

The scoreboard was wiped clean each time a relic changed hands so to speak.
That was the difference.

Definitely support this idea. It works well in PlanetSide 2 and I think it would help quite a bit with server hoppers in Guild Wars 2 as well. Great idea Sticx!

Been pushing this for a while – glad you started a new thread on it Sticx. If you want to see some of my thoughts on the subject check this post:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Top-Requested-Changes-to-WvW-made-in-the-Forums/page/2#post462368

I’ve put quite a bit of thought into this as well. This is one of the major differences between DAoC and WvW. I’m always searching for root cause analysis. It’s my nature to reverse engineer everything. :P My only agenda is to make the game better. It has so much potential!

I’m totally for this. I honestly can’t see an downside to the suggestion. Remove the point system elimanates players giving up all hope and hopefully boosts the general atmosphere for WvW. Instead of such players just saying “Oh we’re loosing by 150k+ points, why bother?”

+1

Good job!