Guild Wars 2

Every week, it seems I hear about so-and-so guild disbanding or quitting. As an outsider, I’m opening this thread to discuss what’s going on to cause this and what can be done to prevent it from happening in other tiers as well.

I’d like to keep this away from the mind-numbing server bashing that happens on the community forums (i.e. refrain from comments like “server X is stacking/buying guilds”) and focus on the issue of what caused so many guilds to quit in the past month.

The death of some of the best guilds in the game should be symptomatic of a larger problem that we can hopefully address.

From what i heard , some folk are happy with the way t2 is panning out and some are unhappy. I shall leave it there.

Ch-ch-ch-ch-Changes, turn and face the strain! o/~

Fuzzion.2504:

From what i heard , some folk are happy with the way t2 is panning out and some are unhappy. I shall leave it there.

I haven’t heard anyone happy with the way things are panning out. And why are people unhappy? Stale matchups? Broken PPT mechanic? No fights? Lack of GvG support? What specifically caused so many guilds to disband recently?

Guilds are bored. Sos guilds are like non exsistent outside of reset. Otherwise they do what yb does and sit on siege all day. FA is all pugs now,
Guilds disappeared, and mag is mostly pugs also, they either camp cap FA bl all day or 5+ single roamers. If they Zerg it’s 40+ people wantin fights but don’t get any.

Too much GvG, not enough actual WvW, means people on those so called “GvG” servers find it hard to get new blood into their guilds.

Well, I used to be in one of the best guilds in FA until the commander quit. He told me he got tired of wvw. There’s just not much guilds and small groups to fight esp during OCX times. There are less and less people playing wvw because nothing new is coming up. The only major thing that changed in wvw was the removal of the quags and their lil’ pond in the middle of the BLs. With all the SSDD going on, people will move on to a different game. Oh and server stacking and buying guilds too >.>

Once one guild disband and the majority of them leave the game, maybe a few who leaves the game entirely will get replaced. Because of the lack of people playing wvw players in the lower tier might end up going to a higher tier to find people to play or fight with (i.e. OCX and SEA players). I know the OCX guild I was in transferred to a T1 server because there were more people to fight in T1 vs T2.

What Anet needs to do is to promote wvw and add in new features. I only see them advertise pve and pvp stuffs but rarely wvw.

Reverence.6915:

Too much GvG, not enough actual WvW, means people on those so called “GvG” servers find it hard to get new blood into their guilds.

I think this is only an NA phenomenon.

Chaba.5410:

Reverence.6915:

Too much GvG, not enough actual WvW, means people on those so called “GvG” servers find it hard to get new blood into their guilds.

I think this is only an NA phenomenon.

Probably. ’Muricans like to Pee Vee the Dee?

(is a roamer in a t2 eu server)

the wvw population, outside of reset or raid times (6-12gmt) has plummeted in the last few weeks. im very much a roamer so ill keep my comments to what i can see from that perspective:
-stale matchups: who wants to crush or be crushed by population imbalances every single week? i dont just mean ppt, i mean fights also.
-stale maps: placement/population/zero differences for how long now?
-zero emphasis on defending: why even bother ppt when, over the course of the week, the stacked server is always going to win. i dont want to use the k-word but sometimes recently wvw can just feel like a ktrain, “ok, well we cant beat them in a fight/we will crush them in a fight so lets just avoid them and recap before the tick”
-boredom: see all of the above
(this list goes on but from these points im sure most can tell its direction and i wont waste time in rehashing them).

these points are definitely issues for players at the base level. the repercussions, in terms of guilds disbanding, is a product of that (imo). and lets be fair here for a minute, i know atm we all drooling over the prospect of actual input and development from the devs but its been too long, wvw is so so stale. even, from my limited knowledge of gvg’s, the meta is old as hell there. all of this stems from a complete lack of interest from the games developers.

Lord Kuru.3685:

When a gaming company calls colored commander tags “big changes,” it’s pretty obvious what the problem is.

LOL. No arguments there… But, seriously it is a BIG change no? Something new other than just another tournament season?

Ego that where way too big and the ppl who had them could not live up to them. Update has nothing to do with what going on in T2.

Because when a player/guild sucks at all other aspects of wvw so decides to focus on “gvg” fights, only to find that they are inadequate at that as well, they quit.

Also it was all fun when everyone was focused on the fights and running in guild groups only. Then one server decided it would be more fun running in a 50+ man zerg in all time zones. The other two server don’t have the coverage to do it themselves neither is it particularly fun to fight map blobs with just 15-20 people so they stopped turning up to wvw because as long as said server is in T2, it won’t be what we all hoped it would be .

Chaba.5410:

Reverence.6915:

Too much GvG, not enough actual WvW, means people on those so called “GvG” servers find it hard to get new blood into their guilds.

I think this is only an NA phenomenon.

The NA servers in T1 consists of a number of countries outside of the NA timezone.

The main issue with GvG is not about if you playing gw2 Eu,China or NA. It is about support for GvG in the game.

Sharpoon.8197:

Because when a player/guild sucks at all other aspects of wvw so decides to focus on “gvg” fights, only to find that they are inadequate at that as well, they quit.

Also it was all fun when everyone was focused on the fights and running in guild groups only. Then one server decided it would be more fun running in a 50+ man zerg in all time zones. The other two server don’t have the coverage to do it themselves neither is it particularly fun to fight map blobs with just 15-20 people so they stopped turning up to wvw because as long as said server is in T2, it won’t be what we all hoped it would be .

This. Truth hurts.

Any specific names ? Haven’t really heard any guild on SoS quitting or disbanding.

Sounds like the typical issues of population/coverage and lack of changes to WvW.

Question though. If all these guilds really have stopped playing what is Mag and FA’s population like?

I ask because we’re having a great time in T3/T4 at the moment. Would DB/CD/SBI/YB be anywhere near competitive? Or do Mag and FA still have too many peeps for that?

Lord Kuru.3685:

When a gaming company calls colored commander tags “big changes,” it’s pretty obvious what the problem is.

Its so big that it cost 300g.

Johje Holan.4607:

Question though. If all these guilds really have stopped playing what is Mag and FA’s population like?

Mag is out manned most of NA Prime and has very little non NA prime coverage. Mag sometimes rallies a decent force but it is usually for a short time. Also our zergs often have a pocket of highly skilled GvG players. This means hitting a Mag group with a typical pug zerg often ends in an enemy wipe. Mags skill to scrub ratio lands squarely on the skilled side unlike most servers I have fought on. While we lack numbers most of the day, we give every bit as good as we get.

I would guess that if Mag moved down that would rally some forces and we would still dominate a T3 but it is hard to know for sure. Active population is probably just over half what they were when I got here 3-4 months ago.

Closet blobbers with delusions of roam skills slowly fill up tier.
Toss in shameless PvDoor force on one of three servers.
t2 now t1 with less people.

I think you are referring to a number of top GvG guilds that are breaking up after this weekend. In talking to members of a few of them it’s the whole “dead game” thing (read wvw is stale and they don’t enjoy pve) so the members of those guilds are moving to other games or moving to kitten pug and relax with old guild mates.

Fuzzion.2504:

Chaba.5410:

Reverence.6915:

Too much GvG, not enough actual WvW, means people on those so called “GvG” servers find it hard to get new blood into their guilds.

I think this is only an NA phenomenon.

The NA servers in T1 consists of a number of countries outside of the NA timezone.

The main issue with GvG is not about if you playing gw2 Eu,China or NA. It is about support for GvG in the game.

That’s true, I’d love to see a GvG mode myself, but my comment was more in reference to “not enough actual WvW”. It is regular WvW raiding that gave birth to the GW2 GvG. WvW was the lifeblood of developing the players to do GvGs. It takes time and good coaching to develop players, work no one seems to want to do anymore. Which is fine. That’s change.

Next “big change” coming to wvw I predict: update in supply count to push one button!

LetoII.3782:

Closet blobbers with delusions of roam skills slowly fill up tier.
Toss in shameless PvDoor force on one of three servers.
t2 now t1 with less people.

oo a guessing game this looks like fun!

LetoII.3782:

Closet blobbers

Is it FA? No wait..

LetoII.3782:

delusions of roam skills

ooo It is Mag right? hmm hang on a second…

LetoII.3782:

shameless PvDoor force on one of three servers.

I guess by elimination that leaves SoS.

TC-FA-SoS post S1 T2 matchups were fine until Mag and BG destroyed more then half of FA’s OCX+SEA, but I’m sure that is somehow SoS’ fault. It always is. So tell us, when are Australians supposed to play if it isn’t during the evening Australian time? Failing that, are you willing to pay for all the transfers to compensate for Mag’s and FA’s, shall we say, shortcomings? I didn’t think anyone would get so salty after spending 2 weeks on a server 5 months ago. Although funny how some SoR guy, TW no less, is complaining about blobbing, terrible roaming, and shameless PvD.

What is happening in T2 is a whole bunch of GvG only players wanted something out of this game that wasn’t possible. They wanted to stay in high ranked servers with a spread of coverage outside of NA but didn’t want to contribute themselves. They wanted everyone to play like they did, and couldn’t handle it when it didn’t go their way. They wanted to eat their cake.
Add that to the terrible score system, terrible matchmaking system, horribly stale matchup, and a horrendously stale game mode, people have just had enough. The biggest news for new and improved WvW in a year has been coloured tags and a Siege Trick. That is depressing and dissapointing as hell.

The current state of the GvG scene, as seen from the outside, looks as if one were to take all the best players in the NHL and stack them onto a single team. It’s akin to server stacking for a PPT win. That’s the effect of having no real league system where the number of teams are limited and the process of player additions is controlled, as what would be expected from a game mode for this. So unless GvG guilds are willing to compensate this lack of a game mode by agreeing to do NORMAL STUFF that professional sports leagues do, they will continue to create their ded gaem.

Called it a few months ago:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Tier-2-Problems/page/1

Ya know with all these GvG craze going on in your tier, has anyone ever wondered the health of each server’s militias? Guilds come and go to greener pastures for its own health and well being. That is a fact, the militias however are the ones that will always be left behind.
This T2 “project” was bound to fail from the get go. :p A competitive WvW server needs a healthy balance of militias and guilds in order for it to be sustainable.

There is a reason why so many guilds disbanded and recently left the game to Wildstar/Archeage, and this upcoming season has caused even more to leave the game. A-net the destruction of its own game.

Change happens. Deal with it.

It’s ok, Esports never die…

Chaba.5410:

The current state of the GvG scene, as seen from the outside, looks as if one were to take all the best players in the NHL and stack them onto a single team.

He’s referring to [NaCl], the result of trimmed fat after [Agg] merged into [EP].

Screenshot is post-match emote lineup for [BMO] vs [EP] scrim the week of that merger.

The death of t2 has far more to do with a lack of new content, skills, kittenty meta, and a declining WvW population than a failure of GvG guilds to PPT. Mag’s GvG guilds, for instance, regularly captured objectives during downtime, and some of the best drivers even frequently pinned up for pugs to PPT (although such participation certainly wanned considerably the past two months). In addition to general GW2 fatigue and staleness, the final straw for my guild was the ridiculous driver-sniping meta (stack corruption necros, target driver = driverless GvG). It’s not that it can’t be countered, it’s just that a desire to experiment with counters was absent – GW2 fatigue.

Shrouded.6450:

Called it a few months ago:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Tier-2-Problems/page/1

Ya know with all these GvG craze going on in your tier, has anyone ever wondered the health of each server’s militias? Guilds come and go to greener pastures for its own health and well being. That is a fact, the militias however are the ones that will always be left behind.
This T2 “project” was bound to fail from the get go. :p A competitive WvW server needs a healthy balance of militias and guilds in order for it to be sustainable.

This is why there is one clear scoreboard winner of tier 2 every week: because there is only one tier 2 server that innately followed your advice.

Because people got bored. Not because a lack of players, or one guild stacking great players, or cause there wasn’t enough pugs to fight, OR because ppt(lol ppt).

People just got sick of the repetitive WvW. Anet does nothing to fix the game mode, instead introduces new RNG skins and stupid WvW tournies that nobody likes except(you guessed it!) pve players that want new skins.

People then look at new games like Archeage and Wildstar, that look refreshing and hopeful, and from there it’s GG for GW2. Blame Anet for the lack of content.

Doomdesire.9365:

Not because a lack of players, or one guild stacking great players

Agreed. Great players come and go, and that “stack” was extremely short-lived, anyway.

Lord Kuru.3685:

When a gaming company calls colored commander tags “big changes,” it’s pretty obvious what the problem is.

GW2: the fastest growing game, is now becoming the fastest dying game.

The patch gave none of the wvw core that have been around for a very long time nothing to look forward too.

Ded gaem is ded

Virtute.8251:

This is why there is one clear scoreboard winner of tier 2 every week: because there is only one tier 2 server that innately followed your advice.

This server has an overnight presence that is the only reason they are a clear scoreboard winner.

Ya know with all these GvG craze going on in your tier, has anyone ever wondered the health of each server’s militias? Guilds come and go to greener pastures for its own health and well being. That is a fact, the militias however are the ones that will always be left behind.
This T2 “project” was bound to fail from the get go. :p A competitive WvW server needs a healthy balance of militias and guilds in order for it to be sustainable.

Straegen.2938:

Virtute.8251:

This is why there is one clear scoreboard winner of tier 2 every week: because there is only one tier 2 server that innately followed your advice.

This server has an overnight presence that is the only reason they are a clear scoreboard winner.

Every time anyone says anything about their bunch of Australians it just seems so dam sour.

If you mean “they only win coz of the ocx” then yes, that is what a healthy balance of militia and guilds is.
SoS did an amazing job of keeping their Australian (of course not forgetting their benevolent S-E Asians) crew because they weren’t forced into being told what to do and how to play. They catered to their play styles, let them come and go as they please and didn’t osctracise them week in and week out. That kept them from falling too far down the tiers and put them in a very strong position to be able to rebuild – which they did. They recognised militia was important and used them as a base to attract guilds who were able to completely focus on themselves, so they didn’t have to carry the entire burden of the server. They let guilds be guilds and pug be pugs. They provided a healthy mix of militia and guilds to sustain the server and that is why there is 1 clear scoreboard winner every week.

rashkin.9530:

Every time anyone says anything about their bunch of Australians it just seems so dam sour.

If you mean “they only win coz of the ocx” then yes, that is what a healthy balance of militia and guilds is.

Win is such a relative term. SoS is right in line with FA and Mag most of NA prime. They make up most of their big leads during non-NA prime. SoS isn’t some juggernaut they just do a lot more PvDoor than the other two servers in the tier. I am not casting any judgement on the server as they have several skilled players and guilds but that 2x score lead is almost entirely from PvD.

Mag on the other hand really doesn’t give a crap about PPT… most of us prefer open field fights and get bored running from one PvE unmanned objective to the next. I would quit the game rather than play on OCX SoS… that has to be the most boring events outside of EotM.

rashkin.9530:

SoS did an amazing job of keeping their Australian (of course not forgetting their benevolent S-E Asians) crew because they weren’t forced into being told what to do and how to play.

Not really sure what this means. I’m pretty sure FA didn’t tell their OCX what to do and how to play. It’s depressing to OCX players to log in and find they don’t own anything on a map and have to rebuild rather than finding good fights.

rashkin.9530:

snip

Yes, yes! The rest of t2 is totally sour about SoS’ PPT lead. I cut myself just thinking about it.

so much for anet ppl saying something about wvw/gvg community

Here’s what REALLY happened. FA and DB melted down before season 1 and that brought SoS and Maguuma up into T2. Both were mere fractions of the size that FA and DB were before that and the matches reflected the disparity.

Since then, SoS has grown into a full fledged T2 server on par with the servers that were in that tier 1+ year ago. Maguuma has remained the same; only picking up two SEA guilds (one of which were bored SoS players wanting someone to face).

FA rebuilt, but only rebuilt their EST NA and not much else.

So you have one legit T2 or T1.5 server with modest to good coverage 21 hours a day (that gap soon to be covered) and two servers with good coverage for about 6 hours a day.

I still think Anet needs to take the six lowest ranked servers out of rotation and force all those players to pick a new server. Six servers worth of players (even if they are low pop) transferring into tiers 6-2 should go along way towards closing the tier gaps.

Chris.3290:

So you have one legit T2 or T1.5 server with modest to good coverage 21 hours a day (that gap soon to be covered) and two servers with good coverage for about 6 hours a day.

Pretty accurate assessment by my recollection..

Lurock Turoth.9085:

I still think Anet needs to take the six lowest ranked servers out of rotation and force all those players to pick a new server. Six servers worth of players (even if they are low pop) transferring into tiers 6-2 should go along way towards closing the tier gaps.

No it won’t.

I recently bought a second account to tour the lower tiers with. From what I’ve seen in the ET/Ebay/FC matchup, all 3 servers have a decent sized population but absolutely 0 organisation. 90% of the time there’s no commander on any map (on ET). Zergs are spread out and it’s really easy to pick people off. People play the siege game harder than in T1. Fights are sparse and boring. Contrary to what has been said before on these boards, the average skill level is a lot lower than in the upper tiers (will readjust this statement as I move from server to server if needed, but what I’ve seen so far is disappointing).

The main issue though? The majority of these players on NA T8 servers are NA players. NA players don’t make coverage. People from other places in the world do. The servers with “off hours coverage” will still dominate those who don’t. The tier gaps will still be there, even more prevalent than before as the majority of NA players will continue to play NA prime only while peeps from the other side of the world can wrack up the PPT for their server with little to no fights or resistance (this is of course, talking about lower tiers).

Psh , zero organization. We like how our WvW is right now. We don’t want to be forced from our home to some server with guilds that want to tell us what to do. We used to be T3, once we had an exodus it was bad sure. But the people here never left and don’t want to be forced to leave. Most guilds that left have disappeared and we’re still here with guilds that never left. We have a very active community forum as well. So Anet better not take that away from us and force us up to servers we don’t want to be on. We have excellent fights. You just picked ET who’s the worst at the moment. You shouldn’t be speaking for every server down here.

Reverence.6915:

Lurock Turoth.9085:

I still think Anet needs to take the six lowest ranked servers out of rotation and force all those players to pick a new server. Six servers worth of players (even if they are low pop) transferring into tiers 6-2 should go along way towards closing the tier gaps.

No it won’t.

I recently bought a second account to tour the lower tiers with. From what I’ve seen in the ET/Ebay/FC matchup, all 3 servers have a decent sized population but absolutely 0 organisation. 90% of the time there’s no commander on any map (on ET). Zergs are spread out and it’s really easy to pick people off. People play the siege game harder than in T1. Fights are sparse and boring. Contrary to what has been said before on these boards, the average skill level is a lot lower than in the upper tiers (will readjust this statement as I move from server to server if needed, but what I’ve seen so far is disappointing).

The main issue though? The majority of these players on NA T8 servers are NA players. NA players don’t make coverage. People from other places in the world do. The servers with “off hours coverage” will still dominate those who don’t. The tier gaps will still be there, even more prevalent than before as the majority of NA players will continue to play NA prime only while peeps from the other side of the world can wrack up the PPT for their server with little to no fights or resistance (this is of course, talking about lower tiers).

What’s your other account name because I’m sure we never ran into each other

As for skill….T2 was the epitome of skill. T1 was full of free bags tbh