Guild Wars 2

I am in EoTM now. I know its a bag/badge train,

But I cant help but wonder, what would have made this mode better and more fun?

What about the Map Design, limits its gameplay from being more like the other WvW modes?

When I first heard about EoTM being cross server, I was simply expecting a new more balanced (population wise) version of Eternal Battlegrounds, but EoTM is nothing like it in terms of gameplay nor fun factor. It has its own enjoyment element which is Bag Train of course (just to note that Bag train is fun in its own rewarding way), but I like the large scale PvP of WvW, and really I simply wanted a fix to the Server Population of the current Server vs Server model of the WvW mode.

EoTM fixed that problem by making it cross server factions, but it added its own list of issues.

I wouldnt want to take away the Bag/Badge train from anybody. Because like I said before. Thats fun in its own rewarding way, when it comes to getting random loot with a chance at something big in that loot bag.

But I would totally love a new EoTM map/mode that still does the cross server design for factions, but with a more Eternal Battleground feel to it, in which players want to defend and attack locations.

But this is my opinion. What are yours?

It wasn’t a karma train when initially released. People actually played it strategically for 1-2 weeks. Then when they realized there were no real reasons to win (PPT) they went back to normal WvW. A new crowd learned how to exploit the karma events to level characters or make gold from it, by playing only the PvE aspects of it and disregarding the other enemy players who were doing the same thing.

To make it better you have to either:
1- bring it back into the PPT rotation and un-merge the servers from EOTM
2- make another server version of the map for serious PPT in the current matchup

They could also make the keeps upgradable.

Make it drop way less badges and significantly reduce the WvW experience/karma experience points. It’s literally PvDoor and avoid the enemy zerg at all costs in its current form. It is currently the most exploited thing in game. You can forget about that Blix exploit. This is way worse in giving inflated WvW ranks, Level up, karma and loot rewards.

If this mode was supposed to help teach PvErs how to WvW then it has done the opposite. We have clueless commanders going in WvW leading zergs out and not sweeping immediately upon taking a keep and trying to run it as a karma train in WvW.

EotM is an overflow for WvW. It gives WvW players something to do when all maps have a queue. Working as intended.

EotM is also happens to be a great place accumulate xp/karma/loot. Judging by the popularity, the effort-reward ratio is probably even better than in PvE.

EotM should not be serious. Who cares if it’s balanced or not. If you do want some balance, the easiest way would be making the colors truly random at every WvW reset.

EotM should not have any impact on WvW. I think most WvW players haven’t even noticed the EotM victory supplies in the Citadel.

No need to fix anything.

Make it less like skyhammer.

Coldtart.4785:

Make it less like skyhammer.

This. The overall design is just awful.

EotM would benefit greatly from a few of the same things WvW maps would, mainly rewards for defending. Of course ANET still has to figure out a non-exploitable way to accomplish that but they’ve been working on it for over a year now. Must be getting close.

I will say that the recent increase of guilds and anti-karma farmers in EotM who try to defend and train bust are making things more entertaining at least so kudos to them. I use to level my alts in WvW but that has become more difficult and EotM was so mind numbingly boring for awhile there that I stopped bothering to try but its been more fun with defenders around lately. Sure you die a bit more often and level a tad slower, but the chat entertainment value skyrockets and sometimes you get into some great skirmishes. I do hate falling through hard to see holes in the terrain tho.

Use eotm to test a faction v faction v faction play style over wvwvw

I hate to say it but a means of punishing the sides that lose in some way i have no ideal how though. In a lot of ways ppt set up now is more of a system to dish out fails over rewards by dropping worlds from tears into lower ones making ppl work harder on ppt or simply leave that world.

This will push ppl to hold keeps etc.. in EotM the main problem with the system now.

Short runs, way fewer choke points, less PvE mobs and less falling terrain. The map is a roaming/skirmish disaster. No GvG either. Basically the only people that want to go to EotM are zerglings looking for passive advancement. Skilled players simply cannot find consistently decent fights.

Straegen.2938:

Short runs, way fewer choke points, less PvE mobs and less falling terrain. The map is a roaming/skirmish disaster. No GvG either. Basically the only people that want to go to EotM are zerglings looking for passive advancement. Skilled players simply cannot find consistently find decent fights.

That would make ppl blob more to fix EotM there must be something the players are fighting for that just how RvR works with out something real to fight for that is harmful to lose and great to keep there no reason to fight. You can GvG in EotM just not vs green.

Jski.6180:

That would make ppl blob more to fix EotM there must be something the players are fighting for that just how RvR works with out something real to fight for that is harmful to lose and great to keep there no reason to fight. You can GvG in EotM just not vs green.

A map that encourages breaking up blobs was needed and EotM did just the opposite. PvE mobs that are a PIA to kill solo, choke points that force players together, long runs that make getting to the enemy difficult and ridiculously easy one shot attacks that push people off the edge for a loss are all features that enhance the blob effect.

There is absolutely nothing roamer, skirmisher or GvG friendly about EotM which is why so few are there.

PvE mobs are good. They often slow roamers down so zerg can catch them.

To improve it as an actual pvp map instead of karma train? It needs to be built from scratch.

Let’s see:
-NPC’s are way too impactful (auto repair, massive damage). They should be sponges, not one shoting your raid.

-Almost everything is a choke point which makes battles a matter of spamming aoe on a bridge and who has the most bodies.

-Defending is far too easy, especially keeps because point one and the fact that spawn is so close. Have you ever tried to take FR keep with a few as 3 or so arrow carts on you? There’s no room to set up a healthy siege either.

-Team sizes are horrendously balanced and need fixing. I am on red for the second week in a row and we currently hold nothing and are camped at our base. I had outnumbered all last week.

-There’s no point in winning.

Honestly, I think having anonymous ally names tainted the first impression of EotM, by the time they changed it, it was too late. It helped to compound the issue of “Offense > Defense” that classic WvWvW maps have.

Perhaps a larger advantage for your home server. Like more NPC guards or something. Orfree upgrades to structures.

Coldtart.4785:

Make it less like skyhammer.

This; and make defending/pvp kills rewarding. And since defending is overpowered, and siege too expensive for a map that doesn’t count towards wvw (I’m talking supers/omegas here), there should be eotm-exclusive superior siege that’s very cheap.

Defending a keep should reward you about as much as taking a keep, as well as give your dragonit. Right now, you get no items (besides the poor quality junk in player bags that can never amount to more than what you get from champ bags), low exp and low karma for defending a keep.

Until a balance is found (and I don’t mean nerfing the ktrain, it’s defending that needs a buff), EotM will be a joke and the defenders/bag hunters are going to get yelled at by the karma trainers because you can’t karma train very well when your keep is never flipped.

Phantasmal.5631:

Make it drop way less badges and significantly reduce the WvW experience/karma experience points. It’s literally PvDoor and avoid the enemy zerg at all costs in its current form. It is currently the most exploited thing in game. You can forget about that Blix exploit. This is way worse in giving inflated WvW ranks, Level up, karma and loot rewards.

Terrible idea, nobody will even do EotM if you do that. The rewards for training is fine right now, but you literally have no reason to defend or pvp, which is what needs fixing. (as well as the fact it’s way too easy to defend, 2-3 people is all you need to defend FR vs uplevels since the champ kills them all).

Perhaps by making rewards scale with how long you’ve held the assets you own. The more stuff you own, the better the scaling. Start the rewards off fairly low, but increase them as you hold keeps and towers each tick. Losing them resets the scale back to the start.

Gives incentive to defend and tones down the blatant K-training.

My suggestion is to swap EOTM and EB for one week as a test. See how well the map works when in an environment that is both coordinated and competitive. If the community likes it, then they can make whatever tweaks are necessary based on feedback and have EOTM and EB rotate every other matchup. The one not used in the matchup can be the map ktrainers go to.

This would also be a good direction for adding extra maps to WvW. The population really can’t support having more than 4 maps so instead there can be rotations for the non-BL map.

Arcadio.6875:

My suggestion is to swap EOTM and EB for one week as a test. See how well the map works when in an environment that is both coordinated and competitive. If the community likes it, then they can make whatever tweaks are necessary based on feedback and have EOTM and EB rotate every other matchup. The one not used in the matchup can be the map ktrainers go to.

This would also be a good direction for adding extra maps to WvW. The population really can’t support having more than 4 maps so instead there can be rotations for the non-BL map.

No swap. I don’t wanna play in EB or www EotM.

Junkpile.7439:

I don’t wanna play in EB or www EotM.

Well, I would lol. But no one person’s opinion should be the final decision on whether EOTM can be a real WvW map. That’s why we need to test it by having it in a matchup.

If the WvW community hates it, then it can stay as a ktrain map forever.

Arcadio.6875:

Junkpile.7439:

I don’t wanna play in EB or www EotM.

Well, I would lol. But no one person’s opinion should be the final decision on whether EOTM can be a real WvW map. That’s why we need to test it by having it in a matchup.

If the WvW community hates it, then it can stay as a ktrain map forever.

Whoever holds FR would never lose : always 2nd or 1st ppt. Too easy to defend. That would not work.

EotM is a perma ktrain because :
- there is no incentive to win (at all), neither personal nor for your server (the supplies usually don’t really change anything in the end)
- no one is invested, because between the fact it’s cross server and your are put with random people (and screwed over half the time by being put on empty maps for the whole week when blue), you aren’t playing with/against people you “know” but with annonymous people you couldn’t care less about, against people you couldn’t care less about.
- there is absolutely no tactical decisions to be made in that place, because WvW roaming is “balanced” compared to that piece of crap map….. take blue keep : put 10 sieges and 15 people in it defending and you could have both red and green zergs sieging it for the whole mu and they would probably not get in. And it’s only one of the dozens imbalance problems in that place.
- you spend too much time running covering the map to really have anything “tactical” to respond to the ennemy and face it, unless it’s roughly “balanced” and then everything will happen around the center of the map (and it’ll be boring far faster)

- the whole design of the map with various levels/layers, edges, bridges and such makes it nice/original/fun… for a whole lot of 2/3 mus. After that it makes it the most painful broken WvW map, where basically you have the winner decided by whomever control the choke points first, or have people with lines/mass kb/fear walls/fear wells/siege to send a whole group to their death from ledges/bridges on top of making moving around totally ridiculous, and it would be insanely frustrating and a pure evil grind worse than WW2’s Normady invasion to move around the map for any group if it was made “serious”.

This map can NEVER be allowed to host any sort of “serious” WvW that matter, it would be the end of WvW for good.

Filovirus.6258:

EotM is a perma ktrain because :
- there is no incentive to win (at all), neither personal nor for your server (the supplies usually don’t really change anything in the end)
- no one is invested, because between the fact it’s cross server and your are put with random people (and screwed over half the time by being put on empty maps for the whole week when blue), you aren’t playing with/against people you “know” but with annonymous people you couldn’t care less about, against people you couldn’t care less about.
- there is absolutely no tactical decisions to be made in that place, because WvW roaming is “balanced” compared to that piece of crap map….. take blue keep : put 10 sieges and 15 people in it defending and you could have both red and green zergs sieging it for the whole mu and they would probably not get in. And it’s only one of the dozens imbalance problems in that place.
- you spend too much time running covering the map to really have anything “tactical” to respond to the ennemy and face it, unless it’s roughly “balanced” and then everything will happen around the center of the map (and it’ll be boring far faster)

- the whole design of the map with various levels/layers, edges, bridges and such makes it nice/original/fun… for a whole lot of 2/3 mus. After that it makes it the most painful broken WvW map, where basically you have the winner decided by whomever control the choke points first, or have people with lines/mass kb/fear walls/fear wells/siege to send a whole group to their death from ledges/bridges on top of making moving around totally ridiculous, and it would be insanely frustrating and a pure evil grind worse than WW2’s Normady invasion to move around the map for any group if it was made “serious”.

This map can NEVER be allowed to host any sort of “serious” WvW that matter, it would be the end of WvW for good.

Unfortunately I would have to agree.

What would make EotM better?

• Reduce champion rewards
• Increase player kill rewards
• Balance green/blue/red properly
• End chest -Gold for nr1 -Silver for nr2 -Copper for nr3
  (End chest contains all the bloodstone dust and other pve stuff that some players don’t need)

THAT will make EotM better!

Menzies The Heretic.3415:

What would make EotM better?

• Reduce champion rewards
• Increase player kill rewards
• Balance green/blue/red properly
• End chest -Gold for nr1 -Silver for nr2 -Copper for nr3
  (End chest contains all the bloodstone dust and other pve stuff that some players don’t need)

THAT will make EotM better!

Congrats, you just killed EotM (like everyone with “bright” ideas for it).

The ONLY 2 things making EotM alive and used right now are :
- the rewards you get from it (the all around ones, allowing you to lvl up, farm wxp, karma, badges, loot, gold at the same time)
- the fact you can go there with an upscaled/idiotic or inadequate build without being a liability and still have fun/get what you want.

Remove the rewards, and EotM will be a ghost town… put the rest into equation, and the upscaled will be bullied out of WvW like they were before…and quite some of the upscaled wil go back to WvW, thing nobody wants.

I really don’t get why peole want to NERF EotM income all day long when what’s needed is to transfert said income to classic WvW so WvWers have a decent income at long last…… (on top of that npcs from EotM should be transfered over too, to make them challenging and stop having people 1/3 manning Kepp LORDS or people soloing fully buffed camps with mercenaries, things that should never happen ever, but that’s another discussion).

EotM right now is serving it’s purpose, it’s a kittenfest for everyone to test, learn quite some things actually (RI mechanisms, timers, capping, some of siege building/defense, the whole ledge/edges knockback and use of Stability to counter it, difference between vet ands lords/champs, and so on), allowing people to get very basic WvW mechanisms introduction without hampering or hurting more “serious” mu, a way for people to level up, or farm badges/WxP without hampering WvW once again and so on.

We NEED it into the game, and mostly with no changes. And finally having people moving out of the “looooottttttttttttbbbaaagss foam on the mouth” mentality is a good thing, it’s not something you want to add on top.

The fact is OBJECTIVES should hold the most of rewards and income, not stomps (it’s stupid as Hell honestly, specially coupled to the fact that stomps and simple kills don’t reward the same, specially now with bloodlust), and that it’s the fact in EotM is a good thing.

Objectives makes you win in WvW, not stomping….. There is probably the need for a few tweaks here and there, but anyway, as long as EotM is SHORT mu, you can’t have any “serious” WvW in there, because “serious” WvW requires the whole tactical management of supplies, upgrades, yak running/attack/defense, and so on, and that takes time and investment.

Keep it that way (with a few tweaks, and a LOAD of bug fixes, specially the invisible holes through the ground, the places you take falling damage while running on a flat suface, and so on), and import the good things they did there in WvW.

And really use it as a testing ground. Golem Mastery and traps should have been deployed there for a few months for testing purpose before entering WvW.

And sentries and such should have been deployed to WvW a long time ago too (it would put a whole new tactical aspect of scouting/hampering scouting all over).