Guild Wars 2

Agreed, People are really losing faith in this game and Anet and with the failed patches of late if these Leagues go belly up then it could well be the final nail in the coffin.

Why do pve players benefit from wvw scores anyway. Or should you get more bonusses per rank in wvw? Not very alt friendly I know

It won’t change anything about the fact I love WvW at all… I won’t quit for that for sure…

Valid point. Furthermore, it is sad with the enourmous feedback given on these forums, not a single kitten has been given about us – the WvW community.

It`s already been zergy for months & now the T7 mats are (barely dropping) nobody wants to defend any more as they miss out on the (again, barely) dropping loots.
Come the Orb buff, I bet roamers will be almost extinct, like the balance in this game.

My biggest gripe with the whole idea and wvw in general is the massive fail in the matchmaking system. For example the difference between the top 3 servers to the 4 server is a jump, the 4 to the 5-7ish is another large jump, then the 8-10 is another jump. Another example, CD got paired with FA for three weeks straight, the first two it was CD vs FA vs SOS and CD vs FA vs EB. In both those matchups FA completely destroyed all of us. In week three it was CD vs FA vs TC, in that matchup TC completely wrecked us AND FA. That right there really put in perspective just how far apart some of these servers are….so now they want to put us all in a league together? Hate to say this because I really love GW2 and WvW but this league thing is going to fail so incredibly hard..and i’m really really scared that it’s going to kill our server and possibly kill WvW. Why can’t the matchups be made off of the servers rank, I would much rather be paired with the same two servers each week instead of this unbalanced garbage.

Anet should have already said in a statement that the new league setup will make it more difficult for the top servers to win. This alone would help spread out the WvW population. Nothing like being on a server at over 400 PPT and losing the match to make you question why you’re on a single color BL escorting yaks, paying for upgrades and not fighting anyone all while finishing in third place.

Everyone in NA who has played in the latest matchmaking system knows that when you get one server that’s from a lower tier than the others, they quickly get pushed off the maps and it ends up being a 1v1. A match between 3 tiers becomes a route. T1vT2 is a route, T1vT3 even more so and T1vT4, well, we don’t even need to play that week.

Anet should also say that the people who are above a certain rank in WvW are going to have their transfer ability limited. Zero transfers to a server that has more WvW coverage and a set limit to a lower coverage server. This prevents further stacking of population in a few servers like we have now and also prevents the stacking of one lower server, similar to what happened to Kaineg earlier this year.

Grotesque.6479:

Valid point. Furthermore, it is sad with the enourmous feedback given on these forums, not a single kitten has been given about us – the WvW community.

To be fair, these forums, and this board in particular is less then 1% of the population. On top of that, these forums are the most negative of what I’ve seen in the GW2 community. When you realize those things, it makes sense why little attention is given here. I mean how does “we stopped this update because less then 1% voiced they were displeased with it.” Sound?
If you want to send a message, you need to muster way more then a couple hundred people. Especially in a forum with a climate like this.

Are you guys serious ?
WvW has finaly became the pvp game we all dreamed of.. now the zerg not only farms towers/keeps but they also farm Champions !!!!!111!!! who doesn’t like a sane PvDvC ?

They say we have to wait untill the end of this kitten League ‘cuz they don’t wanth to.. I don’t know.. work ? .. but maybe is better to leave things like they used to be, last changes ruined the game.

Maybe an option could be for two WvW instances…a competitive League instance and a normal “casual” WvW.

One way that could be executed is by eliminating the current server vs sever model for the competitive league. Why not create a new set of 12 “Teams” that are not server dependent and allow players to join them for the competitive WvW play?
The current Server Model could stay in effect for the casual WvW play…

Players would be asked to select which version of WvW they would want to join for the week…or day…

I know…most likely not really “do able”…

Why bother defending?
Why bother escorting Dollies?
Why bother scouting?

Anet has made it that all the rewards go to those that are in the zerg.

Colly.4073:

Why bother defending?
Why bother escorting Dollies?
Why bother scouting?

Anet has made it that all the rewards go to those that are in the zerg.

Agreed.

I remember months back when small team play was going to be the focus of the WvW dev team.

I’m also from GoM, and my concerns are basically the same.

The problem with leagues is it will make the matchups EVEN MORE IMBALANCED, and then rub it in the lower tier servers faces by rewarding the stacked servers.

I love being the underdog too, but GoM will be a T8 server soon (once the scores settle out). Fighting T7 servers will still be fun. Fighting one T6 server everyone once in a while could be an interesting challenge. But fighting T5 or multiple T6/T5 servers at once, that can be nothing but depressing. Since every server in the league will fight every other server at least once, this will happen frequently.

It has been a LONG time since I’ve seen a server stuck at 10 ppt for an entire week, but that will be happening again soon. However, this will be even worse than before, the game will reward the other servers for their “victory.”

WvW has enough balance issues. This league will only make it worse.

@ point 3.

They have already stated that there will be a list of achievements to be done in order to qualify for a reward. So in that respect your server will see MORE people join WvW and participate because they will have to go and grab camps, take towers/keeps and defend stuff in order to receive the reward.

I can’t comment on the other points because everything is speculation at this point, we simply don’t know what will happen.

Zumi.6384:

I’m sure there are thousands of threads on this already, but I want to throw my hat into the ring.

I never really post threads of doom and gloom about an upcoming patch, because I feel like people in general tend to overreact, and for the most part it all works itself out in the long run.

However, I have to say that after reading the blog post about leagues I’m feeling very down about WvW and this game in general at this point, and here’s why.

I spend a vast majority of my playing time in WvW. It’s what I find fun in GW2 and roaming in groups with my guildmates or solo is always my favorite activity. We play on a lower tier server (Gates of Madness) so we’ve had our ups and downs, and we’ve always been sort of an underdog server, which we like. Until recently we had actually built up a pretty decent group of dedicated players that were helping us improve and move up the rankings.

Leagues have already destroyed that progress, as all but ourselves and maybe 1-2 other WvW guilds have left.

With that said, here are my concerns about the new system.

1) Getting rolled every week is incredibly frustrating and could easily take the fun out of the game completely. I’m all for underdogs and I love the thought of pulling GoM out of the ashes, but the fact is everyone will be on 1-2 servers and we’ll get destroyed. This will be the case for a lot of lower tier servers, and it will only encourage even more top heavy servers.

2) Even if we DID want to transfer to a server with a shot, it would just turn into a massive zerg fest 24/7, which is also no fun.

3) This greatly encourages PvE players with no investment in WvW to not only transfer, but get rewards for doing NOTHING! We don’t get rewards if we don’t participate in Living Story content, nor do we get PvP rewards if we don’t play in tournaments. Why should everyone else get the rewards that we fight for day in and day out without lifting a finger?

4) This is probably my biggest concern. A quote from the GW2 blog post: “To further incentivize spending your points we will not be introducing any new ability lines during the season, nor shall we be making any other changes to WvW, with the exception of bug fixes, until the season concludes”

This means we’ll get no improvements to WvW at all and be stuck with a pretty stale game mode for a long period of time. I’ve tried to defend ANet before when people claimed that WvW was the bottom of the barrel in terms of their priorities, but this change makes it pretty clear to me that they aren’t really interested in what our player base wants.

I’m really scared that this change will make me want to stop playing the game altogether, and I’m pretty sure there are a LOT of other players that will do the same.

Great post. The population and coverage imbalance is already bad, but with this system its going to get worse. The annoying thing is that it doesn’t really add anything from a design standpoint. There is already a ladder with servers fighting for the top spot. Its already something to go for. I think the designers working on this have forgotten that first and foremost it is a game that should be fun. It is not fun to be destroyed by a server with 3x your population. It is not fun to destroy a server with 3x less of yous. WvW is currently lacking pop and coverage balance.

Altie.4571:

@ point 3.

They have already stated that there will be a list of achievements to be done in order to qualify for a reward. So in that respect your server will see MORE people join WvW and participate because they will have to go and grab camps, take towers/keeps and defend stuff in order to receive the reward.

I can’t comment on the other points because everything is speculation at this point, we simply don’t know what will happen.

Fair enough, I must have missed that. I’m still worried overall, but that is a bit of relief.

Let’s hope they decide to stick around!

Dual.8953:

Grotesque.6479:

Valid point. Furthermore, it is sad with the enourmous feedback given on these forums, not a single kitten has been given about us – the WvW community.

To be fair, these forums, and this board in particular is less then 1% of the population. On top of that, these forums are the most negative of what I’ve seen in the GW2 community. When you realize those things, it makes sense why little attention is given here. I mean how does “we stopped this update because less then 1% voiced they were displeased with it.” Sound?
If you want to send a message, you need to muster way more then a couple hundred people. Especially in a forum with a climate like this.

The forums may be a (very vocal) minority, but all posters care about this game enough to take the effort to write down their oppinion here.

So what if the majority of the WvW players are following a shiny blue commander tag around (much like a skritt) spamming 1 all day? Sure they might feel like they’re a great player doing a great job because they are winning a coverage war. As soon as something else catches their short (much like a skritt) attention span, they’ll hop off board and sign up for the next game.

Does it make much more sense to explain to the playerbase “Ya… uhm. The majority thought pressing 1 all day is no issue with skill lag, so we leave it at that.”? I am going to sound like an elitist kitten here, but the majority of the playerbase that does not think anything is wrong with the game is in most cases too blind to see existing issues. (Or does not care about them enough to bother with it.)

Up until this day there is yet to be one “balanced” MMO. Does that mean those games suck? – No, ofcourse not. But denying there are issues does not help to improve the games either.

Finally, I can sound like I’m talking about sports without talking about sports.

Fantasy GW2? Moa WvW Racing?

Very good points by OP.

Unfortunately there is NO dialogue between Arenanet and its WvWvW player base. There is mainly just one WvWvW developer commenting in these forums, but I am sure the WvWvW team consists at least half a dozen developers (including artists and programmers). I guess everybody is just incredibly busy doing those Super Adventure whatever.

Arenanet tends to ignore the serious and important questions. Instead the side notes and minor things might get a humorous answer. More over the communication feels very one directional. All the pleas and ideas by the player base, especially by the hard core player base are consistently ignored and Arenanet implements the opposite choice. E.g. the player base pleas for account based WXP or toning down some of the overpowered runes of perplexity or WXP traits and siege warface, Arenanet ends up always doing the opposite. This is sure sign that the developers are out of touch the with their hard core player base. Of course some of the ideas presented in these forums by the player base are just plain bad, very difficult to implement or would wreck the balance even worse, but in general I feel that all the comments go just down the drain.

I have many times suggested State of the Game for WvWvW, happening on a monthly basis. I haven’t ever gotten any developer feedback for that. I could even organize some great players from different servers for that. Wouldn’t it be interesting to see and hear some of the most dedicated WvWvW players talk with Arenanet devs on a live stream?

I think you will have to set it up and send e-mail to anet community manager like Martin
to organize it. That is what spvp players did.

Deniara Devious.3948:

Very good points by OP.

Unfortunately there is NO dialogue between Arenanet and its WvWvW player base. There is mainly just one WvWvW developer commenting in these forums, but I am sure the WvWvW team consists at least half a dozen developers (including artists and programmers). I guess everybody is just incredibly busy doing those Super Adventure whatever.

Arenanet tends to ignore the serious and important questions. Instead the side notes and minor things might get a humorous answer. More over the communication feels very one directional. All the pleas and ideas by the player base, especially by the hard core player base are consistently ignored and Arenanet implements the opposite choice. E.g. the player base pleas for account based WXP or toning down some of the overpowered runes of perplexity or WXP traits and siege warface, Arenanet ends up always doing the opposite. This is sure sign that the developers are out of touch the with their hard core player base. Of course some of the ideas presented in these forums by the player base are just plain bad, very difficult to implement or would wreck the balance even worse, but in general I feel that all the comments go just down the drain.

I have many times suggested State of the Game for WvWvW, happening on a monthly basis. I haven’t ever gotten any developer feedback for that. I could even organize some great players from different servers for that. Wouldn’t it be interesting to see and hear some of the most dedicated WvWvW players talk with Arenanet devs on a live stream?

There was a post by ANET developer way back saying that they welcome any players’ organized wvw state of the game. So if you can do the organization, I am sure you will get ANET devs on a live stream.

Altie.4571:

@ point 3.

They have already stated that there will be a list of achievements to be done in order to qualify for a reward. So in that respect your server will see MORE people join WvW and participate because they will have to go and grab camps, take towers/keeps and defend stuff in order to receive the reward.

I can’t comment on the other points because everything is speculation at this point, we simply don’t know what will happen.

Unfortunately, this will actually make the blowouts bigger!
The people this will bring in are the achievement hunters, and they will be busy already trying to do their dailies + all the Living World stuff. So they will come in when their server is winning to karma train through their achievements in the most efficient way possible. As soon as it gets tough they will leave to PvE and come try again later.
These people won’t help upgrade/defend, or probably even drop siege, and the hardcore WvW players will once again be left holding the bag.

We dont know much details, but the current Server MMR got stuck and the randomization recently on the matchups a little more interessting.
Maybe after this 1st leagues event/season the top & bottom servers will be split into leagues of their own and wont be matched up for some time.

There will be 2 or 3 leagues in the first “season”, the i.e. Top6 of each league might end up in a gold league for the next season, those further down the ranks then into their own silver/bronze league.

This way we would have 2-3 individual ladders for a region, instead of 1 like now. Next season the losing servers in gold would descend back into silver league while winners of the silver league would get a shot to step up into gold…would actually give more progression/fluctuation and enhance even matchups.

@Reslinal:
“State of WvW” would be nice and yes Devs actually said itself more than once, that they would welcome this…wondering why the “socalled” organized guilds didnt step up to this after 1 year of WvW….
Maybe would be better to get a gameing site like Gamebreaker, wartower, curse etc. to host this. Seems if the guilds itself feel too overwhelmed to be up for the task… my guessing

@1 – you mean like gom/sf did to us on our descent to t8 for weeks on end… spawn camping us, rolling over everything we had every hour, helping to make sure our wvw population stayed out of wvw (till just recently… what you’re seeing right now btw).

@3 – never underestimate pve’ers who want map completion combined with high/very high server population. there is rewards in somebody who needs to run through some borderland and and creative recruiting and careful support can win ppt’s as we’ve shown over the past few days. running off to winning servers won’t help you either.

The devs know it’s going to ruin wvw for a number of servers. They have been told enough times by enough people that it’s a bad idea. They have the statistical data to show that r7-12 servers can not come close to matching the coverage and numbers of r4-6 let along the top ranked servers.

Bottom line is they just don’t give a f….

‘Devon: Wvw isn’t meant to be fair.’

Altie.4571:

@ point 3.

They have already stated that there will be a list of achievements to be done in order to qualify for a reward. So in that respect your server will see MORE people join WvW and participate because they will have to go and grab camps, take towers/keeps and defend stuff in order to receive the reward.

I can’t comment on the other points because everything is speculation at this point, we simply don’t know what will happen.

This won’t help at all. The higher ranked (and thus the winning) servers get better rewards — expect them to get players.

What we really need is a 1 week boycott. It doesn’t seem like anything will get through to Anet unless it’s numbers. If everyone on the forums complain, they’ll just say forum goers are a minority.

i have to laugh, yeah, they like it, cause it will bring more money to Anet
a lot of ppl is buying gems and its high chance, that more ppl will buy them to transfer to another server, of course
use your brains, they care about our oppinion, only in their sentenses, but its all about money

UrMom.4205:

My biggest gripe with the whole idea and wvw in general is the massive fail in the matchmaking system. For example the difference between the top 3 servers to the 4 server is a jump, the 4 to the 5-7ish is another large jump, then the 8-10 is another jump. Another example, CD got paired with FA for three weeks straight, the first two it was CD vs FA vs SOS and CD vs FA vs EB. In both those matchups FA completely destroyed all of us. In week three it was CD vs FA vs TC, in that matchup TC completely wrecked us AND FA. That right there really put in perspective just how far apart some of these servers are….so now they want to put us all in a league together? Hate to say this because I really love GW2 and WvW but this league thing is going to fail so incredibly hard..and i’m really really scared that it’s going to kill our server and possibly kill WvW. Why can’t the matchups be made off of the servers rank, I would much rather be paired with the same two servers each week instead of this unbalanced garbage.

As a FA player I have to say that the two weeks vs CD/SoS/EB were the most boring two weeks of WvW I’ve been a part of. I wouldn’t say we destroyed CD, as they do have a few good guilds, but not enough of them to go around. WvW basically became a karma train for FA those weeks, and I’m sure TC/JQ/BG feel the same as well at the moment.

Istaf.1953:

UrMom.4205:

My biggest gripe with the whole idea and wvw in general is the massive fail in the matchmaking system. For example the difference between the top 3 servers to the 4 server is a jump, the 4 to the 5-7ish is another large jump, then the 8-10 is another jump. Another example, CD got paired with FA for three weeks straight, the first two it was CD vs FA vs SOS and CD vs FA vs EB. In both those matchups FA completely destroyed all of us. In week three it was CD vs FA vs TC, in that matchup TC completely wrecked us AND FA. That right there really put in perspective just how far apart some of these servers are….so now they want to put us all in a league together? Hate to say this because I really love GW2 and WvW but this league thing is going to fail so incredibly hard..and i’m really really scared that it’s going to kill our server and possibly kill WvW. Why can’t the matchups be made off of the servers rank, I would much rather be paired with the same two servers each week instead of this unbalanced garbage.

As a FA player I have to say that the two weeks vs CD/SoS/EB were the most boring two weeks of WvW I’ve been a part of. I wouldn’t say we destroyed CD, as they do have a few good guilds, but not enough of them to go around. WvW basically became a karma train for FA those weeks, and I’m sure TC/JQ/BG feel the same as well at the moment.

By destroyed, I meant by the points, since leagues are going to be about points and all.

Chris.3290:

I have a proposal.

We will cease complaining about leagues: if, and only if, Devon Carver agrees to do a weekly video announcing the results.

We further stipulate that he must act and sound genuinely surprised when a higher ranked server beats a lower ranked one. He should also give a list of reasons why the matches the proceeding week are interesting and the outcome is in doubt.

I want him to go on record, explaining how Crystal Desert vs Fort Aspenwood vs Jade Quarry is a competitive match and how it is anyone’s game.

If he is willing to do this, aka do to himself what he’s doing to us (insulting intelligence); then we can admit that we are all in this together and will cease pestering them on these boards.

Everyone please +1 to give this visibility.

+1. Great idea. Unfortunately, the devs are so out of touch that they would probably believe everything they say!

Chris.3290:

I have a proposal.

We will cease complaining about leagues: if, and only if, Devon Carver agrees to do a weekly video announcing the results.

We further stipulate that he must act and sound genuinely surprised when a higher ranked server beats a lower ranked one. He should also give a list of reasons why the matches the proceeding week are interesting and the outcome is in doubt.

I want him to go on record, explaining how Crystal Desert vs Fort Aspenwood vs Jade Quarry is a competitive match and how it is anyone’s game.

If he is willing to do this, aka do to himself what he’s doing to us (insulting intelligence); then we can admit that we are all in this together and will cease pestering them on these boards.

Everyone please +1 to give this visibility.

+1 all the way

Chris.3290:

I have a proposal.

We will cease complaining about leagues: if, and only if, Devon Carver agrees to do a weekly video announcing the results.

We further stipulate that he must act and sound genuinely surprised when a higher ranked server beats a lower ranked one. He should also give a list of reasons why the matches the proceeding week are interesting and the outcome is in doubt.

I want him to go on record, explaining how Crystal Desert vs Fort Aspenwood vs Jade Quarry is a competitive match and how it is anyone’s game.

If he is willing to do this, aka do to himself what he’s doing to us (insulting intelligence); then we can admit that we are all in this together and will cease pestering them on these boards.

Everyone please +1 to give this visibility.

Lawl! +1000000

Chris.3290:

I have a proposal.

We will cease complaining about leagues: if, and only if, Devon Carver agrees to do a weekly video announcing the results.

We further stipulate that he must act and sound genuinely surprised when a higher ranked server beats a lower ranked one. He should also give a list of reasons why the matches the proceeding week are interesting and the outcome is in doubt.

I want him to go on record, explaining how Crystal Desert vs Fort Aspenwood vs Jade Quarry is a competitive match and how it is anyone’s game.

If he is willing to do this, aka do to himself what he’s doing to us (insulting intelligence); then we can admit that we are all in this together and will cease pestering them on these boards.

Everyone please +1 to give this visibility.

I like Devon and the work he has been doing. That said, this illustrates our concerns nicely.

titanlectro.5029:

I like Devon and the work he has been doing. That said, this illustrates our concerns nicely.

I’m picking on him unfairly, I know. However as the “ombudsman” for the WvW development team, he is the face of the decisions being made.

It’s an odd situation because I believe they still care. If they didn’t care, they wouldn’t have him answering on the forums.
So how to explain the decisions being made?

Well, I personally believe they are looking at overall server population and think if the incentives were high enough that would get more casuals into WvW and would even the playing field.

Of course, this also means they haven’t been exploring the matches enough to understand how much WvW guilds determine the flow of battle and that flooding the borderlands with PvE beserkers, is not going to equal victory for anyone.

My solution, well Devon should get the chance to explain why he thinks things like the leagues and the bloodlust mechanics do anything other than punish lower participation servers.
We don’t expect anything to make victory easier, but the constant emphasis on making WvW a painful experience for lower tier servers speaks to either a lot of naive thinking…or downright evil intentions.

Chris.3290:

I have a proposal.

We will cease complaining about leagues: if, and only if, Devon Carver agrees to do a weekly video announcing the results.

We further stipulate that he must act and sound genuinely surprised when a higher ranked server beats a lower ranked one. He should also give a list of reasons why the matches the proceeding week are interesting and the outcome is in doubt.

I want him to go on record, explaining how Crystal Desert vs Fort Aspenwood vs Jade Quarry is a competitive match and how it is anyone’s game.

If he is willing to do this, aka do to himself what he’s doing to us (insulting intelligence); then we can admit that we are all in this together and will cease pestering them on these boards.

Everyone please +1 to give this visibility.

+1
This week not being able to face SoR has been so boring. I took to AC dungeon for the first time in months last night out of boredom.

Chris.3290:

I have a proposal.

We will cease complaining about leagues: if, and only if, Devon Carver agrees to do a weekly video announcing the results.

We further stipulate that he must act and sound genuinely surprised when a higher ranked server beats a lower ranked one. He should also give a list of reasons why the matches the proceeding week are interesting and the outcome is in doubt.

I want him to go on record, explaining how Crystal Desert vs Fort Aspenwood vs Jade Quarry is a competitive match and how it is anyone’s game.

If he is willing to do this, aka do to himself what he’s doing to us (insulting intelligence); then we can admit that we are all in this together and will cease pestering them on these boards.

Everyone please +1 to give this visibility.

+1

Chris.3290:

titanlectro.5029:

I like Devon and the work he has been doing. That said, this illustrates our concerns nicely.

I’m picking on him unfairly, I know. However as the “ombudsman” for the WvW development team, he is the face of the decisions being made.

It’s an odd situation because I believe they still care. If they didn’t care, they wouldn’t have him answering on the forums.
So how to explain the decisions being made?

Well, I personally believe they are looking at overall server population and think if the incentives were high enough that would get more casuals into WvW and would even the playing field.

Of course, this also means they haven’t been exploring the matches enough to understand how much WvW guilds determine the flow of battle and that flooding the borderlands with PvE beserkers, is not going to equal victory for anyone.

My solution, well Devon should get the chance to explain why he thinks things like the leagues and the bloodlust mechanics do anything other than punish lower participation servers.
We don’t expect anything to make victory easier, but the constant emphasis on making WvW a painful experience for lower tier servers speaks to either a lot of naive thinking…or downright evil intentions.

(By the way, Great! post OP;)

Chris, i’m sorry to put this to you, Caring in not a word, it’s an Action.

Answering questions doesn’t not make him care or anyone care

So going back to Caring; where is it Arena.net?

I wouldn’t hold your breath. It seems like who we’ve been dealing with in this forum is a PR guy and not an actual dev.

Chris.3290:

titanlectro.5029:

I like Devon and the work he has been doing. That said, this illustrates our concerns nicely.

I’m picking on him unfairly, I know. However as the “ombudsman” for the WvW development team, he is the face of the decisions being made.

It’s an odd situation because I believe they still care. If they didn’t care, they wouldn’t have him answering on the forums.
So how to explain the decisions being made?

Well, I personally believe they are looking at overall server population and think if the incentives were high enough that would get more casuals into WvW and would even the playing field.

Of course, this also means they haven’t been exploring the matches enough to understand how much WvW guilds determine the flow of battle and that flooding the borderlands with PvE beserkers, is not going to equal victory for anyone.

My solution, well Devon should get the chance to explain why he thinks things like the leagues and the bloodlust mechanics do anything other than punish lower participation servers.
We don’t expect anything to make victory easier, but the constant emphasis on making WvW a painful experience for lower tier servers speaks to either a lot of naive thinking…or downright evil intentions.

This is pretty insightful and IMO likely the biggest reason these changes are being made now that I’ve thought about it. If the rewards are big enough to draw PVEers, it could be an interesting development.

But that being said, if after a year people who PVE don’t want to WvW, I doubt much will change with a few rewards when their PVE rewards are guaranteed, and WvW rewards are usually fleeting. And if it doesn’t draw people to WvW, then the Leagues will just result in 6 servers basically mopping up the other 18, getting big rewards for it, and repeating as long as the leagues stay constant.

gennyt.3428:

I wouldn’t hold your breath. It seems like who we’ve been dealing with in this forum is a PR guy and not an actual dev.

He took issue with that at some point in the past, implying that he does develop.

It actually explains things clearly, because developers are less likely to have the time to actually look over their work.

Like I said, I think they are going purely on server population and have a poor understanding what a difference even a slight change in WvW-focused population makes on a server’s overall performance.

NA T1 is chock full of WvW-focused players, and it goes down in degrees as you go down the ranks.

Chris.3290:

Like I said, I think they are going purely on server population and have a poor understanding what a difference even a slight change in WvW-focused population makes on a server’s overall performance.

NA T1 is chock full of WvW-focused players, and it goes down in degrees as you go down the ranks.

It would be extremely irresponsible of a development team to develop WvW solely with “WvW active” population in mind. It simply shouldn’t even be discussed as an option, because we can never know what a specific player might decide to do on a given day.

That being said, rather than negative posting that is going on constantly and the “help X because I want Y” we should be throwing out IDEAS. I truly do believe that they read ideas and will use them in some form if it is feasible.

So, lets get cracking with constructive ideas, I started in the reward players on Siege thread.

I personally think folks are getting too bent out of shape about the league, the effect in game to me should be minimal. Coverage issues makes me not care about PPT before, why would any of that change in regards to league? I plan to go out and kill people every night just like I always do, league doesn’t change that. We already have messed up matches, so league wont change that. The whole ‘we wont be doing anything till league is over’ is an obvious cop-out and excuse to do more living story kitten instead of fixing WvW, but realistically I cant think of the last patch I cared about anyways.

Do I think it is stupid that ANET is creating a ‘the server with the best coverage and most people’ award, yes of course. A huge waste of resources that could be better spent on areas of WvW that would help everyone. Does it show that ANET has profound lack of understanding about WvW in general, yes of course. Overall though, I didnt care about PPT before and nothing has changed to make me care now.

Altie.4571:

Chris.3290:

Like I said, I think they are going purely on server population and have a poor understanding what a difference even a slight change in WvW-focused population makes on a server’s overall performance.

NA T1 is chock full of WvW-focused players, and it goes down in degrees as you go down the ranks.

It would be extremely irresponsible of a development team to develop WvW solely with “WvW active” population in mind. It simply shouldn’t even be discussed as an option, because we can never know what a specific player might decide to do on a given day.

That being said, rather than negative posting that is going on constantly and the “help X because I want Y” we should be throwing out IDEAS. I truly do believe that they read ideas and will use them in some form if it is feasible.

So, lets get cracking with constructive ideas, I started in the reward players on Siege thread.

On the other hand, bad ideas need to be called out. Someone is sitting over there at ANet and is thinking this is a good idea.
So far the only benefit has been to ANet’s bottom line in terms of gem sales; so the thin-line of trust is bending severely at the moment.

I also think you need to develop with your customer-base in mind. Leagues may get more people involved at first, but it’s also going to create giant whipsaws in performance, with T4 and T8 just getting hammered on.

For instance, if Fort Aspenwood faces a match with JQ the first week; a few people will get on but most won’t enjoy the curbstomp.
Then the next week they get SBI and EB, every casual player will come out of the woodwork. Their PPT will go insanely high (the only limiter being queues) and it will create an artificial picture of participation on all three servers.

What it will do, is create more interest in WvW. What it will also do, is show a whole new group the rewards of massive bandwagoning. and we’ll see another mass migration in between and once again when the second season of leagues are announced.

UrMom.4205:

By destroyed, I meant by the points, since leagues are going to be about points and all.

When I say we didn’t destroy you I’m talking about the fights, really couldn’t give two kittens about PPT. Regardless my point is WvW wasn’t “fun” for anyone that month.

It’s funny. WvWvW has been the same for an entire year except for some new abilities. The same mechanics for the most part are the same. It got old after 3-4 months and TONS of players left the game completely. The forums here are riddled with people who don’t want any sort of change….. let’s face it… you won’t quit because of the following:

1. GW2 is hands down one of the best PVP/WvW games on the market right now. No other game offers this sort of combat/performance and balance.(sure it has its issues but every game does..)
2. It’s free.

You will not see massive xsfers to servers… do you want to know why? cus its expensive. You may see a one Xsfer by some guilds, but that won’t last. It’s just too much gold/gems.

The League will eventually get to the point the game is already at.. the top servers on top fighting one another and the rest followed suit.

You people need to deal with the change or quit. But we all know your not quitting.

Fastbucks.5073:

It’s funny. WvWvW has been the same for an entire year except for some new abilities. The same mechanics for the most part are the same. It got old after 3-4 months and TONS of players left the game completely. The forums here are riddled with people who don’t want any sort of change….. let’s face it… you won’t quit because of the following:

1. GW2 is hands down one of the best PVP/WvW games on the market right now. No other game offers this sort of combat/performance and balance.(sure it has its issues but every game does..)
2. It’s free.

You will not see massive xsfers to servers… do you want to know why? cus its expensive. You may see a one Xsfer by some guilds, but that won’t last. It’s just too much gold/gems.

The League will eventually get to the point the game is already at.. the top servers on top fighting one another and the rest followed suit.

You people need to deal with the change or quit. But we all know your not quitting.

Actually, that’s completely untrue. There have been massive changes in WvW since launch. Here are the main ones:

1) Removal of culling. Game-changer. WvW before and after were almost different games.

2) AC buff. Opening salvo in Anet’s self-induced Project Kill Your Own Game. Drastically lowered PvP competition in WvW and lead directly to the rise of GvG’s.

3) Randomized Matchup’s. Part II of Project Kill Your Own Game. Even further reduced competition. Began PPT’s descent into irrelevance. Cemented existence of GvG.

And in the near-future we have these changes coming:

4) WvW Leagues: Project Kill Your Own Game Part III. PPT will fade into obscurity and who you are actually fighting will cease to matter. WvW will become all about the GvG and open field fights.

5) Full Ascended Gear. Not necessarily Project Kill Your Own Game IV, as it may stabilize gear treadmill hampsters as the PvP population. But is a complete 180 on WvW as it was at launch. It is now full MMO gear grind PvP.

I’m not going to quit playing this game. I have stopped buying gems with real world money. If ArenaNet cannot figure out this move is anti-competitive, then I will use 2 of the 3 forms of protest available to me. 1) No more real money, 2) Post in the forums (I wonder how many achievement points I can get with this one).

For the curious, option 3 is leave the game, but we know that has 0 effect on ArenaNet.