Guild Wars 2

I only recently started playing WvW in general, but i noticed few things that bother me greatly after short time of playing.

Support Tagging:

Why do i get punished for Healing up the Zerg with Waterfields and Blastfinishers or buffing them ?
I wont get any loot but the people that go for the aoe dmg have loot raining all over them.

=> People that heal/buff should get the same tag on the enemy as the player they have healed/buffed

WvW Char change:

Why do i get punished if i want to change to a different char in order to help out the Zerg for example: switch to a char with commander title / switching to a class to execute a certain strategy ( Mesmer Portal / Ele Heal …. etc ).
What i get in return is usually a 2 hour queue.

=> You should be able to change your character while staying in WvW or at least be put up at the top of the queue.

WvW Account Rank:

Why do i get punished if i want class diversity ? I currently have 8 lvl 80 full exotic characters that i could use but its ineffective to switch and try them out in WvW.
WvW abilities need a horrible amount of rank ups in order to get them and you have to acquire them for every single character you have.
Playing the same class in WvW for the rest of my life isnt fun, but its what i have to do if i want all the extra abilites and maximize the value of my character in WvW.

=> WvW rank should be account-wide with individual World-Ability-points for each character.

Seperate WvW Traits / Equipslots:

Why do i get punished for using my Pve character in WvW although i need other abilities and traits as my Pve char that i use for dungeons ?
Everytime i want to do WvW i need to change my traits and my gear for obvious reasons. I dont mind acquiring my gear in Pve and i sure wouldnt mind acquiring some kind of token through pve or the gem store that would allow me to have a seperate set of gear and traits if i enter WvW.

=> Implement seperate WvW traits/equipslots

I didnt go through the whole forum but it would be nice if someone knew that the devs said something about those topics to let me know

otherwise discuss / criticize

Point 1: Yes. I’ve asked for this since the beta. It’s not going to happen. It’s all part of their “we aren’t a trinity game, we don’t want you healing your friends” idea

Point 2: Yes, and may happen eventually. We shall see.

Point 3: Yes. Unsure if it will change though. The ranks are a nice time sink/grind for WvW, which I’m sure was part of their idea doing it this way.

Point 4: Don’t care either way. It might happen, in just don’t care. I only play WvW so I don’t need it. I could see how a person who wants to maximize their skill in different areas might like it though. The rare times I do any pve, the content isn’t so hard that I need to change anything.

in the resent state of the game for wvw they said they were looking into how to help support roles with the lack of loot and other such problems

Can’t wait till they fix mesmers so they get more than 2 bags for a 50 v 50 fight.

Totally ruined that class, except for portals and veils. Only reason anybody plays mesmer which is really disheartening.

Frvwfr.4307:

Can’t wait till they fix mesmers so they get more than 2 bags for a 50 v 50 fight.

Totally ruined that class, except for portals and veils. Only reason anybody plays mesmer which is really disheartening.

Uhhh… staff #5, feedback, focus reflections… collect bags… I get plenty with just that alone.

Frvwfr.4307:

Can’t wait till they fix mesmers so they get more than 2 bags for a 50 v 50 fight.

Totally ruined that class, except for portals and veils. Only reason anybody plays mesmer which is really disheartening.

Here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NflQszaxqA0

Now go and get your loot ^^

On top of the topic, rez is support too. It gets laggy in zerg fights and sometimes you are stuck rez people and couldn’t get away. (just like stuck after building sieges and couldn’t move for few seconds) Sieges always target the downed ones first and 90% of my deaths come from rez people because of that.

It gets more and more often now people don’t help rez downed players and rather stand away watching ’cause they know they will probably get killed during rez. What can we do about this?

Support doesn’t mean ‘healing’. Even though Anet said they do not want ‘healers’, they did say they wanted damage, control, and support.

Right now, only damage is rewarded.

I hear ya on the support side of things, but you’ll also get more bags overall if you win the fight. Support helps wins fights, so there you go!

Yeah the zerker, dps, aoe nuts will get more loot, but you’re the clutch player makin’ stuff happen. You get the glory.

1. Support Tagging:
Wat? If you ele/guardian, you have best tagging options in game. Ele have TONS of aoe on staff, guardians can spam staff 1 all day every day.

2. Seperate WvW Traits / Equipslots
Change traits and equip is ~1 min of time and 3.5 silver. Dunno how it can be a problem.

Rednik.3809:

1. Support Tagging:
Wat? If you ele/guardian, you have best tagging options in game. Ele have TONS of aoe on staff, guardians can spam staff 1 all day every day.

2. Seperate WvW Traits / Equipslots
Change traits and equip is ~1 min of time and 3.5 silver. Dunno how it can be a problem.

Your kind of missing the point here, read more carefully
Of course you have good tagging options, noone denied that. But you dont tag enemies if you buff up or heal the zerg, you cant cast a meteor spell if you are busy healing/buffing up the zerg. If you run within a zerg that is just focused on damage without any buffs or strategy your zerg will be dead within seconds (Im on a higher tier server, i dont know how it works on servers that are not so focused on wvw).

“1 min of time and 3.5 silver” yeah of course thats not much if you do it ONCE …. if you have 8 different characters that you want to play with through the day it is really really annoying. Put yourself into that position and try to be understanding. Not every player has 1 character with 1 set of gear and 1 playstyle (traits and skills).

And i was kinda hoping for more feedback i cant be the only player that has these kinds of problems ?!

Gumby.1708:

Why do i get punished for Healing up the Zerg with Waterfields and Blastfinishers or buffing them ?
I wont get any loot but the people that go for the aoe dmg have loot raining all over them.

I agree that this is a problem.

Gumby.1708:

Why do i get punished if i want to change to a different char in order to help out the Zerg for example: switch to a char with commander title / switching to a class to execute a certain strategy ( Mesmer Portal / Ele Heal …. etc ).
What i get in return is usually a 2 hour queue.

There is a queue because lots of people want to play WvW. If you could stay in while changing characters it would make it even harder for other people to have a chance to play.

Gumby.1708:

Why do i get punished if i want class diversity ? I currently have 8 lvl 80 full exotic characters that i could use but its ineffective to switch and try them out in WvW.
WvW abilities need a horrible amount of rank ups in order to get them and you have to acquire them for every single character you have.

Yeah, but the rewards and abilities really aren’t a big deal (IMO)

Gumby.1708:

Seperate WvW Traits / Equipslots:

Why do i get punished for using my Pve character in WvW although i need other abilities and traits as my Pve char that i use for dungeons ?
Everytime i want to do WvW i need to change my traits and my gear for obvious reasons. I dont mind acquiring my gear in Pve and i sure wouldnt mind acquiring some kind of token through pve or the gem store that would allow me to have a seperate set of gear and traits if i enter WvW.

This would be nice.

Gumby.1708:

“1 min of time and 3.5 silver” yeah of course thats not much if you do it ONCE ….

It’s not even that!

1) You can’t change your trait allocation inside WvW. You have leave and requeue afterwards.
2) Even without reallocation of points, there is no way to save your trait and gear setup short of taking screen shots.

Interesting concept.. being able to switch through all your characters in WvW… I wonder how that’d go over?

More so, suppose we could switch them on the fly, similar to how fast Rangers can pet swap.. lol

Mattargul.9235:

2) Even without reallocation of points, there is no way to save your trait and gear setup short of taking screen shots.

That’s what I would really like to see, being able to save a build. Its so annoying to have to either commit all your different builds for all your different characters to memory, or screenshots, etc. Also it takes a bit of time to switch around all your gear and traits, and leaves the chance of mistakenly slotting an incorrect trait or piece of gear.

On the queues thing, I don’t think that’s much of an issue, as if you are playing on a server with a large queue, that was your decision. If anything there should be more incentives for people moving to lower pop servers, not fewer.

The “multiple traits/ equip slot” is useful even outside WvW. I use a different set of traits/skills/pets for Dungeons, Fractals, general PvE, WvW Roaming and WvW zerging. I even use different skills for different Dungeons (ie, I use a different mitigator depending on if there is a lot of condition damage, or more straight damage ).

Timelord.8190:

Frvwfr.4307:

Can’t wait till they fix mesmers so they get more than 2 bags for a 50 v 50 fight.

Totally ruined that class, except for portals and veils. Only reason anybody plays mesmer which is really disheartening.

Here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NflQszaxqA0

Now go and get your loot ^^

Yes, but this is the thing, you can EITHER go DPS, or help your team. There is no reward for helping your team, which is the entire point of this thread. Thank you for letting it fly completely over your head.. -.-’

The support roles, don’t get loot, which you very clearly pointed out.

Mattargul.9235:

1) You can’t change your trait allocation inside WvW. You have leave and requeue afterwards.

This is false.

Mattargul.9235:

2) Even without reallocation of points, there is no way to save your trait and gear setup short of taking screen shots.

Or you could, you know, remember your builds…

Support roles get tons of loot, no idea what this nonsense is about. The first player to hit 250,000 WvW kills played a STAFF GUARDIAN.

Friggin spam #1. Geez.

There’s some myth about high dps getting more loot. It’s not true. There are plenty of myths about droprates, humans like to see patterns in randomness, it’s how our brains are built, pattern recognition machines.

DPS means “damage per second”. Are you saying support roles cause NO damage? If you are ONLY using heal/boon skills you are playing wrong, and not fully supporting your team.

If you’re switching characters 8 times a day and switching their builds several times each, you are working unnecessarily hard. That is entirely your choice, but no one said you have to play this game 12 hours a day and that you must win every possible engagement.

Mattargul.9235:

Gumby.1708:

“1 min of time and 3.5 silver” yeah of course thats not much if you do it ONCE ….

It’s not even that!

1) You can’t change your trait allocation inside WvW. You have leave and requeue afterwards.
.

Wait… Wat. There is a vendor that sells the books at every spawn. Select the “reset traits” just like you were not in wvw.

Thrashbarg.9820:

Support roles get tons of loot, no idea what this nonsense is about. The first player to hit 250,000 WvW kills played a STAFF GUARDIAN.

Friggin spam #1. Geez.

There’s some myth about high dps getting more loot. It’s not true. There are plenty of myths about droprates, humans like to see patterns in randomness, it’s how our brains are built, pattern recognition machines.

DPS means “damage per second”. Are you saying support roles cause NO damage? If you are ONLY using heal/boon skills you are playing wrong, and not fully supporting your team.

If you’re switching characters 8 times a day and switching their builds several times each, you are working unnecessarily hard. That is entirely your choice, but no one said you have to play this game 12 hours a day and that you must win every possible engagement.

Yeah. I don’t know where it comes to you to think that a staff guardian is a support character. That is an AoE skill. If they are using that skill, then they are not using healing skills, thus not support.

You are totally missing the point. The roles that use healing/buff skills INSTEAD of these DPS builds, get no loot. Yes, we all know that every class →CAN<- get loot. It’s the fact of the matter that if they are going to go healing specced, to support the team then they will not be doing that, which puts down the support roles.

If you are hearing specced and you refuse to attack, pls go. You need to do like 200 damage to get loot.

Drop water, swap to fire, aoe. Switch to water and heal. Gratz, u just got 30 kills by being in fire for 8 seconds instead of standing there, doing nothing. Your damage skills don’t magically disappear because you have +healing gear on.

If you spec for healing, you can still do damage. Stop being lazy.

When I play staff on my ele, I probably get more bags than anyone else.
Are you sitting in water the entire time or something?

Tier 1 sounds horrible. I haven’t had to wait more than 30 mins to get into a map of choice, and never was locked out of all 4.

Account-wide ranks would be very nice. Especially if the accounts were 80. But it’s also nice to put oil mastery on just some random character you barely play just to mess around with it.

I’ve changed my spec. up to 4 times in a day, depending on the situation. It’s like 3s. I don’t see it being a problem. I just wish we could buy a trait-master npc to spawn at current location, like the bankers, and trading post. I do wish we could save specs and just click a button to swap between then, and auto-equip gear we use for them. Other MMOs have this feature. I hope it’s being considered already.

Thrashbarg.9820:

Support roles get tons of loot, no idea what this nonsense is about. … There’s some myth about high dps getting more loot. It’s not true. … DPS means “damage per second”. Are you saying support roles cause NO damage? If you are ONLY using heal/boon skills you are playing wrong, and not fully supporting your team.

Either im expressing myself really bad or you are just ignorant. Of course support roles can do damage and tag enemies, NOBODY said something different. But in the time you are buffing and healing you CANNOT tag enemy players to get loot. Theres a system called CAST TIME its literally time you spend casting. For Example explain to me while using this combo with my elementalist to heal up the zerg, how do i get to tag the enemy?

Switch attunement earth => Cast Erruption (for blast finisher) => Switch attunement water => Cast healing rain => Cast Geyser = > Cast Arcane Wave => Dodgeroll Heal

This is just ONE of many examples. After that combo im free to cast my other spells and tag enemies and wait for my support skills cooldown, but in that time other players that focused on damaging/tagging the other raid have killed some players and got more loot.

Despite that AoE spells of the ele need cast time and time to activate and have a cap that can hit only 5 players at once. While the fight goes on the enemy Zerg probably scatters much more and the same Aoe doesnt tag as many different players as if you fought from the start.

And DONT focus on ONE class “the guardian blah blah….” there are several other classes. If you feel the need to disapprove something i would like to see an example that works for everybody

Frvwfr.4307:

Timelord.8190:

Frvwfr.4307:

Can’t wait till they fix mesmers so they get more than 2 bags for a 50 v 50 fight.

Totally ruined that class, except for portals and veils. Only reason anybody plays mesmer which is really disheartening.

Here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NflQszaxqA0

Now go and get your loot ^^

Yes, but this is the thing, you can EITHER go DPS, or help your team. There is no reward for helping your team, which is the entire point of this thread. Thank you for letting it fly completely over your head.. -.-’

The support roles, don’t get loot, which you very clearly pointed out.

Yes, you will probably get less loot if u don’t deal as much DPS as a pure dmg dealer . But you will still get loot. You could find a guild or a group who cares about sharing might stacks. You can get up to 25 stacks of might. That’s 875 more power and 875 more condition dmg.

I also think you will get alot of loot just by spamming staff skill 1 on a guardian because it selects 5 people at random. That makes you able to tag more enemies. You will also attack with a higher frequency than an elementalist.

So i think you should get a guardian if you want to play support.
I’m lvling one myself atm and i got alot of loot just at lvl 12 it was even with a tanky build. My main char is an ele btw which i don’t play anymore cause of all those silly nerfs they have gotten. A gurdian is way better now after my opinion.

Gumby.1708:

Thrashbarg.9820:

Support roles get tons of loot, no idea what this nonsense is about. … There’s some myth about high dps getting more loot. It’s not true. … DPS means “damage per second”. Are you saying support roles cause NO damage? If you are ONLY using heal/boon skills you are playing wrong, and not fully supporting your team.

Either im expressing myself really bad or you are just ignorant. Of course support roles can do damage and tag enemies, NOBODY said something different. But in the time you are buffing and healing you CANNOT tag enemy players to get loot. Theres a system called CAST TIME its literally time you spend casting. For Example explain to me while using this combo with my elementalist to heal up the zerg, how do i get to tag the enemy?

Switch attunement earth => Cast Erruption (for blast finisher) => Switch attunement water => Cast healing rain => Cast Geyser = > Cast Arcane Wave => Dodgeroll Heal

This is just ONE of many examples. After that combo im free to cast my other spells and tag enemies and wait for my support skills cooldown, but in that time other players that focused on damaging/tagging the other raid have killed some players and got more loot.

Despite that AoE spells of the ele need cast time and time to activate and have a cap that can hit only 5 players at once. While the fight goes on the enemy Zerg probably scatters much more and the same Aoe doesnt tag as many different players as if you fought from the start.

And DONT focus on ONE class “the guardian blah blah….” there are several other classes. If you feel the need to disapprove something i would like to see an example that works for everybody

Yeah, I’m probably just ignorant. Especially about elementalists, I only have about 1700 hours on mine and only about 2/3rds of that in WvW. Personal insults are generally a good way to present an argument.

A better healing rotation is water>geyser OR healing rain>start dodge>swap earth>arcane wave. That will give you the same heal as your rotation and leave eruption off CD for damage (use 4 or 5 first to land it).

A cool trick is to drop your healing on downed enemies and let the team’s blast finishers finish enemies. Tagging and healing all in one, give it a try.

The other thing that doesn’t make sense to me is why you’re healing if you haven’t already tagged everything. Do you generally enter combat by spamming heals? What attunement are you in before you start your healing rotation, perhaps fire or air? Total cast time on your healing rotation should be around 4 seconds, if your team wipes everyone in that time consider farming in Orr or something, that means you vastly outnumber your opponents, and there’s better loot in PvE…..

katniss.6735:

Tier 1 sounds horrible. I haven’t had to wait more than 30 mins to get into a map of choice, and never was locked out of all 4.

Meh… Other than reset night, the longest queues I’ve ever had were about that long, and there’s almost always at least 1 BL I can go help out in until my queue pops for the one I want to be on.

Reset night is about the only time anyone should complain about queues.

I don’t get why you are treating this as a punishment though. Getting rewards such as loot bags, is a … reward. Those that do not get these rewards is anything but punished.

But I agree that the current accolade mechanism is more rewarding to the offensive part of the battle, while those that help in the defensive are rather neglected. (Actually there are other parts of battle that are neglected too)

From what I can see from my team, you need to make use of the tagging mechanism further. Why healing, you should be able to attack too. Sounds troublesome, but that’s what you can do at the moment. Plus, knowing your team has won the battle due to your support, by itself is also a reward.

Gumby.1708:

Rednik.3809:

1. Support Tagging:
Wat? If you ele/guardian, you have best tagging options in game. Ele have TONS of aoe on staff, guardians can spam staff 1 all day every day.

2. Seperate WvW Traits / Equipslots
Change traits and equip is ~1 min of time and 3.5 silver. Dunno how it can be a problem.

Your kind of missing the point here, read more carefully
Of course you have good tagging options, noone denied that. But you dont tag enemies if you buff up or heal the zerg, you cant cast a meteor spell if you are busy healing/buffing up the zerg. If you run within a zerg that is just focused on damage without any buffs or strategy your zerg will be dead within seconds (Im on a higher tier server, i dont know how it works on servers that are not so focused on wvw).

“1 min of time and 3.5 silver” yeah of course thats not much if you do it ONCE …. if you have 8 different characters that you want to play with through the day it is really really annoying. Put yourself into that position and try to be understanding. Not every player has 1 character with 1 set of gear and 1 playstyle (traits and skills).

And i was kinda hoping for more feedback i cant be the only player that has these kinds of problems ?!

If you want that loot your gonna drop aoes in between healing/buffing…..Your not gonna spend every second of combat healing/buffing you simply can’t do it effectively, so you should be dropping aoes in the meantime or in the case of the guardian spamming that awesome tagging tool, Staff #1. I don’t care if your on Tier 1 or Tier 8, that’s just the way it is in gw2, there is no holy trinity(Healer/Tank/DPS roles). If your a Staff ele sitting in Water Attune the whole time trying to heal the zerg, than your doing it wrong. I play 4 different 80s depending on the situation, and yeah it kinda sucks in a lot of ways, but they aren’t gonna make a bunch of changes to make a few people happy(those of us that play more than 1-2 alts).

P.S. If your really in T1 than you probably can’t do anything more than spam #1 99% of the time anyways, lol.

1. Ermm……no comment
2. True, is depressing to re-queue when you already in there.
3. True, still wondering why it is not designed like sPvP rankings system
4. Great to have, this will literally force all pve focus players to seriously think of gears to equip for wvw instead of bringing pve build into wvw. Effectively changing the battles in wvw

Different builds

+1

If they’re not doing this they’re undermining the credibility of WvW as a serious game mode of GW2 rather than a mini-game. You simply cannot efficiently run with the same build in WvW as you do in PVE, or vice versa.