Guild Wars 2

I dont even understand why anet keep on buffing condition builds.

Condi is already facerolling with zero risk high reward braindead game plays

Should be nerfed but every kittening patch they just keep on buffing

Seems like anet doesnt even realize condi is 1 of reason that people continue to leave this game.

I seriously want to know why anet keep on supporting to play more and more braindead condi builds.

It’s just a side effect of WvW not factoring much in balance decisions. Condi isn’t as strong in PvP because the gearsets that make it the most onerous have been banned. Also, classes like condi mesmer are terrible at capping points. Meanwhile, it’s been all but forced as the endgame PvE spec and Anet seems to want to drive that point home.

There is a risk to condi’s it’s called resistance, which is a heavy handed answer to the condi spewing crapshoot that is called HoT. Thing is that means revenants are the new guardians in that they dominate the game mode for organized play. They could expand on that or increase access to condition clears that would likely have negligible effects on PVE play, but that’d take far too much work apparently.

In the end WvW players have to accept that what they get is what they get, and any dream of anything more is simply a delusion that will lead to frustration and anger. So it’s best to play when it’s fun and walk away when it’s not.

Anet doesn’t balance skills for WvW. Their primary focus is PvE and sPVP. When changes are made to WvW it’s almost always with sPVP in mind and very little if any thought as to how it will affect large group combat in WvW. If it’s not that then it’s troll build that aren’t allowed in sPVP, but are are left to reign in WvW. Etc. Etc.

TL;DR Anet doesn’t care about WvW balance.

Sometimes i have this feeling anet does read our complaints, and do exactly the opposite of what we suggest. “Condis too strong nerf; Ok lets buff them.”

I assume because players mainly still roll power builds so statistics don’t look so great for condi builds thus they get buffed and power nerfed with assumption that if condi builds are OP everyone will roll them (even tho neither of those changes may be needed on first place, condi builds have their cheesy aspect and they are not exactly fun for everyone (i personally probably would quit the game all together if only viable build for thief was condi) but i don’t think anyone at dev team actually takes it into account).

Offair.2563:

Sometimes i have this feeling anet does read our complaints, and do exactly the opposite of what we suggest. “Condis too strong nerf; Ok lets buff them.”

What do you mean “sometimes”?

Its pretty much exactly what happens. They still havent backed down from the 100% damage buff on AC but no one still complains about that huh…

Cynz.9437:

I assume because players mainly still roll power builds so statistics don’t look so great for condi builds thus they get buffed and power nerfed with assumption that if condi builds are OP everyone will roll them

[…]

i personally probably would quit the game all together if only viable build for thief was condi

Same here. The day I am forced to run a condi reaper / thief (my two mains) I quit the game. The whole condi playstyle is just braindead, cheesy and boring – no matter if it is balanced or broken.

I really hope what you described (more power build users = condi must be subpar) is not ANets logic behind balancing decisions.

LordEnki.9283:

TL;DR Anet doesn’t care about WvW balance.

I think they care. They just don’t do anything about it so wvw players get hosed for the sake of PVE and their failed pvp system.

The answer is that PvP and PvE are much much much higher priorities; so far above that WvW isn’t even considered when it comes to skill balance unless there’s enough qq on the official forums (aka Reddit) to get some action — see epidemic change most recently. Unfortunately, for the foreseable future WvW will feel the brunt of PvE’s (specifically raids) condi creep combined with absolutely borked stat combinations multiplied up by large numbers and competitive players iterating to find the most effective (read: broken) combinations. In PvP the devs can keep the ‘broken’ part in check with several dials to adjust (amulets, sigils, runes, etc) – in WvW all those dials, as well as devs that care enough to use them if they were in place, are missing.

The second issue is that it feels like a lot, if not all, of the QA/QC has been dropped when it comes to WvW. I recall Jessica Boettiger discussing her roll on with QA and her stating that one of the things they asked/tested for WvW was ‘What if 50 people use this skill?’. However, that was some time ago and since then we’ve had a significant amount of broken and/or oppressive mechanics show up in WvW. Bugged golems (stats bug, asura racial skill golems dmg, duplicating) for golem week, boon share, rev’kittenting through obstacles, stability stacks without icd on strip, life stealing on gates, etc etc the list goes on and on.

Long story short: WvW needs devs who are interested in the content and in touch with the players (i.e. a Grouch), and have enough stroke at Anet to suggest and follow through on changes.

The true answer is people complained.

People complained that the only viable build is berserker.

The fastest and only viable way to kill the harpies/boar/centaur/guards was berserker. There were no build diversity and stack → LoS → spam attack is all you need in WvW.

It was such dark times when there were no build diversity in WvW.

So they buffed condi and fixed WvW

KrHome.1920:

Cynz.9437:

I assume because players mainly still roll power builds so statistics don’t look so great for condi builds thus they get buffed and power nerfed with assumption that if condi builds are OP everyone will roll them

[…]

i personally probably would quit the game all together if only viable build for thief was condi

Same here. The day I am forced to run a condi reaper / thief (my two mains) I quit the game. The whole condi playstyle is just braindead, cheesy and boring – no matter if it is balanced or broken.

I really hope what you described (more power build users = condi must be subpar) is not ANets logic behind balancing decisions.

Power reaper is like 10 times more braindead than condi reaper. At least condi reaper need to land perfect epidemic if he wanna contribute.

It is because people complained about zerker meta so now they gonna switch to condi meta then we gonna have people complain about condi meta. Anet doesn’t know how to balance the two, when anet says they have certain approach or formula for balancing, I don’t believe it at all. It is really just trial and error, hit or miss approach.

Btw, for the above post, do not forget they nerfed condi necro few times before during non-hot days.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Forcing-condition-meta/page/3

Please go support!

I made that post on general discussion if you guys can support it would be nice

Anet are PvE players, that’s why.

Zerker has been nerfed 3 years ago, true, that because of the people complaining that nothing else was ‘viable’/asked for in PvE, yes. I think the idea was to make bunker more viable but in fact the opposite happened, everybody went zerker – was a great meta, though. And since condi hasn’t been adjusted likewise, condi became op even back then. With the trait merge patch 2 years ago condi got a bigger role in PvE and a lot of stuff went wrong (damage, duration, application, traits, armor, runes, removal and so on) and has yet to be fixed. Whatever I guess.

Jerus.4350:

So it’s best to play when it’s fun and walk away when it’s not.

But it’s not the best for the game in driving away players, even if they’re just lowly wvw players.

But yeah it’s not going to change, because that would then peeve off the pve condition players, so either live with it or walk away.

Cos when AN devs play, they play with the zerg, the zerg is condi cancer, so when these devs think about improving WvW on those rare occasions they do look at WvW, they improve it by improving the condi cancer.

Hence the term cancer.

Condi is being buffed because after years of not caring what was best for PvE, they now care. Mathematically, it’s FAR FAR FAR FAR easier to adjust and tune conditions to get the exact DPS you want compared to Power.

Its underbudgeted/staffed or inexperienced devs taking the easiest possible path to giving attention to the game’s most popular mode (PvE)

GW2 will go down as one of the best MMOPVP combat systems that its creators slowly dwindled to irrelevance.

Pinko.2076:

GW2 will go down as one of the best MMOPVP combat systems that its creators slowly dwindled to irrelevance.

Yeahhhhh no. As much as I love and enjoy gw2, Gw1 had a far superior combat system (though they did overdo the amount of skills you could use thus making it a balance nightmare).

Complaining about condition damage is pretty ridiculous in my opinion. The application of conditions is through skills, same as power builds.

Just play with viper and compared it to play with berserker. You will see condition application is no easier than doing power damage.

Exciton.8942:

Complaining about condition damage is pretty ridiculous in my opinion. The application of conditions is through skills, same as power builds.

Just play with viper and compared it to play with berserker. You will see condition application is no easier than doing power damage.

The problem lays with Dire and Trailblazers. Condi builds can become super tanky whilst only doing slightly less condition damage (due to less on crit conditions). The same level of damage cannot be attained with the equivalent power stats (soldiers and wanderers). If they removed or revamped these stats, I guarantee condition qq would drop dramatically.

What leaves me almost speechless is Anet is forcing a condi mechanic towards PVE by sacrificing the pvp modes….

Why forcing something that dont work on the game, or u dont know how to manage/balance for the 3 gamemodes…

IF Anet reallly knew what they were doing they didnt even need to separate 1 skill for pve and other for pvp…. even rewards are a mess in this game, the more u know how the game works the more deep the mess looks like.

cos anet never try it , ur health is full , in 2 sec watch the condi hurt u , from 20+k health going to down , bleeding 6k 1s , bruning 4k 1s , nerco skill Epidemic nerf before more powerful , 1s can let 5ppl down even full health , Anet wanna kill power build players let them change to play condi …… anet have nerf for pvp , why they dont have nerf for wvw ?

like Game Update Notes – May 16, 2017

Endure Pain: >>>> In PvP only <<<<, the cooldown of this skill has been decreased from 60 seconds to 30 seconds, and the active up-time has been decreased from 4 seconds to 2 seconds.

from Seaweed Salad food happen be know they dont know anything in wvw

fix this condi can add the boons like protection -33% damage or let protection boon work on condi

Imo its because ppl complained about the power creep post HoT so anet reduced some DPS and increased some Condi…kinda like a “Be careful what you wish for” scenario.

tobee.1567:

fix this condi can add the boons like protection -33% damage or let protection boon work on condi

So uh… you want a really kittenty version of the -100% condi damage boon we already have?

Play as a berserker warrior using stance and signet. You’ll never worry about conditions again.

Keefe.3821:

Play as a berserker warrior using stance and signet. You’ll never worry about conditions again.

eh warrior is alright, but it’s very easy to play around if the warrior can’t seal the fight quickly.

Dodge/immune/invuln for Berserk Rage duration, then load him up and corrupt the heal resistance. Condi revs are becoming a more common thing in WvW after their necro-like buff, so that’s more common specs running around ready to convert your signet resistance. In fact, condi revs in groups fights can afford to just corrupt 2-3 berserker rage pulses in a row and kill you straight up with team support. IMO the signet is quite trash in a lot of situations in WvW. I use defiant Stance way more now.

Anet people are leaving the game,you are killing your game I have at least 10 friend that have left because of this condi ,kitten.give rev more condi clear!Or make rest work longer or something like adding light field to glent stuff.Something because at this poient most people have lost fath in anet and are leaving and that meens your losing money.

It has nothing to do with wvw why condis keeps getting buffed its because of raids. Nothing in GW2 atm is because of wvw its all about raids i think even open world pve has taken a back seat to raids.

Jski.6180:

It has nothing to do with wvw why condis keeps getting buffed its because of raids. Nothing in GW2 atm is because of wvw its all about raids i think even open world pve has taken a back seat to raids.

This.

Organized PvE now trumps all design and implementation decisions for balance in the game.

It’s a kitten ed shame, and a massive, massive failure on behalf of ANet, but it’s the truth.

The balance is completely out of control and anet is letting it go. It is a shame.

Playing Guardian atm is mostly clearing condi’s off yourself and allies to avoid instantly blowing up. It’s just not fun anymore.

Hey at least we know what’s going to happen here, esports anyone?
They keep trying the raid thing until they realize they just sacrificed the rest of the game for a 10% of the playerbase.

But hey we already experience this, don’t we?

ThunderPanda.1872:

The true answer is people complained.

People complained that the only viable build is berserker.

The fastest and only viable way to kill the harpies/boar/centaur/guards was berserker. There were no build diversity and stack -> LoS -> spam attack is all you need in WvW.

It was such dark times when there were no build diversity in WvW.

So they buffed condi and fixed WvW

Berserker was a little much back then. However, that’s anets problem and needs to provide a service and updates for a product their customers bought and still support. It seems they just don’t care anymore and forgot that we all purchased the game, xpac, and bought gems at times.

I guess we don’t have to care as well so let their quarterly reports continue to decline and do not buy the next xpac. Keep up the esports and raid dream, it’s really making a huge profit -_-

Because it’s easier to change skills than change AI/encounters that would require more build “variety.”

That isn’t to say there still aren’t about 50% useless skills out there… spirit weapons, racial skills, a bunch of signets still, and even falling traits.

If we’re just speaking in terms of PvE balance that is.

Chinchilla.1785:

Because it’s easier to change skills than change AI/encounters that would require more build “variety.”

That isn’t to say there still aren’t about 50% useless skills out there… spirit weapons, racial skills, a bunch of signets still, and even falling traits.

If we’re just speaking in terms of PvE balance that is.

Racial skills should never be useful though. Not in a competitive level anyway.

Lahmia.2193:

Chinchilla.1785:

Because it’s easier to change skills than change AI/encounters that would require more build “variety.”

That isn’t to say there still aren’t about 50% useless skills out there… spirit weapons, racial skills, a bunch of signets still, and even falling traits.

If we’re just speaking in terms of PvE balance that is.

Racial skills should never be useful though. Not in a competitive level anyway.

That would be ideal, but I did say in terms of PvE balance…and sadly WvW uses PvE balance. You won’t find racial skills in Spvp for many good reasons.

anduriell.6280:

Hey at least we know what’s going to happen here, esports anyone?
They keep trying the raid thing until they realize they just sacrificed the rest of the game for a 10% of the playerbase.

But hey we already experience this, don’t we?

This, so much this. I absolutely can’t wait for the day their stupidity blows up in their face again and they finally realize that WvW should be their focus for balance, like players have been saying for years.

Tried esports with spvp, failed horribly, drove tons of players away from the game. Doing the same thing with raids now. Making the rest of the game unfun for everyone to appease a small portion of the population. Its gonna fail too, then maybe they’ll finally pull their heads out their rears and realize the potential that wvw had at one point. But who knows how many players will still be left by the time they realize their mistake this time.

Because if everyone ran power builds wvw would be gankers paradise and drive everyone average or worse away from the mode.

They don’t play WvW. If they do play WvW then they’re bad at their own game and are balancing with that in mind. Either that or they think catering to braindead EZ mode morons makes the most business sense and, sadly, it probably does.

most of condi stats are made so you need to buy the hot expansion to craft them, pay to win confirmed

Justine.6351:

Because if everyone ran power builds wvw would be gankers paradise and drive everyone average or worse away from the mode.

You mean like how everyone plays condi now and it has driven most players from the game mode because its no longer fun? Because thats so much better. I’d rather remove condi entirely from wvw and drive away all the bads who can’t handle being ganked than have to deal with all the mouthbreathers who think they’re actually good, but are carried by dire and trailblazer who just facetank every single attack and only dodge randomly and deal more damage than someone in zerk gear.

Fighting someone who plays condi is like fighting an AI mob. they just stand there like sponges soaking up attacks and not reacting to what you do, because dire gear allows for that, while still dealing insane damage. If i wanted that kind of “engaging” gameplay, I’d just play pve. It may be fun for the people playing it because they get to feel like super powerful gods with no weaknesses, but it isnt the least bit fun for the person fighting against it. Combat should be fun for BOTH people involved, and the way condi is now, it isnt fun to be on the recieving end of it.

Chinchilla.1785:

Because it’s easier to change skills than change AI/encounters that would require more build “variety.”

That isn’t to say there still aren’t about 50% useless skills out there… spirit weapons, racial skills, a bunch of signets still, and even falling traits.

If we’re just speaking in terms of PvE balance that is.

The falling traits aren’t useless, they’re great for doing exactly what they’re intended to do (allow you to survive higher falls) and I for one used to use them all the time. It’s just that gliding kind of ate their lunch on the whole “protect you from falling” thing, and a lot of them are in inconvenient trait lines anyway.

Hyper Cutter.9376:

Chinchilla.1785:

Because it’s easier to change skills than change AI/encounters that would require more build “variety.”

That isn’t to say there still aren’t about 50% useless skills out there… spirit weapons, racial skills, a bunch of signets still, and even falling traits.

If we’re just speaking in terms of PvE balance that is.

The falling traits aren’t useless, they’re great for doing exactly what they’re intended to do (allow you to survive higher falls) and I for one used to use them all the time. It’s just that gliding kind of ate their lunch on the whole “protect you from falling” thing, and a lot of them are in inconvenient trait lines anyway.

No offense in intended but you basically proved why someone might consider on fall traits “useless.” I’m not saying they don’t work to reduce falling damage…but considering how black and white falling can be in WvW their use is limited. You either die to the height (DBL) or the map is safely flat (The other maps). Not to mention it’s harder to make use of whatever impact ability it produces. The best one is warriors’ imo, since they can at least spam it on gate rams to some success.

For purely PvE well, they’re probably even more useless just as you said!

• Gliding invalidated their necessity in PvE (which is why I noted “speaking in terms of PvE”)
• The sacrifice for the trait is too much for players to consider over other trait lines for the already super niche uses.

Yay accretion balancing? Or just make the trait on landing (without needing falling damage). That’d be the easy fix since the current balance likes “easy” fixes.