Guild Wars 2

I am pretty sure it is designed that there are always equal ammounts. When there is a que to join a battlefield then there is always a balanced ammount of people in the battlefield. If there is no que then either one of the teams is lacking in players or they all are.

Rraarrww.3894:

People need to stop whining or quit playing. If W3 had balanced numbers in every tier the same people whining here would whine about something else. They’d whine that they need to limit the number of Guardians because they’re getting owned. They’d whine about Mez’s ability to port because it’s “unfair others can’t do it”. They’d whine that War’s hit hard and wear chainmail “why can’t we hit that hard”. They’d whine that Ele’s have a lot of AOE or they can switch to 4 different schools of magic.

Point is they’d find something to whine about and the OP seems like such a person. Stop the whining already, not everyone is going to agree with you or think that YOUR solution is the “right” solution. When a game does something I don’t like guess what I do……that’s right I stop playing. Why waste my time if I’m not having fun playing a game designed to have fun playing.

All the whining is the forums is just out of hand now. Games been out a month yet people expect INSTANT results. Do you realize how long the game has been in development? Things don’t happen overnight whiners.

you have no idea what your talking about

with your logic a spell that hits for 99999999 should be left in the game

this is not just about balanceing the server in alot of servers this rule would never come into effect its more about the lower population servers and off peek time players

a prime time player on 1 of the high ranked servers will never notice it

People who dismiss the idea outright just aren’t thinking it through. We still have free transfers, use them if needed. This would even out the population considerably, there would only be queue for people who “want” queues for the sake of winning, just as there is now. Agreed of course that they essentially need “guild transfers” atm.

The only downside is the unofficial oceanic server would get utterly screwed. They would have to completely disband. I’m honestly not sure if this is necessarily a bad thing at this point, though, as staying all in one server is only making their matches boring for themselves. I know for darned certain if I was australian I wouldn’t be on that server.

iiMulch.2138:

I am pretty sure it is designed that there are always equal ammounts. When there is a que to join a battlefield then there is always a balanced ammount of people in the battlefield. If there is no que then either one of the teams is lacking in players or they all are.

That isn’t true. It just means YOUR server has hit its max number of players allowed. The other server can have 20 people and yours can have 200.

Daish.6139:

Rraarrww.3894:

People need to stop whining or quit playing. If W3 had balanced numbers in every tier the same people whining here would whine about something else. They’d whine that they need to limit the number of Guardians because they’re getting owned. They’d whine about Mez’s ability to port because it’s “unfair others can’t do it”. They’d whine that War’s hit hard and wear chainmail “why can’t we hit that hard”. They’d whine that Ele’s have a lot of AOE or they can switch to 4 different schools of magic.

Point is they’d find something to whine about and the OP seems like such a person. Stop the whining already, not everyone is going to agree with you or think that YOUR solution is the “right” solution. When a game does something I don’t like guess what I do……that’s right I stop playing. Why waste my time if I’m not having fun playing a game designed to have fun playing.

All the whining is the forums is just out of hand now. Games been out a month yet people expect INSTANT results. Do you realize how long the game has been in development? Things don’t happen overnight whiners.

you have no idea what your talking about

with your logic a spell that hits for 99999999 should be left in the game

this is not just about balanceing the server in alot of servers this rule would never come into effect its more about the lower population servers and off peek time players

a prime time player on 1 of the high ranked servers will never notice it

Please you’re just whining like any other MMO whiner. You’d find something else to whine about if this wasn’t the issue. Like I said if this issue were fixed (going by your logic) AND you still weren’t winning you’d whine about something else. It’s in your nature to whine and so far you haven’t proved me wrong.

Whiners are going to whine

Trolls will troll, people who take advantage of a system until it is fixed will always exist and they will always use the same arguments ‘quit crying, lr2play, umadbro’ Just ignore them and move on. Tho i do think transfers at this point need to stop, who honestly needs to transfer that much to play with friends? what are they all server hopping all the time? lol

yeah your right Eihder

for the last 2 weeks my sever has gone out of its way to try work with the other weaker server to take out the stronger 1

it has made WvW much more enjoyable even tho we are still out numbered 3 to 1

Daish.6139:

yeah your right Eihder

for the last 2 weeks my sever has gone out of its way to try work with the other weaker server to take out the stronger 1

it has made WvW much more enjoyable even tho we are still out numbered 3 to 1

And did you require ANet to implement some form of artificial limits to achieve this? No.

Tzash.5748:

Daish.6139:

yeah your right Eihder

for the last 2 weeks my sever has gone out of its way to try work with the other weaker server to take out the stronger 1

it has made WvW much more enjoyable even tho we are still out numbered 3 to 1

And did you require ANet to implement some form of artificial limits to achieve this? No.

it took alot of effort and was draining to fight 3:1

we cant keep it up more and more people quit and are

“screw this im just going to wait for next week”
or
“lets attack red because blue is to strong this is stupid”

Fair weather players will never be happy unless they are winning. When they aren’t winning there is always some excuse to not compete. Its just the way things are. ANet could implement a ton of things in an attempt to try and keep these players happy and none of them will work.

At the end of the day there can only be one winner per match and if some people can’t handle losing then that is on them.

yeah alot of players are like that Tzash

but there are also alot of players who like a challenge and are willing to stay in the game and fight as long as there is some kind of chance and its not just bending over and being kitten in the kitten /p>

There is always a chance. There is only no chance when everyone gives up. You don’t need external motivations to fight. If you do, that’s a sad state of affairs.

mcl.9240:

There is always a chance. There is only no chance when everyone gives up. You don’t need external motivations to fight. If you do, that’s a sad state of affairs.

your talking out of your butt

when its 100vs20vs10 you dont have a chance

when its 35vs10vs15 you have a chance

there needs to be limits its 1v1v1 not 1v1

there needs to be a cap on the ammount of players based on how many are on the other teams

the server that knows they are weaker if they have smart commanders will focus on the stronger server and avoid the weaker server when possible

if players/guilds are really into WvW there is nothing stoping them from transfering their home server to play in a lower population server

Daish.6139:

mcl.9240:

There is always a chance. There is only no chance when everyone gives up. You don’t need external motivations to fight. If you do, that’s a sad state of affairs.

your talking out of your butt

when its 100vs20vs10 you dont have a chance

when its 35vs10vs15 you have a chance

there needs to be limits its 1v1v1 not 1v1

there needs to be a cap on the ammount of players based on how many are on the other teams

the server that knows they are weaker if they have smart commanders will focus on the stronger server and avoid the weaker server when possible

if players/guilds are really into WvW there is nothing stoping them from transfering their home server to play in a lower population server

There do not need to be limits. There need to be servers full of people who aren’t quitters; who refuse to give up when they start falling behind.

You do not fix psychological shortcomings with game mechanics.

If it’s that imbalanced, it didn’t start that way. It wound up that way because the people on the losing teams are quitters, plain and simple. They don’t want to lose, they don’t like to lose. Their solution to losing is to quit. They fail to realize that if they don’t want to lose, they should fight to win.

1) Fix the “culling”
2) Remove the caps, get rid of the queues
3) Make matching permanent, no resets.
4) Remove the scoring
5) Make each claimable location provide a small buff (cumulative) for the server that holds it (server wide, not just PvP).
6) Add a PvE zone gated by held territory in PvP (ala Darkness Falls)
7) Make Orbs of Power grant a 10% damage buff (per orb held) to the server that holds it (also server wide, PvP and PvE).
8) Remove the AoE target limit.
9) Add more/better tools for coordination/communication.
10) Remove free server transfers.

What really hurts is when there should be an overmatched buff and there isn’t. The lack of a buff means players are going to stay out of WvW or they go to a server that has a high population and live with the queue.

A long queue is better than going to a map with no queue and very few players…unless you are a masochist and like to die, over and over.

mcl.9240:

Daish.6139:

mcl.9240:

There is always a chance. There is only no chance when everyone gives up. You don’t need external motivations to fight. If you do, that’s a sad state of affairs.

your talking out of your butt

when its 100vs20vs10 you dont have a chance

when its 35vs10vs15 you have a chance

there needs to be limits its 1v1v1 not 1v1

there needs to be a cap on the ammount of players based on how many are on the other teams

the server that knows they are weaker if they have smart commanders will focus on the stronger server and avoid the weaker server when possible

if players/guilds are really into WvW there is nothing stoping them from transfering their home server to play in a lower population server

There do not need to be limits. There need to be servers full of people who aren’t quitters; who refuse to give up when they start falling behind.

You do not fix psychological shortcomings with game mechanics.

If it’s that imbalanced, it didn’t start that way. It wound up that way because the people on the losing teams are quitters, plain and simple. They don’t want to lose, they don’t like to lose. Their solution to losing is to quit. They fail to realize that if they don’t want to lose, they should fight to win.

you dont know what your talking about

there is a large population that are willing to play as long as they have a chance

these are the players your loseing

the other type of players that leave when they are loseing are not important

I love being grossly outnumbered. It makes every success my team achieves feel like a real victory. I understand that this can get old quick for servers where there is a chronic population deficit, but I don’t feel that this is a reason to create longer wait times for other people. Punishing players is never the right answer.

Winterwolf.3782:

I love being grossly outnumbered. It makes every success my team achieves feel like a real victory. I understand that this can get old quick for servers where there is a chronic population deficit, but I don’t feel that this is a reason to create longer wait times for other people. Punishing players is never the right answer.

its still going to alow them to have basicly doubble your numbers

its not punishing them at all its going to make WvW more enjoyable

if you own 100% of the map and have nothing to do you may as well be in a queue

Daish.6139:

you dont know what your talking about

there is a large population that are willing to play as long as they have a chance

these are the players your loseing

the other type of players that leave when they are loseing are not important

Actually, I know precisely what I’m talking about. You’re so myopic in pushing your particular agenda you’re just blind to what anyone who doesn’t happen to agree with you is saying.

When a server loses by 200,000 points, they didn’t start the match down by 200,000 points. They started at an even score. They may have slowly slipped down by 10,000 or 20,000 after a day or two.

And that’s when the players on that server quit queuing. And because they quit queuing, they drop back even further.

“Why are we losing?”
“We don’t have enough players!”
“Why don’t we have enough players?”
“Because we’re losing!”

You see, when people quit queuing for WvWvW at the first sign that their server is falling behind, it guarantees the server’s going to lose, because the server is full of a bunch of quitters.

Quitters will not win. They cannot win. And honestly, they don’t deserve to win.

If you want to win WvWvW, figure out a way to motivate the player base to queue. That’s something that the server population is responsible for, not ArenaNet. It’s not ArenaNet’s fault that you’re on a server full of people who feel so entitled, so spoiled, that they need to be externally motivated just to participate when they’re down by a few tens of thousands of points. And it’s not their responsibility.

Want to win? Stay in the fight. Stop quitting at the first sign of trouble. Stop giving up.

You won’t hear this; you can’t. You’re so certain your solution is the one and only solution to the problem, you simply refuse to even entertain any other possibility.

But the simple fact is this: A 200,000 point loss starts with a 20,000 point deficit. And that’s something a server can recover from. But only if they actually bother to try.

Stop behaving like each player on a losing server needs an individual hug from an ArenaNet developer and a pep talk so they can believe that they’re special, they’re unique, and they’re good.

If you want participation trophies, go join…well, just about anything these days. Society has devolved to the point where people have to be given gifts just to try. It’s the societal equivalent of being bribed to eat your broccoli, or to go to the dentist.

That sort of misguided mollycoddling most certainly should not be promulgated further in a video game, for crying out loud. It’s something you play voluntarily, to enjoy yourself. If you can’t figure out how to enjoy yourself when you’re not winning, go talk to pretty much anyone in WvWvW on the Kaineng server. They seem to manage to have a good time, and they ALWAYS lose. It’s a foregone conclusion. But they make the best of it.

Your problem isn’t that you think WvWvW is broken; your problem is that you think everything should be equal at all times. I’ve got news for you: In WvWvW, two of the three servers in any match MUST ALWAYS LOSE. Two thirds of all participants will lose in every single match, every time.

There will be a winner, and there will be two servers of losers.

Right now, a fair number of those losers are taking it extremely gracelessly. Rather than plucking the beam from your own eye, you’re too busy looking for beams anywhere else you possibly can.

Have some humility and grace, and realize that if you lost, the reason and the blame don’t lie in the game mechanics. They lie in the simple fact that the majority of the population on your server that participates in WvWvW quits at the first sign of trouble. They run like cowards back to PvE, waiting for the match to end. They don’t have the guts to stay and fight.

Remember, that 200,000 point loss started because a whole bunch of people on your server decided it was better to run and hide rather than stay and fight when the deficit was a measly 20,000.

Have you ever heard the phrase, “The avalanche has started; it’s too late for the pebbles to vote”? Well, that avalanche is what results in the 200,000 point loss. The time for the pebbles to vote is when you’re down by 10,000 or 20,000 points. And unless and until that vote is something other than, “We’re losing; let’s go grind DEs or something until next week’s match”, you’ll continue to be buried under that avalanche.

And — I don’t mean to be picky, but you’ve done it for a week now, and it grates on my nerves — the proper use of the term you’re looking for is “you’re”. It’s a contraction of “you are”. If you must insult someone, do please try to at least use proper grammar. It lessens the irony somewhat.

mcl.9240:

…. lots of really good, logical and salient points….

^^

This. Well put mcl. From my point of view you are spot on. But the whingers/quitters will not see it. They believe they are entitled to have everything handed to them on a platter. They constantly look for the excuses why they lose and never think of being part of the solution.

Every second week my server (IoJ) is up against a force that is way bigger than us (it’s been ET the last two times). We constantly come second by a fair way in our tier 2 battles. But do we give up? Do we whine on the forums incessantly about the huge population imbalance? No. In fact you’ll see very few posts from IoJ people whining about it (there’s even one currently up thanking ET for a fun week). We try and address the imbalance by positively recruiting people into WvWvW rather than crying about a bigger zerg.

On top of that – right up until server reset you’ll see guilds in WvWvW toughing it out in the trenches even though there is no way we can win the matchup. Why? Because we PvP for the PvP. Not for the scoreboard, not for the accolades, but for the PvP. If you’re doing it for other reasons, well, I think you’re doing it wrong. A target rich environment is a thing of beauty.

IoJ is a great place – no whingers or quitters – just team mates fighting past our last breath until the match ups reset. Then we take another breath and start fighting again. Come on over sometime.

Daish.6139:

mcl.9240:

There is always a chance. There is only no chance when everyone gives up. You don’t need external motivations to fight. If you do, that’s a sad state of affairs.

your talking out of your butt

when its 100vs20vs10 you dont have a chance

If that’s the case servers B and C have no business being matched up against server A.

Let server A accumulate their points and climb up the ranks, and let servers B and C get left behind and fall down the ladder, down where they belong.

I personally don’t see any problems with this at all.

Who wants to bet that everyone opposed to forced balance is on a server that’s already winning? Or at least, doesn’t actually know how very, very difficult it is to get back from a losing battle?

Moa Malady.3176:

Who wants to bet that everyone opposed to forced balance is on a server that’s already winning? Or at least, doesn’t actually know how very, very difficult it is to get back from a losing battle?

I find it ironic that your post with it’s massive, offensive generalization is just below mine ;-)

Moa Malady.3176:

Who wants to bet that everyone opposed to forced balance is on a server that’s already winning? Or at least, doesn’t actually know how very, very difficult it is to get back from a losing battle?

You just lost the bet.

I’m from Sea of Sorrows, same as Daish.

Unless he’s a different Daish.

Moa Malady.3176:

Who wants to bet that everyone opposed to forced balance is on a server that’s already winning? Or at least, doesn’t actually know how very, very difficult it is to get back from a losing battle?

Define “losing battle”.

At what point do you consider your server to be in a “losing battle”?

Why weren’t you trying harder before that point, when it would have been easier to recover?

Because you’d rather blame the game than accept any blame yourselves.

Yes, the server I’m on happened to win our match this week. However, that’s not typically the case. More often than not, we lose. And I don’t mean we come in second whenever we lose, either. Sometimes we’re last, and by a huge margin.

Honestly, it doesn’t change my attitude one bit. When we’re behind, I queue up anyway. I go in and do what I can. So do a lot of other people on my server. We disrupt supply caravans. We take supply depots. We pick off enemy stragglers. We create large-scale distractions on one side of the map to draw the enemy zerg away from our true target, a much smaller, less attractive target on the opposite side of the map. We do all sorts of things to scrape and claw and gain back any territory we can.

And, just for the record, the team that came in second in our match this week fought to the very end with us. They’ve put up a great fight, and they’ve even gained ground in the past 24 hours. The match will end tomorrow even closer than it is between our two servers now.

And we have great respect for the fact that they did that. Several of us have, in fact, thanked them publicly for the great fight they gave us. They get it. So do several other servers. But most of them don’t.

I know exactly how hard it can be to come back from a huge deficit. The point is not to let it get to that point to begin with. Sometimes it’s inevitable; sometimes there’s nothing you can do about it. Much like life, it isn’t fair, but it is something you’ve got to deal with. You can’t always win. Sometimes you can’t even come in a close second. Sometimes you’re going to get soundly trounced.

Suck it up. Learn from it. Soldier on.

…or, roll over, expose your pink belly, and cry ‘foul’ while demanding that ArenaNet do something about the simple truth that the majority of people on your server simply lack the intestinal fortitude to stick around when things get hard. That they’re afraid. That they aren’t good enough to at least lose with some honor and dignity.

You may still lose, but you can make sure your enemy remembers and respects you.

Or you can lose, and ensure that you’re forgotten and ridiculed, even pitied for your complete lack of effort. People may suggest taking a can of paint and a brush into the datacenter and painting a large, yellow stripe right down the center of your server blade.

Which one occurs is entirely up to you.

mcl is quite possibly the most intelligent poster on this forum I’ve seen so far. Everything he’s said is completely true.

All the people complaining about imbalances in WvW are the reason why the imbalance exists. If your server puts in less effort than the other one and ends up losing, your server deserves to lose. Not everyone is entitled to victory. Two-thirds of the servers involved in WvW will lose. There is nothing you can do about this.

The fact that there’s a gap between servers isn’t an issue Arenanet can fix. That’s an issue with the players. Too many people want to be on the winning team without putting in any effort, and sadly this will happen no matter what happens.

The other issue with steamrolls is how Elo works. There will always be steamrolls going on because some servers are obviously better than other ones. However, if they end up in a lower Elo, they will simply rise to where they’re supposed to be. The game is new, and server strength is still balancing out. Elo will not be perfect right now. As is the case with Northern Shiverpeaks, NSP has moved from the bottom to the middle bracket without even a slight issue. Why is this? The guilds on our server have started to work together and more people have come back that had left because of queue times back when NSP was one of the top servers. Although our Elo hadn’t changed, our server’s strength definitely did. Now our Elo needs to balance out.

If your server is losing, tough luck. This doesn’t mean there’s a problem with the matchmaking. It means there’s a problem with your server. Servers aren’t entitled to victory. They have to earn it.

mcl i dont know why you keep crapping on but this is about the players who are in the game and want to keep trying even if their server is currently loseing

because of the lower population joining WvW there needs to be a balance system

1 team out of the 3 should not have more players then the other 2 teams combined

that simple

Can’t wait to see MCL face in 3-4 months when WvW completely dead because Anet did nothing.

I be expecting an apology from all the “man up” people here thinking Anet should do nothing to fix imbalance and nightcapping, have fun playing a dead mode. Mean while I be spvping since at least that not a glitched , lopsided mess.

Agree 100%, the realms on top are only there because of their numbers. And the outmanned “buff” is a joke

yeah WvW is becoming extreamly unenjoyable on servers without max population 24/7

they need to do something now before people leave the game

gamers are not the type of people who will come back and give something a 2nd chance

need balance already wvw is so boring without it

You should really stop pushing this thread, your idea is and always will be awful.

I can’t talk about this week, but last week, we were the one’s outnumbered. So much for that.

The PvP servers currently support 500 (or 600?) players per map, so only 166 (or 200) players can join World PvP, which is already very limited compared to the maximum number of accounts per server.

People who are winning are always going to think they’re entitled to their win because of their superior grit/determination/skill. They are never going to consider structural imbalances. It is much better, and more satisfying, to be able to look down their nose at people and feel better. ‘I am a winner’, they will say, ‘and the rest of you must man up and be like me, as you do not deserve the rewards I have reaped for clicking the server transfer button or winning the server pick lottery’. It never fails.

All this aside….

Ultimately, the ranking system will provide some relief, as better population servers will be matched with similar servers, and lower population servers will be matched with lower population servers. Once the ranking system does what it is supposed to do, then various tweaks and limits can be accounted for. At some point, free transfers must also end, as people will simply continue to transfer to servers where they will feel they have a better shot of winning. As population condenses into fewer and fewer servers, WvW will suffer on those other servers, for those that remain. This is bad for the people on both sides of the equation… . those who must endure longer queues, and those who want to play but can rarely field a full enough team to actually begin moving the WvW map. The dust must be allowed to settle so that now premature decisions are made about the shape of WvW into the future., and Arenanet is the only one with all the data and metrics to know exactly what player numbers are and participation matters that exist in it.

One must wait and see how things bottom out before structural changes can be considered in the long run, as the law of unintended consequences does come into effect. Limits, queueing, and more are a fact of life. They exist to protect the game and ensure that it is fun for everyone, even the losers. After all, one must keep the loser coming back to lose again with the allure that he might be able to win the game at some point, if he only tries harder next time and gets better.

Also, if you’re so sure that people just need to ‘man up’, why not take on that oh-so-manly challenges of leading another server to victory and transfering to another server? I am sure those declaring that others ought to ‘man up’ will be the first to click the server transfer button to a losing server to show us how good their skills are by turning those battles around with their superior skills and organizational capabilities.

You cannot punsish other servers for having more WvW players….
If you server dont field enough WvW players then its time to transfer off to a server that has enough players to fill up your queue.

Seems to me your on the wrong server to do WvW.

this need to happen already kids are rageing this would of fixed most of the issues

night caping and guilds transfering every week

well Daish can see WvW dieing off more and more without something like this

I wouldn’t touch the numbers so much, allthough that does seem like the only ‘fair’ option.
Seeing how it would force people out of doing WvW I don’t like the option that much.

But if your server is below a certain treshhold of players, how about lowering upgrade costs, increasing effectiveness of resources and all that?

I think it’s fair enough to say that a max filled server has more means to buy plans for trebs and all those things, while a low population could do with some reductions.

Just let the system count your numbers and than scale the prices and resources.
Could help a lot.

Seeing as players aren’t equal anyhow (another thing that is in theory ‘not fair’) we could also create small player buffs if you’re outnumbered.
Just a small modifier depending on how many players you have in WvW at that given time.

These 2 solutions will have downsides too, but at least they wouldn’t effect players wanting to get in the fight on any server…

I’m not going to read every post in this thread, but the OP is bullkitten. Complete ignorant bullkitten.

I couldn’t disagree more. If you want strictly equal player numbers, play spvp. Part of wvwvw is being dynamic and open.

In my opinion add paid server transfers.

Low populated servers will even have less people every week because all the spineless people that kitten their pants when outnumbered leave to join another server every week. Just to be able to faceroll along with the mob.

This has to be stopped and eventually it will balance itself out with new players joining a server every day. Ofcourse some servers will still have a huge amount more active pvp participants but you cant level all servers.

Daish.6139:

the WvW Population needs to be balanced out or there is going to be alot of major issues

keep it simple since there are 3 teams no 1 team should out number the other 2 teams combined

say Red has 15 players and Blue has 20 players
Green should have a limit of 35 placed on them

I do want to see more balance in WvWvW, but this is the worst possible idea ever. A server should never be punished just for having more players.

The best and only reasonable way to help the outmanned servers is to make the Outmanned Buff useful and helpful. It would be a simple change for Anet to do, I have no idea why they haven’t done it already. For example, make the Outmanned Buff to give the outmanned side some stat boosts so they do have a chance to fight against bigger numbers. Also, it would be great if upgrades would cost less for the outmanned side because who sane person would waste money on upgrades if they know the money will just go to waste.

My idea would be to have a Gradual Outmanned system like this for example:

Slightly Outmanned ( +10% to all stats, -25% upgrade costs)
Outmanned ( +20% to all stats, -50% upgrade costs)
Seriously Outmanned ( +30% to all stats, -75% upgrade costs)

I know it’s not a perfect solution, but it’s the only reasonable one in my opinion. An outmanned buff working like that would give the outmanned server a better chance to fight against big numbers and would probably make more people join the battle and upgrade towers/keeps due to lower upgrade costs.

Another good idea that caught my eye in these forums some time ago was an idea of a NPC Army that generates for the outmanned server and randomly attacks enemy camps/towers/keeps to help the outmanned server. The NPC Army wouldn’t be anything too strong, but a serious enough threat to keep the spawn camping enemy server busy every now and then. For example, the army could be easily taken care of with a few siege weapons and defenders, but an unmanned tower/keep with no upgrades would fall to this NPC Army.

I know this one is much more harder to implement and I don’t know if it is even possible, but it would give some much needed help for the outmanned side and also make the PvDooring side to have at least some challenge if all the human players have gone to sleep.

Greep.6394:

People who dismiss the idea outright just aren’t thinking it through. We still have free transfers, use them if needed. This would even out the population considerably, there would only be queue for people who “want” queues for the sake of winning, just as there is now. Agreed of course that they essentially need “guild transfers” atm.

The only downside is the unofficial oceanic server would get utterly screwed. They would have to completely disband. I’m honestly not sure if this is necessarily a bad thing at this point, though, as staying all in one server is only making their matches boring for themselves. I know for darned certain if I was australian I wouldn’t be on that server.

Eh? maybe you should try being on this server, our last few weeks of fighting have been great fun, was only boring while we were matched up with lower tier servers without night crews. T2 amd T1 have given great competition.

On a related note, I agree that some kind of pop control needs to be implemented as, as stated 100vs10 is not fun, BUT the problem I see with this one is, if at reset everyone is even in pop, and one server starts winning, the other 2 will start leaving(like they always do), thus reducing the overall number of people in wvw,

Then the people that were already in on the winning side, will just stay(unless you force them out) cap everything, and it snowballs, people on the losing side will not come back in, new people on the winning side cannot get in. I think when it comes to queues the servers with less pop in wvw should get in first over servers with more people already(to within a certain number, too small a gap and it would just be silly)

Shinigami.5932:

I couldn’t disagree more. If you want strictly equal player numbers, play spvp. Part of wvwvw is being dynamic and open.

your acting like there is not already a cap

you have to start queueing up around 50-60 players no more then 50-60 can enter per team

there are 3 teams the team with more players on the server can still have as many as both the other 2 servers COMBINED

not sure if you know what dynamic is

Xavier.2176:

Daish.6139:

the WvW Population needs to be balanced out or there is going to be alot of major issues

keep it simple since there are 3 teams no 1 team should out number the other 2 teams combined

say Red has 15 players and Blue has 20 players
Green should have a limit of 35 placed on them

I do want to see more balance in WvWvW, but this is the worst possible idea ever. A server should never be punished just for having more players.

The best and only reasonable way to help the outmanned servers is to make the Outmanned Buff useful and helpful. It would be a simple change for Anet to do, I have no idea why they haven’t done it already. For example, make the Outmanned Buff to give the outmanned side some stat boosts so they do have a chance to fight against bigger numbers. Also, it would be great if upgrades would cost less for the outmanned side because who sane person would waste money on upgrades if they know the money will just go to waste.

My idea would be to have a Gradual Outmanned system like this for example:

Slightly Outmanned ( +10% to all stats, -25% upgrade costs)
Outmanned ( +20% to all stats, -50% upgrade costs)
Seriously Outmanned ( +30% to all stats, -75% upgrade costs)

I know it’s not a perfect solution, but it’s the only reasonable one in my opinion. An outmanned buff working like that would give the outmanned server a better chance to fight against big numbers and would probably make more people join the battle and upgrade towers/keeps due to lower upgrade costs.

Another good idea that caught my eye in these forums some time ago was an idea of a NPC Army that generates for the outmanned server and randomly attacks enemy camps/towers/keeps to help the outmanned server. The NPC Army wouldn’t be anything too strong, but a serious enough threat to keep the spawn camping enemy server busy every now and then. For example, the army could be easily taken care of with a few siege weapons and defenders, but an unmanned tower/keep with no upgrades would fall to this NPC Army.

I know this one is much more harder to implement and I don’t know if it is even possible, but it would give some much needed help for the outmanned side and also make the PvDooring side to have at least some challenge if all the human players have gone to sleep.

that never works your thinking like a PVE gamer

you havent been around much PVP if you think something like that would work

Azariah.8420:

Greep.6394:

People who dismiss the idea outright just aren’t thinking it through. We still have free transfers, use them if needed. This would even out the population considerably, there would only be queue for people who “want” queues for the sake of winning, just as there is now. Agreed of course that they essentially need “guild transfers” atm.

The only downside is the unofficial oceanic server would get utterly screwed. They would have to completely disband. I’m honestly not sure if this is necessarily a bad thing at this point, though, as staying all in one server is only making their matches boring for themselves. I know for darned certain if I was australian I wouldn’t be on that server.

Eh? maybe you should try being on this server, our last few weeks of fighting have been great fun, was only boring while we were matched up with lower tier servers without night crews. T2 amd T1 have given great competition.

On a related note, I agree that some kind of pop control needs to be implemented as, as stated 100vs10 is not fun, BUT the problem I see with this one is, if at reset everyone is even in pop, and one server starts winning, the other 2 will start leaving(like they always do), thus reducing the overall number of people in wvw,

Then the people that were already in on the winning side, will just stay(unless you force them out) cap everything, and it snowballs, people on the losing side will not come back in, new people on the winning side cannot get in. I think when it comes to queues the servers with less pop in wvw should get in first over servers with more people already(to within a certain number, too small a gap and it would just be silly)

they are not going to stay if they own 100% of the map and have nothing to do or have to run across the whole map to get back to the battle when they die

there would be a limit of something like 25 before this even becomes active

so 1 server could have 25v1v2 players

the players controling the whole map leave faster then the defenders alot of the time there is 4 wvw maps