Guild Wars 2

So they’ve said that the matchups are “Swiss style” but it’s not a true swiss style match because the first grouping should have been completely random which would have allowed the top three teams an easy win for their first game….but with the Gold League there wouldn’t have been enough groups to have three separate matchups allowing the 1, 2, & 3 ranked servers to all get a first place.

According to Swiss style rules, after this week Sea of Sorrows, Jade Quarry and Tarnished Coast will all have 6 points, only two of those servers can be placed against Blackgate and as JQ and SoS will both have one first place in the tournament those two servers should be against Blackgate. Thus Tarnished Coast will be matched against Maguuma and Dragonbrand.

If Tarnished Coast gets stuck with Blackgate again next week, then there is something horribly amiss in the tournament match placements and either I have found all the wrong information regarding how “Swiss” style works or we’re not at all using “swiss” style.

I just don’t want my server being punished in the final rankings because we were stuck with the harder competition the entire time.

So can someone please explain how these matchups are actually determined? (Though I guess I can wait until reset tonight to see who we get)

The first match was seeded by the server’s rank, then points were awarded for each match as follows:
1st place – 5 points
2nd place – 3 points
3rd place – 1 point

All subsequent matches are by total points accumulated. So the 3 highest point servers are matched together, the second three are matched together, etc. In case of a point tie, the server’s rank is used as the tiebreaker.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss-system_tournament

Expect the JQ and SoS constantly swap places as long as TC finishes 2nd. TC/JQ can at best finish 3rd or 5th in the 7 week tournament. Due to TC/JQ having 4 tier 1 match-ups and SoS winning 4 tier 2 match-ups. A 6 server league is not the best format for a swiss tournament, but the 9 server leagues will be more interesting.

Ulion.5476:

Expect the JQ and SoS constantly swap places as long as TC finishes 2nd. TC/JQ can at best finish 3rd or 5th in the 7 week tournament. Due to TC/JQ having 4 tier 1 match-ups and SoS winning 4 tier 2 match-ups. A 6 server league is not the best format for a swiss tournament, but the 9 server leagues will be more interesting.

Yeah, that’s what I was afraid of….. so there is a high chance that SoS will be 2nd overall despite them not actually being better than TC/JQ.

Very unfair tournament…..and I don’t like it one bit. Coming in 3rd to BG & JQ, that’s fine, but coming in 5th behind other servers who get placed higher because they have easier matches….just not right.

khani.4786:

Ulion.5476:

Expect the JQ and SoS constantly swap places as long as TC finishes 2nd. TC/JQ can at best finish 3rd or 5th in the 7 week tournament. Due to TC/JQ having 4 tier 1 match-ups and SoS winning 4 tier 2 match-ups. A 6 server league is not the best format for a swiss tournament, but the 9 server leagues will be more interesting.

Yeah, that’s what I was afraid of….. so there is a high chance that SoS will be 2nd overall despite them not actually being better than TC/JQ.

Very unfair tournament…..and I don’t like it one bit. Coming in 3rd to BG & JQ, that’s fine, but coming in 5th behind other servers who get placed higher because they have easier matches….just not right.

I agree. Unless JQ or TC can manage to beat BG, the outcome of Gold league is set in stone. Probably was after the first week. Being only 6 servers in gold league is the issue and does not work with this type of set-up.

Swiss Tournament = Winners play with winners.
EU gold, next week

SFR, Baruch Bay, Elona Reach (winners of this week matchup)
Deso, Kodash, VZ (2nd place)
JS, Riverside, Augury Rock (3rd place)

Why? Because they have win their matches,.

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

Swiss Tournament = Winners play with winners.
EU gold, next week

SFR, Baruch Bay, Elona Reach (winners of this week matchup)
Deso, Kodash, VZ (2nd place)
JS, Riverside, Augury Rock (3rd place)

Why? Because they have win their matches,.

That works for the EU gold league because there are 9 teams……NA Gold only has 6 teams and so it looks like TC and JQ are getting the shaft.

khani.4786:

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

Swiss Tournament = Winners play with winners.
EU gold, next week

SFR, Baruch Bay, Elona Reach (winners of this week matchup)
Deso, Kodash, VZ (2nd place)
JS, Riverside, Augury Rock (3rd place)

Why? Because they have win their matches,.

That works for the EU gold league because there are 9 teams……NA Gold only has 6 teams and so it looks like TC and JQ are getting the shaft.

OMG. 6 teams in the 1st ladder? That’s really stupid.

NA
Gold – 9 teams
Silver – 9 teams
Bronze – 6 teams

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

khani.4786:

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

Swiss Tournament = Winners play with winners.
EU gold, next week

SFR, Baruch Bay, Elona Reach (winners of this week matchup)
Deso, Kodash, VZ (2nd place)
JS, Riverside, Augury Rock (3rd place)

Why? Because they have win their matches,.

That works for the EU gold league because there are 9 teams……NA Gold only has 6 teams and so it looks like TC and JQ are getting the shaft.

OMG. 6 teams in the 1st ladder? That’s really stupid.

NA
Gold – 9 teams
Silver – 9 teams
Bronze – 6 teams

Actually it makes sense because the gap between T2 and T3 was massive in the lead up to Season 1. The gap between T2 and T1 is already a matter of exponential differences; but it would have been cruel and unusual to put SBI and IoJ in with the rest of us.

khani.4786:

Ulion.5476:

Expect the JQ and SoS constantly swap places as long as TC finishes 2nd. TC/JQ can at best finish 3rd or 5th in the 7 week tournament. Due to TC/JQ having 4 tier 1 match-ups and SoS winning 4 tier 2 match-ups. A 6 server league is not the best format for a swiss tournament, but the 9 server leagues will be more interesting.

Yeah, that’s what I was afraid of….. so there is a high chance that SoS will be 2nd overall despite them not actually being better than TC/JQ.

Very unfair tournament…..and I don’t like it one bit. Coming in 3rd to BG & JQ, that’s fine, but coming in 5th behind other servers who get placed higher because they have easier matches….just not right.

TC should come in at a comfortable 4th, because Maguuma is losing the T2 match this week.
There was the threat that Maguuma could have snatched 2nd in the final match; but JQ made sure they don’t have that option anymore.
The only thing that could change is if DB and Mag 2v1 SoS to drag us down to 4th; but as much as they probably don’t want us to get 2nd, I’m sure they find the thought of JQ and TC finishing behind SoS to be hilarious.

khani.4786:

Ulion.5476:

Expect the JQ and SoS constantly swap places as long as TC finishes 2nd. TC/JQ can at best finish 3rd or 5th in the 7 week tournament. Due to TC/JQ having 4 tier 1 match-ups and SoS winning 4 tier 2 match-ups. A 6 server league is not the best format for a swiss tournament, but the 9 server leagues will be more interesting.

Yeah, that’s what I was afraid of….. so there is a high chance that SoS will be 2nd overall despite them not actually being better than TC/JQ.

Very unfair tournament…..and I don’t like it one bit. Coming in 3rd to BG & JQ, that’s fine, but coming in 5th behind other servers who get placed higher because they have easier matches….just not right.

Gold league is hardly only one affected by this. There’s a good chance that IoJ will beat out SBI for 3rd place because they finished last the first week rather than 2nd. System actually benefits that match’s last place team more than 2nd place team simply due to it being a 10 week tournament.
Sadly looks like I need to actually root for YB against IoJ.

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

Swiss Tournament = Winners play with winners.
EU gold, next week

SFR, Baruch Bay, Elona Reach (winners of this week matchup)
Deso, Kodash, VZ (2nd place)
JS, Riverside, Augury Rock (3rd place)

Why? Because they have win their matches,.

That’s wrong.

“The initial round of the tournament will match the worlds in each league according to their world rating. After that round has ended, worlds will be matched up according to how many points they have in the tournament. This will continue after each round, which means that the matchups are not predetermined but are dependent upon the results of the previous matchups. If two teams have the same number of points, the team with the higher world rating will be considered the higher seed for the purposes of the matchup.”
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/get-ready-for-wvw-spring-tournament-2014/

Therefore, EU-Gold Round 3 will be (order Green – Blue – Red):
T1: SFR (10pts) – Deso (8 pts, Glicko 5) -BB (8pts, Glicko 8 )
T2: Jade (6pts, Glicko 3) – Elona (6pts Glicko 6) – Kodash (6pts, Glicko 7)
T3: RS (4pts, Glicko 2) – Vizu (4pts, Glicko 4) – AR (2 pts)

As Dayra points out that’s how I think it is, it means a chance for the lower ranked servers to accumulate some points and so you may eventually get a variation of “competitive” match-ups.

There is major faul in having 5 -3 -1 pointsystem in place. At most leagues there is one server that has strong hold for that place(usually thanks for transfers) and some teams that at are fighting for second placement. → at that kind of situation its more worth to be placed at 3rd than 2nd, as you get out from top group. 2 times 2nd place at top group = 6pts, one time 3rd and 1st is also 6 points, but is more valuable because the number 1 place.

Well good job on this tournament. TC has Blackgate and JG yet again and because we face harder competition we’re going to be in a lower place overall.

This has really killed my motivation to try anymore. Thanks.

This is kind of ridiculous. Pitting TC against BG three weeks running just means for three weeks we’ve been practically guaranteed to lose, and every odd week we have to fight against the other strongest server too? And then no matter if we keep our place 2nd for every match up despite morale at approximately negative 500, we’ll end up beneath 3rd.

This was not a well planed system.

How is this different from last season? I’m not seeing a difference.

Catseye.3164:

How is this different from last season? I’m not seeing a difference.

Last season, the entire schedule was mapped out from the start. It is not this time.

Greeeeeaaaaaat..we’re up against Gandara next week for the gazillionth time…boring!!
This whole system sucks kitten!! (yes..we are gonna loose again..but thats fact, no worries lol)

But..let’s see if they’re chicken again and team up with the other guys against us like last week…cluck-a dooooo hehehe
“bring it on!” Looking forward !

But seriously..this ranking system sucks.. why not choosen for regular rankings? Everyone plays everyone and when the dust is settled..we’ll see who’s best. Just like in soccer matchups..

Josh Davis says, “Thanks for the feedback, everyone. We are very much interested in making the tournament better for the next round, and we’ll take a lot of this stuff into consideration for our planning. We have a running list of places to improve on.”

Svarty, that quote was about the PvP Tourney, not the WvW tourney.

Even with the many blowouts, the season 1 schedule was far and above much better than the season 2 matchups where most servers are stuck alternating between one matchup on odd weeks and another on even weeks.

Dragan.7568:

There is major faul in having 5 -3 -1 pointsystem in place. At most leagues there is one server that has strong hold for that place(usually thanks for transfers) and some teams that at are fighting for second placement. -> at that kind of situation its more worth to be placed at 3rd than 2nd, as you get out from top group. 2 times 2nd place at top group = 6pts, one time 3rd and 1st is also 6 points, but is more valuable because the number 1 place.

The 5-3-1 point system is really flawed.

One first place and one third place finish is better than 2 second place finishes. Rewarding second place finishes so highly rewards mediocrity and encourages collusion.

5-2-1 or even 4-2-1 would be better.

nekretaal.6485:

5-2-1 or even 4-2-1 would be better.

Assuming you kept the same matchup system, those would be even worse. If your server is in the top bracket of your 9 server league, there would be more incentive to place 3rd in one week, so in the following week, you drop to the second bracket and beat up on the lower tier, get 1st place. You’d easily outscore the server that was in 2nd place both weeks, by losing the first week and having an easier match the second.

That’s the problem with the matchups this season. If all matches award the same points (regardless of difficulty), then over the course of a season, all servers should have a relatively even set of matches compared to any other server. But if you’re basing matchups on how well a server does, then then 2nd or 3rd place against a very difficult opponent should be worth more than an easy win against a weak opponent. We’ve got the worst of both worlds in season 2.

The problem is that if it didn’t work for the Olympics, why would it work here? Swiss match ups can go.