Guild Wars 2

As everyone knows Mesmer is totally unbalanced.I can no longer walk in WvW and not take a burst that leaves me with 100 HP for more than 5 minutes it because I have 3k of toughness and 20k of health using engineer..
We can only call WvW to call MvM (mesmer vs mesmer), since other classes are well below this.
Anyone who does not know play mesmer, including me, kill any other profession, believe, have tested this a lot playing mesmer and not lose 1 × 1 × 1 or 2 and to gain some 1 × 3.
I know they are working on HoT, but the way it is coming of HoT will only worsen things more bugs. It would not be the time to give special attention and balance this?

and……………..?

In Spanish WvW is called MvM (Mundo vs Mundo), so both are correct.

About mesmers… this profession excels in roaming, but lacks in pve and large scale fights.

And for what you write, it’s clearly a l2p issue. In what world would you be able to kill such an unique profession like mesmer without even know what it’s played and its strengths and weaknesses?

GreenRipper.6432:

As everyone knows Mesmer is totally unbalanced.I can no longer walk in WvW and not take a burst that leaves me with 100 HP for more than 5 minutes it because I have 3k of toughness and 20k of health using engineer..
We can only call WvW to call MvM (mesmer vs mesmer), since other classes are well below this.

Doesn’t sound reasonable to me to call it Mesmer Vs Mesmer when you are complaining from an engineer perspective, because by definition, it would be Engineer Vs Mesmer to some extent.

Besides, professions are not OP, some, often very few, builds are. I do agree that the Mesmer has at least one build, with a few small variants that are OP.

Ansau.7326:

About mesmers… this profession excels in roaming, but lacks in pve and large scale fights.

I agree to an extent. It lacks in group support to an extent. It is great for reflects, mass invis, portal, and what not for large groups. it is great to get into back lines and take out water fields spammers and ranged DPS.

Personally, I feel too many people have a misconception of what support in a large scale fight really means. If someone thinks support in a large scale fight is restricted to being able to spam shouts or water fields, then I feel they are selling the force short with short sighted perspective.

Ansau.7326:

And for what you write, it’s clearly a l2p issue. In what world would you be able to kill such an unique profession like mesmer without even know what it’s played and its strengths and weaknesses?

I agree, to an extent. I hopped on my Mesmer and ran the stealth spam PU condi build that everyone is roaming with. It is simply fairly OP. There is only so much L2P you can do, if a build is a bit too strong, and it is a bit too strong. There have been times were eles builds were OP, engineer had builds that were OP (more so in PvP though), warrior had OP builds, and so on. Right now, you can suggest L2P until the cows come home, the Mesmer has some OP builds.

GreenRipper.6432:

As everyone knows Mesmer is totally unbalanced.I can no longer walk in WvW and not take a burst that leaves me with 100 HP for more than 5 minutes it because I have 3k of toughness and 20k of health using engineer..

Well there is your problem. You’re never going to beat classes designed to kill other classes with toughness and hp. Its simply not good enough compared to damage. Take any class as a roaming tank you will still drop like a stone vs zerkers, while hitting like a wet noodle.

Tbh, I think Mesmer is still one of the rarest classes you will encounter on the field… But why not simply swap class yourself? Engineers vs Mesmers is pretty much sheep to the slaughter due to class design. Not enough AoE to take down clones and the range shatter tear him down.

Try something like a Thief instead. Cant shatter what you cant target. Or a Necro. They eat clones like there’s no tomorrow. 1800 range trapper Rangers can outstealth them and pretty much kill them in one burst. Burn Guardian will slaughter them. Etc and so on.

The only thing an Engineer is good at in WvW is holding a chokepoint against a solo melee player and the occasional pull, that’s pretty much it. I dont know any Engineer build that’s going to perform well overall when roaming against roaming classes.

Ansau.7326:

In Spanish WvW is called MvM (Mundo vs Mundo), so both are correct.

About mesmers… this profession excels in roaming, but lacks in pve and large scale fights.

And for what you write, it’s clearly a l2p issue. In what world would you be able to kill such an unique profession like mesmer without even know what it’s played and its strengths and weaknesses?

For now, once hot is released those Mesmer wells will give them a much bigger role in large scale wvw.

I wish people would L2English before making these kinds of threads. Since they probably can’t understand half the replies their own threads get…

dancingmonkey.4902:

I agree to an extent. It lacks in group support to an extent. It is great for reflects, mass invis, portal, and what not for large groups. it is great to get into back lines and take out water fields spammers and ranged DPS.

Personally, I feel too many people have a misconception of what support in a large scale fight really means. If someone thinks support in a large scale fight is restricted to being able to spam shouts or water fields, then I feel they are selling the force short with short sighted perspective.

I was talking the lack in general, not just support. Damage of mesmers in both pve and zergs is one of the lowest in the game. Talking about support, only in pve will be average with Chronomancer (mainly quickness, alacrity and reflects), but in zergs the support is very low, what you said is partially wrong.

Yes, there is more support than healing and condi cleansing, but the problem is nearly all support you actually need. Anything else is just and add, but your zerg won’t win because 3/4 guys get 1s of distortion here, 3/4 others get 2 of alacrity, 5 others get 2s of superspeed…
In the end, what really matters are mobility and recover. It’s not about if it’s all the support or not, but if it’s effective or not.
Same thing could be applied with berserker stat vs others in dungeons.

dancingmonkey.4902:

I agree, to an extent. I hopped on my Mesmer and ran the stealth spam PU condi build that everyone is roaming with. It is simply fairly OP. There is only so much L2P you can do, if a build is a bit too strong, and it is a bit too strong. There have been times were eles builds were OP, engineer had builds that were OP (more so in PvP though), warrior had OP builds, and so on. Right now, you can suggest L2P until the cows come home, the Mesmer has some OP builds.

PU condi shatter mesmer can be killed, I’ve killed some in my non PU condi shatter, funny don’t? Yes, it’s a very powerful build, but only at duels or solo roaming. Outside that its performance decrease dramatically.
Devs don’t balance in every game mode separately, they balance across all or if some skills or traits bring something they don’t desire.

In the end it really is a matter of l2p issue. But not l2p of outskilling the other, but more a l2p of bringing in the table something better or knowing how to deal with it.
If people were more smart, PU-perplexity-full dire or PU mantra burst mesmers wouldn’t be the meta, since they’re subpar compared to other mesmer builds better rounded, that actually can beat both before.
But instead, a lot of people put in WvW maps the build they think it will be good, not the best, fail miserably (since that build is far from being successful for roaming) and come here to the forums whining about how the rest of the people, who really understand the roaming and are prepared to success in it, are destroying them.

Random.4691:

For now, once hot is released those Mesmer wells will give them a much bigger role in large scale wvw.

I’ve tried the new wells and they’ll improve mesmer damage, but we still won’t be at the level of AoE damage of eles and necros. More than 3 mesmers in a group of 20 won’t be needed, which is what you already have in the actual compositions.

Ansau.7326:

I was talking the lack in general, not just support. Damage of mesmers in both pve and zergs is one of the lowest in the game. Talking about support, only in pve will be average with Chronomancer (mainly quickness, alacrity and reflects), but in zergs the support is very low, what you said is partially wrong.

Do you have a link to a damage break down of some sort that is evidence to claiming that mesmer’s are the lowest damage in the game?

Perhaps your support in zergs is low, mine isn’t. I am constantly asked for Mass invis, portals, veils, or feedbacks, and portals.

Ansau.7326:

PU condi shatter mesmer can be killed, I’ve killed some in my non PU condi shatter, funny don’t? Yes, it’s a very powerful build, but only at duels or solo roaming. Outside that its performance decrease dramatically.

I agree. Once you get outside of 1v1, they are not near as strong.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Do you have a link to a damage break down of some sort that is evidence to claiming that mesmer’s are the lowest damage in the game?

Perhaps your support in zergs is low, mine isn’t. I am constantly asked for Mass invis, portals, veils, or feedbacks, and portals.

I haven’t said mesmer don’t have damage, but do to its nature, it doesn’t work in pve neither in zergs.

For zerguing is well known how low the damage is. I am myself one of the fewest who has tried to maximize the damage there, but even being able to reach high numbers (5-6.5k), they were still lower than what the rest of the ranged could get (6-8k) and much fewer in terms of amount of it (I could get 8-10 big numbers in a charge while necros were getting 12-14 with a single well…).
Chronomancer will shorten the difference, but it won’t be enough. Necros and eles have way more AoE skills and they’re not capped with the small+big design from mesmers wells.

The problem of mesmer support is it’s very situational. Veil is only used in the beggining of charges and portal only in specific moments. In comparison, waters and condi cleansings are dropped constantly, so their effect is much bigger and relevant than yours.
And the rest is what I said, secondary: A Feedback here or not isn’t crucial, some boons copied doesn’t have a big impact and MI is only suitable for focus party, but outside it loses the beauty (personally I always ran Time Warp over MI).
Then you can build around support with mantras, but anything would be suboptimal compared to pure damage+situational support, basically because the extra support you could add is somehow wasted with the ranged (that doesn’t need it) or to put it into the melee you’re taking too much risks for being a light armor class.

About pve, here is an outdated dps calculator from last year that it has been true until last 23th June:
http://tinyurl.com/o9wfm29
Note that mesmer damage is counted with 3 illusions, but the reality shows that the average over time will be around 2 illusions, so you ended up having 60-70%% the damage of the maxed DPS and even lower than ranger and necro, which are also considered low damage professions in pve.

Problem with mesmos? Roll survival ranger and make em cry/run. Well timed sic em plus bleed bomb kills 90% of them.

its important to understand not every build is going to go into a battle with equal footing you might or might not face someone with a superior or inferior build vs yours perhaps you should change your build if its not very effective

I agree that mesmers have become very overused in roaming since patch but besides PU i would say that this is part of the condi changes. Basicly any class with fair mobility and one great condi build can roam effectively. As people above have stated, the main way to kill a PU condi mesmer is to use another condi build against it since they are all pretty ridiculous in WvW. Sad to say but as of right now i would recommend to join them or feel the burn.

if u want to be the best at mesmer just go sinister and 1v5 anyone tested and proven im already make a mesmer myself its lol why bother playing any other class when u will be a free bag with in wvw unless ur a thief Stealth META GG

Balance, in WvW, is pretty much non-existent.

Especially as stealth is so useful, in so many situations.

I finally (and very reluctantly) gave up on my Ranger to play Mesmer and I wouldn’t go back, unless Ranger also got some decent (non-targeted) stealth.

I’m not really happy about the situation, but what can you do?

Tigaseye.2047:

Balance, in WvW, is pretty much non-existent.

Especially as stealth is so useful, in so many situations.

I finally (and very reluctantly) gave up on my Ranger to play Mesmer and I wouldn’t go back, unless Ranger also got some decent (non-targeted) stealth.

I’m not really happy about the situation, but what can you do?

Lol I don’t see why I’ve killed plenty of Mesmers snide the patch on my ranger. Half of them can’t function after you take their stealth away with sic em because most of what they do revolves around precious stealth lol. It helps that I have been a main Mesmer and know how to use it and what to look for though.