Guild Wars 2

I wonder about the longevity of this game mode at times. It can be so much fun but the downsides can be a serious drain, a turn off even. Severely lop sided fights are common and that can happen without it being “night capping” hour, overwhelming odds can be fun but I think that wears off when you’re facing it constantly. Couple this with the poor rewards and not so alt friendly “progression”, what will happen when dedicated and or organized players leave?

There are already players who are there for map completion who don’t stick around. At some point Guild Wars 2’s freshness will wear off, new games will roll out, and of those still buying copies, how many will try (and stay!) in WvWvW (they’ll be getting decent fps by then I hope)?

I know I can’t be the only one thinking this. Do you think WvWvW is losing more players than gaining? What are your thoughts?!

If you had asked me around December, early January, I would have said WvW was on the decline. However, since then, at least on Tarnished Coast, we have seen an influx of new recruits. (And our guild is dedicated to small group content, which is difficult to do in the current design).

To me, this is an indication GW2 is getting good word of mouth, and will keep growing at a respectable rate in the future (which is very hard for a new MMO to do). Some of those people will of course get hooked on WvW.

That said, WvW needs work, and with the culling patch Anet has shown they are committed to getting it right. Removal of culling in itself revitalized the game. It felt like launch week again. And the new ranks will keep the “Achiever” type in WvW.

However, map size and zergs are the big problem now. I’m cautiously optimistic that Anet can solve this problem as well, like they did culling (though we might have to wait). If not, Elder Scrolls Online, with its huge PvP map is releasing in late 2013. That will be GW2’s competition in this area.

My personal point of complete turn-off is the character-bound progression BS ANet squeezes into the game and force-feeds us. First FotM level, now WXP rank. I like play several characters (and currently have a lvl 80 ranger, lvl 80 warrior, lvl 80 mesmer – those 3 fully exotic – and a lvl 2 engineer waiting to be played).

My mesmer is FotM level 10, the ranger and warrior are at level 5. I know pretty much all enounters in all fractals but just to bring those other 2 characters up to the same level where I can even have a chance of getting those pristine things would take 2*5*45 minutes (so a total of 7.5 hours in the best case, not counting any time spent on explaining encounters or retrying stuff like swamp or even looking for a group). And from there it certainly doesn’t get better.

And now WXP turning out to be the same kind of grind… no thanks. Usually I played GW2 in double-digit hours on weekends, but today I was so interested in the game that I logged in to do the bare minimum for the daily and then level my ranger in Path of Exile from 7 to 28…

So the burnout is already happening for me since ANet clearly reinforced that they definitively moved away from their manifesto (remember: “no grind!”, “play the way you want!”, yadda yadda) and I’m just done wasting my time on broken promises and stupid grind that gets me nowhere.

So far I’m clocking in on about 1255 hours of /age, but I don’t think I’ll reach 1300 unless those “game designers” at ANet get their kitten act together and remember that they promised not some stupid WoW clone that forces you to grind until your rearend is sucking buttermilk.

<.<
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@ Thrumdi

I’m on Borlis Pass, the map chat alone makes it worth it lol but seriously the server really hangs in there and I’ve had a blast in the skirmishes and epic battles for the most part. I don’t think the less than desirable mechanics in WvWvW will make climbing the ranks any more worthwhile for many though. I mean, gain rank why? To do the same stuff that inevitably annoy and frustrate? Unfortunately for the insular little maps of WvW, it’s easy to not bother, the server loses face and not much else, it doesn’t affect the rest of the game at all and this is what’s concerning me.

@Baelnorn

I understand the gripe. I also understand that some things that might have looked good on paper didn’t translate well practically which is why it didn’t and will not stray far from traditional MMO mechanics regardless of the marketing. The high level cap at launch and the tiers of gear are a dead giveaway and I think that was a mistake because any other “progression” they add will just compound the grind. The WvWvW ranks so far seem lackluster, that is something that will happen as a by product of me having fun, the “having fun” part however, turns into a problem at times.

WvW player participation as of the patch is as it was upon release. That’s not an impression, that’s a fact. As the devs put it, the “quality of life” of WVW has just had a major improvement.

With culling out of the way, and the wvw devs resources now opened, we will continue to see the appropriate developments to further improve WvW. Really there are three options for a reasonably minded person. WvW can get worse, it can stay exactly the same, or it can get better. Anet are dedicated to improving WvW, and as the saying goes, where there’s a will, there’s a way.

Simple as that.

gennyt.3428:

@ Thrumdi

I’m on Borlis Pass, the map chat alone makes it worth it lol but seriously the server really hangs in there and I’ve had a blast in the skirmishes and epic battles for the most part. I don’t think the less than desirable mechanics in WvWvW will make climbing the ranks any more worthwhile for many though. I mean, gain rank why? To do the same stuff that inevitably annoy and frustrate? Unfortunately for the insular little maps of WvW, it’s easy to not bother, the server loses face and not much else, it doesn’t affect the rest of the game at all and this is what’s concerning me.

@Baelnorn

I understand the gripe. I also understand that some things that might have looked good on paper didn’t translate well practically which is why it didn’t and will not stray far from traditional MMO mechanics regardless of the marketing. The high level cap at launch and the tiers of gear are a dead giveaway and I think that was a mistake because any other “progression” they add will just compound the grind. The WvWvW ranks so far seem lackluster, that is something that will happen as a by product of me having fun, the “having fun” part however, turns into a problem at times.

It’s funny because Korean players complain at the lack of grind.

Today the population of wvw is increasing little by little every day.
Is where the grinder ppl go to show their shiny armors and weapons and their lack of skill xD

It’s funny because Korean players complain at the lack of grind.

xDDDDD
grind = lack of content
grind = repeat the same action 1 bazillion of times
That is not fun to me :S
I rly dont understand ppl who like grind, where is the fun???

WvW IS on decline. Compared to last year thats not even a question. Now the action concentrated on few top servers, while still attendance is incomparable to what was before. Before WXP patch one could join maps without queu in prime time in tier 1….

The “metagame” changed too – all big alliances left, there is no real hardboiled competition there was before: form of WvW fighting changed, became more “casual” maybe – since there are no previous goals at stake: you`ll not prove anything right now by “wining” WvW.

So yeah, a lot of people/guilds burnd out length ago and left for other games, however the influx of new players still maintains WvW alive, thankfully – though its nothing comparable to madness and types and complexity of fight and depth of metagame that were in BWEs/after release (just my personal opinion as organizer of one of a biggest wvw forces, i did not play for long and just checked a game again, so might not have full insight in current situation).

Sadly, evolutionary changes, like WXP, culling fix etc. will not bring players back. Need real whole load of new content – something like full WvW expansion with new maps, new mechanics, new siege weapons.

People did not leave WvW because it was imperfect or broken – far from it, it was very enjoyable with every state, even with 4h queues, all things that werent fixed than etc. People left since they were doing essentially same thing for multiple months – and that gets old.

I believe even if nothing is done, as long as GW2 as whole will have nice number of players, WvW will be fine – however i dont see it ever coming back on a level of glorious wars of the past. It became far more casual in most aspects – maybe thats what Developers actually wanted.

Frankly the metagame is so much better than what WvW was at beginning of the game even with the current zerging going on. We don’t really have a meta back then as people are clueless about combat mechanics. It’s the spread of GvG that really introduced how much more depth in large scale combat GW2 has to most of the guilds.

Reslinal.2359:

We don’t really have a meta back then as people are clueless about combat mechanics.

I beg to differ. You obviously have little clue about kind of wars, spying, politics, organization within alliances and strategically and tactical cooperation in wvw was there before and how much work, planing, team meetings and discussions was involved. People started preparing for WvW as early as first BWEs, and by the last one there were already proper alliances wars. First week of release where chaotic, but after a month when majority was lvl 80 – a competition like never before started.

Preacher.9018:

WvW IS on decline. Compared to last year thats not even a question. Now the action concentrated on few top servers, while still attendance is incomparable to what was before. Before WXP patch one could join maps without queu in prime time in tier 1….

The “metagame” changed too – all big alliances left, there is no real hardboiled competition there was before: form of WvW fighting changed, became more “casual” maybe – since there are no previous goals at stake: you`ll not prove anything right now by “wining” WvW.

So yeah, a lot of people/guilds burnd out length ago and left for other games, however the influx of new players still maintains WvW alive, thankfully – though its nothing comparable to madness and types and complexity of fight and depth of metagame that were in BWEs/after release (just my personal opinion as organizer of one of a biggest wvw forces, i did not play for long and just checked a game again, so might not have full insight in current situation).

Sadly, evolutionary changes, like WXP, culling fix etc. will not bring players back. Need real whole load of new content – something like full WvW expansion with new maps, new mechanics, new siege weapons.

People did not leave WvW because it was imperfect or broken – far from it, it was very enjoyable with every state, even with 4h queues, all things that werent fixed than etc. People left since they were doing essentially same thing for multiple months – and that gets old.

I believe even if nothing is done, as long as GW2 as whole will have nice number of players, WvW will be fine – however i dont see it ever coming back on a level of glorious wars of the past. It became far more casual in most aspects – maybe thats what Developers actually wanted.

WHILE on the other hand the lower tiers are now seeing a lot more action than before. Even before the WXP patch.

Preacher.9018:

Reslinal.2359:

We don’t really have a meta back then as people are clueless about combat mechanics.

I beg to differ. You obviously have little clue about kind of wars, spying, politics, organization within alliances and strategically and tactical cooperation in wvw was there before and how much work, planing, team meetings and discussions was involved. People started preparing for WvW as early as first BWEs, and by the last one there were already proper alliances wars. First week of release where chaotic, but after a month when majority was lvl 80 – a competition like never before started.

In NA there were only two alliances that got truly organized before WvW began (and only 1 has true coverage and organization), now most servers (at least top 3-4 tiers) have an organized community that has the same or better level of organization, within server communication, and strategically and tactical cooperation compared to those alliances. BWE is a period of per-organized alliances, now we have entered a period where each server is truly an alliance of itself.

I know you’d like to think fondly of the BWE period and believe that’s the pinnacle of GW2 WvW since you experienced it personally, however the fact is game has evolved since then. Servers got more organized, guilds began to learn combat mechanics, profession composition, and field tactics that they had no clue at beginning of the game. Though I think the current meta is a bit inferior to what we had one month ago due to the new system encourages zerging, it still incorporates a significant amount of elements that we learned through 6 months of wvw and is still definitely much better compared to what we had at beginning.