Guild Wars 2

I think it is between Thief and Necro.

These two class got that condi burst that will make you go wtf and look at your combat log after you die to 3 ticks.

Be sure to blast your light field.

BLAST YOUR LIGHT FIELD BOYSSSS

So wait… I’ve been doing it wrong by asking the devs to actually come up with a different ruleset for soft condis and hard cc? So that must mean I was also wrong asking for condi damage to be offset by a core character stat and improve condi clears too?

The light fields… all makes sense now in gw2… blast the light fields…

Mind is blown

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

so retailation buff works vs condi too now?

Xtinct.7031:

so retailation buff works vs condi too now?

Light field blast was changed from retaliation to a condition cleanse last patch.

I tried but missed my blast finisher cause of blind

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

Chaba.5410:

Be sure to blast your light field.

What are you talking about stay away from wvw doors is far more important to counter condi burst.

No condi burst is broken in this game and each time you play with this set up you make the game worst for everyone. Epi and chill bleeds push necor over ghost thf for sure burst but ghost thf being veritably unkillable and able to kill others makes it headspinning.

What some one needs to do is do a video contest to see what condi build is more broken. They would be good eye openers.

Learn and be saved!

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Light_field

Simonoly.4352:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

pretty much. its easiest to do actually when theres more people around, more rupts=more confusion. its a great build for yolos but…. its very easily killable and stab does a lot of negative things to builds running mistrust.
however. when it works it works well.

This is another one of my favorites, when the stars aligned oh so well.
The fact that they were super clumped and spamming skills probably helped as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3WuA7mTHK0

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

Simonoly.4352:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

pretty much. its easiest to do actually when theres more people around, more rupts=more confusion. its a great build for yolos but…. its very easily killable and stab does a lot of negative things to builds running mistrust.
however. when it works it works well.

Which, if you think about it, is great balance for the trait and builds that rely on it. It has a clear counter through stab, but if it isn’t countered it can be absolutely devastating. However, that is tempered by the fact that the build itself is relatively easy to kill if you focus it down.

OriOri.8724:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

Simonoly.4352:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

pretty much. its easiest to do actually when theres more people around, more rupts=more confusion. its a great build for yolos but…. its very easily killable and stab does a lot of negative things to builds running mistrust.
however. when it works it works well.

Which, if you think about it, is great balance for the trait and builds that rely on it. It has a clear counter through stab, but if it isn’t countered it can be absolutely devastating. However, that is tempered by the fact that the build itself is relatively easy to kill if you focus it down.

pretty much. The power of the trait is very strong, but honestly i don’t think it needs to be nerfed because as you said its balanced through other methods, being very easy to counter and through the fact that if you trait down that line you lose almost all sources of sustain. The build works very well in decently skilled hands, especially against idiots, but it faulters very quickly against people who know what there doing.

Swagger.1459:

Learn and be saved!

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Light_field

The funny thing is things like light field blasting going to make landing big epis easier unless you have 5+ blast from each pt due to every one being grouped up the prime targets for epis. Must like resistance makes epis more deadly because more stack of condi. Kind of means of being saved is also your kitten ation.

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

OriOri.8724:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

Simonoly.4352:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

pretty much. its easiest to do actually when theres more people around, more rupts=more confusion. its a great build for yolos but…. its very easily killable and stab does a lot of negative things to builds running mistrust.
however. when it works it works well.

Which, if you think about it, is great balance for the trait and builds that rely on it. It has a clear counter through stab, but if it isn’t countered it can be absolutely devastating. However, that is tempered by the fact that the build itself is relatively easy to kill if you focus it down.

pretty much. The power of the trait is very strong, but honestly i don’t think it needs to be nerfed because as you said its balanced through other methods, being very easy to counter and through the fact that if you trait down that line you lose almost all sources of sustain. The build works very well in decently skilled hands, especially against idiots, but it faulters very quickly against people who know what there doing.

I don’t really think basing any build to be balanced based on a limited-access boon is a good idea.

Basically the same argument as ghost thief being totally fine because people can reveal it. Although even the ghost thief really doesn’t have amazing kill pressure. It’s more or less just a PITA that gets people only when they literally run no bonus health and zero cleanses at all anywhere in their kits.

It may be “balanced” because sometimes it gets shut down, but the game really shouldn’t be Build Wars.

But that’s just me.

agreed

sometimes all it takes is one reveal and a buddy with you to shutdown a ghost thief. Especially if the thief doesn’t run shadow step or a shortbow to teleport kite the reveal durration.

DeceiverX.8361:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

OriOri.8724:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

Simonoly.4352:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

pretty much. its easiest to do actually when theres more people around, more rupts=more confusion. its a great build for yolos but…. its very easily killable and stab does a lot of negative things to builds running mistrust.
however. when it works it works well.

Which, if you think about it, is great balance for the trait and builds that rely on it. It has a clear counter through stab, but if it isn’t countered it can be absolutely devastating. However, that is tempered by the fact that the build itself is relatively easy to kill if you focus it down.

pretty much. The power of the trait is very strong, but honestly i don’t think it needs to be nerfed because as you said its balanced through other methods, being very easy to counter and through the fact that if you trait down that line you lose almost all sources of sustain. The build works very well in decently skilled hands, especially against idiots, but it faulters very quickly against people who know what there doing.

I don’t really think basing any build to be balanced based on a limited-access boon is a good idea.

Basically the same argument as ghost thief being totally fine because people can reveal it. Although even the ghost thief really doesn’t have amazing kill pressure. It’s more or less just a PITA that gets people only when they literally run no bonus health and zero cleanses at all anywhere in their kits.

It may be “balanced” because sometimes it gets shut down, but the game really shouldn’t be Build Wars.

But that’s just me.

Normally I agree with you, but here I disagree. Ghost trapper thief and mistrust mesmer are not even in the same ballpark. For one, ghost thief is a problem because it breaks a fundamental game mechanic. It can damage you without breaking stealth. That’s just fundamentally broken which is why it needs to be addressed.

Secondly, while a reveal is the only way to go about fighting a ghost thief, you can easily fight a mistrust mesmer without stab. All stab does is completely shutdown any advantage mistrust may have given them. But even without it, you can still fight them. With ghost thief, if you don’t have a reveal you can’t fight them.

And even if you disagree that stab is merely an advantage against mistrust mesmer and believe that its required, consider the fact that every single class has access to stab. The access is not great on some classes, and it does require sacrificing a much stronger skill or line, but each class has access to stab. However only 3 classes have access to a reveal skill that doesn’t require a target to cast (AKA the only 3 that work on someone already in stealth), and of those 3 skills, 1 of them is a trap that the thief would have to wander through in order to trigger. So even if you believe that stab is a necessity to fight mistrust mesmer, you can’t deny that at least all classes have access to that, whereas really only 2 classes have meaningful access to an AoE reveal that would be needed to deal with ghost thief.

Hoo boy. I’m not sure if I call it big burst but when it stalks you.. it’s fully in your face, pray you have teleports/condi cleanses or can stalemate it on guard/warri/equally built thief…

…D/D condi evade thief. Can’t seem to land a hit unless you got eagle eyes with those evade frames/animations or have good ping.

it can dance around keyboard faceroll 1v3+ and be annoying as all heck. A very sadistic build.

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

This is another one of my favorites, when the stars aligned oh so well.
The fact that they were super clumped and spamming skills probably helped as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3WuA7mTHK0

It’s the randomness of Mistrust that makes it so entertaining at times. However, Mantra of Distraction on a downed player is a reliable way to get ~20 stacks of confusion on ressers from range whilst minimising the actual CC time. And obviously Tides of Time with its no target limit just creates utter chaos at times…as you you show in your videos.

However only 3 classes have access to a reveal skill that doesn’t require a target to cast (AKA the only 3 that work on someone already in stealth), and of those 3 skills, 1 of them is a trap that the thief would have to wander through in order to trigger. So even if you believe that stab is a necessity to fight mistrust mesmer, you can’t deny that at least all classes have access to that, whereas really only 2 classes have meaningful access to an AoE reveal that would be needed to deal with ghost thief.

5 of the 9 classes have access to aoe reveal, because warrior and ranger have access to taunt. No, it isn’t used much. No, it isn’t part of the meta, but the meta needs to change. It wrecks the kitten out of ghost thieves.

You have to channel the purity of purpose and blast those light fields.

AngryGrump.5863:

However only 3 classes have access to a reveal skill that doesn’t require a target to cast (AKA the only 3 that work on someone already in stealth), and of those 3 skills, 1 of them is a trap that the thief would have to wander through in order to trigger. So even if you believe that stab is a necessity to fight mistrust mesmer, you can’t deny that at least all classes have access to that, whereas really only 2 classes have meaningful access to an AoE reveal that would be needed to deal with ghost thief.

5 of the 9 classes have access to aoe reveal, because warrior and ranger have access to taunt. No, it isn’t used much. No, it isn’t part of the meta, but the meta needs to change. It wrecks the kitten out of ghost thieves.

Ranger already has a reveal they do not need taunt too. Forced Engagement is zerker only and on a 180 ranged. If you can hit a ghost thf with that that player should not be playing as a ghost thf lol.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Taunt
3 classes 2 classes have it aoe.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Revealed
5 class 3 carry over with taunt and reveal.

There is a big gap between classes who can counter stealth and who cant.

AngryGrump.5863:

However only 3 classes have access to a reveal skill that doesn’t require a target to cast (AKA the only 3 that work on someone already in stealth), and of those 3 skills, 1 of them is a trap that the thief would have to wander through in order to trigger. So even if you believe that stab is a necessity to fight mistrust mesmer, you can’t deny that at least all classes have access to that, whereas really only 2 classes have meaningful access to an AoE reveal that would be needed to deal with ghost thief.

5 of the 9 classes have access to aoe reveal, because warrior and ranger have access to taunt. No, it isn’t used much. No, it isn’t part of the meta, but the meta needs to change. It wrecks the kitten out of ghost thieves.

Like jski said, your numbers are misleading. 1 of the 4 (if you check the wiki, only 4 classes even have access to taunt) classes with access to Taunt is Rev, who is one of the 2 classes with AoE reveal skills. A second class with access to Taunt is mesmer, whose only access involves mirroring taunt back at the source on a 60 sec CD (among every other form of CC, so the chances of it actually reflecting taunt are slim in the first place), but since thieves don’t have access to taunt, mesmers can’t mirror it back to them, so for the purpose of fighting the ghost trapper thief, this doesn’t do anything. So we are down to 2 classes with access to taunt that don’t have access to AoE stealth.

Of those 2 remaining classes, the taunts are small sized AoEs (180 units for the Berserker). Even if you want to run with this though, this leaves 4 out of 9 classes with either a meaningful AoE reveal or an AoE taunt. And 3 of those 4 skills are very small AoEs.

So again I reiterate my above point. Every class has access to stab in some form, which is not even necessary to fight mistrust mesmer, it just completely shuts down mistrust and makes it useless. Only 4 classes out of 9 have a reveal or taunt, of which 75% of the skills are very small AoEs that the ghost thief can easily avoid while still dealing damage without breaking stealth. And you can’’t fight something you can’t see.

Ghost thief breaks fundamental game mechanics and cannot be fought by 5 of the 9 classes at all. The 4 that can fight it don’t have the tools to force it out of stealth if it doesn’t want to be forced out. These two builds are just not comparable whatsoever.

The thief has no condi burst on that scale. Necro has a couple options. Even Condi Chrono cannot drop a player that fast unless the enemy keeps activating skills with Confusion on. It takes a massive amount of condi to kill a player in three ticks.

I think a lot of players dying to a condi thief that fast are falling prey to Sigil of Draining and Impacting Disruption which are very much L2P issues. Otherwise it is more than one attacker focusing which easily happens with power as well.

This isn’t an issue of dying to a ghost thief. Its a problem of it breaking a fundamental game mechanic. You should not be able to damage people without breaking stealth. Period.

Mesmer also deals damage while stealthed, Ori. Clone and Phantasm attacks do not reveal stealthed mesmers, and scepter clones apply torment on AA. In the frames where it decides to try and drop a bomb, it can just Distort during its bomb for invulnerability while hitting Chronophantasma to keep the clones up. Core isn’t as bad as ghost thief in terms of being able to attack with relative impunity, but it does provide much more damage potential than ghost thief.

In general, stealth-chaining and dealing damage while being immune to damage really need to be cut back on. Gameplay is very passive and all about defenses at this point.

The new phantasm skill changes make it harder for mesmers to remain stealthed while summoning a phantasm. And I disagree that the mesmer deals damage while being stealthed. The illusions applying the damage are in plain sight the entire time. You are free to destroy them, you always know where they are, you can use LoS to keep their attacks from landing. No damage is being done from stealth. Whereas with ghost thief it is.

And I also want torment removed from ether bolt regardless, as I think its bullkitten a clone attack is applying it.

BLAST
LIGHT FIELDS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj9WbKSfbao
BLAST THEM

It’s kind of hilarious that they buffed reaper, thieves and Mesmer condi builds but abitrarily nerfed ranger’s sharpened edges by 50%.

Garfried.7295:

BLAST
LIGHT FIELDS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj9WbKSfbao
BLAST THEM

Hahaha saw that too, condi meta is so dumb.

DeceiverX.8361:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

OriOri.8724:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

Simonoly.4352:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

pretty much. its easiest to do actually when theres more people around, more rupts=more confusion. its a great build for yolos but…. its very easily killable and stab does a lot of negative things to builds running mistrust.
however. when it works it works well.

Which, if you think about it, is great balance for the trait and builds that rely on it. It has a clear counter through stab, but if it isn’t countered it can be absolutely devastating. However, that is tempered by the fact that the build itself is relatively easy to kill if you focus it down.

pretty much. The power of the trait is very strong, but honestly i don’t think it needs to be nerfed because as you said its balanced through other methods, being very easy to counter and through the fact that if you trait down that line you lose almost all sources of sustain. The build works very well in decently skilled hands, especially against idiots, but it faulters very quickly against people who know what there doing.

I don’t really think basing any build to be balanced based on a limited-access boon is a good idea.

Basically the same argument as ghost thief being totally fine because people can reveal it. Although even the ghost thief really doesn’t have amazing kill pressure. It’s more or less just a PITA that gets people only when they literally run no bonus health and zero cleanses at all anywhere in their kits.

It may be “balanced” because sometimes it gets shut down, but the game really shouldn’t be Build Wars.

But that’s just me.

IKR. It’s just downright crazy talk to plan out your build and have a strategy!!!

Stinking strategists!

Those stinking strategists can’t out plan my metabattle build, IT’S ON METABATTLE!!!!

you guys just need to blast more light fields.

Aitadis.8269:

you guys just need to blast more light fields.

So I don’t pay attention much and play sparingly these days, I’m assuming this is an inside joke or some dev said it in a post?

This can’t possibly be their “fix” for the condi meta right?

They never said it was a fix for the condi meta. People are just assuming that this is what the Devs intended it to be since they also buffed condis. I just happen to think that Devs don’t consider condis a problem since they expect everyone to be running around with perma resistance honestly (which is equally broken).

“… the addition of condition clears when blasting light fields was made in part to help combat Epidemic and area condition spikes.”

Pancake.3092:

“… the addition of condition clears when blasting light fields was made in part to help combat Epidemic and area condition spikes.”

You got to always watch for epidemic on wvw doors.
That about headspinning as it comes dev. having no ideal what they are talking about i realty wish that thread did not get close.

Pancake.3092:

“… the addition of condition clears when blasting light fields was made in part to help combat Epidemic and area condition spikes.”

Ah I missed that reply in the thread.

Blasting fields is so hard. I don’t have motivation check what skills are blast finishers.

I only have access to one blast every 20 seconds… What about you BOYYYSSSS?

Garfried.7295:

BLAST
LIGHT FIELDS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj9WbKSfbao
BLAST THEM

SURVIVE

/15survives

Garfried.7295:

BLAST
LIGHT FIELDS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj9WbKSfbao
BLAST THEM

So they outplayed your team like kitten and still only you did go down. Seems to me that epidemic needs boost.

Swagger.1459:

So wait… I’ve been doing it wrong by asking the devs to actually come up with a different ruleset for soft condis and hard cc? So that must mean I was also wrong asking for condi damage to be offset by a core character stat and improve condi clears too?

The light fields… all makes sense now in gw2… blast the light fields…

Mind is blown

As a condi necro, it’s very challenging getting all my condi stacked and keeping it on and stacked with a lot of condi clear in game. I don’t understand how anyone could think there is inadequate condi clear to counter conditions.

Now, a class that can do damage in stealth and stay in stealth and keep damaging and doing condition damage in stealth, that’s a whole other story.

Electra.7530:

Swagger.1459:

So wait… I’ve been doing it wrong by asking the devs to actually come up with a different ruleset for soft condis and hard cc? So that must mean I was also wrong asking for condi damage to be offset by a core character stat and improve condi clears too?

The light fields… all makes sense now in gw2… blast the light fields…

Mind is blown

As a condi necro, it’s very challenging getting all my condi stacked and keeping it on and stacked with a lot of condi clear in game. I don’t understand how anyone could think there is inadequate condi clear to counter conditions.

Now, a class that can do damage in stealth and stay in stealth and keep damaging and doing condition damage in stealth, that’s a whole other story.

Wen you can get 45 stacks of bleed, 25 stacks of poison, 10 stacks of Torment, 8 stacks of Vulnerability,and burning from one NECRO in 2 seconds, it is not underpowered, it is OP.

A necro alone can’t do this though.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

A necro alone can’t do this though.

But several can. Always bring frands.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

A necro alone can’t do this though.

Reaper shoud 5 into 4 is nearly 20ish stacks of bleed on its own. If the reaper can get some one else frost field they do do it more. If they are all in shouts they can push it even more (chill on shouts) and with frost auras from the elite shout / leaping though there own frost field is all the more. Then that one reaper can epi its own bleeds to other ppl. If this was real life every thing would be cover in blood all the time with all the dam bleeds necor / reaper can pull off now.

I know what a reaper can do and that deadly chill is pretty op atm. Doesn’t change the fact that reapers can’t do what Dusty Moon was claiming. Shroud 5 + 4 alone takes 4s to execute, taking reaper rune results in a loss in condition dmg and duration and blowing shouts for dmg means, the necro won’t have any defense left.

Siphon.8405:

DeceiverX.8361:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

OriOri.8724:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

Simonoly.4352:

Blades Of Fatalis.1279:

admittedly this is pre patch but… If only this guy had had a light field, maybe then he would of been saved: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmfp92Y_UtU&feature=youtu.be

Oh my. Those few times where the stars align and Mistrust goes absolutely mad…

pretty much. its easiest to do actually when theres more people around, more rupts=more confusion. its a great build for yolos but…. its very easily killable and stab does a lot of negative things to builds running mistrust.
however. when it works it works well.

Which, if you think about it, is great balance for the trait and builds that rely on it. It has a clear counter through stab, but if it isn’t countered it can be absolutely devastating. However, that is tempered by the fact that the build itself is relatively easy to kill if you focus it down.

pretty much. The power of the trait is very strong, but honestly i don’t think it needs to be nerfed because as you said its balanced through other methods, being very easy to counter and through the fact that if you trait down that line you lose almost all sources of sustain. The build works very well in decently skilled hands, especially against idiots, but it faulters very quickly against people who know what there doing.

I don’t really think basing any build to be balanced based on a limited-access boon is a good idea.

Basically the same argument as ghost thief being totally fine because people can reveal it. Although even the ghost thief really doesn’t have amazing kill pressure. It’s more or less just a PITA that gets people only when they literally run no bonus health and zero cleanses at all anywhere in their kits.

It may be “balanced” because sometimes it gets shut down, but the game really shouldn’t be Build Wars.

But that’s just me.

IKR. It’s just downright crazy talk to plan out your build and have a strategy!!!

Stinking strategists!

Those stinking strategists can’t out plan my metabattle build, IT’S ON METABATTLE!!!!

The fact that these builds get answered by a consumable item that requires a resource that’s used elsewhere kind of suggests poor design.

It might be a strategy, but it doesn’t change the fact it’s busted. Basically like letting chess players start with whatever kinds of pieces they want anywhere before the game begins.