Guild Wars 2

although this change would effect all game modes, it would impact wvw the most, and my inspiration to nerf was aimed at improving wvw. people would still be able to stack -condi duration and achieve decent results.

from 100% condi immunity
to condis expire 30% faster
edit
or
you are immune to all damaging condis
edit

resistance has turned wvw into a boon spam fest and the old system of locking a group down with immob is completely gone. watching gvgs, people just run around with no fear of getting spiked. there is no skill anymore, its a boring unending ktrain of mindless skill spam with the occasional water blast. I’m all for giving resistance to more classes and increasing the duration a bit on some skills, but what we have right now is an absolute degradation of skilled play.

It might be better to limit it to only negating the effects of conditions wrather than also the dmg.

Resistance is important for the health of wvw. If anything needs to be nerfed it is conditions over all. Resistance is one of the few things that semi help fight the condition cancer.

xikira.3264:

Resistance is important for the health of wvw. If anything needs to be nerfed it is conditions over all. Resistance is one of the few things that semi help fight the condition cancer.

2 sides to every argument. I’d also argue that the current condition meta is a result of zergs running super tanky, forcing power setups into redundancy. It is the only counter to it. If you nerf condi, then nothing will stop tank/sustain meta.

xikira.3264:

Resistance is important for the health of wvw. If anything needs to be nerfed it is conditions over all. Resistance is one of the few things that semi help fight the condition cancer.

I firmly believe that resistance being so incredibly OP is part of the reason why ANet hasn’t reduced the condi spam of some builds. Because otherwise they wouldn’t even be able to tickle a person with resistance. But I do want to see both aspects nerfed simultaneously.

As for resistance, I think it would be fine if it just negated damage from condis and not all effects. Secondary effect, especially movement impairing effects, should continue to effect you even if you have resistance. And then nerf the access to resistance of a few classes, but only slightly. Small shaves like 0.5 or 1 sec less duration on a few skills.

counter to resistance is sigil of absorption it steal resistance over any other boon has 0 internal CD

Nerf both.

~ Kovu

Nerf dmg condi and epi first.

Lets take a bite outa power creep! That’s my motto!
Make wvw great again! Yarrr!

Are you kidding? I just ran with a zerg during reset and the other zergs ran condi necros or whatever, without it or cleanses, you melt in seconds to conditions

Lahmia.2193:

xikira.3264:

Resistance is important for the health of wvw. If anything needs to be nerfed it is conditions over all. Resistance is one of the few things that semi help fight the condition cancer.

2 sides to every argument. I’d also argue that the current condition meta is a result of zergs running super tanky, forcing power setups into redundancy. It is the only counter to it. If you nerf condi, then nothing will stop tank/sustain meta.

no, it isn’t. The condi meta is the result of easy mode. Load your opponent(s) up with condi and run around like a chicken with your head cut off while condi dmg ticks away. Has nothing to do with tank setups.

Condi is easy mode, and as we all know, people like the best results with the least amount of effort.

Taobella.6597:

counter to resistance is sigil of absorption it steal resistance over any other boon has 0 internal CD

Resistance is too powerful to be a boon plain and simple. Total immunity to both condi damage and secondary effects from condis is absolutely ridiculous to have on a boon, where you can double the duration of the effect through concentration.

Lol..nerf resistance..and let condi bomb power creep ruin wvw also…after pvp…no ty

It should only stop condi dmg soft cc counter should be -% duration. So more -100% or -66% soft cc effects when doing something or in a short time fram for classes.
All though condi needs more of a counter then one boon unless your going to give it to all the classes in one way or another much like stab is something all classes can use (some better then others but all classes have some type of stab). Maybe do it like effects that stun brake and give you stab but on the lines of clear condis and give you resistance (that only effects condi dmg keep this in mind a boon that cover every thing is way too much in a game like this).
So for ele i say make burning fire, water signet (on use) and maybe dimon skin (when broken) give say 2 to 3 sec of resistance. I cant realty say how you do this for other classes who do not have any resistance atm but ele is a good gen class where you can start to make resistance more like stab in both foces of a counter and to spread it out so one class rev (maybe mez but not realty) is not so dam important that its importable to play wvw with out them.

mulzi.8273:

Lahmia.2193:

xikira.3264:

Resistance is important for the health of wvw. If anything needs to be nerfed it is conditions over all. Resistance is one of the few things that semi help fight the condition cancer.

2 sides to every argument. I’d also argue that the current condition meta is a result of zergs running super tanky, forcing power setups into redundancy. It is the only counter to it. If you nerf condi, then nothing will stop tank/sustain meta.

no, it isn’t. The condi meta is the result of easy mode. Load your opponent(s) up with condi and run around like a chicken with your head cut off while condi dmg ticks away. Has nothing to do with tank setups.

Condi is easy mode, and as we all know, people like the best results with the least amount of effort.

Then why is it that condi has become so much worse recently, when condi has been as good as it has ever been for a while now?

I’ve always thought that resistance should only reduce condition damage by 33-50% but it should be as ubiquitous as protection.

WOW – people are that clueless? As others have said, Resistance is the only thing besides clears which can even deal with the mega-condi that blobs use. If you think resistance is too strong, go into T1 and try to even fight a Maguuma blob. The condi is SO OP, that resistance does nothing. Even with resist, the amount of condi’s stacked is massive – Poison, burn, bleed, confusion, torment, etc. ALL OF THEM AT ONCE and the cleanses only take off one or two at a time. Resist is the only thing letting people live for longer than 2 seconds. Resist was already nerfed once.

NERF condi or make sure the AoE condi cannot be stacked on top of each other.

Most blobs are running Trailblazer(toughness, condi, vital, and expertise). This means high toughness and vitality (which really negates power builds). There is no armor/weapon stat that negates condi. If there was, then Resistance would be OP. As it is now, there is nothing so it is not OP.

@Dusty Moon – Just because condi output is broken doesn’t mean that resistance isn’t fundamentally broken either.

OriOri.8724:

@Dusty Moon – Just because condi output is broken doesn’t mean that resistance isn’t fundamentally broken either.

If both are broken..then nothing really is..except your own bias decides, if resistance is nerfed…so will be condi dmg and when both get downgraded, their relation will remain the same and all you would have accomplished is..nothing

Supreme.3164:

OriOri.8724:

@Dusty Moon – Just because condi output is broken doesn’t mean that resistance isn’t fundamentally broken either.

If both are broken..then nothing really is..except your own bias decides, if resistance is nerfed…so will be condi dmg and when both get downgraded, their relation will remain the same and all you would have accomplished is..nothing

This is so incredibly wrong.

OriOri.8724:

Supreme.3164:

OriOri.8724:

@Dusty Moon – Just because condi output is broken doesn’t mean that resistance isn’t fundamentally broken either.

If both are broken..then nothing really is..except your own bias decides, if resistance is nerfed…so will be condi dmg and when both get downgraded, their relation will remain the same and all you would have accomplished is..nothing

This is so incredibly wrong.

No! Condi’s are so strong that there IS ONLY ONE way to deal with them – RESISTANCE. Condi clears only do one or two and then they only clear is a certain way (basically First in, last out). So, if burning, confusion, bleed, poison, and Vulnerability are applied in that order, then they will come off as Vuln, posion, bleed, Confusion and burning. that is the issue, there is not enough condi clear as compared to condis as they can be reapplied almost immediately while one has to wait for the skill recharge for clearing.

Most players in WvW do not use condi clear as it takes away from damage. Condi to boon works in the same way as condi clear.

Dusty Moon.4382:

OriOri.8724:

Supreme.3164:

OriOri.8724:

@Dusty Moon – Just because condi output is broken doesn’t mean that resistance isn’t fundamentally broken either.

If both are broken..then nothing really is..except your own bias decides, if resistance is nerfed…so will be condi dmg and when both get downgraded, their relation will remain the same and all you would have accomplished is..nothing

This is so incredibly wrong.

No! Condi’s are so strong that there IS ONLY ONE way to deal with them – RESISTANCE. Condi clears only do one or two and then they only clear is a certain way (basically First in, last out). So, if burning, confusion, bleed, poison, and Vulnerability are applied in that order, then they will come off as Vuln, posion, bleed, Confusion and burning. that is the issue, there is not enough condi clear as compared to condis as they can be reapplied almost immediately while one has to wait for the skill recharge for clearing.

Most players in WvW do not use condi clear as it takes away from damage. Condi to boon works in the same way as condi clear.

If you would read my replies in this very thread, you would see that I want both condi spam and resistance nerfed. Not just one or the other. Either way, this doesn’t change the fact that Resistance is way too powerful to be a boon. If its effect isn’t changed then it needs to be turned into an effect, so that concentration doesn’t increase its duration.

As to your comment about people not taking condi clears because it lowers their damage………….. seriously? You want people to be able to ignore condis with a broken boon simply because they can’t be bothered to have a build that can clear condis? Building for maximum damage at the expense of condi clears is a build choice. To be able to completely overcome that shortcoming and weakness of the build via a single boon completely ignores balance. If you want to not have any condi clears thats perfectly fine. But that does not in any way mean that condi’s shouldn’t be dangerous to your build. In fact it means the opposite really.

Dusty Moon.4382:

WOW – people are that clueless? As others have said, Resistance is the only thing besides clears which can even deal with the mega-condi that blobs use. If you think resistance is too strong, go into T1 and try to even fight a Maguuma blob. The condi is SO OP, that resistance does nothing. Even with resist, the amount of condi’s stacked is massive – Poison, burn, bleed, confusion, torment, etc. ALL OF THEM AT ONCE and the cleanses only take off one or two at a time. Resist is the only thing letting people live for longer than 2 seconds. Resist was already nerfed once.

NERF condi or make sure the AoE condi cannot be stacked on top of each other.

Most blobs are running Trailblazer(toughness, condi, vital, and expertise). This means high toughness and vitality (which really negates power builds). There is no armor/weapon stat that negates condi. If there was, then Resistance would be OP. As it is now, there is nothing so it is not OP.

Why not just add resistance to some condi clear much like how some stun brakes have stab on them. That and add resistance to all classes like stab is on all classes.

Dusty Moon.4382:

So, if burning, confusion, bleed, poison, and Vulnerability are applied in that order, then they will come off as Vuln, posion, bleed, Confusion and burning. that is the issue, there is not enough condi clear as compared to condis as they can be reapplied almost immediately while one has to wait for the skill recharge for clearing.

Most players in WvW do not use condi clear as it takes away from damage. Condi to boon works in the same way as condi clear.

This is part of what really makes me think resi is bad gamedesign. If you have suddenly that much condis on you, you ate a burst and now we are at a point where folks come to the forums and instead of thinking, “hey maybe i should have dodged that. may someone tell me what hit me and how it is telegraphed?” they defend a button that can be pressed afterwards to completly nullify their misplay. And as far as i know skills that do high condidmg have a higher cd than powerbursts in general so one could argue if that mechanic encourages misplays. Not pointing out things that have been said in this threat or older ones like lack of counterplay on most classes and stuff.

The only class that needs a nerf is warrior. It’s bad enough that they have a stance that resist conditions and are able to remove them using burst skills. Now with berserker they can remove them even faster and have resistance on their signet. Its ridiculous. No point in fighting a warrior with conditions anymore. As always, good kittening job bringing balance to guild wars anet.

Keefe.3821:

The only class that needs a nerf is warrior. It’s bad enough that they have a stance that resist conditions and are able to remove them using burst skills. Now with berserker they can remove them even faster and have resistance on their signet. Its ridiculous. No point in fighting a warrior with conditions anymore. As always, good kittening job bringing balance to guild wars anet.

Obviously you play Necro.

If you want to nerf resistance, then there’ll have to be a major nerf inbound for conditions as well.

Even if the path of “only negates damaging conditions” is taken, a massive cut to the chill and fear flying around is happening for sure. Moreover, removing those impairment conditions shouldn’t be prevented by the damaging conditions, so you may be looking at retweaking resistance to prevent application of damaging conditions.

I’m good with the idea of preventing stacking, or anything to prevent massive uptime of resistance (as in+50% of the time), but making it cut condi duration by some amount will, again, warrant some major nerfs to conditions (which are stronger now than ever).

That said, I think Anet’s hope is that boon theft, corruption, etc. is the counterplay for resistance. While it’s true that some classes don’t have access to that, the major condi classes do.

OriOri.8724:

Dusty Moon.4382:

OriOri.8724:

Supreme.3164:

OriOri.8724:

@Dusty Moon – Just because condi output is broken doesn’t mean that resistance isn’t fundamentally broken either.

If both are broken..then nothing really is..except your own bias decides, if resistance is nerfed…so will be condi dmg and when both get downgraded, their relation will remain the same and all you would have accomplished is..nothing

This is so incredibly wrong.

No! Condi’s are so strong that there IS ONLY ONE way to deal with them – RESISTANCE. Condi clears only do one or two and then they only clear is a certain way (basically First in, last out). So, if burning, confusion, bleed, poison, and Vulnerability are applied in that order, then they will come off as Vuln, posion, bleed, Confusion and burning. that is the issue, there is not enough condi clear as compared to condis as they can be reapplied almost immediately while one has to wait for the skill recharge for clearing.

Most players in WvW do not use condi clear as it takes away from damage. Condi to boon works in the same way as condi clear.

If you would read my replies in this very thread, you would see that I want both condi spam and resistance nerfed. Not just one or the other. Either way, this doesn’t change the fact that Resistance is way too powerful to be a boon. If its effect isn’t changed then it needs to be turned into an effect, so that concentration doesn’t increase its duration.

As to your comment about people not taking condi clears because it lowers their damage………….. seriously? You want people to be able to ignore condis with a broken boon simply because they can’t be bothered to have a build that can clear condis? Building for maximum damage at the expense of condi clears is a build choice. To be able to completely overcome that shortcoming and weakness of the build via a single boon completely ignores balance. If you want to not have any condi clears thats perfectly fine. But that does not in any way mean that condi’s shouldn’t be dangerous to your build. In fact it means the opposite really.

Also, it’s not like we can consistently apply resistence at the broken rate of the insane amount of condi that can be applied, especially with condi duration increase and stuff

Someone suggested changes to resistance : resistance doesn’t negate applied condition effect, but prevents further condition application. I think that was a not so bad idea.

Everytime you take one step within 1200 range of an enemy zerg, you get 5+ condis. Literally. It can be an obvious bomb or it can just come out of nowhere. And its always an eternity of chill or cripple, 20+ seconds of bleed/torment/poision/etc stacks.

If you removed resistance, we would be back to 80% ranged pirateshipping zergs because no one can get close.

That said, I dont really mind. I liked pirateshipping. I could dress up like a pirate and go yarrrr much more often. Nowadays the yarrrr sound you make is from laying on the ground having a stroke, cancer, aids, ebola, diarrhea, diabetes and malaria all at the same time.

Dawdler.8521:

Everytime you take one step within 1200 range of an enemy zerg, you get 5+ condis. Literally.

Sure if you play eyes closed like Wvw players usually do.

ThomasC.1056:

Someone suggested changes to resistance : resistance doesn’t negate applied condition effect, but prevents further condition application. I think that was a not so bad idea.

So pretty much the previous incarnation of Berserker Stance and Diamond Skin. Rev Demon stance would need a bit of tweaking but it could work.

He may be from NA. Players there aren’t aware of anything.

ThomasC.1056:

Someone suggested changes to resistance : resistance doesn’t negate applied condition effect, but prevents further condition application. I think that was a not so bad idea.

if only they tone down condi before doing that ty

ThunderPanda.1872:

ThomasC.1056:

Someone suggested changes to resistance : resistance doesn’t negate applied condition effect, but prevents further condition application. I think that was a not so bad idea.

if only they tone down condi before doing that ty

make condition not working in pvp/pve? if isnt easy to play or effortless isnt balanced, that is what gw2 is about, most gw2 hate effort.

Just make resistance like protection: 33% reduced effectiveness. They can balance the quantity of resistance later. But this makes resistance not godlike, but still very useful when you can get it.

Zintrothen.1056:

Just make resistance like protection: 33% reduced effectiveness. They can balance the quantity of resistance later. But this makes resistance not godlike, but still very useful when you can get it.

Well for that to work Anet should need to reduce the condi spamming, and make the best way to spread condis via epidemic tactics, issue is both Anet and players want to aoe condi with epidemic and with any other stacking casts.

Players affected by epidemic should get a extra condi sayign that they were epidemic targeted while those conditions are in efffect player will get reduced condi passed to them, still this would make more calculations needed server side, wich is what is killign the servers already…

best way is to make game far more simple and direct, more 1 to 1 skill designed combat that could even reduce the lag in wvw… but that would kill the pve carrieness that this game is about (aoe/cleave spammage).

Zintrothen.1056:

Just make resistance like protection: 33% reduced effectiveness. They can balance the quantity of resistance later. But this makes resistance not godlike, but still very useful when you can get it.

Except resistance isn’t godlike now. Sure, some changes seem to be in order, especially in large scale wvw, but having it work like protection would have to come with substantial nerfs to condi application, duration, damage, and effect.

Really easy to corrupt. It’s the first thing to go. It’s a L2P issue

jamesdolla.3954:

Really easy to corrupt. It’s the first thing to go. It’s a L2P issue

Not every class has corrupt the problem with resistance is 2 fold its hard to get and it effects soft cc.
Resistance needs to act more like a dmg -% for condi and by being weak needs to be on a lot more skills and all the classes.
As for counter soft cc there needs to be more temp leaps or even time farms where you cant be effect by soft cc out side of boons.

I can dodge twice, I can remove two to four conditions on me, then wait for things to come off cooldown and for my stamina to return.

Tell me how many stacks of what condition, can you all apply in what timeframe, and how far apart are the applications?

Sure, there are condition bursts and conditions that are just passively put on, some are in more need than others to be dodged or to be cleansed, but the fact of the matter is, that defenses against conditions damage, and application, are severely limited when compared to the gross amount of both active and passive condition application.

You can have conditions ticking for 5k to 7k on you, cleanse them or dodge your choice. But wait, what’s that? Ohh, those conditions you just cleansed off or dodged out of, are back, a few seconds later. Quick let me cleanse those, nope, 8 seconds more on my shortest cd clear, I just used my heal, and dead…

There’s a reason why condition builds are seen as cancer, or cheese. Because they are the most hands off, lazy, passive builds out there. The effort of landing attacks or comboing is taken away, and replaced with passively applying a condition, to a single attack on a short cd, apply several conditions for 10+ seconds.

I’m not saying, there aren’t some pretty OP/Cancer power builds out there, but people defending condition builds as if they where fair and balanced, and took solid concentration and finesse to use, is just, ignorant.

this post was in hand with another I made.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Proposition-to-put-a-hard-cap-on-boons-condis/first
I didn’t mention damaging conditions back then cuz they weren’t a problem, but I think a hard cap on the stacks might be warranted. idk.

Stand The Wall.6987:

this post was in hand with another I made.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Proposition-to-put-a-hard-cap-on-boons-condis/first
I didn’t mention damaging conditions back then cuz they weren’t a problem, but I think a hard cap on the stacks might be warranted. idk.

Over all boons and condis needs to be re-looked at. Just adding in stacking of condis with out chasing any thing else in the game was a bit silly. At the same time adding in a boon that is an invariability to a type of dmg / effect was also silly.

How much per tick would be too much per condi. Burning should hit kind of hard torment and confusion should hit the hardest if there conditions are met. Bleed should be the avages but it needs something more then just dmg maybe a counter boon duration as if the boons are “bleeding away.” Poison hits way too hard for its added effect / condi dmg +% so it should be a low stack.

Really now? Resistance is the only defense against condi spam meta and believe me condi spam meta is boring as hell. It is cheesy and tanky at the same time. There are not enough condi cleanses in the game to prevent condition damage properly.

Someone said not every class has boon corrupt. But not every class has resistance either. Only revenant and some mesmer builds can give it properly(mes is bad though). So either corrupt or use null field for resistance problems.

alain.1659:

Really now? Resistance is the only defense against condi spam meta and believe me condi spam meta is boring as hell. It is cheesy and tanky at the same time. There are not enough condi cleanses in the game to prevent condition damage properly.

Someone said not every class has boon corrupt. But not every class has resistance either. Only revenant and some mesmer builds can give it properly(mes is bad though). So either corrupt or use null field for resistance problems.

Yup, without resistance it becomes a horror show out there in large scale fights. People just don’t understand what they’re asking for.

jamesdolla.3954:

alain.1659:

Really now? Resistance is the only defense against condi spam meta and believe me condi spam meta is boring as hell. It is cheesy and tanky at the same time. There are not enough condi cleanses in the game to prevent condition damage properly.

Someone said not every class has boon corrupt. But not every class has resistance either. Only revenant and some mesmer builds can give it properly(mes is bad though). So either corrupt or use null field for resistance problems.

Yup, without resistance it becomes a horror show out there in large scale fights. People just don’t understand what they’re asking for.

With out resistance wvw is unplayable atm its more important then having gear on. The thing is resistance is too much of an off and on switch for playing and condis are too much of a must have too. They both need nerf badly. Hell most of the lag in wvw now is because of condi spam and with out resistance the lag tends to be too much to be playable. Anet realty made a comply mess of things.

Condition in game needs to be reworked, no only as how it applies the damage but also the spamming.

But well Aney doesn’t want us to tell them how to fix their one game now, do they?

anduriell.6280:

Condition in game needs to be reworked, no only as how it applies the damage but also the spamming.

But well Aney doesn’t want us to tell them how to fix their one game now, do they?

Power need rework too. Makes me sick when power warriors spam gs skills. They should change game turn based combat.

Junkpile.7439:

anduriell.6280:

Condition in game needs to be reworked, no only as how it applies the damage but also the spamming.

But well Aney doesn’t want us to tell them how to fix their one game now, do they?

Power need rework too. Makes me sick when power warriors spam gs skills. They should change game turn based combat.

And a cover system. Dont forget that.

anduriell.6280:

Condition in game needs to be reworked, no only as how it applies the damage but also the spamming.

But well Aney doesn’t want us to tell them how to fix their one game now, do they?

I realy think we are more help the harm with getting info out there. Kind of “free” workers or many eyes and point of view. So say one dev can not see the full consequences of there buffs and nerfs because they are just one person but if you get your players to chime in about the buff / nerf and how it effects other things (and the devs are willing to lesson and act no devs on wvw forms sadly these days but a few) you can get some real good fixes going. This once a 3 month balance update is killing this game it needs to be much more often and more windows of hot fixes base off of the community talking.

Any way GW2 been going on for at least 5 years 7 if you count them working on it over all the devs are most likely bored with GW2 and what to work on something else. I mean have you been doing the same job same thing day in and out for 5+ years of your life and not been bored and in being so slacking off?