Guild Wars 2

like, i’m seriously wondering why anet continuously attempts to re-invent the wheel here. the current system is …how it was on core launch day? Minus the workers.

Not really. It isolates supply within structures from supply being used to upgrade. It also takes the upgrade process out of the hands of players, both for better or for worse.

On the one hand, it stops people from using alts to build troll siege in a keep to waste supply to prevent an upgrade.

On the other hand, it does take away a level of depth and strategy that comes with said resource management.

It probably wouldn’t be as big of an issue if F2P accounts and the absurdities that are guild upgrades weren’t in the mix.

DeceiverX.8361:

Not really. It isolates supply within structures from supply being used to upgrade. It also takes the upgrade process out of the hands of players, both for better or for worse.

On the one hand, it stops people from using alts to build troll siege in a keep to waste supply to prevent an upgrade.

On the other hand, it does take away a level of depth and strategy that comes with said resource management.

It probably wouldn’t be as big of an issue if F2P accounts and the absurdities that are guild upgrades weren’t in the mix.

that ‘issue’ has been present since launch, as there’s nothing you can do about people pressing f. as far as it stands, WVW has gone through three upgrade models in the last year, none of them working nearly as well as the original. as i stated, anet needs to stop trying to reinvent the wheel.

It was too easy to troll both making pointless rams and choosing bad upgrades.

Jski.6180:

It was too easy to troll both making pointless rams and choosing bad upgrades.

and now we have to wait for 40 dolyaks to arrive at a tower, and the supply sitting there does nothing.

Lightsbane.9012:

Jski.6180:

It was too easy to troll both making pointless rams and choosing bad upgrades.

and now we have to wait for 40 dolyaks to arrive at a tower, and the supply sitting there does nothing.

Not realy relevant to stopping ppl from trolling teams but i will bit. You can use the supply to upgrade it in your own way with siege there more then walls and npc you can work on. So that supply is sitting there doing nothing becuse your not doing any thing with it.

Jski.6180:

Lightsbane.9012:

Jski.6180:

It was too easy to troll both making pointless rams and choosing bad upgrades.

and now we have to wait for 40 dolyaks to arrive at a tower, and the supply sitting there does nothing.

Not realy relevant to stopping ppl from trolling teams but i will bit. You can use the supply to upgrade it in your own way with siege there more then walls and npc you can work on. So that supply is sitting there doing nothing becuse your not doing any thing with it.

Yup. At least if supplies are trolled the upgrade will continue unlike the old way. Plus now with guild buffs players can carry 25 supplies and they seem to go faster during primetime.

Lightsbane.9012:

like, i’m seriously wondering why anet continuously attempts to re-invent the wheel here. the current system is …how it was on core launch day? Minus the workers.

Hmm….

Lightsbane.9012:

Minus the workers.

Anet took dey’re jerbs!

Seriously – the current system is not that terrible. The main issue is that they just pulled a more or less random number added 0 and decided that is the desired number of dolyaks. The EB towers seriously suffer in new system.
Maybe the solution would be to keep a timer – as a sort of wind-up clock. And each dolly could make the upgrade timer “tick” for couple of minutes.

In the original one I really hated that a single troll or clueless new person could screw you up.
Like one time in our EB keep was running a wall upgrade with enough supply to finish. And then just when enemy zerg came someone bought merchants, effectively screwing us up.
And it’s not like there were many really viable tactics of upgrading stuff to make it count as tactic.

What I did like was that if you had supply inside – your stuff could get upgraded even during siege. It made defense and offense a lot more interesting when the objective was close to finish some upgrade.

Jski.6180:

It was too easy to troll both making pointless rams and choosing bad upgrades.

I was sort of laughed at for posting this to another thread but it really would fix the trolling problem and should seriously be considered.

Managing trolls is easy…

Post 1
NcSoft(Anet) needs to fix it where only guild members of a claimed structure can upgrade it. They also need to allow the members with appropriate permission to authorize certain players outside of the guild to do upgrades, also giving this player the permission to pass along his authority to upgrade the guilds structure to someone else when he logs off. This way a guild could approve several players they trust to handle upgrades and hence completely take trolls out of the picture. If implemented correctly ie… structures not claimed can be upgraded by anyone including trolls would encourage WvW’ers to start claiming structures as to prevent trolling. Often times many structures in WvW are not even claimed and that needs to be fixed and this solution addresses that and solves the trolling issues.

Post 2
Fix it to where a guild can take over a structure with the approval of say 3 other guilds permission. This needs to be done anyway. How many times have you wished that you could +5 your keep but can’t because its claimed and the guild that has it claimed has no one online. If a guild wants to take over a claimed structure they should be able to even if the current guild disagrees. Its just a matter of setting up a sort of map voting system to allow it or not, based on what the majority of players that vote want. Care needs to be taken in this implementation there are several ways that even this could be circumvented and cause problems but with proper implementation this issue is solvable. If it were me I would even go a step further and only allow guild members or approved non guild members to place siege in a structure. This helps with trolls that want to use up all of the supply or even noobs that are clueless about placing siege even tho their intentions are good. Guilds should also have the ability to disallow a certain player from taking supply from a structure they have claimed and this ability should also be included with any non members that have been given the permission to manage a guilds assets. Non guild members that have been give these permissions should retain this privilege and should be able to help with any structure this guild has claimed and the right to do this should be perpetual so it doesn’t have to be done every time a new structure is claimed. It would be easy in the guild window to setup a list of approved players that have the permission to help manage a guilds structures. Guilds also should be able to revoke this permission as they see fit.

Post 3
Yeah sounds complicated and from someone that maybe smoked too much weed. I have to say tho, if you stop and really think about this it isn’t that hard to implement. I can hear players yelling now wtf you took over my claimed tower and getting all huffy, but the WvW community isn’t all bimbo’s and this could work easier than it sounds if implemented correctly. Plus it solves several issues all at once… keeps no +5 and guild that has it isn’t online, trolls building siege and wasting keep supplies, structures not claimed because there is no direct responsibility placed on anyone(but with this change a guild truly is 100% responsible for the house keeping), troll guilds that claim stuff and then never upgrade it. The biggest issue in making it work is the map voting system but this could easily be implemented it just sounds weird, but with careful planning and implementation it would be easy and non-intrusive to game play.

To the point of the OP’er yes I think its silly they keep changing it when the original system was so much better and the dynamics and depth it brought to game play was much better and more fun!

Noob.5908:

Managing trolls is easy…

Post 1
NcSoft(Anet) needs to fix it where only guild members of a claimed structure can upgrade it. They also need to allow the members with appropriate permission to authorize certain players outside of the guild to do upgrades, also giving this player the permission to pass along his authority to upgrade the guilds structure to someone else when he logs off. This way a guild could approve several players they trust to handle upgrades and hence completely take trolls out of the picture. If implemented correctly ie… structures not claimed can be upgraded by anyone including trolls would encourage WvW’ers to start claiming structures as to prevent trolling. Often times many structures in WvW are not even claimed and that needs to be fixed and this solution addresses that and solves the trolling issues.

This would cause more problems than it could solve, what if every member of a guild left the borderland? What if there were no authorized members? What if it was a troll guild just there to kitten up your efforts?

Noob.5908:

Post 2
Fix it to where a guild can take over a structure with the approval of say 3 other guilds permission.

Guilds? You expect guilds to get more powers over WvW? Most of the upgrades on my server used to be paid for by pugs, with very little input from Guilds. On many borders you might not have authorized members of 3 guilds – you might be lucky to find one. There have been many occasions where I have seemingly been the only member of my world to be on home border.

Noob.5908:

To the point of the OP’er yes I think its silly they keep changing it when the original system was so much better and the dynamics and depth it brought to game play was much better and more fun!

The old system wasn’t better. It was different but that didn’t make it better. Even as it was presented the new system has considerable advantages, including individuals not having to pay for upgrades. There is now no reason to argue over which upgrade to do next and less opportunity for enemies to sabotage your efforts.

What is going on is fine tuning with feedback from the users for once. We complained that their new system had issues and suggested a way to fix it. Specifically we said the dolyaks had become unimportant because things upgraded anyway and therefore this automatic component should be removed. Anet duly removed the automatic component and now we will see if that fix works.

Actually, yes it does. Dolyaks are important again. Intercepting dolyaks once again will stop a target upgrading. There is still a teething issue in the guild mission capture and hold but that hopefully will be adjusted later, if needed.

The old system is gone and good riddance to it.