Guild Wars 2

I’ve been thinking. Living Story is a lot like game of thrones… in the sense that we are still waiting for dragons….

Except no one dies.

And when a doomsday scenario unfolds, everyone actually works together to prevent it.

What about the Moa racers that died? There’s a lot of people that miss Meep…

What both share is a fantasy universe, that’t it :P

Well, we already had our own Arya Stark in Gwen . . .

I doubt most people were watching GoT for the Dragons. Ahem.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Well, we already had our own Arya Stark in Gwen . . .

I still want to know the story behind “the Goremonger” title.

Erukk.1408:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Well, we already had our own Arya Stark in Gwen . . .

I still want to know the story behind “the Goremonger” title.

Probably because she was one of the few people who seriously was able to take on charr for most of her life and get away with it.

Possibly, but “Goremonger” seems to imply a degree of messiness involved though. I’m sure it the Charrs’ attempt of demonizing her, which I’m sure she would have loved, but they kinda made it sound like she liked to bathe in the blood of innocent cubs.

Now I have that imagine in my head. Lol

GW2 is exactly like game of thrones, except everything it offers.

This is how you create a game of thrones situation

1. Raise the stakes. Usually this is done by an overly dramatic, sadistic or honorful person
2. Two or more people make a plan to ensure a positive outcome
3. Somebody messes the plan up in a character defining moment
4. As a consequence somebody dies or you return to point 1 (flip a coin)
5. the events take us to a new place or result in new information
6. All is not as it seems. A new conflict is created. New characters may enter the stage
7. Return to point 1

This is how you create a GW2 situation

1. Someting spectacular happens in a new place (trailer material)
2. NPCs go watch, Players go watch, problem is created, new characters enter the stage
3. One Person makes a plan. Player will follow to the plan
4. A villain tries to get in the way. Players instantly deals with the problem
5. Mission is accomplished, the story is over here, no conclusion or further information
6. Players wait for point 1 to repeat.

The S1 Finale doesnt entirely follow the list – so this might greatly change in S2

My basketball playing is comparable to Michael Jordans,

yeah in my own fantasy world.

I still laugh when this game is compared to Game of Thrones. I think they have two things going for them in that comparison:

1. Fantasy World
2. Factions..

The story of the living world isn’t even in the same solar system of GoT. Just no.

Antara.3189:

My basketball playing is comparable to Michael Jordans,

yeah in my own fantasy world.

I still laugh when this game is compared to Game of Thrones. I think they have two things going for them in that comparison:

1. Fantasy World
2. Factions..

The story of the living world isn’t even in the same solar system of GoT. Just no.

The OP didn’t compare it quality wise to GoT. That was very clear from what they wrote.

Also, GoT isn’t in the same solar system as really decent fantasy writing (of which is almost impossible to find in this generation). It is well written/acted (tick per media form), but ultimately inconsequential and rather uninteresting soap opera.

Before anyone jumps on me for that comment… I’m not a fan of the GW2 season 1 story either, but I look forward to seeing the direction the go in this time around. Prophecies/Factions in GW1 were beyond woeful, but I enjoyed Nightfall and EOTN quite a lot, which shows they can learn lessons from previous story mistakes.

Wanderer.3248:

I doubt most people were watching GoT for the Dragons. Ahem.

Exactly, where’s the zombie army?! Keep teasing us but never delivering.

Randulf.7614:

Also, GoT isn’t in the same solar system as really decent fantasy writing (of which is almost impossible to find in this generation). It is well written/acted (tick per media form), but ultimately inconsequential and rather uninteresting soap opera.

Strangely, I disagree a bit. I agree “A Song of Ice and Fire” isn’t quite as strong as series which it was inspired by (Memory, Sorrow, and Thorn most notably). But probably due to the author killing off viewpoint characters more often.

The TV series is a decent enough adaptation of the books, though it diverged in Season 4 enough that I’d refer to it as its own entity.

Before anyone jumps on me for that comment… I’m not a fan of the GW2 season 1 story either, but I look forward to seeing the direction the go in this time around. Prophecies/Factions in GW1 were beyond woeful, but I enjoyed Nightfall and EOTN quite a lot, which shows they can learn lessons from previous story mistakes.

You. I like you for this comment here. It pretty much parallels my reaction to GW1 as far as story goes.

CureForLiving.5360:

Wanderer.3248:

I doubt most people were watching GoT for the Dragons. Ahem.

Exactly, where’s the zombie army?! Keep teasing us but never delivering.

They moved to “The Walking Dead” for the benefits.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

CureForLiving.5360:

Wanderer.3248:

I doubt most people were watching GoT for the Dragons. Ahem.

Exactly, where’s the zombie army?! Keep teasing us but never delivering.

They moved to “The Walking Dead” for the benefits.

Will be waiting for the Walking Dead references when we get back to Elona

Its nothing like game of thrones, silly comparison…

Game of Thrones story was written by one of the best authors of fantasy currently alive on planet Earth.

No story in any video game could ever compete…

Sarathiel.6374:

I’ve been thinking. Living Story is a lot like game of thrones… in the sense that we are still waiting for dragons….

NOPE

This game story is terrible, the characters are bland, no one dies, and everyone hated Scarlet for ALL THE WRONGS REASONS.

This story isn’t even close to Game of Thrones, that comment deserved a face slap.

Meglobob.8620:

Its nothing like game of thrones, silly comparison…

Game of Thrones story was written by one of the best authors of fantasy currently alive on planet Earth.

No story in any video game could ever compete…

Yes, there are at least a few which can compare. Try looking up Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne. Also strong is ‘Okami’, but that’s a different animal.

Soulstar.7812:

Sarathiel.6374:

I’ve been thinking. Living Story is a lot like game of thrones… in the sense that we are still waiting for dragons….

NOPE

This game story is terrible, the characters are bland, no one dies, and everyone hated Scarlet for ALL THE WRONGS REASONS.

This story isn’t even close to Game of Thrones, that comment deserved a face slap.

Please, everyone hated people in Game of Thrones for all the wrong reasons too

. . . and I still don’t think people hated Jaime enough . . .

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Soulstar.7812:

Sarathiel.6374:

I’ve been thinking. Living Story is a lot like game of thrones… in the sense that we are still waiting for dragons….

NOPE

This game story is terrible, the characters are bland, no one dies, and everyone hated Scarlet for ALL THE WRONGS REASONS.

This story isn’t even close to Game of Thrones, that comment deserved a face slap.

Please, everyone hated people in Game of Thrones for all the wrong reasons too

. . . and I still don’t think people hated Jaime enough . . .

In Game of Thrones the audience hated the villains because the were villains.
In GW2, everyone hates Scarlet because she was obnoxious pest, A-Net tried to pass off as a villain. If GW2 was a tv show it would have been cancelled faster than Firefly.

Soulstar.7812:

In Game of Thrones the audience hated the villains because the were villains.
In GW2, everyone hates Scarlet because she was obnoxious pest, A-Net tried to pass off as a villain. If GW2 was a tv show it would have been cancelled faster than Firefly.

No, they hated Sansa because she was dumb as a post for most of season one. They hated Catelyn Stark for being basically the one person who kept things getting worse who wasn’t doing anything. (Not that this is much different from how readers feel about her.) And they hate Ser Allister Thorne because he’s abrasive. I’d say S4E9 probably showed why people like him are in places of leadership, though. Not spoiling it here.

By the same token, everyone hated Scarlet at first because she was sylvari and that’s enough for a lot of people. Everyone hated her later because we didn’t get to kill her immediately, and that was more reason to hate on her.

On paper, there’s few reasons she shouldn’t have worked. It’s all pretty much there, what we’ve seen in the last few chapters of the first LS.

But in practice, it didn’t come off too well.

And for the record? It wouldn’t have gotten canceled faster than Firefly. It would have wound up like Revolution, which lasted way to darned long and also had an annoying female character as the focus. Or it will end up like Lost . . . lots of potential, dragged in the middle with the pacing, then hurried up to a finale which was adequate but didn’t quite live up to the promise of the show.

If we’re lucky, this will turn out closer to Fringe.

What’s with this “waiting for dragons”? There’s three in the series.

zenleto.6179:

What’s with this “waiting for dragons”? There’s three in the series.

Well, that’s what Bran is doing. Waiting for dragons.

. . . to warg into.

Before the start Living World Season One someone from A-Net said, they want to be for a computer game MMO what Game of Thrones is for a TV-series.

One recurring concept of Game of Thrones is, that if you really start to like a character, it is very likely that this character will die. In GW2 Lions Arch was treated as a character.

Before Ned Stark was killed in Game of Thrones a lot of people thought “No, they can not do this”. But they did.

Before Lions Arch was destroyed in GW2 a lot of people thought “No, they can not do this”. But they did.

Of course, writing and production quality differs a lot. Not every writer/show has the quality to win an Oscar or Grammy. Thats why I really hope that the quality of the storytelling improves in LW season 2.

Greetings.

Zok.4956:

Before the start Living World Season One someone from A-Net said, they want to be for a computer game MMO what Game of Thrones is for a TV-series.

That’s not really what they’d said. What they’d said read to me a lot more like: “We want to be discussed in the same vein. We want to have people deeply invested enough to care about characters, to present theories and discuss them, to get a buzz going about things other than how much it sucked dolyak balls.”

One recurring concept of Game of Thrones is, that if you really start to like a character, it is very likely that this character will die. In GW2 Lions Arch was treated as a character.

Before Ned Stark was killed in Game of Thrones a lot of people thought “No, they can not do this”. But they did.

Nobody said that. Everyone knew he was going to die because it was Sean Bean.

Before Lions Arch was destroyed in GW2 a lot of people thought “No, they can not do this”. But they did.

And once more, it was tagged quickly as one thing they could do to deliver buzz was to do something to Lion’s Arch or Divinity’s Reach. Most people figured DR since Scarlet had seemed more interested in it initially as a side-project.

Of course, writing and production quality differs a lot. Not every writer/show has the quality to win an Oscar or Grammy. Thats why I really hope that the quality of the storytelling improves in LW season 2.

Not every decent show will win anything, or even be continued. Firefly didn’t get even a whole season, and it was actually pretty good once you could watch it in order without the time slot getting shuffled or things aired out of order. Castle hasn’t won an Emmy, despite getting a sixth season and generally being really entertaining TV. (I think it might be Nathan’s fault. He’s cursed.)

Star Trek didn’t win an Emmy, but it did win two Hugo Awards. Guess which two episodes won, if you’re a fan.

And we won’t get into how the Oscars don’t seem to catch “good movies” so much as “good movies within a certain formula” any deeper than to bring up it’s been noted there might be specific strategies to winning one . . .

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

That’s not really what they’d said.

They said a lot of things, as I remember (but can not quote exactly). How can you be so sure to think that you know everything they said?

Before Ned Stark was killed in Game of Thrones a lot of people thought “No, they can not do this”. But they did.

Nobody said that.

You are wrong. I know of a dozen people who said that. That is more than “nobody”.

Everyone knew he was going to die because it was Sean Bean.

You are wrong again. Not everybody. I know a lot of people who did not read the books an did not know that they really kill him of.

Greetings

P.S. Sean Bean is not a redshirt per se.

Zok.4956:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

That’s not really what they’d said.

They said a lot of things, as I remember (but can not quote exactly). How can you be so sure to think that you know everything they said?

Because I spent a lot of time listening to what everyone said they said after the transcript hit the internet and watched it a few times to make sure of what they said.

You are wrong. I know of a dozen people who said that. That is more than “nobody”.

I stand corrected. The savvy people I was around who knew who got cast started a “dead pool” for how long it would take and disqualified anyone who had read the novels.

P.S. Sean Bean is not a redshirt per se.

No, but he does have an impressive resume of dying in things he is in.

And the clips are enough to convince me I need to see him as Sharpe.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

And the clips are enough to convince me I need to see him as Sharpe.

If you have not seen them, the Sharpe tv specials are quite good. There is quite a lot of them, perhaps a dozen or more and they are 2 hours in length I think.

He doesn’t quite die in those…but he always gets the girl…lol

Ignoring the fact that the OP didn’t actually compare GW2 to GoT (a point a couple of people overlooked completely in their post), GW2 is a different medium. It is not accurate to compare a tv series and a game story – they work in two entirely different ways. To even try and emulate a TV series in a game is utter folly. Season 1 proved that.

In my eyes, in order to work, the game needs to concentrate less on living up to a marketing tool of “Living Story”. It is just a gimmick they are fitting the story to.
Small chunks of spoon fed story are frustrating and annnoying to the community. The story needs to be accessible from the word go, not necessarily all of it..but maybe a quarter or a third. Something substantial.

Murmurings indicate Season 2 will address these issues in large. MMO stories are notoriously poor (TSW aside), but I have hopes GW2 writers can turn it around and make something unique and great at the same time.

p.s. Yes the Sharpe series is excellent

I made this post thinking I was clever with the dragon comment…..

Randulf.7614:

It is not accurate to compare a tv series and a game story – they work in two entirely different ways. To even try and emulate a TV series in a game is utter folly. Season 1 proved that.

Yes, they work in different ways. But they can have similarities. Like storytelling. A TV series can have a good storytelling and a computer game can have a good storytelling.

Greetings.

Zok.4956:

Randulf.7614:

It is not accurate to compare a tv series and a game story – they work in two entirely different ways. To even try and emulate a TV series in a game is utter folly. Season 1 proved that.

Yes, they work in different ways. But they can have similarities. Like storytelling. A TV series can have a good storytelling and a computer game can have a good storytelling.

Greetings.

I think it has to deal more with the writing and how the storyline is set up. The LS can emulate a season of a television show, but it can’t be written in the same way. The pacing of the season’s story arc would be completely different between the two genres, and I think that was part of the problem with s1 of the LS.

Not to mention, the writing for games, especially MMOs, needs to be a bit broader than TV. As much as people love Westeros, we can’t actually explore it. Our PoV is entirely tied down to whoever we’re following at the time. In games, the player has a chance to explore and investigate the world, and we can talk to the npcs in the surrounding area to get additional info and depth.

Zok.4956:

Randulf.7614:

It is not accurate to compare a tv series and a game story – they work in two entirely different ways. To even try and emulate a TV series in a game is utter folly. Season 1 proved that.

Yes, they work in different ways. But they can have similarities. Like storytelling. A TV series can have a good storytelling and a computer game can have a good storytelling.

Greetings.

Telltale’s “The Walking Dead” is better than most tv series, even better than AMC’s “The Walking Dead” if you ask me
But .. I agree with your point ..
It’s rare to see good story in videogames, it does happen though :P

Erukk.1408:

Zok.4956:

Randulf.7614:

It is not accurate to compare a tv series and a game story – they work in two entirely different ways. To even try and emulate a TV series in a game is utter folly. Season 1 proved that.

Yes, they work in different ways. But they can have similarities. Like storytelling. A TV series can have a good storytelling and a computer game can have a good storytelling.

Greetings.

I think it has to deal more with the writing and how the storyline is set up. The LS can emulate a season of a television show, but it can’t be written in the same way. The pacing of the season’s story arc would be completely different between the two genres, and I think that was part of the problem with s1 of the LS.

Not to mention, the writing for games, especially MMOs, needs to be a bit broader than TV. As much as people love Westeros, we can’t actually explore it. Our PoV is entirely tied down to whoever we’re following at the time. In games, the player has a chance to explore and investigate the world, and we can talk to the npcs in the surrounding area to get additional info and depth.

That last paragraph is spot on imo. I think they have made a start with that, but I think they don’t encourage people to investigate and explore enough. Much of the background story can be found if you just talk to seemingly innocuous npcs, but players aren’t cognizant of this and thus increases frustration towards the story.

Hi everybody!

I think it´s very difficult to compare a book/TV-series to an MMO, the artistic tools are soo different. But nonetheless i would call it… very, VERY daring to compare the overall quality, imaginative force and well-paced, character-driven plot of GoT somehow with the botched mess that was LS season 1.

But let´s be optimistic and hope they do better with season 2, just by realizing there are things like thrones out there!

Meglobob.8620:

Its nothing like game of thrones, silly comparison…

Game of Thrones story was written by one of the best authors of fantasy currently alive on planet Earth.

No story in any video game could ever compete…

The books must be way better than the TV series then, because the TV series was just a soap opera with swords.

Winter is also coming.

Charming Rogue.8071:

Winter is also coming.

. . . eventually. We swear. Pinky swear.

Charming Rogue.8071:

Winter is also coming.

Winter is here!

Meglobob.8620:

Its nothing like game of thrones, silly comparison…

Game of Thrones story was written by one of the best authors of fantasy currently alive on planet Earth.

No story in any video game could ever compete…

skyrim waves and i LMAO, i have seen some eps of GoT and i find it boring.
it’s one of these horror movies, you think there is so much excitement but sleep wins over……

Meglobob.8620:

Its nothing like game of thrones, silly comparison…

Game of Thrones story was written by one of the best authors of fantasy currently alive on planet Earth.

No story in any video game could ever compete…

That’s highly subjective.
In my opinion Dragon Age and The Elder Scrolls far surpass Game of Thrones when it comes to lore/story. But to each their own.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

In my opinion Dragon Age and The Elder Scrolls far surpass Game of Thrones when it comes to lore/story. But to each their own.

Did Elder Scrolls get much more awesome story-wise after Morrowind or is this just me being jaded with it? Because Morrowind was good and all that but the lore in the world was not quite as developed as Westeros feels.

It’s not terrible, mind you. For what it is, it’s one of the top RPGs I played as far as stories go. Still beat by Digital Devil Saga . . .

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Did Elder Scrolls get much more awesome story-wise after Morrowind or is this just me being jaded with it? Because Morrowind was good and all that but the lore in the world was not quite as developed as Westeros feels.

Of course if you only count Oblivion or Morrowind then Game of Thrones will have a more extensive lore. But the entire Elder Scrolls series, both story and lore, surpasses Game of Thrones by far (in my opinion).

Wether the lore is actually bigger I can’t tell since I have not read the books of Song of Fire and Ice, but I can tell you the lore of TES is gigantic. So is the lore of dragon age, there is even has a whole series of books, comics, some mini webseries and even a movie (animated) which are all canon.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Did Elder Scrolls get much more awesome story-wise after Morrowind or is this just me being jaded with it? Because Morrowind was good and all that but the lore in the world was not quite as developed as Westeros feels.

Of course if you only count Oblivion or Morrowind then Game of Thrones will have a more extensive lore. But the entire Elder Scrolls series, both story and lore, surpasses Game of Thrones by far (in my opinion).

Wether the lore is actually bigger I can’t tell since I have not read the books of Song of Fire and Ice, but I can tell you the lore of TES is gigantic. So is the lore of dragon age, there is even has a whole series of books, comics, some mini webseries and even a movie (animated) which are all canon.

Then you need to read the books.

zenleto.6179:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Did Elder Scrolls get much more awesome story-wise after Morrowind or is this just me being jaded with it? Because Morrowind was good and all that but the lore in the world was not quite as developed as Westeros feels.

Of course if you only count Oblivion or Morrowind then Game of Thrones will have a more extensive lore. But the entire Elder Scrolls series, both story and lore, surpasses Game of Thrones by far (in my opinion).

Wether the lore is actually bigger I can’t tell since I have not read the books of Song of Fire and Ice, but I can tell you the lore of TES is gigantic. So is the lore of dragon age, there is even has a whole series of books, comics, some mini webseries and even a movie (animated) which are all canon.

Then you need to read the books.

Maybe one day. I still need to finish Dragon Age: Asunder and Sea of Sorrows.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

zenleto.6179:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Did Elder Scrolls get much more awesome story-wise after Morrowind or is this just me being jaded with it? Because Morrowind was good and all that but the lore in the world was not quite as developed as Westeros feels.

Of course if you only count Oblivion or Morrowind then Game of Thrones will have a more extensive lore. But the entire Elder Scrolls series, both story and lore, surpasses Game of Thrones by far (in my opinion).

Wether the lore is actually bigger I can’t tell since I have not read the books of Song of Fire and Ice, but I can tell you the lore of TES is gigantic. So is the lore of dragon age, there is even has a whole series of books, comics, some mini webseries and even a movie (animated) which are all canon.

Then you need to read the books.

Maybe one day. I still need to finish Dragon Age: Asunder and Sea of Sorrows.

Fair enough. Give yourself plenty of time, they’re a hefty read.

Oh, and I didn’t know there was such thing as a Dragon Age novelisation. Thanks for the incidental heads up.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Maybe one day. I still need to finish Dragon Age: Asunder and Sea of Sorrows.

Seriously to add to the comment – read the books. And if you can, find “The Hedge Knight” short story too. It’s amazingly simple for a story, almost like a known fairy tale. . . but there’s clearly some attention paid to even it in the narrative of the main series.

And Elder Scrolls, I didn’t actually play Oblivion, just Morrowind and its additions Tribunal and Bloodmoon . . . at least until I got lost in the wilderness with what I stumbled into and forgot where I was in the story. Still impressive worldbuilding for an island the fraction of the size of the world!

But I’ve heard the two games which followed up weren’t as good at giving it that feeling of wonderful expanse.

If you asked me about good worldbuilding in video games, I’d direct you to the post-Avatar “Brittania” (Ultima 4 and onwards) or (with some grumbling about lore snags) Everquest’s “Norrath”. Squeaking by for being memorable are Ivalice (Final Fantasy Tactics: War of the Lions, and Final Fantasy 12) and Lea Monde (Vagrant Story).

Tabletop? I’d mention my old “friends” Barovia (Ravenloft), Mirrodin (MTG), with a nod towards . . . Rokugan I think it was (Legend of the Five Rings) . . . which I had no experience with but I know held a high place for integration of story into game.

BenjaminK.8792:

But nonetheless i would call it… very, VERY daring to compare the overall quality, imaginative force and well-paced, character-driven plot of GoT somehow with the botched mess that was LS season 1.

I think it’s a bit harsh to call LS season 1 a botched mess. There are some things that worked, and some things that didn’t. The new characters for example work for me. And I really liked the Twisted Marionette, and the Tower of Nightmares. Those were pretty good updates. Some other parts felt rushed or disjointed. I think Scarlet as a villain was a failure. In my opinion this is due to a lack of backstory (most of which was on the website, instead of in-game) and good motivations (which were missing completely). I also think they borrowed too heavy from Batman’s Harlyquin (even bringing in Tara Strong, the voice of Harly, to voice Scarlet), without giving their own Harly a unique angle. But it’s not all bad. Mai Trin’s initial attack on the Ship’s Council was good, the investigation and the Dead End Bar scenes were good, and I liked the introduction of the Watchknights.