Guild Wars 2

The map as the carpet and the images on the roof are exceptionally exciting and encourages very interesting thinking about what lies ahead.

This episode overall was excellent – really enjoyed it.

Positives

• The game felt rooted in its world. A wealth of lore was exposed in a pace that I could decide myself, and NPC interaction that felt endearing (the people in the library) and real (their conversations felt relevant, e.g. Ogden’s questioning).
• I was not lead by the nose! The library was just a huge accomplishment to this. The ‘lead’ team of Marjory/Kasmeer took a step back for once, and let me do my own thing. They were there still however, and only really spoke when it felt appropriate.
• I was impressed by the gameplay that felt thought through and varied in a way I have not seen in quite some time. It wasn’t particularly hard, but it felt fresh and exciting. Found myself saying ‘cool!’ for the crystal cavern – both on gameplay, lore and presentation. Also – observing Kasmeer and Marjory from behind the crystal walls was a nice way of line delivery.
• I’m not a former GW1 player, so I don’t know the background of this universe as well as some. But to finally be able to take in the wealth of world lore in this update felt exciting, and I went through the whole library.
• Loving the attention to Rox’s former warband – it made her more real. I would love to be able to delve deeper into the character’s lesser traumas and imperfections as opposed to only the major character defining ones (e.g. Braham and Eir). Keep these tie-ins alive and kicking, allow me to be amazed that maybe two months later, I’ll be awarded for knowing about Rox’s former warband member. Take the time to expand the characters like this, and I’ll like ’em even more.

Negatives

• Marjory and Kasmeer surely felt more educated on matters regarding old lore than they previously were. They were vessels to enrich the lore in the crystal caverns, but it also felt a bit like they were out of character for all of that.
• I’ll be honest, Belinda as a character is probably the worst of our cast of characters. She was introduced out of nowhere as a tool to further the story in a certain part of the world (“I’m going to Brisban Wildlands to investigate…”), then swiftly killed of, then turned into an actual object for little reason than a power-fantasy of having a literal ‘soul blade’. I guess it is essentially another Caladbolg, but so far all of these ‘powerful weapons’ have not left me impressed. That stays true for Marjory getting some incredibly oozing green daggers (promptly on the gemstore later mind you) from a boy on the street that was murdered – and now she wields a katana with the soul of her sister in it. Just… no. Not even close to impactful.

Suggestions
Just more of this. I’m going to buy gems to support this patch and what it stands for, because I want more. My only wish is that you keep this level of quality up, and remember to know your own nods to characters and the sub-stories that occur and honor them at every possible opportunity.

And if you could, please talk to your gameplay team about making a revised ‘Tower of Nightmares’. I so want you and your team to take another try on the patch that got me actually whispering strangers in-game to participate in epic adventure together up a tower. Kindly consider this.

I agree with what others have mentioned-seeing the library, and being able to explore more of the rich world history; the sly touches of poking fun at some of past instances (crafting recipes for all the bloodstone dust drops that can’t really be used that readily!); the greater development of so many of the characters, as well as a sense of real struggle and danger in the world. The first half of second season started well, but this second half? It really made the world feel real, and storied.

Overall I really enjoyed the new episode, definitely the best one so far in terms of story. Biggest highlights for me were Glint’s lair, because I really loved how you could listen in on Marjory and Kasmeer talking to each other and learn about the history of Glint while you were absorbing in your surroundings.

Second is the library, of course. So much lore, so much information! And it doesn’t even need any voice acting! I loved the small details like the people shushing whenever you talked to someone. It was just a treasure trove for any GW player who enjoys the lore of Tyria. I wish you could have a book collection where you can actually read the books you’ve found through your Collection panel.

The thing I didn’t really like, or felt was a bit awkward, was the encounter with Belinda. It felt weird that she went from being hostile to suddenly infusing her sword with her being. She didn’t seem THAT close to Marjory when she was alive, but she spoke differently to her in ghost form, like Jory was the most important thing in the world to her. Maybe she was, but it didn’t seem that way previously in the story because we were given the impression that Marjory doesn’t visit her family very often.

Also, I think it was a bit awkward not having a unique music track playing in the background. It was meant to be an emotional moment, there should have been music to accompany that. Music helps set the mood in intense 1 to 1 character interactions like these, and it guides the player’s reaction. I think it would really, really, REALLY give some extra oomph to the story episodes if Maclaine and Leif penned some short tunes for important cutscenes.

As an example, in the mission where you meet Trahearne, a music track is playing in the background. It really set the mood for the moment and I felt like my character really was the Commander of the Pact, slayer of Zhaitan, returning to the field after a long hiatus. That mission is much more memorable to me than Belinda unfortunately, because the fitting music invoked emotions.

I hope this means someone is looking at the mixed-up, final chapters of the Personal Story. Missions were shuffled/dropped, but the references in other missions were left as-is. So stuff tends to conclude before it happens, or didn’t happen.

A mess. And the first story new players see.

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Hi folks! Now that I’ve settled in a bit at ANet, I wanted to check in again on this thread. The first Living World episode that I was involved in, “Echoes of the Past,” has now been live for a few days. We’ve all been really pleased that people seem to be enjoying the story and content a lot. But I’d love to ask you all for more specifics. What were your favorite narrative moments? What did you like about the content? About the way it was told? And of course, I want to hear what you think we can still do better on.

Thanks in advance to everyone for their comments. I’m very excited to be part of such a great game, and to work with such an excellent team of creative people.

Hidden Arcana, best living story mission [won’t even mention personal story] gw2 ever had. More stuff like this please!

The first mission where the ghost girl went into the sword, that was kinda lame. She thinks she’s fighting Mordrem, then suddenly she knows she’s a ghost.

But the rest was great! The library, as many have stated was really cool, and Glint’s crystal world.. Fantastic. The fighting in there was different, and the visual appeal was great.

I hope we get more content with that type of look. A Fractal, or a new Dungeon. And this is a bit off topic, but we should have more PvP arenas! Even if they’re shaped the same as say, Legacy Of The Foefire, it would be neat to see different texture layouts like Glint’s Lair, or a volcanic theme like the Fire Legion. I love pvp but it gets a little boring seeing the same place even though the fighting could be different, a wider variety of arenas would be super cool.

Hello! First off, huge props to you + the team for this patch. For the first time in recent memory, playing through this chapter had me stopping to realize “Oh.. this is Guild Wars after all,” which is something I and a lot of GW1 veterans appreciate. Even subtle nods to the established lore (the symbol on those lost badges.. mm) are exciting to those who are familiar with the original game.

Fort Salma
The cutscene with Marjory and Belinda was a fantastic storytelling choice. We were able to see the emotions Marjory felt, rather than having to listen to her and Kasmeer talk it out after the fact. I found this had tons more impact, and whoever animated her face did an excellent job, so kudos on that.

However, this chapter’s place in the overall narrative of the chapter was a bit questionable. I can see how it was necessary to introduce the sword, but it was sort of “welp I’ve arrived, oh fancy meeting you two here, exposition time!” It played out too conveniently. It might have made more sense if you’d gotten a letter from Marjory asking for your help dealing with the problems at Fort Salma rather than being summoned by the Priory.

The Pact
Fantastic job making the player character feel recognized for their past. I know that there are different opinions on whether the player character should be the hero or simply one more grunt among many, but the personal story has already established our identity as the commander of the pact and the defeater of Zhaitan. Also, profession and race-specific dialogue and interaction is a great way to feel like your character’s identity matters.
Neither of these things have to be big, they don’t need to throw a party in our honor, just acknowledge who we are and what we’ve done.

Caithe Reconnaissance
More Canach please.

Okay, but really, Canach (and Countess Anise) are imo two of the more interesting characters currently in play. They feel like actual characters with their own set of motives, rather than just cardboard hero #15. I think there’s a lot of room for smaller intrigue within the story, even if the main event driving the plot is bringing down the dragon. I like the feeling that there’s more at work than just what we’re dealing with at this moment, because it makes me curious and excited for what is going to happen in the future.

Library
Yesssssssssssssssssssssss.
Yessssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss.
I had a huge smile on my face the entire time. I talked to every NPC because I loved the dialogue and the shushing. Giving the player the option to read up on lore is great, because it lets interested players learn more without forcing disinterested players (or those replaying for achievements) to slog through it multiple times.

Speaking of slogging, since it is such a long chapter I agree that the chapter would have been better served if it was divided between the story section (up to meeting Ogden) and the combat section (Glint’s lair).

Glint’s lair was fantastic. It brought back memories of the GW1 mission while still retaining a GW2 feeling re: combat and mechanics.

As shown in this chapter, location & ambiance are a fantastic storytelling device. We don’t need NPCs to feed us every part of the story if we can look around and get an idea of what’s going on.

Great work, and I can’t wait to see what the next chapter brings.

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Hi folks! Now that I’ve settled in a bit at ANet, I wanted to check in again on this thread. The first Living World episode that I was involved in, “Echoes of the Past,” has now been live for a few days. We’ve all been really pleased that people seem to be enjoying the story and content a lot. But I’d love to ask you all for more specifics. What were your favorite narrative moments? What did you like about the content? About the way it was told? And of course, I want to hear what you think we can still do better on.

Thanks in advance to everyone for their comments. I’m very excited to be part of such a great game, and to work with such an excellent team of creative people.

For the first time in 2 years I’ve felt that the GW universe matters. Never forget that this is a sequel, don’t abandon every single old storyline, there are so many untold, epic stories!

Best narrative moment, hard to pick one, loved the entire chapter.. Canach is probably my favorite character in the story and I’m a bit disappointed that we treat him so bad all the time. Don’t get me wrong, I’d never fully trust him, but it’s just geting too much. If I could customize the method my character deals with things I’d be a Canach 2.0, so it’s a bit frustrating that our whiteknight character’s constantly bashing him while I, as a player, understand Canach’s motives and he’s just a fallen hero, IMO.

And the library was epic for so many reasons. Obviously everyone who loves the lore liked this new area, but there’s also a way more important thing here. Eversince launch the Priory’s been portrayed as these scholars searching for things all around the world, 24/7, with no significant results, being utterly useless so far – at least that’s how i saw them. This library showed us that they do possess an insane amount of knowledge and powerful artifacts, so this order grew a lot in my eyes and it’s great. All I’m waiting for now is more interaction on the side of the Order of Whispers – I hope they have a similar hidden area too, and because their strength is infiltration and manipulation I felt like they couldn’t fill any role that fits their order while fighting dragons, for obvious reasons, but I hope they’ll be able to utilize their skills sooner or later against some enemy froce that’s not only about brainless monsters.

positive—-
I have my biases with Canach, Caithe and Anise. So that being my favourite scene isn’t saying much. canach and caithe tanked damage, thats great. you didn’t felt alone, when it wasn’t appropriate to do so.

the conversation with trahearne felt good

What i found exceptionally well done, oddly enough, was the scene with Taimi and Braham at Camp Resolve. I was displeased with the Personal Story and then in season 1, because many scenes felt forced. Something in this scene however made it feel authentic, I can’t put my finger on it.
Later, when you tried to relay the lore from guild wars 1 through the conversation between majory and kasmeer, it still at least felt somewhat plausible.

The way you flowed from story-step to story step was different. Less fighting i guess, which made it seem less “gamey”. Less like levels, you had to beat, like in Mario-games. It didn’t felt like our character had to endure a ratrace, where we get cheese-sticks for completing a test after another. also, less cookie-cuter. its great, that we didn’t get to see rox, just so its complete. if it doesn’t happen, it doesn’t happen. nice!

The fact, that you can port via waypoints cheapens the experience though. in this episode i only felt it when you travel to the durmand priory.

My suggestion: use these big jumps only when necessary. if time and budged is avaiable, show something of the world, when your character is supposed to travel. what do the common folk say? is there (still) hate toward sylvari? (scarlet, mordrem) you can’t change npc’s all the time, i get that. but at least show something, when you have the opprtunity to mask those big jumps.

the library was gorgeous.

the lair looked nice, but the second phase took too long, or the others were too short. i at least felt a dip.

negative—-
the npc’s didn’t notice the fact, that the a big stairway showed itself, while the bookshelves, they looked into, vanished into the ground.

kasmeer still feels very clichéd. i cringe, when she is involved. maybe its only my preferences.

belindas behaviour felt forced. either its the voice actress, or its the lines.

off-topic, what bugs me about the story in the living story so far, in general. —-

the cookie-cutter aproach up until now made it very hard for me to get immersed into the story. while the beginning of season 2 was a step-up, but it isn’t enough.

guild wars 2 as a game feels great, every some weeks a new patch. contrary to world of warcraft for example, the world, that isn’t directly related to the story-arc feels static and hollow. in wow you had an enitre orc generation growing up in internment camps, astranged from the old ones. ‘economic’ crisis in durotar, where they had to starve, because orcish-people had to atone for their sins. sins, only the older did, and the punishment the younger ones had to endure anyway. which lead to the orcish approval of garrosh hellscream, which lead to war. racial prejudice. bad blood between trolls, tauren, undead and orcs (that being the direct consequence of games/events prior. wrathgate!), and between the leadership and garrosh(that being ingame events). it felt like revolution, each time a expansion came. a big, immediate impact on leadership aswell on the people. not mechanically. these still were the same npc’s with same text. but you got an idea.

in guild wars 2 this opportunity is missed. or at least is neglected right now. why creating five very distinct races with their own flair and IDENTITY.
and then, when it should’ve become interesting, lump them together into the three orders? sure, they had their identity as well, but not as distinct, as the races. when you see human and charr in the same organisation, you loose respect for the supposed hardships, the politicians had to go through on the summit in the fields of ruin. where is the prejudice? where is the hard fought road to reason? This “band together and live, or die alone”-thing isn’t working, if you felt none of the hardships of getting there.
not only are orders in feel and style inferior to the races, they get lumped together again!

the pact did felt good in this episode i will give them that much. i can’t explain why excactly. maybe, because they seemed much smaller than before. i don’t want them to be ‘deleted’ necessarily. they are implemented. you have to deal with it, i understand.

guild wars 2 already lacked identity, not as an game, but the populace definitely suffers from not enough colour. your world designers are making a good job, but the races right now, aren’t diverse. its not like sylvari are green, the norn blue, the charr red, the human yellow and the asura purple. no, you have big oily brown stain. where is the tension and the dynamic between the governments? don’t mix, play around with each individual piece! compare it to factions of star wars, wow or warhammer. the faction identitys are, what gives the world its colour!
what do the races feel right now in this situation? how is there stance towards each other? have they different interests? what is the stance of the iron legion towards the other two legions? why are blood and ash legion helping, do they have their own agenda? how are sylvari faring, now, that plants are killing dozens of people, again!

you can’t change that ofc, not now. i am aware, but please keep that in mind, when going forward. maybe in a years time or two, you can salvage that!

I’ve liked just about everything so far! One suggestion that I have, and that a lot of folks over on Reddit have suggested, is to bring back the personality options— even if the actual choices don’t change much, being able to give different dialogue options (Dignity, Charm and Ferocity) would help to personalise things. (Canach was the NPC most mentioned, to whom having different dialogue options might have been nice, as not everyone wants to beat him up!)

Imo everything what connect us more with gw1 lore is fantastic. What can be better? Music. Dont get me wrong music is fantastic its more about we dont heard it often enough and it was big problem for me in prevours LS too. Some cutscenes (especialy ingame ones) was very cool but bad timing or even absense of music at all really downgrade experience for me.

Overall this patch was great storywise all those eastereggs and links to gw1 really gets me. If GW2 as whole game missing right now is lack lore depth but if you will be continue this way it will be great.

Mechanic wise was lair perfect example of great boss design. Mechanics are great step forward and if you will work this way I will be no longer sceptic about upcoming raids as another start/zerk content.

I really enjoyed Echos of the Past.

I greatly enjoyed that we got to see development and improvement to the Priory. The feeling of having Jory’s tie to the organization helped smooth over what might have been confusing for non-priory Commanders. the assortment of lore and references in the library were great but i ended up getting bored because it was just linear dialog. I would have liked to get more visuals that i could infer information from (like the world map rug – a great addition by the way) I also liked how Jory’s character developed in a meaningful articulated way, where Kas’s powers of observation/lie-detector(?) felt forced to meet a mechanical need ingame. Rotating some of the biconics and Edge of Destiny in and out was a nice way to re-establish the strength and capability between the two groups. I may have missed it but i would have thought there would have been some discussion at the pact camp of where the triforge pact was, searching for them etc. it just seemed that the silver wastes didn’t blend quite as well with brisban as i would have thought. I liked that the different story arcs of the release were different lengths, i feel that it helped with the pacing between, recollecting after the summit, the initial encounter between the mordem and pact and then the slower hidden arcana arc. In the future i think it would be interesting to see lore delivered either visually or by having the more modern versions of groups tell us about the origins of themselves. the Zephyrites were introduced well this way and their origin story was nicely wrapped up here. I would have also liked to have gotten to talk to caithe to see if there were any developments with EoD or hear her thoughts on the dissappearance of Rytlock. I cannot wait to experience the next installment!

I’ll keep it short and sweet:

Loved:
The pact

• The recognition of who you are again
• All of the optional dialogue, being able to talk to various people about all sorts of stuff
• DE’s involvement again, was nice finally talking to Logan about what happened to Rytlock etc.. and now that another dragon’s on the horizon they’re active again. More please, it makes no sense story wise for them to “sit out” in favour of the bi-conics
• Trahearne seemed a lot more alive, and as a sylvari was good to talk to him afterwards about the pale tree.

The library
So much wonderful lore. Please make this accessible outside of the LS instance for ease!
I loved the reference to your character as a sylvari!

Glint’s Lair
Pretty much perfect, I was constantly cheering on TS about how everything referenced GW1.
Only thing I didn’t like was how Kas and Jory suddenly became experts on the GW1 lore.

Down Side:
Only one thing really.. I played most of the instances with friends, and they couldn’t interact with books or see the optional diaglogues with the NPCs

The library was just perfect.

The scouting felt a bit empty. And you can just jump down at the end, so people may miss the fight. Its not explained well, that when they say “down” they mean going the way they came, not jumping down the cliff.

The revisit of the form was just too fast, and Marjory just picking the sword too sudden. We should have to attack the ghost or something else other than Marjory simply talking to her.

Glint’s Lair – Best location ever + simple and/but fun fights.

The only feedback I have is pretty plain – please stop trying to connect so many things to GW1.

Players new to the series with GW2 won’t know the difference between ‘new’ history and the revision of ‘old’ history, and players who put a lot of time into GW1 don’t always see these historical retcons as a good thing.

The story is very hard to enjoy when every time you stop to read something, you run into something that contradicts previously established lore.

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Hi folks! Now that I’ve settled in a bit at ANet, I wanted to check in again on this thread. The first Living World episode that I was involved in, “Echoes of the Past,” has now been live for a few days. We’ve all been really pleased that people seem to be enjoying the story and content a lot. But I’d love to ask you all for more specifics. What were your favorite narrative moments? What did you like about the content? About the way it was told? And of course, I want to hear what you think we can still do better on.

First and foremost, this is a fantastic leap forward when it comes to integrating the story into a larger, deeper world. The Pact feels like its doing exactly what it is meant to do and the Priory acts like a massive scholastic organization brimming with artifacts and history. The set pieces were exactly what we needed to feel like we’re part of an epic narrative. Using historical elements to drive the plot was excellent. Returning to Glint’s sand realm was especially fun, and the prospect of protecting her offspring is a great plot hook.

As for the room for improvement…

The pacing was nonexistent. You dropped us into Marjory’s big moment with her sister without any buildup whatsoever, and then immediately yanked us out and sent us to Pact headquarters for a brief skirmish, then rubberbanded us back into the heart of the Priory to go talk about lore. I understand you’re trying to set up plot threads for the future events, but it didn’t feel cohesive. None of the individual episodes had any relevance with one another. Similarly, the Belinda ghost bit felt like it was supposed to be a climactic moment, but its brevity followed up with two completely different sets of rising action made it feel almost unnecessary.

And secondly, the constant attention to the Biconics felt like a distraction from the plot that was actually relevant. Marjory’s big moment was nice and dramatic, but the player character had absolutely no involvement. We showed up, walked through a ruin, watched a cutscene, and were left wondering why we were there. Taimi’s long exposition about training in new skills felt like navel gazing, giving her screentime purely for the purpose of giving her screentime (and it didn’t help that Braham is still acting like a lost puppy clinging to more interesting characters).

The really big offender for me personally, however, was Marjory and Kasmeer spouting exposition while we try to explore Glint’s cavern. This was a tragically missed opportunity to use the concept of memories and visages to tell the story of Glint. You introduced the idea of crystals holding the echoes of the past, but most of them did nothing. Instead, we got two characters without any major connection to Glint having a Maid and Butler moment introducing the dragon to the player.

The player just left a library full of brilliant references and historical oddities, a love letter to Guild Wars 1 in museum form. The journey through Glint’s lair would have been so much more powerful if you had kept that format. The player interacts with crystalline memories, and actually witnesses history. Imagine the Flameseeker Prophecies enshrined across the wall, along with other sibyllic inscribed throughout the lair. Rather than tell us that Glint nearly fought and then allied with Destiny’s Edge, why not show us the memory of their interaction? This was a classic case of Show, Don’t Tell, and despite the wondrous library and the nostalgic moment of seeing the Lair redone, it could have been something far more powerful.

You don’t need to make the Biconics the center of the world. This isn’t their story, and the more you break away from those five characters pretending to be the protagonists of the entire franchise, the better.

Horrible.3470:

The only feedback I have is pretty plain – please stop trying to connect so many things to GW1.

Players new to the series with GW2 won’t know the difference between ‘new’ history and the revision of ‘old’ history, and players who put a lot of time into GW1 don’t always see these historical retcons as a good thing.

The story is very hard to enjoy when every time you stop to read something, you run into something that contradicts previously established lore.

Tying things with gw1 is why this patch has been so well received. Both games took place in the same universe, ignoring gw1 would not only betray anet’s most loyal customers but also make no sense whatsoever lore-wise. If you didn’t play gw1, there are so many resources out there for you to catch up (besides buying the game and playing it yourself).

However, yes it is extremely important that anet doesn’t botch up the lore. I think they now know how important the lore is to their players, after the fiasco over the calendar change.

I know this going to sound odd, but it seems like those people who were holding back those hidden lore cards finally had their hands slapped. So we got a pretty big lore dump this time. However I have a feeling that something like this was already planned, but not extensively or coherently. It’s like we are actually starting to see more of a lore connection to GW1 then we have seen since launch.

Making GW2 feel like a real sequel to the original game. Instead of what living world Season 1 did in order to butcher that connection, including some of the lore standing within GW2 itself. Which was a big problem. It felt like they were trying to hand out the lore outside of the game, and thought being overly ambiguous on everything was a great idea. I am hoping that the Mursaat, Lazarus the Dire gets this special type of treatment if he ever returns. Playing to the strengths that made the original game lore so extraordinary.

I love all, the little and not so little nods to gw1 and the rich lore it had. It was a great start and i can’t wait to see more.

I think it was a good episode, but not great. Honestly it feels like most people that say it’s great are the GW1 players who had their nostalgia played on. I’m not saying that’s bad, just that without it the story doesn’t feel as great.

The main detractions I felt with the story were Marjory and her sister because her sister still feels like she was shoe horned in and her death had no impact on me.

And the interaction of Marjory and Kas in Glint’s Lair. While their talking felt more natural than before it felt like an info dump for the sake of the player and that the characters would know it all already and thus wouldn’t be talking about it in quite that manner. It would have been a bit more immersive to have all of that info in the books and have Kas and Marjory talk about it more matter of factly/obliquely than as an info dump. The LS could have guided us through the books like it already does or just let us explore and find it ourselves.

Overall it’s a large step up from Ep 3&4. This is the first LS update that actually made me want to play it again and made me stop and consider if I’d rather play GW2 than something else. Which is a rarity for me now.

Keep up the good work.

The Belinda story didn’t make any sense. Why is she special? Why did she stay behind as ghost? Why was Marjory gifted with Calabolg 2.0? Shouldn’t the player character be gifted with something? I don’t feel like I exist as a player character in this living story.

Why is Kasmeer even part of Destiny’s Edge 2.0? She’s absolutely useless all the time. Downed during the final boss fight. Typical.

I did not enjoy the Hidden Arcana. I do not mind the occasional nod to Guild Wars one lore but this was excessively pointless. I have been playing Guild Wars since July 2005. I do not need a refresher course in basic lore. After two years I would like to think that you would want to flesh out the current world of Guild Wars 2. You mention things like the tengu and you elude to them possibly fleeing, but thats about it. Sigh.

What happened to the baby dragon in Eye of the North? Surely this should somehow be relevant now since the Master of Peace is claiming he has the last egg. Are we just going to pretend that doesn’t exist?

Vekk’s Thesis and The Six: Being or Playing God couldn’t have existed back in Guild Wars 1 because there wasn’t any lore at the time that talked about the elder dragons.

Also, its Prince Rurik not Rurick. -_-

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Hi folks! Now that I’ve settled in a bit at ANet, I wanted to check in again on this thread. The first Living World episode that I was involved in, “Echoes of the Past,” has now been live for a few days. We’ve all been really pleased that people seem to be enjoying the story and content a lot. But I’d love to ask you all for more specifics. What were your favorite narrative moments? What did you like about the content? About the way it was told? And of course, I want to hear what you think we can still do better on.

Thanks in advance to everyone for their comments. I’m very excited to be part of such a great game, and to work with such an excellent team of creative people.

Perhaps I’ve just become very jaded but I don’t feel much difference between E5 and E1-4, for the most part. But the things I think were improvements:

• There’s less focus on the biconics overall. The previous episodes had at least one biconic and a huge focus on character development on them or Scarlet in almost every story instance, which gets smothering. We don’t need character development, we need plot development.
• There’s a lot of GW1 references. People have been feeling like GW1 has been more or less forgotten by the devs, and some GW1 lore has been called into question. The veterans would lop this up. I would argue that there’s a big case of overhyping because of this.
• Lore. Bloody. Overdrive. This episode was a lore dump of lore dumps. People enjoyed The Edge of the Mists update in Season 1 because it had a huge lore dump on Season 1; similarly, Season 1 had a heavy like for – aside from the return of new content (which E5 also had) – the lore dump in the final instance. Same thing with the E2 ending.

People enjoy lore dumps, people love continuity, and people love it when the plot doesn’t focus on the character, but the plot – it feels less drawn on then. The last being the reason behind the arguments of “the biconics cannot carry GW2”.

You know what would have made it better? If the Priory’s Special Collection were in the instance The Durmand Priory – so that it could be accessible at any point outside the story step, perhaps completing E5 as a requirement.

Some things I disliked:
Ghosts at Fort Salma The instance felt forced into the plot, irrelevant overall with no purpose. It felt like a GW1 side-quest that would have a hero requirement to do.

Canach Can we please drop the forced utter hatred on him? It’s making my character look to be a complete kitten to be continuously suspicious and down right giving death threats to someone who has openly stated to be attempting to repent for his crimes. Yes, he was a criminal, but the world isn’t black and white – and our PCs know this, given that they may have done something to result in people’s deaths. Oh wait, that storyline no longer exists because you guys removed it. Nevermind, I guess. (Side note: Please, for the love of god, tell us what’s up with the fear storyline?).

Rather than forcing our characters to be complete jerks to Canach, give us a multi-dialogue tree that gives players a chance to be forgiving. Because in all honesty? I hate my character whenever I interact with Canach. I want to just kittenslap my character and shake them furiously and shout in their face “HE. IS. TRYING. TO. REPENT. STOP. THREATENING. HIS. LIFE. YOU. PSYCHOPATH!”

Yeah, sure, he talks about lopping off heads and planting bombs. He has a dark history. But he’s sad for his dark past, and remained in jail when he could have escaped, and is now working to help us against the Elder Dragons. It’s reasonable to be leery but lines like:

“I’ll be at the front of the hunting party if you mess this up.” followed by “We can always put you back.” the next time we see him, feels like I’m playing a Renegade Shepard – rather, like I’m forced to play a Renegade Shepard in the Mass Effect series, when the image I have of my characters is less brutish and threatening.

As Canach says: “I do wish you’d get over the past.”

So do I Canach, so do I.

Too Many GW1 References In all honesty, it felt like you guys were at a point where you were stuffing GW1 references for the sake of stuffing as many GW1 references as you could. Regardless of relevance and logic to them.

For example, how could Vekk know that the Elder Dragons consumed and leaked magic? If this is true, then he had theorized long ago Gorr’s own theory and then some, things that were only realized in 1325-1326, would not have been jerred and lauded at! Vekk was a renown member of asura society, so it’s hard to believe he could make such a theory and it not be commonplace in asura society.

Another example, would be Nick’s book about the Bloodstone – how could Nick know this stuff? I mean, the Priory had to learn it from somewhere, sure, and it’s plausible Nicholas Sandford could know the Seer’s ties to the Bloodstone and the truth of Abaddon’s gift of magic, but the chances of that are so unlikely even given his travels and ties to Durmand.

And what’s with the charr myth on the Elder Dragons? Up until now, we were told that the knowledge of the Elder Dragons came solely from the ancient races – but suddenly in Season 2, the norn and Six Gods have knowledge, and now the charr do too! Yet the Elder Dragons “wiped out nearly all races”, despite so many surviving myths of them, despite no races to exist for them to spread them.

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Thanks to everyone for the great feedback! I agree with the overall sentiment that the team did a really good job with this one. And better story takes a great effort from not only Narrative, but Art, Audio, Design and others as well. We really do have a great group of developers here.

Art and audio has been doing an excellent job since day one. Any dislike does not fall on their shoulders.

Siobhan.6027:

Why is Kasmeer even part of Destiny’s Edge 2.0? She’s absolutely useless all the time. Downed during the final boss fight. Typical.

This felt like an opposite to Scarlet’s End instance, where Kasmeer was fighting but Marjory was knocked out.

Right now the story feels like it’s written and told like a radio drama, not a video game.

1. Show more, tell less. Guild Wars 2 relies too much on long-winded speeches and too little on compelling game events that keep the player at the center of interesting plot points. Many missions involve no more than a couple minutes of gameplay but are padded out by cutscenes — some people may like this, but I’m here to play a game.

2. Use fewer, more meaningful characters. Focus on a few interesting characters rather than many uninteresting ones. I can’t care about characters that don’t have an interesting hook or feature real character development. If I don’t care about the character, the character shouldn’t exist.

3. Use cutscenes only when they improve the storytelling. Having the camera wildly pan around to show off random things in the environment isn’t interesting or compelling. If you’re going to take control away from the player, it had better be worth it. Most films and many top-tier story-based games feature camerawork that enhances the storytelling instead of distracting from it — take note.

4. Less travel, more gameplay. Too often we’re told to travel across the world for what amounts to a forced cutscene. Choose your locations more carefully to limit the amount of downtime between gameplay segments.

5. Use escort and holdout quests only as a last resort. The overwhelming bulk of Guild Wars 2 story gameplay involves supporting AI as they hold or wander to a location. Focus on story points that promote epic gameplay — waiting around for AI isnt’ epic.

I think the two biggest standouts were the new Pact base and the library. I would even go so far as to say I think the new Pact base was probably the most impressive thing about this release’s narrative, even more so than the Hidden Arcana mission. You guys did such a great job of really making it feel alive, especially compared to Fort Trinity. While Fort Trinity feels very static and lifeless, the new base was absolutely bustling with activity. Every NPC seemed like they had a purpose and something to do, and it was fun exploring the base and finding the different members of Destiny’s Edge and some familiar faces from the personal story. Good use of ambient dialogue as well. I also really liked how it was one of the few times I felt like we had a chance to actually play our characters in the dialogue options. For example, with Eir, we were actually given the chance to call her out on the whole “deadbeat mom” issue or to take the more diplomatic route and say how you’re glad they’re getting along. For Logan, you get the chance to be a charr sympathizer when talking about the Foefire if that’s your thing. I’d love to see more of that, giving us the chance to actually play our characters the way we want to play them. In an ideal world, this kind of thing would actually affect our characters’ relationships with the NPCs and it would carry over in future releases, but I don’t know if that’s feasible.

Thanks Leah for all your hard work! I love how the GW1 lore was included. My favorite part of the new content overall was the cutscenes in the priory basement. Those gave me the best OOOOOOOHH moments.

My favorite part of narrative was all the little conversations we could have in the Reunion story section – adding a little backstory for Rox, chatting up Eir about Braham – basically any of the option and/or background noise conversations are so immersion giving! I loved being cheered by soldiers as “the Commander” when I walked around.

Other things. I loved the crystalline nature of Glint’s lair. Kas’s exclamation that she could understand why people joined the Priory as she saw the library. Seeing old names in the books (Vekk’s thesis!…) getting downed by Abaddon (btw his name is misspelled the second time it appears on the plaque! put a sticky note on someone’s monitor, eh?)

The march music during Reunion of the Pact is my new favorite GW2 track. My kids couldn’t stop listening to it, either I liked the guy welcoming us and the other soldiers coming in!

I agree with posters above that the last instance was very long. Doing the library and lair separately would have been ideal, time-wise.

(also the person who said we’d like to see some personal development for Faren. YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.)

The lair fights were really difficult and had interesting mechanics. MORE OF THIS! Yes yes yes!!!

The new armor set is both beautiful and acquired through actual hard work, so kudos on that. I think my #1 complaint about the entire release was that the male shoulders don’t have butterfly stuff on them…. and in fact the entire armors are barely resembling the female ones. I was so, so, SO looking forward to having those butterfly shoulders on my female charr, because regardless of how the chest/pants turned out to look in the male version, at least the shoulders would match, right??!!! But… no. They are completely plain, generic shoulders. And not butterflies. That is my #1 disappointment with the whole release.

By the way, I wanted to make sure you go over and check reddit for posts, including this one in particular: http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/2llufv/new_narrative_design_director_leah_hoyer_is/

My biggest issue was the redundancy between the voiceover and text. Canach was the perfect example. “Here’s my dialogue. It is long and now you can get specifics from me when my interact goes to text”

Text: Here’s my dialogue yet again. It’s long and only slightly changed in text form so that you have to read what I just said.

Almost every time a character talked then had me read text it seemed to be this same way.

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Hi folks! Now that I’ve settled in a bit at ANet, I wanted to check in again on this thread. The first Living World episode that I was involved in, “Echoes of the Past,” has now been live for a few days. We’ve all been really pleased that people seem to be enjoying the story and content a lot. But I’d love to ask you all for more specifics. What were your favorite narrative moments? What did you like about the content? About the way it was told? And of course, I want to hear what you think we can still do better on.

Thanks in advance to everyone for their comments. I’m very excited to be part of such a great game, and to work with such an excellent team of creative people.

The fact that NPCs recognize my past achievements through ambient dialogue and emotes is a huge deal. It really makes my character feel like a part of the game universe. Also, your initial efforts at redeeming both Trahearne and Canach are pretty good and hopefully will continue to develop them into more faceted characters. This hope also applies to the player characters. I really hope you will continue to take the extra efforts to make the player characters reflect the players. More divergent dialogue choices to reflect our individual toons are very welcome. I want to feel like MY hero not a generic one, dialogue is a part of that. Finally, one of my favorite bits of living story has been when the NPCs who are close to me converse and banter. PLEASE let the banter and humorous dialogue that occasionally occurs involve my character. I am aware that involving the 16 voice actors used for player characters is expensive, but if my toon laughs at a joke that Kasmeer makes or chides Trahearne for his absence when fighting Zhaitan that makes a huge impact on creating a cohesive universe that my characters exist in. Ideally, you can plan your episode dialogue in larger batches and justify hiring your full cast back to record multiple episodes worth of banter/dialogue. (Adding some player voice over to the past living story episodes would be a welcome addition as well) Regardless of what you choose/can afford to do, I really enjoyed the last episode. I trust you can continue to craft an intriguing tale that will continue to let characters drive the plot through the mountain of entertaining and rich lore.

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Thanks in advance to everyone for their comments. I’m very excited to be part of such a great game, and to work with such an excellent team of creative people.

Positives:

The library is a great nod to GW1 players. Although Kas & Mar exposition was a bit too forced in Glint’s lair. Ogden’s exposition was much better, since we could ask whatever we wanted. My character is the descendant of my GW1 characters, so it would’ve been great to ask Ogden about journeying with them on GW1… but since non-humans can use the HoM as well, it’s kinda moot now.

I also liked how people were finally recognizing you for your efforts, although I’m still not a fan being “hey you” or “boss” to my supposed friends. “Commander” at least works on a military organization.

I like Canach a lot. He’s a breath of fresh air, a character who is morally grey and has interesting character arc. Unfortunately the rest of b-iconics aren’t as interesting to me.

Then the negatives:

I don’t really like having my character blurt out stuff that’s totally out of character both for me AND the character. Namely, Marjory’s bad taste jokes (which you weren’t there to write, so don’t worry) or how snippy we were towards Canach and basically threatening Phlunt with violence.

I understand why this is done (especially if the personality system is really gone for good) but I don’t like it. Always give us a neutral way out of a dialogue. It hurts my immersion when you guys tell me “right, your opinion is this” even though it would make the narrative more easy to have it the same for all player characters.

Few things that bothered me :

- I don’t care about the story because I don’t remember. You took months and months to push a single questline, I can’t be involved in that. I don’t remember the characters, I don’t remember why my toon is here and what he has to do. I red that LS was like a TV serie, but what we had is one episode of this serie sliced and spread months after months. Too tiny, can’t bother.

- It’s like a TV show, so we just watch, our character has no choice to make. Why do we have to be so passive in a video game ? No decision, no involment. Race of character doesn’t matter, nor his mind tendancies that were scrapped. I could play a blind duck all the story would be the same. Nothing matters, we just watch the 20 mins/ 6 months. I remember with LS 2.2, you made my char to lead his best friends. Friends that I didn’t remember, I didn’t know what was happening, and why you throwed at me a band of friends.

- It’s already been pointed, but the dialogue box for the books is an horrible vector.

- New map seems dead when you look at normal maps. These had different stories with hearths, some races lived there, they were the testament of a living world. But the new map has nothing, and is only 1/4 the size of a normal map.

In short, the LS is anti-immersive. I don’t care cause it take too long for too few and I don’t remember, I’m not involved, and you do nothing to involve my char in it.

Pros:
-Iconics, Biconics, Trahearne and Doern Velazquez, all in the same istance. Finally.
-Trahearne acting as the plant in charge
-The characterization of Canach: he is still a shady bomber. Love the pessimist attitude.
-The dialogues/books reflect what playerbase said during the previous patches.
-Mechanics of facets in the Lair: not just a “go there and bash them”, well done.
-Attention to details: the istances felt alive. Every NPC had a reason to be there, something to do. Zhaitan tail. Books. Amazing.
-Marjory and Belinda. Very touching moment.
-The library. I’ve spent 2h there. Well done.
-The reliquary: loved the gems behind the crates!
-You are not forced to listen, dialogues don’t stop the action (the opposite of the Aetherpath)
-WvWvW/PvE crossover.
-Air strikes: I really love to light that signals!
-Mordrem are very uniques, I love them, the flanking of wolves, the dashing of the teragriff and the knockdown when crippled (that’s how should work for players too: if you are clippled, you can’t Whirl/Rush away) and so on.
-Ogden: finally he’s truly back. And have a great voice acting.

Cons:
-Don’t forget that Marjory is a Necromancer. If she have to use the greatsword all the time, please, add a persistent “necromantic touch” (I’ll miss her axe and dagger).
-Silverwastes event cicle is a bit too repetitive (maybe this will change in 2 weeks)
-The ghosts: why they are there? We got no explanation (is Marjory fault? Or due krait obelisk shards?)
-The library seem to be designed by Order of Whispers rather then Priory.

Note: so many artifacts in an “I only hope it is safe” place. Really bad idea. I think someone will feast on them soon.

OT:

Hi! I just want to give some general tips as an old GW1 and GW2 player for making GW2 lore interesting and better:

1. Old story lines

Take old story lines from GW1 and finish them in GW2. There are so many stories in GW1, where we still don’t know how the stories ended. What happened with Evennia in Old-Ascalon? What’s happening on the floating fortress in Kessex Hills? Is it still the same old mage as in GW1?

I know GW2 is supposed to have his own story, so new players can have a easy access to the GW universe but the story of GW2 has its basics in GW1. We need way more references to GW1.

2. More political aspects and conflicts

The lore of GW2 needs way more political aspects. We have five races which are so different to each other. They are so different, there must be conflicts! Even with peace talks between human and charr, there is still a long way to go, that they would call each other “partners”. In this state of living story, it seems like everything is so peaceful between all five raves. It shouldn’t be like this! Humans and charr still hate each other, norn are thinking Queen Jannah is weak! What about sylvari racism? Kryta wants to assimilate Silverwastes! Why would charr allow humans to do that? Humans are still a potential enemy! This is a great foundation for political conflicts! The big enemies are the Elder Dragons but the process of rapprochement between all races is going way to fast! Stop it! Now!

3. What happened elsewhere?

You want to design GW2 as a “living” game, where the world is changing every day. So if you want to do so … get a chronicle. Tell the players what happened elsewhere in Tyria. With “Echoes of the Past” every lore aspect will happen in the Silverwastes for the next weeks. But in these weeks there is still something happening everywhere in Tyria. The world is not frozen! With the reformation of the Mouvelian calendar, you have the best requirments to publish a chronicle where players can read what happended elsewhere in Tyria. With every content update, we can read: "Modrem invaded Silverwastes, peace talks between High legions and humans are going well etc. " This would be awesome for roleplay and lore fans. This little bit of work would make Tyria way more alive.

Thank you for reading!
I am sorry for possible grammar mistakes but english is not my native language.

Edit for second point:

The world summit in the Grove was just … bad. The whole display of this big event was just sooo bad. The most powerful leaders of Tyria are coming together to discuss a dragon-sized problem and we only get this? Seriously? The leaders were standing! There were only a few flags, and they were just coming with less then four bodyguards? Such a political event must be huge! Very huge! Take a example from the real political world! Such meetings are huge!

JerryMain.4371:

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

The story was solid. I found myself able to forgive the whole bloodstones lore redcon, because it was properly explained in game for once.

Wait what do you mean by this, now I think I have missed something…

There’s a book in the library on the Bloodstones. It explains a lot about why the original Prophecies lore is wrong. It’s basically a retcon, but it is backed up by good writing.

One thing i didn’t like so much, because it reminds me of a scene in the final of LS1: When Ogden asks you, if you know who gave the dragon egg to the leader of the zephyrites. We didn’t know and he told that stereotypical “then you aren’t ready to know it”. It’s like Bhraman, when Scarlet said, that we don’t know what her real plan was and he just refuses to hear more, because “We don’t need to hear here words, because she is evil and has to be stopped and that is all…”.

I don’t like tropes like that, because they show that the NPCs are leading the story and have might over the decision what we have to know and what not. And so the NPCs start to annoy me.

But all in all, that was the best LS update since The Origins of Madness for me

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

JerryMain.4371:

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

The story was solid. I found myself able to forgive the whole bloodstones lore redcon, because it was properly explained in game for once.

Wait what do you mean by this, now I think I have missed something…

There’s a book in the library on the Bloodstones. It explains a lot about why the original Prophecies lore is wrong. It’s basically a redcon, but it is backed up by good writing.

Do you mean the book that states that it wasn’t the human gods who created the bloodstone?

Because, i don’t actually see that as a retcon. It’s a simple matter of looking at it from the eyes of someone more aware of the world. In gw1, it was all about the humans, they were fierce believers in their gods and know them to be the one to grant them magic, which they did technically do. So it’s not impossible to assume that from a human point of view, they see the bloodstone as a creation from their gods. While in gw2, we learn to see so much more than jsut the human perspective. We learn what happened to ancient races and the truth about many things. Including that the bloodstone was made not by the gods but by the forgotten and the other important races at that time. It’s a simple matter of learning more about the world compared to having a rather shortsighted view of the world as the humans had in gw1.

They had no reason to question their gods. The gods however probably knew better of its origins, and maybe saw it to be the safer option to not let their followers, the human know the full truth, the same reason why glint was said to be an ally from the gods and not revealed at that time to be an elder dragon’s champion (yes i know at that time there was no elder dragons)

i guess the point is, tl;dr; when comparing the narrow view of the world we had in gw1 to the more open view that we have in gw2 , it isn’t so much as a retcon but learning new things that weren’t previously known

(i’m gonna stop here because i’m fairly certain i’ve become quite incomprehensible :p)

ps: though then again, that may jsut be a complicated way of saying its a retcon and would add to the point you made that it was backed up by great writing, in which case, ignore me :p

dsslive.8473:

ps: though then again, that may just be a complicated way of saying its a retcon and would add to the point you made that it was backed up by great writing, in which case, ignore me :p

It basically is, haha. It is a retcon, pure and simple. But a good one. They give a good explanation of why the humans perceived this to be the truth in GW1, and it explains that there is more to it than that. I can accept it, because not only do they just change the facts, but they also expand on it, and give a deeper understanding of what really happened. Retcons are annoying when they simply change the story retroactively, but when they add more lore, then they can also be a good thing. In the case of GW1 lore, a lot of it was probably terribly simplistic, and it wasn’t until later that they started adding more depth to the existing lore, and improving the story.
The books in the library suggest that the Forgotten used the bloodstones to lock away magic from the elder dragons, which is also new. It also suggests that the human gods plundered Arah, and used the Bloodstone to become powerful. This puts the human gods in a more negative light, which I think is really clever.

Leah Hoyer.9382:

Hi folks! Now that I’ve settled in a bit at ANet, I wanted to check in again on this thread. The first Living World episode that I was involved in, “Echoes of the Past,” has now been live for a few days. We’ve all been really pleased that people seem to be enjoying the story and content a lot. But I’d love to ask you all for more specifics. What were your favorite narrative moments? What did you like about the content? About the way it was told? And of course, I want to hear what you think we can still do better on.

Thanks in advance to everyone for their comments. I’m very excited to be part of such a great game, and to work with such an excellent team of creative people.

Welcome Leah! Let’s go:

The entire episode is golden, except the beginning. There were some suspicions an instance was cut off during EP3, the part where Braham and Eir fight together. Same happens in this episode, with the ghosts of the Seraph at Fort Salma.

First of all, the most basic problem: No explanations. The setting is so sudden, so forced.

In my opinion, the way to go here would have been “There’s ghosts at Fort Salma, go there and find if Mordremoth has anything to do with it, and put them to rest”. Then you get there, kill some ghosts, and then Belinda would be a mini-boss. You save some Durmand Priory and alive Seraph too. Then everyone is safe and leaving, you stay talking with a Durmand member but Belinda reforms and tries to kill her. And then Marjory and Kasmeer arrive and the cutscene plays. Mordremoth could have nothing to do with the ghosts, but it’s a good excuse to link it to the main storyline. After all, you witnessed the attack.

A very basic mission in terms of gameplay, but that serves its purpose and gives the odachi/katana moment a purpose. Wouldn’t require a lot of work, in my opinion. The special mechanic could be just waves of ghosts which you defeat. Then Belinda spawns, with some basic attacks you must dodge, an easy miniboss. Achievements? Dodge Belinda’s attacks, for example.

I don’t know if the deadline killed the instance, but anyway, I hope some day you go back and improve these moments.

As I said above, the rest of the episode is pure gold. Trahearne got really redeemed to my eyes, too. His character was always fine no matter the haters, it was the storytelling around him which was bad, and he got all the blame being in the middle, just like Scarlet. I really love you made other commanders “canon”, too. The player should never have been such an important figure, and it’s good to see the role diluted.

As for past episodes, if you want some feedback, for you or the team in general:

If you want to improve the EP3 moment with Brahamn and Eir, you could keep the event, and then make an instance where you destroy the totem with some special ritual where Eir summons the Spirits of the Wild, while some Sons of Svanir attack. Again, nothing too complicated, enough to make it not feel out of place, like my Belinda’s ghost moment improvement above.

The crown scavenger hunt in EP3 feels really forced and cheap too, if you can’t make it feel epic, then make it feel more basic. Instead of searching the pieces by yourself in such a weak manner, make it be NPCs holding the crown pieces, and you need to talk with them and gather them. Let’s say Imperator Smodur got the crown pieces long ago, but it was dangerous so he gave the pieces to some soldiers, who kept them in secret. Now you must go and find those guys, and show them a letter so they give it back to you. They are involved in different dynamic events you need to complete first. Pretty much the same scavenger hunt, but now it doesn’t feel cheap, it feels logic and up to its level. And if you can’t make it feel right, maybe just scrap it altogether and make Rytlock have the crown already (It didn’t make too much sense for it to be broken in pieces anyway to begin with).

Also I don’t know what happened in EP3, but the dialogues are desynchronized in the timeline. In one instance, you talk about stuff that is acknowledged as not having happened before, when it just happened in the previous mission. It was really confusing, there’s some continuity errors here, and serious ones for that matter. EP1, EP2 and EP4 were pretty much perfect.

That’s all. Great job so far, and looking forward more of the story! And please, never falter to go back and improve already released content, even if it’s old and already served its purpose. You can always give it new rewards to encourage replayability and make it worth enough. And I say this for the the Living World and the Personal Story, which could use some improving, too.

Episode 5 was a huge hike in quality. Things felt more cohesive and meaningful. It was a relief to take a break from focusing almost solely on the “biconics” introduced in season 1 and return to older characters. Players have clamored for exploring more GW1 lore and it was explored in depth after being largely neglected since launch. It was strangely satisfying to see Trahearne acting like a leader after he spent all of the personal story reluctantly trying to direct the Pact.

The only bits that didn’t resonate with me involved Marjory and Kasmeer. The ghost katana feels cheesy, and it was weird having them deliver exposition on Glint.

I really liked the episode but Ghosts at Fort Salma definitely didn’t fit in. Didn’t the player character say something like “No, I haven’t heard anything from Marjory or Kasmeer since the summit”, even though we met them at Fort Salma? I can’t remember where that line was said, though. I think it might’ve been in the instance after Ghosts at Fort Salma, in the Silverwastes. Maybe while talking with Braham?

@Samuli: Yeah, seems to be for Vigil characters only, which us odd given we just met them.

Yay more oversights!

For all the praise, E5 has a lot of oversights and inconsistencies. It’s like the 2 week break and overload of gw1 references have led to folks not realizing that E5 isn’t all that better than E1-4.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

@Samuli: Yeah, seems to be for Vigil characters only, which us odd given we just met them.

Yay more oversights!

For all the praise, E5 has a lot of oversights and inconsistencies. It’s like the 2 week break and overload of gw1 references have led to folks not realizing that E5 isn’t all that better than E1-4.

Nope, my character is with the Priory. Maybe it’s a bug or something.

Positiv:
detailed world. You can find details everywhere. I was dissapointed by the durmand priory. But now, after i’ve seen the library in the underground, it is my new favourite place.
I like the medieval setting especially in divinity’s reach and the villages beneath.
I hope to see more from Guild wars 2. I liked the guerilla warfare of the shining blade against the white mantle.
Very nice ideas in the world. There are such many thing we know since propecies and now they make sense. Like the blood stones.

Negativ:
I dislike the steam punk setting. I disliked the guns, but now they’re ok for me. The zeppelins are cool, but tanks, submarines and helicopters are hard to accept and really overpowered. Why should we lead our whole army through a deadly land, when we can transport them by hundreds of zeppelins and helicopters?
I dislike the rank of the main character. I’ve helped logan and a little later i was represantive of the queen. Now i’m the commander of the pact and wandering around the world all alone. I want to be a simple adventurer like in gw1 and not the big ‘boss’.
In gw1 you have to group for access a mission. In gw2 you can play in group. But the living story ‘missions’ are too short to play in group. I liked to play in group with random players. The only thing i can do in gw2 to have this feeling, is to play fractals. In the dungeons are too much speedrunner -.- and with them, there are no roleplaying atmosphere. Livin story and personal story missions are too short to build a group. I don’t need a group for teleport to orr, fight three enemies in orr, jump back to trahearne and talk with him for over 5 minutes.

Please kindly ignore the comments saying that there was too much GW1 lore in this patch. It’s been far too long since the GW1 players have felt like this game was being made for them. Our game was abandoned after EotN to work on GW2, and this is finally the first patch in a very long time that it really feels like we’re playing the sequel to Guild Wars.

Season One was an ugly, disjointed mess with no cohesion, a thousand unanswered questions, contradictions, and plot holes, little relevance to the GW universe, and one of the most disliked villains in video games. Season Two, especially starting with this patch, is a complete 180 degree turn in the right direction. Whoever was in charge before didn’t understand what GW is and how to craft it, and if what this patch has given us is the direction Leah is taking the narrative, she gets it. This is the GW sequel we’ve been waiting for, and the story updates introduced in the Priory are making people start to believe in the Living Story.

I’m waiting to give feedback when I have time to do a proper job of it, but in the meantime:

Phex.8423:

The thing I didn’t really like, or felt was a bit awkward, was the encounter with Belinda. It felt weird that she went from being hostile to suddenly infusing her sword with her being. She didn’t seem THAT close to Marjory when she was alive, but she spoke differently to her in ghost form, like Jory was the most important thing in the world to her. Maybe she was, but it didn’t seem that way previously in the story because we were given the impression that Marjory doesn’t visit her family very often.

It’s a common trope in fantasy that death can change your perspective and help you focus on what’s really going on.

The impression I have of the Delaquas is that while they may not always be together, they do have a close family ‘us against the world’ bond (shown in part by their mother’s apparent distrust of outsiders). Belinda’s spirit may not be responding specifically to Marjory, but demonstrating the importance of family in general. Marjory represents not only her family, but is also her family member who is going to be going into the most danger in the foreseeable future, and thus she’s the one Belinda protects.

@Samuli: There seems to be a bug in which some order-specific dialogue comes even if you’re not a member of an order. For instance, Ela Makkay has referred to my Whispers character and Konig’s Vigil character as a ‘Scholar’ – according to dialogue posted on the wiki, this is supposed to be a Priory-only dialogue and there is alternate dialogue for members of other orders, but teh Priory dialogue is firing regardless.

KdT wrote: “… I hate my character whenever I interact with Canach …” – Yeah, same feeling here. :-D However, as I know that my sweet char has her own agenda with Canach (asking him for a favour dear to her – and his – heart), I can view these dialogues as part of their secret mission. :-)

Really enjoyed this patch, some more historical dimension / depth / epicness sips back into the storyline. There are also nice crisp encounters everywhere which made you wish for more (like the dialogue with the Zephyrite masters, for instance). The library, of course! Think it will become my favorite spot to go back to for some more reading. :-)

The pacing is still not perfect, imho. The overall dynamic through the storyline is not really balanced, as well as the transition between the instances, between lore-heavy parts, more or less cinematics and the combat heavy parts.

For what its worth, here are some pictures from Rémi Heltzer’s yesterdays adventures in “Echoes of the Past” – played it through in one piece: www.tumblr.com/blog/aurora16875 – to me, it shows how much the story improved – its simply beautiful stuff! Could be a great animated movie! :-)

I personally do not care about any minor plot inconsistencies or retcons of GW1 lore. It’s a game I played over five years ago, which had a lot of minute plot details, and I’m sure you could make it contradict itself as much as GW2 if you really wanted to make the effort.

Reunion of the Pact was great. The camp seemed alive and organic, and the marching tune really helped. Caithe’s recon squad had good chemistry between Caithe and Canach (less so between the PC and Canach, especially as someone who missed the update where Canach was captured), but the final combat sequence didn’t really convey that you were supposed to stay by the base of the ledge. I ended up just running all the way back to the mission beginning, and I know others just climbed down the cliffs.

Hidden Arcana was just magical. I spent quite some time just marveling at the Priory basement and reading all the books. Ogden was coyly telling me to touch the hourglass and I thought it was just going to be a cutscene to wrap up what was my favorite Living Story chapter. Glint’s Lair absolutely blindsided me. Huge kudos to the art team for that and the library, and kudos to the direction for the way it was set up. Only issues were with the gameplay: only the instance owner could read the books, you’d have to sit through a lot of dead space when doing achievement/skin runs, and the boss fights had a lot of downtime as well.

Having a separate achievement instance of the last mission was really great and I hope it gets expanded on in later installments. I’d be thrilled to see the option to choose between an achievement/completion version and a story version of a given mission, where the former cuts out a lot of downtime and cutscenes. I adored Hidden Arcana, but I had to complete it five times for achievements/Carapace skins, and having to watch all the cutscenes and wait for Marge and Kas to walk somewhere over and over kind of killed the magic for me. Yes yes, I didn’t have to do any of that, but the reward for doing so was really, really shiny, and I am only human after all.

The references to class and race are great and do a lot to help with immersion. Taking a sylvari through the living story stands in pretty sharp contrast to the personal story, where the Pale Tree didn’t recognize you and your accomplishments were retconned to be Trahearne’s. Incidentally, is there any hope of seeing the player characters’ voice actors again? I realize it involves bringing in ten VAs to do the work of one, but I really miss my sassy mushroom voiced by Jennifer Hale.