Guild Wars 2

Are these NPC’s supposed to be Guild Wars 2’s version of Devona, Cynn, Aidan, Mhenlo, and Eve?

More like Living Story version of Caithe, Logan, Rytlock, Zojja and Eir.

lordkrall.7241:

More like Living Story version of Caithe, Logan, Rytlock, Zojja and Eir.

Yeah I was thinking that too. More like a Destiny’s Edge v2

Caithe, Logan, Rytlock, Zojja and Eir are referred to as the Iconics.

Rox, Braham, Marjory, Kasmeer, and Taimi are referred to as the Bi -conics.

Thus, it seems they are the second iteration, so to speak, of the original Iconics.

I like these characters way more than those kittens from destiny’s edge

They’re actually known as Destiny’s Orphans.

GW2’s “Mystery men” lol

Taimi has the best lines.

“I don’t have a fop to quote…”

Niels.5396:

I like these characters way more than those kittens from destiny’s edge

I like Destiny’s Edge a lot more than them. I miss adventuring with Eir and Rytlock.

I would have thought Destiny’s Edge was the GW2 version of the Ascalon five, although the GW1 NPCs were never intrusive in the story. They may have turned up all over Tyria but the story was almost never about them. It’s one of the things I liked better about the GW1 NPCs.

Vesuvius.9874:

They’re actually known as Destiny’s Orphans.

Actually, no they aren’t. That was scrapped (read: never came to canon) dialogue. Just like Arachnia or Abaddon’s Dead Children, it holds no weight in the canon story.

Scott McGough.6897:

Tanith.5264:

Taimi has the best lines.

“I don’t have a fop to quote…”

Thank you! So glad you like Taimi’s dialogue, and specifically that line. It’s one of my faves, too (and it’s hard for me to pick a fave because Taimi’s way fun to write).

I could listen to you talk about character design and development all day long. It’s a real pleasure to hear your passion for the writing when you speak.

I know how she got her name, but did you happen to have any alternative names for Taimi (or Rox, Marjory, etc.) that you, personally, were fond of, but they ended up not being chosen for various reasons?

lordkrall.7241:

More like Living Story version of Caithe, Logan, Rytlock, Zojja and Eir.

What I don’t get is if they’re supposed to be the Living Story version of Destiny’s Edge why are there 2 humans and no Sylvari?

That Other Guy.7351:

lordkrall.7241:

More like Living Story version of Caithe, Logan, Rytlock, Zojja and Eir.

What I don’t get is if they’re supposed to be the Living Story version of Destiny’s Edge why are there 2 humans and no Sylvari?

I’m sure that the writers really looked into the species dynamics of the B-iconics when planning out S1 with the knowledge that the enemy was a sylvari. I have some guesses as to why they opted to omit this species from the B-iconic team for S1, but they are just guesses.

I really wonder how the dynamics of the characters’ relationships would have been impacted (with Scarlet having been the villain) had there been a sylvari as part of the group. How very differently S1 could have played out.

The group finds out that the enemy of Tyria is a sylvari. Had there been a sylvari component of the group, that character’s becoming conflicted over Scarlet and her actions could have been a real ‘growing’ experience.

I do not think that the hate for all sylvari by the peoples of Tyria (that came about after Scarlet was taken down) would have even become an issue since one of the people in the group that took her down would have been a sylvari as well. This would have shown the people that the sylvari were not even ok with how Scarlet was acting, that a sylvari assisted in ending the Scarlet threat. Had there been a sylvari among the heroes, the growing hatred for all sylvari would not have come about, just the hatred for Scarlet where her being sylvari would not even have been paid much attention.

An alternate path for the story could have been the emotional aspect for the PC were the sylvari of our group to have fallen into Nightmare during the Nightmares Within or Tower of Nightmares releases. This could have given an interesting comparison for the B-iconic team to the Caithe and Faolain situation (and a sylvari personal story), as well as being reminiscent of the entire personal story with the deaths of the mentors.

Or, what if Scarlet thought that perhaps ‘our sylvari’ group member could be capable of seeing things as she saw them, and that Scarlet tried to get ‘our sylvari’ onto her side. What if ‘our sylvari’ did seem to go to Scarlet’s side for a bit, but was really playing Scarlet to find out her secrets (like where her secret workshop was) so as to help us to take her down . Or if ‘our sylvari’ encountered her nightmare in the nightmare chamber, which was to fall into Nightmare, and then overcame that fear. I believe that would have been real good character development for us to witness.

There were a lot of possibilities for our group and for the story, but it is too late for those possibilities to be reality as LS:S1 is over and Scarlet is dead (or is she? dun-dun-dunnnn). If a sylvari becomes a part of our group in Season 2, much like Taimi, an asura, became part of our group toward the end of S1, then the sylvari would need to be introduced immediately for the group dynamics to adjust to their addition prior to the meat of S2 happening. Unless the adjustment to the group dynamics intentionally stretches the entire season due to their being a sylvari. Perhaps it would take the entire season for some elements of our group to accept a sylvari into it after what happened with Scarlet. If we are going to march on Mordremoth over this season, perhaps elements of what I have written will come out over the entire season; elements of trust, fear, judgment, acceptance, etc).

I’m actually really excited to see what they end up having happen over Season 2.

Sorry for the disorganized rantings, was just spewing thoughts out as they came to me after reading your question.

Scott McGough.6897:

StinVec.3621:

Scott McGough.6897:

Tanith.5264:

Taimi has the best lines.

“I don’t have a fop to quote…”

Thank you! So glad you like Taimi’s dialogue, and specifically that line. It’s one of my faves, too (and it’s hard for me to pick a fave because Taimi’s way fun to write).

I could listen to you talk about character design and development all day long. It’s a real pleasure to hear your passion for the writing when you speak.

I know how she got her name, but did you happen to have any alternative names for Taimi (or Rox, Marjory, etc.) that you, personally, were fond of, but they ended up not being chosen for various reasons?

Thanks very much—it’s a topic I love exploring, and as such it’s not often people tell me to keep talking about it. ;-)

Angel McCoy had the names for Rox and Taimi ready to go, and we liked them so much we didn’t have to think of alternatives. Fortunately they both passed all the subsequent reviews by Editing, QA, lead writer, etc..

I remember collaborating on Marjory’s name, in that Angel had the first name locked in and I think I suggested the surname. Or maybe it was vice-versa. It was a team effort, in any case, and once we put ’em together we were happy with the result.

I’m going to refrain from listing the alternates we suggested because we might need ‘em later. During the brainstorming process for names (namestorming?), we usually generate several ideas that we like, and those we don’t use we usually put aside in case we can apply them to another character later on.

But I can say, as a huge MST3K fan, I try to avoid names that sound like they’re from the list that Mike and the ‘bots generated for the hero of the MST3K classic “Space Mutiny.” (e.g., Rip Steakface! Bulk VanderHuge!). Sometimes it’s harder than others (I’m looking at you, charr and norn).

Cheers,

I don’t know what I was thinking asking that question as I know all too well how the “saving of great names for later, just in case” thing goes. When you come up with a real good name, it is sometimes more fun (and even easier) to create a character that fits the name instead of coming up with a name for an existing character. Much like the situation of one writing great music and then coming up with proper lyrics for it afterward versus writing great lyrics and then coming up with the appropriate music to put them to.

MST3K, oh the many laughs (and tears) they’ve given me over the years. Thanks for mentioning them! Other players have made more than enough charr and norn with those type of names for my taste, so your efforts in staying clear of those type of names are much appreciated!

Thank you for the response!

BobbyStein.2315:

StinVec.3621:

I know how she got her name, but did you happen to have any alternative names for Taimi (or Rox, Marjory, etc.) that you, personally, were fond of, but they ended up not being chosen for various reasons?

Braham’s original name was Dyre, but some felt that the pronunciation sounded too much like “Die, Eir” so it was changed. Considering their strained relationship, this was for the best.

Thank you for your response on this as well!

Wow…
Yeah, I think that was a real good call, especially since BroHam has become legendary in his own right! That would not have been possible had he been named Dyre and caused players to think he really wanted his mother dead. I know he doesn’t like her much, but want her dead? I don’t think so. Or, as Eir was the one that named him, that she blamed him and his being born for her life/legend-forging coming to an end prematurely (or so she may have thought at the time) and so named him as such.

Yes, a real good call.

However, I do like the name “Dyre”, though it does ring a bit close to “Pyre” in sound and spelling, which we have had for a long time. I wonder if we will see an NPC someplace in the game someday where you pass “Dyre” on to be used, and perhaps by an NPC that really, really does not like Eir.

(Also, we’re still hoping to hear Taimi ask Braham if he likes ham in some random little conversation between the two and that you’ve not forgotten that legend-forging thread that Matthew Medina’s comment spawned)

That Other Guy.7351:

lordkrall.7241:

More like Living Story version of Caithe, Logan, Rytlock, Zojja and Eir.

What I don’t get is if they’re supposed to be the Living Story version of Destiny’s Edge why are there 2 humans and no Sylvari?

Canach will be out of his cage soon.

I don’t see why a sylvari should feel any differently about Scarlet to any of the other races. All of the races have their opposing factions (Nightmare Court, Flame Legion, Bandits, Inquest and Svanir) and they’ve all shown willingness to fight and kill them.

The game would quickly get ridiculous if every character was expected to act conflicted and consider joining the other side every time the enemy was the same race.

(Also for many players there was a sylvari in the group, who was apparently their leader.)

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

Caithe, Logan, Rytlock, Zojja and Eir are referred to as the Iconics.

Rox, Braham, Marjory, Kasmeer, and Taimi are referred to as the Bi -conics.

Thus, it seems they are the second iteration, so to speak, of the original Iconics.

I miss destiny’s edge

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Vesuvius.9874:

They’re actually known as Destiny’s Orphans.

Actually, no they aren’t. That was scrapped (read: never came to canon) dialogue. Just like Arachnia or Abaddon’s Dead Children, it holds no weight in the canon story.

Re: Arachnia and Abaddon’s Dead Children: you don’t know that for certain. We definitely shouldn’t definitively say that they’re canon, but equally we can’t say for certain that they aren’t, either.

For those who don’t know, information about Arachnia, the god who Abaddon deposed to gain his power (in the same way Kormir later deposed Abaddon), and a set of demi-gods who were the children of Abaddon, opposed him, and were killed, was obtained from the gw.dat, along with a large number of other text strings that provided lore and flavour relating to Elona. Much of this lore was new, although most of it wasn’t as significant as Arachnia, and some of it was “confirmed” in-game through other means such as NPC dialogue, allowing some of the landmarks to specifically be identified Although none of it (to my knowledge) has been contradicted, the argument is that since none of the lore is actually explicitly confirmed in-game, we shouldn’t take it too seriously, since it could easily be changed (and indeed, could have been already) without contradicting the established story if ANet decide to take the world in a different direction.

EDIT: I should also point out that in BWE2, Arachnia Plateau was a Guild Wars 2 world name, which is an indication that Arachnia and the surrounding lore had not been forgotten

Scott McGough.6897:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Vesuvius.9874:

They’re actually known as Destiny’s Orphans.

Actually, no they aren’t. That was scrapped (read: never came to canon) dialogue. Just like Arachnia or Abaddon’s Dead Children, it holds no weight in the canon story.

Confirmed: “Destiny’s Orphans” is not the official name of the adventuring group that includes Rox, Braham, Taimi, Marjory, and Kasmeer.

It was playfully mentioned in a scene between Rox and Kasmeer, but it’s not their official name.

Oh snap! Maybe it’s just me but sometimes it’s hard to understand what to take seriously and what not to. There have been random NPC dialogues in game that I thought were “ah they’re just rambling on about random stuff that has no impact on anything whatsoever”, but turns out it’s an important part of the GW2 lore (can’t remember any specific dialogues atm).

At other times, like Rox mentioning Destiny’s Orphans, I thought “naah, maybe I should stop thinking like that. This is their name now.” but turns out it isn’t.

Anyway, I thought Destiny’s Orphans was a cool name. It was a definite nod to Destiny’s Edge, a legendary guild that really hasn’t received much recognition in game given their deeds. So when Rox suggested they be called Destiny’s Orphans, I thought it was really cool that they wanted to emulate and become these legendary heroes they look up to.

Vesuvius.9874:

Oh snap! Maybe it’s just me but sometimes it’s hard to understand what to take seriously and what not to. There have been random NPC dialogues in game that I thought were “ah they’re just rambling on about random stuff that has no impact on anything whatsoever”, but turns out it’s an important part of the GW2 lore (can’t remember any specific dialogues atm).

At other times, like Rox mentioning Destiny’s Orphans, I thought “naah, maybe I should stop thinking like that. This is their name now.” but turns out it isn’t.

The main reason that’s not their name is because that line was never actually used in-game. It was data-mined and talked about on Reddit, but the in-game conversation that was actually used in the Dead End didn’t include that line.

BobbyStein.2315:

Braham’s original name was Dyre, but some felt that the pronunciation sounded too much like “Die, Eir” so it was changed. Considering their strained relationship, this was for the best.

Good thing he isn’t an elementalist. Every time he’d switch to lightning, he’d shout “Glorious Eir!”.

(Which is one of two lines in the game I keep mishearing. The other one is from the announcer on Spirit Watch. I never really understood why the orb has a beard.)

Xiahou Mao.9701:

Vesuvius.9874:

Oh snap! Maybe it’s just me but sometimes it’s hard to understand what to take seriously and what not to. There have been random NPC dialogues in game that I thought were “ah they’re just rambling on about random stuff that has no impact on anything whatsoever”, but turns out it’s an important part of the GW2 lore (can’t remember any specific dialogues atm).

At other times, like Rox mentioning Destiny’s Orphans, I thought “naah, maybe I should stop thinking like that. This is their name now.” but turns out it isn’t.

The main reason that’s not their name is because that line was never actually used in-game. It was data-mined and talked about on Reddit, but the in-game conversation that was actually used in the Dead End didn’t include that line.

No it was actually mentioned in game by Rox. It wasn’t data mined. See below.

Scott McGough.6897:

It was playfully mentioned in a scene between Rox and Kasmeer, but it’s not their official name.