Guild Wars 2

Any good story is told by characters.

Characters that on one cares about will result in a story that no one cares about.

Characters take time to develop. Your audience has to learn to love them or hate them. Their experiences shapes the story and the world. When they die; we will mourn or we will celebrate.

Make your characters important; give us time to love them; then make them stab us in the back. Let these characters change the world so severely that we as players must work together to save what’s left of it.

I don’t know anything about Queen Jenna. She sounds like an important person but; apparently for a Queen she doesn’t do anything worth talking about.

It is tough to say who will be coming back in future releases. The story is still quite young, so it is difficult to really say if it is meaningful.

Calae.1738:

Any good story is told my characters.

Characters that on one cares about will result in a story that no one cares about.

Characters take time to develop. Your audience has to learn to love them or hate them. Their experiences shapes the story and the world. When they die; we will mourn or we will celebrate.

Make your characters important; give us time to love them; then make them stab us in the back. Let these characters change the world so severely that we as players must work together to save what’s left of it.

I don’t know anything about Queen Jenna. She sounds like an important person but; apparently for a Queen she doesn’t do anything worth talking about.

You know, maybe the reason you feel there are no important characters is because you obviously haven’t put a single ounce of effort into learning about them.

Queen Jennah is involved a good bit in the human personal storyline, mentioned throughout the whole game by NPCs in various areas, she’s pretty much the only reason why the Charr and Humans have a peace treaty, you have to free her from a political rival with bandits in CM’s story mode, and so on. Also, we’ve had Inspector Kiel for almost a year now for us to learn to “love” her. At first she was awesome, then when SoS came around I started to really not like her just due to the fact that she wasn’t on the refugee’s sides(Which makes very good sense for her character), and then she “slipped up” and totally didn’t let some refugees plant bombs on the Consortium’s ship which was escorting documents about the refugees. That made me respect her and start liking her again, then she’s here yet again for Dragon Bash and Aetherblade Retreat being a kitten as usual. And there’s probably gonna be something else with her when we get to talk to Mai today which makes me like Kiel even more.

She has had lots of time to develop, and imo she’s developed pretty kitten well. And if you think she’s not important then Lion’s Arch may be a lot worse off without her due to how incredibly helpful she’s been. Just as the players(Well, human ones) are the Heroes of Shaemoor, Kiel is the Hero of Lion’s Arch. That’s not an official title or anything, but the comparison is there. If she dies I’ll be pretty kitten sad too. I’ve actually never seen a single negative thing said about Kiel, only positive. And seeing as how she’s essentially the protagonist of all the recent LS updates I’ll assume that’s who you’re talking about when you talk about making characters we actually like.

EDIT:

Oh, then there’s Rox and Brahm who both had pretty good backstories and were awesome in-game with good development. Cannach had a good story and development too, it’s just a shame that it didn’t translate well to in-game. Then there’s Lady Kasmeer who everybody is suspicious of and constantly coming up with theories about – same with Mr. E – and now there’s Mrs. Noir(I forget her name on the spot, Marjory something?) that I’ve seen tons of people talk about loving her.

The characters in the Living Story are dealing with small matters. It’s like being in a boring meeting talking why the stock market dipped 2% yesterday.

Calae.1738:

The characters in the Living Story are dealing with small matters. It’s like being in a boring meeting talking why the stock market dipped 2% yesterday.

This much I greatly disagree with.

We’ve dealt with a bunch of terrorists invading charr and norn lands and causing refugees to flee. We end that by escorting the living story characters through a giant and dangerous mine where the terrorists are hiding out to plant a bomb and end it.

We’ve dealt with taking care of an assassin at Southsun.

We’ve dealt with a murder investigation.

We’ve dealt with protecting a city from pirates.

Unless you think that terrorists, murderers, assassins and pirates are small matters?

Calae.1738:

The characters in the Living Story are dealing with small matters. It’s like being in a boring meeting talking why the stock market dipped 2% yesterday.

Oh really? With the Molten Alliance you don’t think it would have been bad if the Dredge and Flame Legion Charrs became more powerful than they were able to? Countless numbers more of Norn and Charr would have been killed. And apparently then having to fight to keep all the refugees who already lost their homes alive while they’re practically enslaved by the Consortium is something incredibly petty according to you. Then you’ve got Dragon Bash which served it’s purpose exactly as a fun festival. Nothing major or life-threatening had to happen then. You know why? Because it was a holiday. Then with the Aetherblades we got a bit of that anyways. What do you think would have happened if LA lost it’s leadership like the Aetherblades wanted? The only truly neutral area in Tyria for all races would have been lost. I doubt anything good would happen from it. In the worst case scenario the whole city could have been lost(This also could have happened with the original Lost Shores update). If the whole city had been lost/taken over/occupied/etc then a TON of trade would be ruined, there wouldn’t be any more easy travelling between cities via the gates, and nobody would have a place to gamble with the mystic toilet. Does that really all count as small matters? The whole point of the Living Story is to give a feeling of life to the world that isn’t just about dragons 100% of the time. Just like with our world we have major issues all over it, and then we have smaller-but-still-important issues too. Most of the times when you play games – especially MMOs – there is only 1 overall problem. In GW2 there is the major overall problem of the dragons, and then all these other problems too.

Omg A Hotpocket.7683:

Calae.1738:

The characters in the Living Story are dealing with small matters. It’s like being in a boring meeting talking why the stock market dipped 2% yesterday.

Oh really? With the Molten Alliance you don’t think it would have been bad if the Dredge and Flame Legion Charrs became more powerful than they were able to? Countless numbers more of Norn and Charr would have been killed.

What do you mean what if?

How about instead of preventing destruction; we failed to stop it. We fight trying to save what’s left of it and rebuild.

The molten alliance story was like a convenient store robbery. No one cares. No one will care long after it happened.

Calae.1738:

What do you mean what if?

What do you mean what do I mean what if? I said “With the Molten Alliance you don’t think it would have been bad if the Dredge and Flame Legion Charrs became more powerful than they were able to?”. We stopped the Molten Alliance before they could get any more powerful. I asked what do you think would have happened if we didn’t stop them in time and they just continued to grow in power.

Calae.1738:

How about instead of preventing destruction; we failed to stop it. We fight trying to save what’s left of it and rebuild.

Isn’t that pretty much exactly what we’re doing now? Before the defeat of Zhaitan everybody was just trying to survive and rebuild. The world has already been lost to the dragons, and now we’re all trying to take it back. However, just as real villains would do so, they come up and try to attack while the good guys(us) are weak/pre-occupied with the dragons. If there was something powerful enough to just completely destroy everything then there wouldn’t be much of a story left. The entirety of the Human race in-game is doing exactly what you just said. Humans used to be all over the kitten ed place in Tyria, now they’re just a small fraction of what they used to be.

Calae.1738:

The molten alliance story was like a convenient store robbery. No one cares. No one will care long after it happened.

So nobody’s going to care about – as Jemmi called them – terrorists that completely destroyed several villages and killed tons of people? Or how about the fact that they created an entirely new form of magic+technology? Or the fact that somebody somehow got them working together and that person is still at large? And how the hell was it “convenient”? I don’t think that word means what you think it means.

It left a permanent change in the world. Refugees got sent to Southsun, two new areas(Nolani Hatchery and Cragstead), new NPCs, and it added to the lore of the world. The Living Story completed it’s purpose in doing so. As for people who “don’t care” is that why people are always whining about how the LS is temporary and they can’t go back to do things like F&F?

Calae.1738:

Not enough of an impact for anyone to really care about any of these stories.

You want something meaningful?

Queen Jenna gets killed trying to stop a rebellion and Divinty’s Reach becomes a war zone. Centaurs take advantage and humans are fighting a war on 2 fronts. The Asura, Charr and Norn leadership don’t give a hoot which increases tensions among the races.

I’d like to log in one day and have the world completely flipped upside down no matter how many RP carebears get inconvenienced.

I’m legit starting to think you’re trolling.

If Queen Jennah got killed they would have to rework a lot of things. CM, NPC dialogue, Personal Story, etc.. And why would the humans be fighting a war on 2 fronts? Also, why the hell would humans form a rebellion? The closest thing to a large-scale rebellion that there is would be the citizens of Ebonhawke who are already closely watched by the Fallen Angels as well as having Order of Whispers members hidden in the city who would know if anything was gonna go on. The Centaurs have also already been pushed back and essentially taken care of for the most part. You have to remember that major meta events should be considered pre-living story too.

Champion Modniir Ulgoth the Mighty is the War King and High Sage of the Modniir centaur tribe. He is responsible for uniting the modniir after they were mostly destroyed two hundred years ago by humans and norn. After reuniting the Modniir, he led them into a forced alliance with the Tamini and Harathi centaurs and began a new war on humans and norn, seeking revenge.

And guess what? He’s dead. The leader of the centaurs we fight in-game is dead.

So not only is there practically no more fighting with the Charr(only a few seperatists remain), no more Zhaitain and his Risen armies, and no more major Centaur threat, the humans are very close to having a major comeback in this world. Everything is going right for them with little-to-no problems. The only reason that there would ever be a rebellion in this day and age among humans would be because of the alliance with the Charr, and as I already pointed out, most humans are fine with the Charr now. Especially after they helped to kick Zhaitan’s kitten .

The world wouldn’t just be an inconvenience to RP’ers(Hell, it would HELP RP probably.), but it would be a major story/game-breaking inconvenience to a lot of people.

One last thing. I highly doubt the Norn, Charr, and Asura leadership “wouldn’t give a hoot”. Why? Because they’re all smart enough to know that having alliances with each other helps everybody out. If even one of the major races of Tyria possibly decided not to help with the fight against Zhaitan then it could have possibly turned out a LOT worse. They all know that. The bond between races has only been strengthened more and more since the game’s launch, and I fail to see that bond weakening anytime soon.

The bond between races has only been strengthened more and more since the game’s launch, and I fail to see that bond weakening anytime soon.

That’ll continue to make stories that no one cares about.

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

Calae.1738:

The bond between races has only been strengthened more and more since the game’s launch, and I fail to see that bond weakening anytime soon.

That’ll continue to make stories that no one cares about.

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

From Wikipedia, the most watched shows are MASH, Cheers and Seinfeld with 125, 84 and 76 million viewers each (Game of Thrones is 141st on the list). Now, I don’t know these shows very well, but I get the impression that none of them have the same faction-like tension that you are suggesting.

Note: I do love Game of Thrones TV Show and book; however, one major difference between Game of Thrones and what you are suggesting is that the tensions and struggles are actually believable given the course of the story.

Jemmi.6058:

Calae.1738:

The bond between races has only been strengthened more and more since the game’s launch, and I fail to see that bond weakening anytime soon.

That’ll continue to make stories that no one cares about.

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

From Wikipedia, the most watched shows are MASH, Cheers and Seinfeld with 125, 84 and 76 million viewers each (Game of Thrones is 141st on the list). Now, I don’t know these shows very well, but I get the impression that none of them have the same faction-like tension that you are suggesting.

Note: I do love Game of Thrones TV Show and book; however, one major difference between Game of Thrones and what you are suggesting is that the tensions and struggles are actually believable given the course of the story.

How can you compare viewership to shows that have run for a different length of time…

RoRo.8270:

Jemmi.6058:

Calae.1738:

The bond between races has only been strengthened more and more since the game’s launch, and I fail to see that bond weakening anytime soon.

That’ll continue to make stories that no one cares about.

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

From Wikipedia, the most watched shows are MASH, Cheers and Seinfeld with 125, 84 and 76 million viewers each (Game of Thrones is 141st on the list). Now, I don’t know these shows very well, but I get the impression that none of them have the same faction-like tension that you are suggesting.

Note: I do love Game of Thrones TV Show and book; however, one major difference between Game of Thrones and what you are suggesting is that the tensions and struggles are actually believable given the course of the story.

How can you compare viewership to shows that have run for a different length of time…

Viewership is based on an episode, not a total.

EDIT: To clarify, these are Season/Series finale numbers and not the highest viewed episode of the series. For example, Lost series finale had 13.6 Million viewers and there were 23.47 million viewers on the season 2 premiere. That said, no episode of Game of Thrones has come near 125 million viewers.

I think the OP wants to say that these living stories should alter the current state of the game in a way that it will feel different. A sort of permanent change,
Lets think of Brahan and Rox. Where are they now? We should see them in the respective zones participating / starting different events.
And later, when or if they will make another episode with them, we already know them from the world (if we are new players) or from the Molten Alliance story (if we have already experienced it)
We helped them save their village. Did they just vanish in the air?

No Braham is in Cragstead infact, he even received a letter from his mother. Rox I haven’t bothered checking in a while, but should be having troubles entering Rytlock’s warband.

Calae.1738:

The bond between races has only been strengthened more and more since the game’s launch, and I fail to see that bond weakening anytime soon.

That’ll continue to make stories that no one cares about.

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

Now you’re just turning this into an argument about opinion in which case nobody can win because there is no “right” opinion. We get it, you don’t personally like the story so far. That’s your opinion. Lots of people do like the story so far. Most of the complaining comes from the execution and temporary nature of the content instead of the story.

Also, I do follow GoT books and the TV show, so no need to tell me to go watch or read it. Again, it all comes down to opinion if that’s your only remaining point in this discussion.

Calae.1738:

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

Because a lot of episodes are basically softcore porn?

Oh, that wasn’t your point.

synk.6907:

Calae.1738:

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

Because a lot of episodes are basically softcore porn?

Oh, that wasn’t your point.

Actually that could be a good suggestion

synk.6907:

Calae.1738:

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

Because a lot of episodes are basically softcore porn?

Oh, that wasn’t your point.

What planet do you live on? Does anyone have any meaningful relationships on this planet? Does anyone hate each other, fight over land, power and resources? Does anyone ever fall in love?

I suppose not; this game is rated T afterall. More Scooby-Doo villians would suffice.

Calae.1738:

synk.6907:

Calae.1738:

Go watch Game of Thrones and ask yourself why that show is watched by over 5 million people.

Because a lot of episodes are basically softcore porn?

Oh, that wasn’t your point.

What planet do you live on? Does anyone have any meaningful relationships on this planet? Does anyone hate each other, fight over land, power and resources? Does anyone ever fall in love?

I suppose not; this game is rated T afterall. More Scooby-Doo villians would suffice.

I can hear Mai Trin/Mad King/ Sub Director Noll/Canach “And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren’t for those meddlesome kids.”

The concepts and the stories themselves are not bad; they just didn’t translate well into the game so far.

Take for example Flame and Frost. Cool idea. Here are some quotes:

“The sky falls and the ground shakes in the lands of the north…..when earth and sky seem to have become the enemy…”

“The storm there gains momentum, but the forces of good are beginning to rally…”

“….the stakes are raised, and battles rage, in the foothills of the Shiverpeaks.”

When I read about it, I had imagined something else. I had taken it more literally, I guess. I had imagined the sky of Wayfarer Foothills actually turning red, similar to the one in the Northlands of pre-searing (ss attached). An incredibly violent snow/ash storm making it hard to see very far, maybe even giving you a debuff similar to blind. Proper sound effects. Squads of dredges and flame legion patrolling the whole place. Really basic, simple things to implement – and they would’ve had a direct impact on the player.

What we got was basically a line of refugees and two homesteads with flaming portals.

The idea was nice. The story was tragic. It just didn’t feel that way at all ing, because we weren’t truly involved in it, we were told what happened by the refugees. The instances were nice, but they contributed to making the whole story feel like a series of small events – instead of a large scale one.

Southsun and the Sky Pirates had their own issues but surely counted as an improvement, so I’m looking forward to their next one.

it seems to me people just don’t want to play anymore and yet stick around because they have nothing better to do. If you don’t like the stories and being there watching the world be built. Go play another game. I can name 50 other games that have a simple quest chain and you can just simply dungeon crawl and enjoy your own time. The fact is people love this game and GW2 gets new players every week and then they love the game. If it’s not the game for you, then it’s not the game for you, it’s as simple as that. You don’t have to like, you don’t have to do anything. It’s your life, but please don’t try to spoil it for the rest of us that do like it.

fuzzypanda.9365:

it seems to me people just don’t want to play anymore and yet stick around because they have nothing better to do. If you don’t like the stories and being there watching the world be built. Go play another game.

I will.

Those games are just not out yet. In the meantime I’m going to point out to Arenanet why their stories are for children and how to make them more meaningful. I’m not holding my breath though; MMO developers are notorious for writing terrible dialog and creating very forgettable characters.

fuzzypanda.9365:

it seems to me people just don’t want to play anymore and yet stick around because they have nothing better to do. If you don’t like the stories and being there watching the world be built. Go play another game. I can name 50 other games that have a simple quest chain and you can just simply dungeon crawl and enjoy your own time. The fact is people love this game and GW2 gets new players every week and then they love the game. If it’s not the game for you, then it’s not the game for you, it’s as simple as that. You don’t have to like, you don’t have to do anything. It’s your life, but please don’t try to spoil it for the rest of us that do like it.

I love this game. But at the same time, if ANet only got positive feedback, how would they ever know what was working well for the playerbase and what wasn’t?

Developers need honest feedback to be able to make their game the best it can be; providing that feedback isn’t malice or disloyalty, it’s the player’s part of the player/developer equation.