Guild Wars 2

Not sure if anet hates glass builds or if 3rd level is designed to be done with a group.
It’s been impossible to solo when I keep getting killed any time I get knocked down or feared. Its bad enough that there is way to many mobs up there but ALL of them are stacking some sort of debuff constantly, (DoT effects, fear, knockdowns, and cripple) I think this floor really needs to be looked at imho…

I believe it is supposed to be done with a group. I died many times with my ranger.
She was wearing her experimental Assassin build, though. I will try to solo the third level with my condition necro later.

(But taking into account that berserker is the most used stat combo and almost all PvE is about DPSing down everything, I really doubt that ANet hates glass builds)

I can’t hardly get a group because it is solo-able for most other players. When I do get a group, it says ‘cannot connect to login server’ and now my group is inside and I am alone in my own instance.

I have yet to run this in a group (after my initial run). Been trying for an hour.

I’d like to know that also. My zerker thief has been yo-yoing up and down for like 30-40 times and it’s 3rd floor that gets me. Only time i’ve made it to the top is when i sumbled to a large zerg. Not that i’m complaining because i support challenges and all but it is beginning to hurt my wallet, i’m poor and 5 silver per yo-yo game times 30 makes a dent in my wallet.

All i’ve learned about the tower is in 3rd floor if you solo and stop to rez someone you’re dead, if you get stunned you’re dead, if you go with a small group to clear the path you will all die thanks to the respawn.

i like the instances tho, but the road to get to them is starting to kitten me off.

Solo’d easy on my zerker ele 0/30/0/10/30. Just gotta dodge.

The whole “just gotta dodge” cant apply for 3rd level since you literally have to dodge something every few seconds or take the hit that will kill u if your vitality and toughness is not way up there or if you don’t have enough cleanse/escape skills to negate the constant DoT’s and knockdowns

You are trading your toughness and vitality in a glass build. Don’t complain about downing all the time if you cannot dodge. It’s YOUR build. Own it.

I have ran dungeons with glass warriors complaining about the lack of dps the rest of the team does when he goes down every 5 seconds… not impressed.

I don’t think you are reading anything that I wrote, 3rd level has LITTLE TO DO WITH DODGING. I can dodge I do dodge but NO ONE in this game is going to be able to dodge every few seconds, and that literally means every few seconds. NOT minutes.
The fact is that the mobs on the 3rd floor all do either knockdowns, DoT’s, or cripples and the mobs are stacked very closely together resulting in a spam fest of all these negative effects. This in return means that there is NO possible way to avoid everything being thrown at you unless your running with a group. And for some glass builds that means 3rd level floor is impossible to be solo.

It’s not too bad imo. You just have to change up your utilities fairly often (at those air pumps). I ran it zerk guard and with a couple of people it’s not a very difficult fight. Just need to stay on your toes and watch for spawns.

I can see why folks are frustrated but I think it’s meant to push your reaction times. Anyways, some of the better content out there in LS. Good luck with it. Oh and OP, Anet doesn’t “hate glass” if the current meta game is any evidence to this.

Honestly if you’re dying a lot, you may be able to thank the staff camping guards and PVT range toons that take agro right to you but do nothing to help you kill.

Many other living story updates have favored zerker builds (I’m looking at you Scarlet update!), the ones where people would just blob around a map spamming skills to get tags. I think this is the first living story update where they are encouraging people to have more bunker-y kind of builds. That being said, you can still run zerker, just run the new heal that removes it…or get in a group with someone with a water field and you’ll be just fine.

Gillian.1859:

You are trading your toughness and vitality in a glass build. Don’t complain about downing all the time if you cannot dodge. It’s YOUR build. Own it.

I have ran dungeons with glass warriors complaining about the lack of dps the rest of the team does when he goes down every 5 seconds… not impressed.

Exactly. Let me elaborate: DPS should not be calculated—or estimated—as an ideal maximum, but as an average. This value may not be the same in every situation.

The key is that time spent waiting for your teammates to pick you up off the floor, (over…and over…and over again), counts heavily against you. Here are a couple reasons why:

• You are doing less damage with your downed skills than your standing ones. Make that none when you fall from downed to dead.
• Teammates reviving you are unable to activate most skills. This subtracts from your personal contribution to team DPS.

It is possible for your net damage contribution to be negative. In certain difficult modes of play, you simply cannot dodge everything, and moving points from offense to defense can actually increase your damage output.

I made it through the 3rd floor somewhat easily on my Ranger using the WvW setup I have for him (30/30/0/10/0, signet build, using LB and GS). As long as an event didn’t spawn, it was pretty easy for me to get up there without death.

Posting at work, can’t wait to try out this content after reading this. It’s kinda funny, sorry to say, to see this after soooo long of reading the ‘pro-zerker’ chants of dps dps dps, or ‘zerker or gtfo’… while i dont think Anet generally hates glass cannons, I do think its been felt that too many things PvE are just soo much simpler with a “dps dps dps” mindset that perhaps they thought some things shud be easier for those that can actually take hits? yknow, for variety’s sake?

bear in mind i generally dont mind ppl making glass cannons but seeing that this is an mmo, grouping up should be a viable solution to this..

Toxin ticks for 254 in there and its unavoidable, so its basically just run through to get to the top.

I made it though on my glass guard.

Considering the group event at the end you need to complete to continue I believe it was meant to be done in a group

Glass is just optimal, some people just aren’t very good at playing glass. I did it on my glass mesmer using a build I’ve never used before. If you want to solo it, make sure you have the skill and build to do so. If you don’t want to solo it, it’s not hard to acquire allies as you go along (even in overflows).

Honestly, until you have to take some damage and the most threatening attacks aren’t dodge or die, glass is always going to be optimal. This game doesn’t weigh defensive and offensive stats equally, the value of offensive stats is almost always great than defensive stats and this content is no different.

States.6387:

I don’t think you are reading anything that I wrote, 3rd level has LITTLE TO DO WITH DODGING. I can dodge I do dodge but NO ONE in this game is going to be able to dodge every few seconds, and that literally means every few seconds. NOT minutes.
The fact is that the mobs on the 3rd floor all do either knockdowns, DoT’s, or cripples and the mobs are stacked very closely together resulting in a spam fest of all these negative effects. This in return means that there is NO possible way to avoid everything being thrown at you unless your running with a group. And for some glass builds that means 3rd level floor is impossible to be solo.

Thief can dodge 9 times in a row with the proper traits/runes/sigils.

I can’t do it therefore it sucks.

/thread

I ran through it without problems as a thief, the only problem I found was when the events hitted, couldn’t solo it because of extra spawns

I went through the third floor twice already without dying on a full berserker Gs and sword/focus mesmer. It’s suppose to be difficult and the difficulty is just perfect.

States.6387:

Not sure if anet hates glass builds or if 3rd level is designed to be done with a group.
It’s been impossible to solo

From patchnote :

The interior of the Tower of Nightmares has been revealed, and it is as deadly as its name suggests. The Tower of Nightmares is an open-world map designed to challenge even the hardiest of groups. Fighting side by side, players will need to rely on each other to survive.

(emphasis mine)
So no, it isn’t designed to solo. The central chamber is, though.

It was no problem for me in full zerker gear, learn when to dodge etc…

States.6387:

Not sure if anet hates glass builds or if 3rd level is designed to be done with a group.

I think the Group Events blocking access to higher levels could be interpreted as a subtle hint

Now that you understand how difficult the content is inside the tower, build around it. Forsake your usual utilities for things that will help you survive—evades, distractions, CC, teleports, and/or invulnerabilities. Also consider changing one of your weapons to something more survivable; many weaponsets have built-in evades.

Maybe it’s time to bring toughness and vitality for a change. I run a toughness build, and have no trouble what so ever.

Sorry, I wanna answer with my point of view before I forget it so I haven’t read all the posts but…

Remember if you roll a glass build you will be squishy and glass builds are often made to be played in a group, if you expect to be doing more damage and survive as good as another player traited to survive a little better but by the cost of damage you are to stuck in doing CoF runs or something.

I have read so many posts that you don’t need anything else than Zerker gear and the rest is just crap and other won’t allow you to roll with them if you have cleric gear or something. I hate those posts and this LS totally changes that! No more Zerker only, now we actually need someone to help the classcannons to survive.

IMO you should have thought about not rolling a glasscannon if you play solo, it says it self. If I trait “tanky” it will take forever to win and new spawns will come and kill me in the end, if I trait Glasscannon I can kill very fast but will also die very fast, so if I solo I need something in between, to survive long enough and do enough damage to not have spawns in my back.

Pixelpumpkin.4608:

States.6387:

Not sure if anet hates glass builds or if 3rd level is designed to be done with a group.

I think the Group Events blocking access to higher levels could be interpreted as a subtle hint

That’s the charm with the whole tower at the moment in my opinion

I mean, I run solo at the start and Fight my way through (Not run), other players will catch up and we will fight togheter (Not run) and suddenly we can’t travel further, we have to fight an obstacle and while doing that even more players will end up joining up (not grouping up, it is not needed) and after the event we are or atleast are almost a zerg so that we easely fight through the tower (Not run) togheter. I love the concept to the fullest!

Why do they hate glass builds? I always thought main part of the game was to change build accordingly to the situation?

Neuroticus.4605:

I’d like to know that also. My zerker thief has been yo-yoing up and down for like 30-40 times and it’s 3rd floor that gets me. Only time i’ve made it to the top is when i sumbled to a large zerg. Not that i’m complaining because i support challenges and all but it is beginning to hurt my wallet, i’m poor and 5 silver per yo-yo game times 30 makes a dent in my wallet.

All i’ve learned about the tower is in 3rd floor if you solo and stop to rez someone you’re dead, if you get stunned you’re dead, if you go with a small group to clear the path you will all die thanks to the respawn.

i like the instances tho, but the road to get to them is starting to kitten me off.

I play a thief also and I was able to get up ok without dying… Although I do not run a glass build. On 3rd level I was relying heavily on my stealth though and on SB skill 5 to travel very fast past the mobs. All this with some dodging should do the trick. I also gain swiftness on dodge and leave caltrops. It may sound like nothing but it can just sneak you by in the last moment.
How much health do you have? I’m running around with around 17.5k, 18 with d/d. But my advice if the zerg is not around is RUN LIKE HELL and hope all passages are open.

if you play a thief, reroll please <<< that is message i got from tower

i love when ppl say, make another build… no matter what build you run thieves ARE glassy since their survival is non existant almost

stealth through? ayee……. can’t stealth through aoe

i did make it to the last instance but basically by walking over other ppl bodies

tbh i can deal with poison and other crap, but devs obsession with confusion really kills any content for me lately

There’s a time and a place for everything. It’s like taking a water type Pokemon up against a whole team if electric types and asking if Nintendo hates water types.

The gane is working as intended, you need to adjust your build to the situation at hand.

Everyone hates glass builds except for stubborn glass-builds users.

Cynz.9437:

if you play a thief, reroll please <<< that is message i got from tower

i love when ppl say, make another build… no matter what build you run thieves ARE glassy since their survival is non existant almost

stealth through? ayee……. can’t stealth through aoe

i did make it to the last instance but basically by walking over other ppl bodies

tbh i can deal with poison and other crap, but devs obsession with confusion really kills any content for me lately

Sorry to break it to you, it is doable as a thief solo, I did it solo all the way up and the last instance aswell, just joining random other solo players as we did the events to open the walls to the next levels. Actually stealth is a huge advantage in there.

Maybe it is just you…

Awesome content, dangerous npcs that actually require some tactics and strategy, no oneshot AOE next to no imunities and still dangerous, FREAKING AWESOME STUFF THERE!!!!

drkn.3429:

Everyone hates glass builds except for stubborn glass-builds users.

i play a thief, what’s my option?
i tried full “bunker” thief build, it has as much survivability basically as zerker… simply because thief scaling is non existant

Bazzoong.7145:

Cynz.9437:

if you play a thief, reroll please <<< that is message i got from tower

i love when ppl say, make another build… no matter what build you run thieves ARE glassy since their survival is non existant almost

stealth through? ayee……. can’t stealth through aoe

i did make it to the last instance but basically by walking over other ppl bodies

tbh i can deal with poison and other crap, but devs obsession with confusion really kills any content for me lately

Sorry to break it to you, it is doable as a thief solo, I did it solo all the way up and the last instance aswell, just joining random other solo players as we did the events to open the walls to the next levels. Actually stealth is a huge advantage in there.

Maybe it is just you…

Awesome content, dangerous npcs that actually require some tactics and strategy, no oneshot AOE next to no imunities and still dangerous, FREAKING AWESOME STUFF THERE!!!!

or the server… nobody bothers to fight together nor there is point, somebody just waits untill someone else engages fights so they can walk over their bodies while mobs are distracted

i can’t blame them either, mobs are annoying to fight and you mostlikely will end up dying and loot is obviosly… yeah let’s not talk about loot

Hey OP please before making threads like that, please learn to play, or at least adapt and use a more defensive setup/armor if you can’t do it as a glass canon. For once the content is a little challenging and encourage players to group, which is a good thing. If you want to faceroll in full zerker please go to the champ train in queen’s dale.

I am enjoying this LW update way more than what came before (except for the terrible story but that’s off topic).

Cynz.9437:

i play a thief, what’s my option?
i tried full “bunker” thief build, it has as much survivability basically as zerker… simply because thief scaling is non existant

---

or the server… nobody bothers to fight together nor there is point, somebody just waits untill someone else engages fights so they can walk over their bodies while mobs are distracted

You are unlucky with the servers then… Actually the content isn’t made to be soloed since there are parts of the tower where you have to kill a champion or another group event to progress so… If you can’t get help from others, manage to find a group to help you (Ask your guild), the chambers are solo-5 content, but the tower itself is an open world where you also have to work together to progress, it is an MMO after all. I never done the towers solo but I run it duo and have always ended up with a group of players fighting our way up together.

So in short if there is a group event in your way, more or less no class is made to solo the tower.

States.6387:

The whole “just gotta dodge” cant apply for 3rd level since you literally have to dodge something every few seconds or take the hit that will kill u if your vitality and toughness is not way up there or if you don’t have enough cleanse/escape skills to negate the constant DoT’s and knockdowns

Wait… so you’re saying that if you don’t adjust your build for the content the content might beat you?

Gee, never saw that coming.

This is basically the mentality the general playerbase have adopted. Getting a full Zerker build and expecting it to work for everything.

Then Anet starts to develop content which makes you use other builds and people thing they got a curveball thrown at them.

The notion of being upset that challenging content is not soloable when geared with zero defense is mind-boggling. What do you expect to happen? There’s a reason it’s referred to as “glass”…it’s easily breakable.

This is why Effective Healthpool and Effective Power are the more superior approaches to building in this game. Slapping on Berserker stats every which way is setting yourself up for frustration like this.

I WvW, a lot. I prefer to deal a lot of damage but not get instakitten. My WvW build had me laughing all the way to the bank in the Tower of Nightmares as I passed by dead glass-cannon players on the Third Floor. EHP and EP certain has its place in a PvE environment, and I highly encourage looking into it for your character (at least having a second set of gear for it).

tl;dr-zerker is perfectly fine here.

The only cheap space I feel is at the beginning of the third level where you have to make it past the forked bridge. After that it gets a lot better.

It’s the stupid long kitten immobilizes that get you, so bring a lot of condi clear.

Unfortunately for classes like ranger you don’t have many.

Zenith.7301:

The only cheap space I feel is at the beginning of the third level where you have to make it past the forked bridge. After that it gets a lot better.

It’s the stupid long kitten immobilizes that get you, so bring a lot of condi clear.

Unfortunately for classes like ranger you don’t have many.

That space is quite fine when you work with others and kill your way through instead of trying to run it alone. It’s designed for teamwork.

Poor topicstarter cannot swap builds.
No idea how did he get to lvl 80

Go ask the Dungeon forums if they think Anet hates glass builds and specifically mention you’re using it in open world pve

Glass builds are meant to be extreme, if you find playing an extreme hard, then don´t play it. Simple as that. And there is painfully alot of glass-friendly content, so this is a nice change.

4 hours spent in the tower as glasscanon thief and i never died. I was going up, down, killing mobs and champs in all levels, sometime with a zerg sometime without. To get on top without any zerg or party through lvl 3 i was only runing, stealthing and dodging.
Actualy i really recommend the thief for the tower. Btw, i use 15 on acrobatics, thats insane.

glass builds were favored by every single release ANet made…

I cross my fingers, this is the way anet should’ve been doing this game. Hope we get many more content like this tower. Lots of fun.

I did it fine with my glass thief, but I was spending a whole lot of time in stealth and using tons of shadowsteps. In hindsight, it would have been much more fun and productive if I had simply swapped to more defensive setup. Glass isn’t always the answer. People have gotten it in their heads that all pve must be “burn down and forget it”. But honestly this is the worst kind of L2P issue. Need to L2P something besides glass cannons lol. Everything has a time and place.