Guild Wars 2

Well this thread is embarrasing. As soon as anet delivers slightly more complex fights people claim its too hard. Its really not hard. I honestly dont know what to think. I thought games were supposed to be challenging.

I want more than 10 times the difficulty of this fight for future stuff. But its a step in the right direction. Maybe you will learn how to play the game if anet continues to increase the difficulty. I can only hope. :P

spoj.9672:

Well this thread is embarrasing. As soon as anet delivers slightly more complex fights people claim its too hard. Its really not hard. I honestly dont know what to think. I thought games were supposed to be challenging.

I want more than 10 times the difficulty of this fight for future stuff. But its a step in the right direction. Maybe you will learn how to play the game if anet continues to increase the difficulty. I can only hope. :P

cultural change happens.

80s – games were rather new and niche. They were whatever their developers made them to be, also barely any means of communication between audience and developers.

90s – games slowly became mainstream and met a culture that admired achieving and saw failure as an incentive for improving. People barely complained about difficulty.

2000s and later – games are mainstream, western culture is post-materialistic / post-socialist. Everyone is special. Achievers are seen as suspicious or are downright frowned upon. Self-improvement is not viewed as gratifying anymore. People don´t enjoy overcoming obstacles, but demand having them removed.

The decline in video game culture simply mirrors the decline of western civilization. Sad, but that is just the way of the world. Or poetically put: It is said that what is called the Spirit of an Age is something to which one cannot return.

I did this again this morning on my #1 mesmer. This makes twice I’ve done this solo on that mesmer. I also did it once with a group of three on my #2 ranger. Anyway, I went in this morning with the idea of just looking around and taking some screenshots instead of trying to complete the mission, and oddly enough, that sense of being ‘aloof’ and ‘above it all’ actually made it go more smoothly. I got no achievements, of course, but I did manage to make a few of the jumps – this time, for some reason, I actually had time to react when the floor turned orange – and got out of most of the circles without dodging. The only major snags were the wolf and leeching thrasher adds. I usually run this mesmer with either Greatsword or Staff and Sword/whatever, but I switched the Sword/whatever for a Staff this time. Came out with minor armor damage.

I did manage to take some screenshots, one of which I’ll post here. My mesmer got backed up against a wall or something. It was not a happy moment.

As I mentioned, this time it seemed I had more opportunity to react than previously. Could that be due to fewer people being on this morning (AM in EST)? When lots of people are around the game lags badly – it’s much worse since megaserver, because there’s almost always a big crowd everywhere now – and sometimes after I’ve been at an event, like Shatterer, the game crashes when I try to zone.

Algreg.3629:

spoj.9672:

Well this thread is embarrasing. As soon as anet delivers slightly more complex fights people claim its too hard. Its really not hard. I honestly dont know what to think. I thought games were supposed to be challenging.

I want more than 10 times the difficulty of this fight for future stuff. But its a step in the right direction. Maybe you will learn how to play the game if anet continues to increase the difficulty. I can only hope. :P

cultural change happens.

80s – games were rather new and niche. They were whatever their developers made them to be, also barely any means of communication between audience and developers.

90s – games slowly became mainstream and met a culture that admired achieving and saw failure as an incentive for improving. People barely complained about difficulty.

2000s and later – games are mainstream, western culture is post-materialistic / post-socialist. Everyone is special. Achievers are seen as suspicious or are downright frowned upon. Self-improvement is not viewed as gratifying anymore. People don´t enjoy overcoming obstacles, but demand having them removed.

The decline in video game culture simply mirrors the decline of western civilization. Sad, but that is just the way of the world. Or poetically put: It is said that what is called the Spirit of an Age is something to which one cannot return.

And thats what i dont get. I only really started playing video games 2000 onwards. And i can still appreciate challenge and wanting to improve yourself. I guess i had a pretty good introduction by watching my dad play doom, quake and half life as i was growing up. Why the hell are people so warped and lazy.

It’s a number of factors, I think.

When I started gaming as a kid, I basically had tons of free times. Games were hard, but they were mostly exercises in rote memory. A playthrough of Contra was exactly the same every single time I ran it, and I could devote hours upon hours of practice until I had the muscle memory to almost do them blindfolded.

As games evolved, they also became more complex. Strategy started becoming an important part of beating the game; knowing how and when to use different skills and tactics mattered as much as stats and equipment.

Then gaming started really going mainstream. In order to appeal to a wider market, developers also had to lower the difficulty threshold so that less “hardcore” players wouldn’t get frustrated and quit. This became especially crucial in the years 2000 onwards because the Internet had arrived, and entertainment and other distractions were easily at hand. If you couldn’t retain your audience, you would be left behind in the dust when dozens of other competing products were available.

What’s more, the average gamer age today is 30. A lot of us gamers who grew up with our hobby don’t want to give it up, but we’re also a lot more pressed for time with jobs, families and other responsibilities. We are less tolerant for games that still utilise the “DIAS” system when failure strikes. We’re ALSO the gaming group with the most disposable income to spend, so it makes sense that developers would want to appeal to us the most.

I died lots.

I was also using almost full level 50 blues and greens….. So, yeah.

No problem, beat it first try. Awesome fight love to see more difficulty.

Stooperdale.3560:

I was a bit surprised by this fight actually, particularly the floor. You might be able to jump but it isn’t ‘obvious’ by any stretch of the imagination. Only a handful of attacks in the game can be avoided by jumping and it wouldn’t come naturally to players who haven’t seen the molten fractals. I didn’t really understand what the graphics represented and couldn’t see any color changes mentioned by posters above as hints to timing.

This meant the floor required a timed jump which I think is fine for dungeon runners, who need to time dodges, but is isn’t ok for casuals who may do nothing other than play personal story and living story. The two second timing on most dodges isn’t hidden in the game but it’s not described anywhere either and to my mind it is an exact knowledge of game mechanics that casuals shouldn’t need to know (and from my experiences in CoE I’m guessing they don’t know).

For me personally the difficulty is fine but I can see why some people are having a lot of trouble. Players can always bring a friend along to help them though.

The NPCs also said something about the floor the first time it did the attack. I assumed they were giving hints on how to avoid it. Couldn’t actually make out what they said between all the noise though.

I saw the color change but it also didn’t match anything in the rest of the game.

I probably did the fight in the most boring way possible. Didn’t really bother too much with dodging mostly because I saw they went with the “cover everything with AoE” approach and just healed my way through most of it. Had to swap to range for the second thresher though.

I found it cool that it was mildly challenging. GW2 is far too easy these days, having something that actually made you move a bit and not stack was a bit refreshing.

Unless there’s a way of stacking this boss i don’t know about…

There are a couple of spots around the Chamber where you can stand safely out of reach of all the Dragon’s attacks, except for the map-wide stomp. Pair that up with a 1500 range weapon and the boss becomes a cakewalk; you can just pick off the Tendrils and mobs one at a time, run up to the Dragon for the burn phase, then run back to the safe® spot to repeat the process. Bonus points if you’re a Ranger, turret Engi or a MM necro who can send your pets to draw all the aggro from the Tendrils so you’re never attacked at all.

Eszett.6950:

I found it cool that it was mildly challenging. GW2 is far too easy these days, having something that actually made you move a bit and not stack was a bit refreshing.

Unless there’s a way of stacking this boss i don’t know about…

Stacking tendrils is probably a terrible idea anyway.

spoj.9672:

And thats what i dont get. I only really started playing video games 2000 onwards. And i can still appreciate challenge and wanting to improve yourself. I guess i had a pretty good introduction by watching my dad play doom, quake and half life as i was growing up. Why the hell are people so warped and lazy.

It’s less about when gamers started playing but rather when they were born/how they were raised. Typically people born mid-late 90s and up were/are part of the “everyone’s a winner, there are no losers” generation. Nobody was/is allowed to feel bad for not being as good as someone else in anything. They were/are raised to be extra sensitive and that if you hit an obstacle you can’t overcome, it isn’t because of you or your skills because you are perfect just the way you are, rather it’s because that obstacle isn’t accessible enough to everyone’s wide range of skills and thus needs to be changed or able to be bypassed so that no one feels like they are failing.

That’s why with this boss fight, the ones that have failed it don’t think to themselves “hmm, maybe I need to re-think my strategy here”, they think “wow, that boss is waay too hard, they need to fix it!”

Dunno when OP was born, but I would venture to guess mid-90s or later.

This is all hypothetical of course, I’ve done no research.

Well, I was born in 1960, and regardless of their relative ease or difficulty, I still don’t like these ‘hokey pokey’ boss fights. I’d rather be able to just fight it out. Or, if the devs simply must have some wacky ‘ermahgerd the boss can’t be damaged until you dance the hokey pokey’ gimmicks in order to feel like they are being innovative or whatever, have it be like: okay, do the thing to make the boss vulnerable. Once. Now, attack the boss. BOOM. Boss dead. That would suit me just fine.

Oh, all right. Three times, then. Max. Anything beyond that, the devs are just trolling.

I didn’t even get below 1/3 health on this boss. Just don’t stand in the orange areas and it’s easy.

Considering death isn’t much of a penalty anymore, it’s not so bad to have hard fights.
Not that I fell over soloing it, but still.

Draknar.5748:

spoj.9672:

And thats what i dont get. I only really started playing video games 2000 onwards. And i can still appreciate challenge and wanting to improve yourself. I guess i had a pretty good introduction by watching my dad play doom, quake and half life as i was growing up. Why the hell are people so warped and lazy.

It’s less about when gamers started playing but rather when they were born/how they were raised. Typically people born mid-late 90s and up were/are part of the “everyone’s a winner, there are no losers” generation. Nobody was/is allowed to feel bad for not being as good as someone else in anything. They were/are raised to be extra sensitive and that if you hit an obstacle you can’t overcome, it isn’t because of you or your skills because you are perfect just the way you are, rather it’s because that obstacle isn’t accessible enough to everyone’s wide range of skills and thus needs to be changed or able to be bypassed so that no one feels like they are failing.

That’s why with this boss fight, the ones that have failed it don’t think to themselves “hmm, maybe I need to re-think my strategy here”, they think “wow, that boss is waay too hard, they need to fix it!”

Dunno when OP was born, but I would venture to guess mid-90s or later.

This is all hypothetical of course, I’ve done no research.

Guess i just missed out on being raised like that thankfully. Born 91.

Zylonite.5913:

Didn’t die but after 30 minutes of the fight, the boss was still 80% health. Logged off and moved on….

What are your primary stats and weapons?

spoj.9672:

Draknar.5748:

spoj.9672:

And thats what i dont get. I only really started playing video games 2000 onwards. And i can still appreciate challenge and wanting to improve yourself. I guess i had a pretty good introduction by watching my dad play doom, quake and half life as i was growing up. Why the hell are people so warped and lazy.

It’s less about when gamers started playing but rather when they were born/how they were raised. Typically people born mid-late 90s and up were/are part of the “everyone’s a winner, there are no losers” generation. Nobody was/is allowed to feel bad for not being as good as someone else in anything. They were/are raised to be extra sensitive and that if you hit an obstacle you can’t overcome, it isn’t because of you or your skills because you are perfect just the way you are, rather it’s because that obstacle isn’t accessible enough to everyone’s wide range of skills and thus needs to be changed or able to be bypassed so that no one feels like they are failing.

That’s why with this boss fight, the ones that have failed it don’t think to themselves “hmm, maybe I need to re-think my strategy here”, they think “wow, that boss is waay too hard, they need to fix it!”

Dunno when OP was born, but I would venture to guess mid-90s or later.

This is all hypothetical of course, I’ve done no research.

Guess i just missed out on being raised like that thankfully. Born 91.

Well clearly it isn’t written in stone. Just a theory as to why people would rather “difficult” content be made much easier or bypassed instead of…I dunno, practicing it so you can overcome it.

Like JPs. The people against them sometimes say “I’m not good at them, so I shouldn’t have to do them in the game if I don’t want to.” Which is fine, especially the hard JPs I agree completely, but for simple jumping exercises like what we’ve seen in Dry Top? I mean…why can’t people just learn to be better at them? Barring physical limitations/disabilities that would prevent them from performing key strokes, humans have the amazing ability to learn and adapt. Try something once and fail, OK, try it again and it is slightly easier. Keep trying it and you will get better and better at it. It’s like people don’t even want to try anymore. Failing isn’t fun for anyone, but failure happens in life people, it’s time to stop blaming the content for being too hard, and start accepting that maybe you need to get better.

Draknar.5748:

It’s less about when gamers started playing but rather when they were born/how they were raised. Typically people born mid-late 90s and up were/are part of the “everyone’s a winner, there are no losers” generation. Nobody was/is allowed to feel bad for not being as good as someone else in anything. They were/are raised to be extra sensitive and that if you hit an obstacle you can’t overcome, it isn’t because of you or your skills because you are perfect just the way you are, rather it’s because that obstacle isn’t accessible enough to everyone’s wide range of skills and thus needs to be changed or able to be bypassed so that no one feels like they are failing.

That’s why with this boss fight, the ones that have failed it don’t think to themselves “hmm, maybe I need to re-think my strategy here”, they think “wow, that boss is waay too hard, they need to fix it!”

Dunno when OP was born, but I would venture to guess mid-90s or later.

This is all hypothetical of course, I’ve done no research.

It’s an interesting theory, but I think the mid-late 90s generation wouldn’t be complaining about this sort of thing because they’re the ones who are more likely to have been born with a controller in their hands – experts at video games at a young age, simply because of the exposure.

Personally, I think the crowd most likely to complain about this stuff (for its difficulty) are the 30+ people with families and jobs who play games as a low-intensity hobby, some of whom may have the potential to kick the kitten out of the elitists but simply don’t have the time to hone that level of expertise.

Granted, sometimes having all the time in the world will not make a mediocre player into an expert, but that’s just how life works with any activity.

The easiest way to do the boss is the stand in the corner where Jennah was. Most of the attacks miss that area and then you just attack the vines with ranged weapons and step out to attack the dragon when it’s attackable.

The only part that is hardish is avoiding the ground attack. Jumping is unreliable so I’d suggest dodging twice to ensure you evade it.

The final fight of the living is nothing more than a cheap way by the devs to create an illusion of a challenging boss fight.

Having to fight a boss with other mobs spawning at the same time and dodging red markers on the ground is not challenge, it is called unfair fight….

None of the bosses in the living story have any mechanics. They just have big AoEs with CC with other smaller vets mobs spawning at the same time. In other words, they are just copy/paste from other boss or mobs.

You want us to solo a fight boss in the living story then give us a real boss with new mechanics to solo…/sigh who I am I kidding.

I actually really liked the final boss battle. It was quiet challenging but really interesting. Hope we will se the dragons soon as an open world boss.

If I can do it the first try with a mesmer, you can do it too.

Zylonite.5913:

The final fight of the living is nothing more than a cheap way by the devs to create an illusion of a challenging boss fight.

Having to fight a boss with other mobs spawning at the same time and dodging red markers on the ground is not challenge, it is called unfair fight….

None of the bosses in the living story have any mechanics. They just have big AoEs with CC with other smaller vets mobs spawning at the same time. In other words, they are just copy/paste from other boss or mobs.

You want us to solo a fight boss in the living story then give us a real boss with new mechanics to solo…/sigh who I am I kidding.

what are you talking about? they may not all be “unique mechanics”, but they all have mechanics beyond simple focus dps ’em down/dodge.

first boss: use sun aspect to break his shield…additionally, you could use other aspects to follow him from platform to platform if you want to challenge yourself….or range him and use the safe-spot rock for cover and have an easier experience.

second boss: defend the minions marj summons as they go to boss to break his shield.

third boss: kill mender mobs before they can heal boss

fourth boss: jump the floor attack and kill the tendrils

one or two simple mechanics to go along with additional mobs is not “cheap”….its a mix of enemy factors that we have all the tools to deal with solo, if we build/gear correctly. further more, you don’t have to do these solo.

i think they’ve hit the perfect level of difficulty for casual content.

Only got downed , didnt die from the first try(not that there was other tryies). People realy need to learn that dodge isn’t there just to be there, its a huge part of the game mechanics and skills, and for the the record, didn’t had to dodge unless i couldn’t move out of the skills aoes by foot. A good way to learn how to dodge is to run a zerk build and go run arrah, trying to survive for a 2 weeks, thats how i did.

Zylonite.5913:

The final fight of the living is nothing more than a cheap way by the devs to create an illusion of a challenging boss fight.

Having to fight a boss with other mobs spawning at the same time and dodging red markers on the ground is not challenge, it is called unfair fight….

None of the bosses in the living story have any mechanics. They just have big AoEs with CC with other smaller vets mobs spawning at the same time. In other words, they are just copy/paste from other boss or mobs.

You want us to solo a fight boss in the living story then give us a real boss with new mechanics to solo…/sigh who I am I kidding.

Who are you kidding? Yourself, because none of that is true.

Zylonite.5913:

The final fight of the living is nothing more than a cheap way by the devs to create an illusion of a challenging boss fight.

The final fight isn’t challenging, it’s a normal boss fight, except you have to avoid large AoEs that show up in random spots while simultaneously killing mobs in order to make the boss vulnerable in order to even damage him. When will they ever make a boss that is more than just tank and spank…

/sarcasm

I mean honestly, what would you consider a challenging fight, because Liadri was exactly the same concept just a different format. Avoid AoEs, you have to remove her invulnerability by kiting mobs into AoEs, then the rest is DPS while avoiding AoE while killing orbs that pull you.

It’s basically the same thing and Liadri is considered uber challenging.

Unless of course you’re saying that Liadri wasn’t challenging either…

I found the fight “a step in the correct direction” but “not punishing enough”.

The entire living story suffers from the issue of “not punishing enough”. Death has no consequence, and even if you do end up dying a lot, you still don’t fail. It is literally impossible to fail unless you leave. That isn’t inherently bad; you shouldn’t make the player completely redo the instance the moment they die, but I don’t think you should be dropped directly back into the fight you died in. That doesn’t happen in dungeon bosses, why should it in solo bosses?

When you die you should have to restart the fight you died in, then the difficulty would be spot on because death would have some kind of consequence. Other than that big nit-pick with the entire living story in general; the fight mechanics were of a perfect difficulty. The mechanics were easy to figure out, no mechanic felt overly cheap, and the fight wasn’t too long or too short.

Still though… Anet, get on making death mean something in these instances.

Liadri was challenging because of the time limit and not being able to see the circles before the orange change.

Chokolata.1870:

Liadri was challenging because of the time limit and not being able to see the circles before the orange change.

And the camera running into the wall. That killed me the most.

Labjax.2465:

Draknar.5748:

It’s less about when gamers started playing but rather when they were born/how they were raised. Typically people born mid-late 90s and up were/are part of the “everyone’s a winner, there are no losers” generation. Nobody was/is allowed to feel bad for not being as good as someone else in anything. They were/are raised to be extra sensitive and that if you hit an obstacle you can’t overcome, it isn’t because of you or your skills because you are perfect just the way you are, rather it’s because that obstacle isn’t accessible enough to everyone’s wide range of skills and thus needs to be changed or able to be bypassed so that no one feels like they are failing.

That’s why with this boss fight, the ones that have failed it don’t think to themselves “hmm, maybe I need to re-think my strategy here”, they think “wow, that boss is waay too hard, they need to fix it!”

Dunno when OP was born, but I would venture to guess mid-90s or later.

This is all hypothetical of course, I’ve done no research.

It’s an interesting theory, but I think the mid-late 90s generation wouldn’t be complaining about this sort of thing because they’re the ones who are more likely to have been born with a controller in their hands – experts at video games at a young age, simply because of the exposure.

Personally, I think the crowd most likely to complain about this stuff (for its difficulty) are the 30+ people with families and jobs who play games as a low-intensity hobby, some of whom may have the potential to kick the kitten out of the elitists but simply don’t have the time to hone that level of expertise.

Granted, sometimes having all the time in the world will not make a mediocre player into an expert, but that’s just how life works with any activity.

You’re throwing this word “elitist” around.

I don’t think you actually know what it means.

maha.7902:

You’re throwing this word “elitist” around.

I don’t think you actually know what it means.

I know exactly what it means, regardless of whether I’m precisely referencing the official definition or using it more as slang. In this case, I’m talking about video game elitists – players who think they are better than other people (like better as a person) because their skill level is higher.

Essentially, any variation on players with an above-average skill level (real or perceived) looking down on people whose skill level (real or perceived) is average or below-average.

So maybe it’s best you review the definition, cause I’m not sure you know what it means.

Really? I loved that fight, there was a ton going on, which is exactly what I want from a being so powerful as a dragon, but it was clear enough that you could avoid everything if you paid attention and played well. I went down once and rallied of a vine, and still beat it on the first try. And that down was only because of ANets stupid problems with dodge not always interrupting channeled skills like it ought to.

Labjax.2465:

maha.7902:

You’re throwing this word “elitist” around.

I don’t think you actually know what it means.

I know exactly what it means, regardless of whether I’m precisely referencing the official definition or using it more as slang. In this case, I’m talking about video game elitists – players who think they are better than other people (like better as a person) because their skill level is higher.

Essentially, any variation on players with an above-average skill level (real or perceived) looking down on people whose skill level (real or perceived) is average or below-average.

So maybe it’s best you review the definition, cause I’m not sure you know what it means.

Elitism is the exclusion of others from your group due to your belief in your own group’s superiority. What you’re referring to as elitists are players who are more skilled than your average zergling expressing their confusion at people being unable to complete and/or complaining about the LS instance(s), not ‘elitists’. So how about you stop throwing the word around when it doesn’t apply? It’s an overused buzz word by angry forum goers on the same level as words like ‘toxic’ – they have no meaning at this point, people just throw them around when somebody says something they disagree with, which is exactly what you just did.

maha.7902:

Elitism is the exclusion of others from your group due to your belief in your own group’s superiority. What you’re referring to as elitists are players who are more skilled than your average zergling expressing their confusion at people being unable to complete and/or complaining about the LS instance(s), not ‘elitists’. So how about you stop throwing the word around when it doesn’t apply? It’s an overused buzz word by angry forum goers on the same level as words like ‘toxic’ – they have no meaning at this point, people just throw them around when somebody says something they disagree with, which is exactly what you just did.

Oh, so this is personal to you, ok. Have you heard the expression, “If the shoe fits?”

Never once did I indicate that people who are “confused” about others’ struggles are being elitist and toxic. You just concocted that out of nowhere, I guess out of some hurt at the notion of being an elitist yourself?

In fact, I just clarified for you that I’m talking about people who look down on others for being less skilled. Which is part of the definition and/or slang of the word elitist and is a world apart from basic confusion.

Please do yourself a favor and take a step back from this. My goal was not to insult random people for doing nothing wrong and you seem to be getting insulted for no good reason.

No, looking down =/= elitism. If I do a world event and whine about ‘casuals’, that doesn’t make me elitist, it’s called condescension or snobbery. An example of elitism are world event guilds jumping megaservers to get a good teq/wurm/pavilion instance that won’t be leeched by less motivated players because they want to play with like minded individuals and will exclude others in order to do so. Your only goal was to make a snide remark towards players who actually have any sort of skill and don’t understand why people are complaining about the LS difficulty. Whether they express their confusion condescendingly or whatever is not the point, the point is you are misusing a buzz word as you don’t know what it means, but since it has a negative connotation to it you felt sure, I’ll just throw it in at this group of people I dislike. And then calling me one too? Stay classy, I didn’t know teaching players how to run dungeons and not caring what build/gear people used constituted elitism, but YMMV.

maha.7902:

No, looking down =/= elitism.

I don’t know what your deal is with this word, but, um…

elitism
the attitude that government should be by those who consider themselves superior to others by virtue of intelligence, social status, or greater accomplishment.

And here’s a slang definition as well:

A person who believes that they are superior to others (and thus deserve favored status) because of their intellect, social status, wealth, or other factors.

And condescension is:

an attitude of patronizing superiority

So… yeah. I suggest you let this one go.

maha.7902:

And then calling me one too? Stay classy, I didn’t know teaching players how to run dungeons and not caring what build/gear people used constituted elitism, but YMMV.

I didn’t call you one. Again, there is no slight here. Only a perceived one. I made a guess that perhaps you’re bothered by what I’m saying because you think it’s an accusation that you, specifically, are an elitist in some way.

I have not actually accused you of being one. Considering that I know nothing about you, it would be absurd to assume such a thing.

I did the current episode on a pvt guardian with no traits (had none unlocked) and level 20 accessories. Armor and weapons were level 80 exotics.

I had no issues completing either of the instances. They took a little longer but were manageable.

That was miserable. Glad it’s done.

I thought it was amazing. Cleared it first time on my zerker guardian, only died once but once you got into the rhythm of things it was easy enough. Looking forward to challenge mode!

@Labjax:

The problem with the word is exactly what mah described:

“What you’re referring to as elitists are players who are more skilled than your average zergling expressing their confusion at people being unable to complete and/or complaining about the LS instance(s), not ‘elitists’.”

Currently the bottom 1% is calling the other average or even low skilled players ‘elitsts’. And it’s kinda disgusting.

Bubi.7942:

@Labjax:

The problem with the word is exactly what mah described:

“What you’re referring to as elitists are players who are more skilled than your average zergling expressing their confusion at people being unable to complete and/or complaining about the LS instance(s), not ‘elitists’.”

Currently the bottom 1% is calling the other average or even low skilled players ‘elitsts’. And it’s kinda disgusting.

I don’t know what I’m supposed to say to this. You’re just pulling it out of your magic hat that the “bottom 1%” is calling average/low-skilled people elitists. For one thing, I consider myself an above average player, I had no great troubles with this fight, and I was the one in question who was referring to certain types of people as elitists.

Second, being elitist, at the very least in the context that I was talking about, is referring to an attitude. It doesn’t require people to actually be “elite” players in a more objective sense of the word.

What’s disgusting is people looking down on each other for being different. It’s just one of those things that is never pretty, no matter what the excuse is.

And once again, I’m not talking about people who are expressing innocent confusion and never was.

Have a good night.

Zok.4956:

Pandaman.4758:

I learned from the first three episode: be ranged. I spent the entire fight being glad I didn’t do the latest episode with my condi thief.

Well I tried this fight melee only. I died a lot. When I was naked I thought is seems I did something wrong, I switched to ranged, looked for a kind of safe spot and finished it naked without dying again. I like this fight and how you have to learn/understand it.

Greetings.

P.S. Has anyone done damage directly to the boss with pure melee?

Yes. Boss is a joke. GS + S/F Guardian. Easy to handle the Mordrem and you can drop half the DPS rotation for a single weapon on the dragon to have him “phase change”.

I found the boss to be rather easy, even the achievements were really easy. People complain that dungeon are too easy aka, FGS in corner. Believe me, this fight was 100x easier than any dungeon speedrun. One leap, whirlind wrath on the boss, he lost 25%. Pull the mobs together with Binding blade, 2-4 hits, leap on boss, whirlind wrath. The AoE were clearly indicated on the ground, the huge one could be blocked, dodge or even jump if you had nothing.

It may be different for people with subpar gear, but I do everything on my alt account with rare/masterwork and bad runes all the time.

This is the kind of boss I like, this game combat is all about fluidity, when a mob attack you should be able to see it coming, and be able to counter play. Liadri, was also a good example. What I do not want to see, are bosses with un-blockable attack, un dodgeable attack, fast paced with no animation.

spoj.9672:

Well this thread is embarrasing. As soon as anet delivers slightly more complex fights people claim its too hard. Its really not hard. I honestly dont know what to think. I thought games were supposed to be challenging.

I want more than 10 times the difficulty of this fight for future stuff. But its a step in the right direction. Maybe you will learn how to play the game if anet continues to increase the difficulty. I can only hope. :P

I’d say people play games for fun, not challenge, but to many challenge = fun, while to some others the fun in the game may be the visuals, the activities they can do in the game, and other things that make up a game.

In short, I think games are supposed to be fun, whether it’s challenging or not depends on who is playing it, and who the target audience is.

So just stacking on the boss and pressing your #1 skill is more fun? That’s essentially what all bosses were before in this game. It seems people either want that back or for the game to play itself like a movie.

I could so go further and say how does Halloween and Wintersday fit within the living story? They’ve never been a part of it in the past.

The better answer for why SAB was not released would probably have been because of the direction they want to take with it, which was strongly hinted at the world 3 teaser, is why it’s being postponed. They want to weave SAB sub plot into a future living story narrative at a later date.

Lambent.6375:

spoj.9672:

Well this thread is embarrasing. As soon as anet delivers slightly more complex fights people claim its too hard. Its really not hard. I honestly dont know what to think. I thought games were supposed to be challenging.

I want more than 10 times the difficulty of this fight for future stuff. But its a step in the right direction. Maybe you will learn how to play the game if anet continues to increase the difficulty. I can only hope. :P

I’d say people play games for fun, not challenge, but to many challenge = fun, while to some others the fun in the game may be the visuals, the activities they can do in the game, and other things that make up a game.

In short, I think games are supposed to be fun, whether it’s challenging or not depends on who is playing it, and who the target audience is.

If you play games for visuals etc you are probably better off watching films. Just saying. I dont think anyone buys games purely for visuals. Gameplay is important. And that usually involves some form of challenge to make you interact with the game. Obviously they are nice additions and make good games better, but the reason way play games is to play something interactive. If its not challenging then that interaction is somewhat numbed and the play experience becomes dull very quickly. You need challenge to increase the longevity of a game.

This is why most of us dungeon runners are now thinking of moving away from the game. With the announced no work being done on new dungeon content. The game looks like it is wasting its combat system and new content with high replayability is not a priority for anet. The games longevity will suffer in the longterm if this isnt revised. Unfortunately its too late for most of us. Which is a shame because the combat system is amazing and really suits challenging combat perfectly.

I suppose it’s pointless, but here we go again anyway. Speaking only for myself, I don’t mind that we have to disable the boss’ defenses in order to damage it, or that we must always dodge some red circles or whatever in the process. I’m opposed to having to do it again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

I suppose it’s pointless, but here we go again anyway. Speaking only for myself, I don’t mind that we have to disable the boss’ defenses in order to damage it, or that we must always dodge some red circles or whatever in the process. I’m opposed to having to do it again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

I suppose it’s pointless, but here we go again anyway. Speaking only for myself, I don’t mind that we have to disable the boss’ defenses in order to damage it, or that we must always dodge some red circles or whatever in the process. I’m opposed to having to do it again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

Once would suit me fine. Three times, tops. Anything beyond that is unnecessary padding. As I hope my dramatic dramatization here has dramatically dramatized.

Krosslite.1950:

You had too much going on and no way to confront all the baddies at one time. died at least 25 times and even nearly became naked due to destroyed armor.

It was difficult for me until I figured out the mechanics.

I play a staff elementalist so admittedly I have an easier time surviving and kiting than others might, but here’s some advice for others in your position.

1. Stay out of the middle of the chamber as much as possible. This is where the majority of the AoE effects come from.

2. The vines phase becomes problematic about the second or third time in when the Mordrem wolves begin popping up. For this part, it’s easier to hug the wall near the Ventari Tablet or to fight behind the Avatar of the Pale Tree so that there’s less chance of being flanked. It should make dodging vine juice easier to some extent as well.

3. Try to bring a ranged weapon option along if possible. It’ll make finishing off the vines so much easier in between dodging the dragon’s area attacks.

4. This one might sound odd, but if you’re low on health don’t be afraid to die. Restarting from a checkpoint dumps you right back into the chamber, usually within a couple of feet of one of the vines. If you’re having trouble, try jumping through one of the holes out of the chamber (to help prevent armor damage), and respawn back inside.

I dropped a couple of times at the start of the encounter, but once I figured out positioning it became a lot easier.

spoj.9672:

If you play games for visuals etc you are probably better off watching films. Just saying. I dont think anyone buys games purely for visuals. Gameplay is important. And that usually involves some form of challenge to make you interact with the game. Obviously they are nice additions and make good games better, but the reason way play games is to play something interactive. If its not challenging then that interaction is somewhat numbed and the play experience becomes dull very quickly. You need challenge to increase the longevity of a game.

This is why most of us dungeon runners are now thinking of moving away from the game. With the announced no work being done on new dungeon content. The game looks like it is wasting its combat system and new content with high replayability is not a priority for anet. The games longevity will suffer in the longterm if this isnt revised. Unfortunately its too late for most of us. Which is a shame because the combat system is amazing and really suits challenging combat perfectly.

Case in point re: visuals. I don’t care how epic an encounter looks, I care about how epic it feels. Most players do.

I liked this part of the story. At first I was a bit confused and frustrated by the fight, but the initial shock of a sudden, challenging encounter spurned me on. Yes, it was foreshadowed earlier, and as a Sylvari I enjoyed having everything in my personal story up until this point tie together so nicely.

However, I’m not entirely sold that this is the right way to go about things. I enjoy the continuity, and I enjoy the challenge, but the problem is that the mechanics of the fight are thrust upon the player suddenly.

They’re not difficult once overcome, but the problem is that this is meant to be a story telling device. It’s not a dungeon encounter. This isn’t something that people are going into expecting to die a few times figuring out how something works, or going into expecting to spend a good 10 minutes stalling in order to feel out a fight before really diving in.

It’s the same problem that players had at the game’s launch. ArenaNet over-tuned the tutorial boss fights to the extent that new players were spending much of the fight on their back or simply in a defeated state, and that isn’t exactly the best way to be introduced to a new game.

What we’re seeing here is a well-designed mini boss that’s been poorly placed into the world. If we had seen some of these mechanics in recent fights (such as by battling Mordrem Drakes with a forward cone attack, or something similar to the claw attacks and stomps), then combining them all together into this encounter would have made much more sense to the average player.

Most of the issue here is the sudden learning curve not matching player expectations going into the instance. I’m sure that most players expected to enter combat to some extent, and it’s true that some of the Mordrem mechanics such as the wolves and vines were recycled, but it’s the introduction of the dragon boss itself that muddies things.

I personally enjoyed it, but I definitely understand why other players might not have had the best of times.