Guild Wars 2

In my opinion adrenaline was absolutely DESTROYED with this patch. Taking 3 nerfs. nerf 1: It used to be when if you used your burst skill and it missed, then you would not lose your adrenaline (this needed nerfing imo and i’m fine with this.) You should lose your adrenaline when you use the burst skill, whether it hits or not. Nerf 2: It seems to take FOREVER to build your adrenaline now, unless you dedicate a whole skill to build it faster(e.g. the precision signet, which fills your adrenaline on activate). In pve, i have made my second warrior who is level 29 atm. Even with a low leveled character, i have killed whatever it is i’m fighting before my adrenaline is even close to full unless i’m fighting a champ or something. Making the whole mechanic of what makes warriors different, completely useless in normal play. Nerf 3: Adrenaline depletes very quickly and instantly after you leave combat. So lets say i’m killing a mob in pve and by the time its dead i have managed to build 50% adrenaline (trust me, its usually less than that). I can’t even carry that over to the next mob as its gone in 2 seconds by the time i have engaged. Warriors adrenaline has been absolutely butchered with this update. Its like taking away a guardians virtues, or a rangers pet, or an engis tool kit. Adrenaline is no longer viable at all. They should either make it so you can fill it up a lot faster, or make it so it will deplete after 5 or 10 seconds after leaving combat, or even both.?

Adrenaline gain has only been nerfed on Berserker Stance. Rifle and off-hand Axe saw improvements in their generation.

However, the OOC decay does happen too soon. Before it was so slow as to be meaningless, but now it just means you never get a full bar in PvE. This may be the real source of your feeling that it builds more slowly, as you’re always starting from zero.

I retraited my warrior to see for myself what impact the changes made.

I had no issues refilling my adrenaline. The rapid decay hurts but as far as in combat I tended to have full bars on a short period of time.

This meant retraiting to the line that is designed to maximize that trait which is reasonable.

The Out of combat decay is just insane. In wvw when you are kited/reset you just lose it and have to start from scratch. And when so many traits are build around the adrenaline system it renders a lot of builds and traits nerfed, not JUST the burst skills that are involved. Berserkers power (increases damage at higher levels of adreneline) in the Strength line, which is used in a lot on PVE damage builds, paired with the fact that you rarely get to max adrenaline in PVE now makes that trait virtually useless. Cleansing ire (removes a condition when adrenaline is spent, 1 condi per bar) in the Defense line, which unless you wanna run a Troopers shout build, is one of the only viable ways to remove conditions when you are a warrior. So lets say a condi burst enemy comes into contact with you. Nearly every class has high potential to be viable with condis when specced for it. All they do, is lay down their conditions, paired with cripple, immob or chill. And the warrior dies unless he invests 6 points into shout mastery and takes trooper runes. Its just downright stupid. Heightened focus in Discipline trait line (improves crit chance with higher levels of adrenaline) Utterly useless since you wont be getting 3 bars in pve and in 1v1 fights you lose your adrenaline so easily. Burst mastery in Discipline (burst skills restore adrenaline after use) Yeah nice one, if i could get my adrenaline up enough to use a burst skill, that would be pretty good. The MAIN issue is the instant decay of adrenaline, it just ruins so many options and potential of all these traits and tactics. They need to buff the time it takes for decay to start to 10 seconds in my opinion. The other nerfs wouldn’t be so bad if you could actually maintain adrenaline and use it.

^ the same way that warriors can have fights reset on them, warriors can no longer maintain adrenaline and run away from fights. So that works both ways.

I agree, the old system was slightly broken with how warriors could keep adrenaline as long as they wanted. But INSTANT decay just makes the whole adrenaline system useless. Especially when combat is so easily broken with simple kiting/stealth.

Adrenaline gain/decay are debateable.

Losing adrenaline when you miss is similar to most other mechanics in the game … look at Mesmer shatters for a very close parallel.

Hopefully, rather than undoing this, ArenaNet will continue to revamp mechanics in the game so that when a player makes a mistake, there is an actual consequence (ex: missing an attack or having it blocked/dodged/evaded/miss while stealthed actually breaking stealth).

Otherwise, if we went the other direction … would you like Mesmer illusions to stay if they miss the shatter? :-p

How about when my Ranger pet misses their fear/knockdown/immobilize/stun ?

I agree that if you attempt to use your burst skill, you should lose your adrenaline whether you hit or miss it. But with adrenaline so hard to maintain you wont get chance to use your burst skill effectively in the first place.

I think that might depend on trait points right now … which brings up the questions:
- what ranges for adrenaline gain are acceptable (min, avg, max)?
- – how long should it take to gain 1 bar of adrenaline.
- what are acceptable requirements for traits, utilities, etc. to achieve them?

Personally, I think it should probably not much longer (if not less than) 10 seconds to gain roughly 3 bars of adrenaline. Then, if you want to be able to use a burst skill, swap, and quickly use the next, you will need to use either less than 3 bars or use traits/utilities to up your adrenaline gain.

If it takes longer than 10 seconds on the cooldown then, to me, the purpose of the short (10s) base cooldown and the benefits of the Discipline trait line reducing that even more go out the window.

Also i don’t see how you can compare illusions to adrenaline. Illusions provide confusion to the enemy (In a literal sense. In some situations its very hard to keep track of the real mesmer) adrenaline does not affect the enemy in that way. Illusions are very easily replaced and you have a huge range of skills to INSTANTLY replenish clones/illusions if you wish. Adrenaline has one skill that will instantly replenish it and it has a long cooldown. You can’t really compare the two, they are completely different mechanics. At least mesmers can hide behind clones and are hard to locate whilst providing huge damage if they wish. Warriors have decent mobility (providing you want to use swords and greatsword) to compensate and they have adrenaline to provide buffs when it is full (again, only if you spec for it) or to provide a hindrance to the enemy for a short time (stun for hammer, immob for sword, decent burst dmg for axe etc) when burst skills are used. Once a warrior drops his adrenaline he loses his dmg buff, precision buff, ability to remove condis until he can regain it back. Mesmer can instantly replace what they use when played right (obviously if you spam all your illusions and over wright your old ones without utilizing your shatter abilities first then you are simply a bad player) The nerfs to adrenaline are made a lot worse due to the fact it can be removed at any time by the enemy if they run away for a few seconds. That aspect of the nerf IS game breaking.

Mahtayoo.3748:

… The nerfs to adrenaline are made a lot worse due to the fact it can be removed at any time by the enemy if they run away for a few seconds. That aspect of the nerf IS game breaking.

Seriously, have you even tried this? You have to run across the map in sPVP to break combat. In WvW that’s quite a distance too. Adrenaline drains while HP regens to max. There’s no point.

Mahtayoo.3748:

Also i don’t see how you can compare illusions to adrenaline. Illusions provide confusion to the enemy (In a literal sense. In some situations its very hard to keep track of the real mesmer) adrenaline does not affect the enemy in that way. Illusions are very easily replaced and you have a huge range of skills to INSTANTLY replenish clones/illusions if you wish. Adrenaline has one skill that will instantly replenish it and it has a long cooldown. You can’t really compare the two,

You can.

You are talking about mechanics for a class.

Mesmer uses there mechanics to cause CC.—Like a warrior with a hammer or mace.
if our class mechanic misses.. you have to start over and wait for the cd.
Same with warrior, except your CD is more forgiving.

Mesmer uses there class functions to cause damage—like the warrior with axe,rifle or gs
if our class mechanic misses.. you have to start over and wait for the cd.
Same with warrior.

Mesmer uses there class function to cause conditions—like the warrior with sword or longbow.
Unlike warrior with longbow. If you miss the shatter..you have to start over. and wait for the CD.

They are very comparable class mechanics. Because both are really similar.
In the fact that missing a burst means waiting, baiting, and retrying.

Mahtayoo.3748:

I agree that if you attempt to use your burst skill, you should lose your adrenaline whether you hit or miss it. But with adrenaline so hard to maintain you wont get chance to use your burst skill effectively in the first place.

Warriors are very mobile. Not a lot of people get to reset a fight on a Warrior, and Warriors have used this to their benefit for a long time to be the one reseting fights.

Its sucks very bad now in pve.. its terrible to start with empty adrenaline ALL THE TIME
Almost never use a burst skill now in pve..

in PVP/WVW i can understand it

overall it was a good change, but i think they went too far by starting degen instantly. after a fight ends. as its been pointed out others, it pretty much means nothing but the occasion 1bar burst skill (unless you’re fighting a champ/boss) in PvE. a few seconds (something like 4 or 5) would remedy this……….and would also allow a warrior to chase down a disengaging opponent (w/ a movement skill) to keep adrenaline.