Guild Wars 2

Hey all. SO I took a big break and am back — wondering about the current state of the game regarding class imbalance and/or niches for certain classes.

Would someone be able to provide some overall breakdown of what each class provides and what kind of personality each class might be suited for?

Long time ago I played mesmer and necromancer, thoroughly enjoyed both. I know people will tell you to just go in the game and try it out but it’s difficult to tell how a class will pan out come late game.

Thanks in advance!

The current state are condition bunkers.
Or at least that’s all the whine I see.
Although I’ve got to admit these perplexity engineers are everywhere.
As for the rest of the classes, to my eyes they use the same stuff as before.
I haven’t touched my build.

The game is better balanced, but not in a good way. Instead of nerfing some over the top specs, they buffed everything to the roof. Same old problems: AI, targetting is bad, AoE conditions, hard CC’s, way too tanky or way too bursty specs, are still a thing.

It depends on your game mode you look at this forum you see condition whining all the time despite that condi builds aren’t used in PvE and as evidence by the EU and NA Tournament of Legends there isn’t much condi setups being used in s/tPvP either at least at the top level.

So that leaves WvW where zerging is still direct damage, solo roaming is a mix with people complaining about conditions because they can’t 1vX when a condi build is around and dueling who’s group you can put with solo roaming.

So glad the ToL showed there is no condi meta at top level play, and that most of these balance whines against conditions are WvW solo roamers, duelers, and spvp duel server players riding the coattail of what USE to be the tPvP meta.

As soon as the condi meta hit s/tPvP back in the day WvW roamers and duelers jumped on condi meta quickly now they have to stand on their own argument about balance in their “user-generated” activities that the game isn’t balanced around.

So you would say — current state of game..
WvW / PvP: Classes who maximize conditions (E.G. engineer, necro, thief)
PvE: Classes who maximize damage output (E.G. warrior, ranger, ele)

Domzz.1260:

So you would say — current state of game..
WvW / PvP: Classes who maximize conditions (E.G. engineer, necro, thief)
PvE: Classes who maximize damage output (E.G. warrior, ranger, ele)

Well WvW is about objectives so you would usually associate that with Zerging so that would be Direct Damage/Power.

Roaming/Dueling in WvW is a mix of power and direct damage but alot of people complain about conditions it all depends on the person and server density of their opponent on how often you see condi builds.

WvW is the mix bagged because it’s a sandbox with an objective. So many people look at balanced based on what they find fun and do the most and not the overall picture of the game. Warriors, Guardians, and Thieves are probably the class I see the most but those are also good at roaming too (meditation guard or dps shouts to a lesser extent).

PvE is all about direct damage and dps.

Run away……

Luke.4562:

Run away……

Meaning?

Domzz.1260:

Luke.4562:

Run away……

Meaning?

Run away before the QQers come

Asomal.6453:

The game is better balanced, but not in a good way. Instead of nerfing some over the top specs, they buffed everything to the roof. Same old problems: AI, targetting is bad, AoE conditions, hard CC’s, way too tanky or way too bursty specs, are still a thing.

Yeah, in short the extremes are too extreme. Max-damage should deal much less damage (and be more tanky), max-bunker should be much less tanky (and do more damage), etc, etc, etc.

Right now it’s too easy to overstack into a single element, leading to a lot of wobbly balance issues.

As soon as you aggregate enough players (20++ fights in WvW for example) the issues largely disappear ofc, due to the mixing. But individually they stil lexist.

Domzz.1260:

So you would say — current state of game..
WvW / PvP: Classes who maximize conditions (E.G. engineer, necro, thief)
PvE: Classes who maximize damage output (E.G. warrior, ranger, ele)

No, WvW is also the power-builds running rampant. In roaming there are some more condition builds, but its still Power all the way. The Anti-Condition propaganda crew will have you believe otherwise.

And the large groups (aka zergs/blobs) is mostly Guardians and Warriors with some support from Ele’s and Necro’s at range. As it has been for the past year or so.

If i had to sum the general state of the game up in one sentence.
Guardians and Warriors everywhere.

Domzz.1260:

So you would say — current state of game..
WvW / PvP: Classes who maximize conditions (E.G. engineer, necro, thief)
PvE: Classes who maximize damage output (E.G. warrior, ranger, ele)

It’s much less simple than that.

In NA PvP, a popular team composition in the recent tournament was double warrior with other tanky specs like bunker guardian, spirit ranger, or celestial ele. However, in EU specs were much more dps and mobility oriented from what I hear.

However, in solo queue PvP and regular team queues, you’ll see a ton of engineers (often condition builds or turret point-holders). In less-coordinated matches (matches where people are not using voip), “solo artists” like engineers seem to shine.

In WvW, the most popular roamer is power thief because of stealth and mobility. Condition thief is also somewhat popular. However, condition engineers perform well vs. power thieves and have also become popular. Warriors and mesmers are also somewhat popular for roaming in WvW. You will almost never see a roaming necro because they lack the ability to run away, which is so central to WvW roaming.

In large groups in WvW, you’re likely to see a lot of hammer warriors, several guardians for support and healing, several eles and necros for ranged AoE damage, and some other professions in specialized roles or just tagging along.

I don’t do much PvE but I think whatever does the most damage seems to be most wanted.

Chances are the game will be exactly as it was when you left but you may have WXP (which didn’t add much to the game), EotM (which is only used for leveling), or the recent feature patch (god help you if you make a new character and don’t have 500 skill scrolls saved up).

Anet seems to just keep shooting themselves in the foot with this game. Was it like this in GW1?

So what I gather from all this are that warriors and guardians reign supreme ~~ necros can sometimes be helpful. Eles and Mesmers are the supports. Across most game modes.

Yes?

Edited by moderator: became off topic

Here’s what I think ~~

I think the game is about either 1v1 ability, survival (bunkering), or pure damage. Everything else doesnt matter cuz it blends in in large scale groups and battles.

Domzz.1260:

So what I gather from all this are that warriors and guardians reign supreme ~~ necros can sometimes be helpful. Eles and Mesmers are the supports. Across most game modes.

Yes?

Pretty much. In WvW, it’s the GWEN meta (Guardian, Warrior, Elementalist, Necro) for zerg makeup (roaming, you get everyone, but more thieves than anything else). The only real change to PvE is that necro gets dropped (what necro is good at doesn’t matter in PvE) and sometimes Mesmer takes its place. PvP tends to be Warriors and Guardians with a mix of the other classes filling out the rest of the roster.

Atherakhia.4086:

Chances are the game will be exactly as it was when you left but you may have WXP (which didn’t add much to the game), EotM (which is only used for leveling), or the recent feature patch (god help you if you make a new character and don’t have 500 skill scrolls saved up).

Anet seems to just keep shooting themselves in the foot with this game. Was it like this in GW1?

Wait, EotM and world XP didn’t add much? :o
They seem hugely popular, and the common opinion is to scrap the main WvW maps if any, because needs more EotM-like design.

Carighan.6758:

Atherakhia.4086:

Chances are the game will be exactly as it was when you left but you may have WXP (which didn’t add much to the game), EotM (which is only used for leveling), or the recent feature patch (god help you if you make a new character and don’t have 500 skill scrolls saved up).

Anet seems to just keep shooting themselves in the foot with this game. Was it like this in GW1?

Wait, EotM and world XP didn’t add much? :o
They seem hugely popular, and the common opinion is to scrap the main WvW maps if any, because needs more EotM-like design.

WXP was supposed to introduce more variety into the game mode but most everyone invests the first several hundred points into the same exact thing so there is no real variety.

For EotM, I’ve not heard much positive about it on the other forums. As I said, most view it as a karma train and absolutely useless for anything beyond that. People probably want new WvW maps for no other reason than they’re tired of the same old maps.

But this is a subjective thread asking about people’s opinions. If you don’t agree with mine, that’s cool.

Far, far too many gank specs

It’s almost as though the devs only play Spvp, and complaints about WvW class balance is completely ignored.

Ezeriel.9574:

Far, far too many gank specs

It’s almost as though the devs only play Spvp, and complaints about WvW class balance is completely ignored.

Is this a new buzzword? Gank Specs? What is a gank spec? My first thought is a thief, for the other classes a gank spec would be quick burst damage?

Retal was mostly nerfed because of WvW anyway, confusion was nerfed in WvW, thieves get to keep 3 second reveal instead of 4, there are many different things but people forget.

oZii.2864:

Ezeriel.9574:

Far, far too many gank specs

It’s almost as though the devs only play Spvp, and complaints about WvW class balance is completely ignored.

Is this a new buzzword? Gank Specs? What is a gank spec? My first thought is a thief, for the other classes a gank spec would be quick burst damage?

Retal was mostly nerfed because of WvW anyway, confusion was nerfed in WvW, thieves get to keep 3 second reveal instead of 4, there are many different things but people forget.

I’m assuming they’re most likely the “hit and run” speccs used in WvW as roamers, so yes, Thieves are counted in the lot.

Ganking comes from MOBAs, it is a class that can come out of no where, an stun you really hard. Then a metric ton of damage gets thrown down and you die. In DOTA 2 this requires 2 classes really, but here with immobilize, basalisk venom, and stun in general it can be accomplished by one class.

zapv.8051:

Ganking comes from MOBAs, it is a class that can come out of no where, an stun you really hard. Then a metric ton of damage gets thrown down and you die. In DOTA 2 this requires 2 classes really, but here with immobilize, basalisk venom, and stun in general it can be accomplished by one class.

Yes but it’s largely pointless as only silly people would risk travelling alone in WvW.
That’s exactly what the highwayman-type of spec is after, after all. They’re meant to eliminate sole reinforcement-runners. That’s what they bring to their realm. They are countered in stead by anti-highwaymen-setups.
These can either be specific builds (Blackwater Mesmer is the prime example here, lacking stopping power but being superb when attacked 1v1) or teams of 2 players focused on preventing the burst and then capitalizing on their numerical advantage.

The latter is where a certain imbalance exists in that many builds – but ahead of most, Thief – are insanely mobile in this game. And I really don’t think it’s healthy. In general, not just on thieves.

Ezeriel.9574:

Far, far too many gank specs

It’s almost as though the devs only play Spvp, —- —

ganky hold a circle wars 2    ?
i don’t know if that’s entirely accurate.. although, i’m not sure the current state of the game involves fun, skill, or strategy.. i really don’t

Ganking is Gang Killing. It was popular in WoW, as one person would be bait, and if you attacked them five rogues (thieves) would attack you from stealth for an instant kill.

…but they didn’t need five, one would do, as rogues could stunlock a person from full health to dead, by themselves. It was however much harder to do alone, so they usually traveled in pairs.

..and it sucked all the fun out of the game. Players traveled in zergs, and people whined endlessly about zergs. Sound familiar?

So Anet promised it’s player base that, that wouldn’t happen in GW2, but it did. You can’t go anywhere without a zerg in WvW, ganking is everywhere.

Gank spec’s that are popular… CnD thief, P/D condi thief, shattercat mesmer (now with condition damage), condi engineer…. and hammer warriors can stunlock you, from full health to dead, but it’s hard to do, so they travel in pairs.

If you’re not one of those classes, and you see one of those classes, you might just as well lay down and die.

This video applies to GW2 more and more everyday….

The ToL showed us. in PvP is bunker/power now the meta. In the finals was no condi build and in the semifinal was also no condi build.

Ezeriel.9574:

Ganking is Gang Killing. It was popular in WoW, as one person would be bait, and if you attacked them five rogues (thieves) would attack you from stealth for an instant kill.

…but they didn’t need five, one would do, as rogues could stunlock a person from full health to dead, by themselves. It was however much harder to do alone, so they usually traveled in pairs.

..and it sucked all the fun out of the game. Players traveled in zergs, and people whined endlessly about zergs. Sound familiar?

So Anet promised it’s player base that, that wouldn’t happen in GW2, but it did. You can’t go anywhere without a zerg in WvW, ganking is everywhere.

Gank spec’s that are popular… CnD thief, P/D condi thief, shattercat mesmer (now with condition damage), condi engineer…. and hammer warriors can stunlock you, from full health to dead, but it’s hard to do, so they travel in pairs.

If you’re not one of those classes, and you see one of those classes, you might just as well lay down and die.

This video applies to GW2 more and more everyday….

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6h7nOYggik

Ahh I see what your saying well your referring to builds not really classes. The options are going out by yourself or a small group so I don’t really understand. So it’s either a 1v1 issue or group issue. Some of the specs you named can be annoying like the p/d condi thief but many of those can be ignored unless your running around on a necromancer.

HOD has a PD thief that camps FA’s spawn point for hours on end.

He can easily kill people two and three at a time, without any risk to himself.

…five people can force him to back off for a minute or two, but anything less than ten can’t catch him, and we’ve completely given up on getting a yak to our base.

I’m sure someone would argue that it’s “fair” since FA has thieves that do the same thing, but personally, I find the whole thing toxic to the game.

For pvp this is what i think :

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/Balance-Competitive-GW2/first#post3995121

Ezeriel.9574:

So Anet promised it’s player base that, that wouldn’t happen in GW2, but it did. You can’t go anywhere without a zerg in WvW, ganking is everywhere.

Gank spec’s that are popular… CnD thief, P/D condi thief, shattercat mesmer (now with condition damage), condi engineer…. and hammer warriors can stunlock you, from full health to dead, but it’s hard to do, so they travel in pairs.

If you’re not one of those classes, and you see one of those classes, you might just as well lay down and die.

What did ANet promise its userbase? That, in the PvP mode where it’s larger-scale combat over objectives often requiring siege, the players wouldn’t band together and travel in groups? Why would that be the case? You don’t need to zerg around in PvE because no PvP is allowed in PvE, and it sounds like your WoW example was rooted in open-world PvP. Even if ANet lied about how players would work together in WvW, why would you believe it even for a single second? Put 150 players into a map, force them to attack large objectives with walls, and you think they’re going to spread out and look for fair fights?

Also, laying down and dying is boring, and I wouldn’t recommend it. Even as a Necro, fights against some of the popular solo roaming builds are on a tightrope, and often come down to if I use my transfers properly. If I time them right, it comes down to making sure they land. So what if they can basically lay down and half-play their way through their build for good results? I know for a fact I can kill reasonable representatives of those builds around the world, and I actively seek 1v1 situations with them. I like being on the razor’s edge, because wins are sweeter, and losses shine a bright light on what you did wrong, as you don’t really win if you do many things wrong.

Speaking of, which BL does that HoD Thief you mentioned frequent? I’ll happily fight him alone.

Cogbyrn.7283:

Put 150 players into a map, force them to attack large objectives with walls, and you think they’re going to spread out and look for fair fights?

You can shorten that quite a bit:
Put […] players […], you think they’re going to […] look for fair fights?

Still true.