Guild Wars 2

I am getting close to 1600 hours under my belt playing this class. The goal here isn’t to attempt to get Guild Wars 2 to buff the class into oblivion, my objective here is to simply give the devs some insight on a hardcore PvPers perspective of this wonderful class. Keep in mind I mainly spend most of my time in SPvP, but have also achieved rank 200+ in WvW just solo roaming while also participating in small groups.

The changes I propose will be based off my SPvP experience. Lets get started.

Lightning Touch- http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lightning_Touch

The cast time of this skill is 3/4 a second, the overall damage is much lower than a standard auto attack in air, the only real benefit you’ll obtain out of this skill is the weakness. Therefore this skill(when used tactically) is used strictly for defensive purposes, using Lightning Touch takes away from the pressure you could put on your enemy. This skill can also be difficult to actually land due to minor latency issues vs small hitbox.

Ideas on how to revamp Lightning Touch

-lower cast time to 1/2 a second
-create a radius around the elementalist when casting the ability, similar to Frozen Burst.
-slightly increase the weakness duration.
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Vapor Blade – http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vapor_Blade

This auto attack from the water line is extremely subpar. The blade’s travel speed is extremely slow, so slow most of the time the attack can be completely avoided. The damage is also so minor, even if you were to land this skill on your opponent, it doesn’t seem to provide the kind of benefit that would make you want to use this skill.

Ideas on how to revamp Vapor Blade

-turn the vapor blade into a homing missile
-increase the duration of the vulnerability
-increase the amount of vulnerability your opponent receives when landing this attack.
-increase the hitbox size of vapor blade
-increase travel velocity
-revamp/replace the skill
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Magnetic Grasp- http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magnetic_Grasp

This skill on paper is great, and the skill it self IS great… when it lands. Need I say more?
Magnetic leap, the chain to Magnetic Grasp, has problems of its own as well. Like making you travel in a direction that leaves you even further away from your opponent than you were before using it!

Ideas on how to improve Magnetic Grasp

-increase the projectiles velocity
-increase range from 900 to 1200
-turn the projectile into a homing missile
-increase the travel velocity of magnetic leap.
-give magnetic leap an evasion property while being used
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Churning Earth – http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Churning_Earth

Don’t get me started on this skill, Churning Earth is the bane of every elementalist’s existence, a double edged sword if you will. I could rant for hours on how useless it is, or even complain about how broken it can be when being used inside of a shadow refuge. Lightning Flash anyone? Overall though I feel the skill needs to either be completely replaced or heavily revamped in a manner that leaves the elementalist potentially wanting to use this skill in any battle they find themselves in.

Ideas on how to improve/revamp Churning Earth

-heavily reduce the cast time (and damage accordingly)
-implement an early “detonate” option. (damage scales accordingly)
-while the skill is channeling, reflect missiles
-replace the skill entirely
-allow the elementalist to be on the run while channeling, self snare included while channeling.
-Churning Earth creates a rocky shield around the user which detonates if being struck, ends if leaving earth attunement. (Should the skill still channel? Damage revamped accordingly)
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Although there are other skills which I believe need some reworking, these are the ones at the top of my list.

My thoughts on your ideas:

>> Lightning Touch : The hit box is my complaint about this skill (same with Fire Grab); I would like to see a large hit box
>> Vapor Blade: The blades literally get stopped by grass (or any elevation difference), so my tuning idea would be to increase general damage (15%) or do something with “the return path” (if that is technically possible, like more damage on return path or another vulnerability stack on the return)
>> Magnetic Grasp/Leap : Its ability to miss or fumble is legendary, so I doubt they can make it more stable. I like the idea of a range increase, e.g. so catch Thieves, but also the baseline damage could need some love.
>> Churning Earth : The problem is the PvP vs. PvE issue; it works like a charm on the AI, but is bad vs. real people if the can see the channelling animation. I have no solution for that right now.

Actually, churning earth is also bad in pve cuz its a dps loss in the d/d rotation and using off hand dagger instead of focus is not desirable to begin with.

but the WvW churn bombs

As an Elementalist with 2,000 hours, got to rank 6 on the leader boards (before I realize the ladder was junk, so I stopped rank) have 2 Incinerators and plenty of theory crafting with the Ele.

Lightning Touch hit box as well as Fire Grab needs adjusting, the cone is pretty long and skinny, where it should be wide and short. Lightning Touch doesn’t need improvement stat wise, it’s an excellent skill for landing on any zerker-builds, nulling their damage output for 5 seconds.

Vapor Blade can use a projectile speed boost, otherwise, I never use it other than poking running foes while Ride the Lightning is on a 40 second recharge because some bullkitten block.

Magnetic Grasp needs a faster casting and projectile speed for sure, it fails way more than it should and the problem is the speed it comes out.

Churning Earth does not need any adjustment, what makes the skill so good is the zoning it does. I’ll let the skill hit nothing if it forces the enemy team to use an interrupt or off point. Save that Lightning Flash for Earthquake, knocking half the enemy team down.

The Elementalist needs some damage sustain nerfs, it’s way to easy to land 10+ seconds of burning every 10 seconds.

2k hour+ Mag ele who focuses on duels and roaming (Mostly in WvW but I typically SPvP on a weekly basis in a roamer role.)

My thoughts-

Completely spot on with the churning earth detonation.

Vapor blade is a great skill. I think it would be neat if instead of some projectile it was a bomb/grenade type skill. Like “Drop Dry Ice” opponents walking through this are chilled for 1/2 second. Just a hastily thought up example of what a skil like that could do.

Lightning touch and fire grab are perfect skills. In my opinion the damage on fire grab should be raised to complement its skill floor and the weakness on LT should be longer for the same reason. Less aoe, more aim IMO.

Finally, I have roughly 80% success with magnetic blade when I am in range. Even so, I think the skill’s accuracy and bugs should be worked out. Other than that I am happy with that skill.

Mbelch.9028:

2k hour+ Mag ele who focuses on duels and roaming (Mostly in WvW but I typically SPvP on a weekly basis in a roamer role.)

My thoughts-

Completely spot on with the churning earth detonation.

Vapor blade is a great skill. I think it would be neat if instead of some projectile it was a bomb/grenade type skill. Like “Drop Dry Ice” opponents walking through this are chilled for 1/2 second. Just a hastily thought up example of what a skil like that could do.

Lightning touch and fire grab are perfect skills. In my opinion the damage on fire grab should be raised to complement its skill floor and the weakness on LT should be longer for the same reason. Less aoe, more aim IMO.

Finally, I have roughly 80% success with magnetic blade when I am in range. Even so, I think the skill’s accuracy and bugs should be worked out. Other than that I am happy with that skill.

It’s funny how we have about the same play time yet completely different opinions on how the skills play out.

In my opinion Churning Earth is in a great spot, a very high risk, high reward and requires skill placement and timing. Teleport an Earthquake onto 3 people then begin casting Churning Earth, forcing dodge rolls from 3 panicking players.
I don’t even carry Armor of Earth for interrupt protection. Arcane Blast, Lightning Flash and Arcane Shield and face roll my way on my D/D Elementalist.

PvP doesn’t need more condition spam, Vapor Blade does not need to chill. Plus, chill is a very powerful condition enough as it is.

Lightning Touch and Fire Grab does need hit box adjustments. Play a Charr Elementalist (like I do) and the animation doesn’t match hit box.
Fire Grab doesn’t need more damage and I always save it to finish a foe under 10% health, a target running away with low health in a straight line is an easy hit for this skill.
For Fire Breath to hit 2 targets and yet Fire Grab to miss the same targets, kittenes me off.

I am not happy with Magnitic Grasp, even with my own estimated chance of a 80% hit or bug I need it to halt enemies. Stopping them from running to my thief for a stomp or stopping them from running away to fight another day, having this randomly fail is unexcusable.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Mbelch.9028:

2k hour+ Mag ele who focuses on duels and roaming (Mostly in WvW but I typically SPvP on a weekly basis in a roamer role.)

My thoughts-

Completely spot on with the churning earth detonation.

Vapor blade is a great skill. I think it would be neat if instead of some projectile it was a bomb/grenade type skill. Like “Drop Dry Ice” opponents walking through this are chilled for 1/2 second. Just a hastily thought up example of what a skil like that could do.

Lightning touch and fire grab are perfect skills. In my opinion the damage on fire grab should be raised to complement its skill floor and the weakness on LT should be longer for the same reason. Less aoe, more aim IMO.

Finally, I have roughly 80% success with magnetic blade when I am in range. Even so, I think the skill’s accuracy and bugs should be worked out. Other than that I am happy with that skill.

It’s funny how we have about the same play time yet completely different opinions on how the skills play out.

In my opinion Churning Earth is in a great spot, a very high risk, high reward and requires skill placement and timing. Teleport an Earthquake onto 3 people then begin casting Churning Earth, forcing dodge rolls from 3 panicking players.
I don’t even carry Armor of Earth for interrupt protection. Arcane Blast, Lightning Flash and Arcane Shield and face roll my way on my D/D Elementalist.

PvP doesn’t need more condition spam, Vapor Blade does not need to chill. Plus, chill is a very powerful condition enough as it is.

Lightning Touch and Fire Grab does need hit box adjustments. Play a Charr Elementalist (like I do) and the animation doesn’t match hit box.
Fire Grab doesn’t need more damage and I always save it to finish a foe under 10% health, a target running away with low health in a straight line is an easy hit for this skill.
For Fire Breath to hit 2 targets and yet Fire Grab to miss the same targets, kittenes me off.

I am not happy with Magnitic Grasp, even with my own estimated chance of a 80% hit or bug I need it to halt enemies. Stopping them from running to my thief for a stomp or stopping them from running away to fight another day, having this randomly fail is unexcusable.

Different people, different experiences. I’m not happy that Mag Grasp is so buggy, but I am happy with the skill itself once the bugs are fixed.

Fire grab never misses when you aim it right. I have a very high hit rate with it, you just have to be so perfect with it. I feel like that should be rewarded more if that is preserved (which I hope it is)

The whole chill thing was just an example, I am more or less for the change to a bomb/nade thing for chill.

Churning earth is where we completely disagree. I think it has its uses, don’t get me wrong. It is perfect for opening, for closing, for crowd control, for a stealthed sneak attack mid battle. But in a duel (my favorite activity) this skill is neigh useless.

I’m pretty well known amongst ele duelers in my tier for being able to hit churning earth on anybody. So I do understand its parameters and the way to use it. But I argue it is far more efficient to use just about any other skill combo than to blow utilities and use churning earth. No skilled person busts more than 1 dodge on a churn.

Churn definitely needs a change if anything about /d does.

Mbelch.9028:

I’m pretty well known amongst ele duelers in my tier for being able to hit churning earth on anybody. So I do understand its parameters and the way to use it. But I argue it is far more efficient to use just about any other skill combo than to blow utilities and use churning earth. No skilled person busts more than 1 dodge on a churn.

Churn definitely needs a change if anything about /d does.

I disagree.

Hitting someone with Churning Earth in a duel isn’t hard, it’s all about timing your opponent, not yourself.

Granted, it’s hard for unskilled players to hit during a duel but Churning Earth already has it’s benefits that even unskilled players can use.

Timing your opponents? Sure that’s part of it. But no skilled person gets hit frequently by a churn. It’s easy to remember the cast time. It’s easy to interrupt and it’s easy to skirt the range of if the other evasion plans don’t work.

Something so clunky shouldn’t be untouched.

Fire Grab and Lightning Touch could get a combined hitbox: A small PBAoE circle (130 at max) in addition to the long narrow cone it has. That way it would at least be a guaranteed hit in melee range.

Okay I have also a 2k+ hours in ele, playing both d/d and staff.

The things you place are like those small things that tend to bug me out also indeed.

Lightning Touch is indeed hard to hit for litle reward, if used right however it’s not to much of a problem, making this skill a bit friendlier to use might help out new d/d eles allot, there is however something else that should be fixed if the would do this.

Vapor Blade: Never use it, 2-3-4-5 are very good skill is water auto attack is totally useless. after I used my other skill in water I always instantly swap to next attumment.

Magnetic Grasp: Making this skill homing will probably make a huge difference, increasing the range would be fun to make use able to chase down those pesky GS warrior properly, however I don’t think buffing d/d ele chasing ability would be the right solution for that. Proper solution would be tuning down the fleeing speed of gs warriors.

Most of this changes would make D/D ele more friendly to starting players on D/D, however not necessarily stronger in experienced hands. Which probably is where you should be looking for.

Churning Earth: Mixed feelings about this, if you hit it (either by using a lighting flash or because enemy is plain stupid or due to a mistake form the enemy), it’s a fight winning skill, but indeed against a proper player is nearly impossible to hit, so it’s more or less a snowball skill and I don’t know if that is what you should be looking for to have in a skill bar. Probally a detonation option might be the best solution indeed.

I did mention at the Lightning Touch something else should be fix and that is the thing that is know as burning flash, it’s an extremely powerfull glitch and if they would make those changes to the D/D skills, which would make D/D a bit more friendlier to starters, it would make the D/D to powerfull in experienced hands if the glitch is still in, due to the extreme damage when this glitch is used.

As an Ele with 3.5k hours, dual Incinerators, and Meteorlogics, I think that ArenaNet need to leave D/D alone and focus on the other weapons.

D/D is already stupidly strong especially with Celestial gear/amulet. Focus skills could use a look at. As could chill affecting attunement swapping. But please for the love of god do not buff D/D specifically any more.

Thanks,
Jam
“That” Mag roamer.

Scepter Fire #2… Dragons Tooth, Ground Target Please and thank you!

SonOfKrypton.4357:

As an Ele with 3.5k hours, dual Incinerators, and Meteorlogics, I think that ArenaNet need to leave D/D alone and focus on the other weapons.

D/D is already stupidly strong especially with Celestial gear/amulet. Focus skills could use a look at. As could chill affecting attunement swapping. But please for the love of god do not buff D/D specifically any more.

Thanks,
Jam
“That” Mag roamer.

This. This is what needs to be adjusted, D/D doesn’t need buffs, it’s already really good.

The amount of burning that is applied is way to much and needs to be toned down.
Drakes Breath: Burning Duriation 3 Seconds per tick => 2 seconds per tick.
Ring of Fire: Burning Duration 5 seconds => 3 Seconds.

D/D is already really tanky and can deal decent damage but add that 25 stacks of might to power AND condition damage and burning is going to hurt. A lot.

(I have 2 incinerators too *COUGH)

As for other weapons, staff needs shorter CC duration with shorter cooldown on the CC skills with better mobility. Staff elementalist should be closer to a shortbow thief rather than a longbow ranger. Using CC and mobility to continue a ranged assault.

Scepter needs to focus on quick attacks at the cost of mobility. Dragons Tooth, Shatterstone and even Dust Devil are way to slow. Even with Dust Devils 1/4th casting time, it’s projectile speed is just bad.

Focus recharge is just dumb. The least useful Aura, Fire Aura, is 40 seconds long, while the best Aura, Shock Aura, is 25 seconds. The heck ArenaNet? Adjust these recharges and casting times please.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Mbelch.9028:

I’m pretty well known amongst ele duelers in my tier for being able to hit churning earth on anybody. So I do understand its parameters and the way to use it. But I argue it is far more efficient to use just about any other skill combo than to blow utilities and use churning earth. No skilled person busts more than 1 dodge on a churn.

Churn definitely needs a change if anything about /d does.

I disagree.

Hitting someone with Churning Earth in a duel isn’t hard, it’s all about timing your opponent, not yourself.

Granted, it’s hard for unskilled players to hit during a duel but Churning Earth already has it’s benefits that even unskilled players can use.

Any half decent player can easily dodge a churning earth even if you lighting flash…Not hard to remember the cast time and dodge accordingly.

Why is it that when I use Magnetic Grasp in range it misses 95% of the time? I also noticed when using Evasive Arcana that when I tried to blast a field with my Earth dodge roll I would sometimes press 3 quickly (second phase skill MG) so that I could leap through my fire field and that would cancel out the blast finisher of EA. Is this intended or was it because I potentially spammed the 2nd part of the MG skill?

Onto Lightning Touch as someone else has mentioned. Only thing it does is give weakness. Compare it to the other 2nd slot skills for other attunements; Fire does damage/burning, Water heals/damage and Earth does damage/bleed/blocks projectiles too apparently. Why does this skill lacks sufficient damage or abilities like other attunement skills?

Focus. I think there’s nothing wrong with it with the exception of Flame Wall. I don’t want to use this skill, it bores me. Takes a bit of time to cast and for what? A line on the floor that stays longer than your Burning Speed. Sure that can be nice when you want to leap through it for fury/protection/Fire Aura, but I think it needs something new, possibly a rework.

Since everyone is posting their hours, I have over 4,400 hours on my elementalist.

Edit: forgot title said d/d but I thought I’d give my 2 cents on Focus anyway, byesss!

SonOfKrypton.4357:

As an Ele with 3.5k hours, dual Incinerators, and Meteorlogics, I think that ArenaNet need to leave D/D alone and focus on the other weapons.

D/D is already stupidly strong especially with Celestial gear/amulet. Focus skills could use a look at. As could chill affecting attunement swapping. But please for the love of god do not buff D/D specifically any more.

Thanks,
Jam
“That” Mag roamer.

I’m not sure how this thread got turned into a boasting match about pve gear, we are discussing pvp here folks >.>

All weapon sets should be looked at, for every class, its not fair to say weapon X shouldn’t get rework even though it has a completely useless skill because Y class is already very strong with that weapon. Buff every weapon set, nerf where its needed and create change, change is good.

I’m already expecting nerfs to might stacking and/or sustain for eles, which will kind of suck because then stat combos like the zerker amulet in SPvP(One of my favorites!) will probably never be seen again, at least not on d/d! Then again who knows, maybe after the new skill bar patch hits the shelves we’ll all reconsider how powerful our elementalists feel.

SonOfKrypton.4357:

As an Ele with 3.5k hours, dual Incinerators, and Meteorlogics, I think that ArenaNet need to leave D/D alone and focus on the other weapons.

D/D is already stupidly strong especially with Celestial gear/amulet. Focus skills could use a look at. As could chill affecting attunement swapping. But please for the love of god do not buff D/D specifically any more.

Thanks,
Jam
“That” Mag roamer.

Thanks for your irony.

Focus is extremely good but needs shorter cooldown and IMO a teleport skill.

Scepter needs a few auto attack changes, ground targetable dragon tooth.

Dagger mainhand needs a few auto changes.

Dagger offhand needs a bug fix and a churning earth change.

I don’t know what legendary weapons mean for this discussion. In most cases I’ve noticed having a legendary weapon means a player is actually worse.

I want celestial nerfed to be only as good as other armor sets. It’s stupid strong, and makes baddies good. It covers up the defensive flaw in D/D, and it shouldn’t.

So other things to consider here: don’t judge a weapon set and its skills by an armor set… Weapon skills are proven to be more stationary, so change the armor, not the weapon.

I can agree with pretty much all of the above, although idk if focus should really become… stronger? I feel like a teleport on top of what focus can do now might make offhand dagger a useless weapon choice. I really hope they look into those auto attacks for dagger main hand and revamp churning earth… My mind will be blown if they leave CE untouched.

I agree it is a great weapon but it definitely needs cooldowns at least reviewed. If no CDs are reviewed, then it needs a buff.

I’d kill for that CE change.

Nova Stiker.8396:

Mbelch.9028:

I’m pretty well known amongst ele duelers in my tier for being able to hit churning earth on anybody. So I do understand its parameters and the way to use it. But I argue it is far more efficient to use just about any other skill combo than to blow utilities and use churning earth. No skilled person busts more than 1 dodge on a churn.

Churn definitely needs a change if anything about /d does.

I disagree.

Hitting someone with Churning Earth in a duel isn’t hard, it’s all about timing your opponent, not yourself.

Granted, it’s hard for unskilled players to hit during a duel but Churning Earth already has it’s benefits that even unskilled players can use.

Churning Earth is perhaps the easiest skill in the game to avoid.

You think Churning Earth needs a revamp? And it’s one of the only balanced skills in the game atm? Sry. But what are you smoking?
You claim to have been playing elementalist for almost 1600 hours, and still havn’t realized Churning Earth is one of the only well designed skills. In a 1v1, yes it’s hard to land, but I land it regularly in teamfights with Lightning Flash or via being stealthed.
Can people please stop posting suggestions when they have absolutely no clue how to design/balance a game.
The Churning Earth revamp is completely ridiculous, and the other suggestions won’t change anything at all. So why even bother?
Sry I’m being harsh, but I think it’s necessary. If Anet went in this direction, oh boy.

Changes that were made to ranger mauk skill, widening the hit box so its essentially a I80°/ full frontal semi circle smash , would be perfect fire lightning touch and fire grab.
As it is now its pretty finkey and you can miss even when it seems like it has landed. With a similar change, sence maul suffered from similar issues, it would become a better finisher than it is now.

My biggest issue with Vapor Blade is the way it disappears when it hits a wall or something. It should immediately bounce back instead of disappearing. That and a velocity boost would make the skill useable.

KrisHQ.4719:

You think Churning Earth needs a revamp? And it’s one of the only balanced skills in the game atm? Sry. But what are you smoking?
You claim to have been playing elementalist for almost 1600 hours, and still havn’t realized Churning Earth is one of the only well designed skills. In a 1v1, yes it’s hard to land, but I land it regularly in teamfights with Lightning Flash or via being stealthed.
Can people please stop posting suggestions when they have absolutely no clue how to design/balance a game.
The Churning Earth revamp is completely ridiculous, and the other suggestions won’t change anything at all. So why even bother?
Sry I’m being harsh, but I think it’s necessary. If Anet went in this direction, oh boy.

So this is pretty out there. No need to be disrespectful.

I disagree with your opinion. I in fact think you don’t have enough experience/time played in all facets of the game to think churning earth is well designed.

I think the change to a charged churning earth is perfectly skillful… It doesn’t buff churn and it doesn’t nerf it. Just makes it useful in more facets of the game (so an indirect buff, not a skill buff).

People like you can continue to use full charges.

People like me can use a half or a quarter charge depending on the group.

Small man/fueling makes churn pretty low on the totem pole for useful skills. Please don’t try to argue that I am wrong, as I know for a fact you won’t use it more than once in your average one on one if ever. A three second charge where you can be fully wailed on is something not worth using. Like I said, I can hit it quite well, but you literally get more out of four lightning whips than out of one churning earth most times.

I feel every skill should find a use everywhere in the game.

I’ve played d/d ele for a while now, even in tPvP and WvW,

I think they are in a decent spot, they could use some quality of life adjustments to some of the skills for sure, and maybe a cooldown reduction of 5-10 s for skills like Fire Grab, Updraft, Earthquake

I agree with changing vapor blade.

I personally think they should consolidate the magnetic grasp -----> magnetic leap into one motion. You basically leap to your foe then immobilize them to allow for some interesting combos.

The truth is, not every skill is suited to every situation, nor do I think it should be.

killahmayne.9518:

The truth is, not every skill is suited to every situation, nor do I think it should be.

I like vapor blade a lot. It could use some QoL. I wouldn’t mind the bomb/nade change I suggested.

No, every skill shouldn’t be for every situation, but you better believe they should be able to be used for multiple situations.

Churning earth doesn’t fall into that category. That’s why it needs a slight change.

Mbelch.9028:

killahmayne.9518:

The truth is, not every skill is suited to every situation, nor do I think it should be.

I like vapor blade a lot. It could use some QoL. I wouldn’t mind the bomb/nade change I suggested.

No, every skill shouldn’t be for every situation, but you better believe they should be able to be used for multiple situations.

Churning earth doesn’t fall into that category. That’s why it needs a slight change.

I feel like churning earth does have uses for multiple situations.

Obviously it is good for casting into a large group of people, or a zerg. But I feel like it is also good for area denial. For example if one of my allies is being focused by a thief or something like that he can just walk into my churning earth and the thief would be somewhat of a fool to follow into it.

I feel like it is also good if you have 2-3 enemies down and can’t stomp, the AoE damage from it can bring em to fully downed and also maybe hit people who are trying to res. Sometimes it can also force people to blow cooldowns on utility skills. Maybe a mesmer feels like he can’t escape the churning earth so they blow a teleport, or a warrior needs to blow an endure pain.

Although rare, I may use it 1v1 against certain classes. If they’ve blown their dodges, I can teleport hit them even if they are initially out of range. Sometimes they might slip up and not dodge it (it happens to the best of us) and I feel like why not it is worth a shot if it hits I get a significant advantage.

Sigmoid.7082:

Changes that were made to ranger mauk skill, widening the hit box so its essentially a I80°/ full frontal semi circle smash , would be perfect fire lightning touch and fire grab.
As it is now its pretty finkey and you can miss even when it seems like it has landed. With a similar change, sence maul suffered from similar issues, it would become a better finisher than it is now.

I kind of like that fire grab takes a little bit of “anticipation aiming” to land, but I don’t think it would hurt to slightly improve the hitbox either, a fire grab that would hit anyone in your entire front arc is a little too much imo, lots of people would start crying in tpvp.

KrisHQ.4719:

You think Churning Earth needs a revamp? And it’s one of the only balanced skills in the game atm? Sry. But what are you smoking?
You claim to have been playing elementalist for almost 1600 hours, and still havn’t realized Churning Earth is one of the only well designed skills. In a 1v1, yes it’s hard to land, but I land it regularly in teamfights with Lightning Flash or via being stealthed.
Can people please stop posting suggestions when they have absolutely no clue how to design/balance a game.
The Churning Earth revamp is completely ridiculous, and the other suggestions won’t change anything at all. So why even bother?
Sry I’m being harsh, but I think it’s necessary. If Anet went in this direction, oh boy.

I don’t think you have enough experience fighting teams that know what they’re doing if you feel like CE is completely balanced. While there are team oriented scenarios that make CE a great skill, the cons far outweigh the pros. You mention using CE + LF… this strat wont work a great majority of the time when VSing an experienced player. I also mentioned using CE in shadow refuge and how it was a great tactic, I’m left to believe that you did not take the time to fully read my post.

The problem isn’t that CE is COMPLETELY useless, the problem is that CE is rarely viable.

Oddly enough, you didn’t mention Fire Grab. It has the same landing problem of Air #2 and an insane CD.

this is from my POV, with 800 tournament wins and best rank 23 on leaderboards

Ideas on how to revamp Lightning Touch

-lower cast time to 1/2 a second
i agree

-create a radius around the elementalist when casting the ability, similar to Frozen Burst.
id rather have a wider cone than a radius, imo it fits the skill and its name better

-slightly increase the weakness duration.
i never felt like it was too short but i wouldn’t mind an increased duration either
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Ideas on how to revamp Vapor Blade

-turn the vapor blade into a homing missile
either that or make it 3 projectiles like the fire auto attack. i think its less plausible that it will become a homing missile because it acts like an aoe hitting all targets on its way.

-increase the duration of the vulnerability
i agree, necro axe for example has 7 seconds

-increase the amount of vulnerability your opponent receives when landing this attack.
if it becomes a homing projectile i don’t think this will be needed as it will hit the target twice

-increase the hitbox size of vapor blade
not necessary if it is homing, problem solved if they make the skill fire 3 projectiles with a wider cone

-increase travel velocity
wouldn’t mind

-revamp/replace the skill:
i don’t think they would do that.
————————————————————————————————

Ideas on how to improve Magnetic Grasp

-increase the projectiles velocity
i think it shouldn’t be a projectile at all. increase the cast time to 3/4 and make it hit instantly similar to how necro’s dark pact works. (and lower necro’s skill to 3/4 from 1)

-increase range from 900 to 1200
no that’s too much

-turn the projectile into a homing missile
see above

-increase the travel velocity of magnetic leap.
as far as i know all leaps have the same speed. a faster travel velocity also means that you leap less far, similar to when you have quickness.

-give magnetic leap an evasion property while being used
tbh that would be too much for a skill that already immobilizes and is a leap.
————————————————————————————————

Ideas on how to improve/revamp Churning Earth

-heavily reduce the cast time (and damage accordingly)
i think it kinda destroys the purpose of this skill as it is meant to be a “BOOM” skill

-implement an early “detonate” option. (damage scales accordingly)i would rather have this with a lowered cooldown depending on how early you detonate it with the blast finisher only activating after a set amount of channeled seconds.

-while the skill is channeling, reflect missiles
too strong

-replace the skill entirely
just make the skill work

-allow the elementalist to be on the run while channeling, self snare included while channeling.
no that would be like a walking bomb.

-Churning Earth creates a rocky shield around the user which detonates if being struck, ends if leaving earth attunement. (Should the skill still channel? Damage revamped accordingly)
tbh too similar to arcane shield

killahmayne.9518:

Mbelch.9028:

killahmayne.9518:

The truth is, not every skill is suited to every situation, nor do I think it should be.

I like vapor blade a lot. It could use some QoL. I wouldn’t mind the bomb/nade change I suggested.

No, every skill shouldn’t be for every situation, but you better believe they should be able to be used for multiple situations.

Churning earth doesn’t fall into that category. That’s why it needs a slight change.

I feel like churning earth does have uses for multiple situations.

Obviously it is good for casting into a large group of people, or a zerg. But I feel like it is also good for area denial. For example if one of my allies is being focused by a thief or something like that he can just walk into my churning earth and the thief would be somewhat of a fool to follow into it.

I feel like it is also good if you have 2-3 enemies down and can’t stomp, the AoE damage from it can bring em to fully downed and also maybe hit people who are trying to res. Sometimes it can also force people to blow cooldowns on utility skills. Maybe a mesmer feels like he can’t escape the churning earth so they blow a teleport, or a warrior needs to blow an endure pain.

Although rare, I may use it 1v1 against certain classes. If they’ve blown their dodges, I can teleport hit them even if they are initially out of range. Sometimes they might slip up and not dodge it (it happens to the best of us) and I feel like why not it is worth a shot if it hits I get a significant advantage.

You’ve really only listed one use… It’s an area damage skill for use when multiple people aren’t going to be focusing you.

That’s not several uses.

Plus, all it takes is a well timed block/dodge and all three seconds of the abuse you took, and the cooldown you likely blew to land the skill make it completely unreliable at best.

That’s not even beginning to mention how you need to use between one and three utities to hit a skill that literally does the same damage of three lightning whips.

I’m not really speaking a different language here am I?

Most of the changes would be in traits (nerfs and buffs to force people out of Water Magic and Arcana) and utilities especially elite wise…. I’m feeling like earth might becomes more attractive and reliable.

Don’t forget the mindset of the changes:“Tone down the most popular improve the less popular”.

Grimreaper.5370:

KrisHQ.4719:

You think Churning Earth needs a revamp? And it’s one of the only balanced skills in the game atm? Sry. But what are you smoking?
You claim to have been playing elementalist for almost 1600 hours, and still havn’t realized Churning Earth is one of the only well designed skills. In a 1v1, yes it’s hard to land, but I land it regularly in teamfights with Lightning Flash or via being stealthed.
Can people please stop posting suggestions when they have absolutely no clue how to design/balance a game.
The Churning Earth revamp is completely ridiculous, and the other suggestions won’t change anything at all. So why even bother?
Sry I’m being harsh, but I think it’s necessary. If Anet went in this direction, oh boy.

I don’t think you have enough experience fighting teams that know what they’re doing if you feel like CE is completely balanced. While there are team oriented scenarios that make CE a great skill, the cons far outweigh the pros. You mention using CE + LF… this strat wont work a great majority of the time when VSing an experienced player. I also mentioned using CE in shadow refuge and how it was a great tactic, I’m left to believe that you did not take the time to fully read my post.

The problem isn’t that CE is COMPLETELY useless, the problem is that CE is rarely viable.

CE is probably the only skill where people have to think before activating it:
Do I use CE now, or will it be better for me to wait and initiate in a teamfight where I’m unexpected?
Some other skills such as Shocking Aura can have the same effect, where it can be used to chain a lot of CC or use it mainly for defensive purposes.
Furthermore, Shocking Aura and CE can actually be combined to land a rather unsuspected strike. Since most people in GW2 spam their skills, timing a shocking aura correctly will stun people the moment CE goes off.
However, thats two abilities. If Churning Earth was revamped in a way that allowed people to detonate it faster, it would probably just be used as another spammable skill to grant a few conditions. So, another incredibly boring skill with zero risk/reward factor. I’m pretty sure that is NOT what you want, you might not know it though.
Rather fix a lot of the spammable skills on other classes, and that way make the risk in CE more worth it.

@OP:

and what nerfs do you think ele needs? You can’t just talk all buffs.

Mbelch.9028:

killahmayne.9518:

Mbelch.9028:

killahmayne.9518:

The truth is, not every skill is suited to every situation, nor do I think it should be.

I like vapor blade a lot. It could use some QoL. I wouldn’t mind the bomb/nade change I suggested.

No, every skill shouldn’t be for every situation, but you better believe they should be able to be used for multiple situations.

Churning earth doesn’t fall into that category. That’s why it needs a slight change.

I feel like churning earth does have uses for multiple situations.

Obviously it is good for casting into a large group of people, or a zerg. But I feel like it is also good for area denial. For example if one of my allies is being focused by a thief or something like that he can just walk into my churning earth and the thief would be somewhat of a fool to follow into it.

I feel like it is also good if you have 2-3 enemies down and can’t stomp, the AoE damage from it can bring em to fully downed and also maybe hit people who are trying to res. Sometimes it can also force people to blow cooldowns on utility skills. Maybe a mesmer feels like he can’t escape the churning earth so they blow a teleport, or a warrior needs to blow an endure pain.

Although rare, I may use it 1v1 against certain classes. If they’ve blown their dodges, I can teleport hit them even if they are initially out of range. Sometimes they might slip up and not dodge it (it happens to the best of us) and I feel like why not it is worth a shot if it hits I get a significant advantage.

You’ve really only listed one use… It’s an area damage skill for use when multiple people aren’t going to be focusing you.

That’s not several uses.

Plus, all it takes is a well timed block/dodge and all three seconds of the abuse you took, and the cooldown you likely blew to land the skill make it completely unreliable at best.

That’s not even beginning to mention how you need to use between one and three utities to hit a skill that literally does the same damage of three lightning whips.

I’m not really speaking a different language here am I?

Based off of what you said, then there really is only two uses for any skill in the game. Either in 1v1, or group settings, or both. Saying a skill is only useful for group settings is quite a broad spectrum don’t you think and can encompass a lot of things? Things like area denial and what not don’t have to be group-based either. It is also a blast finisher so is that not useful?

If what you say is the case then there are so many other skills that only have uses against multiple opponents and in my opinion that is perfectly fine and there is no problem with that.

I’ll gladly take a skill that can be very good and game changing in group settings. At least in my experience 70-80% of fights are either me vs more than one person or me and a group vs another group. Most fights I participate in involve more than 1 opponent and usually more than one ally, and I am sure this is the same for most people.

Now I am not opposing any changes to Churning Earth whatsoever, I am just saying that despite what people say it is a very useful skill, in the right situations. A well-timed dodge/aegis against anything can be detrimental to you, it is apart of risk vs reward. But if churning earth does hit, it is quite a large AoE and also inflicts 8 stacks of bleed which is also significant which could change a fight. On my celestial ele the 8 stacks of bleed equate to 800 damage a second. I don’t think 3 lightning whips has that same impact.

I do agree however that it does require somewhat of high investment of utilities to make this skill successful. However you can say the same for many other skills.

Churning Earth is amazing for team fights. Plain and simple

If you are using it in a middle of a 1v1 for DAMAGE, you are doing it wrong.

Grasping Earth, Lightning Flash+Earthquake, then Churning Earth. The opponent has to either blow a double dodge or take the hit. If they double dodge, fully lay a Drakes Breath+Fire Grab.

Granted, its uses are limited 1v1 due to its slow casting time. It is all about proper timing or forcing your opponent to do something that will leave them vulnerable.

But Guild Wars 2 is not a 1v1 game.

In team fights, oh man I love Churning Earth. Secure rezzes, secure stomps, zoning, force dodges, force blocks and my favorite, focusing a target, then flash Churning Earth to that thief poking with his shortbow on the ledge.

style.6173:

@OP:

and what nerfs do you think ele needs? You can’t just talk all buffs.

A nerf to sustain if anything, I don’t know how Anet should deal with the abundant sustain Ele has. If healing is nerfed in general then stat combos which don’t need a nerf, will be nerfed, for example, zerker stats.

Celestial amulet + str runes is what brought eles from being a kitten class to slightly over the top. Perhaps one of the two needs to be toned down.

imo the only nerf that should happen is to the max amount of might stacks in s/tPvP. this will not only harm eles but they will also benefit from that when other might stacking classes hit less.

i’d say remove the max stack size to 15 (or maybe 20 for a start).

KrisHQ.4719:

Grimreaper.5370:

KrisHQ.4719:

You think Churning Earth needs a revamp? And it’s one of the only balanced skills in the game atm? Sry. But what are you smoking?
You claim to have been playing elementalist for almost 1600 hours, and still havn’t realized Churning Earth is one of the only well designed skills. In a 1v1, yes it’s hard to land, but I land it regularly in teamfights with Lightning Flash or via being stealthed.
Can people please stop posting suggestions when they have absolutely no clue how to design/balance a game.
The Churning Earth revamp is completely ridiculous, and the other suggestions won’t change anything at all. So why even bother?
Sry I’m being harsh, but I think it’s necessary. If Anet went in this direction, oh boy.

I don’t think you have enough experience fighting teams that know what they’re doing if you feel like CE is completely balanced. While there are team oriented scenarios that make CE a great skill, the cons far outweigh the pros. You mention using CE + LF… this strat wont work a great majority of the time when VSing an experienced player. I also mentioned using CE in shadow refuge and how it was a great tactic, I’m left to believe that you did not take the time to fully read my post.

The problem isn’t that CE is COMPLETELY useless, the problem is that CE is rarely viable.

CE is probably the only skill where people have to think before activating it:
Do I use CE now, or will it be better for me to wait and initiate in a teamfight where I’m unexpected?
Some other skills such as Shocking Aura can have the same effect, where it can be used to chain a lot of CC or use it mainly for defensive purposes.
Furthermore, Shocking Aura and CE can actually be combined to land a rather unsuspected strike. Since most people in GW2 spam their skills, timing a shocking aura correctly will stun people the moment CE goes off.
However, thats two abilities. If Churning Earth was revamped in a way that allowed people to detonate it faster, it would probably just be used as another spammable skill to grant a few conditions. So, another incredibly boring skill with zero risk/reward factor. I’m pretty sure that is NOT what you want, you might not know it though.
Rather fix a lot of the spammable skills on other classes, and that way make the risk in CE more worth it.

Any skill with over 3/4 of a second cast time gives enough time to become fairly easy to dodge. 3 1/4 seconds is a tad too much reaction time… I understand where you’re coming from, I like tactical combat as well, but that amount of time to cast 1 skill is just too much time to allow players to react and dodge.

Jekkt.6045:

imo the only nerf that should happen is to the max amount of might stacks in s/tPvP. this will not only harm eles but they will also benefit from that when other might stacking classes hit less.

i’d say remove the max stack size to 15 (or maybe 20 for a start).

Note that the Ele’s boon dependency can also be its downfall

Nerf celestial gear, problem solved

Grimreaper.5370:

Jekkt.6045:

imo the only nerf that should happen is to the max amount of might stacks in s/tPvP. this will not only harm eles but they will also benefit from that when other might stacking classes hit less.

i’d say remove the max stack size to 15 (or maybe 20 for a start).

Note that the Ele’s boon dependency can also be its downfall

this is right but the same applies for soldier warriors. and the reason for the ele’s sustain is might stacking.

Jekkt.6045:

Grimreaper.5370:

Jekkt.6045:

imo the only nerf that should happen is to the max amount of might stacks in s/tPvP. this will not only harm eles but they will also benefit from that when other might stacking classes hit less.

i’d say remove the max stack size to 15 (or maybe 20 for a start).

Note that the Ele’s boon dependency can also be its downfall

this is right but the same applies for soldier warriors. and the reason for the ele’s sustain is might stacking.

I really don’t feel like their dps is the problem, the amount of healing with Celestial is.

it is both together. but rather than seeing the healing nerfed again they should go for the might stacks this time as it will also lower the damage output of other might reliant classes like warrior or engi which both are a bit over the top right now. its not like warrior has less healing with soldier

I’m all for down with celestial. It is ridiculously overused.

Mbelch.9028:

I’m all for down with celestial. It is ridiculously overused.

The problem with celestial imo is that you have to sacrifice nothing. You only lack damage but thats easily compensated by might stacking.

Mayama.1854:

Mbelch.9028:

I’m all for down with celestial. It is ridiculously overused.

The problem with celestial imo is that you have to sacrifice nothing. You only lack damage but thats easily compensated by might stacking.

I’ve been trying to explain to this enemies who msg me and trash talk on celestial, its not really that out of line with out the might stacks…at least on an ele.

I’m worried about an overall might stack nerf taking away too much dps from the ele using d/d with balanced stats in spvp. Before this last balance patch the class struggled severely when fighting bunker-ish type builds. I think I’d much rather take a hit to healing sustain.