The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Ghoul.2084

Ghoul.2084

or he staying on top of everything..

First.. im reading the Guild wars 2 Forum.. im Playing since release..
most PvP got my legendary Champ. and the rest of the PvP Titels..
i think i can play each class good.. not perfect but its in the Higher one of Good..

I see a lot i mean a LOT of Posts her who are nonsense…

like..
Nerv this.. Op OP everything!! Warrio Rangers Thiefs Mesmers Ingis..

I mean.. this class have immunity in GW 2 ?

THE Guardian =)
is it really so Hard Arena Net to not “nerf” thats a wrong word for a Game its Negative.. just too customize or change a bit about this class ?
I know.. each Greatsword are Brainless spamming in GW 2 its o.k.. thats how you like it..

But really ? Guardian Greatsword is too much Damage output..
who is the Problem too take some Hits of Skill Nr 2 ? from 7 too 4 ? its still strong than..

Or Meditation i dont care so much about the free 4x Heal.. its o.k strong but o.k
but Smite Condition need a change reduce damage or remove the + damage with Condition this skill have no activation time and deals a lot of damage.

and guys.. pls.. dont react too this thread with “learn your class/learn how the guard works” .. really be neutral and only talk about Guardian and dont come with but but.. but.. the thief have backstep .. and and the ranger have RF and.. or you need too play this way.. wait if he is on CD..
and im not talking too Persons her who need too spin 4x times too get a target in PvP..
..
thats some small changes but still effective..

Arena Net .. you dont can Balance PvP with PvE.. do some changes pls i dont care about PvE..
Do it like Guild Wars 1 and weak some Traits and skills for PvP.
(and yea.. i know some skills are balanced this way) but its not enove..

And sorry guys =) my English is not that Good.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: endersluck.4708

endersluck.4708

“learn your class/learn how the guard works”

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Jelzouki.4128

Jelzouki.4128

the last thing dps gaurds need is a nerf, a good source of their damage is also there survivability, truly a double edged sword

http://strawpoll.me/3648686/r Queue for PvP from any map. Vote Here. Zojoel [ASAP Zerg]

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: ViralVarda.2739

ViralVarda.2739

How can the class most commonly cited as “in a good place” albeit boring and unchanged even think about needing a nerf?

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

the last thing dps gaurds need is a nerf, a good source of their damage is also there survivability, truly a double edged sword

dps guard gets too much out of investing in Valor

all you need for the basis of any dps guard is x/x/6/x/x.
Valor is essentially shadow arts with critical damage instead of healing power.

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Dojo.1867

Dojo.1867

the last thing dps gaurds need is a nerf, a good source of their damage is also there survivability, truly a double edged sword

dps guard gets too much out of investing in Valor

all you need for the basis of any dps guard is x/x/6/x/x.
Valor is essentially shadow arts with critical damage instead of healing power.

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Uhm this is why zerk build require some kind of evasion and that is a good thing. Guardian Bursts → you pop your Evasion, Signet of Stone, leap/teleport away. If you don’t run stuff to evade them just too maximize the DPS of your zerker build then don’t complain.

Btw neverplayed DPS guard but I hate when people ask to nerf specs that aren’t even played in top lvl team queue because they aren’t good enough.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Razor.9132

Razor.9132

I hate when people ask to nerf specs that aren’t even played in top lvl team queue because they aren’t good enough.

Quoted for truth.

It’s really just another learn to play issue.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Holl.3109

Holl.3109

I lolled, because first you say other brainless ppl keep saying OPPOPOPOPOP, and than you do it yourself :P

All 80’s – PvP/WvW
My YouTube channel
Reapers gonna reap ¯\(°_°)/¯

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Ragnarox.9601

Ragnarox.9601

I dont know which thread is more fun, this one or that deleted character one xD

A troll thread is a troll thread. Dont feed the troll.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Sandrox.9524

Sandrox.9524

You sure you been in pvp once? cause guards need buff not nerf.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: KrisHQ.4719

KrisHQ.4719

Do #2 in a teamfight while everyone has retaliation.
Then tell me again how imba the skill is.

Lysis Kawahara – D/D Elementalist
Zaphiel Faires – DPS Guardian

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Jelzouki.4128

Jelzouki.4128

the last thing dps gaurds need is a nerf, a good source of their damage is also there survivability, truly a double edged sword

dps guard gets too much out of investing in Valor

all you need for the basis of any dps guard is x/x/6/x/x.
Valor is essentially shadow arts with critical damage instead of healing power.

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

If you think DPs guardian is faceroll you need to re evaluate your skill level and learn how to play your class better and adapt to changing your gameplay when facing a DPs gaurd

http://strawpoll.me/3648686/r Queue for PvP from any map. Vote Here. Zojoel [ASAP Zerg]

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Warlord of Chaos.7845

Warlord of Chaos.7845

I hate when people ask to nerf specs that aren’t even played in top lvl team queue because they aren’t good enough.

Quoted for truth.

It’s really just another learn to play issue.

Not to play the devil’s advocate, but even if some specs aren’t played at the top level, they can still be cancerous. DPS guard hardcounters thief and is a very hard matchup for Mesmer which could screw over some teams, but yet it isn’t played at the top level. CI Mesmer hardcounters d/d ele and basically anything cele but it isn’t played at the top level (although CI Mesmer isn’t really overpowered, its just a little cheesy). Just because something isn’t seen at the top level doesn’t mean it cant be balanced.

-Rylock [vE]
Retired.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: coglin.1867

coglin.1867

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Let me get this straight. You complaining that you can be killed easily in a full zerker build?

If your complaining that you die quickly while in a full zerker build, what difference does it make if it is a guardian or not?

A video on what weak PvPer’s and WvWer’s want.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6q3em9s5I4c

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: ventusthunder.5067

ventusthunder.5067

If you have problems beating dps guardian, just roll celestial d/d ele, play the piano, and you will beat dps guard.

collector of liquid aurillium

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

Every post sinject makes is an OmG that’s op post. Eventually he will hit on one…

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Nike.2631

Nike.2631

For the Ten Millionth Time: If you want something nerfed, PLAY IT. The only way to build a case the Devs can see and care about is to contribute to that class/build’s reign of terror by adding to its impossible to ignore track record in the metrics they collect every minute, every hour, every day.

Of course, if you don’t become an unstoppable juggernaut with that perfect win/loss record you imagine others had while beating you down with it, well maybe you just got outplayed in the first place.

“You keep saying ‘its unfair.’
I wonder what your basis for comparison is…”
- Jareth, King of Goblins.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

Every post sinject makes is an OmG that’s op post. Eventually he will hit on one…

just about everything i’ve brought up as overpowered has usually gotten nerfed one way or another.

you’re obviously still sour about me suggesting a broken mechanic be fixed because of the advantage it gives you on ranger.

i bet if you played ele you’d be mad about me saying the stow lightning whip exploit needs to be fixed too.

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Let me get this straight. You complaining that you can be killed easily in a full zerker build?

If your complaining that you die quickly while in a full zerker build, what difference does it make if it is a guardian or not?

you completely reworded my argument and created a strawman argument to attack. im not spending my time replying to you with anything serious.

For the Ten Millionth Time: If you want something nerfed, PLAY IT. The only way to build a case the Devs can see and care about is to contribute to that class/build’s reign of terror by adding to its impossible to ignore track record in the metrics they collect every minute, every hour, every day.

Of course, if you don’t become an unstoppable juggernaut with that perfect win/loss record you imagine others had while beating you down with it, well maybe you just got outplayed in the first place.

guardian was my second level 80, i’ve played plenty of it in PvP and PvE. see attached image.

as someone who has seen both sides i can readily say that medi guard is one of the easiest things you can use that rolls with zerker amulet. arguably easier (or at least more effective) than power ranger.

Attachments:

(edited by sinject.4607)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Shanks.2907

Shanks.2907

guardian was my second level 80, i’ve played plenty of it in PvP and PvE. see attached image.

as someone who has seen both sides i can readily say that medi guard is one of the easiest things you can use that rolls with zerker amulet. arguably easier (or at least more effective) than power ranger.

I don’t see why people think that because they have a level 80 of any given class it means that they understand the profession well. All it shows is that you’ve killed monsters and finished quests. Perhaps swapped at the end of dungeons, used tomes of knowledge or crafted to 80.

If you truly know a class, you would know how to counter it and wouldn’t be on the forums making OP topics.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: dancingmonkey.4902

dancingmonkey.4902

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Let me get this straight. You complaining that you can be killed easily in a full zerker build?

If your complaining that you die quickly while in a full zerker build, what difference does it make if it is a guardian or not?

you completely reworded my argument and created a strawman argument to attack. im not spending my time replying to you with anything serious.

I am a little curious here. How is someone asking you questions considered “rewording your argument”?

Are you suggesting that “as a guardian” you face roll anything with a zerker amulet? I am curious, but are you going to attack me for asking you a question as well?

What skill level of players are you competing against, and what profession are they? I assure you, those two points factor in. The particular build factors in too.

Based on my experience, I hardly believe you are face rolling skilled players.

I don’t see why people think that because they have a level 80 of any given class it means that they understand the profession well. All it shows is that you’ve killed monsters and finished quests. Perhaps swapped at the end of dungeons, used tomes of knowledge or crafted to 80.

If you truly know a class, you would know how to counter it and wouldn’t be on the forums making OP topics.

To be fair, at least this time, he is making a some what informed opinion. Obviously you do not agree with it, but at least it is based on experience and not complete, uninformed assumption.

(edited by dancingmonkey.4902)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Let me get this straight. You complaining that you can be killed easily in a full zerker build?

If your complaining that you die quickly while in a full zerker build, what difference does it make if it is a guardian or not?

you completely reworded my argument and created a strawman argument to attack. im not spending my time replying to you with anything serious.

I am a little curious here. How is someone asking you questions considered “rewording your argument”?

Are you suggesting that “as a guardian” you face roll anything with a zerker amulet? I am curious, but are you going to attack me for asking you a question as well?

What skill level of players are you competing against, and what profession are they? I assure you, those two points factor in. The particular build factors in too.

Based on my experience, I hardly believe you are face rolling skilled players.

I don’t see why people think that because they have a level 80 of any given class it means that they understand the profession well. All it shows is that you’ve killed monsters and finished quests. Perhaps swapped at the end of dungeons, used tomes of knowledge or crafted to 80.

If you truly know a class, you would know how to counter it and wouldn’t be on the forums making OP topics.

To be fair, at least this time, he is making a some what informed opinion. Obviously you do not agree with it, but at least it is based on experience and not complete, uninformed assumption.

he is paraphrasing me to make it appear that i am saying i have an issue with getting killed on zerker. my issue isn’t that. I can get dropped by backstab thieves, shatter mesmers, static discharge engineers, power rangers, evis warriors, etc all day and be perfectly fine with it as they are a fair fight in zerker v zerker; my issue (as it was clearly stated) is the complete effectiveness guardian has in general against anything else running a zerker amulet while using zerker itself.

meditation guard is largely devoid of counterplay to the point where it’s obnoxious. not a single one of their extremely powerful utilities including their elite has any counterplay whatsoever, they are all instant cast.

a complete condition clear that grants them a complete counter to any condition nuke while giving them boons ( a la lyssa runes pre-nerf) and also is a stun break, a teleport that inflicts burning and inflicts damage and is also a stun break as well, a single condition clear that aoe hits for 1k that’s on a 16 second cd, and a 2 second invulnerability; all of these things healing for 2k each and granting 4.5sec of fury. you also have sc/f’s chains of light, a 2 second immobilize and 3x vulnerability inflicting skill which suffers from a lack of counterplay as well. it has no practical cast time (only 0.5sec, near instant), it has no projectile to dodge, and it has no noticeable animation to tell you it’s coming; it genuinely has no counterplay.

not a single one of these things can be interrupted, knowingly countered, or effectively prevented other than simply forcing them to be used and getting lucky with predicting them or something along the lines of that- and that isn’t necessarily a bad thing on it’s own, but when that applies to almost everything you do, it becomes a problem.

i’ll hold my tongue on their heal. it has little in the way of counterplay but some counterplay is at least infinitely more than none at all.

making Valor increase both toughness and ferocity while allowing for a high fury uptime and sustain was simply one of the single worst design decisions in this game period. it essentially allowed Valor to become as strong as thief’s Shadow Arts and warrior’s Discipline combined.

if i had to suggest a nerf, maybe make Focused Mind a GM trait while buffing it to make it worth using as a GM trait. that would force some choice to be made between offensive and defensive viability within the same traitline, while slightly nerfing meditations indirectly.

(edited by sinject.4607)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

Every post sinject makes is an OmG that’s op post. Eventually he will hit on one…

just about everything i’ve brought up as overpowered has usually gotten nerfed one way or another.

you’re obviously still sour about me suggesting a broken mechanic be fixed because of the advantage it gives you on ranger.

i bet if you played ele you’d be mad about me saying the stow lightning whip exploit needs to be fixed too.

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Let me get this straight. You complaining that you can be killed easily in a full zerker build?

If your complaining that you die quickly while in a full zerker build, what difference does it make if it is a guardian or not?

you completely reworded my argument and created a strawman argument to attack. im not spending my time replying to you with anything serious.

For the Ten Millionth Time: If you want something nerfed, PLAY IT. The only way to build a case the Devs can see and care about is to contribute to that class/build’s reign of terror by adding to its impossible to ignore track record in the metrics they collect every minute, every hour, every day.

Of course, if you don’t become an unstoppable juggernaut with that perfect win/loss record you imagine others had while beating you down with it, well maybe you just got outplayed in the first place.

guardian was my second level 80, i’ve played plenty of it in PvP and PvE. see attached image.

as someone who has seen both sides i can readily say that medi guard is one of the easiest things you can use that rolls with zerker amulet. arguably easier (or at least more effective) than power ranger.

LoL I’m not bitter about anything I don’t play a ranger, I do play an ele =) my view on whip is if you can do it then more power to you, but most people who try doing it end up screwing themselves. Do you actually know what lightning whip stow is doing? Can you do it in the middle of a fight?

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: dancingmonkey.4902

dancingmonkey.4902

he is paraphrasing me to make it appear that i am saying i have an issue with getting killed on zerker. my issue isn’t that. I can get dropped by backstab thieves, shatter mesmers, static discharge engineers, power rangers, evis warriors, etc all day and be perfectly fine with it as they are a fair fight in zerker v zerker; my issue (as it was clearly stated) is the complete effectiveness guardian has in general against anything else running a zerker amulet while using zerker itself.

Paraphrasing means someone is summing up what you said. Not saying you said something else. Now that we have cleared that up. I feel you are being dishonest or intentionally misleading. I have never had difficulty with what I assume is a “zerker” guardian. Nor, from what I have read of some of your frivolous complaints, do I believe you can beat most of the good builds i am familiar with in those professions, with decent players.

You are confusing bad players in mediocre builds (I assure you some of the builds you listed are mediocre, although you were not very specific) and projecting that into you beating them easily. by the way, you realize anyone can look at your specific win/loss record and ranking in PvP right? With what I read in a great deal of your recent post, combined with your poor win/lose ration, I have difficulty believing you, when you claim how you are consistently beating all of those professions.

meditation guard is largely devoid of counterplay to the point where it’s obnoxious. not a single one of their extremely powerful utilities including their elite has any counterplay whatsoever, they are all instant cast.

It sems fishy to me that I have sen you make similar complaints in other threads about guardians, from the perspective of one of the professions they are known to counter.

a complete condition clear that grants them a complete counter to any condition nuke while giving them boons ( a la lyssa runes pre-nerf) and also is a stun break, a teleport that inflicts burning and inflicts damage and is also a stun break as well, a single condition clear that aoe hits for 1k that’s on a 16 second cd, and a 2 second invulnerability; all of these things healing for 2k each and granting 4.5sec of fury. you also have sc/f’s chains of light, a 2 second immobilize and 3x vulnerability inflicting skill which suffers from a lack of counterplay as well. it has no practical cast time (only 0.5sec, near instant), it has no projectile to dodge, and it has no noticeable animation to tell you it’s coming; it genuinely has no counterplay.

This sounds suspiciously like a complaint i read in the thief forums not too long ago.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: dancingmonkey.4902

dancingmonkey.4902

not a single one of these things can be interrupted, knowingly countered, or effectively prevented other than simply forcing them to be used and getting lucky with predicting them or something along the lines of that- and that isn’t necessarily a bad thing on it’s own, but when that applies to almost everything you do, it becomes a problem.

This is where I truly see a problematic pattern arising. You complain about how someone paraphrases you, yet you state your opinion as if it were fact. It is a fact that I personally can, and have countered many a guardian.

I would love to see you post the specific build that you suggest is a problem

i’ll hold my tongue on their heal. it has little in the way of counterplay but some counterplay is at least infinitely more than none at all.

You mean as compare to an counterbalance heal such as the thief has? As you have repeatedly declared yourself a thief main, isn’t it extremely hypocritical to argue one is fine and another is problematic?

making Valor increase both toughness and ferocity while allowing for a high fury uptime and sustain was simply one of the single worst design decisions in this game period. it essentially allowed Valor to become as strong as thief’s Shadow Arts and warrior’s Discipline combined.

I suspect you would complain regardless of the stat combo that line offered. You offer a great deal of nonconstructive complains, and little to none when it come to constructive feed back. What stats do you suggest this line offers and why?

if i had to suggest a nerf, maybe make Focused Mind a GM trait while buffing it to make it worth using as a GM trait. that would force some choice to be made between offensive and defensive viability within the same traitline, while slightly nerfing meditations indirectly.

Hmm, I think you have now covered all of your bases. You have either created a thread, or hijacked a thread, that demanded a nerf for every single profession now, with the exception of thief.

You do realize when you are entirely negative (offering little to know positive feedback) that when the devs that this matter too read this, they may see the same patters I (and I assume others) see, and find it all to easy to dismiss your claims and demands.

(edited by dancingmonkey.4902)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

not a single one of these things can be interrupted, knowingly countered, or effectively prevented other than simply forcing them to be used and getting lucky with predicting them or something along the lines of that- and that isn’t necessarily a bad thing on it’s own, but when that applies to almost everything you do, it becomes a problem.

This is where I truly see a problematic pattern arising. You complain about how someone paraphrases you, yet you state your opinion as if it were fact. It is a fact that I personally can, and have countered many a guardian.

I would love to see you post the specific build that you suggest is a problem

you are more than welcome to explain how skills that are completely instant cast, have no broadcast, etc are counterable in any way whatsoever.

i am not stating my opinion as fact because i am not stating my opinion. i am stating something factual. all meditations are instant and give absolutely 0 room for any counter. that’s there in black and white.

when every utility you use has no counterplay whatsoever there is a problem.

here is the build in question since you need it explicitly shown to you:
http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Guardian_-_Meditation_DPS_Variant

i’ll hold my tongue on their heal. it has little in the way of counterplay but some counterplay is at least infinitely more than none at all.

You mean as compare to an counterbalance heal such as the thief has? As you have repeatedly declared yourself a thief main, isn’t it extremely hypocritical to argue one is fine and another is problematic?

had you read the previous part of my post, you’d understand it would be fine on it’s own, but coupled with a skill bar of completely uncounterable meditations it should be easier to deal with to make up for the fact you cant do anything about any other utility.

making Valor increase both toughness and ferocity while allowing for a high fury uptime and sustain was simply one of the single worst design decisions in this game period. it essentially allowed Valor to become as strong as thief’s Shadow Arts and warrior’s Discipline combined.

I suspect you would complain regardless of the stat combo that line offered. You offer a great deal of nonconstructive complains, and little to none when it come to constructive feed back. What stats do you suggest this line offers and why?

i would suggest getting rid of ferocity or toughness, since having both stats in one traitline is having your cake and eating it too. but seeing as that will probably be too heavyhanded at this point, the only suggestion i can make it the nerf i suggested down below.

if i had to suggest a nerf, maybe make Focused Mind a GM trait while buffing it to make it worth using as a GM trait. that would force some choice to be made between offensive and defensive viability within the same traitline, while slightly nerfing meditations indirectly.

Hmm, I think you have now covered all of your bases. You have either created a thread, or hijacked a thread, that demanded a nerf for every single profession now, with the exception of thief.

You do realize when you are entirely negative (offering little to know positive feedback) that when the devs that this matter too read this, they may see the same patters I (and I assume others) see, and find it all to easy to dismiss your claims and demands.

you completely ignore the actual suggestion and attack the fact that i made a suggestion at all. so i guess you get to conveniently ignore any constructive criticism i have for the sake of your own arguments huh? sorry i’m discussing balance in the balance subforum.

also what’s your experience with guardian? do you have any even? or does the old routine of demanding someone having played hundreds of hours of a profession before they can comment on it with any validity only apply to people other than yourself?

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: coglin.1867

coglin.1867

Something doesn’t have to be interruptible to be countered.

Monks focus trait is countered by poison.

Contemplation of purity is countered by boon strips or corruptions.

The weapon skills are countered in the same manner they are in any other build.

Yet you claim is its a fact and not an opinion that nothing about this build can be countered at all. Part of the problem as I see it, is that you fault to understand the difference between what is objective and what is subjective.

A video on what weak PvPer’s and WvWer’s want.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6q3em9s5I4c

(edited by coglin.1867)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Shanks.2907

Shanks.2907

meditation guard is largely devoid of counterplay to the point where it’s obnoxious. not a single one of their extremely powerful utilities including their elite has any counterplay whatsoever, they are all instant cast.

a complete condition clear that grants them a complete counter to any condition nuke while giving them boons ( a la lyssa runes pre-nerf) and also is a stun break, a teleport that inflicts burning and inflicts damage and is also a stun break as well, a single condition clear that aoe hits for 1k that’s on a 16 second cd, and a 2 second invulnerability; all of these things healing for 2k each and granting 4.5sec of fury. you also have sc/f’s chains of light, a 2 second immobilize and 3x vulnerability inflicting skill which suffers from a lack of counterplay as well. it has no practical cast time (only 0.5sec, near instant), it has no projectile to dodge, and it has no noticeable animation to tell you it’s coming; it genuinely has no counterplay.

not a single one of these things can be interrupted, knowingly countered, or effectively prevented other than simply forcing them to be used and getting lucky with predicting them or something along the lines of that- and that isn’t necessarily a bad thing on it’s own, but when that applies to almost everything you do, it becomes a problem.

Meditation guardian’s bursts are telegraphed and easy to dodge. The most damaging skills (whirling wrath, shield of wrath, mighty blow, etc) are simple enough to avoid.

As for the utilities, judge’s intervention can be anticipated if you’ve ever played a meditation guardian. It’s usually used with a burst so if you see a whirling wrath or mighty blow start, chances are they’re going to teleport to you. After that the meditation guardian is very weak to CC as the only other stunbreak is on their full cleanse.

As a thief, you have access to a ton of immobilizes and basilisk venom that can shut a meditation guardian down. Once contemplation of purity is used the meditation guardian has no way to deal with either conditions or CC. Panic strike and devourer venom work well against medi guards.

Try using deadly arts more when playing them. The poison, weakness and immob are the keys to countering a meditation guardian. Try playing it more to learn it’s burst rotations. Careful of binding blades because it’ll pull you while in stealth.

Listening to advice given by those who main classes is usually more effective to countering it than complaining on the forums.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Vargamonth.2047

Vargamonth.2047

I don’t think defensive tools like CoP or Renewed Focus are meant to be counterplayed, just like you don’t counterplay a ranger Signet of Stone or a mesmer distortion.
Judges Intervention is nothing but an instant teleport, not specially different from an offensive Lightning Flash, Blink or Shadowstep. The effectiveness is all about the skills you can combine with it and, in this case, every big move is either multiattack or has an incredibly obvious tell, so the biggest part of the damage can be actively avoided.
Mace would be the exception to this rule, but the weapon also introduces some other drawbacks.

Smite Condition is the only truly non-countereable skill.
It’s an instant cast dealing a good amount of damage on a fairly short cooldown. Mechanic wise I find this skill terrible but, if I have to be honest, I don’t think medi guard would be barely viable without it.
Lacking any form of soft CC (and hard cc being limited enough too) and having quite unreliable ranged attacks, medi guards can be easily kited, even inside of a small conquest point. In this situations, terrible designs like SC or a high retaliation uptime become crucial if fighting against any decent players.
Should these things be toned down? For the shake of a skill based gameplay, they totally deserve it. For the spec to remain somewhat viable, however, something alleviating the many drawbacks of the class should be granted in exchange, and balancing completely unrelated aspects of a class in never an easy task to do.

(edited by Vargamonth.2047)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Ragnar the Rock.3174

Ragnar the Rock.3174

While DPS meditation guardians do counter melee zerker specs they are hard pressed against anything with ranged potential or kiting potential.

They also have a few other problems

For instance The majority of their survivability is tied to their ability to gap close & do damage (See smite condition & judge’s intervention, the later of which is on a 36 second CD even after traits.)
Make them burn these CD’s and their gap closing ability, ability to stay on target & survivability goes to crap.

Also guardians are lacking a great deal compared to other classes/specs (especially melee specs) when it comes to CC output. This makes their ability to stay on target vs anything that can kite fairly bad. It also makes controlling enemies something they just cannot do.

Lastly they also have a much lower base health then a warrior, this makes them more vulnerable to being nuked down while under the effects of CC.

So the next time you see a DPS meditation guardian switch to ranged weapons, Sman whatever conditions you have, get them to blow CD’s then nuke them.

(edited by Ragnar the Rock.3174)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Aeolus.3615

Aeolus.3615

Guard is the easiest class to kill:
- skills are easy telegraphed
-bunker are easy to kill becouse game mechanics only mater power over armor, player can high crit even if haz protection.
-high damage guard are squishy, avoid its burst and he cant do much on the next 10 seconds.
- Guard with utilities in cooldown is a dead one.
- stress guardian with some conditions and he will wastes is condi removers/boons due low HP.
- Wall of reflection, just sit and wait until it ends, easy kill after that.
- Strip boons or convert them to condis.
- Spirit weapons are a bad since thief can use spirit to trigger stealth far from the Guardian and most spirit weapon attack miss target due being “heavy slow”.

-etc

1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.

(edited by Aeolus.3615)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: style.6173

style.6173

Guards are fine. These are the specs that need a nerf:

D/D cele ele
nade cele engi
turret engi

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: SoLeciTO.3490

SoLeciTO.3490

Totally agree with OP,

Is even funny how people complain about ranger when a guardian can kill 3 people in the cap point like nothing then go invu, block block block, heal heal, block and spam the easiest rotation of the game again to hit like a truck.

IMO 3 profession need to be down tone:

Engi(torret, celestial)
Ele (cele)
Guard.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Aggrostemma.1703

Aggrostemma.1703

@SoLeciTO:

Do not worry! Two more weeks and everybody’s going to complain about the Ranger again… than Warrior… than Necro… than Thief… than Mesmer… than Engineer… than Elementalist… than Guardian…

We have a 20 weeks rotation… Wait 2 weeks from now and Ranger will be kitteningOP again….

#I no words have"

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: sinject.4607

sinject.4607

Guard is the easiest class to kill:
- skills are easy telegraphed
-bunker are easy to kill becouse game mechanics only mater power over armor, player can high crit even if haz protection.
-high damage guard are squishy, avoid its burst and he cant do much on the next 10 seconds.
- Guard with utilities in cooldown is a dead one.
- stress guardian with some conditions and he will wastes is condi removers/boons due low HP.
- Wall of reflection, just sit and wait until it ends, easy kill after that.
- Strip boons or convert them to condis.
- Spirit weapons are a bad since thief can use spirit to trigger stealth far from the Guardian and most spirit weapon attack miss target due being “heavy slow”.

-etc

when it comes to meditation guardians you are wrong across the board.

- all meditations are instant cast and have no animation until after the fact. various other skills are either hard to interrupt or straight up mitigate.
- bunkers usually force 2v1s because of their survival mechanics. thus the whole point in bunkering.
- medi guards have the highest base armor in the game and have an additional 300 toughness from valor, they also have access to 8k in healing from meditations, blinds, aegis, blocks, and invuln. they also have a complete condi cleanse, a 16 second single cleanse that deals aoe damage, and a triple condi cleanse as well. no other build in the game can boast this much survivability by simply investing in one traitline.
- anything with all cooldowns is a dead anything. especially when guardian’s utilities have shorter cooldowns than most other professions’.

LET’S COMPARE META BUILD UTILITIES CROSS-PROFESSION:

standard meditation guardian utilities x/x/6/x/x:

  • contemplation of purity (48sec cd)
  • smite condition (16sec cd)
  • judge’s intervention (36sec cd)
  • renewed focus (72sec cd)

standard thief utilities for 2/6/0/0/6:

  • shadow step (50sec cd)
  • infiltrator’s signet (30sec cd)
  • shadow refuge (60sec cd)
  • basilisk venom (40sec cd)

standard warrior utilities for 0/0/6/2/6:

  • beserker’s stance (60sec cd)
  • endure pain (60sec cd)
  • balanced stance (40sec cd)
  • signet of rage (60sec cd)

standard mesmer utilities for 4/4/0/0/6:

  • blink (30sec cd)
  • decoy (40sec cd)
  • portal (90sec cd)
  • mass invisibility (90sec cd)

standard elementalist utilities for 0/0/2/6/6:

  • lightning flash (32sec cd)
  • armor of earth (60sec cd)
  • cleansing fire (32sec cd)
  • glyph of elementals (120sec cd)

etc.

so if you’re making the argument that guardian is really weak to cooldowns (as if anything isn’t), just keep in mind they usually have shorter utility cooldowns than most everything else, while their utilities end up doing 2-3 more things than most other utilities with similar cooldowns.

(edited by Moderator)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Ragnar the Rock.3174

Ragnar the Rock.3174

Totally agree with OP,

Is even funny how people complain about ranger when a guardian can kill 3 people in the cap point like nothing then go invu, block block block, heal heal, block and spam the easiest rotation of the game again to hit like a truck.

IMO 3 profession need to be down tone:

Engi(torret, celestial)
Ele (cele)
Guard.

If You actually compare a guardian to all the other classes it is actually about the middle of the pack in terms of how difficult it is to play in PvP.

There are several other classes/specs which are much easier to play like longbow ranger, D/D thief, Anything warrior etc…

As for your claim of a guardian killing 3 players like it was nothing. It was likely a good player on the guardian VS 3 idiots who had no idea how a guardians mechanics work.

Some of the things all guardians have in common

1: All have a low base health pool. This means they must trait defensively & or gear defensively (not so with several other classes)

2: They all have horrible target uptime due to not having much in the way of CC. What little they do have is on long CD’s. So kite them.

3: Much of their ability to remove conditions is linked to utility skills (skills which often have a good 20-40second CD’s). Which also likely is a big part of their DPS potential & or survivability. Get them to burn their CD’s then you can dominate them.

Once you realize these things and study guardian attacks a bit you can beat them quite easily.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Brutal Augus.5917

Brutal Augus.5917

For the love of god. Do not nerf the guardian. It is the slowest class in the game, thus making it extremely kiteable already. I play all classes, and the only one that I have issues beating guardians on is my elementalist. This is probably due to the fact that it is my most recent 80 and I am still learning to play it. Just kite them time your highest dps combos for when they have most of their healing on cool down. Meditations have incredibly obvious skill animations and if they use sig of resolve you have the advantage of being able to look at their boon bar and knowing when their heal is on cool down. Guard does not need nerf. It is easy to beat if you just pay attention to them while you kite. Warrior does not need to kite the guard, they simply need to time their combos around when they’ve spammed their meditation heals.

[varX] Limitless Potential

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: SoLeciTO.3490

SoLeciTO.3490

Totally agree with OP,

Is even funny how people complain about ranger when a guardian can kill 3 people in the cap point like nothing then go invu, block block block, heal heal, block and spam the easiest rotation of the game again to hit like a truck.

IMO 3 profession need to be down tone:

Engi(torret, celestial)
Ele (cele)
Guard.

If You actually compare a guardian to all the other classes it is actually about the middle of the pack in terms of how difficult it is to play in PvP.

There are several other classes/specs which are much easier to play like longbow ranger, D/D thief, Anything warrior etc…

As for your claim of a guardian killing 3 players like it was nothing. It was likely a good player on the guardian VS 3 idiots who had no idea how a guardians mechanics work.

Some of the things all guardians have in common

1: All have a low base health pool. This means they must trait defensively & or gear defensively (not so with several other classes)

2: They all have horrible target uptime due to not having much in the way of CC. What little they do have is on long CD’s. So kite them.

3: Much of their ability to remove conditions is linked to utility skills (skills which often have a good 20-40second CD’s). Which also likely is a big part of their DPS potential & or survivability. Get them to burn their CD’s then you can dominate them.

Once you realize these things and study guardian attacks a bit you can beat them quite easily.

Man i stop reading you when you said that D/D thief is easier to play than Guard.

D/D thief is the hardest set to play correctly . . .

have a potato

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Ragnar the Rock.3174

Ragnar the Rock.3174

Totally agree with OP,

Is even funny how people complain about ranger when a guardian can kill 3 people in the cap point like nothing then go invu, block block block, heal heal, block and spam the easiest rotation of the game again to hit like a truck.

IMO 3 profession need to be down tone:

Engi(torret, celestial)
Ele (cele)
Guard.

If You actually compare a guardian to all the other classes it is actually about the middle of the pack in terms of how difficult it is to play in PvP.

There are several other classes/specs which are much easier to play like longbow ranger, D/D thief, Anything warrior etc…

As for your claim of a guardian killing 3 players like it was nothing. It was likely a good player on the guardian VS 3 idiots who had no idea how a guardians mechanics work.

Some of the things all guardians have in common

1: All have a low base health pool. This means they must trait defensively & or gear defensively (not so with several other classes)

2: They all have horrible target uptime due to not having much in the way of CC. What little they do have is on long CD’s. So kite them.

3: Much of their ability to remove conditions is linked to utility skills (skills which often have a good 20-40second CD’s). Which also likely is a big part of their DPS potential & or survivability. Get them to burn their CD’s then you can dominate them.

Once you realize these things and study guardian attacks a bit you can beat them quite easily.

Man i stop reading you when you said that D/D thief is easier to play than Guard.

D/D thief is the hardest set to play correctly . . .

have a potato

Really ?

I find D/D thief much easier to play (Both condition & power options) then my guardian.

The fact that I have either insane burst & or a ton of control is great. + being able to stealth and reset the fight if things go south is just frekin fantastic.

My guardian on the other hand may dominate idiots but anyone with any skill realizes the weaknesses I described above & makes full use of them.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: WEXXES.2378

WEXXES.2378

Guardian < Poison

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: creepmatic.9435

creepmatic.9435

I’m sure Meditation Guardian also pawns OH pistol thieves, S/S LB condi warris, S/x Hamm warris, fearmancers, axe/dagger SB lynx/spider condi rangers, some engies, D/D eles, condi mesmers, etc. It probably doesn’t but Anet needs to nerf them if I got rekt, ain’t that right OP?

or he staying on top of everything..

Get out please.
L2getRekt

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Fix the other classes to be on par with the guardian, rather than nerfing the guardian into uselessness.

Also, make the game revolve less about everything the guardian is good at. Give a place for the other game mechanics, rather than making them redundant by focusing everything on DPS, group buffing, reflection, while making bosses immune to conditions and control skills. That is what the game needs right now.

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Terrahero.9358

Terrahero.9358

I also want to see Guardians adressed, based not on anecdotal evidence or my “expert opinion”.
Simply, based on statistics.

Guardians are everywhere, and theyve always been everywhere. WvW is mostly Guardians, PvE Guardians have been on the forefront since forever. And yes, even in pvp. Especially in pvp.
Guardians are practically mandatory in spvp, and theyve been highly popular since launch.

Clearly Guardians do something, something that is important, better then any other profession can do it. And wether this means Guardians need to be nerfed, or other professions who compete with the Guardian need buffed, that i leave up for debate.
But pretending Guardians are perfectly fine, when we’ve been drowning in them for more then two years now, is just willfull ignorance.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: yLoon.5289

yLoon.5289

I’m pretty sure OP’s favorite class in sPVP must be a Zerker Thief because those are my fresh meat =x.

Despite getting a Legend Champ title, you QQ in forum about Guardian as if you are a new player? facepalm Yes i agree with you, the AA of GS is the highest among the classes, however bear in mind Guards also have the lowest starting HP, i think this balance things up.

Instead of whining, why don’t you articulate in what situation makes you comes to this conclusion of yours?

12K AP
Level 54 Bear Rank

(edited by yLoon.5289)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: coglin.1867

coglin.1867

I also want to see Guardians adressed, based not on anecdotal evidence or my “expert opinion”.
Simply, based on statistics.

WvW is mostly Guardians,

In 3 regions we have 166 servers, and your claiming you can speak for how many Guardians are on them all? Or are you claiming what you see on your server represents everything else. I see more thieves and necros by far over guardians. I see as many eles as guardians. Then again, I am not claiming that applies to every server. That is just what I see.

PvE Guardians have been on the forefront since forever. And yes, even in pvp. Especially in pvp.
Guardians are practically mandatory in spvp, and theyve been highly popular since launch.

This doesn’t seem even remotely true based on my experience. Some of the top PvP teams do not even use a guardian. I hadn’t seen them in soloq hardly at all. Thinks may change with the new matchmaking, but I doubt it.

A video on what weak PvPer’s and WvWer’s want.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6q3em9s5I4c

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Tyreal.5230

Tyreal.5230

I also want to see Guardians adressed, based not on anecdotal evidence or my “expert opinion”.
Simply, based on statistics.

WvW is mostly Guardians,

In 3 regions we have 166 servers, and your claiming you can speak for how many Guardians are on them all? Or are you claiming what you see on your server represents everything else. I see more thieves and necros by far over guardians. I see as many eles as guardians. Then again, I am not claiming that applies to every server. That is just what I see.

PvE Guardians have been on the forefront since forever. And yes, even in pvp. Especially in pvp.
Guardians are practically mandatory in spvp, and theyve been highly popular since launch.

This doesn’t seem even remotely true based on my experience. Some of the top PvP teams do not even use a guardian. I hadn’t seen them in soloq hardly at all. Thinks may change with the new matchmaking, but I doubt it.

lol Right? I can come across thieves, mesmers, warriors and engis even Necros several times over before I see another Medi Guard in WvW OR PvP before I see another Medi Guard.

It’s threads like this that makes me stay away from the forums. Nothing but people complaining about what every other profession can do.

Guild: guildless
Elementalist: Sheva Alamarr
Guardian: Stella Alamarr

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Tyreal.5230

Tyreal.5230

Every post sinject makes is an OmG that’s op post. Eventually he will hit on one…

just about everything i’ve brought up as overpowered has usually gotten nerfed one way or another.

you’re obviously still sour about me suggesting a broken mechanic be fixed because of the advantage it gives you on ranger.

i bet if you played ele you’d be mad about me saying the stow lightning whip exploit needs to be fixed too.

something honestly needs to be done about how ridiculously faceroll guardian is against anything with a zerker amulet.

Let me get this straight. You complaining that you can be killed easily in a full zerker build?

If your complaining that you die quickly while in a full zerker build, what difference does it make if it is a guardian or not?

you completely reworded my argument and created a strawman argument to attack. im not spending my time replying to you with anything serious.

For the Ten Millionth Time: If you want something nerfed, PLAY IT. The only way to build a case the Devs can see and care about is to contribute to that class/build’s reign of terror by adding to its impossible to ignore track record in the metrics they collect every minute, every hour, every day.

Of course, if you don’t become an unstoppable juggernaut with that perfect win/loss record you imagine others had while beating you down with it, well maybe you just got outplayed in the first place.

guardian was my second level 80, i’ve played plenty of it in PvP and PvE. see attached image.

as someone who has seen both sides i can readily say that medi guard is one of the easiest things you can use that rolls with zerker amulet. arguably easier (or at least more effective) than power ranger.

In what way did he reword your comment? Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t that exactly what your post was saying?

Secondly, having a level 80 character in a profession doesn’t mean anything. You can get lvl80 without ever casting a single skill(crafting). I;ve been Medi guard for over a year now and I still have little to know experience fighting other medi guards because they are just that rare to come across.

Guild: guildless
Elementalist: Sheva Alamarr
Guardian: Stella Alamarr

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Terrahero.9358

Terrahero.9358

I also want to see Guardians adressed, based not on anecdotal evidence or my “expert opinion”.
Simply, based on statistics.

WvW is mostly Guardians,

In 3 regions we have 166 servers, and your claiming you can speak for how many Guardians are on them all? Or are you claiming what you see on your server represents everything else. I see more thieves and necros by far over guardians. I see as many eles as guardians. Then again, I am not claiming that applies to every server. That is just what I see.

PvE Guardians have been on the forefront since forever. And yes, even in pvp. Especially in pvp.
Guardians are practically mandatory in spvp, and theyve been highly popular since launch.

This doesn’t seem even remotely true based on my experience. Some of the top PvP teams do not even use a guardian. I hadn’t seen them in soloq hardly at all. Thinks may change with the new matchmaking, but I doubt it.

We have only 1 piece of official proof and that is arenanets own statistics, its a bit old but thats the only proof anyone has.
And it supports the argument that Guardians are wildly popular, the most popular profession infact.

Further proof is in the ToL comps, if you want to bring high-end spvp into this. I dont have the exact statistics on the 2nd ToL but i did run the exact class picks for the first ToL. Guardians were the most popular profession, so popular infact it averaged out to more than 1 guardian per team on average.

Do i know if Guardians are massivly popular on all servers? no, i dont. But i am very familiar with the meta of WvW, Hammertrain. Hammertrain has been the staple for a long time now, and Hammertrain is an overwhelming number of Guardians.
But you’re right, i havent played against the lowest ranked servers in a while, at best servers in the top9. Frequently.
And they all, atleast try, to run Hammertrain. With Guardians being a very popular choice to say the least, amongst these servers.

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Shanks.2907

Shanks.2907

We have only 1 piece of official proof and that is arenanets own statistics, its a bit old but thats the only proof anyone has.
And it supports the argument that Guardians are wildly popular, the most popular profession infact.

Further proof is in the ToL comps, if you want to bring high-end spvp into this. I dont have the exact statistics on the 2nd ToL but i did run the exact class picks for the first ToL. Guardians were the most popular profession, so popular infact it averaged out to more than 1 guardian per team on average.

Do i know if Guardians are massivly popular on all servers? no, i dont. But i am very familiar with the meta of WvW, Hammertrain. Hammertrain has been the staple for a long time now, and Hammertrain is an overwhelming number of Guardians.
But you’re right, i havent played against the lowest ranked servers in a while, at best servers in the top9. Frequently.
And they all, atleast try, to run Hammertrain. With Guardians being a very popular choice to say the least, amongst these servers.

And all of those guardians were bunkers.

Nerfing meditation guardians based on “a lot of guardians in all game modes” is quite silly when they don’t even represent those numbers and aren’t viable to take any roles.

(edited by Shanks.2907)

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: Rothem.8174

Rothem.8174

when TCG plays guardian i’ll bother to finish reading the first post

The God of Guild Wars getting Balanced ?

in Profession Balance

Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

when TCG plays guardian i’ll bother to finish reading the first post

Not sure if sarcasm….

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA