Guild Wars 2

And we still have no fixed Tempest changes?

This doesn’t bode well…

I PMed Karl asking about it the other day but didn’t get a response. I can understand not needing notes for reaper/chrono/herald since they’re nearly perfect, but it seems odd to me that Tempest wouldn’t get notes when DD/DH got notes about them.

Could still be in discussion (team, remember) or could be they have a plan that’s proving harder to code than expected and they don’t want to announce anything more until they’re sure it works.

Some of the fixes that are being announced have been whole new types of code. They’re pressing hard over there. Hopefully that groundwork pays off for an interesting and effective Tempest by launch.

@Nike, love that you still keep a positive outlook, but looking back Tempest is by far the worst elite specialization and has seen very little changes from BWE1 to BWE2 and from BWE2 to BWE3 (the only meaningful one being the stability trait which became the mandatory Master trait).

Tempest needed a lot of changes to reach a decent state, but sadly got far too little and far too meaningless.

And now you need to consider that ANET has already mentioned that they are only going to do minor changes (mostly likely meaning less than the little they did before), as after all, if it still doesn’t work they can just “fix it later” because that is how the standard of good service from good companies works right now, is it not?

They sell a car without engine and maybe one day they go and put an engine there that may or may not be good enough to move your car. And if it still doesn’t move, maybe one day, who knows, they come back and fix it. But remember, if you complain, you are just an entitled and ungrateful brat.

Bottom line, don’t expect much.

Tempest will still be garbage tier when it launches and will continue to be for any foreseeable future. Better start looking for another class (if you want to use a good elite specialization) or just another MMO.

I believe this image conveys my sentiments properly.

I called it already, they don’t know how to fix and balance the bad mechanics befor launch and they realized too late after refusing to listen for months.

They are just trying to put bandaids on the tempest when are bones are broken.

So we won’t get notes because they haven’t figgured it out yet.

If they have decided to make no or minimal changes I don’t see why they just don’t tell us and be done with it. It’s better to warn us than to just spring that on the 23rd.

grahf.7540:

If they have decided to make no or minimal changes I don’t see why they just don’t tell us and be done with it. It’s better to warn us than to just spring that on the 23rd.

This. And if they’re really still just finalizing the (bigger) changes then they could at least tell us the direction of the changes to come.

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

100% this. Tempest has failed to captivate a majority of the eles who have been around since pre launch. It was an utter flop and disregard for feedback. I will be playing rev as well. It’ll hold the players who are captivated by shinny but tempest is not the fast paced class we all love.

OneKlicKill.4285:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

100% this. Tempest has failed to captivate a majority of the eles who have been around since pre launch. It was an utter flop and disregard for feedback. I will be playing rev as well. It’ll hold the players who are captivated by shinny but tempest is not the fast paced class we all love.

Speak for yourself and only yourself please.

I for one happen to enjoy the tempest and I’m happy to see it continually improve. It expands my options in the areas that I would like to use my Elementalist, such as mid to close range wide area support, healing, and control.

I think it is very good at that, and at doing what an Elite specialization should do: Change the way you play, not be a huge upgrade over base options. But I guess I like Dragonhunter and Daredevil for the same reasons, as both offer unique new play styles to each class that were not possible before with said class.

Swiftwynd.1685:

OneKlicKill.4285:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

100% this. Tempest has failed to captivate a majority of the eles who have been around since pre launch. It was an utter flop and disregard for feedback. I will be playing rev as well. It’ll hold the players who are captivated by shinny but tempest is not the fast paced class we all love.

Speak for yourself and only yourself please.

I for one happen to enjoy the tempest and I’m happy to see it continually improve. It expands my options in the areas that I would like to use my Elementalist, such as mid to close range wide area support, healing, and control.

I think it is very good at that, and at doing what an Elite specialization should do: Change the way you play, not be a huge upgrade over base options. But I guess I like Dragonhunter and Daredevil for the same reasons, as both offer unique new play styles to each class that were not possible before with said class.

Have you not played celestial d/d or staff…?? that’s literally what you do… Close mid range support healing cleanse control pressure ….
And tempest doesn’t allow a new playstyle, thats what we wanted, it just gave us more auras (which are pretty bad as a defense mech 9/10 times) and more support in a game that really doesn’t need a hard support…

Maybe I should specify from a pvp perspective but even from pve idk why youd take a tempest over a druid and staff is better support with water fields while still being max damage.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

They can still give us a sword :^)

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

So basically you’ll only play a spec or class if it’s confirmed to be more or less overpowered by the majority of the game’s community? not trying to attack your position or anything, but it’s odd to me that people choose to play only the strongest and most meta things when we have such a large pool of possibilities that allow for a high degree of creativity, and the builds that we can create can be on par with those meta options.

nearlight.3064:

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

So basically you’ll only play a spec or class if it’s confirmed to be more or less overpowered by the majority of the game’s community? not trying to attack your position or anything, but it’s odd to me that people choose to play only the strongest and most meta things when we have such a large pool of possibilities that allow for a high degree of creativity, and the builds that we can create can be on par with those meta options.

You don’t have a choice if you want to play an ele in pvp because you enjoy the class. There is only d/d water+arcane+cantrips, there always only was. And after 3 years of playing that spec – 1 year where elementalists were so extremely bad you got flamed for bringing one into unranked pvp – things get boring.

Acotje.5689:

They can still give us a sword :^)

Tempest is not deserving of a Sword. It’s concept is terrible, I’d like a sword using Ele to be extremely fast paced and up close and personal but also more suited to big fights such as WvW or raids with an “Ok” ability in smaller groups.

Make a class called a Battlemage or something.

Sword Main Hand needs at least 1 blast finisher preferably on fire/earth/water and new mechanics to make it an effective front line class that can work in both large groups (aka raids dps or WvW large groups) and small groups (to a lesser extent).

I suggest since it will be an elite spec that it give as minors.
1) movespeed, less CC duration
2) Vitality (to give it a decent health pool to bother with larger fights)
3) Stability on attunement swap (balanced due to 1 stack and you still have attunement cool downs. so at most you can get 4 stacks if you swap to all the attunements)

Give it Wells.

Make the choices focus on buffing up wells, improving sword cooldowns and damage with sword skills, defensive stats+boons similar to a guardian’s boon+heal as well as protection(for example toughness is increased by so and so when you have protection and protection is applied on attunement swap).

And none of those sword skills better root you in place while using them. I expect a swift pseudo melee/mage playstyle that is more focused on big fights than small.

Just a quick idea but honestly, anything except tempest with a sword. Give me a real sword class that matches the quality that Anet put into classes like Herald/Revenant and Chronomancer.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

nearlight.3064:

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

So basically you’ll only play a spec or class if it’s confirmed to be more or less overpowered by the majority of the game’s community? not trying to attack your position or anything, but it’s odd to me that people choose to play only the strongest and most meta things when we have such a large pool of possibilities that allow for a high degree of creativity, and the builds that we can create can be on par with those meta options.

You don’t have a choice if you want to play an ele in pvp because you enjoy the class. There is only d/d water+arcane+cantrips, there always only was. And after 3 years of playing that spec – 1 year where elementalists were so extremely bad you got flamed for bringing one into unranked pvp – things get boring.

Hmmm… I guess that explains why I don’t play ele all the time 1000%. Its just boring. Tempest was different enough that I found it fun. But I’m a true multi-classer, so it doesn’t really have the same crippling meaning to me as it does to you guys.. but I also don’t feel the need to bandwagon to things like Herald that can easily a hold a point 1v2 in marauder.. so yeah.

nearlight.3064:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

nearlight.3064:

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

So basically you’ll only play a spec or class if it’s confirmed to be more or less overpowered by the majority of the game’s community? not trying to attack your position or anything, but it’s odd to me that people choose to play only the strongest and most meta things when we have such a large pool of possibilities that allow for a high degree of creativity, and the builds that we can create can be on par with those meta options.

You don’t have a choice if you want to play an ele in pvp because you enjoy the class. There is only d/d water+arcane+cantrips, there always only was. And after 3 years of playing that spec – 1 year where elementalists were so extremely bad you got flamed for bringing one into unranked pvp – things get boring.

Hmmm… I guess that explains why I don’t play ele all the time 1000%. Its just boring. Tempest was different enough that I found it fun. But I’m a true multi-classer, so it doesn’t really have the same crippling meaning to me as it does to you guys.. but I also don’t feel the need to bandwagon to things like Herald that can easily a hold a point 1v2 in marauder.. so yeah.

I wouldn’t call it bandwagoning. Many people not only don’t think that tempest is unviable, but also don’t find enjoyment at afking for 4 second channels on the most apm intensive class they love (along with hating other things like shouts, auras, WH, the traits etc… take your pick). It’s just a very slow pace for people who love the fast paced action of the ele. I love playing d/d, I loved it pre launch and I still love it to this day, weather or not it’s viability or place in the meta through different times didnt change that. But I don’t have that with tempest, I don’t like shouts, I don’t like WH and I dread overloads.

Rev just falls into the fast paced playstyle we enjoy while giving many of us what we wanted (Sword, although i actually fell in love with mace/axe after playing but totally another story) I’ve also really enjoyed Reaper and Chrono and my main alts are actually mesmer and necro so they will get some play time too. But as far as PvP goes my eles going to be shelved for a while. I’m still torn deciding to 100% hot with my ele first or go rev since Ive 100% the rest of the game with it, but staff farming running is boring as kitten (stay in fire and click 321, swap to earth->water and blast when you get hit with that 11k hp) and MH dagger ele really doesn’t work great for open world events unless you really tank up and then you don’t hit for kitten, and scepter is… well we all know about that scepter life..

Raids Glass zerk ele is still going to be high up there so Ill raid between my rev and ele depending what we need. But I won’t play tempest I just don’t like the play-style and don’t think it is good, nor can it be good without them making it OP for a while.

OneKlicKill.4285:

But I won’t play tempest I just don’t like the play-style and don’t think it is good, nor can it be good without them making it OP for a while.

I completely disagree. It’s a fallacy to say it cannot be good without being OP. Yes, balancing MMOs is hard – but it’s far from unattainable.

The problem is that Anet has had several BWEs now and did not make enough substantive changes to actually test if they could make Tempest good without being OP. They were content to leave it severely undertuned. Well, I could be wrong about that once we see it on the 23rd but realistically we all have to prepare for disappointment.

The reason is that they focused on revenant to replace existing characters. They made relevant an only revenant raid. Elementalist is has been.

speaking from a pvp pov the difference between ele and tempest is that they carry in a different way. while d/d is more of a solo character and doesn’t rely that much on teammates but they rely on the ele, tempest is the exact opposite: tempest is a big threat in a teamfight that needs to be protected in order for it to freecast overloads. its main role is not the peel/support a d/d ele has with mediocre damage but a hybrid damage/support.

i’m not talking about water arcana tempest builds that go support, because i don’t see a reason to use that if you can simply take d/d ele and do better or staff ele.

tempest is certainly not the best elite spec and it needs some polishing. once the polishing is done i can see tempest have its own unique spot that totally has the potential to be viable with a 1.5 support comp.

I’m actually looking forward to playing Tempest at the end of this week. Yes, it’s far from perfect… but the BWE3 Tempest was worlds beyond the BWE1 Tempest, at least. And changes far beyond bandaids happened; every overload is a stun breaker, a stability on overload trait (with a nice damage boost at the end, though I feel 5s is too short for the bonus), new effects on overloads (water cleanse, air static charge on weapons, protection stacking on earth dust effect…)

The most glaring issues in my view with Tempest are:

1.The comparatively awful minor traits – at the very least, combine them into one trait and give us another trait that has some synergy with base elementalist, as opposed to making Overloading more viable. This is especially desired as Overloads are designed to be situational, thus traits solely affecting them have a poor uptime as if you spam Overloads you’ll have a lot of 20s attunement cooldowns to deal with (unless you’re running Fresh Air and spamming Air Overload).

2. No attunement swapping during Overloads (without disrupting the channel). If there is a balance concern here then perhaps stipulate that yes, you can change attunement during the Overload… but the attunement won’t begin it’s 20s cd period until the Overload channel finishes. This change would open up more gameplay diversity for the Tempest (attunement swap boons and spell effects, interrupting Overload channels with evasive/block/immunity skills and preparing two Overloads in quick succession if we still have to wait 5s in an attunement [balanced by the fact half our attunements are now on 15-20s cooldowns – thematically suits Tempest, recovering after going all out with half their attunement potential]).

3. The 5s delay in an attunement before you can overload it… this kills the potential to be reactive with it, and as it always carries the pricey penalty of a 20s attunement cooldown, this seems too restrictive.

4. Shout cast times. This is particularly problematic with the already mediocre Rebound skill.

Aside from these points, I think they’ve been pushing Tempest in a positive direction.

I whole heartedly agree with the point that Anet should communicate something to this forum and elementalists generally however, even if it is simply to confirm that no tweaks are incoming. The silence is defeaning and even though I imagine their schedules are completely full with the Halloween event, HoT launch, general maintenance and background issues we players are blissfully ignorant of, it would be wonderful to receive some acknowledgement and reassurance that the devs are content with Tempest so we know where we stand, or that they plan changes down the line as they agree with players that Tempest is unpolished.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

nearlight.3064:

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

So basically you’ll only play a spec or class if it’s confirmed to be more or less overpowered by the majority of the game’s community? not trying to attack your position or anything, but it’s odd to me that people choose to play only the strongest and most meta things when we have such a large pool of possibilities that allow for a high degree of creativity, and the builds that we can create can be on par with those meta options.

You don’t have a choice if you want to play an ele in pvp because you enjoy the class. There is only d/d water+arcane+cantrips, there always only was. And after 3 years of playing that spec – 1 year where elementalists were so extremely bad you got flamed for bringing one into unranked pvp – things get boring.

Exactly, I play this class for 3 years, during none of this time there wasn’t two viables specs for two environment (D/D for PVP and Staff for PVE), what is cripple Ele most the developers fear to introduce anything in Ele that might make OP because it is such a tough profession to balance.

It is hard to believe people who are designing Reaper/Herald/Chrono is also designing Tempest which feels so dull.

With Revenant, there is so much to discover a new way to play, not in the same level but Reaper and Chrono also.

reaper chrono and berserker are lead by robert gee
herald by roy cronacher
dragonhunter daredevil and tempest by karl mclain
scrapper and druid by irenio

all devs attend the same meetings and discuss stuff but the above are the lead designers? of those elite specs.

nearlight.3064:

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

So basically you’ll only play a spec or class if it’s confirmed to be more or less overpowered by the majority of the game’s community? not trying to attack your position or anything, but it’s odd to me that people choose to play only the strongest and most meta things when we have such a large pool of possibilities that allow for a high degree of creativity, and the builds that we can create can be on par with those meta options.

Then my question is why you would play something worse? To be less effective? To get carried more? In every game people tend to play the strongest stuff, especially in pvp. Not many people have fun playing a spec that’s just a downgrade something.

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

nearlight.3064:

posthumecaver.6473:

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

princode.2750:

We still have d/d ele spec to fall back of tempest wont workout fot us. D/e spec will still be the strongest even with the release of new spec

After 3 years of exactly the same spec a lot of people get bored though. That’s why I’m gonna change to Revenant main in HoT, so much new fun stuff.

Exactly my thoughts, every gear for my Revenant is ready, I will main Revenant until something relevant happens with Tempest. Reaper, Chrono, Revenant are so fun there is no need to play same old Ele.

Godly D/D is still there, if I miss him, I will comeback to it.

So basically you’ll only play a spec or class if it’s confirmed to be more or less overpowered by the majority of the game’s community? not trying to attack your position or anything, but it’s odd to me that people choose to play only the strongest and most meta things when we have such a large pool of possibilities that allow for a high degree of creativity, and the builds that we can create can be on par with those meta options.

You don’t have a choice if you want to play an ele in pvp because you enjoy the class. There is only d/d water+arcane+cantrips, there always only was. And after 3 years of playing that spec – 1 year where elementalists were so extremely bad you got flamed for bringing one into unranked pvp – things get boring.

Exactly, I play this class for 3 years, during none of this time there wasn’t two viables specs for two environment (D/D for PVP and Staff for PVE), what is cripple Ele most the developers fear to introduce anything in Ele that might make OP because it is such a tough profession to balance.

It is hard to believe people who are designing Reaper/Herald/Chrono is also designing Tempest which feels so dull.

With Revenant, there is so much to discover a new way to play, not in the same level but Reaper and Chrono also.

I guess my issue with revenant (and potential bandwagoning) is that glint/shiro builds have been made to be much stronger than all the others. Since the mallyx nerf, and the general lack of use in ventari/jalis, I feel as though the revenant’s build diversity isn’t as great as everyone thinks it is.

@Laraley, I wouldn’t say tempest is strictly worse than taking a base class trait line, it’s just different. The boonspam it brings is stronger than base ele for sure, and since fire was nerfed, I think it’s viable to drop fire for tempest to use come of its components.

@oneclick, I guess personally I like tempest more because I don’t always like the high apm style of base ele (necro main here and I like guardian so yeah).

In general though, since I multiclass, I don’t feel too bogged down by tempests relative inferiority, but I still plan to play it for fun, though maybe not competitively like I will for reaper, and potentially dragonhunter.

grahf.7540:

OneKlicKill.4285:

But I won’t play tempest I just don’t like the play-style and don’t think it is good, nor can it be good without them making it OP for a while.

I completely disagree. It’s a fallacy to say it cannot be good without being OP. Yes, balancing MMOs is hard – but it’s far from unattainable.

The problem is that Anet has had several BWEs now and did not make enough substantive changes to actually test if they could make Tempest good without being OP. They were content to leave it severely undertuned. Well, I could be wrong about that once we see it on the 23rd but realistically we all have to prepare for disappointment.

Sorry for not being clear. It has to either be better than base ele, or worse. Because it fills the same role and competes for the same position, it will either be the choice or not, so the OP is in comparison to base ele.

And everyone should have started prepping for disappointment after BE1, hell I just admitted disappointment on the teaser and confirmed it on the announcement. I fought for changes every BE weekend and they didn’t do kitten, don’t expect much on the 23rd. Tempest is at a mechanical level bad, and its unlikely they made big changes.

you’re wrong about that. tempest doesn’t fill the same role as d/d ele.

a build doesn’t have to be op to compete with existing builds, just a viable alternative which tempest can be if certain minor things get polished a bit more.

3s for an overload instead of 5
switching attunement mid overlod without canceling
instant shouts would be great
rebound buffed
minor traits merged and given new functionality
water overload maybe a water field
cooldowns of some shouts lowered
etc

Jekkt.6045:

you’re wrong about that. tempest doesn’t fill the same role as d/d ele.

a build doesn’t have to be op to compete with existing builds, just a viable alternative which tempest can be if certain minor things get polished a bit more.

3s for an overload instead of 5
switching attunement mid overlod without canceling
instant shouts would be great
rebound buffed
minor traits merged and given new functionality
water overload maybe a water field
cooldowns of some shouts lowered
etc

D/D ele is a tankly dmg roll its support was no more stronger then staff ele. Tempest is nearly pure support though it can be build to do dmg and to be tankly. In a lot of ways you can say the same for all wepon types for ele and tempest becuse ele more so then say tempest is a jack of all class what could it not do?

Any way at the end of the day d/d ele is a lot weaker then it use to be to the point of no longer filling the roll that it use to. Tempest fills that old roll to a point but less dmg aimed and more support / tankly aim. Its different yet not different just more specialized as the name says “elite specialized.”

Jski.6180:

Jekkt.6045:

you’re wrong about that. tempest doesn’t fill the same role as d/d ele.

a build doesn’t have to be op to compete with existing builds, just a viable alternative which tempest can be if certain minor things get polished a bit more.

3s for an overload instead of 5
switching attunement mid overlod without canceling
instant shouts would be great
rebound buffed
minor traits merged and given new functionality
water overload maybe a water field
cooldowns of some shouts lowered
etc

D/D ele is a tankly dmg roll its support was no more stronger then staff ele. Tempest is nearly pure support though it can be build to do dmg and to be tankly. In a lot of ways you can say the same for all wepon types for ele and tempest becuse ele more so then say tempest is a jack of all class what could it not do?

Any way at the end of the day d/d ele is a lot weaker then it use to be to the point of no longer filling the roll that it use to. Tempest fills that old roll to a point but less dmg aimed and more support / tankly aim. Its different yet not different just more specialized as the name says “elite specialized.”

You know, d/d is still quite strong, what hurts me the most when it comes to the new specialization is that you don’t get a new primary weapon. Elementalist only has 3 main hand weapons and even tho you have many skills, using the same ones over and over is quite boring. Engineer has 3 main weapons only as well, but it’s getting a new primary weapon and also having kits. Where with the tempest, you will be playing the role in PvP you’ve been playing from the start (fresh air is fun, but scepter is just bad compared to other classes, hell, even d/d – burning speed^^).

Tomiyou.3790:

Jski.6180:

Jekkt.6045:

you’re wrong about that. tempest doesn’t fill the same role as d/d ele.

a build doesn’t have to be op to compete with existing builds, just a viable alternative which tempest can be if certain minor things get polished a bit more.

3s for an overload instead of 5
switching attunement mid overlod without canceling
instant shouts would be great
rebound buffed
minor traits merged and given new functionality
water overload maybe a water field
cooldowns of some shouts lowered
etc

D/D ele is a tankly dmg roll its support was no more stronger then staff ele. Tempest is nearly pure support though it can be build to do dmg and to be tankly. In a lot of ways you can say the same for all wepon types for ele and tempest becuse ele more so then say tempest is a jack of all class what could it not do?

Any way at the end of the day d/d ele is a lot weaker then it use to be to the point of no longer filling the roll that it use to. Tempest fills that old roll to a point but less dmg aimed and more support / tankly aim. Its different yet not different just more specialized as the name says “elite specialized.”

You know, d/d is still quite strong, what hurts me the most when it comes to the new specialization is that you don’t get a new primary weapon. Elementalist only has 3 main hand weapons and even tho you have many skills, using the same ones over and over is quite boring. Engineer has 3 main weapons only as well, but it’s getting a new primary weapon and also having kits. Where with the tempest, you will be playing the role in PvP you’ve been playing from the start (fresh air is fun, but scepter is just bad compared to other classes, hell, even d/d – burning speed^^).

I get d/d is still good its just not able to do it all and its a lot weaker when paired off with team support then just self support. That the question when playing an d/d ele do you do self support or do you do pt support aimed builds (at the end of the day pt support is far weaker then self support builds in all formats). What tempest lets you do is build for that pt support over self support. THAT is what makes tempest different form d/d ele. The abitly to go true support and not the part support that has been played up to now.

Not to say tempest cant go dmg or very high tanklyness but at the end of the day a tempest still an ele with one line missing for a def line up and a few new skills your still very able to be the jack of all your just a bit more specialized into support and tanklyness. (If any thing its more of a question of maybe ele it doing too much of the same as tempest and ele is missing the unique build that tempest can not do. The real thing that should be said of all base classes vs elite spec kind of backwards of what ppl are saying now. Something very true of a lot of things in life its the backwards point of view that maybe more true to what going on or needs to be done just hard to do becuse it means you need to go beyond your own point of view and look from others.)

tbh i would still pick a support guard over a support tempest. guard just offers so much more than tempest and the aoe cleanse is also better on guard because you get 2x condi removal with soldier runes where you only get 1 on tempest.

i would even argue that heal druid is better than tempest in terms of support.

Jekkt.6045:

tbh i would still pick a support guard over a support tempest. guard just offers so much more than tempest and the aoe cleanse is also better on guard because you get 2x condi removal with soldier runes where you only get 1 on tempest.

i would even argue that heal druid is better than tempest in terms of support.

I would agree that druid as we saw it in the last beta could be better than tempest as the amount of healing from it was insane. However, it’s gonna get nerfed so no one really knows how it will do when hot comes out.

But I don’t agree tempest is a new way to play ele, it’s pretty much the same with added skills and longer cd’s on attunements. I doubt it will be on the same level as d/d ele due to the fact you take d/d for both support and damage, for pure support you will just take a guard as you said.