Guild Wars 2

Leave your thoughts and feedback from BWE2 about the tempest here!

Nothing changed, still the most useless elite spec. Overloads are NEVER worth using, warhorn is okay-ish but we already have offhand dagger and focus to cover all bases. Tempest has absolutely nothing new that ele didn’t already do (much better).

Traits are probably the worst part of the spec, the minor traits besides the first are a joke and should all be rolled into the first minor. 3 Minor traits for overloads is a bad joke.

Basically all traits fell boring and out of place. The vigor trait screams water line, as does the frost aura one.

Just spam ice bow 4. Everything else is trivial

Been messing around with some builds and you can get some impressive healing and defensive boons going. The self heal alone is a ~6-7k heal on all nearby allies (yes, it says something like 3.8k, but that’s actually only the first pulse, of three pulses – combine this with something like runes of the monk and it’s a very potent heal), and you can get insane protection uptime. Whilst this is absolutely useless in current GW2, this may possibly be a good thing for raids! It all depends on that content.

I like the shouts, but I feel they need some buffs. The earth and air shouts have slightly too long a cooldown (air wouldn’t be too bad if it gave an aura, but since it doesn’t I feel it could either do with a slight cd reduction or given an aura). The water shout needs a bit more ‘oomph’ to it than a 3s chill too. In PvE it just doesn’t feel like it adds up to much (and I’m thinking towards raids too, how often will a 3s chill help when something like frozen ground can provide so much more?).

The warhorn feels better, especially with the new blast finisher on earth 4 (in combination with the moving water field, that’s a lot of healing potential!). However, earth 5’s ‘wind up’ time is still far too long and usually proves useless as a result. Lightning orb still needs a major buff to damage. It’s a skill 5 that does much, much less damage than lava font! Increase the cooldown from 20s if needs be, but that skill needs to feel damaging if it’s to live up to its GW1 roots!

Overloads:

- Water is getting decent, the condition removal and final heal are both better, but could still do with being a bit higher. After all, these overloads are very high risk (not least the inability to dodge!).

- Air: This feels pretty decent to me now, it’s like a mini GoS on a shorter recharge. It also has the least risk, since you’re already getting decent use out of it before you finish chanelling anyway.

- Earth: The protection pulsing is great, but I feel like the blast finisher could do with being as the beginning of the channel.

- Fire: Considering that this is the ‘big damage dealer’ of the tempest (in theory), I feel like this could be dealing 50% more damage before it started feeling worth it.

Rebound: It’s bad. We all know it’s bad. If it didn’t get negated by auto attacks it’d still be bad. The idea itself doesn’t even work with the tempest theme! If you’re going to go with some kind of ‘recharge’ deal, why not just make it recharge all of your other shouts? It’s still not making huge sense, but at least would be powerful, since it could allow for some heavy spike heals via WtPA without worrying about the balance of other ele utilities receiving that recharge.

Note that all of the above are considering playing some kind of ‘support/healer’ in a raid scenario. If that’s not a role that’s needed in raids, then this elite spec is a write off for PvE entirely. I can see good utility for this spec in WvW due to the moving water fields and heavy heal spikes. For PvP? Nope. I just can’t see tempest ever working as well as base ele, never mind any of the other interesting elite specs.

first off you need to be able to swap attunement while overloading without breaking the overload, secondly you need to have a breakbar for all overloads and Tempest might work out

Also is Rebound supose to trigger on auto-attack?

@The Comfy Chair, Thanks for the feedback. It reminded me that I need to retest out the warhorn to see how it’s changed. I’ll probably try a couple more support type builds as well.

not the most worthless elite spec, ive personally got 2 tied for worst, and this isnt one of them

gonna write here what i wrote in 2 threads so you have it in 1 thread:

if you cast fire overload inside of a combo field you get 1 whirl finisher for the whole 4.5 seconds casting time. many other skills with a lower casting time have multiple whirl finishers and yet this skill has only 1

still not possible to cast an overload and switch attunement without breaking the cast. please address this for a more fluid playstyle. especially for a dps fresh air build this is important because you will be channeling and at the same time going through other attunements to get the fresh air proc. a small goodie for dps eles would be appreciated.

(example, cast air overload, switch to earth, air overload still channeling, fresh air proc, back to air, air overload is about to finish, 5s till next air overload → repeat)

the new version of rebound looks good IF the cooldown and casting stay the same. how long will that “prevent death” effect be active?

Magnetic Aura on sand squall is nice, thanks

Karl McLain.5604:

“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Definitely sounds like an improvement. Payout for either outcome. Seems like the big thing would be the timeframe for lethal damage. Hopefully this version doesn’t have a delay before the shout takes effect. =P

Sounds interesting if the heal that is received is a static amount or % of max hp. If the heal is just what the killing blow would have been it might be too weak take for example a bleed tick it wont be so great since you would die a split second later. But its great to hear its being worked on!

wow, Karl, that sounds like an elite that would actually address some of the elementalist’s squishiness in general. it also fits the tempest’s support role much better than the BWE1, and BWE2 version of the shout.

The Comfy Chair’s feedback pretty much echoes my own. fire overload still feels kinda weak as the big damage dealer. earth and air shouts still take too long to recharge. (air shout really feels like it needs shocking aura)

i’m hoping to see more info on the iterations in quite a few areas of the specialization, especially in the traits. since i’ve given feedback on the traits in BWE1, i’ll direct you to the BWE1 thread.

the main suggestions of course, being to combine the miner traits (and make them work on all channels, not just overload channels), give some stability somewhere (or traited breakbars for all overloads), shout cooldown reduction, damage multipliers (maybe something like how Berserker’s Power works, but the damage boost is granted upon overload channel completion), or add damage pulses every second to all channels for elementalist.

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Another small change we was due to the case that warhorn was missing an aura. As such (in our test iteration), Magnetic Aura now belongs to Sand Squall, in addition to its other properties. Looking forward to your constructive feedback from this BWE.

-Karl

Hey Karl this seems like a step in the right direction for rebound as it provides more ways for Ele to survive in the frontlines while bolstering allies. Just try to avoid anything like the previous version that requires too much coordination. Also perhaps for overloads you could look at giving Tempest something similar to the berserker’s eternal champion. The Tempest could pulse stability while overloading to help complete the channel. I’m looking forward to playing with Tempest/DH/DD after the various concerns are dealt with. Keep up the good work!

Few things I’d like to see changed:

- add a breakbar for all attunements not just earth overload
- make it possible to change attunement while overloading
- add a trait that lower the cooldown on shouts

Reasoning behind my suggestions:

- without the breakbar it’s nearly impossible to succesfully overload in a teamfight scenario
- not being able to change attunement while overloading leaves you very vurnible and really makes the overloading not worth it.
- The shouts are not even close to being as useful as cantrips

Good things.

The warhorn YES it’s good!

With overloads we need to either be able to dodge or have the cast time lower, 4 seconds to get something off while in melee against most bosses means we just die…

Still not liking it. Overloads are clunky and not worth casting, the whole spec just plays weirdly. Traits are still bad, shouts are still bad, , warhorn is still bad, high cooldowns…as I said the issue wasn’t in numbers, but at least they’re reworking the elite I guess. Can’t see myself playing it, though.

The major concern I have with the Tempest right now is the trait line. Using the Tempest traits as they are feels lIke a net bad. Aside from a few neat interactions with overloads and negligible effects with auras (maybe scale up the healing one a bit?), there really is nothing going on in the trait line. I’d recommend removing at least a few of the more narrow and niche trait slots and replacing them with traits that have a general beneficial effect, not something that comes up once in a blue moon. Don’t punish the player that wants to play a Tempest with the trait line’s current design, make it so he/she feels happy to be a Tempest.

I noticed all of Warhorn skills have shorter recharge time than the last beta test and attument recharge traits are incorrect with warhorn skills.
For example, Water Globe (Warhorn water 5) used to has 50s recharge time, now it has 28s recharge time (16.5s recharge time with Aquamancer’s Training.)

There is just no way anyone will prioritise casting an overload. 4.25s cast is just mental. Either drop the cast down to 1.5-2s or have it cast in the background whilst you can still use other skills (but still be CC’d or interrupted). You’d have to balance the overloads – but honestly they will NEVER be used in anything competitive.

Aside from that so far the Warhorn skills are too slow. With any movement speed bonus you out-run the spells making them pretty much insignificant. The speed needs at least parity with whatever speed the character is running at. Although I feel like the spells are actually in an good spot.

Also the elite shout needs something a bit extra maybe 2-3 stacks of Stability (for 5s) giving scope to cast an overload.

I only tried it in pvp:

Warhorn is a fun weapon (and the best thing about tempest right now) but could use quite some tweaks.

Overall I like almost all the skills on warhorn, though it’s really hard to hit frantic enemies with air 4 (the pull-tornado) and air 5 does pitiful damage against both aoe and single targets. Fire skills are really nice though fire 5 is just a max-power focus firewall.

Overall what I liked most about warhorn is that basically all the skills have really low cooldowns for ele 4+5 skills. Nothing more than 35 seconds with the average probably around ~25 seconds. Though it really lacks a strong defensive skill when you’re focused, but I guess that’s the price for low cooldowns. Focus earth+air is just so much defense warhorn simply can’t compete.

Warhorn probably needs a real defensive cooldown (defense or mobility) to make it have a chance of getting used over the awesome power and mobility of offhand dagger or the sheer defensive power of focus.

I don’t see the point in using Overloads as they are right now.

Overloads, while looking cool, don’t really do much you can’t do without them anyway (and better even). Fire overload is nice for might stacking but that’s it, pretty boring. The heal from water overload is noticable if you’re out of heal cooldowns but you’ll mostly get CCed out of it ASAP. Both fire and air overloads do pityful damage for their insanely long channel times and both have pitiful ranges too (air should be straight up ranged). Earth is okay-ish I guess for the aoe protection, but switching to earth usually gives AOE protection anyway so it’s kinda pointless again.

I really think Overloads need to do something eles cannot do normally to ever find use. Something like this:

Fire Overload: grants aoe retaliation while channeling.
Water Overload: converts condition(s) into boons upon finishing it.
Air Overload: pulses aoe daze around you while channeling.
Earth Overload: grants aoe aegis upon finishing it.

Something like this, anything, really to make casting, and even more, finishing them, worth it. Right now it can even be benefitial to cancel the overload by attunement swapping right after starting the channel – because you keep the 5+ seconds of protection and swiftness. And that can’t really be the point of the mechanic?

Shouts seem neat but lack a Cooldown trait.

The auras on shouts make them the best choice for auramancer utilities, though the trait for them really should give 20% CDR. And the frost aura grandmaster trait should probably straight up cast the frost shout (which is extremely weak btw).

Fire shout is really nice, 20 secs cooldown aoe burn + fire aura + condi removal from soldier runes.

Frost shout is, as above, pretty useless, chill is a rather weak condition for us because it’s always really short and doesn’t proc anything like damage.

Earth shout is neat but really really long cooldown for such a small effect. Keep the cooldown and give it some AOE bleed pulses please, bleed is totally unsupported on ele right now

Air shout should really give static aura, at least to yourself.

There’s no way I’m gonna drop signet heal for shout heal, Signet active even heals for about as much as the shout…

P.S. Rebound is such a joke. Best used with other elites or Armor of Earth. Such a boring elite. Please remake it completely, this is a mesmer elite…

“Rebound” literally doesn’t give the 25% recharge reduction to any of your weapon skills if you have pyromancer’s/Aquamancer’s/Aeromancer’s/Geomancer’s Training in the trait line, or Imbued Melodies. It only seems to work on Attunement swap…… not even your utility skills get that 25% reduction.

Until it’s changed, I want my spammable meteor shower at least. Lol

EDIT 2: It just doesn’t work at all on warhorn or tempest utility skills.

I don’t know why I still find some hope in the Tempest becoming useable, but I will bite:

Feedback

THE BAD:

1.Tempest doesn’t have an unique role, it just competes with D/D cele ele.

2. Tempest does not have any uniqueness to the abilities it brings (except boon sharing and extension, which I will comment on the “the broken”). It does literally the same thing that the elementalist does now.

3. Trait line is terrible. It is a net loss to spec into this traitline.

4, Mechanic doesn’t synergy at all with the base ele.

The Broken:

1. Overloads: Are designed for corner stacking in dungeons. Seriously, this is their only use right now, specially with the changes thus far being just buffing damage to make it better. It will literally become the new Dungeon meta if it keeps on this trend. Any other use is lost because of the terrible drawbacks to it.

2. Boon sharing and extension will break Raids and WvW.
Yes Tempest will be mandatory here because of the ability of making all boons permanent (think perma quickness, alacracy, 25x might, regen, protection, resistance, etc.). How will raids be challenging with those boons permanent with ease with the tempest and a mix of other classes?

The terrible Elite

The elite right now is terrible and should go.

The Elite rework suggested above is not completely useless as what we have right now, but it seems just a poor man’s version of Warrior’s Banner.

Unless the duration of the effect is really high, you are better off just having something that rez one person and does an area of effect buff, rather than giving something to potentially rez all.

This is because in PvP very rarely you have a “group wide” drop, so it is just a 1 man heal skill.

In WvW unless it helps the group to stay alive through the whole collision of Zergs (again long duration and fantastic heal), it is just not useful and it is better to have something to raise the dead commander / ally. (Remember when you are downing you become invincible for a while, but if you just heal you continue to eat the damage and in a ZvZ you will die and not even notice this buff)

In PvE this skill may be useful in raids, but just maybe before that big attack from the boss. But that is so niche….

Auramancer goal

It is quite clear that the goal is to make this elite specialization the auramancer that never happened with base elementalist. Fine. But make it fun.

Suggestions:

1. First of all, remove all trait auras in other lines and consolidate in the Tempest trait line. Take out from fire, air, earth and water (yes remove powerful aura as well and replace with something better. Tempest is already giving party wide auras so that grandmaster is redundant).

2. Give each line of the Tempest traits a purpose. Make one to be perhaps geared towards selfish builds, another designed around party-wide support and the last one geared towards the weapon and the utilities (warhorn and shouts).

3. Create an unique aura to come with the Tempest. Give the class that special something that is missing right now and an unique aura that made you go “Wow this aura is cool!” would really help sell this elite specialization.

I think that Overloads need to have a stability bar, as well as the ability to dodge without canceling the overload. There aren’t enough ways to help ensure the overload succeeds without relying on others.

In general I just don’t think the survivability is where it needs to be. Would like to see ‘protection on aura’ get moved to the tempest line. Vigor on aura would be an interesting trait as well.

They should have made the Tempest weapon Main-Hand Trident. That would have been at least something unique … and probably the only time you would see a Trident used.

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

-Karl

It’s certainly better, but what if there are 2-3 killing blows at the same time? I guess we will have to see it in practice.

Is it a shout or an arcane skill and will it work with the shout/arcane traits?

I did some duels for over an hour with a friend reaper today and never managed to finish an overload. They all got interrupted, even earth.

Azel.4786:

1. First of all, remove all trait auras in other lines and consolidate in the Tempest trait line. Take out from fire, air, earth and water (yes remove powerful aura as well and replace with something better. Tempest is already giving party wide auras so that grandmaster is redundant).

2. Give each line of the Tempest traits a purpose. Make one to be perhaps geared towards selfish builds, another designed around party-wide support and the last one geared towards the weapon and the utilities (warhorn and shouts).

3. Create an unique aura to come with the Tempest. Give the class that special something that is missing right now and an unique aura that made you go “Wow this aura is cool!” would really help sell this elite specialization.

I really like these suggestions. If tempest is supposed to help our aura situation then this looks like a great way to reflect that in the traits.

Also: while we’re on the topic of auras, “Eye of the storm” still looks like it’s missing shock aura.

“Rebound” looks like it’s headed in the right direction, but instead of giving it a repeat aura based on attunement, I agree that it deserves it’s own aura. And if it can’t have that much, then at least a light aura. Light aura would fit the conditional survival bonus effect.

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”
-Karl

Now THAT actually sounds like a decent elite. A party wide AED could be useful in pvp, wvw, maybe even pve (but only baddies take fatal damage, right?

The overloads still dont feel right. Air is no longer a DPS loss (but not much of a gain) and water is a decent heal, but they’re only breaking even if they finish casting. Its like the current problem with churning earth- why should I make myself a target for a 4 second channel if the payoff on a successful channel doesnt significantly exceed the payoff for autoattacking 6 or 8 times? Maybe if Unstable conduit granted us auras while channeling the overload instead of finishing them, then earth would be a better engage tool, water would be more effective definsively, and fire and air would better discourage your enemy from just meleeing your face in while you channel the attunement, because right now they still dont do enough damage to make your enemy back off. Oh, and hardy conduit needs to last the duration of the overload at least. it says I’m supposed to have protection while overloading, but here I am at the 4 second mark on fire and I have no protection.

Instead of adding auras here and there, it would be nice if you could turn overloads or at least the after effects into big kitten AoE attacks like meteor shower, tornado? Both overloading and staying in an attunement for a longer time should be rewarded more. Also, focus would still be my way to go offhand for wvw frontline as it provides more survivability. Boon sharing is good and op with warhorn but, not even earth overload can keep me alive at frontline. If you are dead, you are just another rally bot.

I did my first run with tempest. I did the build i like to play and more or less tempest substitued my arcane line going for aura shouts.

I do WvW roaming and had been paired with a friends ranger.
It played better then i thought. There is not so much missing.

Overcharges: Only used the earth once in a player fight when i solo engaged two oponents. Thought i give it a try because they did´t see me coming. Was ok, could droped one after but the second got me. Thats OK.
The other overcharges were only agaist static guards when doing a camp. Its the chill version. Pull and overload instead of klicking 20 buttons :-).
In tough fights they were of no use/oportunity till now.

Warhorn: Did´t use it. Guess i try today.

Shouts:
Worked OK.
Feel the burn: The 20s cooldown and instant make the day. This one is fine when traited.
Flash freeze: The impact felt low but i think its also fine. I wish it is an instant. This would greatly help.
Aftershock: The long cooldown is hard. But having a missile reflection is great as usual(destroyed a Dragonhunter twice …) and the imobilize helped to catch two oponents. Also being instant cast would be the thing. Slower cooldown of course but don´t know if it would get to strong. 40s seem OK.

I like that it also heals my temmate.

Rebound: Fine to hear its reworked as aura share.
Did slot i for a while. Äh … No real useful oportunity :-/. Way better with my FSG.
Make it instant and add an aura share + kitten cooldown. Its easy. You don´t need to make it complicated.

What was realy the main Problem, is what i expected.
I have troubles to do the build itself.
Droping my utilities for shouts was hard because 2 blast finishers, condi removal, speed, two stunbreakers all gone. The stunbreaker didn´t feel so hard as i expected. Traited the auto one from tempest.
What was realy hard is i had to drop my damage to stay mobile. Used traveler rune and the changed traits made a sum of i guess 25% total damage loss. The boonshare from arcane was not an issue. The shouts substituted that.
So the main thing i would need is baseline speed (or for the great tempest feeling full 33% permaswiftness baseline) so i have more build flexibility and a real great new thing that makes playing smother.

To be continued.

oh ok and i did create new topic kk gona post it here

well i tried tempest and it really bad and need alot of work
first of all 5 sec is soo long to wait for overload i think if they made to 3 sec it will be better .. second fire overload and air overload dmg is still low ..
the animation at the end of earth overload i hope u fix it

the shout skill .. well it will be better for air shout to have aura and the fire shout dmg is too low if ur not gona buff the dmg then increase the the stack of buring and the duration .. the ice shout or water shout it just bad .. the earth shout i think it fine but the CD to long 50 sec ? for imob and aura ?

the trait cant talk about it cuz it really need a lot of work and mix some trait with other so wont bother my self if they gona ignore this feedback anyway ..

Rebound skill .. this skill is the worst skill in GW2 history .. please remove it or work on it !!
it dont give anything + it so useless in TPVP,, it can trigger with autoattack and swamping between attu .. this skill need a lot of work.. really alot of work .
please anet as u give love for warrior and mesmer give some to Tempest
Well overall tempest still bad and the worst elite from all of them

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Another small change we was due to the case that warhorn was missing an aura. As such (in our test iteration), Magnetic Aura now belongs to Sand Squall, in addition to its other properties. Looking forward to your constructive feedback from this BWE.

-Karl

please don’t do that it way worse than the one we have ! .. what about -25% cool down on any skill u use for the 8 sec or 10 sec ? sound cool ? and maybe u gain light aura ? i think this way most will like it and it will give way much more .. ^^

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Another small change we was due to the case that warhorn was missing an aura. As such (in our test iteration), Magnetic Aura now belongs to Sand Squall, in addition to its other properties. Looking forward to your constructive feedback from this BWE.

-Karl

Wow! This is surprising to me, I was just about to post the lack of an aura from the Warhorn and the only one that came to my mind was exactly the addition of Magnetic Aura to Sand Squall. :O
But, when I was thinking that, I realized Sand Squall is an incredibly overloaded skill already. It provides protection, it extends boons and is a blast finisher. Sand Squall is going to be used mostly to blast something, wasting the strategic use of that aura most of the time. Please consider the addition of Magnetic Aura to Dust Storm instead, with blinds for melee and proyectile reflection from the aura it now becomes a really decent defensive skill, the current iteration of only blinds is really poor, the addition of this aura would give it the push it needs. But either way, this change is really good.

Now, the new Rebound. The key is in how much the Rebound buff is going to last, it needs to be a fair amount. This is your typical skill that creates… clutch plays! That’s really good for PvP Karl, really good! You also added in there another possible aura, just the cherry on top. I really like the idea of this elite, the buff has to last enough though, we’ll see.

I would love to see standardized overload cast times 3-4 sec a brake bar on all of them when your using them and an field effect during the cast (earth gets blast per sec). I think it should be more on the support side that is added at this point tempest now is in danger of becoming better dmg then ele.

Now my feedback (almost the same as from BWE1):

What I’d change from traits:

—You now have to wait 3 seconds to get an overload instead of 5.
Reasoning: 5 seconds just feels way too long. The effectiveness of the ele quickly diminishes the longer one stays in an attunement. Attunement lockdown is enough penalty already.

—16s attunement lockdown is now base. Harmonious Conduit redisigned. It now gives 2 seconds of quickness after finishing an Overload (nice reward to get that Overload off).
Afterthought: Or it gives 3 stacks of might when an overload is finished or during the channels (if you have to interrupt your might stacking rotation, might as well get some might in return to compensate). Just throwing some random ideas here.
Reasoning: Harmonious Conduit is a boring passive trait that feels a little too mandatory if you ever want to overload semi-regularly. 20s of attunement lockdown feels a little too extreme.

—Speedy Conduit minor trait now provides Super Speed (instead of swiftness) as long as the channel lasts, if the channel stops or gets interrupted, you lose the Super Speed buff.
Reasoning: eles already have over 80% swiftness uptime with Elemental Attunement trait alone. More swiftness just overlaps with all the other swiftness sources the ele has, Superspeed would also provide much needed maneuverability to this frontliner spec.

—Unstable Conduit now has a 10 second ICD per attunement (like Evasive Arcana trait).
Reasoning: This may seem random, but really, this is to prevent extremely high uptime of Shocking Aura from Fresh Air. (And also to justify the addition of Shocking Aura to Eye of the Storm!)

—Tempestuous Aria also reduces shout CDs by 20%.
Reasoning: Self-explanatory. Why isn’t there already?

—Lucid Singularity now provides a breakbar to all overload channels.
Or just make the breakbar thing baseline, really.
Reasoning: The new Verdant brink and the current PvP meta is a CC fest, you almost never land an entire overload, other than earth, reliably. I imagine, in WvW, on the frontlines is even worse. This mechanic just can’t work without CC protection, sorry.

What I’d change from Overloads:

Overload Air. It now also pulses 1 second of weakness every second during the channel. The end effect now leaves a lightning field on the ground for x seconds, it dazes enemies that try to cross it (Like a weaker version of static field).
Reasoning: If you are going to be channeling this so close to melee range, it needs utility that reduces damage to allies as well as to you in order to suvive. The end of the channel needs to be way stronger.

Overload Earth. Now pulses bleeding during the channel. The end effect now causes massive bleeding in addition to its current effects. It’s now a blast finisher on cast rather than (or as well as) on finish.
Reasoning: Earth is supposed to be bleed themed as well as defensive, it would also help some condi orinted eles. This particular overload has its defensive nature covered by the protection pulse.

Overload Water. It now converts conditions into boons during the channel instead of just cleansing them.
Reasoning: Why not? You’re making big risks by locking down your most important defensive attunement, may as well do something more besides the boring heal+condi cleanse of old.

Overload FIre. Damage and range of the effect slightly increased or you reflect projectiles when channeling.
Reasoning: This is by far the riskiest overload of them all due to its reduced range. You either increase the range or attach a defensive mechanism of sorts to it.

What I’d change from Warhorn skills:

—Wildfire fire field is placed on the ground twice as fast.
Reasoning: I feel it takes way too long to be fully on the ground.

—Lightning Orb. Added some functionality to it. The orb now travels much faster and now you have the choice to teleport to your current orb location or you teleport automatically at the end of it. It would be the ground version of the underwater bubble Air Pocket.
Reasoning: Warhorn desperately needs some sort of mobility or a reposition tool, not something as strong as Ride the Lightning, but stronger than mere swiftness, this would provide some much needed ‘soft’ mobility to it.

— Tidal Surge now moves way faster.
Reasoning: It moves so slow that the knockback is always delayed and can’t really be used eficiently as a CC skill.

— Water Globe. You’re now sorrounded by water and are now considered a mobile water field. It’s the water field version of Berserker’s torch 5.
Reasoning: Blasting this moving orb proved to be very annoying in the thick of battle, this would just be and incredibly good (and cool!) QoL change.

Shouts
—Eye of the Storm! now grants Shocking Aura instead of superspeed (superspeed now comes from overloading as previously suggested).
Reasoning: For consistency, and now Unstable Condiut has an ICD to balance it out.

—Shock and Aftershock! CD reduced to 40s.
Reasoning: Well, I’m not sure about this one, it’s true the CD feels a little too long, but it applies AoE immobilize, which is really strong.

Karl McLain.5604:

We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

I like this version a lot better. The only problem might be, that you take fatal damage, get healed and go down right away again. Since Mist Form is an ele skill, I’d propose to move the 6th bonus of vampirism runes here (scratch it on the rune). So the effect would heal affected allies to 25% health and proc Mist Form on them. This provides a stunbreak, an opportunity to reposition, stealth up etc. and it offers more counterplay than the passive rune proc, because the ele can be interrupted while casting it.

Khenzy.9348:

Wow! This is surprising to me, I was just about to post the lack of an aura from the Warhorn and the only one that came to my mind was exactly the addition of Magnetic Aura to Sand Squall. :O
But, when I was thinking that, I realized Sand Squall is an incredibly overloaded skill already. It provides protection, it extends boons and is a blast finisher. Sand Squall is going to be used mostly to blast something, wasting the strategic use of that aura most of the time. Please consider the addition of Magnetic Aura to Dust Storm instead, with blinds for melee and proyectile reflection from the aura it now becomes a really decent defensive skill, the current iteration of only blinds is really poor, the addition of this aura would give it the push it needs. But either way, this change is really good.

Great idea. +1

Overloads -for me- have 2 big non number related problems:

1) Overloads are over-limited
Interrupts weakness in a class with really limited stability (the prime offender as they cant be actually used in PvP)+ 5 secs to charge + 15 secs for “recharging” the attunement + cant evade while overloading + cant swap attunement is just too much. Balancing something with that many limitations at the same time is making something simple overcomplicated.

2) They don´t really add a new layer of strategy or option to what the attunements already do
I don´t mind that every attunement has a predetermined flavor and the overloads follow it, the thing is -how- they do it. For example, with all the storm theme, there could be a long range damage dealer that only dmgs those that are at some distance from you, but not near -in the eye of the storm-, offering a ranged option for a ranged limited class. A fire tornado that burns enemy boons and allies conditions, giving some support in a non support attunement, or even going more traditional, with something like Shmendrick said: converting conditions into boons when you finish the water overload.

Traits

I totally agree with Azel on this: If tempest is trying to bring the auramancer back (and I dont see it as a bad idea) traits should be relocated to reflect that. I think its important to bring attention to the fact that we NEED to use cantrips for survability, so both shouts and auramancer traits need to have it included in some way. Using boons can be a good way as they can be countered by boon destroyer classes / builds.

About the new elite:

Its far better than Rebound, and if it affects you maybe can be even used when playing alone. What about giving it chaos armor or light aura, as they are really rarely used and can benefit auramancers.

About changesfor this beta

- Fire overload still needs dmg as it is almost on par with staaf metor shower + skills.
- Water last heal is there if the overload will do something more, if not, its almost there, but it will be a shame that it only removes conditions and heals.
- Earth dmg is still too low, the extra immobilize sec may be awesome in PvP, but no change to interrupts mean Im not even trying to test it again.
- Air Range was needed, the dmg is still totally low and the fact that it does the same as fire with just little differences is a shame
- Love the increase of dmg & speed in wildfire, it was totally needed
- The blast finisher in sand squall 2
- Lightning orb still feels underwhelming and unpredictable, the best suggestion to make it interesting I read was making it a movement skill: the second time you activate the skill it teleports you where the ligthning is.

Other things:

- Dust storm seemed awesome, but the fact that its in line instead of surrounding you limits its use as a defensive position
- No matter how I see it, “eye of the storm” should give shocking aura instead of super speed (which has tons of problems limitations, and as a stunbreaker the trait for the warhorn is far more interesting)
- Flash Freeze is lacking, why not make it so that if someone is already chilled it stuns/immobilizes them (freezes)
- Then to not duplicate (and even compete with the overload), shock and aftershock can bleed giving eles a little of the bleeding aplciation that we lack and if it hits a chilled target it “breaks” it doing bonus damage for shouts sinergy

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Another small change we was due to the case that warhorn was missing an aura. As such (in our test iteration), Magnetic Aura now belongs to Sand Squall, in addition to its other properties. Looking forward to your constructive feedback from this BWE.

-Karl

this still doesn’t address the lack of “new role” we were promised.

Argol Vazin.3061:

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Another small change we was due to the case that warhorn was missing an aura. As such (in our test iteration), Magnetic Aura now belongs to Sand Squall, in addition to its other properties. Looking forward to your constructive feedback from this BWE.

-Karl

this still doesn’t address the lack of “new role” we were promised.

The new role is being a buffbot for raids and maybe WvW if survivabilty is addressed. It is true that the ele can already do support, but it seems to me that the tempest is supposed to take it a step further and make you a pure support character. The particular change that we got to rebound makes it kind of obvious.

I’m not really thrilled about such a role but it is new in a way. Pure support that’s viable doesn’t really exist in GW2 atm. The spec might need a few more support options that are unavailable to base ele to make it more unique though. I liked Azel’s idea of giving tempest a unique aura and rebound is an obvious way to give access to it.

Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem that this spec can be made useful for PvP and open world PvE. Such a heavy support focus is a major hindrance in these modes imo.

Edit: As for fractals, they are a wildcard. We will have to wait and see what kind of rules high level fractals have before we can determine if pure support has a use.

Ganathar.4956:

Argol Vazin.3061:

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Another small change we was due to the case that warhorn was missing an aura. As such (in our test iteration), Magnetic Aura now belongs to Sand Squall, in addition to its other properties. Looking forward to your constructive feedback from this BWE.

-Karl

this still doesn’t address the lack of “new role” we were promised.

The new role is being a buffbot for raids and maybe WvW if survivabilty is addressed. It is true that the ele can already do support, but it seems to me that the tempest is supposed to take it a step further and make you a pure support character. The particular change that we got to rebound makes it kind of obvious.

I’m not really thrilled about such a role but it is new in a way. Pure support that’s viable doesn’t really exist in GW2 atm. The spec might need a few more support options that are unavailable to base ele to make it more unique though. I liked Azel’s idea of giving tempest a unique aura and rebound is an obvious way to give access to it.

Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem that this spec can be made useful for PvP and open world PvE. Such a heavy support focus is a major hindrance in these modes imo.

Edit: As for fractals, they are a wildcard. We will have to wait and see what kind of rules high level fractals have before we can determine if pure support has a use.

the problem is, within elite specs they also have the herald. So tempest has to compete with elementalist base which offers better DPS and herald which has greater durability.

while I haven’t played herald enough to be certain. It does seem at a first glance to be better then tempest. but that could be coloured by my dislike for tempest and the newness of herald thus my lack of knowledge about that class.

Karl McLain.5604:

Hi all!
Thanks for your continued feedback on the Tempest. If possible, let’s compile all feedback into this thread.
We’re iterating in quite a few areas for this specialization, including Rebound. Here’s the description of the latest implementation we’ve been testing over the last few days:
“Shout and infuse your allies with arcane energy. Allies who would take lethal damage while this is active ignore the deathblow and are healed instead. If the effect expires naturally, grant an aura based on your current attunement.”

Another small change we was due to the case that warhorn was missing an aura. As such (in our test iteration), Magnetic Aura now belongs to Sand Squall, in addition to its other properties. Looking forward to your constructive feedback from this BWE.

-Karl

Please stop asking for feedback if you aren’t going to take any of it into consideration. Overloads need a serious review, as does the trait line, these are two things you and other devs have continuously failed to acknowledge and address. We don’t care if you have to delay fixing tempest until a month after release to have that extra time. We want the acknowledgement that you WILL BE FIXING IT.

The WH is the only decent thing about this spec, and that was our most hated thing in the first place… For more feedback see ele forums since the announcement.

Can we get access to quickness some way pls??

Rebound is a good opportunity for this, try what you said but instead of another aura, add quickness to the end of the effect, done elite fixed!

Argol Vazin.3061:

the problem is, within elite specs they also have the herald. So tempest has to compete with elementalist base which offers better DPS and herald which has greater durability.

while I haven’t played herald enough to be certain. It does seem at a first glance to be better then tempest. but that could be coloured by my dislike for tempest and the newness of herald thus my lack of knowledge about that class.

I would argue that most base elementalist specs offer both better DPS and survivability than the current tempest, while still offering good support and that is a major problem. Tempest will undoubtedly end up offering better support than base elementalist but it will still feel weak. I believe that the tempest needs more survivability in its traits, since they are pretty bad atm anyway.

With more survival the tempest might be useful in WvW as well, instead of being for raids only. This could potentially add more build diversity for the tempest by opening up the option to experiment with more builds that take less core specs focused on survivability for other game modes.

Vissarion.6509:

Can we get access to quickness some way pls??

Rebound is a good opportunity for this, try what you said but instead of another aura, add quickness to the end of the effect, done elite fixed!

In a previous post that I made a week or two ago I suggested to add a new aura that is exclusive to rebound and grants quickness to the user when struck and dazes foes. This way you can combine auras with quickness. However, it may end up too powerful if it is added to Karl’s existing idea as it was the main feature of the skill in my idea.

This is my first time posting in this forum. I’m afraid I’m not an english native writer, so I’m sorry about any mistakes you find in my writting. However, I would really
like to help improve the Tempest.

Warhorn:

• I would prefer its skills without any activation time (e.g. Heat Sync)
• Furthermore, why not improving Tempest’s support role by allowing its main hand Boons not only to be applied to himself, but also to any surrounding ally? Let’s illustrate
  this with an example: Phoenix gives vigor and removes a condition. In my humble opinion, if you wear a warhorn and use the aforementioned skill it would be nice that your allies get vigor and have a condition removed as well.
• To improve its interaction with the scepter.
• Last but not least, I recon warhorn should have some skill that destroys projectile… maybe Cyclone?

Overload:

• While you are in a certain attunnement so as to get an overload, it could be helpful that skills cooldown would be reduced with proper traits selected. As an example, Water Overload cooldown should be reduced by Aquamancer’s Training trait.

PS: Warhorn sounds are great. Well done. I’m just wondering if these warhorn sounds are also available for any other profession. I’d rather they would be available only for
Tempest. :P

Tried it a bit to, but with the mind set of staying in an attunment. (Yeah I know it’s absolutely not ele like ). Took a set of rampager stat.

Here are my though :
Warhorn : There is a clear lack of reponsivness in this weapon, I was simply outruning every effect. In the end, be it with a scepter or a dagger the weapon didn’t fit me at all. (simply everything, be it skill CD, cast time or effect, was to slow).

Overload :
- Fire simply out perform any other attunment whirl finsher, burn, damage, might… honnestly eveb by doing only the “Beta PvE event”, everything melted in front.
- Water feltgood as a healing support, I think it’s in a good place atm.
- Air… felt disappointing. It didn’t felt like doing the attack interval shown. And limiting it to 3 foes felt even worst.
- Earth. I didn’t tried it so I won’t arg about it.

Shout :
I love them. Even the elite which doesn’t feel like an elite at all felt useful. To feel elite like rebound need to have a cut on it’s CD. Simply put, give it the CD of the traited gardian elite shout and we will be able to do something with this. Or let it affect more utilities per character (one simply ain’t enough for what’s done).

Aura share :
Aura share from shout/overload seemed to work perfectly fine with npc while doing the LS part but didn’t work at all on other player while doing beta event. I changed some traits in the mean time so I think it could be a bug of trait combination, didn’t test enough to be sure.

Overall, the elite spec felt pretty strong (for the mindset and gameplay I intended to do).

I’m trying tempest ele since yesterday.

The first thing i could say is: good job with warhorn, I really like it. You’ve added a blast and that’s great it was really needed! I usually play zerker blackline staff ele and this warhorn really made me want to play support cc, heal, boon share.

BUT that’s all… I’ve tried shouts and only flash freeze is worth using, the elite is half bugged in wvw … and the other are ever not worth it or the coolddown freeze me so I don’t wanna play it.

Not even talking about overload that I just .. don’t use at all. bAnimation are nice but .. I can’t stay in one attunement spamming one waiting for a skill that isn’t overbuffed or anything … would it be in 1v1 nor in wvw … I’ll just get killed for a normal skill cause .. that doesn’t give me enough for me to take the risk using it … (it would be something like the warior F1 I ay reconcider but it’s not). Cause yes, you’ve powered up the damage but .. it’s still awfully a long cast and a melee attack .. any other classes come hit you, do damage to you or even interrupt you and .. you have : awful cd + not much damage done cause interrupted + you’re dead cause to do correct damage with it you have to be zerk + melee…
I may forget things … but well ..

last thing to say is .. I would add some dispel to aura or I don’t know but I really feels like .. if I wanna be the support I choose to be .. I’m really vulnerable to condi .. I heal but I hardly dispel… I could change traits obviously but then I wouldn’t heal as I want to do.

To finish I tryed it zerker and .. it works quite good it’s fun but .. not as effective as double dagger or scepter fresh air :x

I just want to mention that warhorn air #5 is still a weak and boring skill. Offhand #5 skills are supposed to have strong effects (on a longer cooldown), something should be done to this skill.

I had a Marauder Tempest vs Marauder Tempest duel that doesn’t end. Reason? not because it can heal well, but because both of us basically had no damage despite wearing Marauder.

The most we can crit is 3k from Burning Speed, with the rest of the attack are below 800 damage.

Tempest needs a major damage buff and combat fluidity improvement. Cast time/animation are too slow and clunky (can’t cast insta-cast spells during Overload)

So it’s pretty much the exact same feedback that was given after first bwe. inb4 feedback was positive, have some damage adjustments.