Guild Wars 2

I play a hammer guardian and as you might know the hammer auto-attack creates a permanent light combo field which gives protection to allies standing inside. In combination with a blast finisher this leaves the party with a lousy retaliation buff. Although the permanent protection is nice I’m not sure if the team needs another defensive buff, especially when an elementalist can give offensive buffs.

Does a hammer guardian make it hard for elementalist to cast their fire fields and get the proper blasts off so they can provide the party with might/fury/vulnerability? Should I perhaps change weapon when I see I have an elementalist in the team using this build?

Having combo fields overlap is far from ideal and I believe it conflicts with other party members to provide the buffs they want. Perhaps Anet could make the fields stack so that finishers apply to all fields, although that might make it too strong.

This sometimes bothered me when I was in dungeons using my S/D ele to stack might and fury for the party as I had to watch the fields I blast and had no idea how fields would interact with each other…but I didn’t come across many guardians who increased the duration of symbols for it to be a problem for me since the original light field’s duration is quite short compared to my traited fire field which lasts alot longer.

If u see a fire field then u might want to make it a priority to blast it with hammer 2 instead of stacking protection. the small time window does allow the elementalist to execute multiple finishers for even more might and fury.

if u see an elementalist in dungeons using Scepter main hand, it might be worth asking if they run the trait Persisting Flames which increases the fire fields’ duration and rewards executing blast finishers on any fire field with added fury.

I don’t really have a strong opinion on this myself…the community here however might offer better insight

Great topic Noah!

The first field laid down is usually the one used for all the combo effects. As such, most might-stacking eles should have their fire field down before your hammer chain drops its symbol (at least for the initial round). Though, one notable exception is that fire fields seem to have priority over water fields.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combo_field

After that I think it is the responsibility of the one laying the fire field to make sure they don’t throw it on top of another, less useful (when blasted), field.

If you are really that concerned about it you could attempt to time your auto attack chain so that it does not place the symbol under the ele’s fire field. Just watch the party buffs to see when the ele switches to fire attunement and then avoid letting your chain complete until after the fire field is down. Another benefit is this should also help you be ready to blast said fire field for 3 more stacks of area might.

If I see a hammer guard in a dungeon, the first thing I tell him to do is swap to sword/focus. That is the guard meta; there is no reason whatsoever for him to be using hammer in dungeons. If he doesn’t, I kick him. Why? Because I have no tolerance for: 1) players who spam useless combo fields, and 2) players who don’t play the meta for their class. It’s the same for thieves and engis who use Stealth Fields when I’m stacking might; they get 1 warning, then /kick.

Anierna.6918:

If I see a hammer guard in a dungeon, the first thing I tell him to do is swap to sword/focus. That is the guard meta; there is no reason whatsoever for him to be using hammer in dungeons. If he doesn’t, I kick him. Why? Because I have no tolerance for: 1) players who spam useless combo fields, and 2) players who don’t play the meta for their class.

So how do new meta builds get developed if nobody is allowed to try different things?

It’s hard for me to not to resort to personal attacks in this matter, so I’ll just say I strongly disagree with you, that I now understand why we never agree on anything and, in your example, would rather be the one that got kicked than one of the remaining players that are stuck having to play that dungeon with you.

Good thing it takes 2 people to kick someone…

Anierna.6918:

If I see a hammer guard in a dungeon, the first thing I tell him to do is swap to sword/focus. That is the guard meta; there is no reason whatsoever for him to be using hammer in dungeons. If he doesn’t, I kick him. Why? Because I have no tolerance for: 1) players who spam useless combo fields, and 2) players who don’t play the meta for their class. It’s the same for thieves and engis who use Stealth Fields when I’m stacking might; they get 1 warning, then /kick.

You’re partially right that sword/focus is currently the “meta” for guardians. However, there is currently definitely a niche for hammer guardians. Go ahead and take a look on the guardian forums. I’m sure there will be many experienced guardians who will disagree with your /kick.

Perhaps it does not fit into your “speed clearing dungeon team composition” but in other cases hammer is better. Therefore I find your reply somewhat uninformative. Fractals and pugs is not something you do with a sword/focus because it requires the guardian to go fully offensive while most parties are looking for a support guardian. You seem to be very font of maximizing DPS but in that case you might as well not take a guardian in your team at all and replace them with a warrior, because that also seems to be the current meta.

The hammer with its permanent protection buff (so it’s not just a useless combo field as you like to call it) is the best defensive buff a guardian has while still maintaining DPS. Together with projectile finishers it can give the party all the defensive buffs they need.

I’m trying to figure out how to combine a hammer build while having an elementalist in the party. Your solution of simply kicking it is quite arrogant while I believe there are solutions out there that works in the interest of both classes.

To confirm what Da Beetas said, the first combo field laid is the one wich trigers the finisher effect, if you put a larger field on top of a smaller field it is possible to select the desired effect (note : it doesn’t work if the larger field was applied first) with some positioning but it does requiere coordination from your team.

Now for the Guardian issue, it isn’t realy an issue unless you can’t figure out the guardian hammer rotation, wich can be simplified to : 1,1,1,2,1,1,1,1,1,2,1,1,1…
3,4,5 are just utilities, so your guardian won’t spam those unless he doesn’t know his rotation.

A hammer Guardian can only keep his field up 100% of the time if he only uses his auto-attack and also if he took the trait to extend his symbols duration. Whenever he use his blast finisher you just have to wait his first 2 swings and times he puts his symbol back on the ground with his 3th slower smash you will be largely capable to lay down a fire field and allow the guardian to blast might instead of retaliate when he uses his mighty blow again.

Also Hammer builds favour consecration skills because it can support those with ring of warding to prevent ennemies from escaping, and good to know, 2 out 4 consecrations are fire fields. depending on his traits that guardian will be capable to generate between 1-2 Fire blasts with Purging Flames and 2-3 Fire blasts with Hallowed Ground.

Taking this information into consideration, an Elementalist can take control of the field but must be aware of the hammer guardian cycle to be effective in doing so. But it is doable, I play a staff elementalist with my guildmates and we got a hammer guardian in our team and I never had any issue figuring out when I could lay of my fields.

It just ask you to open your eyes instead of following the meta to be effective, but nothing close to impossible.

For dungeons, my group comp is always:

2x war
1x ele
1x mes/guard
1x anything except necro (& never 2nd mes or 2nd guard)

The guard is there for 3 reasons: 1) AoE reflects; 2) AoE condi cleanses; 3) AoE stab. Fire fields via PF & HG are bonuses, but are not needed if your group is using Embers. Burning and blinds are also just bonuses, not necessities.

A mesmer can fulfill those 3 roles as well. I would much rather bring a mes than have to deal with a guard who’s overwriting my fire fields. Which is why I’m so quick to kick; it isn’t hard to find a zerk guard or mes as long as you require a gear ping, and a lot of the time, zerk players happen to be in meta builds or something similar to them.

Mesmers can ruin your fire fields with useless feedbacks too

Basically, I would suggest avoiding the hammer AA if you see the ele trying to stack might. Hammer is unlikely to ever become meta precisely because of this problem— it’s too easy to screw up the best (or second best, next to banners) source of offensive buffs in the game.