Guild Wars 2

Please I’d like to know. I’ve played a solid amount of Ele (never thief because I hate this class from the bottom of my heart, mby that’s why I keep getting stomped by them, take this perspective into consideration please) anyways, I’d like to ask from a general point of view. Who wins? Ele vs Thief, and why?

Thx :p

It really depends on the build.
My D/D Bunker eats P/D Thieves alive and has a little bit of trouble with S/D thieves but not too much.

My S/D Burst is almost always an extremely close fight usually ends with me surviving with a sliver of health left and the thief downed.

The thief S/D build is made to keep S/D burst elementalist in check and if I do run into a thief who plays at the same skill level I do… I will lose.

Assuming you’re talking about D/D ele here:

It’s all about the auras versus a thief. I can’t stress this enough, both shocking aura and frost aura are your most important assets against them. In order of difficulty:

P/D condi
D/P
D/D
S/D
all other thief weapon sets

From my experience in the obsidian sanctum duelling arena, I’ve been told that elementalists are one of the hardest matchups for thieves generally, which is also what I’ve been experiencing as I hardly ever lose against them. Only P/D condi with dazing steal that can interrupt your ether renewal through stability can reliably beat you. Second hardest is a very methodic and tanky D/P thief.

TL;DR: Elementalist wins most of the time

Gokil.2543:

Assuming you’re talking about D/D ele here:

It’s all about the auras versus a thief. I can’t stress this enough, both shocking aura and frost aura are your most important assets against them. In order of difficulty:

P/D condi
D/P
D/D
S/D
all other thief weapon sets

From my experience in the obsidian sanctum duelling arena, I’ve been told that elementalists are one of the hardest matchups for thieves generally, which is also what I’ve been experiencing as I hardly ever lose against them. Only P/D condi with dazing steal that can interrupt your ether renewal through stability can reliably beat you. Second hardest is a very methodic and tanky D/P thief.

TL;DR: Elementalist wins most of the time

Hmm looks like you haven’t come across the full zerker P/D thief same traits as condi but full zerk ranges wittle you down then bursts with another set usually S/D. Still a doable fight but I find P/D power w/ S/D offset the hardest thieves to fight currently.

With a honorable mention to annoying S/D evade spam 30 acro thieves put right into same boat as PU mesmers and P/D thieves.

I have actually, but I don’t find them too threatening at all. Much like rifle warriors they cannot keep an ele at range effectively enough. As for S/D, it really got hit hard last patch. They can’t juke any of your stuff with infiltrator’s return anymore. They used to be extremely hard though I agree.

As far as advice against S/X thieves/thieves in general: If your opponent is decently good, he’ll shadow return/infiltrator’s return your burning speed every time. Flash on top of his platform just before you complete the slide. Also try to keep the fight as close to their return platforms at all times. If you don’t, there’s no way you’ll be able to kill them.

theoretically, a highly experienced thief can reset a fight as many times as he want until you make a mistake and die. In WvW mode.

I say you really have to pick where to fight to stand a chance. (or just hope the thief is bad)

I don’t get how a thief can loose to an ele. When the tide turns to the ele’s favour the thief can basically always stealth away and decide to run away or to re-engage combat (with eles abilities on CD in shouldn’t be that hard then).

I’d also say that D/D bunker is the only weapon-set/build that can effectively kill thieves because it has enough sustain to survive this game of leaving combat and re-engaging. S/D on the contrary can be outplayed easily and for thieves GC-eles are a piece of cake in general.

edit: pulupulu was faster ^^

Thief. Dont get me wrong, I was roaming today in WvW and I killed four thieves one after the other(always 1 vs 1, not 1 vs 4) and it worked out fine.

In WvW thieves are ridiculously overpowered because they can build up a lot of damage/health. Besides that they can hit npcs and animals while roaming and will go into stealth(both not possible in PvP). I´m running this build(link below) and still get hitted for 11k backstabs. See how op it is? Especially when they cast shadow refuge and you dont see it/them. If you dont cast your auras immedietly you are dead due to heatseeker spam. And lets dont forget that they can reset a fight whenever thy want.

http://de.gw2skills.net/editor/?fEAQJAoYhMmkbwx5gjDAkHm4CLiCPUeMTO2A-jEEBYgAYjgkIgUBAJfCiZPKrlhRs6KZlXBVbDT5CV7CWFTIyIGzaeI1G0QyAoPGA-w

Skenderbeu.9102:

Please I’d like to know. I’ve played a solid amount of Ele (never thief because I hate this class from the bottom of my heart

Everyone hates them. Especially when you fight 1 vs 1 and run under 50% hp, random thief will show up with their backstab. Game Over. For me(!) thieves have the lowest skill cap in the game.

However I would go with ele, because thieves are useless in PvE(compared to warriors, guardians, mesmers and eles) and WvW(Zerg ; @roaming they are kings).

Hmm, thank you guys

You can t kill any nearly decent thief…

Most www thieves are bad so people thinks that they can win…

But any decent thief player will be able to disengage at will with no risk of losing….expecially in www.

You can’t kill good thief with no matter how good you are. Because they have perma stealth and escape mechanisms.

who strikes first wins
dps vs dps

depends on what the thief is running. If you have defeated an s/d thief you should spit on his body and tell him that he should go uninstall. It’s one of the most disgusting builds you’ll probably ever fight against. Other then that, ele’s stand a pretty good chance against every other thief build from my knowledge.

If you’re a S/D ele, I don’t think you stand a chance. You desperately need Shocking Aura. It completely changes the nature of the fight.

When I’m going S/D fresh air, I just lose 25% chunks of health while the thief stealths and restealths. I literally never get a chance to respond, because I’ll die before the thief runs out of stealth.

You can’t kill any good thief If you don’t have High burst period. The broken perm steath mechanic can only be counter if and only if you burst the thief down before he resteath or if you interrupt him with daze right before he is about to hide. I also agree on a point made here that most WvW thieves are horrible or simply opportunistic killers that any average Ele player regardless what wep set or build he is using can easily defeat these thieves.

Thieves can’t be killed unless they fully commit. As far as WvW goes, forcing them to run away is good enough.

If the thief actually fights to the end, it really comes down to forcing shadow refuge without having to burn too many CDs.

Alternatively, make a Norn ele so you can also stealth open. I ran a fairly glass S/D 0/30/0/10/30 for awhile with leopard, and being able to open from stealth is all kinds of funny, even at the cost of once every 4 minutes. The benefit of having no good profession elite I guess (although fiery GS for maneuverability in battle has grown on me since I started trying D/D, but that’s strictly sPvP).

Coming from a d/d thief perspective.

Elementalists honestly weren’t an issue. I did meet a few d/d eles who were really good and a struggle, but if i didn’t kill you in my first two assaults combos, ie if you dodged avoided my initial combos and the follow ups i won’t stick around. I’ll just run and reset, since my ability to chain another combo is up in 20 seconds then comeback.

Downside is I have practically no toughness and 14k hps, but I can drop most classes with under 20k hps with a few backstab combos quite quickly, unless they were really good (or an engi with his elite up.)

Since i’m playing an ele now (thieves can’t do a great deal in zerg vs zerg/keep takes/defence), my advice for anyone fighting d/d thieves:

1) If you see a d/d thief they have to get into 900 as a rule to open with a steal+cloak and dagger+basilisk venom. Then they’ll get behind you and go for the backstab. Try to time a dodge roll/immunity right and it denies the initial burst entirely or hit mist as soon as you get stunned to deny follow up.

2) Thieves get no stability, knockdowns are our bane and very few carry more than 1 stunbreak.

3) D/d thieves need to hit things to stealth off, so stay mobile and lay down damage for them to walk through.

4) Keep swinging and backing up, you’ll hit them in stealth still.

5) A stealth from a cloak and dagger lasts 4 seconds.

6) Immobilise really ruins thieves day and stops heartseeker spammers.

7) If they do shadow refuge keep laying down the damage, but if you don’t get them don’t stick around as they’ll either be back at full health or long gone.

I’ll admit it’s not easy. Then again i’ve had warriors absolutely destroy my thief in 5 seconds, or shatter mesmers burst me down if they get the drop. It’s kind of an all or nothing situation.

Thieves have a very predictable style, especially D/D. Now during stealth a thief can:

1. Immediately backstab
-Create distance by either dodging or blinking.

2.Wait till stealth almost expires then backstabs
-Stealth usually last 4 seconds(3 seconds if it isn’t traited) and dodge when stealth is about to end.

3.Chaining cloak and dagger skill
-Be careful about these thieves since thieves who chain cloak and dagger will kitten the situation and backstab if they see a good opening. However, thieves will need to cloak and dagger at the end of the 3-4 seconds of stealth so just dodge.

Tips:

D/D Thieves main defensive mechanic is stealth and do not have easy or any access to stability, protection, or aegis like other classes have. They create their advantages by out-positioning their enemy through stealth. A common initiation used by thieves is the CnD+steal combo. If you counter(dodge) this then the thief is wide open to be bursted.

Also use your dodges sparingly or you’ll be easily backstabbed.

In the state the game is in right now the Thief wins hands down almost every single time. Elementalists are a gimmick profession in pvp right now.

oZii.2864:

Hmm looks like you haven’t come across the full zerker P/D thief same traits as condi but full zerk ranges wittle you down then bursts with another set usually S/D. Still a doable fight but I find P/D power w/ S/D offset the hardest thieves to fight currently.

With a honorable mention to annoying S/D evade spam 30 acro thieves put right into same boat as PU mesmers and P/D thieves.

Pretty sure I’ve fought the thief you’re talking about lol, or at least one of them.

But ya, thief beats ele with almost every weaponset. Broken stealth mechanics just give thieves too much control over the fight. Even if your build is good against the thief’s build or you are a significantly better player, they can reset the fight with stealth an unlimited amount of times until you finally make a mistake and can’t recover.

I feel like a lot of you people are having flashbacks here. Thieves may have easy access to resets, but there’s a limit. It’s really a bit silly to say thieves are still ‘broken as ever’, ‘unbeatable’, ‘easymode’ and what not.

I agree that when two unexperienced players face off, the thief has an advantage due to a much more straightforward playstyle, and will probably win most of the time. However when both are averagely skilled (not insane l33t pro, just some knowledge of each other’s class), it is not as one-sided a duel as much as you seem to believe it is.

S/D thieves have been hit hard by infiltrator’s return getting a cast time, D/x thieves have been hit hard by the nerf to infusion of shadow. In a proper 1v1 setting, especially in WvW, elementalist stands a very good chance. The classic D/D build has enough defense to not die to a thief burst, enough heals to top back up and use the thief’s reset as a reset of his own, and on top of that can produce enough CC and burst to finish a thief.

I agree they were once as you described, so many months ago before the countless nerfs. They have come down to earth though.

Two days ago I dueled the player that is consider to be the best among thieves, triggerless and wow he really surprised me with his playstyle. It was so different and unique from all the previous thieves I have encountered that even use his same weapon set and possibly same build/utilities. My point is you might have fought a lot of thieves and easily beat them but when you find that rare player that doesn’t rely heavily on constant/perm stealth to perform great that’s when you will have a real enjoyable challenge. You will also understand that both ele and thief have a lot of potential to excel but depends by a large margin by how good the player is.

Trigger is a friend of mine, and he’s quite good. Heidia next time you’re against us remind me to have you fight my other thief friend. You’ll have fun with it.

I find if I can’t beat a thief I can always tie them. I’ve yet to find a thief who consistently beats me.

dreztina.4820:

oZii.2864:

Hmm looks like you haven’t come across the full zerker P/D thief same traits as condi but full zerk ranges wittle you down then bursts with another set usually S/D. Still a doable fight but I find P/D power w/ S/D offset the hardest thieves to fight currently.

With a honorable mention to annoying S/D evade spam 30 acro thieves put right into same boat as PU mesmers and P/D thieves.

Pretty sure I’ve fought the thief you’re talking about lol, or at least one of them.

But ya, thief beats ele with almost every weaponset. Broken stealth mechanics just give thieves too much control over the fight. Even if your build is good against the thief’s build or you are a significantly better player, they can reset the fight with stealth an unlimited amount of times until you finally make a mistake and can’t recover.

Someone give this man a huge clap please. Couldn’t said it better myself.