Guild Wars 2

Hey everyone my main charachter is an elementalist, as you know they have lowest hp and armor. I though elementalist had good dps, but ive been reading that its worst DPS.
I spent 500 hours on my elementalist, getting so much gear, map exploration, dungeons, everything in the game. And i knew that ele is the squisyest but does it have the lowest DPS also? Or is it just trolls trolling the forums, its pretty depressing if they are very bad compared to other classes seeing as ive spent around 500 hours on it :/.

The class currently broken .DPS low , healing suck ,halves of traits useless . But my main still ele cuz i have a reason like u ,spent everything for the liltle one . U can searching for daphoenix build and learn about his playstyles , or run a S/d fresh air burst . Good luck with that

I’m also committed to Ele, I have 2 lv 80 eles in fact… But I’m starting to wonder if my necro might not be a good thing for me to turn my attention to. The problem I have with that is that many if my guild mates it at least this with whom I regularly play either run cobdition necro or something that makes heavy use if conditions. Because of this adding another condition necro (how I like to play the class) would be worthless as out damage would just override eachother.

I’m hoping that the October 15 update might breath some life into ele because while I know I am a highly proficient elementalist I can’t help but feel like no matter how good I am I am doomed to be sub par so long as I am in this class (Atleast that is the impression I’m getting from the rest if the forum).

To be honest ice never really felt that Ele was kitten but then I’ve never played eek quite the sane way as I have other classes so I cannot make a good comparison. I keep reading that zerk warriors can do much more dmg than a comparable Ele. My eek can hit for over 5k and I’m not running zerk, what is it a warrior can do that so badly dwarfs that?

mshinga.6540:

To be honest ice never really felt that Ele was kitten but then I’ve never played eek quite the sane way as I have other classes so I cannot make a good comparison. I keep reading that zerk warriors can do much more dmg than a comparable Ele. My eek can hit for over 5k and I’m not running zerk, what is it a warrior can do that so badly dwarfs that?

well, try this; a warrior hit 43k damage with One Hundred Blades on CoF first boss, thats at lvl 75, one skill, if by any chance you can top that with only one skill, on about the same cooldown, please show us. Heck, even Meteor shower on 3 times the CD cant hit that hard even if most of the meteors landed…

Fortus.6175:

mshinga.6540:

To be honest ice never really felt that Ele was kitten but then I’ve never played eek quite the sane way as I have other classes so I cannot make a good comparison. I keep reading that zerk warriors can do much more dmg than a comparable Ele. My eek can hit for over 5k and I’m not running zerk, what is it a warrior can do that so badly dwarfs that?

well, try this; a warrior hit 43k damage with One Hundred Blades on CoF first boss, thats at lvl 75, one skill, if by any chance you can top that with only one skill, on about the same cooldown, please show us. Heck, even Meteor shower on 3 times the CD cant hit that hard even if most of the meteors landed…

ele whirls for 70-80k.

Elementalist might be able to top that using Bolt to the Heart, Ember’s Might/Burning Rage, Stone Splinters, Shard of Ice+Piercing Shards lightning flash +arcane wave or churning earth with a brutal zerker build.

I can hit harder with my tanky warrior’s auto attacks than most of ele’s 40+ sec cooldown skills can hit for, so it’s not just people trolling, damage DOES indeed suck. Back in beta we had decent damage, but because idiots didn’t know how to dodge or simply walk out of the giant red circles, since you literally can walk out of them and not get hit because the attacks are so slow and obvious, we took a more than 60% cut to our overall damage on all our skills. So you can thank the terribad clueless noob players who can’t dodge highly telegraphed AoE attacks. We’ve been nerfed repeatedly.

You’ll hear thieves whine about being nerfed horribly since beta as well, but they’re spoiled and have it way easier than us. They went from being able to hit 17k damage on a backstab to 15k. WoW, such a huge nerf! Plus they have permastealth and omgwtfmobility while we have no active defenses or decent means of getting away after repeated nerfs to healing, condition cleansing, and mobility. They have literally nothing to complain about because they’re still ridiculously OP. At most we might be able to hit a 15k with churning earth or firegrab if we have full stacks of might and bloodlust, go full zerker, and our enemy is afk and glassy and doesn’t dodge the obvious attack.

But then we’ll die from a light fart in our direction being built to be that glassy, while a thief can take hidden killer and have 100% crit chance in full cavalier and valkyrie gear, and hit someone with 10k instant backstabs with no cooldown and just hide in stealth if they miss and try again until they do hit you with it. And if you do manage to hit them? I have about 3k armor on my thief in cav/soldier/valkyrie gear and 30 in shadow arts since stupidly the stealth trait also gives toughness. So thieves saying “oh we’re squishy if we can hit that hard and you can kill us easily L2p!” are full of crap and lying through their teeth. you can be tanky as hell and hit like a truck and hide in stealth and try over and over again. Yet we get nerfed repeatedly because people are stupid and cant dodge our obvious not from stealth attacks? I will normally NEVER post any of my builds on forums, but I don’t really care about my thief and never use it anymore so what the hell. Look at this and tell me if this looks squishy to you. http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYQQNAoYVlYmaPncS6E/5Ex2jeqTiy9wpGtpdFuKA-j0CB4fCiEEAEIQEJgZPFRjtqpIasabYKXAqYLq2aWQ2iWZVKgIGDA-w
I wish I could have stats like that on my ele.

Fortus.6175:

well, try this; a warrior hit 43k damage with One Hundred Blades on CoF first boss, thats at lvl 75, one skill, if by any chance you can top that with only one skill, on about the same cooldown, please show us. Heck, even Meteor shower on 3 times the CD cant hit that hard even if most of the meteors landed…

Try this:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Conjure_Fiery_Greatsword

Specifically this against a wall:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fiery_Whirl

And this (without a target, also against a wall):
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fiery_Rush

People are kittened. Stop listening to random pugs on LA. Ele is one of the highest DPS classes in the game, and outright the highest if you’re just looking at DPS that can be consistently maintained.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

People are kittened. Stop listening to random pugs on LA. Ele is one of the highest DPS classes in the game, and outright the highest if you’re just looking at DPS that can be consistently maintained.

Revelation post 2012; this generation is lost FT. The darkness. Illuminate!

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

People are kittened. Stop listening to random pugs on LA. Ele is one of the highest DPS classes in the game, and outright the highest if you’re just looking at DPS that can be consistently maintained.

Except if you actually play the class. Ele’s are the worst at everything and easy kills in this game. Reroll to something else if you don’t have a rally fetish.

Nikkinella.8254:

I can hit harder with my tanky warrior’s auto attacks than most of ele’s 40+ sec cooldown skills can hit for, so it’s not just people trolling, damage DOES indeed suck. Back in beta we had decent damage, but because idiots didn’t know how to dodge or simply walk out of the giant red circles, since you literally can walk out of them and not get hit because the attacks are so slow and obvious, we took a more than 60% cut to our overall damage on all our skills. So you can thank the terribad clueless noob players who can’t dodge highly telegraphed AoE attacks. We’ve been nerfed repeatedly.

You’ll hear thieves whine about being nerfed horribly since beta as well, but they’re spoiled and have it way easier than us. They went from being able to hit 17k damage on a backstab to 15k. WoW, such a huge nerf! Plus they have permastealth and omgwtfmobility while we have no active defenses or decent means of getting away after repeated nerfs to healing, condition cleansing, and mobility. They have literally nothing to complain about because they’re still ridiculously OP. At most we might be able to hit a 15k with churning earth or firegrab if we have full stacks of might and bloodlust, go full zerker, and our enemy is afk and glassy and doesn’t dodge the obvious attack.

But then we’ll die from a light fart in our direction being built to be that glassy, while a thief can take hidden killer and have 100% crit chance in full cavalier and valkyrie gear, and hit someone with 10k instant backstabs with no cooldown and just hide in stealth if they miss and try again until they do hit you with it. And if you do manage to hit them? I have about 3k armor on my thief in cav/soldier/valkyrie gear and 30 in shadow arts since stupidly the stealth trait also gives toughness. So thieves saying “oh we’re squishy if we can hit that hard and you can kill us easily L2p!” are full of crap and lying through their teeth. you can be tanky as hell and hit like a truck and hide in stealth and try over and over again. Yet we get nerfed repeatedly because people are stupid and cant dodge our obvious not from stealth attacks? I will normally NEVER post any of my builds on forums, but I don’t really care about my thief and never use it anymore so what the hell. Look at this and tell me if this looks squishy to you. http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYQQNAoYVlYmaPncS6E/5Ex2jeqTiy9wpGtpdFuKA-j0CB4fCiEEAEIQEJgZPFRjtqpIasabYKXAqYLq2aWQ2iWZVKgIGDA-w
I wish I could have stats like that on my ele.

Just to clear things up. We don’t have permastealth, if we attack we get a debuff that makes it so we can’t restealth within a period of time. We don’t hit for 15k in PvP situations, unless you count naked level 1s. We have mobility, no mechanic defense. Meaning a Thief has to actively position them self to avoid damage, thus we have mobility. That’s the point. Just so anyone isn’t confused about what a Thief actually does

Just a thing..

Ele has a BUG on fiery GS that does damage.
Also ele does something with conjured hammer….

Neiither of this are intended, or reliable in game.

They forgot to tell you how FGS requires a wall or the usual 40+ seconds CD skill to deal proper damage.

And how to do dps with hammer you need to autoattack melee that is neither good for parties and neither fun to play.

There is a third build relying spamming a single skill again on fire attunement.

Once again i think people should notice that those are only proofs of a class being broken since it gives up all mechanics and skills for the sake of a little situational effective dps.

aside from being boring as hell they require guardians to keep you alive.

If you enjoy playing like 11111111111F1111111111 ele may be fine…..(still inferior to warrior).

let see it this way: if as an ele you manage to do well/average+ in tPvP then you are much more skill than other player, at the same level, playing other classes.
All those superior DPS calculation are valid only against pve large totem boss.

I play ele because I love the gameplay and forget the fact I could faceroll anything playing other classes with significantly less effort

Facts:

(maximum dps)
- FA ele with support: 9k + burn
- FA ele without support: 11k + burn
- Staff ele in fire: 12k + burn
- LH ele: 14k (short duration)
- FGS ele: it’s over nine thousaaaaands

- warriors: 10k-11k

kthxbye

If you want to do more damage as an ele, you will have to take a look at your build first. My suggestions:

Try to get your crits up:
You don’t have to go 30 water 30 arcana, i would investing in air a bit more, going for +10% damage in air and +20% bolt to the hart. and get extra precision and crit damage.

Fury is a nice 20% bonus to precision. take the trait fury&swiftness on aura, and make sure to have at least 5 points in arcana for the Fury on atunement swap. This pretty much gives you permanent fury.

Another great trick is to invest in boon duration, doing this will alow you to make use of you fury even longer and stack’s of might will stack. (get the rune that gives you 3 stacks of might on weapon swap and you will soon be up to 16 stacks in combat)

Toughness is overrated, This counts only towards melee attacks, and since the ele is quite mobile, you usually have more too fear from magic/range attacks. so i recon it’s better to have less toughness and more damage. i suggest valkyrie armor (power/vitality/crit damage) and get some zerker trinkets or weapons.

I think the most important is you find a balance in your build, you don’t have to go full bunker/beserker/condi, you can find a balance in between. just pick your gear and trickets one piece at the time and find what works well.

One more thing, i think investing more then 10 points (+10% fire damage trait) in Fire is a bad option, you only gain 10 power per point invested, and some of the other atunement bonuses give you a +10% damage, which is much higher then the 100 power you gained by investing in fire.

My personal build is a mix of everything, but i do an average of 2k damage on auto attack and still have 19k health left for survivability…

Cries Of Sorrow.5864:

Fortus.6175:

mshinga.6540:

To be honest ice never really felt that Ele was kitten but then I’ve never played eek quite the sane way as I have other classes so I cannot make a good comparison. I keep reading that zerk warriors can do much more dmg than a comparable Ele. My eek can hit for over 5k and I’m not running zerk, what is it a warrior can do that so badly dwarfs that?

well, try this; a warrior hit 43k damage with One Hundred Blades on CoF first boss, thats at lvl 75, one skill, if by any chance you can top that with only one skill, on about the same cooldown, please show us. Heck, even Meteor shower on 3 times the CD cant hit that hard even if most of the meteors landed…

ele whirls for 70-80k.

You are mentioning FGS, right?
Well, how much will warrior do with it, have you tried? You know that it’s a pick-up weapon, right?
Also, this “trick” needs very specific conditions and CD on this conjure is 180 seconds…

Zelyhn.8069:

Facts:

(maximum dps)
- FA ele with support: 9k + burn
- FA ele without support: 11k + burn
- Staff ele in fire: 12k + burn
- LH ele: 14k (short duration)
- FGS ele: it’s over nine thousaaaaands

- warriors: 10k-11k

kthxbye

spreadsheet =/= real ingame situation

Findo Gask.4103:

Toughness is overrated, This counts only towards melee attacks

No, it counts towards all attacks, ranged, melee or “magic”. The only things that bypass the damage reduction from toughness are conditions.

talife.5927:

spreadsheet =/= real ingame situation

I couldn’t agree more!

So you have a way to add all these white numbers popping up on your screen and divide them by the time you see it took them to pop? I don’t.

That’s why we measure dps with spreadsheets.

Zelyhn.8069:

That’s why we measure dps with spreadsheets.

and sustain the delusion ele is a lot more than just viable when no one dared to play it in the last MLG.

While I do agree I can pull out some very decent dps against those world bosses (who cares anyway), Any random “spirit ranger/ CC warrior/ condi necro/etc…” is AA+ a couple CD away from easily negate the potential threat I might theoretically be with this spradsheet

I don’t understand your last sentence.

Anyway I was stating max dps, that is dps in a speedkill situation, not dps in PvP.

I doubt anyone is interested about dps figures in PvP !

Glitchfull.5826:

Nikkinella.8254:

I can hit harder with my tanky warrior’s auto attacks than most of ele’s 40+ sec cooldown skills can hit for, so it’s not just people trolling, damage DOES indeed suck. Back in beta we had decent damage, but because idiots didn’t know how to dodge or simply walk out of the giant red circles, since you literally can walk out of them and not get hit because the attacks are so slow and obvious, we took a more than 60% cut to our overall damage on all our skills. So you can thank the terribad clueless noob players who can’t dodge highly telegraphed AoE attacks. We’ve been nerfed repeatedly.

You’ll hear thieves whine about being nerfed horribly since beta as well, but they’re spoiled and have it way easier than us. They went from being able to hit 17k damage on a backstab to 15k. WoW, such a huge nerf! Plus they have permastealth and omgwtfmobility while we have no active defenses or decent means of getting away after repeated nerfs to healing, condition cleansing, and mobility. They have literally nothing to complain about because they’re still ridiculously OP. At most we might be able to hit a 15k with churning earth or firegrab if we have full stacks of might and bloodlust, go full zerker, and our enemy is afk and glassy and doesn’t dodge the obvious attack.

But then we’ll die from a light fart in our direction being built to be that glassy, while a thief can take hidden killer and have 100% crit chance in full cavalier and valkyrie gear, and hit someone with 10k instant backstabs with no cooldown and just hide in stealth if they miss and try again until they do hit you with it. And if you do manage to hit them? I have about 3k armor on my thief in cav/soldier/valkyrie gear and 30 in shadow arts since stupidly the stealth trait also gives toughness. So thieves saying “oh we’re squishy if we can hit that hard and you can kill us easily L2p!” are full of crap and lying through their teeth. you can be tanky as hell and hit like a truck and hide in stealth and try over and over again. Yet we get nerfed repeatedly because people are stupid and cant dodge our obvious not from stealth attacks? I will normally NEVER post any of my builds on forums, but I don’t really care about my thief and never use it anymore so what the hell. Look at this and tell me if this looks squishy to you. http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYQQNAoYVlYmaPncS6E/5Ex2jeqTiy9wpGtpdFuKA-j0CB4fCiEEAEIQEJgZPFRjtqpIasabYKXAqYLq2aWQ2iWZVKgIGDA-w
I wish I could have stats like that on my ele.

Just to clear things up. We don’t have permastealth, if we attack we get a debuff that makes it so we can’t restealth within a period of time. We don’t hit for 15k in PvP situations, unless you count naked level 1s. We have mobility, no mechanic defense. Meaning a Thief has to actively position them self to avoid damage, thus we have mobility. That’s the point. Just so anyone isn’t confused about what a Thief actually does

Actually you do. Stealth stacks. As long as you restack it before revealed kicks in, you can stay stealthed as long as you want. I’ve gotten up to nearly a minute abusing that broken mechanic. I don’t particularly like offhand pistol, but carry one with me just for trolling people with that. The majority of the time I prefer offhand dagger. They need to make it so that stealth doesn’t stack. And I can tank most damage, way better than an ele can anyway and with superior mobility and condition removal as well. And i can do more damage with 1 button press than an ele can by putting every single ability they have on cooldown. That was my whole point. Were you even paying attention?

Glitchfull.5826:

Just to clear things up. We don’t have permastealth, if we attack we get a debuff that makes it so we can’t restealth within a period of time. We don’t hit for 15k in PvP situations, unless you count naked level 1s. We have mobility, no mechanic defense. Meaning a Thief has to actively position them self to avoid damage, thus we have mobility. That’s the point. Just so anyone isn’t confused about what a Thief actually does

The debuff is less than 5 seconds.
I have done done duel with on my ele with 2 different thiefs in wvw. One backstab while the other one i believe is P/d. WIth the backstab one more than 50% of the fight he is in stealth, and everytime he pops out of it i lose at least 50% of my health. Several times i had him he simply pop shadow refuge and comes out full health again. How fun.
The P/D fight is less annoying, lots of teleports and hard to land any skill. Fortunately the condition cleaning shaved most of his damage off of me. btw, i dont see why people are complaining about condition removal for ele, i personally thing its just fine. Attune to water+evasive arcana+5 will get rid of 3 condition in less than 3 seconds. If thats not enough pop a earth armor and use ethereal renewal.

Cinder.2056:

Glitchfull.5826:

Just to clear things up. We don’t have permastealth, if we attack we get a debuff that makes it so we can’t restealth within a period of time. We don’t hit for 15k in PvP situations, unless you count naked level 1s. We have mobility, no mechanic defense. Meaning a Thief has to actively position them self to avoid damage, thus we have mobility. That’s the point. Just so anyone isn’t confused about what a Thief actually does

The debuff is less than 5 seconds.
I have done done duel with on my ele with 2 different thiefs in wvw. One backstab while the other one i believe is P/d. WIth the backstab one more than 50% of the fight he is in stealth, and everytime he pops out of it i lose at least 50% of my health. Several times i had him he simply pop shadow refuge and comes out full health again. How fun.
The P/D fight is less annoying, lots of teleports and hard to land any skill. Fortunately the condition cleaning shaved most of his damage off of me. btw, i dont see why people are complaining about condition removal for ele, i personally thing its just fine. Attune to water+evasive arcana+5 will get rid of 3 condition in less than 3 seconds. If thats not enough pop a earth armor and use ethereal renewal.

Why would you stand there and not attack when he drops shadow refuge? Use AoE attacks on it. He wont stand in the middle unless he’s stupid, so youll have to kind of guess where he is in it and hope you hit him.

Thief is designed pretty stupidly in this game. Worst design for a stealth class ever in any MMO I’ve ever played. In any decent game, stealth has to be used strategically and intelligently for an opening strike, and rarely in very few MMOs are you ever allowed to restealth while in combat. You have to break combat and run away if you want to restealth. And there are usually penalties when in stealth, not benefits like in this game. You usually have reduced movement speed in stealth, but stealth lasts until you first strike. And stealth breaks when you get damaged. That’s how it SHOULD be in this game. The way it’s designed here, isn’t fun for anyone except the person using and abusing it. It’s very high reward for no risk. There’s no intelligent play with it like in other games. You just fart out stealth whenever you want and if you screw up, restealth and try again till you get it right. Too much room for error and no penalties.

Thieves are not a problem when you take advantage of your surroundings. But I agree their stealth mechanics should be less brainlessly rewarding. On the counterparts, buff their defense mechanics.

MyPuppy.8970:

Thieves are not a problem when you take advantage of your surroundings. But I agree their stealth mechanics should be less brainlessly rewarding. On the counterparts, buff their defense mechanics.

I don’t know about buffing their defense. I only go into stealth for the guaranteed crit. If it weren’t for hidden killer, I wouldn’t stealth at all. I honestly don’t need it because of how tanky and mobile I am. Like I said, a lot of thief complains are total bull. You’re only squishy in full zerker, which is true on every class, except warrior now because they’ve been buffed to god mode tier since they whined about lack of sustainability when they were in full zerker. Meanwhile they’ve always had the best sustainability if they used anything besides a full zerk build. Now a decent warrior is unkillable without 10-20 people to take them down. That’s how much it typically takes to kill my warrior anyway. And I usually take several of them with me before I go if I choose to stay and fight.

Nikkinella.8254:

MyPuppy.8970:

Thieves are not a problem when you take advantage of your surroundings. But I agree their stealth mechanics should be less brainlessly rewarding. On the counterparts, buff their defense mechanics.

I don’t know about buffing their defense. I only go into stealth for the guaranteed crit. If it weren’t for hidden killer, I wouldn’t stealth at all. I honestly don’t need it because of how tanky and mobile I am. Like I said, a lot of thief complains are total bull. You’re only squishy in full zerker, which is true on every class, except warrior now because they’ve been buffed to god mode tier since they whined about lack of sustainability when they were in full zerker. Meanwhile they’ve always had the best sustainability if they used anything besides a full zerk build. Now a decent warrior is unkillable without 10-20 people to take them down. That’s how much it typically takes to kill my warrior anyway. And I usually take several of them with me before I go if I choose to stay and fight.

You may be right, you know that class better than me. I’ve always read thieves have poor defense/sustainability in which they compensate with mobility/stealth/high damage burst. I gave it a try (like lvl 3 before delete), but could never take my eyes away from my elementalist. The only thing I know is that’s a class I really enjoy fighting, as well as mesmers. Tricky classes make fun fights, when you have to think and move fast.

I wonder what would happen if they swapped warriors and eles base hp… Id love to see that one day

MyPuppy.8970:

Nikkinella.8254:

MyPuppy.8970:

Thieves are not a problem when you take advantage of your surroundings. But I agree their stealth mechanics should be less brainlessly rewarding. On the counterparts, buff their defense mechanics.

I don’t know about buffing their defense. I only go into stealth for the guaranteed crit. If it weren’t for hidden killer, I wouldn’t stealth at all. I honestly don’t need it because of how tanky and mobile I am. Like I said, a lot of thief complains are total bull. You’re only squishy in full zerker, which is true on every class, except warrior now because they’ve been buffed to god mode tier since they whined about lack of sustainability when they were in full zerker. Meanwhile they’ve always had the best sustainability if they used anything besides a full zerk build. Now a decent warrior is unkillable without 10-20 people to take them down. That’s how much it typically takes to kill my warrior anyway. And I usually take several of them with me before I go if I choose to stay and fight.

You may be right, you know that class better than me. I’ve always read thieves have poor defense/sustainability in which they compensate with mobility/stealth/high damage burst. I gave it a try (like lvl 3 before delete), but could never take my eyes away from my elementalist. The only thing I know is that’s a class I really enjoy fighting, as well as mesmers. Tricky classes make fun fights, when you have to think and move fast.

It’s a lie that thieves have poor defense. They can build to be tanky if they want and still put out a ton of damage. But most prefer to go full zerk and then complain about being squishy. The only advantage of being full zerk is you can sometimes 1 shot a lot of people if you’re lucky. I’d much rather take 2 or 3 hits to kill someone and be able to stand there and tank their hits. I’ve leveled a thief up twice. First was a human I made simply for that medium underboob armor, but then I got bored with the class and ended up deleting it. Remade it as an asuran because they have less obvious animations and because asurans roll on the floor and kick their feet when they laugh which is really funny. I only use the thief to troll people, so I wanted to be as trolly as possible and asurans are better at that than humans.

Oh, my human ele has just to stand gracefully and brush her hair amongst the corpses. Beauty and presence are troll enough for the vilains.

Elementalist has amazing damage. However, you need Lightning Hammer and FGS. There’s a Staff build that does pretty high damage too but you’re in Fire Magic 90% of the time

I’m not a fan of LH. Not graceful enough in my opinion.

Nikkinella.8254:

Cinder.2056:

Glitchfull.5826:

Just to clear things up. We don’t have permastealth, if we attack we get a debuff that makes it so we can’t restealth within a period of time. We don’t hit for 15k in PvP situations, unless you count naked level 1s. We have mobility, no mechanic defense. Meaning a Thief has to actively position them self to avoid damage, thus we have mobility. That’s the point. Just so anyone isn’t confused about what a Thief actually does

The debuff is less than 5 seconds.
I have done done duel with on my ele with 2 different thiefs in wvw. One backstab while the other one i believe is P/d. WIth the backstab one more than 50% of the fight he is in stealth, and everytime he pops out of it i lose at least 50% of my health. Several times i had him he simply pop shadow refuge and comes out full health again. How fun.
The P/D fight is less annoying, lots of teleports and hard to land any skill. Fortunately the condition cleaning shaved most of his damage off of me. btw, i dont see why people are complaining about condition removal for ele, i personally thing its just fine. Attune to water+evasive arcana+5 will get rid of 3 condition in less than 3 seconds. If thats not enough pop a earth armor and use ethereal renewal.

Why would you stand there and not attack when he drops shadow refuge? Use AoE attacks on it. He wont stand in the middle unless he’s stupid, so youll have to kind of guess where he is in it and hope you hit him.

Thief is designed pretty stupidly in this game. Worst design for a stealth class ever in any MMO I’ve ever played. In any decent game, stealth has to be used strategically and intelligently for an opening strike, and rarely in very few MMOs are you ever allowed to restealth while in combat. You have to break combat and run away if you want to restealth. And there are usually penalties when in stealth, not benefits like in this game. You usually have reduced movement speed in stealth, but stealth lasts until you first strike. And stealth breaks when you get damaged. That’s how it SHOULD be in this game. The way it’s designed here, isn’t fun for anyone except the person using and abusing it. It’s very high reward for no risk. There’s no intelligent play with it like in other games. You just fart out stealth whenever you want and if you screw up, restealth and try again till you get it right. Too much room for error and no penalties.

Who said i didnt try to force him out? Most smart thieves dont stay in shadow refuge for long.

It would be nice to not be forced into conjures to get “good” damage, broken mechanic or not.

People say that this class/build is dead but I ran into a D/D ele today in WvW and she flat out destroyed me and 2 other players. This was on my Warrior, Thief and Mesmer. I was simply amazed on how skilled of a player she was.

Don’t trust what “people” say

FinalPatriot.8034:

People say that this class/build is dead but I ran into a D/D ele today in WvW and she flat out destroyed me and 2 other players. This was on my Warrior, Thief and Mesmer. I was simply amazed on how skilled of a player she was.

Elementalist wasn’t nerfed as hard in WvW as it was in Spvp, it’s still a very strong skirmisher in WvW. Though most people on the ele boards seem clueless somewhat made me wonder what took the fantasy out of these people was it perhaps the industrial revolution?

@FinalPatriot.8034

Do you remember which server this ele was from? (If it’s SoR – I can think of a few d/d ele players with said amount of skill… and most are still using 0/10/0/30/30).

Flux Qemist.6712:

@FinalPatriot.8034

Do you remember which server this ele was from? (If it’s SoR – I can think of a few d/d ele players with said amount of skill… and most are still using 0/10/0/30/30).

Actually, she was from SoR! I wish I could have spoken to her about that spec. What is this version ur talking about because I was using the old “tank” spec and it wasn’t all that fun.

mshinga.6540:

It would be nice to not be forced into conjures to get “good” damage, broken mechanic or not.

Staff and LH are equally viable, despite what Zelyhn might try to tell you. I’ve run the numbers myself and they’re pretty much identical. In fact, LH is worse if you account for the fact that it’s not 100% uptime over a longer fight, or multiple shorter ones in rapid succession.

Dreysman, if you’re happy with your elementalist then stick with it. If you play it well it will be capable of doing everything except the very top end of PvP. Whenever there is a class balancing patch the PvP heirachy moves up and down anyway. By the time you master another class at level 80 it might have problems of its own.

Nikkinella.8254:

Glitchfull.5826:

Nikkinella.8254:

I can hit harder with my tanky warrior’s auto attacks than most of ele’s 40+ sec cooldown skills can hit for, so it’s not just people trolling, damage DOES indeed suck. Back in beta we had decent damage, but because idiots didn’t know how to dodge or simply walk out of the giant red circles, since you literally can walk out of them and not get hit because the attacks are so slow and obvious, we took a more than 60% cut to our overall damage on all our skills. So you can thank the terribad clueless noob players who can’t dodge highly telegraphed AoE attacks. We’ve been nerfed repeatedly.

You’ll hear thieves whine about being nerfed horribly since beta as well, but they’re spoiled and have it way easier than us. They went from being able to hit 17k damage on a backstab to 15k. WoW, such a huge nerf! Plus they have permastealth and omgwtfmobility while we have no active defenses or decent means of getting away after repeated nerfs to healing, condition cleansing, and mobility. They have literally nothing to complain about because they’re still ridiculously OP. At most we might be able to hit a 15k with churning earth or firegrab if we have full stacks of might and bloodlust, go full zerker, and our enemy is afk and glassy and doesn’t dodge the obvious attack.

But then we’ll die from a light fart in our direction being built to be that glassy, while a thief can take hidden killer and have 100% crit chance in full cavalier and valkyrie gear, and hit someone with 10k instant backstabs with no cooldown and just hide in stealth if they miss and try again until they do hit you with it. And if you do manage to hit them? I have about 3k armor on my thief in cav/soldier/valkyrie gear and 30 in shadow arts since stupidly the stealth trait also gives toughness. So thieves saying “oh we’re squishy if we can hit that hard and you can kill us easily L2p!” are full of crap and lying through their teeth. you can be tanky as hell and hit like a truck and hide in stealth and try over and over again. Yet we get nerfed repeatedly because people are stupid and cant dodge our obvious not from stealth attacks? I will normally NEVER post any of my builds on forums, but I don’t really care about my thief and never use it anymore so what the hell. Look at this and tell me if this looks squishy to you. http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYQQNAoYVlYmaPncS6E/5Ex2jeqTiy9wpGtpdFuKA-j0CB4fCiEEAEIQEJgZPFRjtqpIasabYKXAqYLq2aWQ2iWZVKgIGDA-w
I wish I could have stats like that on my ele.

Just to clear things up. We don’t have permastealth, if we attack we get a debuff that makes it so we can’t restealth within a period of time. We don’t hit for 15k in PvP situations, unless you count naked level 1s. We have mobility, no mechanic defense. Meaning a Thief has to actively position them self to avoid damage, thus we have mobility. That’s the point. Just so anyone isn’t confused about what a Thief actually does

Actually you do. Stealth stacks. As long as you restack it before revealed kicks in, you can stay stealthed as long as you want. I’ve gotten up to nearly a minute abusing that broken mechanic. I don’t particularly like offhand pistol, but carry one with me just for trolling people with that. The majority of the time I prefer offhand dagger. They need to make it so that stealth doesn’t stack. And I can tank most damage, way better than an ele can anyway and with superior mobility and condition removal as well. And i can do more damage with 1 button press than an ele can by putting every single ability they have on cooldown. That was my whole point. Were you even paying attention?

Whatever you want to believe I’ve gotten around 24sec of stealth, but that was by blowing everything I had, leaving me extremely open, which it was just a test. Anyways, go back to your make believe world and leave the ele thread alone from hate posts. I was merely just clearing things up.

FinalPatriot.8034:

People say that this class/build is dead but I ran into a D/D ele today in WvW and she flat out destroyed me and 2 other players. This was on my Warrior, Thief and Mesmer. I was simply amazed on how skilled of a player she was.

I find this hard to believe. Were you all upleveled or something? Were you not running cons while she was? Were you in blues and greens? Were you all just running really crappy builds?

I mean, I don’t want to sound mean or anything, but there’s simply no way you should have been destroyed by that—the warrior, thief, and Mesmer are among the strongest WvW classes, and any single one if built right should be able to completely destroy a perfectly played elementalist. Heck, apart from a few bursts, the elementalist (especially D/D tanky roamer types) has trouble out damaging the Warrior’s healing signet.

Lina.9640:

FinalPatriot.8034:

People say that this class/build is dead but I ran into a D/D ele today in WvW and she flat out destroyed me and 2 other players. This was on my Warrior, Thief and Mesmer. I was simply amazed on how skilled of a player she was.

I find this hard to believe. Were you all upleveled or something? Were you not running cons while she was? Were you in blues and greens? Were you all just running really crappy builds?

I mean, I don’t want to sound mean or anything, but there’s simply no way you should have been destroyed by that—the warrior, thief, and Mesmer are among the strongest WvW classes, and any single one if built right should be able to completely destroy a perfectly played elementalist. Heck, apart from a few bursts, the elementalist (especially D/D tanky roamer types) has trouble out damaging the Warrior’s healing signet.

This couldn’t have been at the same time. One warrior stun and the ele goes down. the thief must of been terrible while the mesmer was probably the only condi which is easily cleansed with 30 in water.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

mshinga.6540:

It would be nice to not be forced into conjures to get “good” damage, broken mechanic or not.

Staff and LH are equally viable, despite what Zelyhn might try to tell you. I’ve run the numbers myself and they’re pretty much identical. In fact, LH is worse if you account for the fact that it’s not 100% uptime over a longer fight, or multiple shorter ones in rapid succession.

Guang I agree that staff is strong

But you still have to prove to me that your rotation calculation is correct.
Again, for a usual rotation with full traits (cd reduction, persisitng flames), we do:
- one lava font, hitting 5 times = 296 * 5 = 1480
- three fireballs = 314 * 3 = 942
- wait 0.6s for lava font cd to come back up (usually we start to cast a fireball but it is interrupted by the lava font cast. This is a dps gain compared to cast 4 fireballs in total)
Total damage: 2422
Total time: 5.2 seconds
Damage per second: 466

Note for everybody to understand: this is just tooltip damage at lvl 80, Guang then uses a formula to scale it up with stats and buffs.

But Guang does not use the same rotaton calculation, and he gets a number for tooltip damage that is mistakenly too high: 528

The difference is big. So either you explain to me how you get this rotation number and show me why mine is wrong, or you are over estimating staff’s damage.

FrownyClown.8402:

Lina.9640:

FinalPatriot.8034:

People say that this class/build is dead but I ran into a D/D ele today in WvW and she flat out destroyed me and 2 other players. This was on my Warrior, Thief and Mesmer. I was simply amazed on how skilled of a player she was.

I find this hard to believe. Were you all upleveled or something? Were you not running cons while she was? Were you in blues and greens? Were you all just running really crappy builds?

I mean, I don’t want to sound mean or anything, but there’s simply no way you should have been destroyed by that—the warrior, thief, and Mesmer are among the strongest WvW classes, and any single one if built right should be able to completely destroy a perfectly played elementalist. Heck, apart from a few bursts, the elementalist (especially D/D tanky roamer types) has trouble out damaging the Warrior’s healing signet.

This couldn’t have been at the same time. One warrior stun and the ele goes down. the thief must of been terrible while the mesmer was probably the only condi which is easily cleansed with 30 in water.

It might actually be plausible if she had food buffs+25 stacks of bloodlust+Guard Leech/Fortitude and maybe orb buffs. Perfectly played elementalists can be real monsters. It’s always awesome to meet one, it’s like meeting a dinosaur: fascinating and dangerous (but extinct species). And I think she had what you all three may lack: experience and survival through constant nerfs.

FinalPatriot.8034:

People say that this class/build is dead but I ran into a D/D ele today in WvW and she flat out destroyed me and 2 other players. This was on my Warrior, Thief and Mesmer. I was simply amazed on how skilled of a player she was.

And you know why? Because less skilled players has already given up on the class, so there’s much bigger percentage of “decent+” Elementalists. And I think that’s the main reason of the nerfs, because the class “seems” powerful, but actually, its players are….

Lina.9640:

FinalPatriot.8034:

People say that this class/build is dead but I ran into a D/D ele today in WvW and she flat out destroyed me and 2 other players. This was on my Warrior, Thief and Mesmer. I was simply amazed on how skilled of a player she was.

I find this hard to believe. Were you all upleveled or something? Were you not running cons while she was? Were you in blues and greens? Were you all just running really crappy builds?

I mean, I don’t want to sound mean or anything, but there’s simply no way you should have been destroyed by that—the warrior, thief, and Mesmer are among the strongest WvW classes, and any single one if built right should be able to completely destroy a perfectly played elementalist. Heck, apart from a few bursts, the elementalist (especially D/D tanky roamer types) has trouble out damaging the Warrior’s healing signet.

quite a typical case. I own 99% wvw players on my ele… even to a point I am starting to think maybe indeed ele is OP. Then once every ~10-20h of wvw roaming I encounter a player who totally owns me we make a party I relog to my thief and usually on my thief I totally own him or sometimes we draw. Then I relog back to my ele and again I own 99% players until I find next player who know how to play this game.

Moral:
if 3 players (even in greens) are unable to kill a tanky dd ele in 3v1 it means those players have absolutely no idea about this game. As Lina wrote, warrior, mesmer and thief are proffesions that will win agains an dd ele if the skill on both side is comparable.
If any of you would have 1/2 of the skill that ele had you would win 3v1 in lesss than 10s – the problem is all of you combined had 1/5 of her skill

All you guys in this thread saying ele is fine…
Take a look at the last two “big” tournaments Guild Wars 2 was in, PAX and MLG. You know how many eles were in there competing at top level? I bet you don’t because if you did you’d realize how stupid you all sound.

Answer is zero.