Guild Wars 2

But rather, every other class should be nerfed.

I like how weak Eles are. It makes things challenging. Other classes bulldoze their way through everything. Eles have to be quick and tactical and be constantly deciding their best choice of action for any situation. Eles move and roll and combo while other classes spam 2-3 buttons. I can’t even play other classes because theyre so boring compared to the Ele even if they are better.

Wat?

‘I like how weak Eles are’?

Troll right?

Nah man. It’s fun. I have to cycle through attunements carefully and dodge and combo into my AoE fields at the right time and constantly move so I don’t get hit by anything and die in seconds. Plus, why else are you playing the ele if you don’t like the challenge? What are you? Masochistic?

Other classes, it’s a lot more simple. You don’t have to do much to achieve the same or better results than the Ele. But that’s what makes it boring. You don’t have to try as hard and that makes it boring.

I like a challenge. I like becoming more skillful and getting better everytime I play. It’s why I’ve played a lot of online action games and generally liked than more than MMOs.

So, yes, I do think every other class should be nerfed until all classes are challenging and therefore, fun.

Well, we need more base HP and that is a fact. Increasing it would enable us to use more various builds. And maybe some base damage tweak. We mainly need fixes in skills though, maybe some in traits, too.

Thing like Ride The Lightning, unjustified ‘misses’ etc. Like Dragon tooth – usually useless as in order to hit a target you either need to be in melee range or the target needs to be ranged (and it does not do much of a damage). Stuff like this.

I do agree the class is challenging and highly mobile and for me it is tons of fun to play. I do not want it to be less challenging just fixed.

And it is not weak – some things just do not work.

Fixed. Yeah. That would be nice. But I don’t want a higher base HP. I want everyone’s burst damage to be nerfed in general. Damage over time is much funner than dying in 2 seconds. I hate getting caught without any stunbreakers and dying because its all on CD. The low HP isn’t that big of a problem. It’s everyone else’s stupid burst that is.

Sure, some changes would be nice here and there. But imo, it’d be funner if everyone was just nerfed and we did away with bursts that killed you in 2 seconds. It’s not fun at all to die in 2 seconds because you didn’t react quick enough or your stunbreakers are on CD.

damage isn’t where elementalist is having issues but its more or less very undefined roles in weapon play style and casting mechanics that seem… not correct

first thing i have to point out is the attunements are not doing what they should be doing, anet originally described the attunements with very clear defined roles, you can clearly see now this is not the case

the next issue is weapons in there current state are very inflexible, a double dagger elementalist is forced to be in melee, a staff elementalist has an utter lack of melee abilities
people in the past have suggested let elementalists switch weapons but i disagree, we would benefit if we just turned 1 or 2 of the attunements into a melee or ranged attunement for daggers/staffs

alot of our abilities are too hard to aim especially with latency intolerant players, such as dragons tooth, flame grab or shatterstone, the damage however is quite fine at the moment

other classes are simply too simple to play compared, resulting in an unusual learning curve when starting an elementalist

now to deal with the elephant in the room since day 1 BWE

conjured weapons
i honestly cannot fathom why these utilities exist at the moment, completely utterly useless outside of a few very niche situations (such greatsword and an enemy trapped in a corner), breaks the flow of combat and wastes utility slots, conjured weapons need to be completely redesigned

Elementalists are not as easy to solo PvE with. But a defensively specced d/d Elementalist can easily fight several people at once and either win or escape before death 100% of the time. I do not think it is actually possible for an elementalist to die in a 1v1 with two players of equal skill.

Im sure you’ve seen some of the d/d videos by now. Theives may have it easier but and come in at a close second with their 10 second stealth escape but there is no way to ever kill an elementalist that has mist, teleport, and ride the lightning.

Combine all that with lots of CC and 5 different ways to heal up to 15k HP in a few seconds and you have an amazing roaming class.

I still want buffs. But we dont need them for PvP.

i doubt we’d need more hp if our skills worked like they were supposed to, I think anet shouldn’t buff anything til the bugs are fixed. The downed state improvement was fantastic though.

In order for us to crit high enough to burst down our target, we have to roll around with 12k hp. And even then, it’s nowhere near as easy as a non-80 of another class. In WvW, it’s almost impossible to be a roamer. I have over 5k kills and I still don’t know how to survive half the time. I can’t stand playing anything other than S/D unless I’m with a group, in which case I use a staff for huge crits. I’m using knight’s exalted, and I guess I’d have better luck with zerker’s for burst, but I dunno.

Yeah, but see, if everyone’s damage/burst was nerfed, it wouldn’t matter as much. It’d be ok to roam around with 12khp and you wouldn’t have to worry about dying to one kittening backstab. Burst is the main balance problem and classes doing too much damage and it ends the fight too quickly.

I mostly agree. I don’t feel all classes should be as hard as ele, but I do feel there are some balance issues that are more other class are too simple/strong than ele is to weak. Although, I do feel eles could be improved in some areas, but it would be insane to try and boost us to some of other professions.
And I do like eles being squishy, I just feel their offense doesn’t make up for it. You can be a tank and pile conditions, cc, or team support if you want. Or you can be a critical nuker than the even the rabbit can 1 hit (sure makes things more interesting =p). In PvE I go all out Berserker and I don’t feel like I am dying a ton because of it tbh. Although if my warrior did same thing, he’d tank better, but he is suppose to.
Personally I think ele is one of best to play because it has so much going on. I like having 20 weapon skills and combing them and buffing teams in dungeons. I wouldn’t mind being more of a dps guy if they tweaked it though.

So yah, other professions may need more nerfs than eles needs buffs. But I have a feeling ele will always be one of most challenging to play greatly.

I really don’t think that having higher damage or health or lower cooldowns would diminish the elementalist playstyle; it would just make it more effective.

And frankly, it’d be easier to buff one profession rather than nerf everyone else.

The problem I have with Elementalist is that the base HP is just way too low to justify the squishiness.
I’d also love to see some better damage in our auto attacks especially scepter feels super weak compared to others. The other stuff is just fine.
But then again I’d rather love to see the other classes struggle to learn their class as well as a newcomer to the Elementalist. The thief especially deals way way way too much auto attack damage..if you were to make it more challenging by reducing the numbers on thiefs autoattack that would make it more appealing even for me to play(mostly play my Ele because it is much much more fun). Not to bash the thief but that is the most recent class I tried in Heart of the Mist to check the numbers…if I were to try that with greatsword warrior I’d come to same conclusions as well(would explain why so many run around with that boring weapon^^).
But..I digress.
The question is: Is Ele really okay as it is right now? I’d say no because you’re rather limited in what you can play. As Kietay mentioned “a defensively specced d/d Elementalist” is all you can play in sPvp unless you count bunker..which is rather boring to be honest. There are some obscure S/D builds out there that actually work but again being super defensively is not appealing to everyone…some people expect the Elementalist to be somewhat like their GW1 counterpart. Of course I’m not saying it HAS to be this way(we basicly have no entitlement….which is fine..just sayin). But I’d love to be able to play ranged like a Mesmer dealing damage without going all out defensive.
Our build variations are rather limited and some of our traits have no synergy with other attunements. Now if Lingering Elements would help with that…

That’s all I could add to that. I love my Ele, I can play her well but I just dislike that I have to restrict myself to a certain play style.

Honestly , got 3 lvl 80s.

My ele is as clearly as the sun on a bright shinny day, the weakest of the 3.

So yeah , i would like her buffed.

Im still picking my main , so this does not affect me much anyway.

This really just a post about how hard PvE should be, rather than whether elementalists are good or bad. OP is just using eles as the standard for how hard PvE should be for all the classes.

Anyway, buffing eles wouldn’t necessarily mean a change in play style. It’d just mean that using the same complex style, they should be able to achieve results similar to other classes. People aren’t calling for it to be dumbed down to a 2-3button class.

We need some love with the Staff – Air mainly. Air is very weak on Staff and does not synergize with any of the other trait lines on Staff. Water is also somewhat weak but at least it has 2 semi-decent heals. Air has one auto, one weak blind attack on a long CD, and that’s about it. Its utility is bad for anything other than swiftness buffs. Air 2 needs work, Air 3 should be a knockdown or stun, Air 4 is fine, and Air 5 is on a very long CD and does not work reliably. Also, lightning field is meh. The trait bases are somewhat weak too and fail to synergize well at all. The line is weak also when compared to D/D air or S/D air or even S/F or D/F air, all of which are vastly better.

eh… the squish is fine. its a scholar class. its the lack of cannon in the glass cannon. In general, i like the skill sets of all the weapons availible. Its the power scaling that makes me giggle. Ascalonian Elementalists are scary so everyone kills them first. Everyone also likes to kill a normal ele first just because its an easy kill.

That being said, a power ratio boost on scepter/staff weapons would be nice. Any smart person would just walk out of the aoe so minus well make it hurt while you’re in it for the 2 seconds.

Also. Tornado, great idea, not a great implementation in its current state. When i see one it means. FREE KILL. EVERYONE KITTEN ON IT NOW. Its damage output is not impressive and has no defensive stats. I suggest that either you boost the damage by massive amounts or add a projectile reflection to it.

They should just bring back the elementalist we saw at gstar last year, but at .85 strength.

Fixing the 100+ bugs we have and reassessing the HPs of all classes would be a good start.

<personal opinion>

Did it occur to all those whining about Eles needing a buff that maybe it’s your build skills that require a buff, rather than the class itself? (If you are min/maxing then slap yourself and try again)

I’m not having a go at anyone as such but I do know that my build is working for me very nicely and I can’t say that I’ve ever felt massively underpowered or overly squishy.

My only issue is enemies that spam heavy DoT (think Hyleks and rapid firing poison darts). I have to be very careful to space my condition removal skills to ensure I survive it without getting caught out by cool downs. I am fine with this as every class should have a weakness somewhere…

Note I don’t think Ele’s will ever be able to wander around WvW without a care…nor do I think they should be able to, that’s just not in the spirit of what an Ele is. An Ele will always be most effective in a group, and so it should be.

</personal opinion>

SecondtoNone.7549:

But rather, every other class should be nerfed.

I like how weak Eles are. It makes things challenging. Other classes bulldoze their way through everything. Eles have to be quick and tactical and be constantly deciding their best choice of action for any situation. Eles move and roll and combo while other classes spam 2-3 buttons. I can’t even play other classes because theyre so boring compared to the Ele even if they are better.

Speak for yourself sir

People have put in their time with Ele and have not been rewarded for it. People have done their due diligence as far as learning the class and yet keep being told it’s a ltp issue.

I feel as if the elementalist remained the same as it was in beta, then YOU would be one of the main ones on your knees praising Anet for creating such a great class. The thief is what the elementalist should be in essence, as far as damage and mobility goes.

I still can’t comprehend why Anet felt that decreasing the Elementalist’s damage was justified and a practical idea

Imo, the only real problem I have is in pvp and w3. PVE is fine, even if we kill stuff slower. So, IF WE NERF EVERYONE ELSE so that combat isnt a boring spam 2-3 skills snoozefest for other classes, then it’s an INDIRECT BUFF to the ELE. The ele will now stand toe to toe with other characters.

I am not hating on the ele or telling people to L2P (because hell, ele is hard. I still have tons of room for improvement and die so easily in pvp). What I would like is that everyone was on an equal playing ground but rather than doing it through buffs, I’d rather they did it through nerfs (on everyone but ele).

All an Ele can do right now is Bunker Down and wait for better days

Yeah, but if everyone was nerfed, we could use more builds. :]

Eles aren’t as weak as people say. If you know how to use your skills you can survive pretty long. And I only have 13K hp

The thing that annoy me the most about eles is that a lot of skill take so long to charge (and they are based on a single location), a lot of your skills will miss, unless your enemy just stands still. Perfect example: Dragon’s Tooth; It takes so long for the skill to drop your enemy is long gone when it lands.

I think what would help Elementalist the most is faster cast times. Been running around with S/D for a while, I can do decent damage but fighting can be hard because it takes so long for skills to hit and when you’re running from melee foes to keep them from beating the heck out of you skills like Dragon’s Tooth will never hit

Cast times is something I can definitely agree with. And fixing all our bugs, of course. Maybe if the air attunement was looked at too for staff (i like air staff spells but it definitely doesn’t represent what they initially portrayed about the air attunement)

But my point is that I don’t want big buffs to the ele that change how we play. I don’t want every character to be able to burst and kill each other in 2 seconds. It’s not fun dying in 2 seconds—no matter what character you play. Something needs to happen to burst damage and just frankly dying so kitten quickly in this game.

I’m not saying I want super long drawn out battles, but I’m sure you guys get what I mean.

@Centrix: Pretty much the nail on the head. Even in PvE it can be hard to hit stuff, especially melee foes when you need to constantly be moving so they don’t slug you. Ele skills take too long to cost/too long to come around for the damage they do, in my opinion (my Ele is level 80 with magic find green equipment right now, but this is going based on my experience).

Even if you don’t reduce cast times, for skills like Dragon’s Tooth, make the ability instant but change it so you’re casting the whole time and can move. I don’t know how much that would help but seems like a step in the right direction

Eles definitely need a buff. Pleaaase.

I can understand that some people just like to play harder games, but to be honest, I don’t like the idea of just nerfing/adjusting everyone else to Elementalist’s difficulty level. Besides, if one imagines that people play Elementalists because they like a challenge, I would think that upping the difficulty of other classes to that of Elemantalists would make those who don’t necessarily want that level of challenge rather upset.

Granted, it might be a nice idea for PvP, but as someone who only does PvE I find my Ele the hardest of my characters to play and would be very unhappy if all my other characters got their difficulty cranked up to that level. Sometimes I just want to be able to run into that cave full of aggressive, fast respawning mobs by myself without feeling like my character is being suicidal, y’know? xD I remember the time on my Ele that I followed a Warrior into a cave full of Destroyers . . . gosh that was depressing, lol.

I do see where you are coming from OP, and I sympathize, but I’d personally give this idea a thumbs down.

Buffing one profession instead of nerfing everyone else is not only easier but also creates less QQ.

Elementalists are in a position where they need a buff.

Fire/Air lines need help. Don’t even get me started on when I invested in the Grounded GM trait and didn’t get any increase off of Updraft.

Earth comes in second place to Water/Arcana lines. It’s decent, but needs a bit of help as well.

There is a lack of complexity to individual skills that makes an individual element useless if you use it exclusively for more than 5-6 seconds in a fight. The cooldowns also leave you at a ridiculous disadvantage that no other professions suffer from when they do not swap.

There is also a lack of synergy between skills on some weapon sets/specific elements within those sets. Quite a few of our utilities are also lackluster, and even though our cantrips are quite good compared to the rest of our utility skills, they pale in comparison to the best utilities on stronger professions.

There’s something fundamentally wrong with a class if you’re pretty much forced into a defensive set up in order to enjoy playing it

There’s something fundamentally wrong with a class if you’re pretty much forced into a defensive set up in order to enjoy playing it

This. I wouldn’t say forced, you can go power and make the class playable. However power builds are SO restrictive it removes all the fun.
You MUST have certain traits and utility skills to make the builds work. If you prefer a different trait or the utilities dont fit your playstyle then you are out of luck. It takes away all the fun and uniqueness of the class.

At least with defensive builds I can play the way I wish and still be a decent member of a team, even If I do so little damage it takes me about 1 minute to kill a single other decent player. :S